David Ray Griffin and Stephen Jones join Alex on the Alex Jones Show to talk about the JFK assassination and the conspiracy theories surrounding it. If you like conspiracy theories then you'll love this! Don't forget, for this month in November into December, you get 5 months of 5-months free at Prison Planet.tv.
00:00:00.000Welcome, welcome, welcome on this 19th day of November 2008.
00:00:01.000The Alexis Communications Radio Network proudly presents The Alex Jones Show.
00:00:06.000Because there's a war on for your mind.
00:00:09.000Welcome, welcome, welcome on this 19th day of November 2008.
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00:01:05.000Now, I thought I'd get both these guys on together.
00:01:24.000And so I thought, well, originally I was going to have them on for this hour.
00:01:29.000Because National Geographic wanted to interview me and others about 9-11 Truth.
00:01:35.000And then I found out that the guy that was doing the piece, this Erickson, specializes in hit pieces on the JFK assassination.
00:01:43.000And I watched some of his programs, and let me tell you, I've never seen anything like it.
00:01:48.000So I didn't want to be a kind of a cardboard cutout in a stacked deck.
00:01:52.000I think Griffin and Jones are still being interviewed for it, but they were going to be here today, and I saw the program inside the shooter car this Sunday you made for Discovery, and it was ridiculous.
00:02:04.000I mean, bottom line, they admit they tore up the Chrysler, took it apart, hid the evidence, took it away, witnesses said there were bullet holes all over it, in the windshield, none of that.
00:02:14.000And a parade of spooks telling us that Oswald did it alone.
00:02:18.000And I just said, you know what, I just don't want to be around these people.
00:02:21.000And they're like, but you don't want to be on TV?
00:03:02.000And I haven't seen enough of the National Geographic.
00:03:07.000The one show I turned down was the second BBC show.
00:03:12.000Which was on World Trade Center 7, and Stephen went ahead and went on that one, and I'm glad he did, because he was able to get in a lot of good points, as did Richard Gage.
00:03:23.000And, you know, they said, well, that show was going to be better.
00:03:26.000It indeed was better than the original BBC show on the towers, but it was still full of lies, and mainly the big lie about Barry Jennings' timeline, which they totally Okay, we're going to go over that, and I'm glad that's why you're here today.
00:03:43.000I was originally going to have you talk about 9-11 evidence.
00:03:46.000Okay, I agreed to do BBC, and that was a hit piece and was twisted, but let me tell you, they at least acted like they were getting our side.
00:03:54.000This guy, this Erickson, if you watch the JFK shooter car, inside the shooter car, Completely one-sided.
00:04:02.000I have never seen a hit piece even approaching this.
00:04:06.000So, a word to the wise is sufficient to you and Professor Jones, both of you are professors.
00:04:10.000and so, I mean, believe me, I don't just back out of, I mean, I'm not afraid of going up against somebody, but, I mean, if I know that their specialty is this type of intellectual quackery, then I'm not if I know that their specialty is this type of intellectual quackery, then I'm not going to be part of it, Let's bring Stephen Jones up.
00:04:32.000Speaking of that last BBC hit piece, what did you think of that, Professor Jones?
00:04:39.000Well, I want to talk about the BBC, but also the National Geographic interview that I have already had, actually, Alex, last week.
00:04:50.000So starting with BBC, like I say, I was able to get a few points in.
00:04:54.000I was very disappointed in their headline that came out before the preliminary report from NIST, and that was that the World Trade Center 7 mystery has been solved.
00:05:13.000Well, you know, it's not solved until they get the report, until we have a chance to respond.
00:05:20.000Overall, the piece was basically a hit piece, but like David said, we were able to get a few points across, which I was very gratified that we were able to get some truth out through that medium.
00:05:31.000I think it's very important that we continue to reach people through the media, even if they're not entirely friendly to us.
00:05:39.000You know, it gives us a chance to reach people, then they can get online and learn more.
00:05:45.000Now, Alex, I would like to About this Robert Erickson, I was interviewed by him last week.
00:06:24.000Well, what they do is they do, with crop circles, with other JFK events, they do specific little scientific tests, and then they say, case closed, Oswald alone, you know, shot him from behind.
00:06:41.000I'm not saying you're bad for doing the interview, I'm glad you did it, I'm just saying look out.
00:06:46.000I also kept asking them, what do you want to interview me about?
00:06:49.000And they wouldn't give me the questions.
00:06:52.000So that's the main reason, but let's get into the latest BBC piece with David Ray Griffin, and then Professor Jones, come in with your own points on the science, as a physicist, dealing with this.
00:07:05.000Professor Griffin, breaking down the latest BBC piece, saying, we solved Building 7, and this is why it happened.
00:07:13.000Break that down for folks, the distortions.
00:07:18.000Well, partly they're basing it on what they assumed NIST was going to say.
00:07:25.000The report of the National Institute of Standards and Technology, which wasn't out yet, but they clearly were talking with them and had a pretty good idea what they were going to say.
00:07:38.000And one thing NIST had done was to distort the timeline of Barry Jennings and Michael Hess.
00:07:45.000As you know, And most of your listeners know.
00:07:50.000Jennings very clearly said that he and Hess went into the World Trade Center Building 7 very early, right after the first strike.
00:07:59.000So they were up there by about 9 o'clock.
00:08:02.000He's certain he was there at 9.03 when the second strike on the South Tower occurred.
00:08:07.000And shortly thereafter, they went down the stairs.
00:08:12.000The elevator wouldn't work, and Jennings said he was on the BBC show, he said, He was going a landing at a time.
00:08:19.000And so they were going down very fast.
00:08:21.000So that means they would have gotten down to the 6th floor by about 9.10 or 9.15 at the latest.
00:09:20.000Also on record here, he went on Fox TV, he went on other news channels right after the towers had collapsed, and he's on tape talking about how he quickly got out of the building and then how the towers collapsed.
00:09:34.000So, clearly on record, BBC and everybody knows that that was a very short time frame, not three hours.
00:09:41.000So we're seeing massive deception right there on its face.
00:09:45.000Well, we know that Hess was being interviewed a half mile away before noon.
00:09:51.000Uh, probably 1134, but at least before noon.
00:09:54.000And, uh, in this claim, they didn't even get rescued until 10 after 12, or 10 or 15 minutes after 12.
00:10:04.000I don't think he has... I didn't hear him say anything about the towers coming down, but what he did say was that he... there was a big explosion.
00:10:12.000And now he's changed the story, and he says, well, yeah, I thought there was an explosion at the time, but now I realize it was just the...
00:12:26.000FEMA, to their credit, put this data in Appendix C of their report that came out, and then NIST has totally ignored this data on the steel.
00:12:37.000In fact, NIST admits they didn't look at any steel from World Trade Center 7 in their report.
00:12:41.000Very blatant violation of normal scientific protocol.
00:12:57.000Okay, and I know a lot of it was whisked away, but we do know of a sample that still exists, because we've been in touch with the people at Worcester Polytechnic Institute.
00:13:06.000They have the steel from the rubble pile of Building 7.
00:13:09.000Quite a distance, as you know, from the other two towers, so there's really very little question about it.
00:13:19.000So I did this experiment with thermate, which is what I call thermite plus sulfur, and I had a piece of steel from the South Tower.
00:13:29.000Long story, how I got this small sample of steel, but it was actual steel from the World Trade Center.
00:13:33.000I put this slice of steel in the thermate, touched it off, BBC cameras rolling, I don't see that they showed any of that, but then we took that steel down to the scanning electron microscope and looked at it, and sure enough, there's sulfur in the steel.
00:13:51.000Which is surprising, we've done this experiment before, but you know, I was trying to get the point across that we know how the sulfur and this attack, there's a hole in the steel when you do this with thermate.
00:14:02.000And you showed all this to BBC, and they really didn't show a lot of that.
00:14:08.000Well, let me tell you what's going to happen when this other guy from I mean, it's a production company who just did a Discovery Channel piece on JFK.
00:14:16.000Now they're doing the San Francisco Geographic.
00:14:19.000What he does is he hires a bunch of former cops.
00:14:30.000And then they have them, and they're going to come out and show, knowing that the general public's not going to go out and do your thermate test, and it's going to be kind of like I know what you mean, Alex.
00:14:39.000I'm just saying that I think it's worthwhile to take a shot at trying to get some facts out there to the public.
00:14:45.000Even some of those slipped through in the BBC effort.
00:14:47.000unless I'm totally wrong about all this.
00:14:50.000I still, yeah, I know what you mean, Alex.
00:14:53.000I'm just saying that I think it's worthwhile to take a shot to try and get some facts out there to the public.
00:14:59.000Even some of those slipped through in the BBC effort.
00:15:04.000So I'm hopeful with this fellow Robert.
00:15:07.000And if I say, his questions were fair.
00:15:11.000There's one question that he asked that I thought was a little off, and so I didn't go there, but I explained why.
00:15:17.000His question was, well, he's talking to Professor Thomas Eager, which is good in a sense.
00:15:25.000I'd like to see, I'd like to talk to Professor Eager.
00:15:26.000I'd like to debate the issues publicly with Professor Eager, particularly the 14-point.
00:15:34.000What did he specifically ask you about, Eager?
00:15:37.000Oh, so what he was asking about was, he said, Eager wants me to ask you, how in the world can you get all these explosives into the towers and Building 7 to bring them down?
00:16:23.000National Geographic guy, and then a guy saying, this Professor Eager wants to know exactly how many bombs were in the building, and exactly how they wired up 7 in Tower 1 and 2.
00:16:32.000Well, he asked me that same question over the phone, and I said, well, Building 7 was a spook building, CIA, FBI, it was the emergency, and he just started laughing at me.
00:16:40.000I mean, that's an admitted fact, but it's real funny.
00:16:43.000And, you know, same thing with the other buildings, and Professor Jones was saying, Well, hey, we found the explosive's residue.
00:17:03.000And that's what I explained to him on tape.
00:17:06.000So I didn't give him an exact scenario.
00:17:09.000What I said was there's a lot we can learn from the hard physical evidence from the 9-11 deaths.
00:17:16.000And these residues that we're looking for, the NFPA 921, the National Fire Code, requires a scene of a fire where there's a crime, which certainly applies to 9-11.
00:17:30.000But then the next step, just like in CSI, the scientists do their work, but then you have other investigators with subpoena power, for instance, in a trial setting, so that you can ask questions from a lot of people.
00:17:46.000Well, you've now gotten peer-reviewed journals on this, and I want to talk about that more, but going back to David Ray Griffin, who by the way has written, what, now seven books on 9-11.
00:18:24.000I mean, how are they getting so many people to lie, who've been caught in lies, and how do they get these TV presenters to knowingly go out and lie and say that Barry Jennings was in the building three hours when he was in there 20 minutes?
00:18:38.000I mean, how do they find people to do this?
00:18:46.000A lot of my work was in the problem of evil.
00:18:51.000And this is, of course, a very old story.
00:18:54.000And it still is shocking, even though I've studied it over the centuries, the really just horrible things people can do, and at the same time be kind of ordinary good family men.
00:19:10.000I mean, this was notorious about the Nazis.
00:19:14.000In fact, the famous statement called the Banality of Evil, a study of the Nazis, that these were just ordinary family men that get put in situations where their job depends on it, their career depends on it, their salary depends on it, and so on.
00:19:34.000And it is astounding what people will do.
00:19:38.000I was very disappointed on the BBC show They at least dealt with this question of the steel that had been turned into Swiss cheese looking stuff, that they at least mentioned this, but they brought on one or two of those professors at Worcester Polytechnic Institute who had done that study, and you know at the time they said, well, they had no idea where the sulfur came from.
00:20:09.000On the BBC show, one of them said, oh, well, I don't find that surprising.
00:20:15.000It could have just kind of mixed in, you know, heating up underground there.
00:20:19.000Yeah, they claim steel now corroded in a few weeks in the heat when it's got the, according to Jones and others, you know, the classic burn holes, you know, that happen from something really fast.
00:20:34.000Well, that's right, and you'd be talking about extremely High temperatures.
00:20:39.000Stephen, what temperatures would you need to oxidize steel?
00:20:46.000Well, of course steel can rust, but the point here is that there are very high temperatures in evidence to reduce that steel beam to the thickness.
00:20:58.000It's very thin paper with holes in it, plus the sulfur in the steel.
00:21:04.000I talked to a fellow from WPI saying, well, it could, the operative term there is could, have been something like Wal-Board that could introduce sulfur.
00:21:16.000But you see, Wal-Board has calcium and sulfur, and they're very tightly bound with oxygen as well, calcium and sulfur.
00:21:24.000So, you know, it's not an issue here just saying you could do it.
00:21:33.000Alright, we're going to break and come back and talk about that experiment, and then from both of you, both Professor Jones and Professor Griffin, find out where you think this should go from here.
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00:23:24.000investigators believe that there are Israelis again very much engaged in spying in and on the U.S.
00:23:31.000I'm aware that some Israeli citizens have been detained.
00:23:34.000...Laden's connections to the CIA, the hijacker's ties to the FBI, the Saudi Arabian connection, the Israeli intelligence network, warnings and war games, the shadow government, and much, much more.
00:24:56.000This message has been brought to you by RadioCreditSecrets.com.
00:24:59.000You know, in the 25 minutes or so of airtime we have left with both of you gentlemen today, I'd like for you both to have a discussion and cover the issues that you think are most important.
00:25:17.000and And we can go back over the science of Building 7 or Tower 1 or 2, that's only a small part of it.
00:25:26.000You take all the evidence together, that's what's really strong.
00:25:30.000It's just seeing the other side, how they always lie, they always distort, they always twist, knowingly.
00:25:37.000And I go back to what I was saying to David Ray Griffin, who's a top theologian, amongst other things, is, yeah, the nature of evil.
00:25:46.000I mean, do they rationalize to themselves?
00:25:49.000I think some of them do that, but others, you know, it's funny to them.
00:25:52.000I mean, I guess they get a thrill by working with the evil, by being patted on the head by the system.
00:26:07.000Well, you know, it's hard to know in all cases.
00:26:11.000I think some of it is what Sinclair Lewis pointed out long ago, that it's hard to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on his not understanding it.
00:26:24.000So I think in some cases, the people in the news media, you know, they have blinders on and they just look selectively at the evidence that seems to support the official story.
00:26:37.000And so they recognize, well, if they twist a little bit here and there, they're doing it for a larger truth they can rationalize.
00:26:46.000So I think there's quite a bit of that going on, rather than just, well, I know I'm doing something really horrible, but I need the money.
00:26:56.000So I think there's a lot of self-delusion that allows people to live with themselves.
00:27:05.000Steven Jones, I know you're a physicist, so you stick mainly to the science, but dealing with these people, I mean, your evidence, your research is conclusive.
00:27:13.000It fits in with other research and eyewitness reports.
00:27:18.000They're fitting square pegs and round holes.
00:27:20.000We're fitting round pegs and round holes.
00:27:26.000I mean, what has this whole journey been like for you?
00:27:28.000And where do you see 9-11 Truth going now?
00:27:31.000And then I'll ask that same question to Griffin.
00:27:33.000Now that Obama's coming in, some are saying, oh my gosh, they think everything's fine okay now.
00:27:55.000See, the flip side to those, basically, official people missed, for example, that keep evading many of our questions.
00:28:05.000And then, anyway, we could discuss that further.
00:28:08.000But I want to hit on and mention the people that are There's really a very large, as you know, and you're a big part of it, this large public movement to get at the 9-11 truth.
00:28:22.000And in particular, I want to thank those people in New York City who saved World Trade Center deaths, the 9-11 deaths, on that day or shortly thereafter.
00:28:34.000We now have four samples that we're looking at very actively and scrutinizing very carefully.
00:28:43.000And, uh, this dust is just revealing so much to us about what really happened that day.
00:28:48.000Uh, I have heard reports that the officials that, uh, gathered up the steel and shipped that over to Asia for melting also tried to gather up all the dust, but they did not succeed.
00:29:00.000A lot of people saved dust because it came into their apartments.
00:29:03.000It invaded their private space and, and to their great credit, these, uh, New Yorkers saved some of that dust, often just for a souvenir.
00:29:13.000And we've had a dust-in from Frank D'Alessio, who gathered a sample ten minutes after the North Tower collapsed.
00:29:20.000That dust is full of these red chips, red on one side, gray on the other, that are very actively being studied now by three labs.
00:29:30.000And there are other labs anxious to study this material.
00:29:34.000And the reason I mention this, I had an email from David here just before your program.
00:29:40.000We would like to encourage others who have saved dust samples to provide a portion of the sample, retaining some for a further study.
00:30:58.000Yeah, if they go to the journal of 911studies.com, and then up at the top click on Contact Us, they can write to either Kevin, or either of the three editors, Kevin Ryan, Frank Legge, a Ph.D.
00:31:16.000Or if, this is David Griffin, if anybody just wants to email me, if you know my email, I'm in contact with the same people in France, so I can give you the address too.
00:31:26.000Right, so we're very anxious to turn this into an international, basically a public, conducted investigation with the public being involved in providing... Well that is the good news!
00:31:36.000We also have Russian TV, French, Spanish, Japanese.
00:31:40.000I mean, they're all doing real reports that are showing, wow, there really is evidence of inside job.
00:31:50.000David Ray Griffin, looking at this historically, which you also look at, how do you see it unfolding now?
00:31:55.000Because at one level, I do see it losing some wind in the sails with Obama.
00:31:59.000But at another level, it's already gone international and actually seems to be building despite that.
00:32:06.000And you know, false flag terrorism has now entered the nomenclature.
00:32:13.000People are now looking for it, so it seems that the tool of government, of false flag, or corporations, has been damaged to a certain extent.
00:32:20.000And some people say to me, well, why do you care?
00:32:23.000The whole point is the entire post 9-11 world, this whole surveillance grid, Yes, let me make three points.
00:32:42.000One is I think the election of Obama is a reason to gear up, not to slow down.
00:32:52.000Because, you know, although we all tried, there was no realistic chance, as long as Bush was in power, that anything was going to happen in the United States.
00:33:03.000But with a new administration, a new Attorney General, and so on, there is really a chance that we could have an investigation.
00:33:12.000Now, some people were motivated by revenge.
00:33:14.000They wanted Bush and Cheney and the gang to be punished, and that's understandable.
00:33:21.000The main thing is to get the policies changed, as you've indicated.
00:33:25.000The so-called war on terror is set to continue.
00:33:29.000Obama thus far has talked about increasing our activities in Afghanistan, and they're still talking as if they believe that Osama bin Laden is still alive, even though there's no evidence that he's been alive.
00:33:44.000In fact, it appears they're reviving him!
00:33:45.000Yeah, he's... I'm just writing a paper on that, and the evidence is very strong.
00:33:55.000The evidence that he's been alive since 2001 is really extremely weak to non-existent.
00:34:02.000So that's one point, that we should be increasing our activity, not decreasing it.
00:34:08.000Secondly, on this internationalization, I just returned from a tour in Japan, and there is increasing interest there.
00:34:17.000We had almost 500 people turn out in Tokyo for an all-day conference.
00:34:25.000And then we have political leaders in Tokyo who have taken a public stand.
00:34:35.000And I've been working with Fujita and another person to bring about a group called Political Leaders for 9-11 Truth, which will be an international movement.
00:34:47.000We already, in fact, have a website, although if you go there, there's nothing on it there.
00:34:52.000But we're all ready to fill in the The data.
00:35:03.000Okay, I just... Thirdly, a new group has just formed called Lawyers for 9-11 Truth, which is an international group.
00:35:12.000And William Pepper and many other leading lawyers have already signed up, and it's moving along rather quickly.
00:35:21.000The point is that whereas Stephen and Kevin and others have led the way to get us to this point, where the science is so strong, that it's now time to turn it over to the political and legal realm, and that is now starting to happen.
00:36:01.000Do you see any justice to the perpetrators?
00:36:04.000Or do you just see it becoming a public secret that this has been done, thus deterring some of the same institutions from pulling off similar events in the future?
00:36:17.000Well, I would prefer a third alternative.
00:36:21.000As I say, I'm not interested in and resent, and I'm rather encouraged by Obama.
00:36:31.000First of all, he is very bright, and secondly, I believe he has also got a strong moral compass.
00:36:37.000And he also appreciates constitutional law, and he knows what has been done here.
00:36:45.000And so I think that he will be open to, he and his people will be open to evidence.
00:36:51.000So that's why I say I think we need to ramp things up and present the strongest evidence and take every route we can to get it, bring it to the attention of the Obama people.
00:37:05.000Because I think there is the chance for real investigation, but also he has shown that he has this Virtue called forgiveness that, you know, at least in our Christian tradition, has been called a virtue.
00:37:22.000And he's willing to let bygones be bygones.
00:37:26.000And so I think if the most hopeful route would be a truth and reconciliation commission, where the main thing would be to get the truth out and therefore get the policies changed.
00:37:39.000And if these people, you know, they'll have their own punishment.
00:37:45.000You know, just knowing what they did, and having other people know what they did, that's a very secondary or tertiary matter from my point of view.
00:37:57.000I guess mine would be almost a fourth alternative, or maybe a modification of a couple others, and that is, I think, from the people, ourselves, internationally now, as it's clear that there's an awakening going on.
00:38:12.000I think that there can be this grassroots movement, coupled, frankly, with economic difficulties that are making people say, well, wait a minute, maybe I shouldn't trust the government and everything, you know?
00:38:27.000I mean, the depression or recession, whatever you want to call it, that seems to be spreading internationally is inducing people to take a hard look at what has brought us to this state.
00:38:39.000And as that happens, Through the internet and programs like yours, Alex, the truth about 9-11, I believe, will resonate with more people, and we'll have this grassroots movement demanding answers.
00:38:53.000And I think that, coupled with the science, will force politicians, even in our own Congress, to say, look, we need to take a look at this.
00:39:03.000I might say that our Congressman, my Congressman, here in Utah, Came over to my little apartment and spent an hour with me, one-on-one, discussing 9-11 issues and the research that I've done.
00:39:17.000And he is very supportive of a 9-11 investigation.
00:40:20.000I mean, you were saying that the people are... People are leaning on their congressman to do an investigation.
00:40:29.000I'm hoping that is, you know, various conditions cause people to wake up, that they will continue to speak out to their congressmen.
00:40:37.000Not let that down, but now keep the pressure up on the congressmen, and internationally too, so that as David said, we can get the political arm and the legal arm active in pursuing justice and truth.
00:40:51.000David Ray Griffin, isn't there also a facet to this that the people have learned that when the mainstream media is attacking a 9-11 truth movement or a JFK investigation movement or any other movement, that generally isn't there also a facet to this that the people have learned that when the mainstream media is attacking a 9-11 truth movement or a JFK investigation movement I
00:41:19.000I mean I found as bad as the History Channel piece was that it seemed to backfire on them and got more people to actually look at the evidence.
00:41:28.000Well, yeah, and the BBC show had the same effect.
00:41:34.000Yeah, and just building on what Stephen was saying there, I think that it will take an international movement, and that's why I'm encouraged that Japan, it looks like now, will be putting pressure on Washington and saying, look, we lost some people in the towers.
00:41:58.000We've only had the assurance of President Bush that these were Muslims who did this.
00:42:07.000I understand from Annie McCollum, she was here recently from the UK, the leader of the London movement, and she says that whereas some people in the United States had said things were dying down a little bit here because the Bush-Cheney people would be leaving office, That in Europe it's actually getting much more interest.
00:42:30.000Well, let me say, it's only getting bigger from what I see in New York this last year and other places.
00:42:35.000I'm just seeing some fear that, you know, it's a Bush-centric, all about Bush, whereas the very same military industrial complex that did this Uh, is still there.
00:42:46.000And I think that's the point that has to be made, but we'll see, uh, what Barack Obama does.
00:42:51.000I mean, I have to tell you, appointing Hillary Clinton, or moving to put her in Secretary of State, and a bunch of other stuff, I think we're going to see betrayal from him.
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00:45:59.000All right, final segments with Professor Stephen Jones, who I want to get back on separately by himself and Edirard Griffin, by himself and their future.
00:46:11.000But I thought it would be neat to have both of them on together today.
00:46:17.000Before I go back to them, PrisonPlanet.tv, all of my films of super high quality, the last hour of the show every day live, with the document cam, the video feeds, extras from films that aren't even on the DVDs, My in-studio reports, just so much, is at PrisonPlanet.tv and your membership there funds this operation and what we do here, $5.95 a month.
00:46:39.000But right now you can get five months free when you sign up for a year.
00:47:14.000Also, We're going to David Ray Griffin.
00:47:17.000Tell us about your latest book, your seventh book on 9-11.
00:47:23.000Well, that's the New Pearl Harbor Revisited, and some people have thought it's an update or a revision of the New Pearl Harbor, but not at all.
00:47:35.000The idea is that if a journalist or a politician were going to try to dig into this who knew nothing about it before, It's kind of overwhelming to think, you know, they might have to read 20 journal articles and three or seven books or so.
00:47:52.000So the idea was to try to get all the most essential information in two books.
00:47:57.000So it's now a two-volume set, The New Pearl Harbor and The New Pearl Harbor Revisited.
00:48:03.000And by the way, when you read these books, or you go over the 500 smoking guns of 9-11 online, it is mind-blowing.
00:48:10.000I mean, just how obvious it is, David.
00:48:14.000Well that's right, and I've always argued the main thing is a cumulative case that no matter which part of the story you look at, you find outright contradictions and lies.
00:48:28.000And just assertions that, from a scientific point of view, cannot be true.
00:48:54.000And of course, the steel was cut up and shipped out of this country over the protests of many scientists and engineers who felt that this data, this evidence, was crucial in solving and understanding what happened on 9-11.
00:49:11.000So, and again, now the dust we have is still extant, and I just wanted to re-emphasize, as I'm working with David and others, Kevin Ryan and others, Trying to understand and get samples of this 9-11 dust out to scientists worldwide so that we can really corroborate and confirm the results that we're getting.
00:49:40.000So that people can hear about it from scientists.
00:49:43.000I believe that there's a lot of trust still in scientists as opposed to politicians, I guess I could say it that way.
00:49:51.000And I believe if we can get this out to the public and keep that public discussion going based on hard evidence, it will make tremendous strides in the next year.
00:50:07.000Just go to journalof911studies.com, and our other papers that are published in the more established journals are listed right up at the top on the home page.
00:50:17.000Alright, and then of course for David Ray Griffin's book and other materials, you can just Google David Ray Griffin, The New Pearl Harbor Revisited.
00:50:23.000Gentlemen, I want to thank you both for joining us today, and have a great Thanksgiving coming up next week.