Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) joins the War Room to discuss the Ukraine aid package, Mitch McConnell's handling of the Ukraine crisis, and whether or not he should resign as Senate majority leader.
00:00:26.240Well, everybody does. You know, the direction we took on this, got to have leadership.
00:00:31.600I think he needs to. There'll be a lot of talk about it. You know, when we come back, I promise you.
00:00:37.820Now, this has in large part has to do with his handling of this Ukraine package.
00:00:41.880This is a massive, massive bill, not just Ukraine. It's $95 billion, $60 billion goes to Ukraine.
00:00:47.760You see another $14 billion to Israel. There's humanitarian aid.
00:00:51.100There's also the Indo-American Pacific, Indo-Pacific partners, I should say.
00:00:54.920Look, he was one of 17 Republicans who voted to advance this package.
00:01:00.900He's in the minority of the conference. But still, there are still a sizable amount of McConnell supporters within the conference who say that if he wants to, he can lead this conference.
00:01:11.880There's no question in my mind that as of right now today, Mitch is the leader and he would have more than a majority support in the conference.
00:01:19.980And the question is, does he want to? Kevin Kramer, who is the North Dakota Republican, told me, he said he's the world's greatest vote conner and I don't know what he might want to do.
00:01:30.200What I can't imagine is why he would want to run again.
00:01:35.220You had the Trump factor to it. This has been a complicated series of months for the Republican leader.
00:01:40.200Yeah. And I think if Trump is president again, it's very hard to imagine that Mitch McConnell would want to hang around or that he could hang around, just given where his conference is.
00:01:49.380I mean, it's interesting with McConnell because he has increasingly been out of step with his conference.
00:01:53.820He voted for the bipartisan infrastructure package. He voted for gun reform.
00:01:57.340Now he's pushing this Ukraine aid package.
00:01:59.720But what's important to point out is that McConnell hasn't changed or evolved.
00:02:03.480It's the Republican Party that is evolving underneath him.
00:02:06.260And that's what we're seeing play out on Capitol Hill.
00:02:10.860This is the primal scream of a dying regime.
00:02:15.760Pray for our enemies because we're going to medieval on these people.
00:02:20.980I got a free shot. All these networks lying about the people.
00:02:25.240The people have had a belly full of it.
00:03:59.040We're going to walk through you going to the ramparts, getting Bill Blaster, the app that lets you get right to these folks.
00:04:06.120But you talk about a lesson in civics in modern America.
00:04:12.540It was this weekend in the United States Senate.
00:04:14.640To be just blunt about it, having – not being able to pass the invasion authorization bill that would have destroyed this country, having shut this down.
00:04:25.000Now they're going exactly what they promised they would never do.
00:04:53.600You guys have put these guys on notice.
00:04:55.240But there's certain guys that are working now with the House and trying to be able to take this bill when it's out and be able to gun deck it and get it through the House.
00:05:42.560And I'm going to tie a lot of things together between the CBO report, capital markets, the debt clock, all of it.
00:05:49.120So today we're going to lay the framework of what's really going on in the world and then what your representatives in Congress are working on, particularly the Senate.
00:05:57.440I want to bring in Senator J.D. Vance from Ohio, who's been one of the leading, not just public intellectuals, but fighters in the trenches.
00:06:06.500Senator Vance, first off, you've got a piece up in the American conservative.
00:06:12.920And I want to take some time and walk through this because this audience must understand this.
00:06:17.060This piece headline said how the Republican Party and the Senate is working on funding the Ukraine forever war and to stop the reelection of Donald Trump.
00:06:28.900I want to take our time and go through this piece because this is the type of kind of intellectual work that we need to frame this debate so people know what's going on.
00:06:41.040So first of all, just think about this in two phases and we'll walk through each.
00:06:44.940There's the political phase to prevent Donald Trump from being elected president.
00:06:48.420And then there's sort of an insurance policy phase where even if he is president, this bill contains wording that would effectively make it illegal for him to discharge his campaign promises as president.
00:07:00.940But let's start with the political dynamic here.
00:07:03.580Steve, you saw this play out over the last two weeks.
00:07:05.880So McConnell and a few other Republican leaders come out and say, we've got this great piece of bipartisan policy, when in reality, the bipartisan border policies you've talked about, we've talked about was a disaster.
00:07:18.980So step two is then to say, well, we can't advance this great piece of policy.
00:07:27.000Because of Donald Trump, because of the MAGA Republicans in the House and because of their allies in the Senate.
00:07:32.780So you do this two step where you say that Democrats have done a great job on policy and then you immediately turn around and say it's Donald Trump's fault that this great policy is not passing.
00:07:45.200They're doing it to apply as much political pressure as possible to House Republicans to get in line and support this Ukraine funding.
00:07:53.640And importantly, the fight is not even close to over.
00:07:56.780So you're going to have a fight over the government funding deadline, which will involve whether we fund Ukraine in part.
00:08:03.820You're going to have this talk of a discharge petition, effectively where a few Republicans give control of the House floor to Hakeem Jeffries, the Democratic leader in the House, to try to pass more Ukraine funding.
00:08:15.780There's going to be an omnibus package where I'm sure Ukraine funding will be on the docket.
00:08:20.060And the point is that the establishment's obsession with funding Ukraine will force them to throw Donald Trump under the bus again and again and again.
00:08:31.000This will be a nonstop rinse and repeat news cycle where every time the Republican Party gets close to standing on principle and beating back $61 billion of Ukraine funding, you will have the Republican establishment singing the praises of Democrats and then attacking our nominee.
00:08:50.320And of course, as we get deeper and deeper into the spring and summer, Steve, the political cost is going to be greater and greater.
00:08:56.440You know this as well as anybody, but there will be advertisements run against Donald Trump in swing states that say, look, even some Senate Republicans are saying this was great policy, but Donald Trump killed it.
00:09:08.280We know voters are really worried about the chaos of the Biden administration, especially on the world stage.
00:09:13.900They will run advertisements saying we had a solution to the chaos, but then Donald Trump and the MAGA Republicans killed it.
00:09:20.440This is a constant structure within which they can drive down voter turnout on the Republican side and drive up Democratic turnout on their side in an effort to destroy Donald Trump politically.
00:09:34.400And I think, Steve, you're going to see this news cycle repeat itself.
00:09:38.000The particulars will be a little bit different, but the news cycle will repeat itself.
00:09:42.100And the goal is going to be to destroy a potential Trump presidency.
00:09:46.480Now, that's the political side, and we could go further into that, or we could talk about even if Trump manages to survive this onslaught, I think they've got an insurance plan because I think that's important to talk about too.
00:09:58.640I want to talk about the insurance plan, but I want to go – look, we had a massive audience all weekend watching this.
00:10:04.200And, of course, there was spurts of activity, and then it was behind closed doors.
00:10:07.680Just explain to people what happened over the weekend because I think a lot of our audience are shocked when they saw – they were so excited when this thing was kind of voted down on Friday, I think it was.
00:10:17.200And then you held one of the votes over for 24 hours, and things started to shift.
00:10:39.000Well, there are two things going on, Steve.
00:10:40.640First of all, to give credit to these guys, even though I disagree with them, some of them really think that this is like the Pearl Harbor moment of their lives, and they've got to stand with Ukraine in the same way that we stood against Nazi Germany and Japan.
00:10:51.860Of course, the difference is that was our country fighting against Nazi Germany and Japan, and Nazi Germany was much more powerful than Vladimir Putin's Russia.
00:10:59.920So the comparison doesn't make sense, but these guys have really convinced themselves.
00:11:04.160You know, they've read Winston Churchill speeches, and they think this is their moment.
00:11:08.700Now, there's also a less charitable thing going on, Steve, which is these people are all obsessed with going to the Munich Security Conference in a week and being able to tell their globalist friends that they stood and they got Ukraine their money.
00:11:22.660Now, it won't pass the House in a week, but I can't overstate this.
00:11:26.140How many of these guys want to go and hobnob with the Secretary General of NATO, and they want to sit there with the heads of states of various European countries, and they want to say, yeah, we've got some knuckle-draggers in the Republican Party, but we did our job and we delivered that money for Ukraine.
00:11:42.220So that created this sort of tight deadline over the weekend and into this week, because this fight's not over, by the way, Steve.
00:11:49.080The most important vote maybe is tonight.
00:11:52.340So the fight's not over, but it's created this incredible time pressure where Schumer and a select number of Republicans have wanted to get this done.
00:12:00.360So, yes, the vote went down on Friday, but then there was this massive pressure campaign over the weekend to try to get this thing over the finish line.
00:12:07.680And I think that's sort of what you're seeing play out right now.
00:12:10.960And we're trying to basically put a pressure campaign in the other direction and say, look, we cannot let these guys, in the interest of Ukraine, destroy our nominee, create a constant civil war within the Republican Party, depress our voters, all so that you guys can get $61 billion for Ukraine.
00:12:30.080And the thing I'll say, Steve, just behind the scenes, I've never seen the level of emotion from my even Republican colleagues about this fight for Ukraine as I have over any other issue.
00:12:41.800So you talk about the fentanyl crisis, you talk about the southern border, and, yeah, people care, but it's not top of mind.
00:12:47.940There are some Republicans for whom Ukraine is the most important issue confronting the country.
00:12:54.100And I just say, even if you're pro-Ukraine funding, and obviously I'm not, don't we have 10 more important issues confronting this nation between the border problem, the debt problem?
00:13:21.700You've got Lindsey Graham talking about – and they're giving speeches talking about we can't go back to our communities and our states when we have the southern border invasion.
00:13:30.460That is – the debt in the southern border are two.
00:13:34.480When these guys are reading their Churchill speeches, when they look to the guys against them – and some of these are people that – like Lindsey Graham has been a leader of the DACA.
00:13:43.980How can they sit there against the opposition and saying we can't do this, guys?
00:13:47.360We've got to secure the southern border, take care of our debt, and then we've got to figure out Ukraine later.
00:13:52.700Yes, Steve, I'll say, look, there have been great people who have been great fighters on this.
00:13:56.100I mean, some people you'd expect, like Donald Trump Jr. has been sort of hammering this issue from the very beginning.
00:14:00.860But to your point, even Lindsey Graham, right?
00:14:02.420He and I don't obviously agree on the Ukraine funding question.
00:14:05.240He stood up repeatedly, both privately and publicly, Steve.
00:14:09.080He's been doing this in private, too, and it's been very effective, saying, how can we write a $61 billion check to Ukraine when we haven't done anything on the border?
00:14:21.200We have to force Joe Biden to do his job because he doesn't want to.
00:14:24.760We can't grant mass amnesty and call that border security.
00:14:28.600We've got to force Joe Biden to do his job.
00:14:30.360And there are a lot of even hawks, even pro-Ukraine people within the Senate conference who are saying, we've got to focus on our own border first.
00:14:38.240I'd put Jim Risch in that category, like we mentioned Lindsey Graham.
00:14:41.600And I think it speaks to something very deep here, Steve, where even if you're pro-Ukraine, a lot of people have got the common sense to say our own country's problems have to come first.
00:16:25.440I think that what Trump should do, like if I was giving him one piece of advice, fire every single mid-level bureaucrat, every civil servant in the administrative state.
00:16:38.420And when the courts, because you will get taken to court, and when the courts stop you, stand before the country, like Andrew Jackson did, and say the chief justice has made his ruling, now let him enforce it.
00:16:49.360Fire everyone in the government, then defy the Supreme Court.
00:16:52.100You think it's okay for the president to defy the Supreme Court?
00:17:43.420We have people who are sitting ducks in the Levant right now, three of whom just got killed because the bureaucrats aren't listening to the political branches.
00:17:51.620That's a fundamental component of our government, George, that whoever is in charge, agree or disagree with them, you have to follow the rules.
00:17:58.820If those people aren't following the rules, then of course you've got to fire them, and of course the president has to be able to run the government as he thinks he should.
00:18:06.500That's the way the Constitution works.
00:18:08.640It has been thwarted too much by the way our bureaucracy has worked over the past 15 years.
00:18:13.280The Constitution also says the president must abide by legitimate Supreme Court rulings, doesn't it?
00:18:19.440The Constitution says that the Supreme Court can make rulings, but if the Supreme Court, and look, I hope that they would not do this,
00:18:27.040but if the Supreme Court said the president of the United States can't fire a general, that would be an illegitimate ruling,
00:18:33.320and the president has to have Article II prerogative under the Constitution to actually run the military.
00:18:40.920Okay, Stephan Lais has melted down to cut him off.
00:18:43.680Of course he had the Kamala Harris about the 2020 election.
00:18:47.140This is why J.D. Vance is on the short list under consideration to be President Trump's vice president.
00:18:52.120Senator, poison pills, you had them in the NDAA about taking away President Trump's ability to make sure that NATO shifts from a protectorate to an actual alliance.
00:19:03.200Is there anything we're missing in just looking at we've got to get Ukraine funding to zero?
00:19:09.280Is the Republican Party, particularly Mitch McConnell, working with the administrative state to set traps for President Trump's second term?
00:19:16.360Yes, Steve, and this is maybe the most important point, the thing I want your audience to most take away from what I'm saying here, Steve.
00:19:23.980In the Ukraine-first funding bill, there is funding that is mandatory through 2026.
00:19:31.360Of course, if Trump wins, as I hope he will, he's going to be president on January of 2025.
00:19:37.280So what happens if Donald Trump decides to force Ukraine to go to the negotiating table?
00:19:41.920What if he releases some of the money, but not all of the money?
00:19:44.400What if he decides to do what a president has to do, which is conduct diplomacy?
00:19:59.560The Washington Post has already reported that the purpose of the legislation is to control Donald Trump.
00:20:06.060So what they're trying to do is create a dynamic where if Trump follows his own campaign promises, Steve, they're going to say it's illegal and we have to impeach you.
00:20:16.380It's maybe reason number one why we've got to kill this legislation.
00:20:20.260We cannot pass a law now that ties Trump's hands in 2026 and gives Democrats an excuse to impeach him.
00:20:28.880But that's what way too many Republicans are talking about doing.
00:20:34.080Senator, we're going to be so it's tonight and a big vote tonight.
00:20:37.740I think so. Maybe even roll over to tomorrow.
00:21:53.300The audience, and I want to give a shout out to Super Bowl weekend and all the stuff going on, the tremendous participation we had from the war room posse over the weekend to watch this.
00:22:02.960And I think it was a fantastic lesson.
00:22:05.400I had a lot of stuff going on this weekend, meetings, other things.
00:22:08.600But I was able to keep one ear open and listen to Mike Lee's incredible speech.
00:25:07.940We started War Room because of War Room impeachment.
00:25:11.180Because I said at the time, Nancy Pelosi is bound and determined to impeach him.
00:25:14.860And they started bringing up this Ukraine stuff.
00:25:17.440And I go, that was kind of a perfect phone call.
00:25:21.740He's kind of doing what he's supposed to do about making sure that we're not sending just unlimited billions of dollars into these corrupt regimes.