Based Camp： The THOT Police
Episode Stats
Words per Minute
175.82793
Summary
In this episode of the podcast, I sit down with my good friend Simone to discuss why women who are submissive to men are a major problem in online communities like the Red Pill community and the self-help community, and why they are actually a problem.
Transcript
00:00:00.000
what type of woman decides to sign their entire this one short life they have
00:00:06.400
to being submissive to someone else only for attraction to that person that's a thought like
00:00:14.740
that's the very definition of a thought the type of person who would do that and that's a very
00:00:19.240
narrow psychological profile now this profile can be elicited from most people men and women
00:00:25.880
like suppose you trained a woman how to be like this aggressive sexy bombshell who was like very
00:00:33.840
forward and very good at playing men and everything like that and and this woman created a whole
00:00:39.660
movement around how to do this like how to seduce men like this and then these women are like it's
00:00:44.680
all men are simpering pathetic dogs right and you're like well no you are able to bring that
00:00:53.400
personality out of any man because of the mechanisms that you are using to attract those men
00:00:59.940
yes the systems you are using can attract actually a broad range of men but they change those men's
00:01:09.780
personalities within the narrative context of your relationship because we do change our
00:01:13.820
personalities in different narrative contexts the way i act at work is different from the way i act
00:01:18.420
at home and so if you're creating a persistently similar narrative context you're going to create
00:01:24.900
a persistently similar person would you like to know more hello simone how's it going today good hi
00:01:33.640
malcolm i am excited to be here because today we are going to talk about thoughts not intellectually of
00:01:42.440
course t-h-o-t a hot woman who is vapid primarily interested in sex and who is apparently a major
00:01:52.700
problem for communities like the red pill community and a lot of these conservative intellectual spaces
00:01:59.780
there's a heavy emphasis a lot of them almost seem to be like a red pill diaspora where the men's
00:02:07.240
rights movement of like 20 years ago began to dissipate into like the big towers and the red
00:02:13.000
pillars and the the other types of pickup artists type people uh they begin to influence a lot of the
00:02:19.460
culture of news online right-leaning intellectual movements pretty heavily actually in the same way that sort
00:02:27.720
of the tumblr feminists ended up influencing a lot of progressive online cultures ah yes yes where this
00:02:35.600
gets really interesting is that thoughts in the real world the sort of thirsty manipulative women
00:02:43.980
like they're not actually a problem they're not a problem to most men and so the question is is why are
00:02:51.620
they perceived as such a problem by the red pill diaspora and i have a theory around this so i always found
00:03:01.760
the red pill community really interesting as did you i actually think you used to browse it more than i
00:03:05.880
did way more and they i think were fairly accurate in their understanding of female sexuality well it was
00:03:15.940
also the first community online where i really encountered a more economic analysis of of relationships
00:03:23.660
and dating strategy and sexual strategy which i think is a far better lens than the typical self-help
00:03:29.960
of a romance based analysis oh absolutely yeah and and and they were saying things that were
00:03:36.160
obviously true that people weren't happy to say which was things like actually if you look at
00:03:43.720
statistics the majority of women do prefer men with dark triad traits like narcissism and machiavellianism
00:03:50.700
and that if you like like in terms of sorry i'll use a different word so i won't get demonetized
00:03:57.640
in terms of submission and like in a bedroom context right the the majority not all but but women do
00:04:06.300
differentially prefer that and also stuff like muscle building right like oh if you if you get toned and you
00:04:14.520
spend time at the gym you will be more physically attractive to women and through these realizations
00:04:20.480
they began to be able to pick up more women than they were previously able to pick up and for young
00:04:28.040
men that is a major problem in life like in a way that i don't know if women can fully understand
00:04:34.980
just how much consternation this causes young men well i think there's another really big factor to like
00:04:40.920
the original traction that the community enjoyed which is that in general of a big premise of the red
00:04:46.980
pill etc community seemed to be that men have been told a lie that being a nice guy to women is not
00:04:53.300
going to get you sex and that that's just a very misleading and very damaging lie and here are these
00:05:00.000
various things you can do to actually get sex and i think to a certain extent those tactics work but also
00:05:07.720
i think part of it was just like encouraging men to be direct and assertive about their desire to have
00:05:12.340
sex with women like before i met you i never encountered a guy who was like clear about his
00:05:19.280
motives it was just like he kind of expected it seems like all guys kind of expected women to come
00:05:26.660
on to them somehow like they were never gonna say you were dating in san francisco right yeah which i
00:05:31.480
think is well this is a community that i think is most inundated with the exact opposite mindset
00:05:37.860
right but anyway i feel like that was a major factor of it was just like the fact that men
00:05:43.520
were suddenly being told oh guess what not being assertive not being direct isn't going to work for
00:05:52.560
you that even just that basic realization was really meaningful and impactful and i mean what are
00:05:58.240
your other thoughts on the red pill community if you're going to have more i i loved the the pessimism
00:06:05.060
of it i love like the concept of a waltz all women are like that but like there's this this this
00:06:12.180
animosity that i found to be very intriguing and a straw man of women that that was that was presented
00:06:18.180
was great i loved the the experimentation they'd have case studies remember no no field field reports
00:06:25.300
something like that yeah the lingo in general was great i don't know if using the lingo would get me
00:06:31.780
like get us demonetized like i don't know oh yeah you two probably have referred to the carousel
00:06:37.340
that women would ride oh well yeah but i just mean i i bet even like even if we say the term red pill in
00:06:43.500
the tags here we're probably going to get like delisted so we'll see but no i i agree with a lot of
00:06:49.140
what you're saying and i and i think a community i'd love to do a separate video on later it's a
00:06:53.020
mig tao community the men going their own way community yes yes but one of the things that i really
00:06:58.340
wanted to focus on here is an illusion the the walt illusion i guess i'd call it or the thought
00:07:04.480
illusion um yes yes like they're these women straw men they they are not representative like
00:07:11.780
why do they believe because i believe that this is their actual experience of women and so which is
00:07:17.420
back to what they figured out which was they figured out some ways to be sexually attractive to
00:07:26.380
women and it was actually very effective the the problem is if you go to a stream and you say this
00:07:34.820
stream only has catfish in it and then somebody points out well you're using a catfish lure of
00:07:40.220
course you're only catching catfish if the thing you are using to lure women is how attractive you are
00:07:49.840
going to be in bed to those women you are going to only lure women who go after guys based on how good
00:08:01.540
they are in bed this is where these thought women come from they come from this very narrow sliver of
00:08:12.540
women who is like oh i will go on a date with a guy because i want to have sex with that guy and
00:08:20.980
nothing else well and i think it's underrated just how unusual this this demographic is i i cannot think
00:08:31.500
of a single friend who was like fit this criteria like a hypergamous so person just wanted here i was
00:08:40.500
really good at getting women to sleep with me back in the day okay but you also weren't like a triangle
00:08:46.100
man chad no i wasn't but i had developed a lot of the systems and what i would say is is while i use
00:08:52.100
different systems to do it women enter a different psychological space depending on the mechanism you
00:09:00.160
have used to get them to want to like the lure you have used right to to catch that particular fish
00:09:06.940
and so the same woman who is dating you primarily because you are a bed partner for her versus a
00:09:14.420
woman who's dating you because she respects you will have a very different mental framing of that
00:09:20.020
relationship and her psychological profile within the relationship will be very different this is true
00:09:26.460
of men as well depending on why they're going out with a woman are you going out with a woman because
00:09:30.220
you think she's hot are you going out with a woman because you respect her you are going to act
00:09:34.960
very differently in those two relationships thoughts as like a a concept any woman can to
00:09:42.160
an extent become a thought if a guy is able to lure her using only his his body essentially body right
00:09:49.820
or but not just his body other things that cause attraction like power dynamics in his body power
00:09:55.280
dynamics but if it's if it's primarily because of attraction that she's dating you one of course she's
00:10:00.820
not gonna have loyalty to you she's she's not dating you because she respects you or likes you she's
00:10:06.180
dating you because you have maxed out an attraction metric of course she's going to go with the next
00:10:10.820
guy who offers more attraction to her right that's your value to her because that's what you sold to her
00:10:18.860
you didn't sell anything else you didn't sell a complete package all right so wait that's really
00:10:25.240
interesting what you're saying you're saying basically not only does the broad red pill strategy
00:10:33.660
tactic attract thoughts but it can literally create thoughts like it will train women who might
00:10:41.800
otherwise be very loyal partners who would be less hypergamous more committed better committed partners in
00:10:48.500
general to instead become unfaithful hypergamous game playing shit testing partners right exactly
00:10:57.780
because you have based your relationship off of their attraction to you and because of that that is
00:11:06.300
the value you have to them and i think that this is the thing we we have a twitter thread on this
00:11:13.620
but guys are right when they say the majority of women prefer to take on the submissive role in a
00:11:20.600
relationship right what they often get wrong when you're looking at like the red pill movement or
00:11:25.480
something like that is women are also human beings and when they take on a submissive role they want to
00:11:31.360
take on this submissive role not just in service to a guy's ego but towards some larger ideological
00:11:37.900
objective they want to work with a guy who they respect on some sort of bigger broader project with
00:11:47.200
their life not just the guy being tough and and doing whatever i mean i'm sure you could elaborate
00:11:53.360
on this more simone well yeah i mean a point that you've made is if a woman is going to devote her life
00:11:59.140
to someone like should probably be someone working on something meaningful if it's not then you as a
00:12:05.560
woman who's joined on to that team is wasting her time like um devoting her life to someone else's
00:12:11.940
vanity is kind of a waste of your life right yeah what type of woman decides to sign their entire this
00:12:20.720
one short life they have to being submissive to someone else only for attraction to that person
00:12:29.040
that's a thought like that's the very definition of a thought the type of person who would do that
00:12:34.240
and that's a very narrow psychological profile now this profile can be elicited from most people men
00:12:41.280
and women like suppose you trained a woman how to be like this aggressive sexy bombshell who was like
00:12:49.360
very forward and very good at playing men and everything like that and and this woman created
00:12:55.400
a whole movement around how to do this like how to seduce men like this and then these women are like
00:12:59.840
it's all men are simpering pathetic dogs right and you're like well no you are able to bring
00:13:09.040
that personality out of any man because of the mechanisms that you are using to attract those men
00:13:16.040
yes the systems you are using can attract actually a broad range of men but they change those men's
00:13:25.880
personalities within the narrative context of your relationship because we do change our
00:13:29.900
personalities in different narrative contexts the way i act at work is different from the way i act at
00:13:34.720
home and so if you're creating a persistently similar narrative context you're going to create a
00:13:41.240
persistently similar person and some of these guys will say well come on you can't be serious
00:13:47.420
women don't really date guys because they respect them because they want to work on projects with
00:13:56.340
them i don't know i'll let simone answer that oh 100 i mean i think people come to relationships with a
00:14:02.740
lot of different goals and contexts and you can choose what you want your lure to be essentially your
00:14:09.000
lure to draw someone in and i actually my first message to you on okcupid was about your startup
00:14:16.200
because you chose to use things that you worked on as potential conversation starters and your work
00:14:22.400
was one of those things one question i heard at some point was who who do you need to be to bring
00:14:29.380
out the person that you want someone else in a relationship to be like the way that you treat
00:14:33.000
someone and the way that you behave personally determines how people connect to you so i think the big
00:14:41.300
problem with the optimized red pill archetype is that it really brings out assholes and women
00:14:47.740
which is really bad well and there's a way for women to attract people that brings out assholes and
00:14:52.620
men this isn't like a 100 and i mean one thing that we talk about in the relationships book that we wrote
00:14:57.680
is the extent to which you know begins on both sides with what you call proto abuse he's like
00:15:04.020
typically small like technically harmless technically not not bad or not toxic ending the conversation in the
00:15:10.940
middle of the conversation for example because i just walking out of the room total control over
00:15:15.560
how that conversation has happened which is a means of non-consensually exercising control over the
00:15:20.040
other person and those sorts of things simmer and create bigger problems in the future but it also
00:15:25.320
it draws out certain behavioral patterns in someone else well and i think the reason why for example
00:15:30.380
shit testing is something that women are accused of doing a lot by red pillars or by just generally that
00:15:38.280
broad group i don't even know how big the red pill is anymore i've not been paying attention enough
00:15:42.900
is that if you are primarily offering power dynamics and male dominance as your value proposition in a
00:15:52.260
relationship of course a woman or whatever partner you have with you is going to be validating that or
00:15:58.880
exercising that i wouldn't even say like literally trying to de-seat you they're they're they're enjoying it
00:16:05.580
like how can you enjoy a power dynamic how can you maximize this value proposition if you are not
00:16:12.500
pushing the boundary to the extent where it shows up again so if a woman's coming to you and she loves
00:16:17.140
the power dynamic and now you guys are in a relationship together if she wants that power
00:16:22.580
dynamic she's going to have to push a little bit to get you to demonstrate the fun dominance thing that
00:16:28.020
she really loves so like that's what you're selling yeah yeah you're selling and so she she signed up for
00:16:33.600
the for the lion show and now she's asking for the lion show again and she has to poke the lion for him
00:16:40.300
to growl or whatever you know what i mean like but normal but but something that should also be clear
00:16:44.740
is in normal healthy relationships shit tests aren't rare they just don't happen right right they
00:16:53.240
that's not like a thing that like normal healthy adults do it's a weird attraction dynamic
00:17:00.600
that you have created through the value proposition you offered given that you were optimized around
00:17:07.500
this framing but the framing is useful this dominant framing is an arbitrage opportunity given how few guys
00:17:13.580
demonstrate that really effectively in our society today yeah i mean you can arbitrage meaning that you
00:17:19.940
are offering something that very few other people in the marketplace are offering and so yeah like
00:17:23.900
you can attract women who might be actually out of your league by doing that but out of the league of
00:17:30.680
the real you in the same way that women can get men who are out of the league of the types of partners who
00:17:37.500
will settle for the real them but who are willing to sleep with them right a man can get a woman who's out
00:17:43.720
of the league of like being in a real relationship with them but who will date them for this power
00:17:49.000
dynamic fantasy that they're creating um but then you need to what be in frame for the rest of your
00:17:54.580
life till you die like that sounds miserable that is not you did not win you trapped yourself in a
00:18:02.560
cage it's like congratulations you played yourself you never get to be yourself again for the rest of
00:18:08.600
your life but you get to show off an attractive woman for the next oh i mean okay in defense of the
00:18:16.700
red pill there's a lot of like overlap between red pill men's rights mctow etc and stoicism and i do
00:18:24.580
think that a forcing function like let's say a thought female partner who forces you to always
00:18:30.060
maintain frame also forces a certain level of constant self-discipline that might be appreciated
00:18:35.580
by someone of this community because they appreciate how they are forced to be kept sharp so i'm just
00:18:41.400
i think that anyone actually maintains frame well that's no no i'm genuine here i think that
00:18:47.020
it is very hard to maintain that type of frame without becoming abusive i think this is where
00:18:51.620
you get like the steve crowders and stuff like that that is no i'm not sure i'm not sure so i'm
00:18:56.340
going to push back again i think if you end up with like a trad wife who just really likes being
00:19:00.480
submissive and and because i so there are thoughts and then there are trad wives and i think thoughts
00:19:04.940
regularly like want to push back like they're more like the brat dynamic right because they're
00:19:11.740
interested in a constant power dynamic i don't think trad wives want a constant power dynamic
00:19:16.440
yeah they don't well and also like trad wives are not going to be interested in sleeping with chads
00:19:22.140
because they know that chads are not going to commit trad wives are not going after dark triad trait
00:19:26.840
males well that's here's the other thing is it's really interesting to me how small a sliver
00:19:32.520
of the like the sort of ideal red pill male is of interest to female populations like none of the
00:19:40.980
friends that i grew up with went to college with etc were attracted to this archetype and yes i was
00:19:48.580
friends with nerdy people nerdy smart people this archetype can get these i i guarantee you they can get
00:19:53.980
these women to sleep with them they just cannot get these women to sleep with them and stay safe
00:19:58.040
and it's it's the same with the trad wife thing women in this trad wife mindset they are not with
00:20:04.720
a guy because that guy is is attractive that is not the power dynamic you sell to bring out a trad wife
00:20:11.660
in a person or to have like a stable trad wife relationship you what brings out a stable trad wife
00:20:17.300
relationship is being a good dad that's what a trad wife wants they want a good no it's true more than
00:20:23.720
it is it is and they also they also want a husband to serve so they they had there has to be a level
00:20:28.140
of confidence there has to be a level of dominance yeah and here's an interesting we talk about the
00:20:33.160
lure you use in the framing of the initial relationship so we can talk about our early
00:20:37.100
relationship as an example of that so you look at our early relationship and it was completely based
00:20:41.880
around the company that we were starting together and what that framed for us that you reached out to me
00:20:49.660
about starting a company that we were constantly talking about career and company and and building
00:20:55.780
something like that it meant that a lot of the dynamics that we came into and what we were offering
00:21:03.240
each other was competence intelligence curiosity and work ethic because that is specifically starting a
00:21:09.340
company was in a complementary complementary skill sets in that i was able to do things you weren't able
00:21:14.680
to do and you were able to do things i was not able to do so it was complementary skill sets
00:21:18.660
working on entrepreneurial endeavors together while also being like compatible as romantic partners
00:21:25.120
and friends um yeah but but what that means is that for you or me to go after someone else given the
00:21:32.780
framing of our relationship right early in our relationship what would have caused us to go for
00:21:37.840
somebody else is finding a more competent individual right somebody who is harder working or smarter or
00:21:42.900
something like that right but what's interesting about that kind of relationship is that it is
00:21:49.360
one you invest in to an extent so because we have like literally invested in similar projects together over a long
00:21:58.160
period of time the differential value i have to you and you have to me could not be replicated by another person who was just
00:22:07.860
marginally better than me or you so it comes down to aligned incentives
00:22:12.880
each party is leaning who was 50 smarter than you 50 harder working than you the amount i would have to
00:22:21.380
give up in just our like companies and public image to try to start over with this person would make it outside
00:22:30.240
of any emotions i feel for you just a terrible prospect yeah but you're talking about sunk costs i'm talking
00:22:36.960
about aligned incentives and by that i mean when you are working with someone toward shared values shared
00:22:44.100
goals shared companies whatever it might be it might even be just creating a family and a life together
00:22:48.460
like in a more trad way yeah that there is not this same kind of constant friction when you're looking at a
00:22:55.800
typical red pill relationship it's very extractive on both ends so for the women who are attracted to those
00:23:02.140
relationships it is to what extent am i getting the dominance displays the the other sorts of experiences and
00:23:09.660
scenes that i want from this relationship sort of the drama the thrill the new relationship energy the feelings of
00:23:16.320
threats and then for the men it's to what extent can i have one or many super hot female partners that like
00:23:24.700
really respect and validate me essentially and those are both very individualized and in extractive
00:23:31.480
approaches and those are not aligned incentives and so that also makes these relationships inherently
00:23:36.500
unstable and there's it's funny because to what to one extent like pickup artistry red pill etc is very
00:23:44.980
very good at looking at incentives and very very good at recognizing misaligned incentives and yet there's
00:23:50.300
no discussion of okay wait then how do we make aligned and how do we make stable relationships or both
00:23:56.180
partners are working toward the same thing or something bigger than themselves it's like they can't get out
00:24:00.760
of this atomization and and selfhood that is ultimately leaving them more isolated than they ever would be
00:24:08.540
it's it's interesting i i could not have said it better than that i think that's a really good way to put it and
00:24:15.040
and this is what creates this thought problem where it is literally what they are turning the women in
00:24:22.300
society into that they're interacting with now it is true you know if you look at like divorce laws or
00:24:27.360
something like that and be like yeah well women have such an advantage it's really the legal system
00:24:32.060
which is turning them into these monsters but i think that that misunderstands how screwed a woman is
00:24:40.580
in a long-term relationship in that a woman's sort of value on the marketplace in terms of the types of
00:24:45.860
guys she can get goes down much more dramatically as they age than a man's so if a woman starts dating
00:24:52.140
a guy in her mid-20s and then that guy divorces her when she hits 45 you could be like oh well she got
00:25:00.300
all this money and stuff that he worked for how terrible is that but she's not going to get another
00:25:05.460
partner of his quality whereas he can get another partner of equal quality so well men men enjoy in
00:25:12.340
terms of the typical value propositions like men are more of a resources and dominance kind of offering
00:25:18.980
whereas women are more of a youth and fertility offering so you get cumulative advantages as a man
00:25:25.560
especially if you accumulate wealth and confidence over time whereas as a woman like you spend your
00:25:32.200
youth and it's gone once your fertility window is passed it's gone like you're not getting it back
00:25:37.620
and then you're even worse off from even just a like basic survival standpoint well i love how how
00:25:43.580
like it's weird that there's like this faction of our society that like they know that like they know
00:25:48.480
deep down that like it is harder for an older woman to get a partner right but they're like how can
00:25:53.720
you say that that's so offensive like all women are equally valuable and it's like well i mean you don't
00:25:58.780
literally think that all women can get the same men do you like you you understand that there is a
00:26:04.440
differential value even if it's just socially that we place on these things but the larger point i was
00:26:09.360
making here is from the red pill perspective is that you can often over focus on just the way that guys get
00:26:16.580
screwed in relationships and miss the the system any system in which leaving a partner is possible
00:26:24.780
really screws over both genders and that you need more sort of sunk cost within relationships
00:26:31.620
and social structures that make it very unlikely that or at least more costly to leave a person and
00:26:39.760
we just don't have those in society these days but in addition to that you like the best defense against
00:26:45.420
any of these things as a man or as a woman is to more carefully screen your partner up front
00:26:50.840
and make sure you understand the value proposition you're offering them as opposed to just getting the
00:26:57.920
best possible partner you can get agreed well i love you i'm glad that you she came after me when we were
00:27:06.640
when i was on the dating market i did i reached out to you she was in she was she was like optimizing
00:27:11.680
her profile around nerds so she was in full stormtrooper armor in it and i had seen her profile before but i thought
00:27:17.840
that she was hiding that she was fat because i i'm that kind of cynic that's not how the plating
00:27:23.340
works like if i were if i were huge you would tell like the little rounded like plate plates would not
00:27:28.840
fit over my legs fat a little fat i thought you were a little fat a little you see you couldn't handle
00:27:34.500
a little fat some baby simone simone well thank goodness
00:27:41.200
and it's hey we all have preferences we all have preferences okay no no this this goes both ways i
00:27:48.720
put the fat clause in our marriage contracts oh yeah she did she gets to ban me from things if i get
00:27:54.440
too fat now of course i can do that for her too but like i i will never i will never know but but i'm
00:27:59.700
like the way i eat the fat clause i have accidentally tripped yeah i i have imposed the fat clause on you
00:28:06.000
a couple times i have never tripped the fat wire because i weigh and measure all of my food
00:28:11.640
i'll tell you the meanest clause in our relationship contract because we did put together a contract
00:28:18.800
we're like okay let's and this is what we mean when i'm like find out everything that can go wrong
00:28:22.740
before the relationship so something doesn't come up later that causes the problem in your relationship
00:28:26.460
so we just interviewed a bunch of people about everything that had gone wrong in their
00:28:29.980
relationships and then like like 100 people or something and and made sort of a list and we're
00:28:34.980
like let's discuss how we will handle every one of these scenarios like suppose one of our parents
00:28:38.960
needs a place to live suppose you know how what's the appropriate temperature but of all of these the
00:28:46.980
most evil one and and she did this to me the boat clause the boat clause which is i can't just go out
00:28:54.900
and buy a boat i cannot she cannot wake up one morning and and see a boat in our yard and what
00:29:01.160
this actually applies to is any i think purchase over ten thousand dollars i cannot buy without the
00:29:07.660
veto permission of the other partner no no it's it's it's a size it's a size thing in the contract
00:29:12.820
because we each have discretionary spending that like oh okay yeah yes i don't care if you are like
00:29:19.420
buying puppies and drowning them like per our contract that's fine what isn't okay is a large
00:29:25.860
pieces of property that affect both of us and are like just just big eyesores the boat is in our yard
00:29:32.960
cannot it also applies to pools apparently that's the other yeah because it's a size thing like again
00:29:39.080
like you can't you can't spend discretionary money on a giant money hole eyesore that will sit there
00:29:46.040
and collect dust that's gonna be what destroys our relationship one day i'm gonna i'm gonna come
00:29:51.720
back to the house with a giant used sailboat and it'll just be sitting in our yard well i think that's
00:29:58.560
the fun thing about relationship contracts and something that's important in negotiating them
00:30:02.720
right it's that a lot of people assume that the punishment for breaking a clause in a relationship
00:30:09.540
contract is i will leave you right or like i don't know but really like the primary consequence is
00:30:16.720
this is written and this is gonna really really hurt the other person's feelings or reduce their
00:30:21.940
quality of life in a meaningful way and if you pull a bunch of this probably they're gonna leave
00:30:27.000
the relationship but like just know that really this isn't like oh i have to leave like if if you
00:30:32.020
cheat in this way then don't do the i'm gonna leave thing in a relationship is the moment you don't do
00:30:37.540
that if that was one of your rules and that was the primary thing enforcing your rules then none of
00:30:43.100
the other rules matter anymore because now everybody knows that you're not gonna leave yeah and and it
00:30:48.640
just makes you look pathetic but if if the rules are hey that'll really hurt me well then what you're
00:30:55.540
using to well prevent them from doing it is the knowledge of how it will make you feel which is
00:31:00.760
which is both honest intrinsically you're going to react that way but in many ways it's like much more
00:31:06.900
immoral to break a clause out of how it will make the other person feel versus it's a little more
00:31:14.620
fair like with the fat clause it's understood given our personal aesthetics that if the other partner
00:31:21.420
gets fat we're not going to find them physically attractive we're not going to want to bang them
00:31:26.000
as much like it's gross to us and to each his own and that's i i prefer that to like someone not having
00:31:33.120
that kind of clause in a relationship contract and then one partner getting a little rotund
00:31:37.140
and then being really disappointed that the other partner isn't interested that's a really good point
00:31:42.720
yeah i mean i'm really glad you know that when i trip that clause when you let me know when i'm about
00:31:47.080
to trip it you you you'll let me know when when you're making the call nobody's it's really helpful
00:31:52.620
because well because here's how it would go otherwise right it's like i had an expectation that you
00:31:56.620
would like me if i was no longer yeah because the way it normally works right is one partner gets a
00:32:01.780
little fat they let themselves go like aesthetically it doesn't have to be about fatness it could be
00:32:05.440
like maybe they just stop wearing nice clothes or they stop showering as much and they start to smell
00:32:09.220
and then like what happens is then the other partner stops banging them or showing interest in
00:32:15.380
them the same way they're not taking initiative anymore and then partner number one starts being
00:32:20.240
like oh like why are they ignoring me like they're being so mean and then it's sort of like that trips
00:32:24.080
other unwritten contract violations like i want you to make me feel loved i want you to make me feel
00:32:30.240
pretty and so like there's this sort of spiraling back and forth is all these unspoken like parts of
00:32:36.740
relationship contracts are violated right and then it falls apart but you know what malcolm we should
00:32:41.440
have a separate chat about relationship contracts absolutely and i love you simone i i am so glad you
00:32:47.680
found me yes well and speaking of submission i need to go preheat the oven and put in baked potatoes
00:32:53.300
and brussels sprouts so let's go do that i love you malcolm