In Part 2 of the 3peat, we have two special guests in the house, Salimone and Destiny, and we debate Islamophobia and other taboo topics. We also have an interview with Sneeko with the W Single Mom, and a little bit of After Hours with Rude Boy doing bad man things. Also, Myron cooked a lying, money-hungry, black melon chicken. Also, Big bro Myron talks about how he's going to go work in the military and how he plans on doing it, and why he's not going to stop being a brokie. And of course, we get into the latest episode of the Threepeat, where we do an expose on a certain cloud chaser, and it's a doozy! Stay tuned to the end of the episode to find out who won and who lost in the first round of the debate. Stay Tuned for Part 2, coming soon! - The Freshly Packed Crew Thank you for listening and supporting the show, and stay tuned for more episodes coming soon. -The Freshly Packed Crew . -J.J. Frisk and the Freshly Podcast. . . . and we are live! And we are going to do another 3peat! ! -Suleem and Ahmed ( ) Thanks for listening to the show. , and keep it fresh, brozz Love ya'll! -JBredren , J.B. Bredren, J-J. & Ahmed, J-Bran, J.R. & J-Broke Selleen, JB, JT, and J-E-Suleen, . , J-O-Bredran, J.E. & J.V. and J.J., J.O. J&B. J. B. BEDREN . J. O. J-U-R. -J-O. -A.S. - J.A.Bran - J-A. & B. -YANKEES, JAMIE, JE-BRAKE, JK -JE-AYANDS, JAY-AJ -JK, SONGS, JUICY, JORDAN, JARED -JAY-SUNG, JAX-SUELL, JOKER, JORO, JACOB, JAVE, JOSY-SUMMOR, JERRY-SWEET, JOMIE-BEN, JAWE-DUCHE, AND THE PODCAST!
00:08:09.000So, guys, the way this debate is going to work is I'm going to basically ask an open-ended question, and I'm going to give each party two minutes or 2.30, right, to go ahead and give their full stance uninterrupted, and then another individual will go ahead and give their full stance uninterrupted, and then we can go ahead and do a back-and-forth after the first round,
00:10:27.000And guys, it's going to be 50 and up will be red for this pod because obviously we want to make sure that we focus on the debate and not have interruptions.
00:11:33.000And I think the reason why is because our values allow so many different types of people to come here.
00:11:38.000Like, just look at the four of us around this table.
00:11:40.000Like, how many people here are from other countries or whose parents were immigrants?
00:11:43.000Like, the The only country in the world where all of these different types of people, different types of religions, different types of ideologies can come together and then form a business in a capital-free investment environment and then broadcast that to the entire world on American invented technology is the United States of America.
00:12:03.000None of these Islamic countries are able to take as much culture as we have and kind of like mix them all together in the way that the United States has.
00:12:10.000And I worry sometimes that people that champion certain types of religions do so in kind of a militant way and do so in a bit of an exclusionary way as well.
00:12:18.000For instance, you should be able to make fun of anybody who you want.
00:12:21.000I think that you guys probably agree with that here more than anybody else.
00:12:24.000I agree with it on my platform, obviously.
00:12:27.000A lot of Muslim people don't agree with it.
00:12:28.000In France, when they did the Charlie Hebdo drawings of Muhammad, there were people that broke into that comic facility and they killed people because they were so upset that, you know, people drew the Muhammad, you know, Salaf, whatever the fuck you say, praise be upon him, and they decided to go and kill the dude.
00:12:43.000Kill the dudes, kill multiple people on that attack.
00:12:45.000I don't like the fact that for the people that champion Islam, it seems like they do so in an exclusionary manner, that everybody has to be Islamic, that everybody has to be part of their religion, and that they can attack and kill people who disagree with their religion, because I think one of the most beautiful things about the United States is the fact that we can tell a cop to fuck off,
00:13:01.000that we can tell a Christian to fuck off, that we can tell I want Muslims to fuck off, that we can draw whatever we want, make fun of whatever we want, make porn out of whatever the fuck we want.
00:13:07.000And I would think that that is the coolest thing in the United States, and I think that that's what allows us to even do what we're doing here today.
00:13:12.000And I don't think any Islamic country or Muslim majority country has been able to achieve the world domination that the United States has when it comes to military, economy, and most importantly, culture.
00:13:27.000So first of all, I agree with his analysis of America and American culture in current times.
00:13:34.000When he's mentioned about advancements, that's right in current times, but then obviously that's failing and ignoring the entire history, right?
00:13:40.000So what that demonstrates is you don't need to be a specific culture or religion because if you look at history, it was many of the advancements that were made both in science, culture, literature, The renaissance in terms of Greek philosophy, theology, science, all of it came from the Islamic civilizations.
00:13:58.000So they weren't backward, they were actually visionary in the past.
00:14:02.000Obviously things develop, things change.
00:14:04.000In terms of Islam being exclusionary, that's completely not true.
00:14:07.000Islam within Or totalitarity allows all religions, cultures and psychologies within it.
00:14:15.000Now in terms of what he's talking about in terms of freedom, I'm for all the freedom.
00:14:18.000The problem is we're seeing in real time that this propaganda no longer works because in reality we've seen it.
00:14:25.000You speak against Judaism, you speak against Zionism, and they completely want to censor you.
00:14:29.000You're not allowed to mention the Holocaust in certain countries because you're going to be locked up, put in the gulags.
00:14:33.000You're not allowed right now in the United States.
00:14:35.000You can't even do BDS in 34 states because of Zionism.
00:14:40.000So as much as he wants to say, it's not.
00:14:42.000And when you look at extremism, yes, there are extreme elements within Islam.
00:15:45.000We got multiculturalism and we got former expanded governments from Romans.
00:15:49.000We got the whole industrial age from Europe.
00:15:51.000We got the age of the Catholic Church.
00:15:53.000These civilizations come and they go and we don't go back to them.
00:15:56.000Sometimes people have a lot to contribute to the world, and then we get those things, and then the world moves on.
00:16:00.000You just never turn around and go back.
00:16:02.000If there was such an Islamic golden age, and if Muslims contributed so much to the world and so much to world culture, why did they lose it all?
00:16:09.000Why don't we see them continue to dominate today?
00:16:12.000And so far as, like, in the United States, you can't make fun of Nazis, or you can't make fun of Jews, or you can't make fun of whatever.
00:16:17.000You can make fun of whatever you want here.
00:16:18.000The laws will protect you doing whatever.
00:16:20.000That doesn't mean you don't necessarily get hosted on any platforms.
00:16:22.000But, I mean, again, like, yeah, there might be some platforms that would ban you if you I don't have to worry about getting banned.
00:16:31.000I have to worry about getting beheaded.
00:16:33.000I think there's a significant difference there.
00:16:34.000I think I'd rather be worried about Susan coming after me on YouTube than I would be about Abdel coming after me to murder me because I said something about his religion that he doesn't like.
00:17:05.000A different religion, if you're a Muslim or Christian, being killed by Brett Weinstein or whatever the name is.
00:17:09.000So you've got these ideas in many cultures.
00:17:13.000In terms of what you said, of course, we received democracies from the Greeks, but do you know how we got that information from the Greeks?
00:17:56.000But he would never say, I hate Judaism, even though Judaism is much more extreme.
00:17:59.000Any problem someone like him would ever have with Islam, I've always explained and I've always shown that Judaism is much more extreme in all aspects, in all endeavours.
00:18:09.000So yeah, in terms of YouTube being banned.
00:18:11.000So yeah, you can deep platform someone, you could take someone's voice away.
00:18:34.000I mean, I'll shit on Judaism, but the problem is not many people care.
00:18:39.000If I go online and I start talking about, like, apparently Jewish people bite off foreskins or some shit when they circumcise kids, like, every Jewish friend I have or every Jewish guy online will be like, yeah, that's pretty weird.
00:18:49.000If I go online and I talk about marrying a fucking nine-year-old, or if I do, like, here's a funny picture of Muhammad AI-generated, I've got like five million death threats in my inbox.
00:18:58.000We can pretend that we're just as worried about a Weinstein stabbing you for being Christian as we would be about Muhammad beheading you for being Christian or Jewish.
00:19:08.000But, I mean, where are all of the Muslims trying to immigrate to?
00:19:11.000And where are all of the Christians and Jews going?
00:19:13.000I don't see this reverse, like, Christians and Jews feeling like they can find safe havens in these Arab-majority Muslim countries.
00:19:18.000I do see a lot of Muslims from those countries trying to go to Europe and trying to go to the United States, and I think there's a reason for that.
00:19:35.000Lucas Gage is a prime example of someone who calls Jews out and completely is banned.
00:19:40.000So you would, in terms of death threats, I mean, I've had a huge amount of death threats from Zionists, right?
00:19:43.000And I've had my name on a missile, so let's not pretend that this is only happening one way, right?
00:19:47.000And proportionally, there's two billion Muslims.
00:19:49.000There's only a small people, small number of Jews, and yeah, The death threats are disproportionate.
00:19:53.000In terms of when you talk about marrying an animal, someone like you is an example that you would be willing to mention that.
00:19:57.000And again, you probably, and I know you don't know the epistemology and the hermeneutics behind that argument, but you wouldn't mention about Judaism, which literally says marry three-year-olds.
00:20:05.000And this is an example of when we're mentioned, as an example, when I mention in debates, they lose their minds.
00:20:20.000So, of course, The reason people emigrate to Western countries, and not obviously Israel, is because due to Zionist agenda, basically Muslim countries have been bombed to the ground.
00:20:31.000Now, when there's certain countries that have basically not been bombed to the ground, we're seeing emigration happening.
00:20:36.000We're seeing basically people from Britain go to Dubai and go to UAE. So it's not specifically about that, but it's really about a 20-year, even longer, psychological impact of destroying these countries for Israel.
00:21:13.000I grew up in the Archdiocese in Omaha, Nebraska.
00:21:16.000I've seen a lot of different things between different Catholic churches.
00:21:19.000I've seen a lot of different things in a Catholic church.
00:21:20.000I don't like generalizing any one particular religion because it feels really silly to do so.
00:21:24.000If you look at the culture and how people operate in Saudi Arabia, and then you compare that to the people, the Houthis in Yemen, you compare that to absolute monarchs in the Gulf states compared to the secular dictatorship in Egypt compared to the Islamists.
00:21:38.000Muslimist dictatorship, the Ayatollah in Iran.
00:21:40.000There are so many different types of Muslim people all over the world.
00:21:44.000Muslims in the United States are going to be way different.
00:21:46.000Muslims in Miami are going to be way different than Muslims in Dearborn, Michigan, or Muslims in Europe, in France and Paris, in London.
00:22:00.000Judaism is, I wouldn't say anything is the religion of peace.
00:22:03.000No, I think that people can be violent with religions and people can be not violent with religions.
00:22:08.000It really just depends on the individual actors.
00:22:10.000I do think that Islam kind of has a problem sometimes and that Islam kind of has baked into it more political ideology, which I think can be problematic.
00:22:17.000But, I mean, there are like two billion Muslims on the planet.
00:22:19.000And I think that they're, you know, ironically enough, that was brought up in the last point, is like these countries have been destroyed.
00:22:24.000I mean, I'm pretty sure that Arabs have probably killed each other more than any Western intervention countries have.
00:22:29.000At least for the 1900s and onwards, or the 1920s and onwards at least.
00:22:33.000Real quick, Destiny, if you're going to choose a religion to go to, let's just say you're going to choose a religion to go towards, which would it be?
00:22:47.000From all the things that I've learned about religion, I like Christianity, because I feel like the coolest cheerleader guy is Jesus, because he's super selfless, he's obviously strong, he's God, he does all this shit, but he handles, he treats everybody with respect, even sinners, don't judge the sinner, judge the sin.
00:23:01.000I feel like Jesus is the prime example of if every single person on the planet could be a particular figure, he would be the one that you would want to be like.
00:23:08.000So, fuck the Jews for killing him, I'll say that, okay?
00:23:29.000In terms of Islam being a political ideology, again, this is like a false norma and false notion that's applied.
00:23:34.000Because actually every ideology, whether it's Western or religious, has political elements in it, from Greek, from Plato's Republic, to even current times when you've basically got these scenarios happening.
00:23:46.000Actually, within the United Kingdom, Judaism actually has their own legal courts, they have their own police, so they have their own kind of political framework, even within Western countries.
00:23:56.000So when people make that argument, it's basically based on either Propaganda or they're seeing certain extreme elements within Islam and assuming and basically applying that to everybody else.
00:24:06.000But everything else, I agree with his assessment.
00:24:08.000In terms of Arabs killing each other, that's also fake as well, but we'll talk about that.
00:24:11.000I guess he's going to talk about Syria, but again, that was because of Western intervention.
00:25:33.000And the reason is because it's a foreign country.
00:25:35.000And basically every country should put their own interests first.
00:25:38.000So the fact that you basically got our foreign nation appropriate in that country, and I say the same thing about United Kingdom as well, so we can apply to both in case they think it's a Brit talking about America.
00:25:46.000A foreign nation, you should never have a scenario where a foreign nation is basically being controlled by a foreign entity.
00:25:53.000Now, if America wasn't funding Israel, you wouldn't have many of the problems that we have in the Middle East.
00:25:57.000If you believe in this idea, which many of us don't, but even if you believe in this idea of might is right.
00:26:02.000Well, might should be based on individual bases.
00:26:04.000It shouldn't be based on, for example, America's might being used by lobbyists within America to basically destroy the country.
00:26:11.000If you also want safety in America, you would ensure that you don't basically help or be complicit with basically a crazy nation that is basically destroying the Middle East, trying everything in its power to cause world war.
00:26:25.000When I come here, I'm shocked at the level of poverty that's here, the level of how people are struggling on the streets of America.
00:26:31.000There was a study come out recently that people are trying to decide whether to pay the bills or whether to basically have food.
00:26:42.000So when you've got Americans doing that and then this money is going to Israel or going to Ukraine or many of these foreign nations, you're basically having a scenario where Americans are struggling.
00:26:50.000The second thing is all this does is benefit the military-industrial complex.
00:26:54.000And again, who controls the military-industrial complex?
00:26:58.000If China, Russia or any other foreign nations were in the same situation, no one would accept it.
00:27:02.000So yeah, I believe that America should not be funding foreign nations when it comes to war.
00:27:06.000I'm not a pro complete exclusionary ideology that I would just not logistically I don't think that makes sense even from a multi popularity perspective but you should not have a scenario where you basically have a foreign nation that controls America and then because of that it's acting the way it's what what Israel would never ever act in the way it's doing with Iran if it didn't have this idea that we're gonna get America we're gonna get Britain we're gonna get these foreign nations to come and back us up okay that is two minutes go ahead Destiny your response Yeah,
00:27:33.000I think it's just a really basic game theory.
00:27:35.000If you live on a block with 10 people and you say, hey, nobody's allowed to form any alliances, we all have to be on ourselves or on our own, what's going to happen is two neighbors are going to team up, three neighbors are going to team up, five neighbors are going to team up, and then you who are all like individuals are going to be like, okay, well, Fuck us, because now five neighbors are going to come and beat one guy.
00:27:52.000Five neighbors are going to come and beat another guy.
00:27:59.000We can't navigate the world pretending that if we decide to pull all of our money back from everybody, that everybody else in the world is going to do the same.
00:28:05.000If the United States leaves some particular place, Russia will fill the absence.
00:28:56.000We have to have people that are on our side because if they're not on our side, they're going to join somebody else.
00:28:59.000If somebody's about to come and knock your door down and America says, eh, we're not going to help you, they're not going to sit there and have their house be demolished.
00:29:04.000They're either going to join the enemy or they're going to join somebody else.
00:29:06.000You know, I don't think the move in World War II would have been to say, like, oh, well, we'll let Nazi Germany take over the entirety of Europe and we'll see what happens after that.
00:29:13.000Hopefully they don't come for us, even though Japan did with Pearl Harbor.
00:29:17.000Yeah, I think that having alliances is important.
00:29:18.000I think that it ensures our ability to operate in the world freely.
00:29:21.000I think it gives us access to all sorts of other countries and cultures in ways that we wouldn't otherwise.
00:29:24.000And I think that that is a value that we should absolutely continue to champion in the United States.
00:29:27.000Okay, I don't think you heard my argument because I literally said don't be exclusionary, right?
00:29:35.000I agree that you need trade agreements.
00:29:37.000What I am saying is do not Basically, give money away to a country that is then destabilizing a region and actually having threats in your own country and then have a scenario where your own people are struggling.
00:29:50.000You can, for example, the United States has trade agreements with Saudi.
00:29:54.000That's probably not a great example because of the Houthis.
00:29:56.000But, for example, the United States have trade agreements with the UAE. They have trade agreements with...
00:30:01.000Jordan and many other countries, it doesn't mean that they're basically financially funding them to help with the genocide or basically financially funding them to help destabilize the region.
00:30:10.000The whole problem what we have is when the United States has become the tool of Israel, you have a scenario where the entire region is...
00:30:19.000Basically, there's complete havoc in the region.
00:30:21.000That causes a problem within the region and is actually a threat to the United States from a financial perspective and from a stability perspective and a safety perspective.
00:30:29.000And on top of that as well, it's a problem in terms of...
00:31:16.000Sending money for basically no reason other than destabilizing the region and gifting that money, essentially.
00:31:22.000Hence why you had basically a bill go through now, which was basically to gift them because they're struggling right now.
00:31:27.000Iron Dome is financially supported by America, which again gives them that vigor to basically start being so crazy and destabilizing the region.
00:31:34.000When you look at many of their acts, they've done them acts thinking, we've got this backup from the United States so we can act irrationally.
00:31:41.000And when you've got an irrational actor, the risk for us is that there could be one or three.
00:31:46.000Yeah, I mean, when you look at who's destabilizing the Middle East right now, I don't think Israel is the source of the destabilization.
00:31:52.000I think Iran and their funding of Hezbollah in Lebanon, or Iran's funding of the Houthis in Yemen, or Iran's funding and support for Hamas in Israel, I think that this is a far greater source of destabilization than anything that the United States might be contributing.
00:32:04.000If you look at raw cost of lives, the Iran-Iraq war cost some one to two million lives, which is more than Every single Israeli-Palestinian-Arab conflict combined times ten.
00:32:14.000So it's not even close to the level of destabilization.
00:32:17.000And then when we look at, like, we're destabilizing the Middle East by supporting Israel, we need to pull out so what?
00:32:26.000So it can look more like Iraq or Iran?
00:32:28.000Like, what are our stable bastions of thriving Muslim-majority, you know, theocracies or dictatorships in the Middle East that we want everything to look more similar to?
00:32:38.000I think that Israel is doing pretty good considering they're sitting on land with almost no natural resources.
00:32:42.000All of their industry comes from technology and the agriculture that they've brutally terraformed the land to support.
00:32:48.000I think that it's good to support Israel there.
00:32:49.000I think that they do a lot of good for the United States.
00:32:51.000I think they give us a good eye into the Middle East.
00:32:52.000I think it's a good example of a democratic country working even in the Middle East better than anything else surrounding them.
00:32:57.000And I think we should continue to support said country because, yeah.
00:34:11.000So when you look at it, the acts of Iran when it comes to financially funding the defense That you've got against Israeli aggression in the Middle East or, for example, Israeli aggression through America because they're forcing them through the control of the United States.
00:34:50.000They were killed for nothing and hence why many people who I know, such as Lucas Gage, realised that, wait, I'm fighting this war for this foreign nation and they had an epiphany and realised that the Zionist state is a huge problem for world peace.
00:35:04.000Yeah, the United States and the West was not the reason for the Iran-Iraq war.
00:35:08.000The United States did not tell Saddam Hussein to invade Kuwait.
00:35:11.000The United States did not tell Saddam Hussein to gas the Kurdish people.
00:35:14.000The United States did not tell Assad to gas his own people.
00:35:16.000The United States was not the instigator for the Syrian civil war.
00:35:19.000The United States did not cause the Arab Spring to erupt all across the Arab world.
00:35:25.000That the United States is so singularly powerful that it can uniquely disrupt and cause all of these countries to fall into disarray is probably more reflection on those countries than any U.S. foreign policy.
00:35:34.000I acknowledge that, especially through the Cold War, the United States was quite interventionalist in probably negative ways in a lot of different countries, and the Middle East is not accepted from that.
00:35:42.000However, a lot of that was only possible because of the destabilization that already existed in these countries.
00:35:46.000Even with the installation of the Shah, the only reason why that was even able to happen is because that country was experiencing massive issues relating to unemployment.
00:35:53.000That's why they wanted to nationalize the oil fields.
00:35:54.000That's why BP and Great Britain begged us to come in and help them control the assets that they'd invested all that money into.
00:36:00.000I'm not saying that US or foreign action is perfect here, but these countries all have issues relating to how they run, relating to how their leaders conduct themselves in war, relating to, you know, Yeah.
00:36:32.000Then maybe they don't need to be rulers.
00:36:35.000If they could be so easily meddled with or so easily influenced by the United States because of things that have happened, you know, 30, 40, 50 years ago, I don't know if that's like a strong argument for the stability of any of these countries.
00:36:45.000Because again, if it's not us meddling in them, what?
00:36:49.000You know, we can say no, but like people complain about, oh, you know, Al-Qaeda came from the Mujahideen and blah, blah, blah.
00:36:54.000Well, who did we fund them to fight off?
00:36:55.000It was because the Soviets were trying to install their own government in Afghanistan.
00:36:58.000Yeah, again, world meddling is not unique to any country.
00:37:00.000We don't do it as much as we used to, and I understand that there are issues that happen in the Middle East because of some meddling, but they can't all be blamed on the United States.
00:37:10.000Yeah, so look, this is just completely inaccurate and changing history to what it is, right?
00:37:15.000Like, it's pretending that basically in 1988, when them students took off over the U.S. Embassy and exposed the fact that the U.S. directly intervened and overthrew the democracy in Iran, didn't happen.
00:37:42.000You had basically a scenario where there was people protesting, which you have in many countries, disagreeing with Bashar, and then this was propagated through the media, through the West, To essentially cause a huge amount of protest because this is what they do.
00:37:56.000They know that when you propagate a certain amount of information and you cause a populist to basically be in open arms, you can basically destabilise the country.
00:38:18.000And now you're saying it's completely unfathomable that the United States could dominate.
00:38:23.000But this is, again, in Accra, because when you look at the actual situation that occurred, and we mentioned them, the United States was involved.
00:38:30.000So, for example, when you look at Saddam Hussein, Saddam Hussein had very good relations with the United States.
00:38:59.000Power to do so, but not the military power, not the other aspects that basically intelligence and various other things that which the United States basically provides.
00:39:07.000So when you look at that region, and when I say the United States, I'm saying it's for Israel.
00:39:11.000It's for that country because they want destabilization.
00:39:15.000If you want, I'll give you another 30 if you need to finish.
00:39:20.000Destiny, then we can hit the next topic if you guys feel it.
00:39:22.000Yeah, I mean, stable countries don't have protests that turn into attempted coups.
00:39:26.000It just doesn't happen, no matter how strong you think the United States is.
00:39:28.000When I say that we dominate, I mean that we dominate economically and we dominate culturally.
00:39:32.000Everybody listens to our music, everybody listens to our movies, everybody watches our podcast.
00:39:36.000You probably got people in the Middle East watching this podcast right now, as long as it's not illegal in their particular country to watch.
00:39:40.000That's what I mean when I talk about U.S. domination.
00:39:41.000I don't mean we're necessarily intervening in every single country.
00:39:44.000We do try to intervene in some countries, but it's not because—if you look at the history of Yemen, Yemeni destabilization didn't happen because of the United States.
00:39:51.000This has been a destabilized country for decades.
00:39:55.000There have been fights going back to, from my recollection, at least the 60s, where tons of Middle Eastern countries have huge investments in what's going on in Yemen and supporting different leaders.
00:40:16.000I don't think a lot of it is defensible.
00:40:23.000Or to say that these countries have no autonomy and they just can't resist and they're getting constantly overthrown and school students funded by the United States and Twitter are able to completely destroy the entire country of Syria.
00:40:32.000I think that there are more fundamental problems that exist there if another country can give you a gentle push and all of a sudden your country falls into chaos.
00:40:42.000And then we'll move into the next topic.
00:40:44.000So look, the problem is that you are now making the argument that when you don't have, when someone isn't doing protests, and then there isn't outside interference, that that can't overthrow the country.
00:40:58.000We're seeing the college protests in the United States where they're basically the government is so harshly Harshly attacking the students and stopping them from doing so.
00:41:06.000Now imagine there was foreign intervention in that and you could basically have a scenario where the entire country could be overthrown.
00:41:49.000Because you think the foreign intervention can cause destabilization in a country.
00:41:53.000So every country knows that external forces are able to and do try and destabilize a country.
00:41:59.000And that doesn't mean that the country is weak.
00:42:01.000Sometimes a country could be like 50-50.
00:42:03.000You could have a country which, for example, in Turkey where you've got people like Erdogan who's more towards Islamic ideals, for example, or you've got the secularists.
00:42:09.000That country, if America wanted to basically do it and they tried to do it with Golan and so on and so forth, they could basically push it to have it being overthrown.
00:42:37.000I would just say that if you look at the United States and you compare TikTok to whatever the U.S. was doing in Syria or whatever the U.S. is doing in any other country, TikTok is a massive application that is downloaded on over 200 million phones in the United States.
00:42:53.000The United States is not doing a propaganda campaign on that level.
00:42:57.000When we say that the United States is overthrowing all of these Middle Eastern countries, we're talking about these incredibly subtle things that are very hard to source or very hard to find.
00:43:03.000That is in no way comparable to day talk.
00:43:04.000And also, the comparison of college students right now on U.S. campuses, they're not about to overthrow the government.
00:43:09.000It's going to be a drama, it's going to be a meme for a week or two more or however long this lasts, and then they're going to go back to school and everybody's going to forget about it because that's how protests typically go in the United States.
00:43:16.000And when you say in the United States, like, you know, couldn't...
00:43:19.000Foreign powers, you know, try to influence you guys.
00:43:21.000And like, well, couldn't that be happening now?
00:43:22.000But the United States is a stable democracy.
00:43:24.000So the idea of this country being cooed by a bunch of college students is a lot less likely because we have stronger institutions here and we guard our democratic principles here much closer than other countries do.
00:43:57.000I think it's important that when we consider genocide, we have to consider that a country is operating with the highly special intent to completely, or it's a highly special intent to eliminate, in whole or in part, a group of people.
00:44:08.000And the origination of this hatred, of this desire to eliminate a group of people, can't simply be part of war.
00:44:18.000It's highly specialized when we're talking about genocide.
00:44:20.000I think that we have to be really careful when we set the precedent of these two people at war, therefore, one person is genociding the other.
00:44:26.000Because what you essentially do in that case is you rob every single nation of the ability to go to war.
00:44:31.000You know, was the United States engaged in genocide against Afghanistan?
00:44:34.000Is Russia engaged in genocide against Ukraine?
00:44:37.000Did we engage in genocide against Japan when we nuke them or when we firebomb Tokyo?
00:44:43.000You know, like in every single conflict that you have, there's going to be one group of people trying to defeat another group of people.
00:44:50.000So I think that if we want to claim that Israel is engaged in genocide, I think that we need to be very careful when we look at that highly special intent.
00:44:55.000And I think we need to be careful that we're not confusing military actions, which there are a lot of, with genocidal actions.
00:45:01.000There could be individual people that are engaged in genocidal rhetoric or in genocidal action, and I think if that's happening, those individual people, of course, should be held responsible.
00:45:08.000But I think that if we look at the overall action of Israel, we see that, like, you know, 30,000 people have been killed and, like, twice as many bombs have been dropped.
00:45:17.000We see that the amount of warning Israel takes to try to, you know, have people flee from one side to the other.
00:45:21.000You know, Israel's like, hey, you guys need to leave.
00:45:24.000Basically two weeks before any military operations began, when they're making phone calls to apartment buildings, when they're spending $500,000 on missiles to, like, precisely target people.
00:45:32.000The idea that Israel is engaged in some genocidal action while also taking all of these precautions, while opening up more and more humanitarian ways to get food in, you know, while...
00:45:41.000It just doesn't really make sense, other than just, like, screaming the death toll over and over again, or saying, women and children, this number, and here's the death toll, and just screaming that over and over and over again.
00:45:50.000There is no real argument here that Israel is engaging in genocide against any of the people in Gaza.
00:46:04.000It is the elimination of a part of a people because of their basic ethnicity, which is being Palestinian.
00:46:10.000It's obviously not based on religion because these guys are killing Christians and Muslims and oppressing Jews in Israel, but that's a separate point.
00:46:18.000The ICJ have also stated that there is a plausible case for genocide.
00:46:23.000Now, when Destiny's made his argument, he's not explained that, according to his definition then, what would be a genocide, because he's given many examples of certain acts that occurred, but then he's not explained what genocide is, because if he's saying that whenever there is an act of war, there can't be genocide,
00:46:42.000Now, coming back to it, there has been a huge number of people who've been killed, more than 40,000.
00:46:47.000The vast majority of them are women and children.
00:46:50.000And he mentioned that they're targeting precisely.
00:46:53.000If they're targeting precisely, which is what his last point was, And then they're killing so many women and children, that literally tells you that the intent is to kill women and children, unless they're not targeting precisely.
00:47:05.000In addition to that, they claim that they are trying to go for Hamas.
00:47:08.000Up to now, we have no idea how many Hamas people have been killed.
00:47:12.000They initially were getting exposed because there was one to two hundred.
00:47:15.000So they were claiming that for every one Hamas, there was two hundred.
00:47:19.000And when they started getting exposed so badly, they changed the numbers.
00:47:22.000They changed the numbers and now they're like, oh, 13,000 Hamas people have been killed.
00:47:53.000In reality, they are committing a genocide.
00:47:55.000They are trying to take out an entire people.
00:47:56.000And they're doing it because they are Palestinian.
00:47:59.000So there's two essential elements when we're defining genocide.
00:48:02.000You need the special intent, and then you need to combine it with some action.
00:48:06.000Eliminating a group of people, in part, is not qualifying as a special intent.
00:48:10.000The special intent has to be absent any reason for war.
00:48:13.000It can't just be, I'm going to war with somebody, so I'm trying to blow up, like, you know, part of the military installation, trying to blow up some city.
00:48:29.000Conducting military operations, like you would in war.
00:48:32.000You know, what are all the planes shooting at?
00:48:33.000What are all the artillery shooting at?
00:48:35.000Is it really only 35,000 people have been killed with all of these Israeli munitions, with all of the Israeli airstrikes?
00:48:40.000Who goes to genocide a group of people while telling all of them to flee first?
00:48:44.000Who goes to genocide a group of people while saying like, hey, we're going to make phone calls, and hey, we're going to open up humanitarian corridors, and hey, we're going to try to ensure that enough aid is getting in?
00:49:14.000And the chief surgeon of that al-Shifa hospital said they weren't.
00:49:17.000We found CCTV footage that showed hostages literally being taken into the hospital, with the doctors literally observing it.
00:49:23.000We saw Amnesty International say in 2014 that they know that al-Shifa hospital is operating an interrogation room.
00:49:28.000All of these things have been well documented by NGOs, by international humanitarian organizations and everything, but for some reason we all ignore it when we talk about Hamas.
00:49:35.000Hamas does everything they can to induce civilian death, and they continue to do so because they know that it benefits them internationally because people continue to obsess over the numbers.
00:49:42.000The ICJ did not say that there is a plausible case of genocide happening right now.
00:49:45.000They said that it was plausible that the rights of the Palestinians were being infringed based on the genocide convention.
00:49:49.000The ex-leader, the ex-president of the ICJ literally just did an interview on the BBC clarifying this, that they were not asked to rule on the plausibility of the genocide.
00:49:57.000There's not even a part in that genocide convention that tells a state not to commit genocide.
00:50:00.000It's just telling people to protect their rights against it, and it is plausible, meaning that prima facie, if the facts are true, it could be the case that the Palestinians are having their rights to not be genocide and infringed, but the International Court of Just does not make an actual ruling on that.
00:50:12.000And then also, as a real quick final point, when we say 7,000...
00:50:15.000Hamas themselves claim that 7,000 to 8,000 people that have been killed were literally militants, and that's the Hamas numbers.
00:50:21.000If that's true, then the ratio of militants to civilian killed in this war is already exceeding every single prior military conflict, and that's operating in the most densely populated urban environment ever against an enemy militant that is explicitly trying to induce as much civilian death as possible.
00:51:47.000The most embarrassing thing was some of those videos where they were showing weapons in...
00:51:51.000In certain areas where they couldn't even be in MRI rooms.
00:51:56.000So they were, if they've been exposed so badly in terms of Al Shafar, Al Shafar was not a military place.
00:52:01.000What happened was there were some injured people who were taken there because injured people, irrespective of whether they're civilians or not, will be taken to certain hospitals.
00:52:09.000And that happened to the Israeli hostages as well because they were injured.
00:52:13.000And then doctors do their oath of looking after them and that's what they did.
00:52:16.000Unlike the Israeli doctors who were basically supporting this genocide and supporting the attack on hospitals.
00:52:21.000This attack, this fake news about hospitals only because there was Oprah about the first hospital they attacked and they got exposed so badly.
00:52:28.000In terms of the ICJ, this is fake news, what you're saying.
00:52:30.000They literally said it was a plausible case of genocide.
00:52:32.000And then you said, oh, and they're saying...
00:52:33.000That the case was there to show that there was a genocide.
00:52:36.000So you admitted it in your own argument.
00:52:38.000Hamas' number never said there were 7,000 or 8,000 Hamas people killed.
00:53:18.000They did it with very little satisfaction.
00:53:21.000But then Israel literally came back through and found that al-Shifa had been re-inhabited by Islamic Jihad, by Hamas, and they had a whole other fight a month ago here.
00:53:30.000Were they fighting for two weeks against Palestinian civilians in that hospital?
00:53:34.000The idea is that they've arrested 900 people as part of their rate, 500 that they've already confirmed as being part of Hamas or being part of Palestinian Islamic Jihad.
00:53:41.000There's no way that that second siege took two whole weeks if it was just civilians.
00:54:29.000Hamas is not actively trying to engage in exactly this type of behavior.
00:54:33.000And then to say, oh, well, I've never heard of that before.
00:54:35.000Again, if you trust these international organizations like Amnesty International, Amnesty International has it in part of their report for the 2014 going over a protective edge with that whole military operation.
00:54:45.000They show that there is an interrogation torture room as part of the al-Shifa hospital.
00:55:04.000And then, Suleiman, you can finish it, and then I will, I think you go first for the second question, because Destiny went first on this one, then Destiny will get last word on the next one.
00:55:57.000What we do know is as soon as it was undarked or we were able to see what actually happened, we saw a scenario where they had killed so many civilians.
00:57:23.000So, the next question we're going to get into, and this one, I think Suleiman's going to kick this one off, and then Destin will get the last word.
00:57:29.000Is anti-Semitism used to stop free speech?
00:57:34.000The question again is, or the topic is, is anti-Semitism used to stop free speech?
00:57:43.000And I hope Destiny's consistent on this because he gave us a whole speech at the beginning about how you could basically attack Islam and there should be no problem with it.
00:57:50.000The same people who were crying and crying and crying about identity politics are the same people who are literally crying about anti-Semitism.
00:57:59.000You basically look at the US government saying that anti-Semitism has occurred when hardly any anti-Semitism has occurred in the universities.
00:58:05.000Again, many of those claims were debunked.
00:58:08.000What they really don't want, and they've said it and they proved it by the bill that was sent to the House of Congress, they don't want you to call out the state of Israel because as soon as you call out that state, they're going to be exposed.
00:58:17.000You can't Call out the Zionist control of America and Britain, because again, that's going to be anti-Semitism.
00:58:23.000And what they've done as well with anti-Semitism, they made the parameters so broad that anything can be anti-Semitism.
00:58:29.000So for example now, and these are the same people who used to cry about identity politics when it comes to racism, when it comes to Islamophobia, when it comes to these various other things.
00:58:36.000So yeah, anti-Semitism has been used to end free speech.
00:58:40.000They did it in certain European countries when it was denial of the Holocaust.
00:58:43.000Why isn't an individual able to have free speech and deny it?
00:58:47.000In the United States, you guys had about, as I believe it, 32 states that don't even let you freely take part in BDS, which is boycotting Israel.
00:58:55.000This is the level of propaganda that occurs.
00:58:57.000And now the university protests have been shut down based on these false accusations of anti-Semitism.
00:59:03.000You see people being banned on Twitter for this.
00:59:28.000They want to basically make it so that anyone who calls out this Zionist terrorist regime, you basically have a scenario where you're basically given these false accusations of anti-Semitism.
00:59:57.000Again, Muslims will threaten to kill you if you post pictures of Muhammad on Twitter.
01:00:00.000There's not a bigger attack against freedom of speech than somebody threatening to behead you because you drew a picture of their favorite superhero.
01:00:06.000I think that one of the things I don't like when we talk about anti-Semitism a lot, and people do this a lot, is people aren't honest about their positions.
01:00:13.000I think in the United States, you should be allowed to be anti-Semitic.
01:00:15.000That's part of your constitutional God-given right.
01:00:20.000In the United States, that's protected speech.
01:00:21.000You might get banned on some platforms for it, but you have the right to say those things.
01:00:24.000That being said, there'll be people that will walk around and say things like, oh, no, I'm not anti-Semitic.
01:00:28.000I just think that there's a reason why Jews have been kicked out of every single country they've ever been a part of, and I think that Jews are also controlling the United States of America, and I think that Jews in the United States of America also have more allegiance to Israel, and I think that Jews were actually behind 9-11, and I think that Jews actually have special warnings.
01:00:45.000I'll say I'm Islamophobic when I fight against Muslims online.
01:00:47.000If I was going to fight against Jews online over their dumb religious shit, I'd say I'm anti-Jewish or whatever the fuck.
01:00:51.000But don't sit here and pretend that, oh no, it's just me doing my talking points and I had no idea that using these phrases was considered anti-Semitic.
01:00:57.000I had no idea that walking up to a Jew and saying, Christ is king!
01:00:59.000I don't think any fucking Christian has ever said that until it became popular to use it as a way to bully fucking Jewish people.
01:01:06.000I grew up Catholic for, I was a Catholic for 12 years.
01:01:08.000I don't remember hearing all the screaming about Christ as king.
01:01:11.000Yeah, and as far as the university protesters go, listen, you have a right on the university to protest, but it is a university.
01:01:18.000You have to do it in an appropriate manner and place, or time, manner, and place, meaning you're not allowed to set up encampments for weeks and weeks, or days and days.
01:01:24.000You're not allowed to block students from going to class.
01:02:23.000There's Jewish people in Israel that are oppressed.
01:02:25.000But yes, the Zionist control, and remember, there's much more Christian Zionists than there is Jewish Zionists, of the United States is prevalent.
01:02:32.000And these people want to end it and make it the same because they want to make it look like that you're being anti-Semitic so that you basically have a scenario where you're put in prison or they take away your job.
01:02:41.000You saw that very first Harvard letter where there was an uproar just because the students were calling out the treatment of the Palestinians and they said they're not going to get a job.
01:03:32.000They're like, well, this is ridiculous to say that this isn't part of Christianity.
01:03:34.000Also, having the belief that basically the Jews killed Jesus, they're allowed to have that position because, again, this is their ideological position.
01:03:40.000You shouldn't have no issue with it whatsoever.
01:03:42.000In terms of the university protests, the reason they banned it has nothing to do with certain regulations that were not met is because the Zionists were being exposed.
01:03:49.000Everyone was talking about it in the media.
01:03:50.000There was going to be a huge amount of movement.
01:04:29.000You know, obviously, like I told y'all before, I'm just moderating it, man, making it fair for both parties so they can get their points because I think it's really important to be able to have these ideas and hash them out together.
01:04:56.000I don't think the bell in Congress is making it illegal.
01:04:58.000I think it is providing it the same protections that you have for, you know, attacking somebody for their sexuality or attacking somebody for their religion if you're like an employer or if you like own a house and you're trying to rent a house to people.
01:05:06.000I don't think they're making anti-Zionism illegal.
01:05:08.000There's this talking point again that you can attack Islam but you can't attack Judaism.
01:05:13.000The reality is nobody really cares that much about the religion of Judaism.
01:05:18.000Most Jews in Israel don't care about the religion of Judaism.
01:05:22.000The people that are going to care the most are going to be those in the fucking West Bank They're trying to set up their little settlements and everything.
01:05:27.000They're not going to be online fighting with you on Twitter.
01:05:29.000I go on Twitter and I can shit on Jews in like 15 different ways and nobody gives a fuck because more of the crazy aspects of the Jewish religion, nobody actually cares about.
01:05:36.000Like, most Jewish people won't defend it.
01:05:37.000Whereas if I go online and I start talking about A.E. Sheriff, I start like putting pictures of Mohammed online, I've got like 15 million death threats in my inbox.
01:05:44.000But yeah, I mean, to reiterate, like, yeah, you should be able to, if you want to deny the Holocaust, if you want to deny, you know, Zionists their right to a country, if you want to say all those things in the United States, it should be allowed to be done and I believe it It's still a lot to be done, and there's no way to stop that unless the First Amendment is somehow revoked in the United States.
01:05:58.000If you're upset because people are banning you from certain platforms for it, then I would say that, yeah, I mean, that is what the platforms are doing, but I mean, that's not a freedom of speech violation.
01:06:07.000And I don't even know if I'm fully bought into this idea that Zionists get more protection than anything else.
01:06:11.000It feels like most of the media coverage has been insanely pro-Palestinian.
01:06:14.000If you look at Twitch, for instance, the platform that I'm banned from, Hassan Piker is literally the face of Of fucking Twitch politics.
01:06:20.000And Hamas Piker is literally an avowed supporter of terrorist attacks against Israel, of the destruction of the Israeli state, and will support, you know, the Houthis and the Hamas and the Palestinians in any way, shape, or form.
01:06:29.000And I'm sure when you go on YouTube, you find a ton of pro-Palestinian support as well.
01:06:32.000So this idea that you don't have support for Palestinians that's allowed to flourish on these social media platforms isn't even true in and of itself.
01:06:39.000All right, so if you guys want, we can have a fire run here where you guys can respond to each other and whatever.
01:07:12.000So, yeah, Destiny was supposed to get the last one on this one, which he just did just now.
01:07:16.000But if you guys want, because I saw that you wanted to address something, you can do a fire round while I put two minutes on the clock, and you guys can go back and forth.
01:07:23.00030 seconds, that'll be probably easier.
01:08:16.000So in terms of the reason you don't shit on Jews is because you know that it's somewhere you don't want to go down, right?
01:08:22.000You know it's the issues in the cause.
01:08:23.000We know the risks we take when we attack Zionism.
01:08:25.000I mean, to be clear, I shit on Jews if they're there to shit on, but like most of what you're bringing up, like they do like Jews control all of porn.
01:08:31.000Like these aren't even attacks on the Jewish- No, I didn't sell porn.
01:08:40.000Because if it's a clergyman, a clergyman represents the religion.
01:08:43.000So if an imam did it, it doesn't mean it would have a bit- people would think that you're basically attacking an imam and you're trying to attack Muslims or Islam in a way.
01:09:00.000And in terms of Hassan Piker, I don't know who he is, but I don't know his positions.
01:09:04.000But what I can say is there is a significant amount of content that is not allowed in those platforms.
01:09:09.000And in Twitter, Twitter is a prime example because when you look at the level of de-boosting that happens on pro-Palestinian accounts compared to Zionist accounts, it's significant.
01:09:16.000The only difference is the whole world is with Palestine.
01:09:17.000Wait, you think the de-boosting on Twitter is happening for Palestinians?
01:11:17.000So Zionists, so if Zionist, if the definition of Zionist is somebody who just wants a state of Israel, of course, they should hold office, right?
01:11:23.000What the problem is, is what I believe that someone shouldn't hold office in the United States is when they have Jew...
01:11:56.000Because then you basically got loyalty to two different countries.
01:11:58.000Now you could be Israeli, you could be like, for example, they make the same arguments about Ilhan Omar as well.
01:12:02.000And because your loyalty should be the United States and you shouldn't have someone, for example, if someone's got loyalty to Russia and the United States, there's going to be problems with that loyalty.
01:12:08.000But then in addition to that, and I make a further argument with that, and that is this, that somebody who holds the opportunity for a right to return also should not hold office in the United States and the United Kingdom.
01:12:19.000And the reason for that is because someone can be Hold the opportunity to have right to return.
01:12:27.000They can basically use it for the interest of Israel.
01:12:30.000And then they can go back to Israel and based on their right to return.
01:12:34.000Now your retort that will be, that's anti-Semitic because now you're basically saying no Jewish person can hold office.
01:12:39.000And my retort that is, if you stop the Israeli...
01:12:43.000A supremacist ideology of right to return, then you wouldn't have that problem.
01:12:47.000And so therefore, my argument is very simple, and it is.
01:12:50.000If you have dual citizenship, you shouldn't hold office.
01:12:52.000If you have right to return, you shouldn't hold office.
01:12:54.000And that way you know that the American interests are being put first and the interests of Britain are being put first.
01:13:00.000And the same problems you have in the United States, we have the exact same problems in Britain.
01:13:03.000So any argument I'm making there, you can apply to my country as well.
01:13:09.000I think it's in the U.S. Constitution that you cannot be a citizen of another country, so I'm okay with that in terms of the presidency.
01:13:21.000In terms of barring every single federal office from anybody having dual citizenship, Um, I don't have like super strong feelings on it, but I feel a little bit weird about it.
01:13:30.000I think that's probably okay if dual citizens are, you know, like members of Congress.
01:13:33.000Maybe, maybe not, but I'm like 51, 49.
01:13:46.000Yeah, but I'm saying if giving the right of return automatically disbarks you from holding office, it would be really strange because then effectively any country could just shut down whoever is president.
01:13:56.000Let's say we find out that Biden is part Irish or something, and all of a sudden the Republic of Ireland is like, actually, we're going to give right of return to every Irish person.
01:14:03.000Does Biden have to renounce his Irishness or something?
01:14:05.000Or couldn't you mess with any single member in office if a right of return is granted?
01:14:10.000It just seems like a really big clusterfuck of issues.
01:14:13.000Yeah, I don't have a strong position for, like, if people have dual citizenship, you know, maybe it's questionable, like, do we really want somebody voting on whether or not we should go to war with the country if they hold a citizenship in that country?
01:14:23.000I think you can make, like, strong arguments on either side of that.
01:14:25.000Like, should somebody have to revoke their citizenship just for running for office?
01:14:29.000Would this go all the way down to, like, the governor and the state assembly level?
01:14:32.000Like, maybe just for, you know, federal office, we would say this, but, yeah, I don't have strong opinions on this one or another, but I I don't agree with, like, if they've got right of return, every single Jew is disbarred from holding office, because then any country that offers a right of return means that, like, anybody from these types of countries wouldn't be allowed to hold office.
01:14:49.000In terms of Congress, the problem with your argument is that you're saying that the US president can't have dual citizenship, but then people who are Congress, people who are part of the senators, can essentially, who decide policy, who decide if you're going to go to war in certain aspects, in terms of policy,
01:15:05.000The things that can cause the destruction of the United States, if they put certain policies that internally can cause the destruction of the entire fabric of Western society, for example, certain people would make the argument, as an example, certain liberal ideas, Then you would basically be able to destroy a foreign nation based on those ideas.
01:15:21.000Hence why I agree with the constitution in terms of the president and I think it should be cascaded down.
01:15:26.000In terms of the right to return, yeah, look, there will be problems with it for sure, right?
01:15:32.000The problem is there's only one nation that has this supremacist ideology, which is Israel, where you have a right to return.
01:15:37.000It's merely because of your inherent race.
01:15:41.000And so for that reason, you have a problem where someone can go to the United States and destroy the nation and then use the right to return to go back.
01:15:50.000And that's why to safeguard the country.
01:15:53.000To safeguard the country from foreign intervention, which is something that Americans seem to be caring about.
01:15:57.000They talk about Russian intervention and Chinese intervention, but for some reason they don't care about Israeli intervention.
01:16:02.000A country who literally is forcing the United States to go to war, is forcing the United States to basically have less security, have more financial issues and so on and so forth, then I think when it becomes that major...
01:16:13.000You need to know that whoever is making decisions, they're making those decisions solely based on American interests and for the betterment of the United States.
01:16:20.000Because I'm all for, like, I agree with you at the beginning, there's a reason America is the best country in the world, and it should be left to do so, not without foreign intervention.
01:16:28.000A little bit of time on the clock with that one.
01:16:30.000What's your response to that, Destiny?
01:16:31.000Yeah, again, I don't have strong feelings on most of this.
01:16:34.000The strongest one, just on the right of return, I don't know every country's immigration policy, but I'm sure there are other countries that allow you the ability to immigrate if you've got some ancestry or if you've got some ethnic tie to some particular thing.
01:17:14.000I feel like other countries here probably have other types of ability to return depending upon your ethnic background or religious background.
01:17:26.000Yeah, this is a big one here, and you guys obviously are definitely going to disagree with, and I'm glad we're on Rumble on this one.
01:17:33.000Was October 7th a military operation or a terrorist attack?
01:17:38.000Again, the question is, or the topic is, was October 7th a military operation or a terrorist attack?
01:17:46.000I'll take it to, I think you started last time, so Destiny, you can start on this one, and we'll do a fire run at the end of this one, and I'll let you take it.
01:17:56.000Yeah, a military operation seeks to accomplish military goals.
01:17:59.000If you're doing an invasion and you're a military, there's probably some military goal you're trying to accomplish.
01:18:04.000Hamas very clearly had no military goal they were trying to accomplish.
01:18:06.000The goal was to incite terror in the citizens.
01:18:08.000That's why thousands of rockets were launched at the beginning of the invasion.
01:18:11.000That's why when they cut through and they started going into Israel proper, they hit up kibbutzes, some of which had nothing to do with the military.
01:18:16.000They went to that Nova festival and they killed, raped, and took hostages from tons of people there.
01:18:20.000These people didn't present any sort of actual...
01:18:56.000All right, with another minute to spare, Suleman, let's go with you.
01:18:59.000Yeah, look, it was a military operation, right?
01:19:02.000You don't need to be a military to conduct a military operation.
01:19:05.000They're not allowed to have a military, right?
01:19:06.000So what the actual target was to go to do a military operation, the kibbutzes did hold military personnel, hence why that was their target.
01:19:16.000The Nova Festival was never meant to be there.
01:19:18.000It was extended by a day without anybody knowing it.
01:19:21.000They were meant to go to the kibbutz, get the Israeli hostages, military personnel, and swap them for the Palestinian hostages that are kept in Israeli prisons.
01:19:30.000And they are the same, because in reality many of them have not been held trial, they've basically been kept there, and they've basically been abused.
01:19:36.000The only difference is when the state of Israel does it, it's called prisoners, and when basically Palestinian does it, or Hamas does it, it's called hostages.
01:20:32.000We're expected to have such a multitude of hostages.
01:20:35.000And remember, all of our arguments are based on Israeli news.
01:20:38.000So really, the arguments are much stronger because this is even by their own news, they're making these arguments.
01:20:43.000One thing I appreciate what Destiny said is that they wanted to kill, they wanted to go after the Israelis, the state of Israel.
01:20:48.000And he is very much accurate in that because he didn't say Jews, because in reality, it was an attack on the state as opposed to a people because the Hamas charter is very clear that they don't have no issues with Jewish people.
01:21:59.000That original source is not an Israeli source.
01:22:01.000We can say the mass rape propaganda, but, I mean, we've got tons of eyewitness reports of hearing rapes happening and witnessing rapes happening.
01:22:08.000Now we've had people that were hostages that have come out who have said that they were sexually assaulted, and they know that other hostages were being sexually assaulted.
01:22:13.000And we've got a lot of charred bodies and a lot of dead people whose underwear were torn off, bodies where there was blood coming out of the vagina, bodies where the genitalia were shot over and over again.
01:22:23.000But the problem is that when you've got an invading terrorist organization that is raping you, they also tend to kill you as well.
01:22:28.000It's pretty hard to get away from that.
01:22:46.000Yeah, we can say that arguments are made all from the Israeli news, but I mean, whose fault is that?
01:22:50.000I mean, Hamas isn't open about anything.
01:22:52.000You know, when we go through and we try to audit Israel on some of these, you know, massacres in the past or some of the bad actions they've done, we can only do that because Israel is a democracy and we have the ability to actually audit them.
01:23:00.000That's why Israel hosts its own criticism in the form of B'Tselem or in the form of Haaretz.
01:23:04.000What is the Hamas equivalent to B'Tselem?
01:23:06.000What is the Hamas equivalent to Haaretz?
01:23:08.000They don't host any of their own criticism.
01:23:09.000They throw people on buildings and they kill people who think that they're in opposition to the government there.
01:24:39.000It got charred by Israelis when they were using Apache helicopters.
01:24:42.000As an example, 200 Palestinians were killed, or as they say, Hamas people, or the resistance were killed, and they basically counted them as Israeli numbers, and then later they found out, no, they weren't Israeli, they were Palestinian.
01:25:46.000You know, I... I asked you for the source on that, and I understand we're not going to have sources like right here in the middle of a debate, but that 40-beheaded baby thing did not come from an Israeli source.
01:25:54.000That's why you said a journalist, and then you said I-24 News.
01:25:58.000I don't believe that there was an Israeli source for any of that story.
01:26:01.000A lot of it got spread around on Twitter, but none of this actually came from Israel.
01:26:04.000None of this came from the government, none of it came from the IDF. It was memes that started to get snowballed on Twitter, and then started to get spread around, and people talked about it, but there was no actual...
01:26:52.000We would never do this, despite the fact that dead Hamas soldiers are being found with documents on them, giving them explicit instructions on how to ask for people to take their clothes off, how to ask for people to come with them, or how to take people hostage.
01:27:02.000And then we've got videos of them taking people hostages.
01:27:04.000We've got videos of people walking up and down cars seeing charred bodies and seeing dead people in cars.
01:27:08.000This was way before IDF choppers showed up and started firing.
01:27:11.000You don't think that any of these Israeli citizens that were walking up and down the highways finding all of the dead bodies, you don't think that any of them would have noticed that there were Apache helicopters that were raining down hellfire on any of the cars?
01:27:56.000What they didn't expect was for the Israelis to lose their mind and start attacking them and killing them and basically applying the Hannibal Directive in a mass scale.
01:28:05.000Hannibal Directive is they kill their own people so that they don't become hostages.
01:28:20.000In terms of Riz Cohen, I said to you, and it is, his testimony changed.
01:28:24.000And you mentioned in terms of the hostages held by Hamas.
01:28:30.000Bro, as soon as the hostages came out, all of them were literally saying they treat us really well, they didn't abuse us, they didn't sexually assault us.
01:28:36.000And then what happened was, the Israelis were like, what the hell?
01:28:39.000These Hamases, these guys are making Hamas look good.
01:28:41.000Like, they're treating them like angels.
01:28:43.000They're giving them food as they're eating food themselves.
01:28:45.000And then what they did was, when they started releasing hostages, they kept a blockade.
01:28:49.000And they didn't let them speak to the media for weeks and months to put the propaganda into their minds to control them, to manipulate them and make them lie.
01:29:45.000Yeah, for the hostages that came out initially.
01:29:47.000Yeah, the first hundred hostages that came out didn't say anything about mistreatment, of course, because they only let people out that had family members that were still being held hostage.
01:29:54.000You're not going to come out and be like, yeah, they're treated like shit in there.
01:29:58.000A lot of the hostages came out, yes, because they only allowed women and children and families to come out.
01:30:02.000Some of the hostages were, but some of them weren't.
01:30:04.000And this was a fake news, but this was what Zionists made.
01:30:06.000They made the argument that when that woman came out and literally said, we've been treated really well, they were like, oh, husband's still there.
01:30:13.000You don't think there's anything Do you have family members that are still being held from any of the...
01:30:15.000No, no, I just said some of them work, but some of them are.
01:30:16.000Even if it's not family members, the fact that you would come out and start talking about the hostages when they release you, wouldn't it make sense to tell...
01:30:21.000So why are they talking about it now, then?
01:30:22.000Well, now, because I don't even know if there are any hostages left alive.
01:30:25.000No, because Israel tried to do a ceasefire where they wanted to trade 40 hostages, and for some reason Israel's coming out of 33, because it sounds like Hamas doesn't even have 40 hostages to trade.
01:30:35.000But in reality, what's happened is, the reason they need to negotiate is because the disagreement, why no ceasefire is agreed, is because Hamas want a permanent ceasefire.
01:30:43.000Because the last ceasefire, what happened was, when they got their own Palestinian hostages back, even within them seven days, the Zionists took more hostages.
01:32:00.000Okay, if you're aware of that article- Check my threads.
01:32:01.000If you're aware of that article, do you think it's strange that the article had that they had fired on some likely Israeli civilians without even putting it on the headline?
01:32:07.000Wouldn't that seem like a really big story?
01:32:09.000In the article that you're talking about, because the original language is in Hebrew.
01:32:12.000I don't even know if this was published in English.
01:32:13.000In the Hebrew, they literally say at one point that they had shot, and there were probably some Israeli people that were still being held by a mosque.
01:33:19.000What the article will confirm is that there was shot artillery fire by the Israelis and in Kibbutz Beri, 118, 180 people were killed at that time.
01:34:46.000But what I'm trying to say is the actions of Israel have demonstrated that what they did was they killed a significant number of their own civilians.
01:35:56.000I think that when you talk about the IDF killing their own civilians, it's a common code that people use to try to hand wave how many people Hamas killed when they came in.
01:36:04.000The idea that Israel was killing people in Kibbutz Beri, but somehow Hamas was still operating in the Nova Festival doesn't make sense.
01:36:15.000You can see the whole path and the whole timeline.
01:36:17.000And then they also went to that NOVA festival, and then they started driving back.
01:36:19.000Now, as they were fleeing some of the kibbutzes, there were some people that were locked.
01:36:23.000They've got these little emergency rooms that they hide in because of rockets and hot fires all the time over the Gaza Wall.
01:36:29.000And as the IDF came in, they were already, I think, generally gone from the Nobel Festival, but there were still some lingering Hamas elements that were, and Palestinian Islamic Jihad, that were fighting in some of these kibbutzes.
01:36:38.000And as the IDF came in, they engaged with and they got into conflict with some of the Hamas soldiers that were in some of these kibbutzes.
01:36:43.000And as a result, there might have been, I don't even know if a single Israeli death has been confirmed from that, but there might have been some Israeli people that had been killed while Hamas was operating there.
01:36:50.000But the idea that the IDF came in quick enough to be responsible for all the deaths in the kibbutzes, but then somehow missed everybody that was further into Israel, into the Negev, The Nova Festival just doesn't make any sense.
01:37:01.000They would have never made it back to Gaza if the IDF was already there blowing people up at the kibbutzes.
01:37:08.000So basically, you had a scenario where Hamas came in, right?
01:37:11.000And then they basically did go to the kibbutzes.
01:37:13.000They went to various kibbutzes, kibbutz, very kibbutz, and then various other kibbutzes, and many stationed military personnel, and they were at the Nova Festival.
01:37:20.000His argument is that the Israeli military will only That's just ridiculous.
01:37:29.000There was a multi-operational situation that occurred.
01:37:31.000They had the Apache helicopters and the Apache helicopters were basically attacking and burning people from atop.
01:37:37.000And it was people who were trying to get back to Gaza, but they did do it and they basically applied the masks Because what the aim was is we don't want any hostages to do so.
01:37:47.000This is the directive that Israel have.
01:38:22.000So in terms of the specific way, I don't understand how it works, but in terms of what you look at, what they did was they bombed the people.
01:38:28.000So if you look at the chart people, it was from the helicopters, it was from up top.
01:38:31.000So if you look at the actual cars, you look at it and there's artillery on the top of the cars.
01:38:35.000So how would that happen without there being a helicopter?
01:38:36.000Because we have videos of us throwing grenades into the cars.
01:39:57.000Alright, I thought that was really, I know we went out the time there, but I think it was really important to hash out both perspectives and get both sides out.
01:40:05.000And this is kind of one I thought about while you guys were discussing.
01:40:09.000Does Israel run American foreign policy?
01:40:14.000I will go ahead, because I've seen you guys kind of oppose this, but we'll go ahead and just ask that question, because that's really a big elephant in the room here, I think, that everyone talks about.
01:40:23.000Does Israel run American foreign policy?
01:40:27.000So everyone feels fair, we can do a lightning round at the end where you guys can go ahead and I'll put like three minutes on the clock like last time.
01:40:34.000I think the United States has an interest in Israel.
01:40:36.000I don't think that means Israel runs foreign policy any more than Ukraine runs foreign policy, any more than anybody else runs foreign policy that we've got an interest in.
01:40:43.000I think that Israel's an important ally in the Middle East.
01:40:44.000I think they're our shining beacon of democracy in the Middle East.
01:40:49.000We get a lot of information from them.
01:40:51.000They help us in terms of securing Other allies in the region and fighting against Iran.
01:40:55.000So I think it's pretty obvious why we support Israel and the idea that we have some unique attachment to them or that we're hypnotized or mindfucked by them into supporting them.
01:41:02.000I just don't think there's any evidence for that.
01:41:47.000Or mainly more left, the people who were the Democrats did not care because Israel controls American politics, both from the left and the right.
01:41:55.000It doesn't matter if you're Keir Starmer or if you're Rishi Sunak, it doesn't matter if you're Donald Trump or you're Biden, you are controlled by the Israeli regime.
01:42:01.000So what then happens is the actions of the Israelis basically direct America on how to act and therefore they direct the funding, they direct all aspects of it.
01:42:11.000It's why someone like Speaker Johnson, as soon as he comes in, despite the farah that he comes in with, He literally did not care about issues within America.
01:42:35.000As soon as someone from America, a senator or congressman, makes a statement which is full-on pro-Zio, you literally have him showing, look, they've received this much money from the Zios.
01:42:44.000They've received this much from the lobby.
01:42:46.000And it's well known as well, intrinsically, not just from the financial aspect, that you literally have to be pro-Israel, pro-Israelis to have an opportunity to run for office.
01:42:56.000The irony of the same people crying about Russian intervention, crying about Chinese intervention, when a foreign state is explicitly and intrinsically running your country.
01:43:40.000You get stuff like rockets coming over walls constantly.
01:43:43.000You get stuff like people that are saying they want to destroy an entire country over and over again.
01:43:46.000It's not really surprising why people in the United States would be more favorable to a democracy like Israel than they would to an Islamist, theocratic regime in the Gaza Strip.
01:44:16.000What's October the 7th got to do with America?
01:44:17.000It's because you, in your mind, you know that when you attack Israel...
01:44:22.000What's going to happen is Israel's puppy, America, has to jump in and basically protect it.
01:44:26.000That's literally the position that you're making.
01:44:28.000In reality, when you said that Hamas is an Islamist regime, I don't know what argument you're making from that because if you look at the Hamas charter, they're very clear that their charter is based on equality, fairness and justice.
01:44:40.000To the Netanyahu regime, to the Likudan regime, which is using biblical references in terms of explaining their actions, calling their adversaries biblical terms such as the Amalek.
01:44:50.000If anybody is using religious terms to strike or using this as a political religious war, it is the Zionist regime.
01:46:37.000You can tell me that it's not found anywhere in the Quran, but when I bring up, hey, Aisha was nine, and I start getting death threats, it feels like people want to fuck nine-year-olds.
01:46:44.000Now, if it's the case of, like, where are you even getting this from, bro?
01:46:46.000That's not even true, then they would just say it.
01:46:47.000But instead, there's, like, literally a plethora.
01:46:49.000There's more defenses of fucking nine-year-olds from the world of Islam than there is from the entire world of fucking libertarianism, okay?
01:46:54.000Like, when you go online, there's like 50 million different videos that talk about why Anisha, she was actually really developed for nine years old, and the dolls she was playing with were actually like Super Barbies for like adolescents or teens or whatever.
01:47:53.000Isn't it one of the most cited, most trusted hadiths?
01:47:55.000Or is this just one part we don't like of it?
01:47:56.000No, no, so the hadith, so any hadith, and this is the problem, any hadith, what we have is basically passed on from one person to another, to another, to another.
01:48:04.000So any hadith, every single Muslim scholar will tell you, epistemologically, is a probabilistic knowledge.
01:48:09.000Probabilistic means it could be right, or it could be wrong.
01:48:13.000And therefore, it has no tenets when it comes to Islam.
01:48:15.000So if someone was to reject, example, the hadith about Aisha B9, he would not leave the fold of Islam, because She's not rejecting the tenets within the religion.
01:48:23.000So her being 9, so my position she was 18, as an example, right?
01:48:26.000Because I think that hadith has epistemological issues, as well as the person who narrated that hadith has memory issues.
01:48:51.000When I bring up the Aisha thing, okay, well, I haven't found any Jew that wants to defend it to me, okay?
01:48:55.000Maybe that Rabbi Shmuley guy I've ever talked to him, maybe he would, because that guy seems fucking insane.
01:48:58.000But whenever I bring up anything on Twitter about, like, Aisha, it's, like, fucking World War III. It's, like, World War, like, Muhammad edition, where I've got, like, so many people in mind.
01:49:06.000No, no, no, you've admitted it, because the reason when you bring it up, it's not based on academia, epistemology, anything like that.
01:49:21.000And if you ask them, most people would say, look, the argument, those who even believe it, they'll be like, look, we accept it, but it was physically, emotional development is a different type.
01:49:29.000And I don't agree with these arguments.
01:49:31.000They make those arguments, but they say right now, the development is later, mentally and physically, and therefore it should be much later.
01:49:36.000So even their argument isn't that you should have sex with nine-year-olds.
01:49:38.000The reason you get that response is because you specifically are doing it to attack a person Three minutes.
01:50:08.000But hadiths are oral traditions that are passed down from other people and the credibility of the hadiths and the interpretation of them can be called into question and you can have like imams debating between the validity between hadiths.
01:50:17.000And there's a mechanism to work out the authenticity.
01:50:23.000If that was the case, why doesn't every Muslim just say that?
01:50:26.000No, because there are Muslims who believe that she was nine.
01:50:28.000And so the point is when he's attacking them, it's attacking them for their specific position.
01:50:33.000And so obviously they're emotionally connected to that position.
01:50:36.000But my point is, My issue with destiny is he didn't know what he was arguing, where it come from, the source of it, and he didn't know the epistemological and hermeneutical reasons.
01:50:46.000He was just doing it to attack Muslims, and he's admitted that, and obviously hence why he gets the response he did.
01:51:27.000No, no, the point is because you have to understand how hermeneutics work and you need to understand that what you're attacking isn't Islam.
01:51:33.000You're attacking a certain position that some people have within Islam, even if it's the majority.
01:51:37.000That was my point I was trying to make.
01:51:39.000And actually my position is a position that was held by a large proportion in the early century.
01:51:44.000So for example, the person who narrated the hadith, his own teacher wouldn't take that hadith of him as an example.
01:51:50.000So it wasn't accepted as much in that time.