EZRA LEVANT ｜ Is it just me, or is the Omicron variant of the virus actually worse if you have a vaccine？
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Summary
Is it just me, or is the Omicron variant of the virus actually worse if you have a vaccine? Spoiler alert: it's not just me. Ezra LeVant explains why, and why we should all be worried about it.
Transcript
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Hello, my rebels. I sometimes read scientific papers. I'm not a scientist myself, so I have
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to read very slowly and check with others to make sure I get it. But today I'm going
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to take you through a study. I'm going to read a lot of it word for word. And most importantly,
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I'm going to show you a chart. And you're going to be stunned by it. I don't want to
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give it all away. But it answers the question, hey, doesn't it seem like a lot of vaxxed
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people are getting the Omicron version of this disease? And the scientific study from Denmark
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with more than 5,000 patients studied, well, it gives you an answer that's unbelievable.
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I'll show you the primary documents. I'll show you the charts. I'll read you the report.
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This is one of those times where having the video version of the podcast really helps.
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You can see the chart. You can see that I'm not making it up, that I'm reading from the report.
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Go to rebelnewsplus.com. That's what we call that TV version, the video version,
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rebelnewsplus.com. It's eight bucks a month, half the price of Netflix. You get my daily show,
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going to rebelnewsplus.com and clicking subscribe. Frankly, even if you don't watch our video version
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that often, we could use the support. Okay, here's today's show. I think it's going to surprise you.
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Tonight, is it just me or is the Omicron variant of the virus actually worse if you have a vaccine?
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Spoiler alert, it's not just me. It's December 23rd, and this is the Ezra LeVant Show.
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Why should others go to jail when you're a biggest carbon consumer I know?
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There's 8,500 customers here, and you won't give them an answer.
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The only thing I have to say to the government about why I'm publishing it is because it's my
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bloody right to do so. I don't blame anyone for getting sick, just like I don't blame anyone for
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getting cancer. Sometimes that's hard when someone is an alcoholic, or if they're really fat, and then
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they get liver disease or a heart attack, our untrained eyes detect a cause. And if the cause
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is in some way rooted in a free choice, the mind wanders. Maybe it makes me a bad person, but I think
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that's why it was hard for me to take public health lectures from Sarah Hoffman, the former NDP
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Minister of Health in Alberta. Or imagine Maggie de Bloch, the health minister for Belgium. I'm not making
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fun of them for being fat. They may have a medical problem I don't know about. Maybe, I doubt it,
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they are so good at managing things that it would be nuts to have anyone healthier running the health
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care system. But when so much of health these days is scolding you, nudging you, nagging you, ordering
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you around, it's not quite as compelling when the person doing the scolding doesn't seem to practice
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what they preach. You know, universal health care has been a liberal mantra for nearly a century,
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actually. For a while it was considered by the official people, at least, to be central to Canada's
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identity, Medicare. It's what made us, us. Imagine defining your people and your history and your geography
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and your culture by a government welfare program that, by the way, didn't really work. And we don't
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even really talk about it so much anymore, partly because it so obviously doesn't work in the crisis
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of our time. And the past two years, it's obviously failed. We did a show the other day about a report
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that half a million surgeries have been canceled because of COVID. And of course, COVID didn't cancel
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them. Politicians and bureaucrats did. But what's gross about these days is the blaming of sick people,
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blaming them as unclean and underclass, militarizing public and medical opinion against them. That's
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that they're dirty, that we're clean. They're dirty. It's a moral failure on their part. We're so much
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more moral. It's so weird. We're in the era of fat celebrating, not fat shaming. We're in the era of
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drug legalization, not just marijuana, but hard drugs, where leftists promote shooting galleries,
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public shooting galleries, where you can use hard drugs legally. I think there's still some stigma
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attached to drunk drivers who kill. That's true. Think about it. We praise fat people. We praise
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drug users. We've banned gyms for the past two years. So we've penalized healthy fitness. But if
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you get sick from COVID, you're morally to blame. You have to be shamed. At least that's how it's been
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framed for the past year as forced vaccines have been the narrative. But now the majority of people
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are vaccinated. And far from this all being over, the spread of the virus is the highest ever.
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And it's obviously vaxed people getting sick. Not completely. Some unvaxed people do too. But I
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note, for example, that in Alberta, 81% of the cases these days are in vaccinated people. So how does that
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work? Well, obviously they're not really vaccinated. They're something. But I don't think you can
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honestly call that something a vaccine. I saw some newspapers using the word superimmunity and one
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saying incredible superimmunity. How about just immunity where you're immune? I don't think those
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things are happening. Now, luckily, the Omicron variety seems to be not much worse than the common
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cold. Lots of guesses, lots of speculation about what's going on. Some cognitive dissonance for some
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people who were told to vax and get a booster and they would be fine. But they're not fine. They're
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getting sick. Here's a thoughtful comment by Tim Poole. He was responding to this bizarre vaccine
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mandate rule by the mayor of Chicago, basically banning people from getting anything to eat.
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By the way, most black people in Chicago and also in Washington, D.C., which is about a 70% black city,
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they're unvaxed. But put that Jim Crow law aside for now. Just take a look at the mayor here for a
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second. Exempt from this order are houses of worship, K-12 schools, grocery stores, office buildings,
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and residential buildings. Now, that doesn't mean that people who are in control of those spaces
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shouldn't themselves affirmatively take precautions. But for now, this order doesn't cover
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those venues. Also exempt are any individuals entering an establishment for less than 10 minutes
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for the purpose of merely ordering food or drink. So if you're going in that coffee shop to pick up and
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go, you don't need to show proof. But if you're going to linger, you're going to eat that muffin,
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you're going to sit down with your laptop, you got to show proof of vaccination.
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So Tim Poole points out, he says, two people enter a restaurant. He's talking about Chicago now.
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Only one is vaxed. They're both standing next to each other. Unvaxed is waiting to order takeout.
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Vaxxed is waiting for a table. Vaxxed has COVID, but has proof of vaccination and is allowed to sit.
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Unvaxed does not have COVID, but must leave. That's how it is. Because most people catching
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the virus now are vaxed. But they have a license, a pass, a QR code to enter an establishment to get
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on a plane, whatever. There's absolutely no screening for the virus to get on a plane these
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days. If you've got that little pass saying you're vaxed, curl out on. No test for you.
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The screening isn't for the virus. It's for political compliance. Okay, but enough preamble.
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Here's the news. A study out of Denmark, published here on a website hosted by the British Medical
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Journal and Yale and funded, by the way, by the Chan Zuckerberg Foundation. Now, you'll forgive me
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if I use a little bit of jargon here because I want to read this to you. I'll skip over some
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terminology that's irrelevant to our conversation. Here's the headline of the study. Vaccine
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effectiveness against SARS coronavirus 2. That's how they say COVID-19. Infection with the Omicron
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or Delta variants following a two-dose or booster, BNT-162, that's Pfizer, or mRNA-1273,
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that's Moderna vaccination series, a Danish cohort study. Okay, so for all the jargon,
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that basically means they're studying, do those two vaccines, Pfizer and Moderna, do they work
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against Omicron or Delta if you've got two or three shots of it over time? Okay, so I'm going to
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sometimes skip over words like BNT-162, whatever, just because that's a technical description of
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Pfizer. I'm just going to translate some of the jargon just to make the reading easier,
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but I'll show you the words, and of course, you can click on the study yourself.
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So let me read from it. In this brief communication, we are showing original research results with early
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estimates from Danish nationwide databases of vaccine effectiveness, VE, against COVID-19
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Omicron variant up to five months after a primary vaccination series with the vaccines and Pfizer
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Moderna, the ones they've checked. So is that clear enough? By the way, they studied more than 5,000
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people, so it's a big survey. So here's their summary. Our study provides evidence of protection
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against infection with the Omicron variant after completion of a primary vaccination series with
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the vaccines. In particular, we found a vaccine effectiveness against the Omicron variant
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of 55% and 36% for the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines, respectively, in the first month after primary
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vaccination. However, the vaccine effectiveness is significantly lower than that against Delta
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infection and declines rapidly over just a few months. The vaccine effectiveness is reestablished
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upon re-vaccination with the Pfizer vaccine, 55%, etc. So all that confidence interval stuff that they say is
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just a way of saying how statistically certain they are of this given the sample size. But did you catch
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that part? The vaccine only works a certain percentage of the time, 36% of the time, whatever, against
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Omicron after a very short period of time? How can you sell something as a vaccine if it doesn't work most of the
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time? Isn't that a bad Ron Burgundy joke from Anchorman?
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Well, I'll give this little cookie an hour before we're doing the no pants dance.
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Wow. Never ceases to amaze me. What cologne are you going to go with? London Gentleman or... wait. No, no, no. Hold on. Blackbeard's Delight.
00:12:48.020
No. She gets a special cologne. It's called Sex Panther by Odeon. It's illegal in nine countries.
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Yep. It's made with bits of real panther. So you know it's good. It's quite pungent.
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Oh, yeah. Ooh, it's a formidable scent. Stings the nostrils. In a good way.
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Yeah. Brian, I'm gonna be honest with you. That smells like pure gasoline.
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They've done studies, you know. 60% of the time, it works every time.
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Well, let's go see if we can make this little kitty purr.
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Hey, sweet cheeks. Got an invite I'd like to extend your way.
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God, no. It smells like a used diaper filled with Indian food. Oh. Excuse me.
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You know, desire smells like that to some people. What is that?
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The vaccines are not working against Omicron. They work half the time or a third of the time.
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Even if you're triple boosted, even if you keep getting boosted, it works for a bit, but then it fades away very quickly.
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But actually, their charts show more than their written reports.
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They don't talk about this part in their written report.
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After a while, these two vaccines, Moderna and Pfizer, they give negative protection.
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As in, if you get the Pfizer or Moderna shot after three months, you are more likely to get sick than if you didn't get the shot at all.
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Look at this. Let me read to you from the chart.
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Estimated vaccine effectiveness for Pfizer and Moderna against infection with the Omicron and Delta variants.
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OK, so you can see for the first 30 days, Pfizer is 55 percent effective and Moderna is 37 percent.
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OK, so I told you that before, but look a month out. Right.
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They don't work more than 90 percent of the time.
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And it's weird to me that they didn't highlight this.
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This should be in the headline on the front page.
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You are literally more likely to get infected if you are vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna than if you're not.
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This is what this chart in this national Danish study published online by a collaboration of Yale and the British Medical Journal show.
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And they're sponsored, like I say, by Mark Zuckerberg.
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People are admitted to a hospital for another reason.
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And then maybe they happen to be diagnosed with Omicron, too.
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Buried in this report, they say Denmark's data shows people with two doses to be just as vulnerable to Omicron infection as the unvaccinated.
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The Washington Post, owned by Jeff Bezos, the study doesn't actually show vaccinated people to be just as vulnerable as the unvaccinated.
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It shows them to be more vulnerable than the vaccinated.
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See that Justin Trudeau has punished a member of his caucus who dared to travel when Trudeau told ordinary Canadians not to travel.
00:18:11.060
I don't know if he'll be able to keep it up because, of course, we know Trudeau himself violates all of the lockdown rules when it suits him.
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He does not quarantine when he returns from foreign travel in the way he demands others.
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He does not socially distance or wear masks when it suits him for a photo op.
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On the other hand, he's very showy about it on other occasions.
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You might recall that when our friend David Mentes was beat up by Trudeau's bodyguards, it was because David had the temerity to show up at a Trudeau Christmas party fundraiser and try to ask the question, why can you have a Christmas party but you're asking Canadians not to?
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And I think that's important because I support Canadians being free to travel and free to live their lives at home.
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So if I myself were able to travel, I would not regard it as a hypocrisy because I don't believe in the rules.
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But what about people like John Tory, the mayor of Toronto, and his luxury villa in North Palm Beach?
00:19:08.060
Is it kosher for him to lock down his own city but then fly down there for Christmas to get out of the cold, dreary Toronto?
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Our next guest is an accomplished journalist who was with the Toronto Sun for many years.
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She's now with our friends at True North, and she has escaped the lockdownism of Canada and is in the freedom, the promised land of Delray Beach, Florida.
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She joins us now, Sue Ann Levy. Sue Ann, great to see you again.
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I wish I was down there, but more to the point, I wish I was free to come and go down there, but I'm not. I'm under lockdowns.
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I think there's a moral difference between an ordinary citizen like yourself enjoying freedom, traveling, going to the sun, going to freedom, versus a Trudeau or a John Tory or a Doug Ford, people who lock down others but then want to get away from the lockdown themselves.
00:19:59.060
I think that's an important distinction, isn't it?
00:20:02.060
Oh, for sure. If they're declaring the rules, and they're telling other people that they're vulnerable or they need to stay in their homes or socially distant or not have as many people as they would like for Christmas, then they have to play by the same rules.
00:20:17.580
They need to stay wherever they are, whether it be in Toronto or Ottawa, and as far as I'm concerned, and people have come back at me for traveling, but I'm not declaring the rules.
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I'm not saying you or Ezra or the rest of the world have to stay and hide under their beds.
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I'm free to go, and I'm exercising that freedom.
00:20:40.060
Yeah, and I think it's normal. I mean, travel and, you know, frankly, the idea of being a snowbird is a very Canadian thing.
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A lot of people in Calgary would go down to Arizona, a lot of people in Toronto and Quebec.
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You know, Quebecers love Florida, and the thing is, it's a sign of, do they really mean it?
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It reminds me of when Leo DiCaprio goes on his yacht or when Al Gore flies on private jets.
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I'm not against people having wealth and yachts and private jets.
00:21:07.720
It's just when these are the same people saying, reduce your carbon footprint, it just goes to, do they really mean it?
00:21:14.020
And I think that's the thing here is, I don't believe that these lockdowns have a scientific merit.
00:21:19.660
I think that the vaccination rate in Toronto is around 80%.
00:21:26.400
And then the natural immunity rate, it's almost everyone.
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So I don't know if they believe it, but their own actions tell the tale.
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They try and cheat when they can get away with it.
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They say one thing and do another, just like the carbon cops DiCaprio and Al Gore do.
00:21:46.520
It's been total hypocrisy with this COVID, the whole COVID process in the last two years.
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And, you know, I think Canadians, certainly Trantonians and Ontarians are just sick of it all.
00:22:05.640
Just absolutely sick of being told what to do, being lectured by leftist doctors who think they know better,
00:22:13.240
self-righteous, sanctimonious people who, you know, feel they can get on and tell on social media and tell people
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they're not allowed to go here, there, enjoy their lives.
00:22:27.300
And I understand this is an evolving disease, but we're, you know, double vaxxed, boosted.
00:22:34.920
And, you know, at some point you just have to say we have to learn to live with it.
00:22:39.520
And I don't think any of these health officials are prepared to say that.
00:22:44.160
And they don't like when the camera is turned on them.
00:22:46.780
I did a fairly boring tweet that I've, I mean, I've used the word, I've used the word,
00:22:51.900
send me video of this guy breaking the lockdown rule.
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In fact, we actually last Christmas sent someone down to John Tory's place in Palm Beach just to see if the house was being used.
00:23:14.020
Now it's true that a TV doctor is not an elected politician, but so many of the decision makers are not elected politicians.
00:23:23.820
They're doctors who, for the first time in their lives, people care.
00:23:30.340
I just suggested, hey, anybody, is this TV doctor who's calling for lockdowns,
00:23:34.180
if you catch him breaking the rules, send me the video, and the freak out.
00:23:40.440
I suppose it's because they like their privacy.
00:23:43.860
Or maybe because they don't like being held to a higher standard and they don't think the scrutiny belongs on them.
00:23:55.740
It feels like the fancy people have one set of rules.
00:23:58.700
And, you know, the DoorDash drivers and the Amazon delivery boys and the grocery store cashiers, they work the whole time through.
00:24:08.160
And I just feel like the little people pay the price of the lockdown and the government sector hasn't missed a paycheck.
00:24:15.900
And if anything, they've been having the time of their lives working by remote on Zoom.
00:24:20.880
It just really, and I'm not a Marxist, but I can't help but see the classist elements here.
00:24:28.140
And, yeah, the lack of compassion, the lack of understanding of what the average Joe has gone through, and, you know, the celebrity doctors, the public health officials who have not missed a paycheck, even bureaucrats in the public service, whether it be at the level of the City of Toronto, Ontario, or Canada, none of them have missed a paycheck, have worked from home throughout, are still working from home.
00:24:55.340
And they have no understanding of what, say, a waiter has gone through, a business owner has gone through, of what these ordinary people are doing to try and survive.
00:25:06.740
And you know a lot of businesses have gone out of business because of the draconian rules.
00:25:11.700
I want to talk about one more thing because you put this on Twitter and it made me sad to see it.
00:25:16.220
And, of course, there's hundreds of thousands, probably millions of Canadians in the same position.
00:25:20.820
And your story, unfortunately, is all too common, but because you're a reporter and you're prominent on Twitter, when you tell the story, a lot of people hear it.
00:25:31.660
Your mom is in a senior's home and she was going to get on a plane and join you in sunny Florida.
00:25:39.960
And because, and you tell me if I got the facts right here, because there was a single case in that whole senior's home, every senior has been locked down in the prison sense of the term lockdown.
00:26:01.940
And tell me the story about your mom and how they're literally being imprisoned in their cells.
00:26:09.200
And in fact, I phoned up and we, she has a sense of humor.
00:26:19.640
And at least are you getting three square meals a day?
00:26:22.120
I know you're not allowed to go out to the exercise yard or to go to the prison library.
00:26:27.440
You know, having said that, these seniors, and I spent a lot of time in my last year at the Toronto Sun writing about how they were isolated, how they deteriorated, as many died from the isolation and loneliness, in addition to those who died of COVID.
00:26:47.260
And here we are, two years in, and we're back to 2020.
00:27:01.900
I had to write the homes director four times yesterday because I was supposed to get on a plane on Monday and go up and get her.
00:27:12.400
And I wanted her to have maybe, you know, a good winter.
00:27:19.580
And I wanted her to have a pleasant winter, and I couldn't get information.
00:27:26.620
They're all stuck in their rooms getting their meals, and that's it.
00:27:30.400
They didn't even want my mom to walk the hallway.
00:27:32.840
She needs to move her legs because of her condition.
00:27:36.980
They told her caregiver she couldn't go out of her suite.
00:27:42.300
And it's not just my mom, but I wanted to expose it because it's happening to others.
00:27:46.900
And she will make it down to Florida eventually.
00:27:58.000
Do you think Eileen Davila, the medical officer of health in Toronto, would spend her Christmas alone in a small suite, having meals only delivered, maybe through the door?
00:28:08.880
Maybe we should put a hole in her door and deliver them that way on a train.
00:28:14.680
I've had the unusual experience of visiting people in prison, including in lockdown-type situations.
00:28:22.880
It is considered a form of psychological torture to be in solitary confinement.
00:28:28.580
I should tell you that even when I visited my friend Tommy Robinson in the ultra-high-security Belmarsh Prison, that's the UK version of Guantanamo Bay, that's where all the terrorists and the murderers are kept, even the worst of the worst are allowed out for exercise for an hour a day.
00:28:48.800
Not everyone in solitary is, but it's a form of torture.
00:28:57.460
It's frowned upon by civil rights and groups like amnesty.
00:29:03.240
And what you're describing your mom going through is literally the definition of solitary confinement.
00:29:12.060
The only difference is that she does have a caregiver coming in to help her because she has certain care needs for eight, seven, eight hours a day.
00:29:20.020
But the rest of the time, she's all by herself.
00:29:22.660
I've been calling her once, twice a day to make sure she's okay.
00:29:26.940
I could go visit her because I'm an essential caregiver.
00:29:29.520
If I was up there, my brother can go in as well.
00:29:32.680
But we have to suit up, mask all the protocols.
00:29:41.000
I suited up and, you know, because there was a sincere threat.
00:29:47.300
Why the heck would one have to suit up in a mask, in gowns, in gloves?
00:29:52.900
I mean, you know, to me, it is just a total of abuse of power by public health officials.
00:29:58.160
You know, the whole thing reminds me of airport security.
00:30:05.140
And for 20 years now, we have what I call public, you know, security theater.
00:30:16.820
But I don't think they've got a single terrorist in 20 years.
00:30:23.660
But okay, so it's a half an hour extra of your life on a trip.
00:30:32.220
I think this is public health theater at this point.
00:30:39.020
Or maybe there was some rationale that made sense then.
00:30:43.060
But if you've got a double vax patient and a double vax family member,
00:30:47.380
and the whole facility is vaxed, to dress up like a spaceman from head to toe,
00:30:56.560
And unlike the airport security theater, it's not a half-hour inconvenience on the front end of a lovely trip.
00:31:07.960
I think the, quote, cure for this pandemic is far more devastating than the virus itself.
00:31:25.320
My brother and I are very invested in her care.
00:31:27.420
But I have to tell you, the other thing is that they absolutely hate when you question.
00:31:34.780
And I was even bullied into, because I wanted to take my mom out,
00:31:38.880
into being told that I could face a $5,000 a day fine if I took her out while they were in lockdown.
00:31:57.680
In each of us, there's a little devil and a little angel.
00:32:00.600
I mean, we know that stereotypical image of a devil and an angel on each shoulder whispering into our ears.
00:32:06.180
Each of us has the ability to do wonderful things and to do terrible things.
00:32:11.640
And, unfortunately, this pandemic and the lockdowns have really brought out the authoritarian within so many of us.
00:32:24.920
I was just going to say that what really is upsets me is that these are vulnerable seniors who can't fight back, don't have the energy to fight back.
00:32:40.000
And I regard myself as lucky that I am with my own company, that I'm not.
00:32:47.440
But even workers who have no alternative and if they don't obey some corporate edict or some political edict, they're going to be fired.
00:32:55.840
I regard myself as very lucky that I live a life where I'm independent in most ways.
00:33:01.400
And I think most rebel staff feel the same way, that we have some freedom here.
00:33:04.960
If you're in an institution like your mom is or if you're in a corporate institution, a lot of your civil rights have been taken away.
00:33:12.480
And I think we'll be facing the legal, moral, social, psychological and health consequences of that for a very long time.
00:33:21.160
I'm glad you're down there in the promised land.
00:33:25.660
And folks, just the exciting news is you can continue to follow Sue Ann Levy in the webpages of TrueNorth, TNC.news.
00:33:36.740
She was one of the feistiest columnists and reporters of the Toronto Sun.
00:33:41.480
It was a great loss to them when she left them, but it was a great gain to TrueNorth.
00:34:14.080
I'm not sure if that's your mama's given name to you.
00:34:16.240
I think private people should be allowed to have their private lives.
00:34:38.020
There are some exceptions for people who call for other families to be, for example, if
00:34:48.960
the wife of Toronto's mayor breaks the rules, I think it does reflect on him, even though
00:34:57.480
I mean, we know for a fact that Sophie Trudeau was jetting all around the place and she gave
00:35:01.920
COVID to actually a movie star in London, which was a little bit unusual.
00:35:07.880
But normally I would say Sophie, especially since they're estranged, that's a private person.
00:35:12.380
I think normally the wife of the mayor is a private person.
00:35:14.920
I really don't think private matters should be in the public interest.
00:35:19.660
I don't want to go down that road as a society.
00:35:22.220
But it is not a private matter when a pundit on TV who is calling for lockdowns then breaks
00:35:28.740
And I don't have proof that he disstanding that doctor breaks the rules.
00:35:33.960
I ask for proof of it because I think that his calling for the lockdowns and his calling
00:35:38.060
for the cancellation of Christianist parties is so absurd that I simply don't believe
00:35:46.780
I mean, across this country, we've seen public health officers and premiers and mayors and
00:35:53.480
I think you have to assume none of them mean it, just like you have to assume that the global
00:36:00.440
I don't know if anyone had a larger carbon footprint as a cabinet minister than Catherine
00:36:07.240
I mean, you just can't take them at face value.
00:36:14.880
The tea talk says palliative medicine, the practice of making dying people comfortable
00:36:26.860
Well, I don't think we have any evidence of that.
00:36:40.900
I don't know how he can practice medicine, given his full-time career as a TV darling.
00:36:51.500
I think he's getting away from medicine and into politics.
00:36:57.180
And that's what I want to hold him accountable for.
00:37:03.080
I'm just saying I have no evidence whatsoever that he's anything but a fine doctor.
00:37:14.860
It was him as a politician hiding behind his MD.
00:37:21.300
Until next time, on behalf of all of us here at Rebel World Highquarters, to you at home, good night.
00:37:27.340
And let me leave you with a bit of a change of pace.
00:37:29.740
A video from our Adam Sose in Calgary, talking about something we don't talk about a lot on this show.
00:37:40.320
What I've learned is that there seems to be an undercurrent of thinking that's happening right now,
00:37:45.740
where it's like, let's say I don't validate your feelings, then I'm actually committing a harm to you.
00:37:54.020
And it's like, this is what I'm worried about, is that my story invalidates the feelings of some other people.
00:38:00.640
But people have to dig into this, you know, and explore.
00:38:07.020
Adam Sose here for Rebel News, bringing you an update on our banbillc4.com campaign.
00:38:17.560
We're urging you to go to that URL, check it out, sign our petition, and send an email with our one-click option
00:38:23.600
to let people know that you're opposed to this bill.
00:38:26.320
This bill at face value seems like a standard conversion therapy bill,
00:38:30.100
but when you start looking at the definitions, it becomes extremely problematic.
00:38:34.380
This bill fundamentally undermines people's rights to access whichever sort of therapy they deem best for them.
00:38:43.240
It is a marginalizing bill, and it is a bill that furthermore undermines religious freedoms in this country.
00:38:49.780
I'm going to be joined in just a moment by Hudson, who is going to share his testimony about his experience
00:38:57.560
So, Hudson, if you could just let me know maybe first off why you became concerned about Bill C-4.
00:39:05.060
One of the biggest reasons was because I was afraid that if a bill like this came out,
00:39:09.380
then people with a story like mine, we wouldn't be able to share our stories,
00:39:13.160
often involving, like, you know, being touched by the love of God
00:39:15.720
and how we've devoted our, striven to devote our lives to him
00:39:20.500
and how that has just led us to have transformed lives overall in many ways.
00:39:25.220
I've found that there's some people who believe that that in and of itself
00:39:30.060
could amount to conversion therapy by us sharing our stories.
00:39:35.500
And for those folks who maybe aren't familiar with you,
00:39:37.640
can you share just, like, a little bit about your story, maybe the Coles Notes version?
00:39:43.480
So, same-sex attractions and transgender inclinations, what they be called today,
00:39:49.620
And somehow I found myself back, I found my way back into the Catholic Church,
00:39:55.140
the last place the world said I could ever look.
00:40:00.100
And in there I found, like, the peace, joy, hope, freedom, love,
00:40:04.820
all those things that I was looking for in the world, and I found it there in the church.
00:40:07.920
And I know that negotiating the whole same-sex attractions and transgender inclinations,
00:40:14.480
it's not like, there was never a word of, like, trying to change me or anything like that.
00:40:18.360
It was just, people were just invested in trying to help me discover the love of Jesus more
00:40:25.700
And there came a point where I just needed to, for reasons of my own,
00:40:29.760
I knew I needed to do that, I knew I wanted to do that, and then I did that.
00:40:32.840
And that impacted all areas of my life, and especially including things like self-control
00:40:38.880
and, like, learning, like, keeping my eyes pointing towards, like, spiritual direction
00:40:42.700
so that I could just make better decisions in life.
00:40:44.780
And a lot of that took me out of, you know, other tendencies, let's say,
00:40:50.520
of, like, being thirsty for, like, love and attention from the world,
00:40:56.600
I don't know, a short story is, I, it's helped reform me as a man,
00:41:03.120
and I'm an ongoing project and a journey and stuff, and I get that.
00:41:06.580
But, yeah, like, I've, the, for, in my story, like, I mean, once I had,
00:41:12.640
there was a restoration of sorts in my sense of being a man,
00:41:16.380
and alongside growing in that, in ways that I didn't know at the time,
00:41:21.320
I noticed that the same-sex romantic attractions diminished,
00:41:26.520
and I was like, oh, I didn't notice that until after they were, you know, that happened.
00:41:30.080
And the similar thing with transgender inclinations, it was,
00:41:32.620
I had to no longer become scared of being a man,
00:41:35.740
because I, I did, there was lots of the world of man that I didn't understand,
00:41:40.460
And that, that got, that just kind of, as the fear went down,
00:41:45.540
and I trusted the Lord more, I was able to enter into that more.
00:41:49.640
And then, and then I noticed one day that I wasn't experiencing transgender inclinations anymore.
00:41:56.360
And so I was able to trace it back to that sort of thing.
00:41:59.720
So, so one of the concerns, obviously, with Bill C-4,
00:42:02.600
originally, I think, I think the notion of conversion therapy,
00:42:05.540
the sort of traditional forced course of conversion therapy that we hear about,
00:42:12.620
What, what, what, and that's, that's, that is clearly something we probably would both condemn.
00:42:17.280
What happens with Bill C-4, though, is it becomes extremely problematic,
00:42:20.500
because someone like you, who, would you say you were ever forced to undergo these conversations
00:42:26.240
with pastors, or was it, or people that you're talking to, or was it something that you freely sought out?
00:42:32.880
I, I was never forced into any type of conversation like this.
00:42:36.280
In fact, I know some people who were greatly harmed by what we would think of conversion therapy,
00:42:41.120
where they were trying to force their change, horrible stuff.
00:42:44.260
And, of course, I think anybody would agree that that kind of stuff is ridiculous.
00:42:47.940
What I'm worried about is, I've had some people voice to me that anything short of full promotion
00:42:59.120
Because at the end of the day, in my life, there was definitely a conversion of heart.
00:43:04.320
And that's because of Jesus Christ and entering into that and choosing that for myself.
00:43:07.960
And, you know, having people to support me to not, like, not to change attractions or gender stuff,
00:43:14.680
but to help me, like, taste the love of Christ more.
00:43:19.160
And I worry about that, that there being a chilling effect,
00:43:24.260
that if people know that maybe something like that is part of someone's story,
00:43:27.920
that they'll be afraid to talk about that, because they might not know what is okay and what's not okay, you know?
00:43:33.200
So, just generally speaking, what Bill C-4 could do would be, it's very infantilizing.
00:43:39.860
It could take someone like you, someone who's maybe having some questions,
00:43:43.320
maybe experiencing same-sex attraction, having some transgender inclinations.
00:43:47.260
And that person, I think, regardless of who they are, has every bit of decency,
00:43:54.260
They have the freedom, and I think we should treat them with respect,
00:43:57.560
to allow them to seek out different opinions, to seek out different voices.
00:44:02.020
You had that opportunity, no one forced you, but you had the freedom to do that.
00:44:06.880
And that freedom is likely going to be ultimately taken away, deprived, and made very much illegal by Bill C-4.
00:44:14.000
Yeah, to me, it seems like that is probably going to be the case.
00:44:17.640
And even if it doesn't by the letter of the law,
00:44:19.960
I'm still concerned that enough people will be scared that it could put them in trouble,
00:44:25.820
But I do encourage people to actually read the law,
00:44:28.860
not just like the headline from, you know, what people, you know,
00:44:35.720
And ultimately, I think that if there's truth behind, you know,
00:44:41.000
if there's truth behind things, people won't be afraid to have things, questions asked, right?
00:44:48.660
But if I was trying to twist things, you know, it'd be like, no, I just,
00:44:56.280
Well, and it's nice to see people who've experienced stories like this,
00:45:00.180
people like yourself advocating for conversations.
00:45:02.500
What we're seeing very often politically, Bill C-4 is almost the poster child of it,
00:45:07.140
is an ideological shutdown of conversations and dialogue is vital to society.
00:45:15.800
What I've learned is that there seems to be an undercurrent of thinking that's happening right now,
00:45:21.240
where it's like, let's say I don't validate your feelings,
00:45:24.900
then I'm actually committing like a harm to you.
00:45:29.140
And it's like, this is what I'm worried about is that,
00:45:31.740
like my story invalidates the feelings of some other people.
00:45:36.060
But people have to dig into this, you know, and explore.
00:45:42.500
It's like, you know, even if, like, my heart's been touched by Christ.
00:45:48.280
And it's like, they could make it so that even saying any piece of my story is illegal,
00:45:55.120
And that's what I'm hoping maybe will get brought to the surface.
00:46:01.060
And it's like, well, maybe the peace that I have can be revealed.
00:46:06.160
Well, I want to thank you for coming forward, sharing your story.
00:46:08.420
It's wonderful to see that people like you are keeping the conversation alive.
00:46:13.440
I think very much as Bill, it was intended at shutting the conversation down.
00:46:17.200
But I know your story matters and people who have stories like yours,
00:46:20.500
wherever they are on the spectrum, those stories deserve to be heard
00:46:23.280
because you're every bit as important as anyone else.
00:46:25.440
So thank you so very much for coming forward and sharing your story.
00:46:29.500
Well, I want to thank Hudson for providing us with his perspective and his concerns on Bill C-4.
00:46:36.780
Again, I'm urging you to consider going to banbillc4.com to learn more
00:46:41.660
and to sign our petition opposing this discriminatory and bigoted bill
00:46:46.760
that is riddled with problematic languages and problems.
00:46:50.640
It in itself comes in confrontation with fundamental charter rights that are insured,
00:46:55.980
like the right for an individual to seek the therapy they deem best,
00:47:02.100
I want to thank you all, as always, for tuning in.
00:47:09.420
Hey, if you think that Canadians have the right to seek whichever counselling
00:47:13.720
they deem best for themselves or their family members,
00:47:20.540
click our one-click politics link to send an email
00:47:23.620
to the people responsible for bringing Bill C-4 into law.