EZRA LEVANT ｜ Standing tall： A special longform interview with Maxime Bernier
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Summary
Maxime Bernier, the leader of the People's Party of Canada, is running for a seat in the upcoming by-election in the riding of Portage Lisgar, Manitoba, Canada. He's been in politics for a long time, and is a friend of the show. But recently, he was convicted of a crime that many in the mainstream media would not have seen coming.
Transcript
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Hey, we like talking to Maxime Bernier, the People's Party is always interesting and a very
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principled freedom fighter, but he's actually running for parliament in a special by-election
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in the riding of Portage Lisger in Manitoba. And you may not know that riding, but let me tell you
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something about it that might get your attention. I think it's the riding with the highest PPC vote
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in the entire country. I think, I think it was there. 22% voted for the PPC last time and the
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incumbent conservatives aren't running again. I think the lad might have a chance. We'll talk to
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him about that and other things. But first, let me invite you to become a subscriber to Rebel News Plus.
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It's the video version of this podcast. Just go to rebelnewsplus.com, click subscribe, eight bucks a
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up and that's how we pay our bills. Please consider supporting us. All right, here's today's podcast.
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Tonight, a feature interview with Maxime Bernier, the leader of the People's Party of Canada.
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He's running in a by-election that the PPC might just win. It's May 22nd, and this is the Ezra Levant Show.
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Well, there's a joke, and it's funny in other circumstances, but it is terribly unfunny in this
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one. The old joke was, every politician deserves to serve two terms. The first in parliament, the
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second in prison. It's a joke, but it's not funny here because our guest today is one of the only
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Canadian politicians in history I can think of who was actually jailed as a political expression
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of punishment for him, and now he again seeks a term of office in that same province. You can
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probably guess I'm talking about Maxime Bernier, and you probably know that the arrest and jail time
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I'm referring to is when he dared to campaign in Manitoba during the pandemic, and no one less than
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Brian Pallister, the former MP for the seat he is now contesting in Manitoba, told Maxime Bernier,
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get out, or we will do our worst to you. It was terrible politics. It wasn't even politics. It was
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bullying. It was using the instruments of the state to punish a rival. Enough from me. Let me welcome
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back to the program the leader of the People's Party of Canada and a friend of the show, Maxime Bernier.
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Maxime, great to see you again. Thanks for taking the time to be with us.
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Thank you, Ezra. I'm very pleased to have that opportunity to be with you.
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Well, my joke, it was not a good one, but you actually recently were convicted, weren't you,
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of a legacy pandemic law. I mean, the pandemic has been over for ages, but you were in fact
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convicted and fined. And in this bizarre footage, you were jailed briefly, but you were jailed
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on the left. Let's just remind viewers what that looked like.
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I can get you to step out of the vehicle. I'm going to place you under arrest right now.
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Right now, you're under arrest under the provincial health orders. Okay, so if you can just put your
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hands behind your back, face towards the vehicle. Okay, give me one hand here.
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I'll get you to step out of the vehicle. Okay? Yeah. The other hand. Do you have any weapons
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or anything on you, sir? Weapon? No, no weapon. Only my words. Anything on you that's going to hurt me?
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Anything like that? Sorry? Anything on you that's going to hurt me or anything like that?
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No, no, anything that will hurt you. Only my words. Only my philosophy. Only what I believe in.
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Okay. All right, come on over this way. I'll explain a few things to you hear right away.
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How that video did not receive universal outrage and condemnation, not just in the media,
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but also from politicians of every stripe and civil libertarians, remains a very dark moment to me
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that Canadians, in the establishment at least, were just fine with a politician being jailed
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for daring to go and meet constituents. How did it go in court? I mean, I think it's outrageous
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that you were jailed and fined and convicted at all. What did the judge say?
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First, Ezra, I must say that you and Tucker were the only two who had, you know,
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I won't say the courage, but you, you know, spoke about that, what that happened during the last
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election. The mainstream media didn't want to, you know, cover what happened to me. That was the
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first time in the history of our country that the leader of a political party has been arrested
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and put in jail for a non-crime after a meeting in a park. So, and I was, you're right, recently
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in court and I had the opportunity to speak to the judge because, you know, I didn't plead guilty.
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That's very important. I signed an agreement and I said, you know, I agree with the facts
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because I didn't want the crowd to take three days to prove that I was there at a rally outside
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with 15 people. So, I said, I'm a responsible person and yes, I'm admitting that I did that.
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And so, I said to the court, this is what I did. And that's why, you know, instead of being three days
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in court, it was just a morning, three hours, and I was able to save money for the taxpayer here.
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So, and after that, and the judge said, do you have something to say to the court? I said, absolutely.
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I said, you know, this is what I did. You have a video of what I did, a meeting in a park during
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the pandemic. But don't forget, Your Honor, it was a year and a half after the beginning
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of that pandemic. So, at that time, we knew that the virus was not deadly for the majority
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of Canadians, except for older people with comorbidities. And I said, you know, we have
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a charter of rights. And I must, as a political leader, before a political election, to be able
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to use my constitutional rights, the right to freely speak, the right to peaceful assembly,
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and being able to speak with the Canadians. And, you know, you didn't do that. But for me,
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the worst of all that, I was the only one, we were 15, in a meeting in a park, I was the
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only one who received a ticket, I was the only one who was arrested and coughed and put in jail.
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And I said it was political repression. And I'm saying that because, like you just said
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at the beginning, Ezra, before coming to Manitoba, the premier of that province said, if Maxime Bernier
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is coming to this province, and wants to have a meeting outside, I can tell you, his pocketbook
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will be empty. So he said something like that in a press conference.
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Yeah, let's play a clip of that. It was just absolutely shocking. That statement alone
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should have caused this prosecution to drop because whether or not he meant it, even if he
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was just talking tough, being a big man bragging, he created the perception that the police and the
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prosecution do the bidding of an elected politician. Let's play that clip here. The moment he said that,
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it's like he poisoned the prosecution and anything that came from it would have been fruit of a
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poisoned tree. Let's just show that clip for a second. Premier, Maxime Bernier is supposed to be
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touring the province and holding events Friday through Sunday this week. How is the province
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going to handle these numerous gatherings that are going to be set up along his tour?
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Well, he's violating the public health orders. He's going to be light in the pocketbook.
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And I'd suggest that he not violate the public health orders. But of course, I'm not going to be
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directly involved in the enforcement, nor should I be.
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That was a disgrace. Brian Pallister was one of the most abusive premiers. He was so punitive.
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I'm sure. And that made it extra bad. I mean, you could say, well, it was a police decision. No,
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it was not. The premier said, I'm going to do it. And he did it. And everyone just said, OK,
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And Andrew, I can tell you, that was a political repression. Because when I was arrested and put in
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jail, if you were able to see in the video, these RCMP officers didn't have their full, you know,
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official costume, uniform, sorry, official uniform. And when we arrived at the
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detachment, so the guy just asked, can you tell me where are the washrooms? So that person,
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that officer was not coming from that detachment. He was coming from Winnipeg. And he had an order to
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arrest me. And that's what he did. So and I was 12 hours in a jail. But what I said to the judge,
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I said, you want me to pay a fine? I believe that I did pay for what I did. I was 12 hours in a jail.
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And now you want to add to that a fine? And, you know, that that's your discretion. But if you're
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doing that, I want to have the opportunity to give that money to a shelter for women here in Winnipeg.
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And she said, no, you must give 2000 bucks to the state, the same state that violated my rights.
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That's very frustrating. You know, I'm familiar with stories like this, not obviously
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a high profile political leader. But as you know, the Democracy Fund, which is a civil liberties
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charity created two years ago, has fought literally 2500 cases. And they all sound as excruciatingly
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frustrating and Kafkaesque as what you've just described. Did you ever get an explanation
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for why they took you to jail? It was not a criminal. You broke no criminal law.
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The the worst that could happen to you if you were convicted of this offense is what did happen to
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you. You pay a fine. It's really in a way like an expensive traffic ticket. Like it was not a crime.
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You were not. I don't I mean, correct me if I'm wrong. You were charged with a provincial offense,
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which is like a it's like speeding. And so why would they put you in jail if even being convicted
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of it could not possibly have amounted to a jail term? Did they ever explain why you were jailed?
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No, they did not. But I told the judge at that hearing that, you know, I was traveling across the
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country that summer to build a party to be ready for the next election to find candidates.
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And I did rallies, you know, in Alberta, in Ontario, in Quebec. And I can tell you that I had
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some tickets in Saskatchewan and Ontario, but I didn't go to jail. I received the tickets,
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like you said, and, you know, I just have to pay it. But now that was not enough for them. That's a
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proof that the the leader of that province, the premier at that time didn't want me to do rallies
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and didn't want to hear the other side of the story. And, and I was supposed to have a big rally
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in Winnipeg the day after, but I was not able because I was in jail. So so it's, it's a shame what
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happened. But also, Ezra, I must tell you, some people are telling me, yeah, Maxim, okay, you have
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to pay that fines. But you know, if you're a real freedom fighters, why you didn't appeal that decision?
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And that's a good question. And I want to make it clear. I didn't appeal the decision first,
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to save some time from the court and money for taxpayers. But second, the there is a case like
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my case, you know, against the citizen here in Manitoba, who did have a rally outside during the
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COVID hysteria. And, and that case will be before the appeal court of Manitoba this year. So we will
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have a decision about that, if what the government did to me and other people here in Manitoba will
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have a decision from the appeal court, if that was legal, or constitutional.
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You know, I'm not optimistic, almost every single constitutional challenge of everything done in
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the lockdowns has failed. And for me, it was a great disillusioning. I went to law school, you know,
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25 years ago, and we were taught that the Charter of Rights and Freedoms was not only a
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powerful and almost a holy document, but it was so essentially part of our identity as Canadians and
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certainly as lawyers. And in the greatest civil liberties bonfire in a generation, it literally
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did nothing for us. And in fact, to this day, the Supreme Court has not bothered itself to weigh in on
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anything regarding the lockdowns. I find it atrocious. Well, listen, I appreciate you telling us those
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stories, but I know that if you have your way, you will be redeemed in that same province that jailed
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you so vindictively. And I mentioned Brian Pallister, that premier we just showed, he was the progressive
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conservative MP about 20 years ago for the riding Portage-Lisger that is now in a by-election.
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And there are four federal by-elections happening, if I'm not mistaken, on June 19th. And one of them
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was held by Candace Bergen, formerly known as Candace Heppner. And I was just looking at the stats.
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She used to win that thing with 75% of the vote. It's a very, I spoke at a Candace Bergen fundraiser
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a decade or two ago. It was one of the most right-wing places I've ever been.
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And then in the last election, this is what's so fascinating, and then I'll button up and listen
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to your reaction. I just looked at the stats. In the last election, the People's Party of Canada
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received 22% of the vote, if I'm not mistaken. That's got to be, if not the highest, one of the
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highest numbers in the whole country. And every single one of those votes came off the conservative
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vote. Candace Bergen went from about 75% down to about 50%. And all the other votes went to the
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PPC. So if, in my theory, is if that's one of the strongest PPC ridings in the country,
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if last time against a longstanding member of parliament, he got 22%, with Candace Bergen gone
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and the leader of the party running, I have to say, although I still think it would be a long shot
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and a shock to the system, I have to say, I think it's in the realm of the possible, especially by
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elections, which are prone to protest votes. People who are motivated go out more than people who are
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fine with things. I think you've actually got a chance.
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I believe so, Andrew, but I will have to work very hard. And that's why, you know, I came in the
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riding a couple of weeks before the announcement. I was in that riding a couple of times since the
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general election. As you said, we had our biggest rally in that riding during the last election. We
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had 3,000 people outside. Our candidate did very well, actually, I must admit, did better than myself,
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the leader of the party. I had 21% in both and he had 22%. And it is a rural riding like my former
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riding in both. And there's also a Francophone community here. And you're right to say that's
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maybe the most conservative riding in the country. So, and that's why I believe that I have a chance
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and I may be able to win that election. Because, you know, I'm the only candidate who will speak for
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real conservative values. I'm doing that all the time. And here in that riding, we will promote
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family values like we did at the last election. And like you said, it is not a general election.
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It is a by-election. And as you may know, Ezra, the Conservative Party of Canada likes to say during
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general election, oh, if you like the policies of the People's Party, and if you like Maxime Bernier,
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yeah, that's okay. But, you know, we need to get rid of Justin Trudeau. I don't want you to spit the
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vote. But there's no such thing as spitting the vote during a by-election because we won't change
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the government. The Trudeau government will be there after the election. And during a general
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election, I'm saying, you know, I'm not spitting any vote. I'm just a real conservative. But Poliev
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is spitting the liberal votes. That's his job. And that's what he wants to do to be in power.
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But that being said, I will speak about family values. I will have fun in the riding. We have a
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strong team also. So we will do pretty well. And my team on the ground, they are very happy. And
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they're saying, you know, Maxime, you will come here because you are speaking like us, maybe with
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a French accent. But I like the people here. We share the same values. And I'm having fun running
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for them. And I want to be their representative. I'll do everything. And we'll see what will happen.
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You know, by the way, it's a very multilingual riding. I think about a third of people there
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speak German at home. Oh, yeah. Yeah. You know, there's that Mennonite tradition of German farmers,
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very conservative people. I like it there. I haven't been there in a few years. But it is
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definitely one of the most conservative ridings in the country. Let me ask you this. I know that the
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Conservative Party of Canada has nominated a candidate. And have there been any all-candidates
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debates? Have you attended any of those? Have you been invited to any of those? What is it like when
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you interact with the conservative and the other parties? But I really think this is going to be a
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two-way battle. I don't think the liberals have a chance there. I don't think they ever did.
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I don't think, I mean, listen, last election, it was conservatives 50, approximately 50,
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PPC, approximately 22. I think that it's really a two-horse race there in this by-election.
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What has been the interactions that you've had on this campaign so far? Has there been anything
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formal like a debate? Yeah, I must say that I didn't have any interaction with my conservative
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opponent. I believe it will come because you're right. We called every chamber of commerce,
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every local media, and we said to them, we want to have debates. We want to have debates, you know,
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every day. I'm ready to that. I'm ready for that, sorry. And I'm pretty sure that we'll have a couple
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of debates. But I had the opportunity to meet people here in this writing, farmers, and also
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entrepreneurs. It's going well. It's going well. People understand that as the leader of a party,
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it is my job and my responsibility to be elected as soon as possible. Look what Jack Meade did. He's a
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guy from Toronto, and he went up to the West Coast in Vancouver to be elected. I'm a guy from Montreal,
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originally from Boes. When I did run in Boes, before that, I was living in Montreal. And I said to people
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in Boes, I will live in Boes, I will be with you if I'm winning. And that's what I did. Now I'm
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living in Montreal, and I'm ready to be here in Manitoba after the next election. So it's going well.
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And that's only the beginning of the campaign. So I hope that I will have the opportunity to be with
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you before the end of the campaign. And I will be able to tell you a little bit more about my
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interaction with people here. But we had a good rally. When I started the campaign, we had a lot
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of people there. So it's fun. And people understand that they have an opportunity to make history.
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Because you may know that, Ezra, but the first elected reform party member was Deborah in
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by-election in 1989. And after that, at the next general election, they had 51 reform candidates
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elected. And that's the same thing. It's a by-election. So I can be in the House and start
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that common sense revolution, populist revolution in the House the June the 19th. And I'll be ready
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for that. Yeah, very interesting. Now, the by-election has not been afoot for very long,
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or at least I don't think it's been. So maybe people are just sort of waking up to it. How is the
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local media coverage been? Have you been covered by local reporters, local media? And if so,
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how has their treatment of your candidacy been? Yeah, I thank you for asking, because it's great
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to be with you, Ezra, and to speak to the national media. But the most important is the local media.
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And you have some reach here in the writing, I'm pretty sure. But yeah, I did a press conference,
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and I can tell you that I had a very good, honest, honest coverage. And I like it. And so they told me,
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let me know what you're doing, we will cover you, and we will cover your opponent. So that's good.
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I'm very happy with that. And up to now, that's a fair coverage. And I'm very happy they're doing
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their job. I believe better than the mainstream journalists, leftist journalists, who are not so
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kind to cover a leader of a party in a by-election. But actually, they did cover other leaders during
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the elections. And I hope that the mainstream media will follow our campaign a little bit.
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Yeah. Well, I think you'd probably do better if the Ottawa media completely ignored you,
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and you just dealt with local reporters. I think local reporters are not infected by the mind virus
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of hating anyone who's contrarian, hating anyone who's outside the club. I think one of the main
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problems of the Ottawa media is not just that it's left of center, but that it is such a clique,
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such a closed shop. And they probably look down their nose at anything in Manitoba, let alone a
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small town, rural, riding. Like they would look down their nose at Winnipeg, and they would laugh
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and scoff at Portage-Lisker. So I think, frankly, you don't want Ottawa media. They'll just,
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you know, do the usual number on you. I think talking to local journalists will be much more
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profitable. Have there been any polls so far? Is it still too early? Because that would be
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fascinating. I bet the conservatives are polling there. Has anything been shown publicly yet?
00:24:49.500
No. First, you must know that we at the People's Party, we don't do any pollings and any focus
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group. First, we don't want to spend money for that. The money that we have, we are spending the
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money during a campaign to promote the party because, like you said, we don't have a fair
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coverage. We didn't have a fair coverage at the last general election. So we are putting money aside
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to have that money during the general election. And it's early because, you know, the election was
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called last Sunday. So we are in the beginning of that campaign. But I believe that we will have
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some polling. But for me, I will tell you something that every politician is telling you. The real poll
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is the day of the election. And so we will work very hard to be sure that we have a good score
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the day of the election. Yeah. Well, listen, it's very interesting. And we'll certainly keep our eye
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on it. And I think we might send someone to Portage Lisger on election night. We don't have anyone
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based in Manitoba, but we love to cover the prairies. I mean, we're a prairie at heart. I'm from Calgary
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originally. I think it's interesting. And by the way, we have in the past on a number of occasions made
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invitations to interview the leader of the Conservative Party of Canada, Pierre Polyev.
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He has declined our invitation so far. And we certainly would also interview, because we're
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interested in this race, the local Conservative candidate. And in fact, I will make an invitation
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to him after this video airs. And I think he should come aboard. He will get a fair interview from me,
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and I will ask him very similar questions to what I've asked you. And we'll see if he's brave enough to
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do that or if he's been instructed not to. Maxime Vernier, as always, a pleasure to catch up with
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you. And good luck on the campaign trail. We look forward to talking to you again.
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Thank you, Ezra. So, yes, you must follow us. And I appreciate your fair coverage. Let's stay in
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touch. And I'm pretty sure that I will speak with you maybe at the day of the election. And I hope it
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will be great news for Canadians. We'll see. So, have a nice day. And let's stay in touch.
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We'll do. Thank you very much. There you have it. Maxime Vernier, leader of the People's Party of
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Canada, candidate in the June 19th by-election in Portage-Lisker. And as I mentioned, a very
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strong showing for the People's Party in the last election, over 20%. I think if there's an area for
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a breakthrough, statistically speaking, this could be it. That's our show for today. Until tomorrow,
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on behalf of all of us here at Rebel World Headquarters, to you at home, good night. And keep fighting for