Rebel News Podcast - July 17, 2020


Free the Two Michaels： If Trudeau won't act, then we will. Here's how.


Episode Stats

Length

47 minutes

Words per Minute

162.92415

Word Count

7,732

Sentence Count

368

Misogynist Sentences

7

Hate Speech Sentences

24


Summary

We have a plan to help the two Canadian citizens being held hostage in China. At the UN, we will do something about it, and I ll give you the details. But before I do, let me ask for your help in another way. Can you join as a subscriber to Rebel News Plus? That means you get the video version of the show, and other shows, like Sheila Gunn-Reed, and David Manzies, one of my favourite shows. It s just $8 a month, or if you buy the whole year for $80, it s only $80.


Transcript

00:00:00.000 Hey Rebels, today I have a bit of a different story for you.
00:00:02.940 We're going to try and do something about Michael Kovrig and Michael Spavor,
00:00:06.860 the two Canadians held hostage in China.
00:00:09.140 And by do something, I mean not just talk about it.
00:00:11.520 Actually, do something about it.
00:00:13.680 At the United Nations, we will do something about it.
00:00:17.640 I'll give you the details, and frankly, I need your help.
00:00:20.260 But before I do, let me ask for your help in another way.
00:00:22.480 Can you please join as a subscriber to Rebel News Plus?
00:00:26.620 That means you get the video version of the show.
00:00:30.140 And a couple other shows, one by Sheila Gunn-Reed, one by David Manzies.
00:00:33.420 You can get all that at rebelnews.com.
00:00:35.060 It's just $8 a month.
00:00:36.160 Or if you buy the whole year, it's only $80.
00:00:38.420 So it's a discount, a pretty healthy discount.
00:00:41.620 And of course, the most important thing is it keeps us going.
00:00:44.920 Because we don't take a dime from the government.
00:00:46.600 You know that.
00:00:47.660 All right, here's today's podcast.
00:00:52.700 You're listening to a Rebel News Podcast.
00:01:00.000 We have a plan to help the two Michaels being held hostage in China.
00:01:08.000 It's July 16th, and this is the Ezra LeVant Show.
00:01:12.980 Why should others go to jail when you're a biggest carbon consumer I know?
00:01:16.680 There's 8,500 customers here, and you won't give them an answer.
00:01:20.320 The only thing I have to say to the government of a wire publisher is because it's my bloody right to do so.
00:01:26.620 Almost 600 days ago, the Chinese dictatorship kidnapped two Canadian citizens, Michael Kovrig and Michael Spavor.
00:01:40.300 Justin Trudeau hasn't done anything about it.
00:01:42.440 In fact, he continues to send foreign aid to China, even sending our entire national stockpile of face masks
00:01:49.440 and other personal protective equipment to China for free in the middle of the pandemic.
00:01:54.260 He really is their poodle.
00:01:56.620 There's a level of admiration I actually have for China, because their basic dictatorship is allowing them to actually turn their economy around on a dime.
00:02:10.560 The two Michaels weren't captured in a legal arrest.
00:02:13.840 They were held for the first year and a half without even being charged with a crime.
00:02:18.220 They're being held in brutal conditions in a light, in a room where the lights are never turned off.
00:02:23.580 That's a form of torture.
00:02:24.660 They're being denied visits from Canadian diplomats.
00:02:28.740 China has been crystal clear about what they're doing.
00:02:30.700 They're taking hostages.
00:02:32.140 That's not what G20 countries do.
00:02:34.160 That's what terrorists or pirates or criminals do.
00:02:38.020 Communist China is acting like a rogue country, like gangsters.
00:02:42.600 That dictatorship may be producing your high-tech cell phones and computers,
00:02:46.120 but it is still a dictatorship.
00:02:48.340 It still has that 1970s Mao Zedong thuggery in it.
00:02:53.900 They're not even trying to hide it.
00:02:55.600 Chinese dictators repeatedly admit that these two Canadians were seized as a bargaining chip
00:03:00.500 to force the release of an accused Chinese criminal in Canada.
00:03:05.100 Meng Wanzhou, the CFO of the huge Chinese tech company called Huawei,
00:03:08.480 she was arrested in Vancouver and is being extradited to the U.S. to face charges of fraud.
00:03:14.920 Meng, of course, is out on bail.
00:03:16.340 She's living the high life in Vancouver, a wonderful city where she's free to go out and about,
00:03:21.160 and has the very best lawyers that her billions can buy.
00:03:24.280 So far, she's lost her first round in court.
00:03:27.260 A fair judge in an independent legal system said that the extradition hearing can proceed.
00:03:33.660 But the Chinese dictators want her sprung out of jail before the trial is even over.
00:03:38.600 It's a tit-for-tat, say the Chinese.
00:03:40.460 It's an admission that the two Michaels didn't do anything wrong.
00:03:43.760 They're just hostages, bargaining chips.
00:03:46.900 So what have we done as a country in response to this barbaric behavior by China?
00:03:51.300 This is hostage-taking, kidnapping.
00:03:55.060 Have we kicked out Chinese diplomats in protest?
00:03:58.260 Have we sent home some of the thousands of children of corrupt Communist Party of China officials
00:04:03.480 who send their kids to attend Canadian universities,
00:04:06.620 taking up spaces otherwise available to Canadian citizens?
00:04:09.360 Have we kicked them out?
00:04:10.920 Have we put any tariffs on Chinese imported goods?
00:04:14.480 Have we even just used our words to condemn them?
00:04:17.780 No, no, no, and no.
00:04:19.560 The opposite, actually.
00:04:22.300 We are completely compliant and submissive.
00:04:24.440 Trudeau is even giving more foreign aid to China,
00:04:27.280 including a bizarre financial grant to the Wuhan Virology Lab.
00:04:32.080 I'm not kidding.
00:04:33.540 Is there nothing China can do that Trudeau won't just shrug off?
00:04:37.820 It's humiliating, of course.
00:04:39.260 It's un-Canadian.
00:04:40.360 And most importantly, it's not working.
00:04:41.900 It's not getting the two Michaels back.
00:04:43.820 In fact, the Chinese fake legal system,
00:04:45.880 it's all predetermined by the Communist Party over there.
00:04:48.260 They've ratcheted up the propaganda war,
00:04:51.160 recently charging the two Michaels with spying.
00:04:54.760 It's world news.
00:04:55.520 Here's the BBC story.
00:04:56.680 And yet, still, Trudeau does nothing.
00:05:00.040 No sanctions.
00:05:01.140 No diplomatic expulsions.
00:05:03.420 In fact, Trudeau is actually sending our pandemic benefits
00:05:05.940 to those Chinese Communist Party children I talked about,
00:05:09.240 the ones who attend school in Canada.
00:05:11.040 They're not Canadian citizens,
00:05:12.420 but they're getting that Canadian welfare check,
00:05:15.320 that weekly cash gift.
00:05:18.920 Maybe Donald Trump could help us.
00:05:21.240 He's put a big premium on getting Americans back from around the world.
00:05:24.400 He's repatriated around 40 American citizens at great cost.
00:05:29.420 It seems to be very important to him.
00:05:31.220 China would never dare to take an American hostage with Trump in charge.
00:05:35.660 They know Trump would punish them dearly.
00:05:37.260 So if Trudeau doesn't have the courage himself,
00:05:39.680 maybe he could borrow some of Trump's courage?
00:05:43.480 Well, Trump really wanted something from Trudeau recently.
00:05:46.760 He wanted Trudeau to come down to Washington,
00:05:49.100 along with the Mexican president,
00:05:50.620 to sign the revised NAFTA renegotiated treaty.
00:05:55.080 Now, the Mexican president came up,
00:05:56.620 but Trudeau just refused to come.
00:05:59.500 He said he was too busy.
00:06:00.920 I'm serious.
00:06:01.480 That's what Trudeau said.
00:06:02.600 Trudeau, who hasn't left this house for months,
00:06:04.740 except for the odd photo op,
00:06:06.240 he's too busy.
00:06:08.220 Trump really wanted Trudeau at that meeting for some reason.
00:06:10.900 He proceeded with just the Mexican president,
00:06:13.060 and he made a proud little video of the meeting.
00:06:15.880 I'm sure Trump was irritated with the fact that Trudeau skipped out with no good reason.
00:06:20.160 But imagine if instead Trudeau had gone and said,
00:06:22.660 all right, Mr. President,
00:06:23.800 I'm here for your photo op,
00:06:25.440 and I'll do it with a smile,
00:06:26.620 but can you do me a favor in return?
00:06:28.580 Can you please phone President Xi Jinping right now while I'm here
00:06:32.900 and tell him to release the two Michaels?
00:06:35.500 By the way,
00:06:36.100 they were kidnapped because we Canadians arrested Meng Wanzhou
00:06:39.900 to extradite her to America,
00:06:42.420 so maybe you can help us out since we're sort of paying the price for that.
00:06:45.420 And I bet if Trudeau wasn't snarky about it,
00:06:48.100 and if he asked in a genuine and maybe even a complimentary or flattering way,
00:06:52.480 I bet Trump would have done it.
00:06:54.640 But Trudeau didn't.
00:06:55.820 And so the two Michaels remain in prison.
00:06:58.840 So nothing.
00:06:59.840 It'll soon be 600 days in prison.
00:07:02.600 So we've got an idea.
00:07:06.220 There's a great Canadian human rights law scholar.
00:07:10.380 He used to teach constitutional law.
00:07:12.480 He's been a lawyer.
00:07:14.040 And most importantly for our purposes,
00:07:15.840 he championed the case of the Falun Gong,
00:07:18.780 who were persecuted by the Chinese Communist Party.
00:07:21.500 He worked with a member of Parliament named David Kilgore
00:07:24.920 to investigate and expose China's horrific practice of forcibly harvesting human organs
00:07:31.140 from live prisoners, including Falun Gong political prisoners.
00:07:34.780 They would cut those organs out of people and sell them to China's Communist Party officials
00:07:40.100 or even foreign buyers.
00:07:41.120 David Matus is the name of the lawyer who exposed that and who told the world.
00:07:47.780 Well, we've asked Professor Matus, who knows about China and Chinese prisons and human rights law in the UN.
00:07:53.720 And we asked him what we could possibly do to help the two Michaels.
00:07:57.160 What we could do.
00:07:59.420 I mean, we're not in government.
00:08:00.840 We're just citizens who wish something would be done.
00:08:04.660 Well, Matus had an idea.
00:08:06.740 Here, watch my recent interview with him.
00:08:08.680 Professor, based on your work scrutinizing China,
00:08:13.940 your lifelong dedication to civil rights,
00:08:17.280 and your interest in Canadian politics,
00:08:20.840 our mutual friend, our lawyer Aaron Rosenberg,
00:08:23.960 reached out to you to discuss how we could perhaps work with you
00:08:28.820 on the troubling case of the two Michaels,
00:08:31.960 Michael Kovrig and Michael Spavor,
00:08:34.060 who have been in illegal detention in China for a year and a half.
00:08:39.580 Can you explain to our viewers
00:08:41.620 what legal steps you think we can take,
00:08:46.880 given that we don't have standing as the family or the two men,
00:08:51.020 given that we're not the government of Canada,
00:08:52.940 and given that China is in some ways a rogue state,
00:08:57.140 what could we do legally about what is really a hostage-taking?
00:09:04.180 The opportunities for dealing legally
00:09:07.220 with Chinese violations of international human rights standards
00:09:11.520 is relatively limited
00:09:13.280 because China is not a signatory to many human rights treaties.
00:09:19.060 And the ones where it does sign on to,
00:09:22.380 like the Convention Against Torture,
00:09:24.040 it tends to not sign on to the optional complaints mechanisms
00:09:28.320 or the international legal disputes mechanisms.
00:09:32.180 There are some recourses nonetheless,
00:09:35.020 and a couple of those are through the United Nations Human Rights Council thematic mechanisms.
00:09:48.220 What the United Nations Human Rights Council has done
00:09:51.620 is set up a number of thematic mechanisms,
00:09:55.180 rapporteurs, working groups,
00:09:56.640 dealing with specific human rights issues.
00:10:00.140 There's a rapporteur on torture,
00:10:03.140 there's a working group on disappearances,
00:10:05.420 there's a working group on arbitrary detention,
00:10:07.880 and so on,
00:10:08.560 and there's dozens of them.
00:10:11.000 And these thematic mechanisms,
00:10:13.680 they're not treaty-based,
00:10:15.620 they're just council-based,
00:10:17.740 and so they have jurisdiction over the whole world,
00:10:20.860 including China,
00:10:22.000 whether,
00:10:22.740 and there's no agreement necessary
00:10:24.540 from states of the United Nations
00:10:27.020 for these mechanisms
00:10:29.240 to deal with human rights in those countries.
00:10:31.020 and so these mechanisms can
00:10:35.800 and have in the past dealt with China.
00:10:38.260 And I was dealing, for instance,
00:10:39.700 with the UN rapporteur on torture
00:10:42.620 and the UN rapporteur on religious intolerance
00:10:46.060 about this issue of organ transplant abuse in Falun Gong,
00:10:50.520 and also with the UN Committee Against Torture,
00:10:54.460 because China is a signatory to the Convention Against Torture,
00:10:58.760 also with the Universal Periodic Review,
00:11:01.020 at the UN Human Rights Council,
00:11:02.560 because the Universal Periodic Review,
00:11:05.160 as the name indicates,
00:11:06.200 is universal,
00:11:07.220 and China comes up for review every few years,
00:11:10.940 and then any state can raise
00:11:12.680 any human rights concern it wants
00:11:15.060 during the Universal Periodic Review.
00:11:17.980 When it comes to the Universal Periodic Review
00:11:21.760 or the Convention Against Torture,
00:11:23.920 we are dealing with periodicity.
00:11:27.280 We are dealing with events
00:11:29.760 which occur every so often.
00:11:31.480 But when it comes to the thematic mechanisms,
00:11:34.620 they're continuously functioning.
00:11:36.620 They report to the Human Rights Council every year,
00:11:40.060 and they can take complaints at any time or petitions.
00:11:45.940 Now, these human rights mechanisms do have complaints
00:11:49.720 or petition options,
00:11:52.800 and the petitions are open to everybody.
00:11:56.340 They're open to states,
00:11:58.140 they're open to NGOs,
00:12:00.160 and, of course,
00:12:03.940 they're open to the victims and their families.
00:12:05.880 But consent is not necessary
00:12:08.780 of the families or the victims.
00:12:11.880 I mean, obviously,
00:12:12.660 in some situations,
00:12:14.460 the consent of the victims is impossible
00:12:17.340 where they're disappeared
00:12:18.320 or maybe arbitrarily executed.
00:12:21.520 And the families may be intimidated,
00:12:23.680 which is often the case
00:12:25.080 in China,
00:12:27.520 where the Communist Party makes the point
00:12:30.620 of not just intimidating their target,
00:12:33.160 but everybody in their network
00:12:34.560 to try to get at their target.
00:12:36.960 And so often the only available recourse,
00:12:40.660 which is true, really,
00:12:42.280 of my dealing with Falun Gong,
00:12:44.640 is an outsider
00:12:45.320 who has no connection to China
00:12:48.520 and no point of pressure.
00:12:50.420 I mean,
00:12:50.780 I'm not going to lose any business with China
00:12:53.160 by doing this sort of thing
00:12:54.260 because I don't have any business with China.
00:12:56.440 And so that's the system.
00:12:59.740 It is a system of complainer petition
00:13:03.020 by NGOs or somebody like Rebel News.
00:13:07.060 They can make such a complainer petition
00:13:09.840 and then the thematic mechanism
00:13:13.940 will deal with it.
00:13:14.980 Well, Professor,
00:13:15.920 we would like to do that
00:13:17.700 because we,
00:13:19.040 like so many Canadians
00:13:20.080 and others around the world,
00:13:21.060 have watched what we perceive
00:13:22.980 to be inaction
00:13:24.140 on the part of the Canadian government.
00:13:25.820 There's the odd, gentle statement,
00:13:28.600 but there's been no diplomatic repercussions,
00:13:31.600 no sanctions,
00:13:32.460 no deported diplomats,
00:13:34.340 no trade,
00:13:35.480 you know,
00:13:37.080 consequences.
00:13:38.560 I think that the fact
00:13:41.040 that those two men
00:13:41.820 are still in detention
00:13:42.560 a year and a half later
00:13:43.520 says everything we need to know.
00:13:45.860 Now,
00:13:46.100 I want to tell our viewers
00:13:47.860 that you did take steps
00:13:50.400 to reach out to the family
00:13:52.020 to get their thoughts
00:13:54.700 on this process,
00:13:56.540 to invite them to participate,
00:13:58.520 to invite them
00:13:59.220 to receive updates.
00:14:01.420 What have you heard back,
00:14:03.300 if anything,
00:14:04.440 from the families
00:14:05.680 after you emailed
00:14:07.400 and reached out to them
00:14:08.620 about our proposed steps?
00:14:11.720 Well, yes,
00:14:12.480 that's true.
00:14:13.400 There was a communication
00:14:14.680 to the families
00:14:15.340 because we did have
00:14:15.980 contact information
00:14:17.000 telling them that we,
00:14:17.900 well,
00:14:19.180 Rebel News was planning
00:14:20.040 to do this,
00:14:21.200 that we would keep them
00:14:22.220 in touch.
00:14:22.760 We wanted to inform them.
00:14:24.540 We invited them
00:14:25.740 to participate
00:14:26.960 if they wanted to participate.
00:14:28.940 We haven't heard back
00:14:29.860 from them since.
00:14:30.800 The communication
00:14:31.320 is relatively recent,
00:14:32.840 so I don't know
00:14:35.220 if that tells us
00:14:36.340 anything yet
00:14:37.120 because very often
00:14:38.140 people are slow
00:14:41.320 in communications
00:14:41.980 and also,
00:14:44.080 I assume,
00:14:44.560 they get a lot of stuff.
00:14:45.460 But in any case,
00:14:48.840 we're giving them
00:14:52.000 an option
00:14:52.500 of something
00:14:53.040 they may want to do,
00:14:54.580 but they don't have to answer
00:14:56.420 and their non-answer is,
00:15:00.100 there is no requirement
00:15:01.420 for them to answer
00:15:02.260 for the UN system
00:15:03.120 to become engaged.
00:15:04.880 And I can imagine
00:15:05.620 that given the thing
00:15:06.920 they care about most,
00:15:08.760 these people
00:15:10.560 are still in grave jeopardy.
00:15:13.040 They most likely,
00:15:14.240 I'm trying to put myself
00:15:15.060 in their shoes,
00:15:15.760 they most likely
00:15:16.480 would not want
00:15:17.780 to be seen
00:15:18.880 as being personally
00:15:20.680 antagonistic
00:15:21.760 to the government
00:15:23.240 of China.
00:15:24.120 So even if they were
00:15:26.860 to reply,
00:15:28.200 it would be under
00:15:29.140 a form of duress.
00:15:30.180 It would almost be
00:15:31.220 like asking a hostage,
00:15:33.920 do you like,
00:15:35.080 do you want us to help?
00:15:36.440 I mean,
00:15:37.180 but I'm glad you did
00:15:38.420 reach out to them
00:15:39.160 and of course
00:15:39.600 keep us posted
00:15:40.280 what they say.
00:15:40.980 tell our viewers,
00:15:43.520 what would the form
00:15:44.660 of a complaint be?
00:15:46.340 You mentioned
00:15:46.820 that there are
00:15:47.400 these thematic groups
00:15:49.960 at the UN Human Rights Council.
00:15:52.200 Would it be
00:15:52.960 the form of a letter?
00:15:54.760 Is it a formal application,
00:15:56.580 a formal report?
00:15:57.280 What would it look like
00:15:58.820 what you would prepare
00:16:00.060 as a lawyer?
00:16:01.600 You would refer
00:16:02.260 to certain principles
00:16:03.300 and bring facts
00:16:04.340 to the attention
00:16:05.100 of the UN?
00:16:06.060 Is it just a letter?
00:16:08.620 The UN website
00:16:10.300 actually tells you
00:16:12.320 what they want
00:16:13.060 and they ask
00:16:15.820 for specific
00:16:16.780 types of information.
00:16:19.020 Obviously,
00:16:19.740 what they want
00:16:20.220 is as much detail
00:16:21.220 as possible
00:16:21.800 because often
00:16:24.080 the problem is
00:16:26.340 that when people
00:16:28.860 make complaints,
00:16:29.480 it's difficult
00:16:30.000 to know exactly
00:16:30.720 what they're talking about.
00:16:32.100 So names, dates,
00:16:34.240 times, places,
00:16:35.020 as much detail
00:16:37.720 about the specific
00:16:38.660 violation
00:16:39.480 as you could possibly get.
00:16:42.160 They'd be interested
00:16:43.220 in exhaustion
00:16:43.940 of remedies,
00:16:45.460 not in terms of Canada
00:16:47.460 but in terms of China,
00:16:48.620 like what has been done
00:16:51.460 or could be done
00:16:52.400 in China
00:16:54.060 to alleviate
00:16:55.540 the plight
00:16:55.980 of these people.
00:16:57.660 They'd be interested
00:16:58.660 in other remedies
00:16:59.720 that are being sought
00:17:00.720 that might be useful
00:17:02.300 either in the UN system
00:17:04.360 or anywhere else
00:17:05.560 around the world.
00:17:06.980 They'd be interested
00:17:07.980 in how the particular
00:17:09.860 complaint fits
00:17:10.700 within the mandate
00:17:11.480 of the theme mechanism
00:17:12.880 to which the complaint
00:17:13.720 is being addressed.
00:17:15.100 Those are the sorts
00:17:16.240 of things
00:17:16.740 that the complaint
00:17:18.000 would address.
00:17:18.700 I have a question
00:17:21.120 for you
00:17:21.540 and it would touch
00:17:22.400 on anything
00:17:22.960 of the United Nations.
00:17:24.120 China
00:17:24.460 is very influential
00:17:26.560 of the UN.
00:17:27.520 It runs four agencies
00:17:29.400 and effectively
00:17:30.160 controls a fifth.
00:17:31.620 We saw their interference
00:17:32.900 recently
00:17:33.400 with the World Health
00:17:34.340 Organization.
00:17:36.320 What is the ability
00:17:38.380 of China
00:17:39.120 simply to veto
00:17:40.420 or crush
00:17:41.720 or shut down
00:17:43.120 or summarily dismiss
00:17:44.800 something that criticizes it?
00:17:46.620 Because the UN
00:17:47.300 is not friendly
00:17:48.260 to democratic activists
00:17:50.140 who ask pesky questions
00:17:51.620 like you will do.
00:17:55.780 What do you think
00:17:57.100 China will do
00:17:58.660 in reaction
00:17:59.460 to our legal complaint?
00:18:04.740 Well, as I said,
00:18:06.120 typically what happens
00:18:06.880 with these complaints
00:18:07.700 is that the rapporteur
00:18:10.700 will send the complaint
00:18:12.140 to the foreign government
00:18:13.340 for response
00:18:14.300 and then in the report
00:18:16.600 afterwards,
00:18:18.680 typically what happens
00:18:20.480 is that the rapporteur
00:18:22.980 will put in the complaint
00:18:25.160 to report on the complaint
00:18:26.260 and report on the response
00:18:27.400 and may draw some concluding
00:18:29.500 or may draw some observations
00:18:31.220 based on it.
00:18:33.480 And my experience is,
00:18:35.720 at least with some
00:18:37.620 of the other times
00:18:38.420 I've dealt with the system,
00:18:39.480 is the exercise is useful
00:18:41.420 even if when you're dealing
00:18:43.520 with China
00:18:44.180 what you get back
00:18:45.140 is nonsense.
00:18:49.020 Because if I were to write
00:18:50.720 to the government
00:18:51.200 of China directly
00:18:52.160 and say,
00:18:52.660 I don't like what you're doing
00:18:53.560 with the two Michaels,
00:18:54.580 they'd probably just ignore it.
00:18:56.980 But with the UN system,
00:18:59.800 although they may generate
00:19:01.240 nonsense in response,
00:19:02.560 they feel they can't ignore it
00:19:03.920 so they will reply.
00:19:06.220 And a nonsensical reply
00:19:08.700 from the government
00:19:10.200 of China
00:19:10.720 serves its own purpose
00:19:12.340 because it becomes possible
00:19:14.220 to point out
00:19:15.360 how nonsensical it is.
00:19:17.020 And so, for instance,
00:19:18.100 with this organ transplant abuse,
00:19:19.980 we were concerned about
00:19:21.180 the government of China
00:19:22.440 was saying,
00:19:22.940 look at,
00:19:23.580 you know,
00:19:23.980 they were boasting,
00:19:24.720 look at how big
00:19:25.700 our transplant numbers are
00:19:26.840 trying to show
00:19:27.420 they're technologically
00:19:28.300 head in transplants.
00:19:30.000 And so then
00:19:32.480 the UN rapporteur said,
00:19:34.980 well, okay,
00:19:35.740 you've got these
00:19:36.220 big transplant numbers,
00:19:37.380 where do the organs come from?
00:19:39.820 And the response to that was,
00:19:41.340 we never said
00:19:42.020 our transplant numbers
00:19:42.980 were big,
00:19:43.840 which of course
00:19:44.820 they had said
00:19:45.480 and it was posted
00:19:46.240 on their internet sites
00:19:47.300 at the same time
00:19:48.400 as they were denying
00:19:49.120 they said it.
00:19:50.400 So, I mean,
00:19:51.320 it was just such obvious nonsense
00:19:52.800 that it became
00:19:53.500 another point of attack.
00:19:55.880 And so,
00:19:57.460 I would say
00:19:58.640 that exercise
00:19:59.820 I mean,
00:20:01.140 obviously didn't stop
00:20:02.100 the abuse
00:20:02.540 and it still continues.
00:20:03.740 It just added
00:20:05.220 to the weight
00:20:05.880 of the argument
00:20:06.800 that we had
00:20:07.460 and gave us
00:20:07.980 an additional reason
00:20:09.960 why our position
00:20:11.640 was strong
00:20:12.260 because,
00:20:12.740 I mean,
00:20:13.140 if the government
00:20:14.740 in China
00:20:15.280 in response
00:20:16.020 to a well-reasoned argument
00:20:17.440 can answer
00:20:18.260 only nonsense,
00:20:19.300 it must be
00:20:20.800 that they don't have
00:20:21.740 a good answer
00:20:23.220 if all they can give
00:20:24.100 is a bad answer.
00:20:25.660 Well,
00:20:26.300 so that's the goal here
00:20:28.100 is to write
00:20:29.300 a complaint
00:20:30.040 that properly
00:20:31.380 marshals the facts
00:20:32.800 and the law
00:20:33.340 and shows
00:20:33.920 what China's doing
00:20:34.820 and at the very least
00:20:36.440 compel them
00:20:37.160 to give,
00:20:38.280 I guess it's like
00:20:39.000 question period
00:20:39.780 in Parliament
00:20:40.380 that way.
00:20:41.340 You don't really
00:20:42.260 get a good answer
00:20:43.080 most of the time
00:20:43.960 but sometimes
00:20:45.100 the absurdity
00:20:45.900 of the answer
00:20:46.520 is telling in itself.
00:20:48.220 So that's our goal here.
00:20:50.120 Write a letter
00:20:51.100 to bring attention
00:20:52.000 to this
00:20:52.540 and smoke out
00:20:54.220 China's answers
00:20:55.660 and maybe
00:20:56.520 use those
00:20:57.060 to contradict
00:20:57.700 China
00:20:58.220 or to show
00:20:59.560 how unlawful
00:21:01.800 they are.
00:21:02.220 That's our goal.
00:21:03.020 Is that correct?
00:21:04.980 Yes,
00:21:05.280 I would agree with that.
00:21:06.180 I mean,
00:21:06.400 I think question period
00:21:07.220 is a good analogy.
00:21:08.300 I don't mean to suggest
00:21:09.360 that the government
00:21:10.000 is anything like
00:21:12.580 the government
00:21:13.000 of China
00:21:13.500 but otherwise
00:21:15.000 I think it's
00:21:15.700 a good analogy.
00:21:17.120 Well,
00:21:17.220 what do you think?
00:21:18.620 The plan is simple
00:21:19.820 and small
00:21:20.520 but I think
00:21:21.000 it's better than zero,
00:21:22.080 better than nothing,
00:21:22.980 Trudeau's approach.
00:21:24.440 Draft a formal complaint
00:21:25.680 about how the two Michaels
00:21:26.480 are being mistreated
00:21:27.360 by China.
00:21:28.980 File it with the
00:21:29.620 special rapporteurs
00:21:31.080 at the UN's
00:21:32.060 Human Rights Council.
00:21:33.360 Make China answer it
00:21:34.920 and use their answer
00:21:36.360 politically and diplomatically
00:21:37.480 to name and shame China
00:21:39.440 as breaking
00:21:40.320 international law,
00:21:42.160 breaking international norms.
00:21:43.320 They hate that.
00:21:43.900 They don't like losing face.
00:21:46.180 We have a few other ideas too
00:21:47.740 but the main thing
00:21:48.580 is to do something,
00:21:49.940 something that the world
00:21:51.060 will at least see
00:21:51.940 and hear
00:21:52.580 not the total
00:21:53.760 silent surrender
00:21:54.780 that Trudeau is doing.
00:21:56.700 Will this free
00:21:57.480 the two Michaels?
00:21:58.860 Probably not.
00:22:00.560 Will it bring their plight
00:22:01.560 to a wider audience?
00:22:03.580 You bet it will.
00:22:05.200 Will we hopefully
00:22:06.320 spur actual politicians
00:22:07.900 to do something more?
00:22:09.060 Maybe even to take over
00:22:09.940 this project?
00:22:11.440 I hope so.
00:22:12.840 In any event,
00:22:13.600 we're just going to do it.
00:22:15.460 I just feel like
00:22:16.220 we have to.
00:22:17.620 If you want to help,
00:22:18.520 please do.
00:22:19.000 We're paying
00:22:19.520 Professor Madis' fee
00:22:20.640 for his legal work.
00:22:22.980 We'll file a complaint
00:22:24.020 when it's ready
00:22:24.540 which should be soon.
00:22:26.400 And when the time is right,
00:22:27.580 we will actually go
00:22:28.420 to Geneva, Switzerland
00:22:29.700 where the UN Human Rights Council is
00:22:31.580 and maybe make a bit
00:22:32.640 of a fuss about this too.
00:22:34.840 I do need your help, please.
00:22:36.480 I've signed a retainer agreement
00:22:37.840 with Professor Madis
00:22:38.700 to cover his fees
00:22:39.880 and his travel costs
00:22:40.920 if we go to Geneva.
00:22:41.740 If you think this is a good idea,
00:22:44.400 please help me out
00:22:45.280 by going to
00:22:46.000 freethetomichaels.com
00:22:49.260 freethetomichaels.com
00:22:50.580 I will post updates
00:22:51.980 at that website
00:22:52.800 when the legal complaint
00:22:53.820 is ready.
00:22:54.400 We'll publish the legal complaint
00:22:55.840 itself.
00:22:56.240 You can read it for yourself.
00:22:57.960 And all of our follow-up work
00:22:59.480 including hopefully
00:23:00.200 the trip to Geneva itself.
00:23:01.780 This is a small step
00:23:03.080 but that's more than anything
00:23:05.260 Trudeau has done.
00:23:06.660 If you believe in
00:23:07.620 standing up to China
00:23:08.500 and calling out their bullying
00:23:09.980 and standing up
00:23:11.040 for Canadian citizens,
00:23:12.220 please go to
00:23:12.740 freethetomichaels.com
00:23:15.420 and lend a hand.
00:23:16.700 Thanks.
00:23:28.540 Welcome back.
00:23:29.360 Well, it wasn't too long ago
00:23:30.460 that we spoke to our next guest.
00:23:32.920 His name is Philip Layton.
00:23:33.920 He's a former law school dean
00:23:35.040 and is the author of a book
00:23:36.820 about freedom of speech
00:23:38.140 in Canada
00:23:38.960 called Nothing Left to Lose
00:23:41.700 An Impolite Report
00:23:43.360 on the State of Freedom in Canada.
00:23:46.260 It was a very interesting discussion
00:23:47.400 and was well received
00:23:48.200 by our viewers
00:23:48.880 but who knew
00:23:50.340 that it would be so timely
00:23:52.780 with the wave of
00:23:54.120 cancel culture mobs
00:23:56.420 that we've seen since
00:23:58.300 that interview.
00:23:59.480 I think, for example,
00:24:00.780 the case of Barry Weiss
00:24:01.980 a liberal journalist
00:24:03.700 who was brought into
00:24:06.260 the New York Times
00:24:07.240 to provide a little bit
00:24:08.040 of diversity
00:24:08.800 of opinion
00:24:10.080 and was thrown out,
00:24:11.720 spat out
00:24:12.160 for precisely that reason.
00:24:14.380 Technically,
00:24:15.040 she resigned
00:24:15.920 but only because,
00:24:17.840 as she described
00:24:18.600 in a powerful letter,
00:24:20.060 she was targeted
00:24:21.420 by others
00:24:22.420 within the Times
00:24:23.420 with attacks,
00:24:24.780 personal attacks,
00:24:25.540 even anti-Semitic attacks,
00:24:26.780 for daring not to tell
00:24:28.660 the woke,
00:24:30.380 intersectional leftist
00:24:31.840 take on everything.
00:24:34.460 And so we brought back
00:24:35.280 our guest,
00:24:35.980 Philip Slayton,
00:24:37.040 to talk about
00:24:37.680 the latest
00:24:38.560 in cancel culture.
00:24:40.140 He joins us now
00:24:40.860 via Skype.
00:24:42.000 Philip,
00:24:42.440 what do you make
00:24:43.240 of the liberal icons
00:24:45.940 who have been tumbling,
00:24:46.920 not just right-wingers
00:24:47.860 or conservatives,
00:24:48.900 but people who style
00:24:49.980 themselves as liberal,
00:24:51.160 who write for liberal
00:24:52.660 bastions like
00:24:54.580 the New York Times?
00:24:55.240 If Barry Weiss
00:24:56.440 is worried about
00:24:58.060 cancel culture,
00:24:58.880 it tells me
00:24:59.300 it's gone pretty far.
00:25:01.620 Well, I think
00:25:02.600 it has gone far.
00:25:04.760 Ezra, by the way,
00:25:05.440 I'm delighted
00:25:06.020 to be back on your show.
00:25:07.100 I enjoyed it
00:25:07.780 the first time around
00:25:08.680 and I'm sure
00:25:09.100 I'll enjoy it this time.
00:25:10.480 I think it has gone too far,
00:25:12.160 although I find it
00:25:13.280 somewhat confusing.
00:25:15.320 It's not,
00:25:15.880 the cancel culture
00:25:16.760 is not clearly identified
00:25:17.900 with either the right
00:25:19.080 or the left.
00:25:20.420 It's supposed to be
00:25:21.100 to employ it
00:25:21.640 when it suits them.
00:25:23.040 And it's also
00:25:23.600 not entirely clear
00:25:25.140 to be what
00:25:25.540 is meant
00:25:26.000 by cancel culture.
00:25:27.980 I have no problem
00:25:29.340 with people
00:25:30.460 getting feisty
00:25:31.460 on social media,
00:25:33.360 with people
00:25:34.360 criticizing the views
00:25:37.060 or the careers
00:25:38.420 of people
00:25:38.880 when they do it
00:25:39.360 on social media,
00:25:40.440 even if they do it
00:25:41.360 in a rather intemperate,
00:25:42.760 perhaps even rude way.
00:25:44.200 I mean,
00:25:44.700 we're all grown-ups,
00:25:46.100 we can handle this,
00:25:47.040 if we can't handle this,
00:25:47.900 we should just stay home
00:25:48.800 and not turn on the television
00:25:50.080 or turn on our computer.
00:25:51.920 But the question is,
00:25:54.120 if that's okay,
00:25:55.360 what is no?
00:25:56.880 And I would suggest to you
00:25:57.920 that there's a couple
00:25:58.540 of things that are not okay.
00:26:00.340 It's not okay
00:26:01.240 when what's really happening
00:26:02.720 is an attempt
00:26:03.440 not just to criticize
00:26:04.660 somebody's views
00:26:05.720 or their conduct
00:26:06.500 in a particular case,
00:26:08.120 but to destroy
00:26:08.940 their reputation
00:26:09.740 and destroy their career.
00:26:11.480 In fact,
00:26:11.760 get them fired
00:26:12.540 because they've said
00:26:13.660 something or done something
00:26:14.720 that's not regarded
00:26:15.320 as acceptable.
00:26:15.980 But worst of all,
00:26:17.820 in my view,
00:26:19.160 is the often craven way
00:26:21.500 in which institutions
00:26:23.540 respond to this
00:26:24.920 by firing people,
00:26:27.180 by issuing apologies
00:26:28.420 when it's not clear
00:26:29.060 what the apology is issued for.
00:26:31.000 And even more distressing
00:26:32.660 in some respects
00:26:33.400 is the way people
00:26:34.620 who are the subject
00:26:35.500 of these kinds of attacks
00:26:36.900 feel obliged
00:26:38.900 to kind of put on sackcloth
00:26:41.480 and ashes
00:26:41.960 and apologize
00:26:42.800 and tell everybody
00:26:44.140 they're going to go away
00:26:45.080 to listen
00:26:46.480 and reflect
00:26:47.300 and learn.
00:26:48.320 To me,
00:26:48.580 that's just a bunch of rubbish.
00:26:50.720 You know,
00:26:51.380 there was a case,
00:26:52.740 I mean,
00:26:53.080 I agree with you
00:26:53.840 that we should allow
00:26:54.640 feisty debate
00:26:55.560 and even flame wars
00:26:57.200 as they're called,
00:26:57.880 but that's the point,
00:27:00.020 I think,
00:27:00.420 is that the left doesn't,
00:27:01.720 and I say it's the left
00:27:02.720 because I don't see
00:27:04.100 cancel culture
00:27:04.820 as a traditional
00:27:07.040 or regular tactic
00:27:08.280 on the right.
00:27:08.880 I challenge anyone
00:27:10.660 to tell me a case
00:27:11.640 of a conservative-leaning
00:27:12.920 campus group
00:27:13.860 trying to ban
00:27:15.160 a leftist speaker
00:27:16.120 from campus
00:27:16.820 or shut down
00:27:17.840 a leftist club
00:27:18.720 on campus.
00:27:19.300 I've just never seen it,
00:27:20.600 whereas the reverse
00:27:21.520 is almost universally true.
00:27:24.100 But let me give you
00:27:24.800 an example.
00:27:25.260 So I wish
00:27:26.300 that it was feisty debates.
00:27:28.060 I wish
00:27:28.500 it was rollicking,
00:27:30.540 you know,
00:27:30.900 elbows up,
00:27:31.720 arguing.
00:27:32.320 I don't think that's there.
00:27:33.660 We have safe spaces
00:27:34.940 and trigger warnings now.
00:27:36.500 I mean,
00:27:36.660 for God's sakes,
00:27:37.700 the chain of newspapers
00:27:39.480 in Atlanta,
00:27:39.980 Canada called Salt Wire
00:27:41.400 had a warning
00:27:43.600 on their Canada Day newspaper
00:27:45.580 that there was
00:27:46.440 a Canadian flag inside.
00:27:47.760 They literally had
00:27:48.500 a trigger warning
00:27:49.300 that there was
00:27:50.320 a Canadian flag inside.
00:27:52.100 But let me give you
00:27:52.740 an example
00:27:53.220 that I'd love you
00:27:54.000 to talk about.
00:27:54.940 This is a tweet
00:27:56.040 from the West Midlands
00:27:58.880 Police Department,
00:28:00.480 which is in the UK.
00:28:02.280 It's Birmingham
00:28:03.020 and whatnot.
00:28:04.200 And they're boasting,
00:28:05.780 they're bragging,
00:28:06.580 they're gleeful
00:28:08.420 in announcing
00:28:09.520 that they literally
00:28:10.580 arrested a 12-year-old
00:28:13.720 for making racially
00:28:15.660 insensitive comments
00:28:17.000 on social media
00:28:18.000 about a professional footballer.
00:28:20.340 That's what they call
00:28:20.860 soccer over there.
00:28:22.220 They boasted
00:28:23.180 that they arrested him,
00:28:24.320 that they found him
00:28:25.160 and arrested him.
00:28:26.440 They later,
00:28:27.280 in a subsequent tweet,
00:28:29.620 said that the footballer
00:28:31.160 in question
00:28:31.640 never even complained.
00:28:33.660 He didn't know about it.
00:28:34.700 It was just some
00:28:35.540 12-year-old
00:28:37.660 saying some rude words
00:28:39.060 online.
00:28:40.660 You know,
00:28:41.120 maybe he deserves
00:28:41.780 a spanking,
00:28:42.900 but the cops boasted
00:28:44.340 they arrest him.
00:28:45.140 I think that's part
00:28:45.920 of cancel culture.
00:28:47.500 Well, I mean,
00:28:48.120 what I think is
00:28:49.060 it's absurd,
00:28:51.200 and if it weren't
00:28:51.880 so dangerous,
00:28:53.460 I suppose,
00:28:54.040 it would be humorous.
00:28:54.980 I mean,
00:28:55.240 for God's sake,
00:28:56.140 it's clearly ridiculous.
00:28:57.920 But I would,
00:28:59.100 I'm not so much agitated
00:29:00.440 with that kind of
00:29:01.060 bizarre case,
00:29:02.540 which I'm sure
00:29:03.320 will attract a lot
00:29:04.380 of negative attention
00:29:05.480 and probably lead
00:29:06.760 to an apology
00:29:07.420 by the police department
00:29:08.480 or perhaps the sacking
00:29:09.500 of the police officers
00:29:10.320 involved.
00:29:11.260 I'm more concerned
00:29:12.260 with the case
00:29:13.180 I just read about,
00:29:14.200 for example,
00:29:14.700 before I came on your show,
00:29:16.460 about the long-time director
00:29:19.280 of the San Francisco
00:29:21.100 Museum of Fine Art,
00:29:23.020 who's just been forced
00:29:24.100 to resign
00:29:24.680 because he said
00:29:25.820 that despite
00:29:27.000 what was going on
00:29:28.100 in the United States
00:29:28.960 and the world of culture
00:29:29.900 in general,
00:29:30.460 the international world
00:29:31.120 culture,
00:29:31.920 he was still interested
00:29:33.480 in acquiring works
00:29:35.140 of art
00:29:35.620 by white men.
00:29:37.440 You know,
00:29:37.940 he wasn't going
00:29:38.560 to rule that out
00:29:39.380 as a possibility
00:29:40.160 or as a tactic
00:29:40.920 of the future.
00:29:42.000 And this comment
00:29:42.800 was met with outrage
00:29:44.380 and a lot
00:29:46.760 of the staff
00:29:47.420 of the museum
00:29:48.080 said his departure
00:29:49.240 was non-negotiable.
00:29:51.460 This gentleman
00:29:52.100 may have used
00:29:52.960 language
00:29:54.960 that wasn't
00:29:55.500 too clever,
00:29:56.440 perhaps,
00:29:57.220 or he may have
00:29:58.500 not thought
00:29:59.660 all that carefully
00:30:00.380 about how
00:30:01.120 he positioned himself.
00:30:02.220 But what he said
00:30:03.020 was,
00:30:03.980 to me at least,
00:30:05.100 entirely reasonable
00:30:06.100 and now he's gone.
00:30:08.320 A major cultural figure
00:30:09.820 who apparently
00:30:11.120 did a splendid job
00:30:11.940 is gone
00:30:12.500 because of that.
00:30:13.780 But we've seen
00:30:14.220 other examples
00:30:14.860 of this around the world
00:30:15.860 and indeed
00:30:16.260 in our own country.
00:30:17.560 And when that happens,
00:30:18.660 I think this thing
00:30:19.620 is out of control.
00:30:21.100 But the question,
00:30:21.860 Ezra,
00:30:22.040 is how do you
00:30:23.360 rein it in?
00:30:24.000 I mean,
00:30:24.180 how do you stop
00:30:25.640 this sort of nonsense
00:30:26.400 happening?
00:30:26.900 And I think,
00:30:27.540 as I suggested to you
00:30:28.380 earlier,
00:30:29.160 a part of it
00:30:29.980 is the responsibility
00:30:32.260 of institutions,
00:30:33.580 of universities,
00:30:34.580 for example,
00:30:35.460 or the CBC,
00:30:36.580 for example,
00:30:37.620 to stand up to this
00:30:38.860 to be able
00:30:39.580 to make a judgment
00:30:40.680 as to when
00:30:41.320 the criticism
00:30:42.180 is leveled,
00:30:43.280 the attempt to cancel
00:30:44.280 someone's career
00:30:45.100 and identity
00:30:45.700 is perhaps legitimate,
00:30:47.880 which it may be
00:30:48.580 sometimes,
00:30:49.160 not often,
00:30:49.760 I think,
00:30:50.060 but sometimes,
00:30:50.940 when it clearly isn't.
00:30:52.520 When it isn't legitimate
00:30:53.920 to reject the attack
00:30:56.180 and stand behind
00:30:57.260 the person being attacked.
00:30:59.880 You know,
00:31:00.260 there's a moment
00:31:00.700 a week or two ago
00:31:01.820 when a group
00:31:02.440 of intellectuals,
00:31:03.180 including from Canada,
00:31:04.960 Margaret Atwood,
00:31:06.060 who has impeccable
00:31:07.040 liberal credentials,
00:31:08.740 I mean,
00:31:09.460 and she's had a bit
00:31:10.840 of a revival
00:31:11.460 with, you know,
00:31:13.060 her TV show
00:31:14.220 about The Handmaid's Tale,
00:31:15.600 so she's exquisitely
00:31:17.600 politically correct,
00:31:18.960 but she signed a letter
00:31:20.080 along with Salman Rushdie
00:31:21.200 and J.K. Rowling
00:31:22.400 and others
00:31:22.820 saying that
00:31:24.740 these protests
00:31:26.380 have gone too far,
00:31:27.540 the cancel culture
00:31:28.160 has gone too far.
00:31:29.100 I was momentarily
00:31:30.660 cheered by that
00:31:31.600 because no one
00:31:32.300 is more
00:31:32.840 official Canada
00:31:35.220 establishment
00:31:36.300 than Margaret Atwood.
00:31:38.500 That lasted
00:31:39.400 for about five minutes
00:31:40.360 and then it went
00:31:40.900 right back
00:31:41.360 to what you're talking
00:31:42.140 about,
00:31:42.440 the kind of cancel culture
00:31:43.340 driving people out.
00:31:46.160 How,
00:31:46.700 like,
00:31:47.200 what does it take?
00:31:48.080 I mean,
00:31:48.280 that was,
00:31:48.720 it wasn't a great letter,
00:31:49.800 but it was signed,
00:31:50.480 but I don't think
00:31:51.100 anything happened.
00:31:53.480 Well,
00:31:54.060 you're right.
00:31:54.900 I mean,
00:31:55.220 it was good
00:31:56.380 to see that letter,
00:31:57.280 but as I'm sure
00:31:58.740 you know,
00:31:59.500 the people
00:32:00.100 who signed
00:32:00.760 that letter
00:32:01.340 were immediately
00:32:02.600 themselves attacked
00:32:03.780 for doing it.
00:32:04.600 And one of them
00:32:05.260 recanted.
00:32:06.180 One of them said,
00:32:06.940 oh,
00:32:07.100 I didn't know
00:32:07.600 that guy
00:32:08.280 was signing it.
00:32:09.520 I forgot her name.
00:32:10.720 So,
00:32:11.080 I mean,
00:32:11.760 imagine that
00:32:12.300 you sign a letter
00:32:13.020 saying let's stop
00:32:13.740 cancel culture
00:32:14.500 and then you're,
00:32:16.200 you engage,
00:32:17.620 and then you make
00:32:18.460 a self-renunciation
00:32:19.380 like the Red Guards
00:32:20.460 we had a show
00:32:21.000 the other day,
00:32:21.540 Professor,
00:32:22.180 where we went
00:32:22.800 through photographs
00:32:24.100 of the Cultural Revolution,
00:32:25.420 the self-denunciations,
00:32:26.560 the mass denunciations,
00:32:28.000 and I tell you,
00:32:28.900 other than the fact
00:32:30.000 that it was black
00:32:30.620 and white photos
00:32:31.200 in China,
00:32:31.980 I felt like we were
00:32:33.240 five minutes from that
00:32:34.480 in North America.
00:32:35.840 Yeah,
00:32:36.300 I understand that,
00:32:37.180 but let's just talk
00:32:38.080 about that letter
00:32:38.680 for a minute.
00:32:39.200 There's about 150 people,
00:32:40.580 I think,
00:32:40.820 signed it.
00:32:41.260 You're right,
00:32:41.680 Margaret Atwood signed it,
00:32:42.800 J.Q. Rowling signed it,
00:32:44.800 Salman Rushdie signed it.
00:32:45.840 I mean,
00:32:45.940 these people
00:32:46.520 are titans
00:32:47.840 in their field.
00:32:49.120 They're extremely
00:32:49.780 well-known,
00:32:50.400 famous,
00:32:51.460 and they have a lot
00:32:52.100 of authority
00:32:53.180 and clout.
00:32:54.540 And then,
00:32:55.000 of course,
00:32:55.320 they were attacked.
00:32:56.080 Of course,
00:32:56.380 J.K. Rowling
00:32:57.080 is an interesting
00:32:57.680 and separate case
00:32:58.460 all by itself.
00:33:00.460 And you have
00:33:01.100 to ask yourself,
00:33:02.400 who's doing the attacking
00:33:03.700 and why are they doing it?
00:33:05.500 The views expressed
00:33:06.420 were very hard to attack.
00:33:08.000 It was more ad hominem
00:33:09.280 than anything else,
00:33:10.340 attacking the people.
00:33:11.640 And I think it's perhaps
00:33:12.600 because it's a way
00:33:13.520 of people
00:33:14.280 who are not fake
00:33:16.600 and who are not rich,
00:33:20.200 but who want their voices heard
00:33:22.180 or getting their voices heard.
00:33:23.700 I mean,
00:33:23.860 that's one of the things
00:33:24.380 that's happened now.
00:33:25.660 People who can tussle with,
00:33:28.340 can take on,
00:33:29.640 can confront,
00:33:30.760 and maybe even harm
00:33:31.700 and damage these famous people
00:33:34.020 who before were virtually immune
00:33:35.780 from this kind of thing.
00:33:36.920 Another recent example
00:33:38.140 is Steven Pinker,
00:33:40.880 the Harvard professor,
00:33:43.020 linguist,
00:33:44.560 very well-known,
00:33:45.420 famous indeed,
00:33:46.760 who has just come under attack
00:33:48.460 because people have been
00:33:49.960 sifting through his tweet
00:33:51.840 from years ago
00:33:53.120 and finding things
00:33:54.540 that he said
00:33:55.020 that might be subject
00:33:56.420 to misinterpretation.
00:33:57.520 For example,
00:33:58.540 he used the word
00:33:59.460 urban crime,
00:34:00.700 the phrase
00:34:01.140 urban crime.
00:34:02.620 And apparently,
00:34:03.200 and I didn't know this
00:34:03.880 until I read the article
00:34:04.560 in the New York Times,
00:34:05.900 urban is kind of a code word
00:34:07.620 for black crime.
00:34:09.040 Who knew, right?
00:34:10.520 Now,
00:34:11.000 he has been tarred
00:34:12.120 with the racist brush
00:34:13.460 that so many other people
00:34:14.940 have been tarred with.
00:34:16.160 He's famous enough
00:34:17.400 and strong enough
00:34:18.700 perhaps to resist
00:34:19.880 this kind of attack.
00:34:20.940 But the people
00:34:21.540 who are doing it,
00:34:22.220 and Steven Pinker himself
00:34:23.040 pointed this out,
00:34:24.060 are people that he'd
00:34:24.860 never heard of.
00:34:25.880 He said,
00:34:26.460 I've never heard of these people
00:34:27.820 who are signing this letter
00:34:29.200 and attacked me.
00:34:30.260 And that in itself
00:34:31.180 was taken to be
00:34:32.260 kind of a derogatory comment.
00:34:34.500 So you get into
00:34:35.380 this incredible miasma
00:34:36.820 of insult
00:34:38.420 and ridiculous behavior
00:34:41.040 and ridiculous expression
00:34:42.160 of opinion.
00:34:43.480 You know,
00:34:44.040 it's funny you say that.
00:34:45.000 I mean,
00:34:45.280 you've listed a few
00:34:46.240 really big,
00:34:46.960 big shots.
00:34:48.280 You know,
00:34:48.800 bosses of museums.
00:34:50.240 Pinker is very
00:34:51.340 prominent in his field.
00:34:53.020 At the University
00:34:54.960 of British Columbia,
00:34:55.700 we did a show on this
00:34:56.680 about a month ago.
00:34:58.600 The chair of their
00:34:59.700 board of governors
00:35:00.500 was fired for the crime
00:35:03.600 of liking a few tweets
00:35:07.200 by Donald Trump.
00:35:08.500 I swear that's all he did.
00:35:10.320 And I went through
00:35:11.140 and I looked at the tweets
00:35:12.000 and they were
00:35:12.500 completely boring.
00:35:14.460 Typical Trump braggadocio,
00:35:16.100 but they weren't even
00:35:17.020 racial in any way.
00:35:18.160 The word black
00:35:18.880 did not appear in them.
00:35:20.060 One of them was about
00:35:22.160 coronavirus
00:35:23.080 and protecting seniors,
00:35:24.760 but simply liking
00:35:26.020 a tweet from Trump.
00:35:29.720 And here's what's so insane.
00:35:31.020 There was an emergency
00:35:31.920 weekend meeting
00:35:33.400 of the board
00:35:35.140 to sack him.
00:35:36.860 But what gets me,
00:35:39.420 professor,
00:35:40.420 is that this
00:35:41.380 hero of the community,
00:35:43.860 this super volunteer,
00:35:45.140 this fundraiser for UBC,
00:35:46.860 who's not doing it
00:35:48.040 for his self-enrichment,
00:35:48.960 he's giving.
00:35:50.060 And because he liked
00:35:51.140 a tweet of the U.S. president,
00:35:53.420 he was being fired.
00:35:54.800 But instead of standing up
00:35:55.940 and saying this is wrong,
00:35:57.880 he joined in
00:35:58.720 the denunciation of himself,
00:36:00.100 just like something
00:36:00.700 out of the Red Guard.
00:36:02.000 And my question for you,
00:36:03.360 whether it's that
00:36:03.920 UBC board chairman
00:36:05.140 or the museum boss
00:36:07.020 you talked about
00:36:07.620 who said,
00:36:08.040 well, I would still look
00:36:08.740 at art from white men,
00:36:10.240 or the professor at Harvard,
00:36:13.900 if any one of them said,
00:36:15.660 you know what, guys?
00:36:16.600 I'm not going to join
00:36:17.600 in the self-denunciation
00:36:18.680 struggle session.
00:36:20.040 I'm going to fight back
00:36:22.380 and I'm going to sue
00:36:24.120 the university
00:36:24.820 and I'm going to make a fuss
00:36:26.600 and I'm going to try
00:36:28.060 and rally donors
00:36:29.520 to the university
00:36:30.440 and I'm going to try
00:36:31.460 and become a seed crystal
00:36:33.720 around which others
00:36:34.520 will fight.
00:36:34.960 So not just signing a letter.
00:36:36.920 You know,
00:36:37.120 signing a letter
00:36:37.760 is nothing.
00:36:38.240 It's like checking
00:36:39.160 a like on Facebook.
00:36:40.920 But if one of these people
00:36:42.040 actually said,
00:36:42.560 you know what,
00:36:43.740 I'm not quitting
00:36:44.560 because I like to tweet
00:36:45.360 from Donald Trump.
00:36:46.140 I'm not.
00:36:47.040 And I will fight you
00:36:48.540 and burn you to the ground
00:36:50.100 instead of,
00:36:51.880 if that's what you are now.
00:36:53.660 Maybe that's not
00:36:54.420 normal people think.
00:36:56.380 Maybe normal people
00:36:57.200 don't do that.
00:36:58.240 Maybe they love
00:36:58.740 the institution so much
00:36:59.980 they would rather
00:37:00.860 let it be taken over
00:37:01.920 than burnt to the ground.
00:37:03.100 But if I was being fired,
00:37:04.520 I would sue.
00:37:06.280 I'm sure you would, Ezra.
00:37:08.180 I think you're right
00:37:09.180 about this.
00:37:09.840 I think it's time
00:37:11.740 for people
00:37:12.480 who are
00:37:13.720 on the receiving end
00:37:15.260 of this kind of nonsense.
00:37:16.480 It's not always nonsense.
00:37:17.480 Sometimes it's justified,
00:37:18.380 but often it's nonsense
00:37:19.460 for them to fight back.
00:37:21.180 It takes a lot of guts.
00:37:22.540 It takes courage.
00:37:23.440 It takes fortitude.
00:37:25.620 Those are the qualities
00:37:26.440 perhaps that are required.
00:37:27.880 And I also think
00:37:28.540 it's time
00:37:29.060 for our institution,
00:37:31.000 for government,
00:37:32.420 for universities,
00:37:33.800 for businesses,
00:37:35.160 for the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation
00:37:36.780 also to stand up
00:37:38.240 and to say,
00:37:38.700 well,
00:37:39.020 let's take CBC,
00:37:41.080 for example.
00:37:41.780 These charges have been made.
00:37:43.320 These allegations
00:37:43.960 have been made.
00:37:45.260 People are demanding
00:37:46.260 somebody's head
00:37:47.300 as a result of something
00:37:48.680 they said
00:37:49.160 last week
00:37:50.800 or last month
00:37:51.500 or 10 years ago.
00:37:53.160 We are not going
00:37:54.000 to respond to this.
00:37:55.080 We are not doing it.
00:37:55.940 We are standing behind
00:37:57.120 our employee.
00:37:58.360 We do not think
00:37:59.060 the behavior
00:37:59.640 or the comment
00:38:00.480 is sufficiently egregious
00:38:01.840 or damaging
00:38:02.980 or racist
00:38:03.740 or whatever
00:38:04.420 to warrant any kind of action.
00:38:06.140 But there seems to be
00:38:07.840 a failure to do that.
00:38:10.080 I don't know whether
00:38:10.500 it's because people
00:38:11.880 are scared.
00:38:12.600 I don't know whether
00:38:13.100 because they're scared
00:38:13.920 of the mob
00:38:14.760 or what.
00:38:15.960 But it's time
00:38:16.580 for people
00:38:16.960 to stand up
00:38:17.560 and fight.
00:38:18.640 I mean,
00:38:18.840 there have been
00:38:19.440 a handful of examples
00:38:20.600 of this recently
00:38:21.740 but not nearly enough.
00:38:23.040 So I agree with you.
00:38:24.100 I'm not sure
00:38:24.380 about burning down
00:38:25.520 the house
00:38:25.980 but I agree with you.
00:38:27.640 No, I'm just saying
00:38:29.380 I can understand someone
00:38:32.180 but if someone
00:38:33.080 was so falsely accused
00:38:35.180 the idea of
00:38:36.800 accusing yourself
00:38:37.920 is just so...
00:38:39.700 Well, that's the red guard
00:38:40.860 thing, of course.
00:38:42.060 Yeah.
00:38:42.080 Well, I am.
00:38:45.020 Yeah, that's the red guard.
00:38:46.800 Drag them in front
00:38:47.460 of a tribunal
00:38:48.100 and get them to confess
00:38:49.220 to whatever it is.
00:38:50.980 I have a theory.
00:38:52.280 It's a political theory
00:38:53.160 that there are certain
00:38:54.320 subjects out there
00:38:55.200 that are so universally
00:38:56.300 believed by people
00:38:57.480 quietly
00:38:58.300 yet so rarely
00:38:59.640 expressed by those
00:39:00.580 in power
00:39:01.060 that if any politician
00:39:02.980 actually says the words
00:39:04.100 they're immediately
00:39:05.140 embraced by
00:39:05.940 by the people
00:39:07.520 in a populist way.
00:39:09.100 I point to
00:39:10.160 the premier of Quebec
00:39:12.100 who in my view
00:39:13.840 became premier in part
00:39:15.480 because he said
00:39:16.160 I want to roll back
00:39:16.860 immigration by 20%
00:39:18.020 and I want to bring in
00:39:19.400 a law to ensure
00:39:20.420 the secular nature
00:39:21.660 of symbols
00:39:22.560 in government
00:39:23.660 so no burqas
00:39:24.540 no religious symbols
00:39:26.280 those two things
00:39:27.500 and he said them
00:39:28.080 both rather meekly
00:39:29.120 at least he said them
00:39:30.680 and I believe
00:39:31.760 as an outsider
00:39:32.760 that's one of the reasons
00:39:33.980 he's premier of Quebec.
00:39:35.360 I also think
00:39:36.440 cancel culture
00:39:37.240 is that sort of thing
00:39:38.900 and I have this
00:39:40.360 hope
00:39:41.380 more than a suspicion
00:39:43.200 that if some politician
00:39:45.620 somewhere just said
00:39:46.520 enough
00:39:47.180 I'm going to speak out
00:39:49.040 against this cancel culture
00:39:50.160 I'm going to hold
00:39:50.920 universities to account
00:39:51.940 I'm going to hold
00:39:52.780 museums to account
00:39:53.720 I'm going to summon
00:39:55.720 the board of governors
00:39:56.900 I'm going to summon
00:39:58.080 the board of the museum
00:39:59.480 to answer
00:40:00.620 and I'm going to cut off
00:40:01.700 their funding
00:40:02.240 like I just think
00:40:03.660 such a politician
00:40:04.620 would immediately be
00:40:06.700 met by
00:40:08.000 the silent majority
00:40:09.320 with such a thunderous applause
00:40:11.020 and that's what gets me
00:40:13.260 is how few
00:40:14.020 even conservatives
00:40:15.220 how few opposition MPs
00:40:17.320 who have nothing to lose
00:40:18.340 are they're so afraid
00:40:20.220 of taking this on
00:40:20.920 the only
00:40:21.260 I mean Rex Murphy
00:40:22.960 held his ground
00:40:23.740 at the National Post
00:40:24.620 but most people cower
00:40:27.380 and I don't see
00:40:28.240 I don't see
00:40:28.820 an opposition politician
00:40:29.800 who's an entrepreneur
00:40:30.940 and who would say
00:40:31.620 hey I can make a name
00:40:32.940 for myself
00:40:33.400 as a freedom fighter
00:40:34.300 I just don't see it
00:40:35.340 is there anyone in Canada
00:40:36.500 who fits that role
00:40:37.840 professor?
00:40:38.880 Well let me just say
00:40:39.920 that again
00:40:40.420 I agree with you
00:40:42.020 in fact
00:40:42.500 in my book
00:40:43.260 as you know
00:40:43.700 there's a chapter
00:40:44.520 on political leadership
00:40:45.560 which I think
00:40:46.040 is sorely lacking
00:40:47.000 around the world
00:40:47.720 in another country
00:40:48.580 that you do not have
00:40:50.540 you know the famous story
00:40:52.540 about the French revolutionary
00:40:53.800 who looked out of his window
00:40:55.140 and saw the mob
00:40:56.800 surging down the street
00:40:58.180 and he said
00:40:59.100 I must follow them
00:41:00.220 for I am their leader
00:41:01.240 that's the sort of thing
00:41:02.740 we have
00:41:03.140 we don't want
00:41:03.760 we don't need
00:41:04.680 political leaders
00:41:05.380 who are running after the mob
00:41:06.740 thinking they're the leader
00:41:07.660 we need political leaders
00:41:09.180 who are out in front
00:41:10.080 and are articulating
00:41:11.360 what should happen
00:41:12.400 in their view
00:41:13.040 and trying to convince people
00:41:14.440 that's the right thing to do
00:41:15.420 I'm fond of telling the story
00:41:17.440 of FDR
00:41:18.700 Franklin Delano Roosevelt
00:41:20.900 who just before
00:41:21.820 the 1936 election
00:41:23.100 gave a big speech
00:41:24.720 talking about
00:41:25.600 his initial attempts
00:41:26.600 to implement the New Deal
00:41:27.900 and he said
00:41:28.580 there are people
00:41:29.800 in this country
00:41:30.700 who hate me
00:41:32.100 for what I am trying to do
00:41:33.920 and then he said
00:41:34.840 I welcome their hatred
00:41:36.480 to me that's leadership
00:41:38.120 that's willing to fight back
00:41:39.980 whatever you think
00:41:41.120 of the New Deal
00:41:41.800 whatever you think
00:41:42.360 of FDR
00:41:42.820 he showed
00:41:43.580 leadership
00:41:44.900 strength
00:41:45.600 the willingness
00:41:46.060 to fight back
00:41:46.840 the willingness
00:41:47.500 to try and guide
00:41:48.460 the nation
00:41:49.340 and I think that's what we need
00:41:50.420 not just at the highest
00:41:51.620 political level
00:41:52.420 but in the universities
00:41:54.060 presidents of universities
00:41:55.240 chairmen of the board of governors
00:41:56.560 boards of governors
00:41:57.580 of museums
00:41:58.260 the people who run the CBC
00:41:59.900 we need people with courage
00:42:01.620 who have a vision
00:42:02.640 of what they should be doing
00:42:03.620 and do not bend
00:42:05.040 every passing breeze
00:42:07.080 we need people
00:42:09.440 of oak
00:42:10.220 not of willow
00:42:11.120 you know
00:42:13.440 I just thought
00:42:14.060 of someone
00:42:14.540 who meets
00:42:15.060 that definition
00:42:16.040 the head of the
00:42:17.160 Toronto Public Library
00:42:18.460 when asked
00:42:20.240 to cancel
00:42:20.900 a room rental
00:42:21.980 to Megan Murphy
00:42:22.840 a feminist
00:42:23.480 who wanted to talk
00:42:25.040 about
00:42:25.480 how in her view
00:42:26.820 transgenderism
00:42:28.340 is threatening
00:42:29.280 women's spaces
00:42:30.380 there was a
00:42:31.900 transgender move
00:42:32.800 to blacklist
00:42:33.800 and cancel that
00:42:35.140 and the head
00:42:35.660 of the library
00:42:36.200 said
00:42:36.580 we really care
00:42:37.860 about trans people
00:42:38.740 very very much
00:42:39.520 in these five ways
00:42:40.400 but we are not
00:42:41.480 going to cancel
00:42:42.640 this feminist
00:42:43.980 and you know what
00:42:44.760 I remember that
00:42:45.420 heroic moment
00:42:46.060 we did a show
00:42:46.600 on that too
00:42:47.100 that's a local hero
00:42:48.720 and you know what
00:42:49.340 she survived
00:42:50.020 I might also add
00:42:52.620 that all of a sudden
00:42:53.920 every institution
00:42:55.120 like the library system
00:42:56.480 for example
00:42:57.060 is supposed to have
00:42:58.380 kind of political
00:42:59.500 sociological theories
00:43:01.280 about everything
00:43:02.220 why don't they just
00:43:03.480 run the library
00:43:04.440 or run their institution
00:43:06.020 without feeling
00:43:06.840 that they have to be involved
00:43:07.900 in basic
00:43:09.020 kind of down
00:43:09.700 and dirty politics
00:43:10.600 all the time
00:43:11.160 that's not really
00:43:12.040 their role
00:43:12.580 that's not what
00:43:13.340 they're there to do
00:43:14.180 they're there
00:43:14.600 in the case
00:43:15.180 let's say
00:43:15.520 of the library system
00:43:16.300 to provide a library system
00:43:18.000 everybody seems
00:43:19.080 to get dragged in
00:43:20.380 this horrible
00:43:21.560 bitter
00:43:22.280 often senseless
00:43:23.940 political fight
00:43:24.920 well listen
00:43:27.280 it's great to catch up
00:43:28.240 with you
00:43:28.520 and there's so much
00:43:29.100 cancelling going on
00:43:29.960 I wanted to reach out
00:43:30.700 to you again
00:43:31.040 I enjoyed our conversation
00:43:32.540 last time
00:43:33.020 folks
00:43:33.320 if you haven't got it yet
00:43:34.600 we have the Amazon link
00:43:36.520 under this video
00:43:37.600 we're talking
00:43:39.380 to Philip Slayton
00:43:40.880 former dean of law
00:43:42.020 his book is called
00:43:43.600 Nothing Left to Lose
00:43:45.580 an impolite report
00:43:47.780 on the state of freedom
00:43:49.000 in Canada
00:43:49.480 and I have to disclose
00:43:50.500 that there's a very
00:43:51.300 friendly chapter
00:43:52.040 on one of my
00:43:52.880 free speech battles
00:43:53.680 so I appreciate that
00:43:54.920 and there's a lot
00:43:56.760 of important news there
00:43:57.800 that I think
00:43:58.300 you know
00:43:59.060 and I say to our viewers
00:44:00.040 there's a lot of
00:44:01.660 leftist books
00:44:02.260 there's a lot of
00:44:02.800 censorious books
00:44:03.760 when there's a book
00:44:05.100 that comes along
00:44:05.700 in defense of freedom
00:44:06.600 not only should we
00:44:07.820 read it
00:44:08.180 because it's interesting
00:44:09.280 and we can learn something
00:44:10.200 but I think
00:44:11.540 we have a bit of a
00:44:12.920 public obligation
00:44:14.420 to support
00:44:15.360 conservative books
00:44:17.000 if we want more
00:44:18.100 of them made
00:44:18.740 so what I would
00:44:19.940 I would encourage folks
00:44:21.100 I mean if you're on the
00:44:21.780 I think you should buy
00:44:22.740 this book because
00:44:23.300 it's interesting
00:44:23.900 and it makes the case
00:44:24.860 for free speech
00:44:25.460 but we also have to
00:44:26.800 support the few
00:44:27.440 freedom oriented books
00:44:28.380 published in Canada
00:44:29.160 at all
00:44:29.760 so please do that
00:44:30.660 at the Amazon link below
00:44:32.100 last word to you
00:44:32.760 Professor
00:44:33.100 well thank you
00:44:34.940 it's always a pleasure
00:44:36.080 to be on your show
00:44:36.800 you and I don't agree
00:44:37.920 on everything
00:44:38.600 that's for certain
00:44:39.480 but we do agree
00:44:40.780 on a lot of things
00:44:41.520 well it's nice to see you
00:44:43.140 keep fighting for freedom
00:44:44.220 it's what we do here
00:44:45.140 and your book
00:44:45.740 is an important
00:44:46.340 part of that
00:44:47.420 and I'll encourage
00:44:48.020 all our rebels
00:44:48.640 to do their part
00:44:49.420 take care professor
00:44:50.220 I appreciate it
00:44:51.160 thank you
00:44:51.420 bye bye
00:44:51.940 there you have it
00:44:52.580 Philip Slayton
00:44:53.200 is the author
00:44:54.200 of Nothing Left to Move
00:44:55.860 stay with us
00:44:56.480 more ahead
00:44:56.940 on my monologue
00:45:09.200 last night
00:45:09.700 Matt writes
00:45:10.420 Canada should ban
00:45:11.920 all Chinese companies
00:45:12.740 like Huawei
00:45:13.220 from doing business here
00:45:14.180 well I mean
00:45:16.720 I don't know
00:45:17.520 if I have an objection
00:45:18.280 to Huawei
00:45:18.960 selling actual
00:45:20.040 hand phones here
00:45:20.880 like a phone itself
00:45:21.860 I wouldn't use one
00:45:23.020 for sure
00:45:23.360 I'm sure it's
00:45:23.940 spying on you
00:45:24.540 but at least
00:45:25.580 you can choose
00:45:26.220 not to do that
00:45:27.060 if Huawei technology
00:45:28.620 is built into
00:45:29.560 Telus and Shaw
00:45:31.020 and Bell
00:45:32.360 and whatever
00:45:33.100 other companies
00:45:34.180 there are
00:45:34.580 you can't avoid it
00:45:35.800 that's the problem
00:45:36.560 and even our military
00:45:37.900 and police
00:45:38.580 and other
00:45:39.300 confidential people
00:45:41.100 can't avoid it
00:45:42.420 that's the reason
00:45:43.180 you have to ban
00:45:43.880 them from the 5G network
00:45:45.440 Christine writes
00:45:47.440 Canada is the only
00:45:48.680 five eyes country
00:45:49.380 that has not banned
00:45:50.300 Huawei
00:45:50.720 what's Trudeau waiting for
00:45:51.960 well that's the question
00:45:53.560 is it ideological
00:45:54.380 or is it
00:45:55.960 compromat
00:45:56.960 as the Soviets
00:45:57.640 would say
00:45:57.960 compromising
00:45:58.720 materials
00:45:59.600 do they have him
00:46:00.520 in a blackmail
00:46:01.720 or extortion position
00:46:02.620 that's a real question
00:46:03.560 we know
00:46:04.860 about some
00:46:06.440 of his bad behavior
00:46:07.580 groping people
00:46:08.980 blackface
00:46:09.940 his financial
00:46:11.120 skullduggery
00:46:11.760 with we
00:46:12.260 if that's what
00:46:13.500 ordinary journalists
00:46:14.720 can dig up
00:46:15.320 imagine what
00:46:15.980 the Chinese government
00:46:17.320 spies can dig up
00:46:18.620 on Trudeau
00:46:19.100 I bet they have
00:46:20.220 some pretty nasty
00:46:21.040 stuff on him
00:46:21.760 on my interview
00:46:23.620 with Joel Pollack
00:46:24.200 on Barry Weiss
00:46:24.800 Peter writes
00:46:25.380 putting any opinions
00:46:26.840 of Barry Weiss
00:46:27.400 to one side
00:46:28.040 this bowing down
00:46:28.860 to the Twitter mob
00:46:29.480 is a major concern
00:46:30.560 yeah I thought it was
00:46:32.460 interesting to hear
00:46:33.080 from Joel Pollack
00:46:33.680 that Barry Weiss
00:46:34.380 herself was a
00:46:35.340 practitioner of
00:46:35.980 cancel culture
00:46:36.600 that makes it all
00:46:37.740 the more interesting
00:46:38.540 don't you think
00:46:39.200 that even if you
00:46:40.340 try and go along
00:46:41.060 with a mob
00:46:41.520 one day they will
00:46:42.240 devour you
00:46:42.960 as we've just
00:46:43.640 discovered
00:46:44.100 I mean
00:46:45.060 well that's the show
00:46:46.380 for today
00:46:46.680 what do you think
00:46:47.140 of freethetomichaels.com
00:46:48.620 do you think
00:46:49.260 it has any chance
00:46:50.140 Professor Matus
00:46:51.640 knows how to
00:46:52.260 tell a story
00:46:52.980 and fight
00:46:54.040 with the law
00:46:54.920 I don't put a lot
00:46:56.320 of stock
00:46:56.800 in international law
00:46:58.120 you know
00:46:58.860 you and what army
00:47:00.140 is the first thing
00:47:00.940 that comes to mind
00:47:01.720 but if it names
00:47:02.700 and shames
00:47:03.260 the Chinese communists
00:47:04.220 who want a safe face
00:47:05.180 I think it's worth
00:47:06.160 a few bucks
00:47:06.740 that's the show
00:47:08.200 for today
00:47:08.580 until tomorrow
00:47:09.260 on behalf of all
00:47:10.400 us here at
00:47:10.860 Rebel World Headquarters
00:47:11.720 to you at home
00:47:12.380 good night
00:47:12.940 and keep fighting
00:47:13.920 for freedom
00:47:14.420 you
00:47:19.320 you
00:47:20.320 you
00:47:21.320 you
00:47:23.480 you
00:47:26.360 you