SHEILA GUNN REID ｜ Viral 'get off my lawn' mom hit with $30K ATIP bill
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Summary
Lise Murrell is a mom of six, a writer, and a fierce advocate for transparency and parents' rights. She started an investigation into what teachers and education bureaucrats were saying about her and her family, and that required filing for access to information. And she got a big fat bill.
Transcript
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Imagine being slapped with a $30,000 bill to find out what government bureaucrats were saying about
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you and your family behind your backs. That's what happened to my guests today. I'm Sheila
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Gunn-Reed, and you're watching The Gunn Show. Some of you may already know my guest today,
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particularly if you're from the beautiful province of Saskatchewan. She's a former
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conservative broadcaster there. So if you already know her, let me reintroduce you to her. Now,
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some of you may have recently learned of my friend Lise Murrell from the viral video wherein
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she kicked the local NDP candidate off her lawn when they refused to denounce secrecy between
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teachers and parents. Take a look at this. Do you believe the teacher should keep secrets from parents?
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I may not agree with you. Do you believe the teacher should keep secrets from parents?
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You do believe that they should keep secrets from parents? Get off my lawn.
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That's Lise Murrell, Regina mom of six, and my dear friend. She joins me today because she started
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an investigation into what teachers and education bureaucrats were saying about her,
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and that required filing for access to information. And she didn't get information. She got a big fat
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So joining me now is my good friend, dear friend, beloved friend, Lise Murrell, mom to many and parents
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rights activist. Lise, thanks for coming on the show. If people follow me on the internet,
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they know that we are friends in real life. And besides all the other things that we have in common,
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we're staunch advocates for government transparency and parents' rights. And you've got a wild story
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of your attempts to hold the government to account and to find out what they were doing
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with regard to their attacks on parents' rights behind closed doors. And the story just spirals out
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of control from there. But instead of me telling you how, or telling the world how great you are,
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why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself? Because you're a former broadcaster and a full-time
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mom. Yes. Well, hello, my beloved friend, Sheila Gunn-Reed. Hello, Rebel Sam. It is so good to be
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here today. My name is Lise Murrell. I'm a mom of six and a writer and a little bit of a media personality
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from Saskatchewan. And as we all know, parental rights have become quite a big topic du jour.
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In Canada, these last couple of years, especially in the wake of what happened in COVID. And being a
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big fan of Sheila Gunn-Reed on Rebel News, and hearing her talk about filing Freedom of Information
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Act requests on government institutions, I submitted a Freedom of Information Act request
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on the Regina Public School Division. This was back in June. And basically, I asked for four things.
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I asked for information about myself. I asked for information about my children. I asked for
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information about sexual orientation and gender ideology in schools, because as you know, the
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government of Saskatchewan basically said that we're not going to have the SOGI curriculum in our
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schools. And I also asked about Pride events and the Rainbow Week of Equality, which is a brand new
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rainbow week that was introduced and foisted upon the Canadian public via taxpayer funds this last
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June. And what I got back was a fee estimate. Are you sitting down, Sheila? Are you sitting down?
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They sent me back a fee estimate that said in order to get the records that I requested, it would cost me
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$29,247. So nearly the Regina Public School Division. Yes, this is the school division that my kids
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attend, that my kids attend. Because as a parent, as the holder of the charter right to education,
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this is a little known fact in Canada, but parents are the explicit holders of the right to education
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in Canada and have the ability and have the right to direct all education-related initiatives. The
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parents hold the right. The children do not have the right. The teachers do not hold the right.
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Parents hold the right to education in Canada. And I wanted to know what my school division was up to
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when all of the parents were struggling to survive. So what they did was they sent me back an invoice
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that said, give us $30,000 and we'll let you know what we've been up to. But it goes further than that,
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Sheila, what they said was that if they had followed the methodology of the Office of the Information and
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Privacy Commissioner of Saskatchewan, that my fee estimate would have come back at $197,000. This is for
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one school division in Canada. Can you imagine the resources and the waste that they've put on this
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particular focus of their attention? Can you imagine? $200,000 to figure out what your own school
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school division has been doing? It's outrageous. It's absolutely outrageous.
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Well, and you know, as someone who files for access to information all the time,
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this is a load of malarkey. These are digital documents. This is, you go into somebody's email,
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you search by keyword. They're not, you know, going down to the old printing press, turning a crank,
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cranking out a stack of paper, then getting in the file, big file folders. This is no, it's a,
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this would be a keyword search. Yeah. They're not paying someone to scroll through a microfiche for
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hours on end and then jumping in the jalopy, going down to the post office three hours away,
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sticking a ream of paper in the mail and then shipping it off to you. These are digital documents
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that will be sent to you by email. If indeed they ever send them to you. Yes. Yeah. And, and not
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only, well, not only is it just an egregious cost, an egregious cost. And it tells, it tells me really
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everything I need to know about their focus and what their focus has been on this last couple of years.
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But, but it's also, it also contra, it may contravene the Saskatchewan Parents Bill of Rights. As you
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know, the government of Saskatchewan has been probably the most proactive government in the
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country as it pertains to what parents get to determine and what we get to know. And as part
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of the Parents Bill of Rights, there's a section that says parents have the ability to get their
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kids school files. So how much of this are my kids school files? I would argue all of it. Every part
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of what I'm asking for has to do with my kids experience. And yet Regina Public Schools with
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their tagline, I respect, I'm responsible, I belong, I want to know, uh, say you have to pay
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us $30,000 in order to get this information. It's, it's outrageous. It's an absolute outrage.
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Now, uh, I showed the video in the intro to our interview, but I think the video of, well,
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a couple of videos, the one of you kicking the NDP candidates off your lawn, um, that went
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Do you believe that teachers should keep secrets from parents?
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Do you believe that teachers should keep secrets from parents?
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You do believe that they should keep secrets from parents?
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And then your speech at the, uh, March for Parents.
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I think that puts you on the radar of your own school board.
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And I think that's why there are so many communications regarding you directly.
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In over 1,000 subsidized daycare facilities, including one in Regina and one in Lumsden.
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are conditioning babies, toddlers, preschool children to adopt gender theory and immerse
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I would love to know what these people were saying about you behind your back using the
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resources provided to them by your tax dollars.
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Um, not only, not only is it, is it a breach of the social contract, right?
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Parents must be able to trust the teachers and school divisions and the entire education
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Um, but it's, but it's also, but it's also really telling in what they think they can get
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And to be completely honest, I'm a mom that's done playing nice when it comes to this.
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I hold the rights and I'm going to hold your feet to the fire until you start producing what
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And, and this goes for, this goes for all levels of, of government.
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I'm just, I'm just done being, uh, dumb splained that, that, you know, this really isn't any
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We all know how far the expert, as Scott Mo says, as Premier Scott Mo says, parents are
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We must be given a voice at this, not, not only a seat at the table, we must be sitting
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God, God help any bureaucrat that tries to get in my way on this issue.
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Oh, I, I almost slightly feel bad for them if they weren't doing such a sinister thing.
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And let's just talk about the great irony in all of this is that you want to know what
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they're doing and saying about you and your kids and, uh, the policies around them, the
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Throw up a paywall to enforce that shroud of secrecy.
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You're doing exactly the thing you want to know that they're doing.
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And, and what's really interesting is that in Saskatchewan, our office of information and,
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uh, privacy, the commissioner in charge of information and privacy in Saskatchewan does
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not have order making ability, which means even if, so even if I go to them with this
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invoice thing, this is, this is an egregious, egregious sin, as far as I'm concerned against
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parents, not being able to find the information or be able to access the information on their
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The, the commissioner cannot order the school board to release the documents to me or reduce
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And this is a big, uh, it's a big hole in our ability to be able to collect information
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because how else do we hold these bureaucrats to account if a, we can't afford to get the
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documents and if B, they're not obligated to provide them anyway.
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How do we, how do we, how are we supposed to do that?
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I think if the government knew just how many public servants, uh, they had working against
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them, like actively working against them to get them reelected, they would be singing a
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different tune as it pertains to the privacy commissioner.
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But this is something that we need to, we need to have a hard look at in, especially in
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Saskatchewan and in every jurisdiction where the, uh, where the information and privacy
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commissioner doesn't have order making authority.
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I mean, this is the education deep state in Saskatchewan working against parents and the
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government who are trying to bring in legislation to protect parents.
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And at the end of the day, it rewards the bad behavior of the bureaucrats.
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They can talk crap about you and your family behind your back.
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You know that they're doing it now because of the amount of documents that could potentially
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be returned to you, but because they did it in such an enormous manner, it amounts to
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a paywall preventing you from getting the information.
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When I, when I got the fee estimate that I about fell off my chair, like I called my husband
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I was like, how okay, are we remortgaging the house for me to get information about our school
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Like that's what it would come to their fee estimate.
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That's, I mean, it is completely, it's completely outrageous, right?
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Now you can't buy a, excuse me, you can't buy a, a hovel for $200,000 hardly at Saskatchewan,
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but it's still just an outrageous sum of money for any, for any individual or even organization
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to be able to come up with, to figure out what's, what's gone on.
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And, and they're absolutely using it to their advantage.
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This is an organization that's absolutely stuffed full of crazed NDP activists.
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We, they were, they were extraordinary online through COVID, just especially on Twitter.
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When Twitter, back in the olden days where Twitter was being run by the, by the insane
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left, you know, the lunatics running the asylum, they were extraordinarily active in attacking
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And our family, uh, our family has been harassed for over two years by a Regina public school
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teacher for over two years by a Regina public school teacher.
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My kids have been made targets of a Regina public school teacher and her online activist
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And to find out what they've been doing, well, give us a check for $30,000.
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I mean, what is, this is telling the bad teachers and bad bureaucrats that if we talk poorly about
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these parents, let's just make sure we do a lot of it.
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So that the parents can't, can't climb over this paywall to figure out what they're doing
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It's literally incentivizing, incentivizing awful, abhorrent behavior by the public service.
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I mean, these things have to, these things have to get looked at.
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Saskatchewan, Saskatchewan has done a lot of heavy lifting as it pertains to education.
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Just recently, they announced that they were banning cell phones in school.
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And this was an issue that I was on talking to them about even last year, because as far
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as I'm concerned, sexual orientation and gender ideology caught on like wildfire throughout
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our, throughout our young people's population in, in, in three sort of ways.
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We had the social, the social contagion that's propagated through social media and online usage.
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So this is just self, this is kids using cell phones.
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It was propagated through public schools, through activist teachers that are encouraging
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this insane thing to a mind virus to, to keep, to keep going.
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And it was also, it was also, it also sort of happened because, because our kids were forced
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into such solitude through COVID and they are, they are so starved for peer groups and for
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And what they did was they set up these circumstances where they said, well, here's a whole new,
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here's a whole set of accepting, inclusive, diverse peers that you can have.
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And the government of Saskatchewan said, right, we're doing away with cell phones in Saskatchewan.
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They also brought out the Saskatchewan Parents Bill of Rights, which was an incredible moment
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and one of many, many that are going to be coming to other provinces.
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But we have a lot more, we have a lot more work to do.
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One of the reasons why teachers in Saskatchewan are able to operate the way they are with
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I mean, short of being a sexual predator in Saskatchewan, there is no way, real way to fire
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This is because they're not legislated by the Employment Act in Saskatchewan.
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Teachers have a special act called the Saskatchewan Teachers Federation Act and the Education Act
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And so long as teachers have special protections under these acts, they can act with immunity.
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They can act, they can do whatever the hell they want.
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Teachers need to be, need to be governed by the Employment Act, just like everybody else.
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And when they step out of line, when they violate the social contract, they must not be teachers
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So, and you know, this is, this is frightening for, I think, people who live in less conservative
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For example, if you live in BC, if you live in Manitoba, you live in Ontario, this is, this
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Um, because Saskatchewan is one of the most conservative places, I think, in North America.
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Uh, you have a conservative government that is advocating for parents' rights.
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Um, but this is what the Education Deep State will do.
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And it's time that parents had something more to enable us to hold them to account because
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they are working against us every step of the way.
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And, and one of the, one of the things that, one of the barriers that parents have is that
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we have no direct line of communication with, with, with anybody with decision-making powers,
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unless, you know, unless you know a guy who knows, which I have, which I happily do.
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But if you're a regular parent, there are so many barriers between you and being able to direct
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This is so much bigger than just having a quick conversation with a teacher or with
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your, you know, with your principal at your school, because, uh, like I learned talking
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to the former director of education for my school division, they will lie to you.
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There is nothing stopping them from just placating you saying, right, this is, we'll handle it,
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So what parents need is across the country of Canada is a mechanism to speak directly
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to the decision makers, directly to the decision makers, where if an issue comes up, if a parent
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has a concern or if a parent holds, waves a red flag saying my rights have been violated,
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that there is a, that there is a support system in place to be able to support that parent.
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Because as much as the public opinion polls, uh, say parents have wide support on this, uh, you know,
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teachers in school should not be keeping secrets from, from parents.
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Um, all, all with respect, the key stakeholder in every one of these issues is the parent and
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being a parent with kids in school is such a compressed amount of time to be completely
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What I think and what I say, having six children, four of them right now in elementary school
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in Saskatchewan, what I say should have much greater weight than some Joe blow right in,
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What I, what I say should have a hundred times more weight than that person.
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And that is what, that is, what does not exist in, in any jurisdiction in Canada right now.
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And I think there is a failing, and I hate to say it on behalf of the regular citizen here,
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um, in that we have not been paying attention to this nonsense for a very long time.
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Oh yeah, we've been in, we've been asleep at the switch, the wheel.
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And you know, we focus on as conservatives and I'm guilty of this too.
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We have that dumb guy in Ottawa, who's ruining the country.
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And then we look at the provincial government and we're like, God help us.
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If the NDP get back in, in both of our provinces, but we have to pay attention at
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the municipal level, most of the COVID restrictions that really harmed us came down at the COVID
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Um, the municipal government isn't just when your pothole is too big that it blows.
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Out of your ear and your garbage doesn't get picked up.
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We are not paying attention to making sure the right people get elected at the school board.
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Now I will, I'll credit my muse, Nilly Kaplan-Mirth of the Ottawa Carleton district school board
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for, for, I think turning a lot of people on to the craziness that happens at the school
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And if you're wondering why the teachers and the unions get away with the things that
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they do, look directly at the school board and then look in the mirror.
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Were you involved in the school board election?
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What did you do, um, with those school board trustees are supposed to be your voice in
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Would now be an appropriate time to announce my candidacy for the Regina public school division.
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Like we do not, this North Regina does not abide by like this.
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And we need a grownup in the room to redirect our focus because not only is our school division
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completely cap, like absolutely completely captured.
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It's being run by lunatic, like lunatics, Sheila.
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These are people that are wholly invested in social justice, in DEI, um, the, in the complete,
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What we want as parents, okay, what we want as parents is for our kids to be good at math,
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for kids to be good at science, for kids to be really, really great at languages, to
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This is what we want for our children, not all of this garbage that they've been forcing
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And we need the ability to, to, to, to tell, to tell them what we want.
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Every municipal board needs to be overtaken in this country because those municipal boards
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report up to the provincial who report up to federal.
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And I'm so happy that you brought up the federal government in this conversation, because as you
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know, education in Canada is the jurisdiction of the provincial government.
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But what we have as it pertains to sexual orientation and gender ideology, uh, across the country
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of Canada in education is a federal overreach by Justin Trudeau.
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Justin Trudeau is the worst teacher in the entire country of Canada.
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And it is his beliefs that were percolated down to the provincial jurisdictions of education.
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Every time that there is a sexual orientation and gender ideology issue in Canadian schools,
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that is the result of electing this fool teacher as our prime minister.
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And he is funding the activist organizations with federal bucks.
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And those are the ones influencing the local curriculum.
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As it pertains to, as it pertains to the rainbow week of action that, that, that was propagated
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throughout all of the public school boards in June, uh, that was, that was funded by him.
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All of these initiatives are being funded by him.
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The, over the federal overreach into provincial jurisdiction on this matter.
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And, um, I can't, I can't wait to, I can't, I mean, I will be dancing in the street when that man is voted out of his office.
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Our little sprinter vans just leading a parade.
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Uh, but then, but then also we'll have a lot of work to do to, to undo all of the damage.
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And that's, that's very much a part of this is we're going to have a lot of heavy lifting to do to undo the damage of these last nine years.
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Well, and as Trump says, you got to drain the swamp.
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You cannot think that things are going to change when you leave a bunch of underminers in the bureaucracy.
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No, if we could cleave off, if we could cleave off that Laurentian triangle, I mean, just expropriate it from the rest of the country.
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We'd be so much, we'd be so much further ahead right now, but, uh, a little, it's going to be an interesting year.
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I'm going to do what I can to help you, uh, unravel what's going on with your access to information filings.
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Uh, we have some in-house expertise that we will rely on because I'm just as curious about what's in those documents as you are now at this point.
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Um, because if they're doing this to you, they're doing this to a lot of people, probably me included.
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I don't think they should be able to do this stuff in darkness.
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Um, and this should scare them, prevent them from doing it to the next batch of parents that come up behind you.
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Um, and then we also need to get those, uh, access to information laws changed.
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It's imperative if we want to correct, if we want to correct the public trust, if we want the public to have trust in the institutions, we must be able to know what these institutions do.
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So, Lise, how do people, uh, see what you're doing?
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And my handle is my name, Lise Merle, L-I-S-E-M-E-R-L-E.
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Uh, or, or you can just contact Sheila because she knows where I am all the time.
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Lise, I feel like I'm going to have you back on again very, very soon, especially since you have a new foray into the political sphere, which you did not tell me about until now.
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And I'm, I'm sorry, I thought, sorry, I thought I, I thought I mentioned it before, but I might have been.
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You know, I, I, I go between like, God, am I bombing her phone too much?
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But then, no, it just, no, it's just always, it's, it's just like a, it's like a stream of consciousness.
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And this is what's great about our friendship is, is I feel like we operate very much on the same level.
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At a really fast clip and we keep up with each other.
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Actually, it's a pretty, it's a pretty new decision.
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It's a pretty new decision, but I'm, I'm, I'm super excited.
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I mean, you know, those tattoos that people have, be the change you want to see in the world or what I go.
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Well, that's what, that's basically what I'm doing.
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I can't wait to see, I can't wait to see you win and then strike fear in the hearts of your fellow trustees.
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I, I can't wait either, but, but to be on, but to be honest, across, across the country of Canada, we've all identified school boards as a big, big problem.
00:28:46.920
And what I'm recommending people do is go to their, go to their school board website right now, screen cap, all of the current trustees names, and then commit to voting for somebody else.
00:29:03.840
Vote them out at your earliest convenience, Canada.
00:29:07.720
It's absolutely nothing is more critical than voting your current school board members out.
00:29:13.980
If they did the damage, they may not be rewarded for it.
00:29:24.480
Well, friends, we've come to the portion of the show wherein we invite your viewer feedback because unlike the mainstream media, I actually care about what you think about the work that I do here at Rebel News because without you, there really is no Rebel News.
00:29:35.080
We rely on you because we will never take a penny from not only Justin Trudeau, but any level of government to do the work that we do to hold the government to account.
00:29:56.480
Sometimes I read those comments on air, but I will give you my email address right now.
00:30:02.900
Put gun show letters in the subject line so I know why you're emailing me because I do get dozens of emails every single day from outside of the company, and it is hard to keep track of them all.
00:30:14.660
Now, this week's letter comes from a regular viewer and longtime supporter of Rebel News, and it was on last week's show where I just took letters from you.
00:30:27.800
So, and one of the letters was on some comments that I made about the Australian breakdancer, if you can call her that, named Ray Gunn, no relation.
00:30:39.900
And Ray Gunn, if I understand correctly, thought that her useless degree in, I think it's cultural movement, would magically transform her into some sort of Olympic athlete.
00:30:58.740
I think she single-handedly had breakdancing removed from the Olympics going forward.
00:31:06.920
But imagine the narcissism of thinking that just because you studied the politics of breakdancing in the Olympics, that somehow you would then be a better athlete than actual breakdancers.
00:31:25.140
Well, that's what happened with good old Ray Gunn.
00:31:27.840
Now, she has complained now that anybody being critical of her is guilty of devastating misogyny.
00:31:34.560
No, actually, I think the woman who thought that her useless degree would somehow make her better than the other female breakdancers, that's the misogynist, right?
00:31:46.860
She's the one that did something to harm female breakdancers, not me.
00:31:51.440
Anyway, I made some comments about Rachel Gunn, no relation, Ray Gunn as she dances under.
00:31:57.580
And so a lady sent me a scathing email about how I, I'm obviously jealous of Rachel because I don't have the same university qualifications as her.
00:32:14.440
But anyway, and I think the fact that Ray Gunn has a doctorate in cultural movement is more of an indictment on the university system than anything else.
00:32:29.780
Because I read her university dissertation and just, wow, lots of progressive mumbo-jumbo and exactly what you would expect if someone wrote a dissertation on the politics of breakdancing and the inclusion of breakdancing into the Olympics.
00:32:49.520
So, long time Rebel News viewer, supporter of the things that we do here at Rebel News, Dave Hines, sent me an email about my remarks to the lady who said that I was just jealous of Rachel Gunn, no relation.
00:33:12.860
So, he says, hi Sheila, regarding today's university degrees, I think this cartoon sums it up.
00:33:21.060
You might say that the deer get it or that Alberta's deer are smarter than what is being turned out by today's universities.
00:33:32.480
I normally just sign with my name, but in this case, I'll include my qualification so no one can say that I have not done the work to get a degree and I'm not qualified to criticize our universities.
00:33:44.100
And just for the record, they were all earned in the 20th century.
00:33:57.520
And even if you didn't have all those fancy letters behind your name, you seem like a pretty smart guy and a decent individual.
00:34:05.440
So, well, everybody, that's the show for tonight.
00:34:08.860
I'll see everybody back here in the same time, in the same place next week.
00:34:11.620
And as always, don't let the government tell you that you've had too much to think.