Jody Wilson-Raybould, the Justice Minister fired by Justin Trudeau for, you know, upholding the law, is a Montreal liberal from the very constituency where SNC-Lavalin is headquartered. And there's some crazy stuff about David Melamedi, the new Justice Minister, who just happens to be a Montreal Liberal from the same constituency.
00:25:19.340I am fine. And I should tell you, I watched that little clip there and I read the newspaper coverage in the Quebec media.
00:25:26.340And I know she walked it back very slightly. She just, if I'm not mistaken, she said, well, maybe her phrasing wasn't perfect.
00:25:33.340But the idea that a woman would say the hijab, and she was specifically talking about the hijab, not the full face obscuring the cam,
00:25:42.340offends her belief in freedom. And she wasn't immediately devoured by all the mean girls on Twitter and in the CBC and social media,
00:25:51.340tells me that Quebec is a little bit more grown up above these conversations than the rest of the country.
00:25:57.340Well, it certainly tells you that Quebec is much less politically correct than, you know, the rest of Canada knows what you're allowed to say
00:26:06.340and what you're not allowed to say. But Quebec women didn't get the message.
00:26:09.340They don't, they have very, Quebec is an extremely feminist province. I don't know if anybody noticed,
00:26:16.340but they had lots of women politicians long before it was very common in the rest of Canada.
00:26:22.340They teach feminism. I mean, they've always had a very strong, and that's because of the reaction against the Catholic Church so many years ago
00:26:33.340in the Quiet Revolution. The Catholic Church was not seen as very friendly to women.
00:26:38.340And the response when the, when Quebec became far more secular or very secular was to renounce a lot of the attitudes that came with a very strong clergy, clerical domination of society.
00:26:56.340So they were, they were really ahead of the curve on feminism and, and not shy at all about speaking their minds regarding symbols that they see as oppressive,
00:27:07.340which many, many Canadians, many people in the West also see it as oppressive to women, but they don't dare open their mouth about it.
00:27:15.340I agree with most of what you said there, but I would point out in contrast that Ontario, which certainly regards itself as just as woke.
00:27:25.340I mean, Quebec had Pauline Marois, the female premier.
00:27:30.340Well, Ontario had Kathleen Wynne, who wasn't just feminist. She was a lesbian activist.
00:27:35.340And, you know, you could say she went just as far.
00:27:39.340She certainly despises the Catholic Church just as much as anyone in Quebec.
00:27:43.340But look at this picture of her sitting at the back of a mosque wearing a hijab.
00:27:48.340She was going in some sort of solidarity event.
00:27:51.340And, and this proud feminist was sitting at the back of a mosque because she was unclean.
00:28:22.340I don't think that Quebecers got the, they haven't got the total message because they're, they're kind of segregated from a lot of the media and a lot of the, even the intellectual traditions of the universities in the rest of the world or the rest of the West.
00:28:41.340They kind of go their own way. They're, they're never big on multiculturalism. This intersectionality thing, just, I don't hear about it at all here. It's just not a thing.
00:28:52.340Um, so they have their own style of thinking. And don't forget too, that Quebec intellectuals are much more influenced by, uh, intellectuals in France than they are, uh, intellectuals from Berkeley, say.
00:29:06.340So, uh, there, there are different traditions here and, uh, multiculturalism was never a big deal here or never something to be sought after. Uh, so that accounts for some of it.
00:29:19.340Let me throw another theory at you. And then I want to go to an opinion poll, Barbara, I have in front of me, uh, a very important Angus Reid poll from just two months ago about Quebec.
00:29:28.340So I'll get to that in a moment, but can I put a counter theory to you? I, again, I don't disagree with what you've said, but I put it to you that Quebec, depending on your definitions, can argue, can arguably be called the first ethnic nationalist.
00:29:46.340I won't say alt-right, but an ethno-nationalism. The Quebecois, the Sovereignty Association, the Pure Land Quebecers, we must keep our culture, our language amongst a sea of, uh, others.
00:30:01.340I put it to you that for centuries, and certainly since the Parti Quebecois and the Bloc Quebecois came along, Quebecers have been told it's okay to celebrate your nationalism.
00:30:16.340It's okay to celebrate your history, your culture, your language, and even if they don't practice it, your religion.
00:30:24.340And so when hundreds of thousands of Muslim migrants come in, um, they don't immediately say, well, we, we're just an empty slate, we're just an empty hotel room and a zip code, and we'll, we'll immediately roll with whatever, you know, multi-culti holiday of the week it is.
00:30:42.440They're saying, no, we actually are proud Quebecers. I think there's an ethnic pride in Quebec that is much stronger than anywhere else in the country, and it is accepted by the media class as somehow being not racist, whereas anyone else who would show any ethnic pride is immediately deemed racist.
00:31:00.440So that's my theory. What do you make of that?
00:31:04.440Well, I know there's no question about it. They, they are, uh, quite comfortable with their, uh, own heritage, their own, their own, uh, ethnic identity. They don't have white guilt. They don't, uh, uh, they don't, they don't hate America, and they don't hate themselves. They, they, uh, as I say, they're, they're walking to a beat of a different drum.
00:31:24.440And, and don't forget that outside of Montreal, um, outside of Montreal, Quebecers are the only, uh, probably jurisdiction in the, in the, all of North America where you have an ethnically homogeneous group of people, like six million people, who are still not multicultural at all.
00:31:48.440Montreal is very much multicultural, but, uh, the rest of Quebec is not. And they don't have that whole set. They, they're not, they're not in the flow of progressivism or, or what it means, or intersectionality or any of that stuff. It means that's, that doesn't mean anything to them.
00:32:06.440I, I, I, I find that very interesting. And I think the most interesting part of it is watching how Justin Trudeau, who himself is technically from Montreal, although I, I don't think he, in his bones as a Quebecer, I think he's sort of a global citizen, um, and he probably is more at home in Ontario, frankly.
00:32:27.620Or at least he's, he's, he's in the, in the cosmopolitan parts of Montreal. It's funny to me how he can abide, um, these things in his home province, but when he's in Ottawa, he speaks with a great fury on behalf of hijabs and Islam and, and all these things. I find it interesting. Let's go to the poll.
00:32:47.440I mentioned a poll from Angus Reid, and this, this is very telling. Angus Reid did a survey on the Coalition Avenue near Quebec's, a proposal to ban religious symbols from public sector workers. So this is not a ban of hijabs or niqabs on the street. As for example, France has, they banned the full face obscuring niqab anywhere. So this is just for people, uh, you know, a nurse in a hospital or someone at the motor vehicles.
00:33:16.100And according to this survey, and we'll put it up here on the screen, depending on the particular religious, religious object, let me just read the exact question. Please indicate whether you think public employees be, um, should be allowed to wear each of these religious symbols while on the job. Uh, so this is all respondents, um, including Quebec residents.
00:33:37.940So this is nationwide here. And I'll get to the Quebec numbers a bit later. 77% of Canadians want the burka band. 75% want the niqab band. And I put it to you that there's really little difference.
00:33:53.800So this is extremely popular, not just in Quebec, but across the country. And there's one more chart. I'll, I'll ask you, I'll show you. And this is just of Quebecers now. And then I'll, I'll bring you right back in, Barbara.
00:34:07.280The new government of Quebec has promised to ban public employees in positions of authority from wearing religious symbols at work. Do you support or oppose this ban?
00:34:16.880Now this Barbara is just asked of Quebecers. 43% strongly support the ban. Another 23% support it somewhat. So that's a total of 66% as opposed to just, um, 16% who oppose it and 12% who oppose it strongly. So it's two to one support. Uh, and it's a very strong support in Quebec.
00:34:42.380Sorry, it's a lot of numbers I was throwing at you. But I guess the takeaway here is not only is this extremely popular in Quebec, but this would be popular in every single province in the country.
00:34:52.440Well, I, I, I know that. I mean, I, I know that, uh, for example, the niqab face cover has always been strongly opposed throughout Canada. Uh, but you know, the media, uh, disregard that. They, they, uh, they, they are strongly for it or not for it, but they're strongly for the right, uh, to wear it.
00:35:11.400But I, as far as I know, I'm one of the very few journalists that has come out always for years strongly against the niqab in public service.
00:35:20.180I think it's appalling, uh, that people should be allowed to cover their faces in, in the public service, uh, since you don't have any choice with whom you deal in the public service.
00:35:29.700So, um, I think that's very bad. I, I am sympathetic to women who wear the hijab that want to be able to wear it in their daily life.
00:35:39.680I get that. I have no problem with it, seeing it or interacting with women wearing it. It, it, it's meaningless to me, but I do understand that in, in places of authority, um, judges say, uh, doctors, I don't know.
00:35:55.600I don't know who they considered. There's a case to be made. I, I, I don't say I'm totally on the side of, of those who think it shouldn't ever be in the public service.
00:36:05.140I don't think wearing a little kippah, really, uh, somebody who, who is, um, a school teacher or, uh, um, a doctor. I don't see how that's harmful.
00:36:16.680I can see how judges, uh, that would be something in law courts. I can see where that could be intimidating, uh, to somebody who's from another, you know, they might believe, even though the judge might be totally impartial, but they, they might have feelings about that and they shouldn't have to worry about such feelings.
00:36:34.540So, you know, a bit of a mixed bag there. Yeah. Uh, well, here's, what's interesting to me. I, it is so clear to me that the 2019 federal election, obviously we're less than a year away from that. Um, open borders immigration is going to be a major campaign issue. I don't think Trudeau and Amin Hassan wanted it to be, but I think it is becoming that way partly because of the open border between Quebec and New York, partly because of the homeless crisis this has caused in Ontario.
00:37:04.540Um, the success of the Quebec party that we talked about, I think is part of this. And I think that the liberals are going full speed ahead. They really are replicating what Angela Merkel did. Um, they're calling for 340,000 migrants next year, 40% of whom will not be economic class immigrants. So I think it's going to be an issue.
00:37:26.360I know from another Angus Reid poll that only about 5% of Canadians support increasing immigration that high, only 5%, Barbara. So I think you're having this extreme immigration agenda that is disproportionately Muslim. It's just a fact. And at the same time, you're demonizing critics as Islamophobic, bigoted, racist. They're even demonizing Doug Ford's provincial cabinet ministers as un-Canadian for not going along with this.
00:37:55.460I think we're in for a heck of a fight. And, uh, I just don't know if Quebec is going to have a, a, a different narrative than the rest of us. Maybe Trudeau is not going to criticize anyone in all fronts say, but in English, he's going to call us all bigots. How do you think that's going to go down?
00:38:12.300I, you know, I'm not, I try not to make too many predictions cause I have, I hate having to eat my words. I think, I think immigration is a big issue for a lot of people. Uh, the problem for the conservative party is that the liberals are always going to paint any criticism of immigration as you're a racist. Like, I mean, it's just, it's, it's, it's very hard to avoid that, um, accusation.
00:38:38.300And it's very frustrating to anybody. I know myself when I write, uh, about immigration, I have to be so careful, uh, because for me, it's, it's about the numbers. We just don't have the infrastructure and we don't have the capacity.
00:38:51.660I don't even think we have the, I don't think we know what our job needs are even. And of course, a lot of those immigrants coming, uh, are the ones that are working, but a whole lot of others are not. They're the, the, you know, the grandparents and the sisters and the brothers and the children.
00:39:07.660So it's, it's a tremendous, uh, it's a tremendous burden on the system. And, um, uh, and there's no time for the generations to catch up and, and relieve the burden because, uh, when the next generation comes and they're all integrated, then there's another wave of, of immigration.
00:39:25.060So, uh, you have to keep expanding services, but they can never keep up with the rate. Uh, you know, the hospitals are overcrowded, but you can't keep building hospitals at that pace.
00:39:34.340So it is a problem and the conservatives are going to have a serious problem countering this narrative about Islamophobia, racism. Uh, it's, it's, it's, it's just a mantra. I don't know how it's going to, uh, I think, I think they have to take the bull by the horns.
00:39:50.580I think they have to sort of punch back and say, stop calling us racist. That's wrong, you know, and just, uh, take the offensive on that.
00:39:57.880Well, I mean, the success of Francois Legault and the, the CAC party in Quebec shows it's possible, uh, to win on, and, and they're not saying stop immigration.
00:40:06.700They're not saying ban Muslims. They're saying folks slow down a bit here. Let's reduce it by 20% and let's keep this, uh, religious symbol out of the public sector.
00:40:15.260I think that's an eminent, really reasonable point of view. And at one, I, yeah, I, I agree with you, Ezra.
00:40:20.040And the one thing that might happen is that, uh, Maxine Bernier's party, although it's very tiny and very just, uh, nascent, if, if he starts getting a lot of support from people and if the conservatives see that really, uh, there's a significant number of votes that are going to him because he's honest about immigration.
00:40:40.840Uh, it may encourage them to, uh, take back that, you know, to, to, to appropriate his message a little more in order to keep those votes on side.
00:40:51.100And I'd be perfectly happy for that to happen because I'd like to see the, you know, the conservatives, uh, gain traction.
00:40:56.700Uh, but yeah, they, they really have to go on offense here.
00:41:00.860I think these issues are linked. I think, yeah, I think mass migration without, uh, vetting for cultural fit and without absorption and the hijab.
00:41:10.540I really think they're linked. You know, Barbara, let me end with a little anecdote. You know, the last conversation I had with Andrew Scheer, he doesn't talk to the rebel anymore.
00:41:18.220You know, the last conversation we ever had was he was on this very show and I asked him about immigration and he did not like my questions.
00:41:27.300I put the same question to him five times and he evaded it five times. And because he wasn't on Skype, he couldn't just push the off button.
00:41:37.540He was literally sitting next to me here. And I said, uh, and I, and I asked him, do you have any, you know, putting aside security concerns, which is something very acute.
00:41:48.520Do you have any proposal for a cultural fit? He wouldn't answer it. Andrew Scheer will not answer two questions about immigration.
00:41:57.420The absolute number of immigrants. He, note, he has never criticized Trudeau or Hassan for their huge numbers. He has never said he's opposed to increasing numbers and he won't talk about the quantity.
00:42:09.080He won't talk about the quality either. He will not talk about cultural fit. The, the most I've seen him say is we need to have better processing and an orderly flow.
00:42:18.620So I think that he has yet to cross that Rubicon you talk about. He recently had an epiphany on global warming and he no longer says he wants to follow the UN.
00:42:28.540He's still being a me too mini me of Trudeau on immigration. And I think you're right. I think Maxime Bernier might eat his lunch on that. Last word to you, Barbara.
00:42:37.820Well, I, I'm just, uh, looking forward to the campaign coming up because I think it is going to be very interesting. And I do think migration, uh, and this, by the way, this global pact on migration, which I think is very insidious. Uh, you know, I, I hope these things do come up for debate because, uh, we might see something energetic happen, uh, if we can get some movement on the part of the conservatives to, uh, to own that issue a little bit more.
00:43:01.780I'd love to see that happen. Uh, and I do think Quebec may be showing us the way, uh, you know, Quebec's not always right, but when they are right, they're often very, to me, they seem very courageous because they'll, they'll buck trends.
00:43:13.340They don't even know how courageous they are, uh, because they, they kind of, uh, don't realize how, how politically correct the rest of us are. So.
00:43:21.900Very interesting. Well, listen, I'm always grateful for your time. Time flies with you. I want to share one. Give me 30 seconds to share one more thing. You know, we had Yasmin Mohamed on the show the other day.
00:43:30.540Oh, she's great. Yeah, she's great. She's a former Muslim who was forced to wear, uh, face obscuring veils.
00:43:36.820Actually, she was married to an Al Qaeda activist, if you can believe it. She said to me, she's not for banning, she's not for telling women to take off the hijab because she's worried that doing so could sentence them to death.
00:43:51.500So she says she's, she supports any woman who would take the hijab off, but she would never pressure a woman to take it off because she doesn't know what violence that woman would face.
00:44:03.360I thought that was a terrifying thing to, to hear her say. And obviously it comes from someone who has lived inside that world and would be terrified that if I were free, I would be perhaps murdered by a father or a brother.
00:44:19.980So I just want to leave that anecdote with you. It changed my thinking on that. That's why we need the government to ban it because a woman herself might not be in a position to stand up to the tyrants in her small, in her small world.
00:44:33.040All right. Well, Barbara, thanks for talking with these very controversial subjects with me. You're one of my favorite people to talk with them because you're not afraid. And I wish more people were like you.
00:45:06.980Yeah, you know, I think that the media looked at Jagmeet Singh and thought, he's so handsome, he's such a sharp dresser, and he's got that beautiful, colorful turban.
00:45:25.100And that's all our checkboxes of what a progressive man looks like. And of course, he had strong ties to the Sikh community who came out en masse. And that's just not enough. That's a good add-on to other stuff. But that's not enough in itself.
00:45:40.280And my observations of Jagmeet Singh are that he is, you know, he's not in the thick of the debate. I think it's probably because he's not an MP yet. When I see him on interviews, he doesn't sound well briefed on things. And, you know, I know he's Sikh and everything, and I think that's fine.
00:45:59.460But I think he's obsessed with Sikh separatism. Like, he goes to rallies and stuff for it around the world, even. And that's a project, but that's not the project of someone who wants to be the Prime Minister of Canada. I think it's a distraction for him. I don't know. What do you think about that? I just, I don't think he's going to do well at all. I think for sure he's going to lose this by-election in Burnaby. I might need my words on that, but I think he's going to come in maybe third.
00:46:25.940And I think the NDP have a real question. Do they want to go into an election with him? Because it was only, it was only the collapse of that NDP vote that gave Trudeau his majority. Yeah, I share your worries on that.
00:46:40.140Betty writes, the similarities between Trudeau and Singh are striking. Neither one of them will answer legitimate questions that they're asked.
00:46:47.340Yes, there are some similarities. Both are clothed as horses. Both are masters of the selfie. Both are in love with the mirror.
00:46:55.940But there's an extremely important difference. Trudeau is a household name. And there's a resonance there because his father was Prime Minister. And so a lot of boomers have fond, sentimental memories.
00:47:09.880They're probably not thinking of Pierre Trudeau himself as a Prime Minister. They're probably thinking of their own youth when Trudeau was Prime Minister.
00:47:18.280So if you're, if you're 65 years old now, and you think of Pierre Trudeau, well, maybe you were 25 years old. And so your fond memories of, oh, when I was a kid, when I was 25 and carefree.
00:47:32.240So they have that sentimentality, that nostalgia of their own youth. And the name Trudeau is a household name.
00:47:39.240Jagmeet Singh is none of those things. So I think he's going to get his clock cleaned by Trudeau. And that's not good for those of us on the right.
00:47:46.380On my interview with Andrew Lawton about Trudeau's SNC-Lavalin scandal, Paul writes,
00:47:52.820One liberal actually does their job and they get fired. Let that sink in. The media party will pretend to do their job for a while and let it go.
00:47:59.720Yeah, it's interesting. I mean, I showed you earlier today that the Globe and Mail have this full-on propaganda piece for SNC-Lavalin.
00:48:06.820That was in December. So I am a little surprised and a little impressed that they let Bob Fyfe go on this.
00:48:14.700He seems to be still like a tiger on the issue.