In this episode of Stay Free With Russell Brand, host Russell Brand sits down with former White House Chief Strategist Steve Bannon to discuss his time in the military, his early career in finance, and his rise to become one of the most influential men in American politics. In this episode, we discuss how Steve s early life led him to become a military man, how he became a political strategist for Donald Trump, and how he went on to become the President of the United States. Russell Brand is a comedian, bestselling author, and podcaster. His work has been featured in the New York Times, CNN, and the Hollywood Reporter, and he is a regular contributor to The Weekly Standard, The New York Post, and The Huffington Post. He is also a frequent contributor to the Weekly Standard and The Daily Beast, and is the author of several books, including "The Dark Side Of" and "The Biggest Loser: A Guide to the White House." He is a frequent guest on CNN's Hard Knocks, and hosts a podcast called "Hard Knocks" with John Avlon, a host of his own podcast, John Aviano, hosted by his wife, Janice Yannice Yannis, who also happens to be a writer and host of the book club, The Yiannopoulis Book Club. . The book club is a must-listen-to-listener, and you can join us on all of the best-of-the-best books, as well as all of our social media platforms, wherever you get your free books are available. You can find us on Apple Podcasts, Podchaser, and wherever else you can get your news and information is found, including the latest podcast recommendations, and more! Thanks for listening to Stay Free with Russell Brand! - stay free, friend us on social media, and don't miss it! Stay free, and spread the word to your friends about this episode! Thank you for listening and tweet us your thoughts on this episode. - Russell Brand and thank you for supporting Stay Free, and Good Morning America! and Good Luck, Good Luck! - Jack, Jack, Cheers, - Cheers! - EJ & Gurgle Dot, Sarah, John, Gorms, Gav, and Gav & Gav - Jack, Sarah Sarah - - John, John & Sarah
00:00:00.000Hello you Awakening Wonders there on Spotify, Apple, Stink Whistle, Gurgle Dot, or wherever you download your podcasts these days to remain at least peripherally connected to some tendril of truth in a bewildering miasma of lies and propaganda.
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00:02:24.000Now Bannon, Steve Bannon is an American media executive.
00:02:29.000He was involved in the sale of Castle Rock.
00:03:36.000I'm fascinated by you as an individual, and I'm astonished by how your early life gives us insight into what would come to pass.
00:03:47.000I'm talking about your time as a serviceman in the Navy, your time in finance, your time at Breitbart, and how that led into permutations of independent media.
00:04:00.000In a way, we're living amidst perpetual geopolitical crisis, escalating events in the Middle East, a war that would seem to be unwinnable, funded as it is by your nation, between Ukraine and Russia.
00:04:14.000We live in the aftermath of a financial crash that perhaps you understood better than most people,
00:04:20.000its implications, its impact, how it spelled the end of the kind of moderate
00:04:25.000neoliberalist politics that preceded it and gave birth to the populist era that we live within now.
00:04:32.000Your experiences too in Hollywood, I imagine, give you an interesting perspective
00:05:04.000Commonly, these figures are understood as right-wing pundits.
00:05:07.000So now that many of us believe that we're on the precipice of a Black Swan event, will you tell me, Steve, where you think populism is heading?
00:05:16.000If you think the left-right... I heard you once say at the Oxford Union that the future would belong to populism.
00:05:22.000Do you still believe that there's a chance of either left-wing or right-wing populism?
00:05:27.000Or do you feel that a different ideology is about to assert itself?
00:05:31.000And over the course of our conversation, I hope to get into all of those areas of which you have personal professional experience.
00:05:37.000I would say that if you go back and look at the Oxford Union speech, that was a pretty good call.
00:05:42.000Probably because today is several years later and it's right-wing populism and left-wing populism.
00:05:47.000I think the reason is that the oligarchs that particularly control the West, Uh, have been so over the top in their greed, uh, in their incompetence.
00:05:56.000Their greed and their incompetence that people are rising up all over.
00:05:59.000You see that whether it's the collapse of the Tory party in England, the rise of, uh, alternatives for Deutschland in Germany, the rise of the right in Latin America, Central America, and obviously the Trump movement.
00:06:12.000So I think it's a combination of their greed and their incompetence.
00:06:15.000The elites have failed us and they failed themselves and it's a populist takeover and it's going to be determined whether it be right-wing populism or left-wing populism.
00:06:25.000Yes it is and there yet remains a further alternative.
00:06:29.000I've heard you use the phrase techno feudalism and I think that's what many people wherever they find themselves culturally or politically fear is that we're being guided, manipulated, maneuvered in fact into a new form of globalism where technological power is utilized to control Consciousness, our understanding of the public sphere, to manipulate consent and communication.
00:06:56.000Can you tell me what you mean by techno-feudalism, how it relates to globalism, and who sits at the top of that baronial class in this model of feudalism?
00:07:06.000Well, if you go back even to the Oxford speech, I tell, I'm kind of calling out younger people who have had a tendency just to vote for progressive neoliberalism, right, and will be led by the cultural side that you're nothing but Russian serfs.
00:07:22.000You're the equivalent of Russian serfs.
00:07:23.000You don't own anything and you're not going to own anything.
00:07:26.000The triad that controls The deal is really what I call the easy money overlords of Wall Street, or the City of London, or Frankfurt, or Tokyo, Shanghai, but particularly the City of London and Wall Street.
00:07:40.000Then you have the corporatists, both the American corporatists, but also the multinational corporatists.
00:07:45.000And on top of that, you've got what I call the sociopathic tech overlords.
00:07:50.000And right now, we basically have passed, I think, late-stage capitalism, what I would call finance capitalism.
00:07:58.000I think you saw that, that was kind of the collapse in 2008, and you've seen the rise since then of what I call techno-feudalism, which is now, we're basically going back to almost the Middle Ages in a feudal society where you're a digital serf, Right.
00:08:11.000You're essentially not going to own your own content.
00:08:17.000And as long as you don't come off of the being an indentured servant or being a serf, you can get along.
00:08:22.000But once you stray outside this and you saw a perfect example, and I think was one of your great awakenings was during the pandemic of what you saw about what public health officials did and kind of the combination of big tech Working with big government and of course the biopharmaceutical industrial complex, that was a perfect example of techno-feudalism.
00:08:43.000And unless we start to break this by a democratic means, that means the ballot box and people getting very focused on after you have victories of how you start to take apart these apparatuses, then I think this world is really headed to a new dark age.
00:08:58.000You're right to a degree, Steve, that the pandemic period elicited and stirred in me, as well as obviously millions of people, a kind of awakening.
00:09:08.000Prior to that, I'd always been anti-establishment and had assumed that the position of the left was also anti-establishment, that the left was about free speech, the left was about opposing corruption and power, that the left was about opposing war and empowering Ordinary individuals, wherever we're from, Britain, France, your country, any of the African nations, to stand up and oppose tyranny, globalism, elitism.
00:09:37.000Clearly what's changed in the last few years, and I can't help but consider you to be a significant architect in this transition, is what you refer to as economic nativism has become the default position of the working class or blue-collar populations.
00:09:52.000In America, when you talk of economic nativism, Steve, is that at odds with where I've elsewhere heard you talk about Catholicism, Christianity, subsidiarity, and ideas that are plainly, literally, both in terms of their nomenclature, but plainly their ideology, derived from spiritual ideas?
00:10:13.000How do these two opposing ideas sit together?
00:10:17.000Economic nativism, which, as the name would suggest, is about economics, and the idea that there is something we are aspiring to, that we are people of spirit, that there are values that transcend materialism and materialism in all its forms.
00:10:30.000There are the restrictions that rationalism... I can see your answers ready, Steve.
00:10:35.000I'm watching your body language, but I'm just gonna keep talking!
00:10:39.000So tell me, ultimately, aren't you saying, let the market sort shit out, I don't really care about the Christianity, or are there Are there real ideals behind this?
00:10:49.000No, I think, look, we're in a spiritual war, and I'm a Catholic, you know, Roman Catholic, Irish Catholic, and I'm, you know, as I try to be as close to my faith as possible, but obviously we're all imperfect instruments.
00:11:02.000I do believe in a form of, that the United States is the New Jerusalem, and the United States is particularly endowed with a relationship To divine providence.
00:11:14.000I think we've had a very providential history.
00:11:17.000The economic nativism or nationalism is that I believe that strongly there's still the best system we have is the Westphalian system.
00:11:25.000The nation state was, as you know, was created a couple hundred years ago and that sets it out into national units and is still Until we come up with something different, it's still the best way for the working class and the middle class to have a shot at what I call subsidiarity through a grassroots effort trying to control, to the best of their ability, that national entity.
00:11:47.000Nationalism is for the political leaders and the economic leaders To put the well-being of the citizen first.
00:12:08.000And I think the way Boris Johnson and the Tories implemented it was very imperfect.
00:12:12.000But you've seen this with the Trump program to try to confront China, but most importantly confront China's financiers, which are in the United States, private equity firms, hedge funds, Wall Street, to force them through a series of tariffs and economic confrontations to start to bring manufacturing jobs, particularly high value-added manufacturing jobs, back to the United States.
00:12:33.000So I would say Economic nationalism is in the material realm and of course Christian nationalism or these more spiritual yearnings are in the spiritual realm.
00:12:43.000And I do think we're in a spiritual war.
00:12:46.000I think at the end of the day this is a spiritual war between the forces of light and the forces of darkness.
00:12:50.000Well, I think both sides of this war, if I can be reductive for a moment, consider it to be a spiritual or at least an ideological war.
00:12:58.000And in the final analysis, they are perhaps synonyms, being both immaterial and difficult to ultimately define other than their immateriality and ineffable nature.
00:13:09.000But what I would say when we're talking about a struggle between light and darkness is I wonder what vision we are presenting people with.
00:13:19.000If we say that the nation-state is for now the final word, how are we to acknowledge and then eventually overcome how these nation-state models have plainly become corrupted?
00:13:30.000The nation-state is now plainly subsidiary to agencies, whether it's militaristically like NATO, economically like the IMF or the World Bank or organisations that I'm probably not well enough educated and I certainly haven't ever advised a president or guided someone to high office, so I guess you know how this stuff really works.
00:13:48.000How are we to continue to maintain that aspect of what's plainly a corrupt institutionalized and hijacked system that has led us to this techno-feudalism?
00:14:00.000Why and why would we maintain that when plainly your principles of subsidiarity rely on the smallest units of power possible?
00:14:11.000That we should have the maximum individual sovereignty, the maximum amount of community democracy?
00:14:16.000If you go back to Edmund Burke, the English conservative philosopher, talked about the small divisions, the small platoons of civic society.
00:14:25.000Those people that run the sports teams, build the churches, have the civic organizations, whether that's in Tolkien's little village, the Shire.
00:14:35.000Or whether it's in the small-town America with the town halls.
00:15:00.000We're not isolationists really in our national security policy and we're certainly not isolationists in economic policies.
00:15:06.000You do that through a series of trade deals and commercial relationships that put the citizens of your country first.
00:15:15.000That's one of the problems of the United States.
00:15:16.000We've entered into all these trade arrangements, all these security arrangements, where the citizen, the little guy, had the burden on his shoulder of the taxes and his pension funds going to fund this on trade deals that didn't work for them, and also having a military made up primarily of the working class and lower middle class that was deployed throughout the world to be the world's policeman.
00:15:38.000Just if I could just be specific for a second, if you look at the Basically the world map you take Western Europe let's take the Middle East and particularly around the Gulf the Gulf Emirates you then go around the map to the to the South China Sea and around that area and then up to North you know Northwest or the Pacific or near Japan and
00:15:58.000Those four nodes on the Eurasian landmass, if you think about it, the United States has commercial relationships, cultural relationships, trade deals, economic deals in all of those, okay?
00:16:12.000Those are also whether we have NATO or in the Middle East with our forces, with CENTCOM, the South China Sea and Taiwan, and then up as a protector of the Korean Peninsula and still Japan with forces still in Japan.
00:16:22.000If you look at all the commercial and all the trade deals and then layer on top of it an American security guarantee in back of it, whether that's NATO or troops in the Middle East, that is what's been unfair to the American people.
00:16:33.000The reason we've been bled out for the last 40 or 50 years is that those trade deals and the commercial relationships were all one-sided, all lopsided.
00:17:10.000And more importantly, their sons and daughters.
00:17:12.000Their sons and daughters are the ones that were on patrol in the Hindu Kush in Afghanistan.
00:17:17.000They're the ones in the carrier battle group in the Red Sea right now.
00:17:20.000They're the troops, or they're the sailors in the South China Sea.
00:17:23.000We're also, you know, we have the 101st Airborne, a whole brigade in Romania right on the border to Ukraine, and probably, in all likelihood, many special force operators already in Ukraine.
00:17:33.000So, it's that architecture in the post-war Order that has really led to the managed decline of the United States, and this is what has driven, along with the financial crisis in 2008, a populist uprising.
00:17:46.000And that's why, because it hasn't been solved today.
00:17:48.000In fact, I would argue it's actually getting worse.
00:17:53.000Being kicked to the curb after January 6th of 2021 and sent to Mar-a-Lago is essentially a ruler in exile, never to return.
00:18:05.000He's come back with actually more power in a more powerful and broader movement that now has African-American males now has Hispanic, the Hispanics almost at 50%, Asians at 32%.
00:18:16.000We're building our coalition every day because people can see that the model that exists in the United States, it's economic and governing model no longer works.
00:18:25.000And that's why I think you're seeing populism in Europe and particularly right-wing populism is on the rise.
00:18:31.000Are you then saying that this right-wing, anti-populist movement would have to become universally and fundamentally anti-war, except in matters where responding to an aggressor?
00:18:44.000Should this sort of nativism, this Westphalian nativism, whatever, whether it's your country or mine, be coupled with, if indeed strong borders and migration is, you know, and strong migration rules and regulations is to be part of it, Does it similarly have to be anti-war in order to limit the amount of disruption and migration caused by, in particular, globalist intervention in some of the countries you've listed there, and the more insidious corruption and destabilization that happens through commercial relationships, primarily because a country
00:19:18.000countries or companies, call them what you will, like Apple and their involvement in
00:19:23.000various nations, their financial relationship with China, their mineral requirements in
00:20:04.000So I think, one, I think we're anti-interventionists and anti-war to the degree that what's amazing about our populist movement, it's principally made up of veterans, of parents of veterans, of sons and daughters of veterans, and many active-duty military.
00:20:22.000Remember, we look at the world, America first looks at the world as our two biggest allies are the Russian people, And the Chinese people, Lao Bajing, old hunter namesake, because in World War II we see the war against the fascists and really this was a war against corporate interest.
00:20:37.000Remember the economic structure of both Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan.
00:20:42.000The Kree war is almost virtually the industrial structure of it post-war.
00:20:48.000Almost none of the corporate leaders that supported the fascists and made money off the fascists, both in Imperial Japan and in Italy and in Germany, there were no tribunals for them.
00:20:59.000They were almost virtually intact and had their same ownership.
00:21:02.000The people that were, and most of NATO, and I'm a big supporter of NATO as long as it's an alliance.
00:21:07.000Right now, as I go back around The Eurasian landmass, like we did a minute ago, but the post-war international rules-based order, it makes all those areas of the world protectorates of the United States, not allies.
00:21:20.000We would fall into the same trap the British fell into.
00:21:22.000And I look very much to British history and the British Empire as something, I have tremendous admiration for the British, but I don't want to make the same mistakes the British made, right?
00:21:31.000And I see the United States, which is, remember, Our revolutionary generation was an anti-imperial power at exactly that moment that in India and in North America, because they had Canada, were about to build the greatest empire on earth, and they still did, but our revolutionary generation backed off.
00:21:48.000They said, "We don't want to be a part of something, no matter how much it grows, how
00:21:51.000fast it grows, that has a worthless landed aristocracy that calls the shots along with
00:21:57.000monopolistic power like crown charters given to the East India Company, where you're totally
00:22:34.000I think it's been instigated by the ruling class in the United States, who never put
00:22:37.000their children in harm's way, ever, and always depend upon American taxpayers and the pension
00:22:43.000funds of the American working class to finance this.
00:22:47.000So, this is, I think, and my argument is, most of the elites of Europe Except for the British, right, who were essentially fighting for their empire, their freedom obviously on their own, but their empire.
00:22:59.000A handful of people in France and in Poland and a couple other places.
00:23:04.000Essentially the elites of Europe that are the elites of NATO were essentially either neutral, which meant you were for Hitler or you were for Hitler and the fascists.
00:23:13.000Our allies that lost 65 million people We're the Russian people.
00:23:18.000Now, we abandoned them at the last stages of the war.
00:23:22.000We over-armed Stalin, and there's questions inside the U.S.
00:23:25.000government at the time of who was actually pro-Stalin or really pro-America.
00:23:29.000We also turned over China to Mao Zedong in 1949, so we abandoned the Russian people and we abandoned Lao Baijing, the Chinese people, at the end of World War II, had sacrificed so much to bleed out the Imperial Japanese Army and destroy the Wehrmacht.
00:23:45.000And then in 1989, 50 years later, within six months of each other, which nobody talks about, we had Tiananmen Square, which actually had an uprising against the Chinese Communist Party, and they were on the ropes, and you had to follow the Berlin Wall.
00:23:59.000Between June of 1989 and November of 1989, the entire system collapsed again, and what happened?
00:24:05.000The Bush regime, the Bush-Hunter in the United States, flew over and told Deng Xiaoping,
00:24:10.000"We'll make a deal with you, ease up a bit "because of economic relationships,
00:24:14.000"and we'll get you in the World Trade Organization, "and we'll get you with the Clintons,
00:24:17.000"we'll get you most favored nation, "we'll have a business relationship,
00:24:20.000"and we don't care if you enslave Lao-Bai Jing, "we'll have your back."
00:24:24.000And the same thing essentially in Russia.
00:24:26.000What happened is the West, as predators, tried to go in and essentially steal assets
00:24:31.000from the Russian people, and when it got a little too crazy,
00:24:34.000We essentially turned it back over to the KGB.
00:24:36.000And that's where Putin's gangsters were essentially empowered by the West because of our craven nature, what we did to Russia.
00:24:43.000So the two biggest allies we've ever had, the Russian people and the Chinese people, we've abandoned twice.
00:24:50.000And my point today is, why would we be at war with those two people?
00:24:55.000And right now, and this is why I'm the only civilian in American history to have ever been fully sanctioned by the Chinese Communist Party.
00:25:02.000I'm the leader of the anti-Chinese Communist Party movement in the United States to support Lao-Beijing and to take down the CCP.
00:25:09.000The enemies of this world are the Mulas in Persia, the Chinese Communist Party, and I think the KGB in Moscow, which has caused a lot of problems and who are not good guys.
00:25:18.000Although I fault principally in Ukraine, the West, We're trying to drive this and that's the reason, I think the reason is the West, particularly the elites in the West, hatred of basic Russian culture in society.
00:25:32.000I can see that you have to simultaneously contain a good deal of information in your mind when dealing with matters as complex and as current as this with such intertwined and baffling contradictory and often falsely rendered histories One of the details that I hold on to Steve is I know that your background is a blue collar American background and the principle that I'm guided by personally are spiritual principles of individual sovereignty and community values and when you touched upon the small town communities of America or the small town communities of the United Kingdom and the maximum amount of power for ordinary Americans or ordinary Brits and the ability to control
00:26:11.000The direction of our nations to have the maximal impact when it comes to whether or not there should be intervention given that it's the sons and daughters of these communities that are sent overseas and coming back in the bags.
00:26:21.000I would say that we have to, my feeling and my fear is that what the and indeed the attacks of the what you might call the metropolitan elites and the professional media class and the legacy media is that this type of rhetoric masks just a power struggle to Capture the support of ordinary Americans in order to ensure that the elite that continues to benefit from their compliance is a different elite rather than a non-elitist system entirely.
00:26:55.000But hang on, let me take that for a second, it's a great question.
00:26:57.000And I want to compare and contrast what's happened in the United States over the last couple of years to England.
00:27:02.000In the United States, we just overthrew, we've taken down in the last three months, four months, the Speaker of the House, a moderate, you know, Uniparty Speaker of the House, Kevin McCarthy, first time in the history of this Republic, 250 years of the Republic, taken out a sitting Speaker.
00:27:26.000He's now retired, although he's still sticking around.
00:27:28.000He's officially out as the head of the Republican Party in the Senate.
00:27:33.000And we just took out the entire head of the RNC, the Republican National Committee, which would be your equivalent of the Tory Party.
00:27:39.000We took all this out through a grassroots movement.
00:27:42.000That is called the precinct strategy and also going to school boards.
00:27:46.000This is where people using subsidiarity have gotten engaged over the last three or four years since really because Trump's first term and our first campaign, it was build the wall, you know, lock her up, you know, we had slogans and we have We had directional feelings but not really policy to back it up and quite frankly not a total engagement in people in their own salvation.
00:28:08.000The thing that's changed is now you've seen an act of what I call your use of your agency.
00:28:14.000You're seeing an empowerment of people through social media.
00:28:17.000To understand that they can connect to each other, build networks with each other through social media, and start to take over the local precincts in the Republican Party, their town councils, their school boards, and that's where change is going to come.
00:28:27.000So when you've seen these things take place over the last, because remember, President Trump, God bless him, didn't support us on McCarthy really at all.
00:28:53.000The same with Ron McDaniel with the RNC and Mitch McConnell.
00:28:56.000This is now a populist movement that every day gets bigger and President Trump realizes
00:29:00.000this will be his legacy, it's not simply his presidency but the movement he's built around
00:29:05.000that will be greater than Trump and will be bigger and more powerful even after Trump
00:29:09.000finishes his second term in the White House.
00:29:11.000He's built a movement where people can see I don't have to sit on the sofa and just take
00:29:15.000I just don't have to yell at the TV watching Fox.
00:29:17.000I can be actively engaged and I can be a hoplite or a centurion in this army that we're building to take over the country.
00:29:24.000The difference is, and this is what I think the great tragedy of Brexit and what's happened before then.
00:29:30.000The Tory party never embraced the return of the sovereignty to the United Kingdom.
00:29:35.000They saw it, and I saw this when Theresa May and the team and Boris Johnson came to the White House in the first couple months, they always saw it as a problem to be dealt with instead of an opportunity to be seized.
00:29:46.000And this is why I think you're seeing with Nigel Farage and the Reform Party, You're finally, I think, beginning to see an alternative to the Tories that's populist-based.
00:29:54.000And I think, over the next two years, you're going to see a real flood the zone with people in the United Kingdom and token shires.
00:30:02.000The shires are going to rise up and say, hey, as Englishmen, you know, about our own freedoms, our own rights as Englishmen, we're going to stand up.
00:30:09.000And I think you're going to see the Tory party thrown out.
00:30:12.000And I think that new-form populist party will be what takes on Labour.
00:30:17.000And I think a lot of people in Labour Just like it was the people in labor in the Midlands that gave us Winston Churchill that had his back against the royal family and the elites in England that all want to cut a deal with Hitler and also had the backs of Nigel Farage and those guys during the Brexit.
00:30:31.000That same working class who, by the way, in the last election, went Tory also, I think they're looking not for what I call Singapore on the Thames, they're looking for a real rejuvenation and rebirth of England as a manufacturing center and advanced fourth-generation manufacturing, high-tech jobs.
00:30:49.000I think you're going to see that as the United Kingdom, and particularly the British, start to grip with what populism is.
00:30:55.000And populism, at the end of the day, is fully using your agency, your agency, to affect change.
00:31:01.000That we certainly agree on and there's been a massive uprising in this country and across the world among farmers.
00:31:06.000A global farming movement as people, farmers obviously, seek to keep control of an industry and way of life that seems to be, like many things, becoming co-opted, politicised, centralised and controlled in ways that are astonishing and extraordinary and normally masked behind the language of good intention, environmentalism, And the condemnation of farmers as racist is being practiced right now in Germany, the Netherlands, Sri Lanka, your country, I reckon, and certainly in ours.
00:31:39.000One of the other things I'd like to comment on is that our Labour Party, as I'm sure you're aware, being as educated and informed as you are, is now essentially another globalist, neoliberal outfit led by a globalist in the form of Keir Starmer.
00:31:53.000Now, I reckon you're right when you're talking about the potential of right-wing populism to rise in this country, but we are seeing, indeed, Steve, I should tell you, somewhat undergirded by anti-war sentiment, a rise of figures way, way to the left of the Labour Party, which isn't hard.
00:32:12.000Comparable to what we saw in 2017, around the rise of Jeremy Corbyn, who's, you know, I know you know, but for our listeners and viewers, a kind of, say, Bernie Sanders, but less corporatist, less financially strong, more idealistic.
00:32:30.000There's, for example, and you may not have heard of him, a politician called George Galloway, who's just been elected in the north of our country, who I would describe as a populist.
00:32:39.000He don't like the term leftist anymore.
00:32:41.000He's planning to stand enough candidates to cause a dent in the presumed majority of Keir Starmer's Labour.
00:32:50.000I wonder what you think When figures from the left that are populist are gaining traction, presumably in the case of Rochdale, among the Muslim community.
00:33:00.000I wonder what you think, Steve, about the necessity for cultural differences to be respected within these nativist projects, for when we say things like American communities and British towns, that's not coded to mean, oh, we don't like people that have got Different outfits on that is about working people respecting loving one another respecting native or Christian culture as well as The other cultures that you know live alongside them and but but perhaps more tactically and importantly I wonder if you consider that if you're in a war against the globalist establishment peripheral forces that transcend the former lexicon of left and right
00:33:42.000are going to have to be formed. There's people in my country like Andrew Bridgen who come out hard
00:33:46.000on the vaccine issue and has been kicked out of the Tory party. You've mentioned Nigel Farage and
00:33:51.000not to populate this nebulous question with further matter, but when you see the rise of
00:33:58.000Bobby Kennedy in your country, do you not feel that there is room for truly independent movement
00:34:07.000outside of the United Nations, whether much of their culture and heritage appears to be derived
00:34:12.000from the left or right, as long as it is genuinely about ordinary people from those countries?
00:34:18.000Look, George Galloway, I happen to know him and I met him, I think it was in Kazakhstan years ago when we were at a conference together speaking.
00:34:25.000He's a very, not just bright guy, I think he's one of the best orators out there.
00:34:30.000And so he's going to give a real voice to this.
00:34:32.000The one thing I think the difference in right-wing and left-wing populism, I think for populism like Bernie Sanders, we often have the same Directional approach to the elite, and particularly the taxation of the elite, how much they should own as far as assets go, etc.
00:34:47.000I think we differ in that we don't believe in more state ownership.
00:34:52.000We think there's a problem with state ownership of entities.
00:34:55.000One of the problems I think we have with the arms industry today and the biopharmaceutical industry, they're almost a nationalized industry.
00:35:02.000You've had Elite merger in that regard, not just elite capture.
00:35:07.000You have these quasi-state institutions.
00:35:10.000That's why biopharmaceutical industry is so powerful in the United States and particularly powerful with the progressive left because it underwrites it.
00:35:17.000It's the reason the defense industry is so all-powerful in our country.
00:35:21.000It's the reason we have a trillion-dollar Defense budget that we should never have.
00:35:25.000One trillion dollars just from one country we should never have.
00:35:27.000The one thing I do think differentiates the left and the right and I think the reason the populace left has a tough time getting traction here in the United States is this topic of immigration or migration or what we call here in the United States an invasion of 10 million illegal alien invaders.
00:35:43.000Bernie Sanders and the populace even as short as a decade ago We're more fervent than the Bush administration and the Country Club Republicans about keeping out migrants or economic migration because it drove down wages.
00:35:59.000The one thing that's happening today in the United States is the head of the Federal Reserve and the Biden regime are very open about Why they want so many migrants into the country, we call them illegal alien invaders, is to drive down the wages of working class African-Americans and Hispanics.
00:36:16.000That was their theory of the case to bring down inflation.
00:36:20.000And now, if you look at our budgets and all these massive deficits, They have baked in 10 million illegal alien invaders into the permanent economic model of the United States because they understand that these will drive down wages, and the more government assistance they get, even with the small wages, they spend almost every penny of it, and as you know, as somebody who's very focused on health,
00:36:42.000These folks, unfortunately, are the ones that buy the Cheetos and buy the Oreos.
00:36:46.000And they see that, the corporatist elite see that as a benefit.
00:36:49.000They've baked it into our gross national product that there's $7 trillion of economic benefit in our latest CBO report right to the illegal alien invaders.
00:37:00.000So they make it so that it's almost hard to take it out of the system.
00:37:04.000And the only people that get hurt are the people farthest down the chain.
00:37:07.000This is why, your audience should understand, Why do we have so many black men today that are looking to even give Trump a chance?
00:37:15.000And I'm saying not vote for Biden but even give Trump a chance or Hispanic men.
00:37:19.000It's just not the assault on the family or the assault on the male.
00:37:23.000They understand that they're now forced to compete with the entire world that we let in through this border and they're revolting against that.
00:37:31.000I think this is why you're seeing the Democrats are so freaked out.
00:37:34.000The elites are so freaked out because now our coalition is really taking some of the basic foundation of the AOC and Bernie Sanders left.
00:37:42.000The Bernie bros are coming to our side.
00:37:44.000To a large extent, if they can handle the culture, and we realize there are cultural differences, if they can come to our side.
00:37:49.000I think the same thing in England hasn't coalesced yet.
00:37:54.000In Galloway, remember, the one flying the ointment here As you said, cultures and societies as citizens living side by side.
00:38:30.000It's a problem to the fact that you almost can't talk about it in the United Kingdom.
00:38:34.000And it's going to be a problem here in the United States, the situation in Michigan.
00:38:38.000Where the folks in Dearborn, and I'm not saying they're all Sharia supremacists, but the Muslim community, the Arab community, refuse to vote for Biden and put him on notice because of Gaza and the handling of the situation, the Palestinians, they won't.
00:38:52.000It is mathematically impossible for the Democrats to take the White House or keep the White House in this regard if they don't win Michigan.
00:38:59.000And right now, President Trump's up eight points in Michigan.
00:39:02.000And that is because there's a significant amount of Arab Americans that are just saying, we don't support the Biden regime in this regard, and we're going to stay home.
00:39:10.000Yes, and Bobby Kennedy is also very popular in that state, and it does seem to be a significant interface in that particular campaign.
00:39:20.000There's just so many things I want to cover, Steve, but just let me touch on... Can I just say one thing about Bobby Kennedy?
00:39:27.000Because I think Bobby Kennedy started, and I I felt that although I'm a Kennedy Democrat as a little kid because of being Irish Catholic, when you just never even conceive, I come from a blue-collar working-class family, the conception that you would vote for a Republican would almost be like you would leave the church.
00:39:47.000Bobby Kennedy, I think, started out and had a tremendous message.
00:39:51.000That message was, I've never seen an individual with such clarity about the biopharmaceutical industry and the power it has exerted on modern society.
00:40:01.000He was, to me, the most powerful voice about techno-feudalism and what techno-feudalism really was about.
00:40:09.000I think, unfortunately, over his... I mean, fortunately, as a Trump supporter, because I'd always hoped that at one time we could actually blend the Kennedy movement, particularly the anti-vax part of it, which has a big portion of the MAGA base.
00:40:43.000Now unfortunately, I think Bobby and his team, as he got shut out by the Democratic Party
00:40:48.000and ran as an independent, he's almost run to the left.
00:40:51.000And so now, you're right, he's a dagger to the, particularly with Shanahan, I think it's Nicole Shanahan, his vice presidential pick, he's a dagger at the heart of the Democratic Party right now.
00:41:02.000He almost takes very few Trump voters, very few MAGA, even the strong anti-vax nature of our and the anti-biopharmaceutical industry part of the MAGA, which is a very large part, I think would pass on Bobby Kennedy now to support Trump very strongly.
00:41:18.000But Bobby Kennedy's a dagger at the heart of the Democratic Party.
00:41:22.000If Bobby Kennedy gets access, and they know this, this is why they're coming down on him so hard, if he gets access to the ballots, if he's on the ballot in those states, I think it's very hard mathematically.
00:41:33.000Given the coalition of Biden is not coming there, the under 35s are hesitant, the African American community, the male particularly, is hesitant, the Hispanic community is hesitant, the Arab American or the Muslim community is hesitant.
00:41:45.000His coalition is tough to come together with enthusiasm.
00:41:49.000You add Bobby Kennedy on top of that, I think it's a dagger to the heart of the neoliberal, neocon, Democratic Party.
00:41:56.000If we were to see the degree of subsidiarity that it appears to a degree that we both believe in, how can this be truly achieved when you have behemoths like the biopharma industry and the military-industrial complex?
00:42:12.000What do we do about the big tech monopolies and their evident, and indeed we've touched upon it, albeit fleetingly, ability to control and censor open conversation and free speech?
00:42:27.000Europe is starting, but I think you're seeing here, even in this TikTok debate, these entities have to, first of all, two things have to happen.
00:42:33.000Number one, you have to begin the breakup, like you broke up the Bell System and other massive communications platforms we have.
00:42:42.000These companies have to be broken up into smaller pieces.
00:42:44.000We have to get back to their entrepreneurial benefit, not almost their state capitalism controls.
00:42:50.000Number two, a whole series of rights, I think, people's digital selves Right now I think that people have a, you have an analog self and you have a digital self.
00:43:00.000The digital self is almost raped and pillaged economically.
00:43:03.000I think that that has to be much more controlled by the individual.
00:43:07.000That they're going to actually give those rights and those rights are going to have certain economic benefits to them.
00:43:14.000The other thing is I took a couple of simple things.
00:43:17.000Number one, I think all TV advertising, like for pharmaceuticals, and I think in Canada and Britain, you don't have it.
00:43:23.000In the United States, MSNBC and CNN is virtually, if you cut it on, it's virtually a little bit of news between a biopharmaceutical advertisement, right?
00:43:36.000I think all types of programming, all types of almost political support for that has to come away.
00:43:42.000You have to restrict your ability to advertise.
00:43:44.000You have to, and same with the defense industry.
00:43:47.000You cut on these Sunday shows and the thought-provoking shows in the United States, it's always Grumman, or it's always Northrop, or it's always the defense contractors.
00:43:57.000You have to get their money out of politics to have a fighting chance.
00:44:01.000Then we have to have very tough antitrust, and I mean antitrust to the last part of breaking it down.
00:44:06.000Now, the hardest part, and the one that overlays our entire conversation we haven't gotten into, maybe it'll be next time, this whole issue of transhumanism.
00:44:15.000We are literally, I think, five or six years away from the singularity, and that's just not AI.
00:44:21.000That's the convergence of CRISPR, biotechnology, quantum computing, advanced chip design, regenerative robotics, artificial intelligence, where on this side you have Homo sapien, you have humanity.
00:44:35.000On the other side, at minimum, you have Humanity Plus, or what they call Enhanced Man, and I actually think leading to Homo Sapien 2.0.
00:44:45.000That is the brightest line we've ever had in since recorded history.
00:44:49.000It's going to happen in your, not just your audience's lifetime, it's going to be a major political issue in the next three to five years.
00:44:56.000That's why we must break the tech oligarch state.
00:44:59.000I am a proud, what I call Neo-Luddite.
00:45:04.000I am all for, I would have treaties and stop this immediately because I think what's happening in transhumanism right now, led by artificial intelligence, and you see the flood to capital on artificial intelligence, well once that happens it gets out of control.
00:45:18.000There are things that are going to happen that are so far beyond the Shire's ability to control it, that it'll make a farce of everything else we're working on.
00:45:26.000All the other populist structures we put in it, things to try to get down to subsidiarity, it'll be overwhelmed by this.
00:45:31.000And I'm to the point, I believe with some of these guys that you have to have actual, if you need to, direct military intervention into data centers, water supplies that would supply this.
00:45:43.000What is happening behind the scenes in these big research labs, what's happening behind the scenes in these big companies, and what's happening overseas in places like South Korea, North Korea, Romania, Russia, China, the CCP.
00:45:57.000You have no idea how advanced some of this stuff is.
00:46:00.000Once it comes, it's going to be too late to control.
00:46:04.000On top of all the issues we have, trying to take back and not be tech-feudalistic, On top of that is really what could be the end of the human era.
00:46:15.000And I think that's why to be alive today is to say, hey, Divine Providence put me here for a reason, right?
00:46:21.000For every one of your audience members, what is that reason?
00:46:23.000And I think the greatest epoch in mankind's history in the, what, 10,000 years or 15,000 years or 20,000 years is about to be upon us, and I think in the next five.
00:46:34.000If we are indeed facing something as apocalyptic and izzypocal as the end of human supremacy and the ability to control reality at the scale that you've just described, don't our political and cultural affiliations that have either been formed around agriculture, i.e.
00:46:52.000monotheistic, Abrahamic faiths, or the political ideologies that have emerged from industrialisation, i.e.
00:46:59.000capitalism and all of its late and failing expressions, or socialism and all of its derivatives, somewhat redundant, and all and we be looking for extreme subsidiarity as local as possible, new alliances to oppose that potential immediately, because I believe you that it's a real threat.
00:47:19.000This is what I think you're awakening your show, other shows, War Room, and remember, we have a principally a conservative, blue-collar, deeply religious audience.
00:47:30.000They would rather watch Russell Brand and our audience watches you more than they watch Fox News, right?
00:47:37.000I think people Innately know something's up and that's why populism is getting to be that people are putting their time into populism and trying to put in time at the school boards, at the district level to take things back because they understand there's a dark specter that's over us.
00:47:54.000And the only way to combat that, you're not going to combat that with equal structures.
00:47:58.000It has to be, if it's going to be defeated, it has to be defeated by essentially an uprising of the Shire.
00:48:05.000I mean, is this not what Lord of the Rings was about?
00:48:07.000I mean, remember, Tolkien was, it was the trenches of World War I. We saw the inhumanity of the mechanized German army and what happened to the basic You know, British Tommy and those great, you know, working men that he'd seen from the Shire and the destruction and how much agony it caused when he went back home.
00:48:26.000That's what gave him the whole vision of it.
00:48:28.000That's to me the vision of the Neo-Luddite movement.
00:48:34.000I'm anti-out-of-control technology that could end mankind.
00:48:38.000And we're playing right now with fire and we're empowering Because it comes with so much money, and I just go back to... Remember, Chad GPT just happened.
00:48:47.000It was just revealed in Davos last year, 14 months ago.
00:48:51.000Right now, you have Sam Altman trying to raise $7 trillion, and people are not laughing.
00:48:56.000They're not saying he's going to raise it, but they're not laughing it off like it's ridiculous.
00:49:50.000I think I'm one of the leaders of the movement, and I can't really give you Any more depth and explanation than Russell Brand, who's also one of the leaders of this.
00:49:59.000So, it's all aborning right now, as humanity is under pressure to essentially be overwhelmed by enhanced humanity, controlled by the ultimate puppet masters.
00:50:13.000Well firstly Steve, we've got to brainstorm the name because even I bow to no one in my admiration for Ned Ludd and his attacks on industrialization and his understanding of what it was about to do to the peasant class of the United Kingdom but the Neo-Luddite movement you gotta You've got to come up with some more White House gear that's going to be a little more catchy.
00:50:33.000And also I want to point out this, while we're using image systems that are derived from early political structures, i.e.
00:50:41.000neo-feudalism and techno-feudalism rather, it seems to me that what we are actually being opposed by now is something that is a dark power, and yet Luciferian.
00:50:52.000We are talking about the apex of evil, potentially, and I believe that, as you indicated earlier, that to oppose that you're not going to be able to bolt something together from these sort of half-arsed, neoliberal, secularized, rationalistic structures.
00:51:06.000You're going to have to reach down into the very thing that makes us human, Our, the realization of the divine, the expression of God, God's self, living Christ on earth, transcendence of the individual self, and a willingness to sacrifice all in order to carry the great fight.
00:51:23.000Now, if we are gonna practice that kind of a war, doesn't it seem that economic models that are somewhat, if not arcane, arcane's not the right word, nostalgic, Are they going to be enough to get people up on their feet and out onto the street?
00:51:38.000And can I add to that question, do you really believe that Trump is about to impose the kind of demonopolising regulations that are required across the big tech, finance and military industrial complex spaces?
00:51:49.000Or will he, when in office, as he has been in 2016, ultimately find himself bound and held in the chokehold structures that exist only to perpetuate their own existence?
00:51:59.000But I believe sometimes, Steve, on both sides.
00:52:03.000If you want to know what a Trump presidency is going to be like, look at the Trump presidency there's always, there's already been.
00:52:09.000I feel that we have to break beyond these models and my willingness to even look at something as sanctified, though it need not be so, as the Westphalian treaty and the idea of nation is because we have got to unlock something extremely powerful, Steve, extremely quickly.
00:52:26.000Well, I think the first thing, you know, you gotta, look, it's about a process, right?
00:52:30.000We would love to be able to wish it away and wave a magic wand and have somebody come down and help us and do it.
00:53:00.000We have to, in the process, take care of first things first.
00:53:03.000The reality is we have to take care of the economic structures,
00:53:06.000and that's gonna be a battle all of its own.
00:53:09.000We have to also take of the connective tissue of all this, which is deep state or administrative state actors.
00:53:16.000On that note, I can tell you Trump's going to come in like a crusader from the 11th century.
00:53:23.000The thing about tech and all that, it's complicated.
00:53:27.000I know that even people that are with me in the populist movement, there's a lot of divergence about tech.
00:53:34.000A lot of people don't want to get too hard on that.
00:53:36.000I actually want to shatter it and get it back to human scale, even if we have to lose 40 or 50 years of potential innovation.
00:53:45.000I'm all for losing A generation of innovation, as long as this time we do it right and we don't let technology spin out of control, spin out of control of the people's ability to do it.
00:53:56.000And like I said, this is all, and I use Neil Luddite as the best term I can come up with, but you bring up a great point.
00:54:09.000I am 100% confident, not just in Trump returning to power, but that the populist movement in Europe and other places in the United States will start to take on the vested interests of corporate power and the financial power of the City of London and Wall Street.
00:54:25.000I tell everybody all the time, I am not overly optimistic on the issue about transhumanism and to take that on.
00:54:33.000And I'm a fighter that can often see the sunlit uplands.
00:54:36.000On this one, it's being formed right now and it's going to be a fight because the power in it is so ultimately powerful.
00:54:46.000It's so much money and power for these tech oligarchs to control essentially what it is to be human.
00:54:52.000What it means to have immortal life, what it means to actually be human, to create, to step into the purpose of God.
00:54:59.000Remember, I'm a Catholic, so as a believer in the Judeo-Christian West, I believe we're made in the image and likeness of God and the one thing I always refer to is the most difficult Verse in the New Testament in the Gospel of Mark, when the apostles, he sent the disciples, the apostles out very early in Mark to go out and to cure the blind and to heal the sick and to make the lame walk, and they come back to him and he said, how'd it go?
00:55:24.000And they go, it was good, we did all these things.
00:55:27.000But the people said, people were saying, We weren't good guys, and you weren't God.
00:55:32.000They were saying you were Beelzebub, and we're just taking the power of the devil and doing this.
00:55:37.000And Christ tells them, He says, hey, don't worry about what people call you.
00:56:26.000And this is what we're seeing right now.
00:56:27.000That fight is the central fight we have, but we have other battles we have to win in the process to take that on.
00:56:34.000Yes, because, in a sense, If it is a truly transcendent connection between man and God as established in the figure of Christ, it is by its nature atemporal and aspatial.
00:56:48.000Otherwise, the category of transcendent don't mean much at all.
00:56:52.000Therefore, these kind of revelatory epiphanies and declarations in the gospel must be referring to this very battle where The sanctified nature of man achieved through Christ's redemption is somehow collapsed by the absolute capture of consciousness that this transhuman experiment may yet represent.
00:57:15.000That's why it's so important, I believe, for us to be transcendent in our approach to political spaces, that we must indeed capture the hearts and the minds of entire populations rapidly, As well as challenging forces that are extremely powerful, but are, by your reckoning at least, about to become yet more powerful when this type of technology is married to the increasing centralized globalist authoritarianism that we're now facing.
00:58:18.000Like I said, there are many bigger picture issues that I'm just one small player in.
00:58:22.000I'm kind of like a field commander of one part of the army, of a vast legion.
00:58:27.000And I just know my task and purpose is to, here in the United States, is to assist President Trump in returning to power and grow the MAGA movement and make sure the MAGA movement, at least on a political scale here, begins the process of having the Shire start to take control back from our sociopathic overlords.
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