On this episode of Conspiracy Theories, we have special guest Mick West on the show to debunk the conspiracy theories about chemtrails and the Flat Earth theory. Mick is a writer, researcher, and author who has spent the last 20 years debunking these conspiracy theories. He s been in the business for a long time and has been involved in many conspiracy theories, including the one that has been going around for the past 20 years about the spraying of chemicals in the sky by the government. He s also the author of the book, "Escaping the Rabbit Hole" which is about how people get sucked into conspiracy theories and how they become interested in conspiracies. We talk about what he thinks is going on with conspiracies and why they re so popular and why we should all be interested in them. If you like conspiracy theories then this is the episode for you! If not, you ll have to wait until next week for the next episode where we have another conspiracy theory debunking special guest, the one you ve been asking for. Enjoy this week's episode of Mythology with Mick West! Subscribe to our new podcast, Mythology. Subscribe on Apple Podcasts! Subscribe on iTunes Learn more about your ad choices. Like, comment and subscribe to our other podcast, The Dark Side Of... We post polls, questions, thoughts and thoughts on all things related to this podcast and more! Send us your thoughts on anything else you like it! and let us know what your thoughts and opinions on the podcast and comments are we should we should post them on it on our next episode! on Podcoin or Insta- and we'll get a shoutout on the podCastlecast! tag=australia_castlecastle Subscribe? Thanks for listening to our podcast :) in the pod, <3 - Mick West - & Thank you for your support! - Tom Connolly Timestamps: - The Dark Lord - 5 stars - 7/27/19/8/28/29/9/30/ - Thank you, - 6/28 - 4/7/6/9 - 3/8 - Can you see it? - What s better than that? - 5/6 - I m looking forward to hearing from you? & so on ?
00:00:58.000Well, they don't have any fucking control of the weather, because if they did, they'd make it rain all over Santa Barbara and stop these fires.
00:01:04.000I mean, there's hundreds of millions of dollars worth of damage going on right now.
00:01:08.000There's a fire that's bigger than the city of Washington, D.C., They think they're making those fires.
00:01:12.000They think that's part of the conspiracy.
00:01:15.000Anything that happens is always part of the conspiracy.
00:01:34.000Especially since you're a government shell!
00:01:37.000Well, I'm doing research with a book I'm writing, which is called Escaping the Rabbit Hole, and it's about how people get into the rabbit hole and how people get out of the rabbit hole.
00:01:44.000So the whole thing is about the rabbit hole, which is something basically people get sucked into.
00:01:49.000And I think people do a lot of research into the reasons behind people getting into conspiracy theories, like the psychological reasons and the personality reasons and things like that.
00:02:00.000But I think most conspiracy theorists are just regular people.
00:02:04.000They're just ordinary people who get sucked into something.
00:02:27.000And then they start looking at another video, and another video, and another video, and Facebook and YouTube is feeding them these videos, because once you start going down that road, you just can't change your trajectory.
00:02:43.000I mean, YouTube, since they instigated this...
00:02:48.000Autoplay thing or instituted this autoplay thing or the next video plays immediately and they're all related.
00:02:55.000I think that's definitely been a thing with people and also like the suggestions on the right hand side if you're watching one video on a particular subject.
00:03:02.000Yeah, I was doing some experiments with that.
00:03:03.000I set up like a completely blank YouTube account and I would just go in there and type in one thing like contrails.
00:03:09.000And of course when you look at contrails on YouTube, like half the videos you're gonna get are gonna be chemtrail videos.
00:03:15.000And so if the first video you click on is a chemtrail video, then that just sets you down that road.
00:03:21.000Well, I remember this was in the days, I think, before YouTube.
00:03:27.000This was in the days when maybe YouTube was around, but it just wasn't that popular.
00:03:31.000I remember me and my friend Eddie were high as fuck, and we're talking to my neighbor, and there was some plane that was flying over, and we were wondering why the clouds...
00:03:41.000Coming from behind this plane stood so long.
00:03:44.000So I asked him, I used to have this neighbor, I used to call him Bling Bling, because Bling Bling was incapable of talking about anything other than objects.
00:03:53.000Like, oh, he'd talk about, oh, that's a nice car.
00:04:14.000I just remember how ironic it was because I had told Eddie about Bling Bling.
00:04:19.000You know, like, this is all this guy cares about and wants to talk about.
00:04:22.000And then he did that while we were out there.
00:04:24.000But I remember thinking, man, how weird would it be if all of a sudden clouds from jet engines Started appearing and it just appeared right before our eyes and we hadn't noticed it.
00:04:53.000Like, if they're actually spraying something in the sky, they live here, too.
00:04:57.000Like, what are they spraying themselves?
00:04:58.000Well, the theory now is that it's basically the power elite in the country is doing these chemtrails as a kind of last-ditch attempt to maintain power before the entire world collapses into chaos.
00:05:11.000So they think it's kind of like a desperate situation.
00:05:48.000So he's kind of saying the chemtrails are helping, but we've got to stop them, otherwise they'll make it even worse.
00:05:54.000But we're pretty much all going to die either way.
00:05:56.000Yeah, there's a lot of money and we're gonna die.
00:05:59.000There's a lot of people that love that that that trope it's just like something that gets carted out Constantly throughout history because it's true.
00:06:07.000You are going to die It's like when are you gonna die?
00:06:10.000You don't know so because you don't know you're freaking out like is it gonna be a car accident?
00:07:11.000Jet engines have water in their exhaust.
00:07:15.000If you look at a car on a cold day and you see the exhaust coming out of the tailpipe, you'll see like a cloud of condensation sometimes and you'll see some water coming out.
00:07:23.000And the exact same thing happens with jet engines.
00:07:28.000And when that exhaust hits the cold air, it condenses, it freezes, it makes a cloud.
00:08:03.000You've just got to look at the relative humidity at a certain altitude.
00:08:07.000There's lots of different sites you can go to.
00:08:08.000I've got a whole bunch of them listed on Metabunk.
00:08:11.000And just like the clouds vary in the sky, the amount of moisture varies in the sky as well, which is one of the reasons why you will see a jet pass through one area and you will see a contrail, and then it almost looks like they shut the contrail jets off,
00:08:27.000and then you see it pick up maybe a couple hundred yards later.
00:08:30.000Yeah, and that's, when you say like a cloud, it's really exactly the same as a cloud.
00:08:35.000If you look at any picture of a cloudy day and then just remove all the clouds, but they're still there as invisible clouds, then when the plane comes along, it's almost like the plane is this magic pen revealing these invisible clouds, because all a cloud is is a region of the sky where the humidity is above a certain level.
00:08:54.000So you know that the humidity is pretty patchy across the sky because there's a cloud here and right next to it there's no clouds.
00:09:00.000So where the cloud is, it's high humidity.
00:09:02.000Where the cloud isn't, it's low humidity.
00:09:04.000But if both of those were just lowered, like 10%, then you'd get no clouds at all.
00:09:09.000Then a plane comes along, it raises the humidity in the cloud area and in the non-cloud area.
00:09:15.000But this area, because it was a bit higher, you get a trail forming and this area you get no trail forming.
00:09:19.000So it's exactly the same as invisible clouds.
00:09:23.000Yeah, and for people that are watching it, and you're looking up, you think they're spraying something, if you're conspiracy-minded.
00:09:30.000And because of a lot of the videos that are out there, in particular, two that were recommended to me are, what in the hell are they spraying?
00:09:38.000So I got to meet with that guy that made those documentaries, and right away, I knew something was wrong.
00:09:44.000Like, he's either on Adderall or something.
00:11:10.000I'm like, how did you not put this together yourself?
00:11:14.000Like, if you're the guy who's making this video, and you're trying to find a reason why you could, you know, some facts that you could throw at people.
00:11:22.000We could say, hey, look, the government is definitely spraying things in the sky.
00:11:33.000How the fuck did he not look at it himself, is what I was thinking.
00:11:37.000And when me and him were having this conversation, I realized, like, you have these people that go down—they're not open-minded in regards to these subjects.
00:11:46.000They go down a very narrow road, and that road is, the government is doing something to me.
00:11:57.000So they're trying to find something, and actually trying to find an alternative explanation isn't really that attractive to them.
00:12:04.000So they find aluminum in the water or in the soil or whatever, and then they glom onto that as being evidence of geoengineering, and that's great for them because they can just find loads and loads of samples of soil.
00:12:16.000And that's something that gets repeated online, that very fact over and over again, the aluminum that they found in the water.
00:13:28.000It's not it's not gonna just sit up there like that It would it would be a very different experience It would slowly settle to the ground and wouldn't look like a cloud and there's no reason to do it There's no benefit whatsoever.
00:13:39.000There's no scientific evidence Ever uncovered ever that there's any benefit for anybody of spraying aluminum over people.
00:13:49.000That's the thing, even with the whole geoengineering field, there's really no solid evidence that it will work.
00:13:55.000We don't know what the side effects will be.
00:13:57.000We don't know how much we would need to spray, and we don't know, like, you know, when we stop doing it, will the world bounce back in a terrible way and it'll be a big disaster.
00:14:07.000Well, that's an interesting thing because one of the reasons why contrails are interesting to study is because they actually do have an effect on the temperature of the Earth.
00:14:17.000And this is something that we found out after 9-11.
00:14:20.000When September 11th happened in 2001, it was the big disaster, there was a shutdown on all flights in the United States.
00:14:30.000And when they did that, the temperature changed.
00:14:34.000Because these clouds literally do provide like a cover and do they act as an insulator or an escalator?
00:14:47.000They block incoming radiation during the day and they block outgoing radiation at night.
00:14:54.000But the net effect is that they actually block more outgoing radiation than they do incoming radiation.
00:15:00.000So if planes didn't fly at night, then you would cool the earth down.
00:15:06.000You'd have to stop flying quite a bit before night time.
00:15:10.000So if all the flights in the world were between like 5am and 5pm local time, then you could actually cool the world down by just not having any flights at night because it's the night flights that have this really big kind of blanketing effect that stopped the outgoing radiation.
00:15:24.000So the night of flights actually heat the world up.
00:15:42.000Yeah, the contrails will actually warm the planet because the amount of outgoing radiation they block is just way higher because of the wavelengths and the size of the particles and whatnot.
00:15:56.000So that's something to be concerned about.
00:15:58.000That's something that people are legitimately monitoring.
00:16:02.000What people need to understand is just because you feel like when you look up in the sky and you see these crisscross patterns that they're spraying you.
00:16:20.000They are actually talking about a way of using contrails for a kind of geoengineering.
00:16:24.000And this is something that people often get confused about because you see these two words together, contrails and geoengineering, and they think, oh, that's chemtrails.
00:16:31.000But what they're trying to do is use air traffic control and computers and weather forecasting to make it so the planes don't fly through the contrail-forming areas when they would make contrails at night and make it so they do fly through contrail-forming areas with contrails during the day.
00:16:49.000So this is a conversation they're having or something that's actually being...
00:16:52.000It's not something that they've actually done, but it's something that they can research fairly easily.
00:16:57.000So if they were considering trying to heat up the atmosphere or heat up the earth at night, they would just fly over these moisture-rich areas, and if they weren't, they would avoid them.
00:17:08.000But the goal, obviously, is to combat climate change, global warming, and cool the Earth down.
00:17:14.000So a relatively cheap way of doing that, to a degree, is to have these planes be controlled by computers.
00:17:23.000And it increases fuel costs for the airline by about 2% or 3% because they have to make very deviations, sometimes in height and sometimes in direction.
00:17:33.000But it could actually have a significant effect on the Earth's climate if we had the entire world's airline fleets all in this program where they would fly, making controls where they were needed and not making controls where they were not needed.
00:17:45.000And how exactly are they monitoring the moisture content of the atmosphere?
00:17:52.000They use sounding balloons, which are these weather balloons, basically, which got mistaken for UFOs quite a lot.
00:17:59.000And they use satellites, and they use planes sensing the environment when they're flying through it.
00:18:04.000And they use all these inputs, and it goes into a big computer model, which basically predicts what the humidity will be at any particular point.
00:18:14.000It's basically a big weather forecast for the upper atmosphere.
00:18:16.000Now, Jamie, Google CIA admits geoengineering, because this is one that the chemtrail believers constantly bring up.
00:18:28.000It was a conversation that some guy in the CIA had at some meeting where they were discussing potential future ways to use geoengineering.
00:18:46.000...often referred to collectively as geoengineering, that potentially could help reverse the warming effects of global climate change.
00:18:54.000One that has gained my personal attention is stratospheric aerosol injection, or SAI, a method of seeding the stratosphere with particles that can help reflect the sun's heat in much the same way that volcanic eruptions do.
00:19:15.000Why is that freaking out with the image and keep changing back to?
00:19:35.000A method of seeding the stratosphere with particles that can help reflect the sun's heat in much the same way that volcanic eruptions do.
00:19:43.000An SAI program could limit global temperature increases, reducing some risks associated with higher temperatures and providing the world economy additional time to transition from fossil fuels.
00:19:56.000This process is also relatively inexpensive.
00:19:58.000The National Research Council estimates that a fully deployed SAI program would cost about $10 billion yearly.
00:20:05.000As promising as it may be, moving forward on SAI would also raise a number of challenges for our government and for the international community.
00:20:13.000On the technical side, greenhouse gas emission reductions would still have to accompany SAI to address other climate change effects such as ocean acidification because SAI alone would not remove greenhouse gases from the atmosphere.
00:20:27.000On the geopolitical side, the technology's potential to alter weather patterns and benefit certain regions of the world at the expense of other regions could trigger sharp opposition by some nations.
00:20:41.000Others might seize on SAI's benefits and back away from their commitment to carbon dioxide reductions.
00:20:47.000And as with other breakthrough technologies, global norms and standards are lacking to guide the deployment and implementation of SAI and others.
00:21:14.000Yeah, you spray sulfur dioxide, which isn't exactly a reflective particle, but it acts like a nucleus for upper atmosphere, clouds and things like that.
00:21:24.000It's basically, like he said, the same thing a volcano does.
00:21:27.000When a volcano erupts, it spews a whole bunch of sulfur dioxide and various other things into the upper atmosphere.
00:21:33.000And that creates haze, basically, which blocks the incoming radiation and cools things down.
00:21:40.000Every time a big volcano goes off, you see a little dip in the Earth's temperature because of this blocking effect that it has.
00:21:48.000And so the theory is that you could do something similar, and you could do it by spraying things out of planes.
00:21:53.000But he's talking about things that we might do in the future.
00:21:57.000He uses the future tense, like we could do this, we may do this, the effects might be this.
00:22:03.000And he's talking about the possible geopolitical impacts of it, which are very significant.
00:22:09.000Like if one country is going to be spraying something that would cause, say, the monsoons to double in intensity or to halve in intensity in India...
00:22:19.000That could cause the deaths of millions of people from famine and flooding.
00:22:24.000This is what people think has happened with the big hurricanes in the United States.
00:23:13.000And they did actually experiment with this, I think back in the 70s or so.
00:23:17.000There was one experiment where they tried seeding a hurricane, but it ended up going somewhere else other than where they intended it, and it destroyed a whole bunch of houses.
00:23:27.000The problem with having a video like this is that this guy is admitting that they have looked into potentially spraying things into the air.
00:23:37.000No one has ever denied We've been looking into geoengineering for decades.
00:23:42.000It's been proposed in some sense for over 100 years, in a serious sense since the 70s.
00:23:49.000The other problem is he gave it initials.
00:24:35.000You want to look up and see the thing behind the jet and go, they started it, they're spraying, there's patchwork, look, there's haze all over us, which it does happen.
00:24:43.000You can have a clear sky and you have the right conditions and a bunch of jets fly over and all of a sudden it's very hazy.
00:24:49.000And that's the type of thing that's been reported since the Second World War or even earlier.
00:24:53.000The first contrails that were spreading out into clouds were reported in the 1920s.
00:24:57.000Yeah, well, I took some of these photos and I put them up, I think the last time we had this conversation, where you could see them from World War II. You could see these jets, and you see the contrails behind the jets.
00:25:43.000Well, the contrails are the ones that dissipate.
00:25:46.000So they don't have any basis for their belief.
00:25:49.000And the one thing I do, which you've probably seen, is that video where I go through all my old books on the weather, and I look up in each one of them, the section on contrails, and I read the bit in it that says contrails persist for hours sometimes, contrails sometimes spread out to cover the sky,
00:26:08.000And I go back from these books from the 1990s all the way back to the 1950s, and I've got books in the 1940s.
00:26:16.000And if you show people these actual books, it's a really powerful way of getting through to them because they've just assumed that contrails can't persist.
00:26:32.000Well, 90% of the people don't notice contrails until they hear about the chemtrail conspiracy theory.
00:26:40.000A lot of people, they will hear about it, and then the same day, they will go outside and look at the sky, and then that's the first time they've ever noticed these contrails.
00:26:48.000Even the people who are high-ups in the chemtrail movement, they only notice them when they hear about the theory.
00:27:12.000He's publishing these scientific papers about how the spraying coal ash, the waste products of burning coal in power stations, the spraying that in the upper atmosphere.
00:27:20.000He's actually got like three or four papers published.
00:27:23.000In these kind of pay-to-publish scientific journals.
00:27:27.000And that's kind of becoming a bit of a problem.
00:27:30.000Like this thing with Brennan, the CIA guy.
00:27:49.000Now, the problem with it is, when he's talking about possible solutions, and then people look up and they see these actual clouds that are created by jets, they assume this has already begun, that the government would not tell us about it.
00:29:42.000I understand people love these things, and I understand people don't trust the government.
00:29:47.000Those things completely make sense to me.
00:29:50.000But you've got to pay attention to what's real and what's not real.
00:29:53.000Because as soon as you don't do that, then all the real stuff that the government does, all the real stuff the government does, like these fucking roads they're going to build in Alaska right now through dangerous areas where they have salmon rivers, they're going to start doing mining.
00:30:28.000And they want to do this, and it's near a major salmon area where these salmon use this river, and people that live there are terrified that they're going to do this.
00:30:57.000They don't look at that and go, hey, here's clear evidence of the government being in bed with enormous businesses that stand to profit spectacular amounts of money.
00:31:08.000From risking the environment and risking these very delicate salmon fisheries.
00:31:13.000Yeah, and that type of thing is the exact reason why I still spend so much time debunking stuff like conspiracy theories.
00:31:20.000Because I think that so much of conspiracy theories, the effect of conspiracy theories is distracting people from real issues.
00:31:30.000Like you say with the airplane stuff, like if people are thinking they're spraying chemicals out of the back of the airplanes, they're just not going to be worried about...
00:32:11.000And one of the reasons why I believe that is because of the formation of the single bullet theory.
00:32:15.000And the single bullet theory was formed because the fact that they had to account for one bullet that hit the underpass, ricocheted off, and put some man in the hospital.
00:32:25.000And that before that they did not have an explanation for why all of these bullets, bullet holes, all these wounds were in all these different people's bodies.
00:32:35.000The other reason why I'm inclined to believe there's a conspiracy was the fact that they found that bullet on Connelly's gurney when they brought him into the hospital.
00:32:43.000It's too convenient and the bullet itself is fairly pristine.
00:32:47.000Now knowing as much as I know about bullets from personal experience of hunting, You can't hit anything with a bullet.
00:32:53.000I pulled a lot of bullets out of animals.
00:32:55.000When you shoot an animal and you hit bone, those bullets, they distort brutally.
00:33:01.000I mean, they don't look like that if they go through two people and hit all sorts of bone.
00:33:06.000That's the bullet that came out of Connelly's body, or Connelly's gurney, excuse me.
00:33:11.000And that's the bullet that they're attributing to this single bullet theory.
00:33:15.000If you look at the path of the bullet, That goes through Kennedy and then goes through Connolly.
00:33:33.000It is believable to me because I know that bullets do strange things when they hit things.
00:33:37.000Right, but you've got to combine that with the fact that the bullet came out fairly pristine, which means it didn't actually go through a kind of a bouncy path like that.
00:34:15.000There's also the fact that there was particles, there was more metallic particles from the bullets, more fragments from the bullet in Connelly's body than were missing from the bullet.
00:34:28.000I do not believe that was the bullet and I think that that is a very reasonable assumption.
00:34:53.000When you shoot those bullets into water or you shoot those bullets into like fluff or something like that that doesn't have a lot of impact to slow the bullet down, then you get a bullet that looks like that.
00:35:04.000If you shoot a bullet into bone, they distort wildly.
00:35:07.000But the bone was the last thing that it hit.
00:35:18.000The odds of it hitting only soft tissue and it's going to go through his neck and it came out here that didn't clip one of his vertebrae or something like that, I don't think that's real.
00:35:28.000I think also there's a difference between, and this is fact, from David Lifton's book, Best Evidence, which was a book by an accountant who went over the Warren Commission report and found all these factual inaccuracies and all these contradictions.
00:35:46.000He found that there was a difference in the autopsy report at Bethesda, Maryland, the Bethesda Naval Hospital, versus what they had reported on the scene in Dallas.
00:35:58.000The first doctors that got a hold of Kennedy's body in Dallas before they flew him to Bethesda said that the hole in his neck was an entry wound.
00:36:07.000When they got to Maryland, they changed that to a tracheotomy hole.
00:36:13.000They changed the impact, and they said that this was not an impact from a bullet, that it was from something else.
00:36:21.000Yeah, someone said they enlarged the hole to insert a trach tube.
00:36:26.000Yeah, well, I think, well, there was also a lot of pressure on these people to try to wrap this up nice and tight and say that Lee Harvey Oswald was the shooter.
00:37:37.000Did you see the most recent dump of information on the Kennedy assassination that Jack Ruby had stated to people that before the day of the Kennedy assassination, keep an eye out today, there's gonna be fireworks?
00:38:09.000Whereas he could be just talking about he was going to go visit his ex-wife or something, or he was going to go to the bar, or he was looking forward to shouting at the parade or whatever.
00:38:18.000People say things, and after something happens, people go back and they look at everything that happened, and then they say, well, that sounds like something significant.
00:38:36.000And this was like half an hour before the actual shooting itself.
00:38:40.000So people take that event and then, you know, since a lot of people did die, they think that this woman actually knew what was going to happen and she was trying to warn people.
00:39:37.000It's not like this woman was saying specifically, someone is going to shoot everyone at this concert, get out of here, this is a dangerous area.
00:39:45.000If she was trying to warn them, she would have been a bit more specific.
00:41:13.000And it would have distorted the bullet.
00:41:14.000That's just what happens with bullets.
00:41:16.000See, unfortunately, I don't really follow JFK. Conspiracy very much and the reason I don't is that there are already like I think literally over a thousand books Mm-hmm.
00:41:35.000But I was like this guy's got an agenda.
00:41:37.000It just didn't it There's many books that you could read about the Kennedy assassination, and some of them favor the conspiracy, and some of them favor the assassination.
00:41:48.000I think a lot of them have merit on both sides.
00:41:52.000One thing that drives me crazy was people say that you could never make that shot.
00:42:23.000The reason why I think that's bullshit is because it's easy to knock a scope off.
00:42:26.000You have to have a direct chain of evidence.
00:42:28.000Between the time Lee Harvey Oswald had that scope shooting that rifle, the moment he shot that rifle, and then you have to hand it off to someone who checks the scope right then.
00:42:38.000Because if you drop a rifle, the scope goes off.
00:44:09.000I'm not like the I Believe Every Conspiracy guy.
00:44:12.000I think people have a real weird vested interest in proving that things are a conspiracy.
00:44:19.000I'm interested in finding out what things really are, like legitimately what they really are.
00:44:24.000And even if I'm wrong, like I'm not interested in reinforcing things I've already said.
00:44:31.000If I find out that what I said was wrong, I'm interested in repeating that I was wrong as many times as I can to get it out to as many people as I can.
00:44:40.000So this JFK thing, there's bullshit on both sides of it.
00:44:44.000But the idea that this guy who went over to Russia, married a Russian citizen, came back here, was, I mean, he was absolutely involved in some shady, weird shit with Cuba.
00:45:50.000You can even point to somebody and say there is somebody there and they'll think there's somebody there later because the brain is so chaotically working, it forms memories in a very weird way.
00:46:01.000Especially when it comes to something that's so significant, like the president getting shot or any sort of violent thing.
00:46:07.000Now, this is something that gets repeated ad nauseum about 9-11.
00:46:11.000It's something that people point to where they think that When the planes hit those buildings, that there was detonations that caused Tower 1 and Tower 2 to fall.
00:46:19.000There's no way they would have fallen like that.
00:46:22.000When people say, no, they heard things in the buildings, they heard explosions, people always say shit like that.
00:46:28.000And on top of that, if you're dealing with a building collapsing like that, you're going to hear a lot of crazy shit.
00:46:56.000And then the more he started looking into Tower 7, the more he realized that everyone is just showing the very final video where Tower 7 collapses like a controlled demolition.
00:47:07.000And it looks exactly like a controlled demolition.
00:47:10.000However, if you find the full video, you see that the interior had collapsed moments before, like quite a bit before.
00:47:19.000Edward Currant, I think, is the guy who did that video.
00:47:22.000See if you can find that gentleman's video.
00:47:25.000But he shows how the top of it, you can see the top of Tower 7 give in, which is consistent with this idea that the diesel fuel that they had in the basement had created, wasn't it like diesel tanks?
00:47:39.000Yeah, that was an early theory of the diesel fuel, that that was actually fueling the fire.
00:47:43.000But they never found any evidence that actually the diesel fuel contributed to the fires.
00:47:48.000It was just regular office fires, which is what everybody finds so suspicious.
00:49:37.000The fire is what triggered the collapse eventually, but the fact that all the windows were missing from the south side contributed a lot to that, because you got a lot of wind flow through.
00:50:30.000So this is not a quick thing like a controlled demolition.
00:50:34.000All those windows giving in is indicative of all those floors collapsing probably more than it is.
00:50:41.000The idea of, you know, the people that want to see conspiracy think that those bombs were going off there, and that as those detonations or explosions were going off, that that's what caused all those floors to collapse on top of each other.
00:50:54.000Yeah, I think that's what I was talking about with the core beliefs of the conspiracy theories with 9-11, this fact that World Trade Center 7 looks like a controlled demolition is its core belief.
00:51:04.000But when you actually get into something and describe what's actually happening, you have to go to a much more complicated conspiracy theory and a much more complicated way of looking at what actually happened.
00:51:14.000And now they're trying to do a complicated study of World Trade Center 7 at the University of Alaska.
00:51:22.000This is something paid for by architects and engineers for 9-11 Truth.
00:51:25.000They're trying to actually figure out how they can reconcile controlled demolition with the fact that it collapsed the way it did.
00:51:34.000So they're trying to actually explain something which doesn't really need explaining because the explanation has been done by NIST already.
00:51:40.000So what they're trying to do is find something that reinforces their initial idea instead of just look at the facts itself saying, If you look at the top of the penthouse collapsing, that's not indicative of a controlled demolition.
00:51:53.000That's indicative of the model that NIST described, which is a slow burn inside, extremely hot, deterioration of all the internal structure.
00:52:02.000Everything starts to collapse inside and then the outside collapses too.
00:52:05.000Yeah, well some of them will say that that is actually how controlled demolitions are done.
00:52:08.000You blow up the interior of the building first and then you blow up the exterior of the building.
00:52:13.000But the problem is that none of the exterior columns were cut.
00:52:17.000There was no explosion seen on the exterior columns.
00:52:20.000If you look at the World Trade Center 1 and 2 coming down, you can kind of imagine there are explosions going all the way down because there's things that look like explosions from the falling floors.
00:52:28.000But in 7, you just see the building kind of just kind of crumple down.
00:52:40.000And they're trying to come up with an explanation that doesn't involve fire.
00:52:44.000So they're saying, like, if it was controlled demolition, then the way they would have done it is blowing up these interior columns and it would have pulled in the exterior and collapsed the way we see in the video.
00:52:57.000And I think that some of them say that the penthouse thing was a separate thing.
00:53:01.000Because they wanted to have a neat demolition.
00:53:03.000So they first of all blew up a few floors just underneath the penthouse.
00:53:06.000So it neatly collapsed inside the building.
00:53:08.000And then they blew up some floors at the bottom.
00:53:11.000So it all fell in on itself without damaging the surrounding buildings too much.
00:53:18.000It's based on confirming this idea that this is a controlled demolition, not on examining the whole thing as it is and going, OK, is it possible that the NIST model is correct?
00:53:30.000The thing that I bring up to people all the time when they want to talk about conspiracies, there's a real conspiracy in 9-11 and that's the fact that it happened.
00:53:37.000The fact that they did fly planes into buildings, that's a conspiracy and they pulled it off.
00:53:47.000They want it to be a much broader conspiracy involving world governments that are trying to close in on all our rights and this is the way to do it.
00:54:48.000And planes are made of mostly aluminum.
00:54:51.000So they don't understand how a plane made of aluminum, which is soft, can go through steel, which is very hard and strong.
00:54:59.000And the example I always give to them is the ping-pong ball going through a ping-pong paddle.
00:55:05.000If you make it go fast enough, this is something I think Mythbusters do and various other people have done, you send a regular ping-pong ball 500 miles an hour into a ping-pong paddle and it just goes straight through it, leaves a ping-pong ball hole in the middle of it.
00:55:20.000And that's just what happened on 9-11.
00:55:21.000The planes were going at 500 miles an hour.
00:55:23.000I didn't know you could do that with a ping-pong ball.
00:56:43.000But the fact that it was blank didn't stop that air from blowing through.
00:56:49.000There's a thing that people do when they hunt in Alaska.
00:56:54.000And in incredibly moist climates and places where there's a lot of dirt and debris, they will put tape over the top of the rifle, over the end of the barrel where the bullet comes over.
00:57:07.000And it has no effect whatsoever on the accuracy of the bullet because the air coming out of the rifle barrel from the explosion blows that tape out before the bullet even gets to it.
00:57:21.000The only reason they have to have that thing right at the end of the barrel is the ping pong ball would slow down so rapidly in the air because it's so light.
00:57:30.000If you shot something a little bit heavier but still pretty small, it will go through it.
00:58:13.000I think this is a problem with a lot of these theories is that a lot of the people that are involved in these theories are either not educated in what they're talking about because there are some various nuances to things like this ping pong ball trick or They don't want to be.
00:58:34.000They don't want to look at anything that takes away from this conspiracy.
00:58:40.000They don't want to look at anything that debunks or disproves.
00:58:43.000They just want confirmation of their initial idea that this is some big, grand conspiracy.
00:58:49.000That someone is in on it and it's happening right before our eyes.
00:58:53.000Yeah, it's quite hard to even get one point past a lot of people.
00:58:59.000If someone starts out with that theory that aluminum cannot cut steel, then that just becomes the gatekeeping obstacle that you have to get past.
00:59:10.000If you can't disprove that one thing, nothing else matters really for them because the plane couldn't have entered the building, therefore everything is a conspiracy.
00:59:18.000So you kind of have to address these things.
00:59:22.000And it's important for people before they decide that this is, you know, that the government's spraying things in the sky or that the world is flat or whatever these things are.
00:59:31.000It's important to look at all the evidence.
00:59:34.000These YouTube videos, one of the real problems with them is that they get to play out without being interrupted, much like a podcast, unfortunately.
00:59:44.000Grand statements without anyone who's an expert stepping in and stopping them and saying, well, that's not true, and here's why it's not true, and here's why you can prove that it's not true, which would just derail most of these conspiracy theories really quickly.
00:59:58.000Yeah, and that's kind of the brainwashing aspect of these videos.
01:00:18.000And if you're into something and you get sucked into it and you've got this really interesting theory and it's like all these revelations, like, oh my God, I'm getting the real skinny on the world.
01:00:54.000I would go outside and I would try to find those things streaking across the sky.
01:01:01.000What it was was that there was a video that was made called Roswell Rods and it was trying to say that there was these bugs Like things that looked like jellyfish that were flying through the air so fast the naked eye couldn't see them but they would catch them on video cameras.
01:01:15.000And then finally someone figured it out that what it really was was you could have an HD camera right next to a standard definition camera and the standard see those things flying across the sky.
01:01:27.000It's just a video artifact when the camera cannot pick up Those bugs, it elongates them and streaks them across the camera.
01:02:00.000Yeah, it's so hard when it's actually been proven and you've got this conclusive proof and yet there are still loads and loads of people who believe in rods and orbs.
01:02:09.000Look how he was describing that it looks.
01:02:11.000Yeah, it's like some kind of alien jellyfish.
01:02:14.000That's so fast, it flies through the air faster than you can see.
01:02:18.000Yeah, I mean, the problem is these guys have a vested interest in it being real.
01:02:22.000He's motivated, and not necessarily by money.
01:02:24.000They're just motivated because once they believe something, they feel like they're privy to this special knowledge.
01:02:30.000It's just gonna be such a letdown if they're wrong.
01:02:38.000Well, I just tried to start out with the assumption that people are not, you know, they're basically good people and they're not trying to make money.
01:02:45.000Well, I think they also get caught up in the business of whatever it is.
01:02:49.000You know, if you're in the UFO business and then someone comes along and shuts down your business, you're going to try to, well, let me sort of, they're not going to look at it objectively.
01:02:59.000They're going to go, I want to keep my business alive.
01:03:51.000They say they have thousands of architects and engineers actually signing the petition.
01:03:57.000I think they have maybe a few hundred working structural engineers.
01:04:04.000What do you think of their take on it?
01:04:08.000Their take is kind of like the standard of 9-11 truth.
01:04:12.000They think that it's controlled demolition and they think they have all this evidence for controlled demolition, but it's not very good evidence.
01:04:21.000One of the experts is a high school physics teacher.
01:04:26.000And, you know, he's probably fairly good at high school physics, but he just makes some very simple mistakes about physics of the falling towers, and they repeat this on their website, unquestioningly.
01:04:40.000There's another guy who's, like, the expert on the nanothermite residue that was found.
01:04:46.000You know, they think that these red and grey specks of what looks like paint and rust was actually nanothermite.
01:04:56.000An expert on their site, he gets to say whatever he likes and he's got this one theory about how the bits of steel that flew out of the building had these nanothermite rockets attached to them, which is why they were leaving these trails of smoke behind when they fell down.
01:05:12.000And these are things that are just pretty ridiculous and you can kind of...
01:05:16.000Debunk them with physics, but they'll have none of it because they've got their experts saying something.
01:05:45.000The president has this ridiculous demonstration that he does where he holds up two cardboard boxes and underneath one of them there's empty space and underneath the other one there's a tower and he drops them and this one falls to the ground and this one bounces off the cardboard box and he's basically saying this is what should have happened.
01:06:03.000This upper portion should have stopped on the way down, and he's using these cardboard boxes as a demonstration.
01:06:10.000But they're ridiculous oversimplifications of what actually happened.
01:06:16.000Yeah, I don't know too much about the engineers' take on things, you know, from architects and engineers.
01:06:24.000I really didn't bother getting into it too much.
01:06:27.000But I just do know that it's several hundred people, if not over a thousand, and they're all over the world.
01:06:34.000But how many people have studied it that disagree with them?
01:06:40.000And how good are the architects and engineers that are in...
01:06:43.000I mean, there's a lot of architects and a lot of engineers in this world.
01:06:46.000Yeah, they recently tried to get a motion passed at the American Institute of Architects, which was basically a reopened World Trade Center 7. And they went to the convention and they stood up and they gave their speeches and gave all their evidence about why,
01:07:06.000The investigation should have been reopened, and they took a vote, and I think it was about something like 97% to 3% against doing this.
01:07:15.000So of the architects who were actually there, these professional architects, 97%, I can't remember the exact figures, but it's around that, voted against this.
01:07:26.000Yeah, even though there are thousands of signatures to the AE911 petition who are actually architects, When you actually look at the actual millions of architects that are out there in the world, it's a very small fraction of that.
01:07:41.000Right, but how many of those millions have studied it?
01:07:45.000I would like to see someone who's like a real, legitimate, top-of-the-food-chain architect from the debunking side view it from someone who is absolutely all in as conspiracy.
01:07:58.000Lots of people have done various studies on 9-11, the collapses of the building.
01:08:03.000There was a book by a guy from London, I think it's called Feng Fu, Chinese guy from London who wrote a book on progressive collapses in large buildings.
01:08:15.000It came out last year, 2016, and it discusses why buildings haven't collapsed, why the World Trade Center towers collapsed, amongst a whole bunch of other buildings, why we either collapsed or didn't.
01:08:26.000So there are lots of people who do actually study it.
01:08:29.000And within AE 9-11, architects and engineers for 9-11, the vast majority of them have not studied it.
01:08:37.000If you look at their position statements, everybody who joins it writes a little statement which goes on the website.
01:08:44.000They'll say things like, I watched loose change and that opened my eyes.
01:09:59.000And he believes that there is a neurotoxic quality to Lyme disease that affects the way you see things.
01:10:04.000It even causes hallucinations, and he witnessed it himself.
01:10:07.000He said, I hallucinated and saw something crawling across the surface of my eyeball in the mirror, but it wasn't a real thing.
01:10:15.000I couldn't see it after I looked at it again.
01:10:17.000It was gone, but I did see it for a moment, and he's convinced that Lyme disease, when you catch Lyme disease, You're not necessarily catching...
01:10:27.000It's not like you have Tylenol, something that's isolated.
01:10:32.000When you get Tylenol, you're getting Tylenol.
01:10:34.000He's like, when you get bit by a tick that has Lyme disease, you could get a host of pathogens.
01:10:41.000And there's what tests positive for Lyme disease.
01:10:45.000It's very tricky to find someone to...
01:10:47.000Yeah, but this doctor, this one guy, William Harvey, he's a guy who thinks he has Morgellons or he thinks he has chronic Lyme.
01:10:54.000Well, he definitely has chronic Lyme, and he thinks that what Morgellons is is a side effect of chronic Lyme where people start thinking there's fibers growing out of their skin.
01:11:03.000And so they think that fibers that come from their clothes or carpets, they get stuck to someplace they've been itching because they open up a wound, and that they start misinterpreting that as being something that's grown out of their skin.
01:11:18.000Yeah, well, I would agree with that part of it.
01:11:26.000He's a Morgellons guy in the fact that he has seen the hallucinations, but because of the fact that he's a doctor and scientifically minded, he believes that he's watching his own mind play tricks on him, and he thinks there's neurotoxic qualities to whatever the pathogens that are in Lyme disease are.
01:12:02.000There's post-Lyme syndrome and chronic Lyme, which some people think there's a chronic infection, and other people think there's just chronic effects left over from having Lyme disease for a long time.
01:12:13.000I think there's a lot of variabilities.
01:12:15.000I think we'd probably have to really consult an actual Lyme disease doctor on this.
01:13:31.000I think a problem with a lot of these medical conditions is that they're clinical diagnoses, which means that they're diagnosed not with tests that you can do of blood and things like that, but it's based on the symptoms.
01:14:15.000Self-diagnosis Yeah, and with Morgellons, that happens a lot.
01:14:22.000People get old, your joints start to ache, your hair starts to fall out, and your eyes start to, you know, you're losing your vision, your focus.
01:14:31.000And people think, what's wrong with me?
01:14:33.000And they don't realize they're just getting old.
01:14:34.000And they look it up and they think they have Morgellons.
01:14:40.000People just, if they're getting ill for some reason, they like to attribute their chronic condition to something.
01:14:47.000So they might tag on to a particular thing like chronic Lyme if they got bit by a tick, like last summer, and then this summer now they have all these problems, they might self-diagnose as having chronic Lyme.
01:15:01.000It is possible, but you do realize there's a tremendous amount of Lyme disease in the Northeast in particular.
01:15:06.000Oh yeah, Lyme disease is a very real thing.
01:15:56.000But the noises kind of sound like cicadas.
01:16:01.000And so it could have been, like, one guy waits over the middle of the night, there's a cicada in his room, jumps out of bed, cicada goes quiet.
01:16:08.000And if you ever tried tracking a cicada in your yard, you know, you get close to them and they go quiet, so you've got to start moving.
01:16:14.000So he gets back into bed, cicada starts buzzing again.
01:17:55.000It seems to me that if they're broadcasting it, and this is something that, you know, the government's talking about it, they're investigating it, all these different people are investigating it, it seems like there's enough evidence that they're concerned.
01:18:08.000Yeah, but everyone's reporting different things.
01:18:11.000Stressful conditions, not sonic weapon, sickened U.S. diplomats.
01:18:15.000Cuba panel asserts, yeah, you can't listen to that.
01:18:32.000After a nine-month probe hampered by a lack of access to medical records, a panel of Cuban scientists today declared U.S. diplomats here likely suffered a collective psychogenic disorder Huh.
01:19:19.000They can't even figure out CTE in players.
01:19:22.000Yeah, but who knows what caused this and how many people actually had it.
01:19:26.000If one guy has changes in the white matter of his brain, who knows what that's actually due to.
01:19:32.000Doctors treating victims of the attack, though, have found visible, perceptible damage to the patient's brains, marking the first solid evidence that sophisticated weapon described by embassy staff is entirely real, the Associated Press reports.
01:19:47.000Says the Associated Press, based on what?
01:19:48.000Based on someone at the State Department saying, we have found some damage somewhere.
01:19:54.000You know, the State Department is covering their ass.
01:19:56.000The State Department expelled Cuban diplomats because of this.
01:20:08.000They took some Americans away from the embassy because they were sick.
01:20:12.000And so they said the Cubans didn't protect the Americans well enough, so you're going to have to send six people back as well.
01:20:19.000See, it says the State Department of the FBI officials...
01:20:24.000Oh, it's so unlike anything the State Department and the FBI officials have ever seen that the Cuban government's claim the high-pitched whirring sounds reported by the U.S. Embassy staff are just cicadas.
01:21:42.000Yeah, and I think probably something happened, like, you know, some guy heard something and jumped out of bed and it stopped, and then got back into bed and it started again, and someone else...
01:21:52.000That's funny, because if you were in Cuba, and they didn't want you there, and you heard weird noises, you're like, God damn it, they're attacking me with a sound ray.
01:22:00.000And people are being harassed in Cuba.
01:22:03.000Like, if you work at the American Embassy, you get harassed.
01:22:06.000New sonic attack against American diplomats suggests Russian involvement.
01:22:12.000The Russians did it through Twitter bots.
01:22:15.000When you click on the Twitter bots, they send sound through your earbuds.
01:22:21.000Yeah, people are saying like, you know, linking the cicadas causing the hearing loss.
01:22:25.000But no one's actually saying the cicadas are causing people to lose their hearing.
01:22:29.000They're just saying that, you know, people sometimes get reductions in their hearing as they get older.
01:22:35.000And maybe they're noticing it because they're focusing on it so much.
01:22:39.000That's what happens with all these diseases.
01:22:41.000People think, I'm sick, and then they focus on something.
01:22:43.000Like, if you feel like you're itching a bit and you think you've got some kind of weird pathogen under your skin, you're just going to itch more and more.
01:22:50.000You're going to feel more and more itching.
01:23:41.000Psychosomatic illnesses are absolutely very real.
01:23:43.000And there's a thing called sick building syndrome, which is possibly a real thing and possibly a psychogenic thing.
01:23:52.000But a lot of people think that sick building syndrome, a lot of the times when it happens, it's like when lots of people working in the same place get similar symptoms.
01:24:01.000It's happening because of this mass psychogenic illness.
01:24:04.000One person says, I feel sick, and everyone kind of assumes it's something in the environment around them that's causing that, and so they kind of feel sick as well.
01:24:13.000There's a disease that I had heard of.
01:24:18.000And that is when people go to visit people who have schizophrenia, if they hang out with those people, they start developing very bizarre behavior of their own.
01:24:29.000And sometimes they have to be monitored.
01:26:05.000But it really does put you in a very unusual state.
01:26:09.000And when you get out of it, you can go through a lot of stuff that you have maybe cluttering around inside your mind and reorganize after a hypnotic session.
01:26:19.000There's a reason why people use it for quitting smoking and things along those lines.
01:26:25.000Yeah, well, this just shows how malleable the human brain is.
01:26:28.000And it goes back to that whole thing with being brainwashed by YouTube.
01:26:32.000People make documentaries in a way to hypnotize people.
01:26:37.000They structure it in a way that you get these images coming at you and these ideas and this reinforcement of things in a way that will actually just kind of embed this idea in your brain without you even really realizing it.
01:26:53.000Yeah, they'll say things like, you are being lied to.
01:26:55.000The thing that kills me, too, is that they use, oftentimes, a hypnotic voice.
01:29:42.000Yeah, the science experiments that supposedly proved the earth wasn't moving.
01:29:46.000That one's hilarious to me because when I first brought it up to Eddie, Jamie pulled this up and sent it to me the other day.
01:29:53.000I first brought it up to Eddie from like eight years ago on the podcast, one of the really early podcasts when we still did it in my house on a couch.
01:30:02.000And he's like, what's the most ridiculous conspiracy theory you heard?
01:31:32.000He wrote, the reason why Tenth Planet Jiu-Jitsu is named Tenth Planet Jiu-Jitsu, I actually came up with the name, and one of the reasons why I came up with the name is because we were talking about Zechariah Sitchin.
01:31:46.000And the idea is that this came from another planet.
01:31:51.000We actually came up with the name before Pluto had been changed from, you know, they had...
01:32:00.000So we decided that this jiu-jitsu is coming from another planet, like out there where the Anunnaki live.
01:32:05.000But it was based on Zachariah Sitchin's book, The Twelfth Planet.
01:32:09.000And his book was all about Planet Nibiru and that the Sumerian texts...
01:32:16.000Where when you decipher them correctly, they all describe this ancient race that came from this other planet that has this elliptical orbit that comes in between Earth and Mars and Jupiter?
01:33:17.000What I disbelieve is people that are in contact with aliens.
01:33:21.000I think the idea, you know, the Fermi Paradox, right?
01:33:24.000The idea that there's so many planets and so many galaxies and so many solar systems at the odds of life being out there so high, why have we not been contacted?
01:36:42.000They will be hundreds, thousands, or millions of times more powerful than humans in terms of their processing power and hundreds of times more powerful in terms of their strength.
01:36:55.000Yeah, because it's going to be an explosive thing.
01:36:56.000There's this thing in AI now called...
01:37:02.000I'll write it down because I forgot what it was.
01:37:04.000Generative Adaptive Networks, which is this way of doing AI where the robots basically teach themselves.
01:37:11.000They have one robot who is judging things, and there's one robot that's creating things.
01:37:16.000And the robot that's creating things teaches the robot that's judging things how to judge, and the robot that's judging things teaches the creating robot how to create.
01:37:25.000And then they just go back and forth, back and forth.
01:37:27.000The old way of doing AI was like you would teach a robot to do things and you'd correct it when it gets wrong and you'd tweak the algorithm.
01:37:33.000But now you've got these robots that are learning things incredibly rapidly by teaching themselves how to do things.
01:37:39.000And the humans who are running these robots don't actually understand how this actually works.
01:37:45.000You end up with this huge big matrix of numbers which no one can actually decipher but the results come out of it.
01:37:54.000They've got things like now where you can take a scene in a video and you can turn night into day or you can turn a snow scene into a summer scene because the AI knows how to do these things.
01:38:08.000And this is just the tip of the iceberg.
01:38:10.000There's so much more coming down the line.
01:38:12.000Yeah, I saw something that was incredibly disturbing.
01:38:14.000They said that when robots become sentient, like when they have the ability to make up their own decisions and do things for themselves, the first thing they're going to do is improve upon their own design.
01:38:28.000And they will be able to have 10,000 years of human, like if humans were evolving technology, a robot or a sentient AI could do 10,000 years worth of technological advancement in two weeks.
01:38:58.000It's probably a little bit optimistic in terms of like actual physical development because they can't make prototypes fast enough to try them out.
01:42:03.000I asked you the other day, like, what's the AI gender going to be?
01:42:06.000Has anyone decided or has it been talked about?
01:42:09.000Maybe that's what's going on with all this crazy push to accept 78 different gender pronouns and non-binary people and all this stuff that didn't exist in the past.
01:42:20.000Maybe there's like a natural inclination in the human species to move towards a genderless prototype of the future.
01:42:30.000We went into this in depth yesterday under the influence, obviously.
01:42:34.000We did a podcast where we were talking about what an alien is, the archetype alien with the big head and the very thin body and the mouth that's barely visible.
01:42:45.000I think that this is probably what we see ourselves becoming when we have some sort of a symbiotic relationship with technology, where technology becomes a part of us, when we have the ability to manipulate genes, which is absolutely coming, and then we have This enormous head,
01:43:02.000which, I mean, look at our heads, right?
01:43:05.000It's not very practical, the enormous head.
01:43:07.000Neil deGrasse Tyson was talking about this recently.
01:45:27.000We're like a few weeks and it worked a little sort of science fiction now what yeah, but I think that's entirely possible for the future and then the idea of human beings moving away from Biological bodies If they figure out a way to download consciousness,
01:45:44.000which is one of Kurzweil's things, right?
01:45:45.000They figure out a way to get to a point where consciousness is something that can be transferred.
01:46:33.000You'd have the other body on steroids, and you'd have the other body working out the Olympic Training Center and turn the other body into a super athlete, and then the one that you're skydiving and doing backflips with.
01:46:45.000I think the augmented brains are going to come along before things like that, though.
01:47:01.000These networks I was talking about can actually create videos that look like real videos.
01:47:08.000So I think you're going to get actual content creators, which are artificial intelligence, like YouTube personalities, that are actually artificial intelligence.
01:47:18.000But some of them will be overt, like, you know, here's Google's new bot, you know, posting on the internet, going, hey everybody, I'm Google!
01:47:25.000And then you'll get people, you'll get AIs pretending to be real people.
01:47:30.000And then you'll get these AIs pretending to be real people in thousands if not millions of social media accounts trying to influence people.
01:47:41.000And you talk about botnets and things, but they're just like people just posting shit, like reposting memes and things.
01:47:47.000What if you actually get an artificial intelligence that can actually hold a conversation with someone, and an artificial intelligence that's actually more intelligent than the person that it's holding the conversation with?
01:47:59.000It would be able to manipulate that person and control them.
01:48:02.000And since it's just a computer doing it, you could have thousands or millions of them.
01:48:08.000And you can do all kinds of targeted social media campaigns.
01:48:12.000Well, don't they say that's going on right now?
01:48:13.000Yeah, but they're not actually like...
01:48:16.000It's not an artificial intelligence having a real conversation with people.
01:48:35.000There'll be someone who would be, you know, in a few decades there'll be people, there'll be artificial intelligences that will be just as intelligent as you or me and will be able to have the same conversations on social media that you and I can have on social media right now and people won't be able to tell the difference.
01:48:54.000There's this big famous test in AI, which is the Turing test, where the test is someone sits in a room with a typewriter and they talk to the computer in the other room and if they can tell it's a computer, then it passes the Turing test and it's meant to be intelligent.
01:49:08.000If you can't tell that it's a computer.
01:49:10.000Yeah, if you can't tell it's a computer.
01:49:11.000So there's been very limited successes with that.
01:49:14.000If you restrict the topics to just baseball or Britney Spears or something like that, they have these very limited domains that they can talk about.
01:49:22.000But if you get a general-purpose AI that is actually intelligent and can and has goals to change someone's mind about something like politics You could have a real problem.
01:49:32.000Well, we were talking about Duncan and I yesterday were saying think about Someone creating an artificial version of him based on the hundreds of hours of his audio recordings Because he has so many podcasts as do I you know if somebody wanted to take a podcast Like mine where there's a thousand episodes and take those thousand plus episodes and Take my opinions and the way I describe things the way I talk Which I mean like if you're talking to me in a podcast like this you're just talking
01:50:03.000to me This is what I talk like so and you get a bunch of variables, right?
01:50:06.000You get me excited me depressed me shocked me sad me happy You would have so much to choose from yeah, you could kind of material You could kind of like fill in the blanks and guess pretty accurately how I would react or respond to certain things.
01:50:23.000Yeah, one of the episodes of Black Mirror, a British TV show.
01:50:38.000An AI version of him and it starts out small like someone who would post on social media as him and eventually it grew to be this big thing.
01:52:25.000Let's say your father died, which is one of Ray Kurzweil's big things.
01:52:33.000One of his primary motivations is to recreate his father.
01:52:37.000He lost his father when he was young, and he believes that through the advent of artificial intelligence and through the data that he's collected, the recordings of his father and the images, that one day he will literally be able to communicate with his father again.
01:52:54.000I don't know if that's real, but I do know that someone like Duncan, say if my friend Duncan died, it's entirely possible that within the next 50 years, they're going to be able to create a version of Duncan, and Duncan can come over and say, Hi, dude, I'm back!
01:54:23.000Who lived in the middle of nowhere and had to be flown into him and he had created that guy right there, created artificial intelligence and then went over the Turing test and everything in that too.
01:54:47.000There was none of that in that movie to me.
01:54:49.000That movie to me was like, wow, this all could take place.
01:54:54.000Especially with these future robot things, so much of it is just trying to make a robot that's just like a human, when the robots are not going to be like humans.
01:56:30.000AI is something they don't need this huge physical infrastructure.
01:56:34.000They don't need a big military or anything to do, like cyber warfare, with AI. Fuck.
01:56:39.000So they could be developing all this artificial intelligence to do things like infiltrate everybody's social media and make them vote for the different guy.
01:56:49.000Or just infiltrate all our power stations and shut them all down.
01:56:52.000That's one of the real problems that I have today with the conversations regarding politics, regarding whether or not Russia hacked the election, is because people are so concerned with painting out their party to be innocent and the other party to be guilty and describing all the different things that the Russians did and the interference and all the subterfuge that's being used that I think we're missing out on
01:57:22.000this idea that you can electronically affect the way people think about things if you have enough resources to attack an idea with propaganda through bots.
01:57:39.000And this is something that you see all the time.
01:57:41.000Yeah, a lot of the stuff that Russia did was posted in closed groups on Facebook.
01:57:48.000So it's something that you really wouldn't be able to see happening.
01:58:24.000They're trying to push a certain narrative.
01:58:25.000One of them where the guy got busted because he accidentally had on his location and showed that he was in Russia.
01:58:32.000And, you know, he's some guy with hashtag MAGA, you know, with the American flag and his avatar and the whole deal.
01:58:41.000Yeah, it's going to be really hard to figure out exactly what happened, but it's going to be even harder in the future, though, because people will be covering the tracks a lot better.
01:58:59.000In that movie they described the possibility of faking these conflicts and having this fake video and having movie directors film everything and it would influence the way people thought about world conflicts.
01:59:11.000And now we're getting to a stage where that technology is a lot more realistic than faking videos.
01:59:57.000And there's a scene in that where they map somebody's face onto a porn actor.
02:00:04.000And at the time, I thought that was the most ridiculously stupid thing I've ever heard of because it would never possibly work and there's no way of getting that degree of accuracy.
02:00:12.000And now I've got an app in my iPhone that actually does it to a reasonable degree, where it's quite hard sometimes to see what's going on.
02:00:20.000There's this thing called Mug Life, which is just a toy app where you take a picture of yourself and it instantly maps it onto a 3D face.
02:00:30.000And you can do all these expressions and you can say these things.
02:00:35.000And it's basically, you know, it's that type of thing, which I thought was ridiculous speculation like 20 years ago, but now it's come to pass.
02:00:44.000Well, there's an article that I tweeted today about Gal Gadot, who is the woman from Wonder Woman.
02:00:51.000They use an algorithm, and they tape her face onto a porn video.
02:00:55.000So they have her doing porn, and it looks just like her.
02:00:59.000You can kind of tell a little bit that it's not her, but not much.
02:01:04.000It's enough where you're like, whoa, they're going to get really good at this, and then they'll be able to have you doing anything.
02:01:28.000Not that I support, like, a lot of the fucking hysterics and the craziness that Trump tweets and all the different shit that he tweets, but occasionally they get things wrong, and they make stories about him, like the CNN Russia story,
02:01:54.000They fired them, but the story had already been written.
02:01:59.000I guess there's a rush to get things out there, and they're trying very hard.
02:02:04.000But you've got to be very careful because once something's out there, that initial thing of being out there is so much more powerful than any retraction.
02:02:10.000Yeah, it's really hard to get retractions out because the original thing just goes so much more than the retraction.
02:02:18.000Like the Roy Moore thing, which is going on right now, there's the election today.
02:02:23.000There's a thing where they said that his signature was fake because the ink on the image was black on one side and blue on the other side.
02:02:32.000And so they said, oh, this must have been faked because the Roy is black and the Moore is blue.
02:02:38.000I was looking into that and I did some experiments where I did a signature and then held it at an angle and took photos of it and I found out that there's this type of chromatic aberration from the camera which just does that with ink.
02:02:52.000And it's very easy to duplicate and you can show that this was actually what was going on in this image and then you can look at other images of the signature from different angles which show that it's all black.
02:03:02.000So there's this one image on CNN that showed this blue and black ink.
02:03:06.000And then I figured out that it was just this trick of the camera.
02:03:11.000But even though it's been debunked and explained, people are still spreading the exact same thing around.
02:03:54.000The problem is that she did do it, and she didn't say she did it.
02:03:58.000So many people want that to be true, that it was forged, that if you can take something that's slightly problematic, like her not saying that she actually added this annotation afterwards, and then you can say that she admitted to it being forged,
02:04:18.000It doesn't really matter that it's a lie, because by the end of today, it doesn't really matter at all.
02:04:24.000So all he had to do was get this story out there.
02:04:27.000He had enough stuff in it to make it seem vaguely plausible to people who wanted to believe that she forged it.
02:04:33.000Did she forge the date, and did she try to say that that date was written by him?
02:04:39.000She added a note underneath that had the date, but he had also written the date above.
02:04:44.000He wrote, like, you know, to a sweeter, more darling girl, I could never say Merry Christmas, Roy Moore, 77. And then underneath, she had written Old Hickory House, 1977. And did she try to claim that he had written that?
02:05:00.000Originally, it seemed like she was saying that he'd written the whole thing.
02:05:04.000And she read out the inscription and she said, Roy Moore wrote this in my book, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
02:05:10.000And she read the annotation at the end.
02:06:08.000One of the Al Franken accusers we were talking about yesterday claimed that Al had grabbed her waist and squoze her fat in some sort of way.
02:06:16.000She's talking about something 10 years ago.
02:06:19.000Like, you absolutely remember what happened in something so inconsequential 10 years ago?
02:06:26.000Now, you add 30 years onto that, and I'm just calling bullshit.
02:06:30.000Yeah, you can't really remember that level of detail.
02:06:34.000I mean, it would have to be something really significant.
02:06:38.000But even then, you know about creative memories and how people's memories change over time.
02:06:43.000A lot of people claim they remember where they were when they heard about the space shuttle blowing up, the first one.
02:06:50.000People have done extensive research into that, tracking people's stories over a decade or so, and they found that a significant percentage of people changed their stories ten years later as to about where they were.
02:07:52.000But I really think that that's entirely possible in the future, that there's going to be some way we have a neural interface with some sort of a recording device that's far more accurate.
02:08:11.000You and I say, Jamie and Mick West were in the room together and take a picture.
02:08:15.000It used to be that I could say, well, that's definite because I have this photo.
02:08:19.000But now with Photoshop and video editing tools, so even then, so what am I talking about?
02:08:25.000Because even then your memories are going to be able to create artificial memories.
02:08:27.000You're going to have artificial intelligence getting into your brain and creating memories for you.
02:08:31.000Well, wasn't that like Total Recall, right?
02:08:34.000Wasn't that part of the idea of Total Recall?
02:08:35.000They could put fake memories in your brain and have you have fake experiences?
02:08:43.000There's a lot of experiences that were gigantic to me.
02:08:47.000Like, all of my years of martial arts competition.
02:08:51.000If you had asked me to like accurately depict some of the most significant memories of my life from like age 16 to 21, like all those martial arts fights that I had, I wouldn't even be able to touch it.
02:09:45.000Yeah, there's a few things that I remember because there's some significance to it.
02:09:51.000Like, I remember the space shuttle thing because I was over at an ex-girlfriend's house and it was one of the few times that we saw each other before we had completely stopped seeing each other.
02:10:03.000Like, we had kind of broken up, and then I'd driven out to her house to visit her, and then while I was over her house, we saw the launch, and we were like, holy shit.
02:10:11.000We actually saw the replay of it blowing up, and we were like, whoa.
02:10:17.000See, some people, they see the replay, and then they remember that as seeing the actual event itself live, and so they think they saw it live.
02:15:56.000Yeah, a lot of these, they're like Eastern European, like, scientist types who do things like this.
02:16:02.000So they made it look like this dude's just driving around, and then this water bottle's gonna pull it out of air, and then he can just pull it out of the tube, and wow, look, I've got water all of a sudden.
02:16:34.000I have a humidifier because California's dry.
02:16:36.000If you ever have a dehumidifier, it will eventually fill up the container of the dehumidifier.
02:16:41.000But this is this thing powered by plugging it into the wall, and it's this big machine, and it still takes all day to fill up the reservoir.
02:16:47.000So they're saying like a little water bottle this size with a little solar panel and this little condensing thing that's this big will fill it up in a few hours.
02:16:58.000...physical face technology swapping thing like 20 years ago was impossible, but 20 years from now, maybe they're playing the long game with this water bottle.
02:17:06.000You can improve computers, but you can't really improve the laws of physics.
02:17:09.000You can only get so much water out of a parcel of air.
02:17:12.000So they would have to have some sort of better mechanism for extracting it than what they're doing.
02:17:52.000The slides that he used in the talk to illustrate, there was like an event of some UFO buzzing an aircraft carrier and some fighter jets were going after it and they couldn't find it and they put up some slides on the screen there which looked like a shiny silver penis flying around.
02:18:10.000And it's actually something that, the type of thing we do on Metabunk is identify objects like that.
02:18:14.000So we figured out what this was, and it's actually a number one numerical helium balloon, like the digit one.
02:18:36.000They thought it was a UFO, so he got it off that, and said this is a UFO. Took the image, kind of degraded it a bit, so you can't really tell what it was.
02:18:42.000It was quite hard for me to track it down, because they'd messed with it so much.
02:18:45.000It was actually just this helium balloon that was shiny.
02:18:50.000What's disturbing to me is that he's got this business that claims to be some sort of aerospace business, and he's involved in it with all these other people.
02:19:00.000That's weird, because the guy who's running that, I can't remember his name, Fortune or something like that, is like a real guy who works at Lockheed Martin or somewhere, run the skunk work.
02:19:41.000That's not what they're talking about.
02:19:43.000They're talking about some kind of craft that warps the very nature of time and space itself and kind of rides a wave of a wormhole or something like that.
02:19:53.000And this guy thinks that it's plausible.
02:19:55.000And all they have to do is kind of like try really, really hard.
02:19:58.000If they all put their heads together and like this scientists do all this science a lot and then these builders do their really good building based on these really good science they're gonna get, then they'll get this flying craft.
02:21:52.000The crazy thing, too, was that he had been contacted by the government because they knew that he could go on shows like mine and talk about this, and then he would have a platform because he's a rock star.
02:22:14.000People say they don't want to talk to me on the phone because they're afraid of the government tracking them down and assassinating them or whatever.
02:22:21.000But it's like, I'm talking to you on Facebook.
02:22:27.000If I really was this agent of the government, it wouldn't be very hard to just say, get rid of this guy.
02:22:33.000That's a big one they like to pull on you because you debunk things.
02:23:30.000Yeah, a lot of people will say that I am really stupid.
02:23:32.000There's people who are in the architects and engineers for 9-11 truth type thing who think that I'm really stupid and don't understand physics at all.
02:23:41.000And so they say that I'm not a government agent.
02:23:45.000I'm just this really stupid dude who doesn't understand what actually happened with 9-11.
02:24:18.000So it's a way of getting around the problem.
02:24:20.000And a lot of other people say that I'm so smart about chemtrails and things like that, that I must be a government agent because I know so much about contrails.
02:24:43.000I like doing the backyard science stuff.
02:24:45.000There was a thing I did recently where the scientists were saying that the bits falling off the World Trade Center were leaving trails that must be from the rocket motors that are pushing them away from the World Trade Center.
02:24:58.000So I said, no, it's probably just some dust on it.
02:25:01.000And they said, no, it wouldn't do that.
02:25:03.000So I got a big sledgehammer and I piled some ashes on it from my fireplace and then I stood on top of a wall and I was throwing this sledgehammer with a big trail of dust coming from it for like half an hour videoing myself doing it until I got some representative videos of it.
02:25:22.000You know, one of the ones that kept coming up that I thought was the most ridiculous about the Flat Earth was I'd read this a couple of places where people were talking about ships disappearing on the horizon.
02:26:00.000You know I was talking about how architects and engineers from 9-11 have to do this really advanced thing now because we've debunked the basic stuff so they have to move to this advanced stuff.
02:26:11.000Now you demonstrate how things actually do go over the horizon, and mountains do get obscured by the horizon, and how the sun sets and things like that.
02:26:19.000And so they come up with this complicated explanation where there's this kind of giant refractive lens of atmosphere above the Earth, which is bending all the light from the sun in such a way that the Earth appears to be round, even though it's actually flat.
02:27:34.000If it goes far enough away, you can't see it anymore.
02:27:37.000And you'll be convinced that it's disappeared over the horizon when, in fact, it's only probably a couple inches lower.
02:27:44.000On the horizon as far as like the curve of the earth, but to the naked eye, it's invisible.
02:27:49.000So when they zoom in on it, they're convinced that, aha, there is no curvature of the earth.
02:27:54.000See, this looked like it went over the horizon, but it's an optical illusion.
02:27:58.000Yeah, and the thing is they've been shown this so many times that this actually happens.
02:28:01.000There's so many videos now on YouTube that actually demonstrate this thing, like there's time lapses of ships going over the horizon, like zoomed in all the way with the P900 cameras, which do like an 83 times zoom, as big as you can go.
02:28:16.000They just ignore it or they say it's all made up.
02:28:19.000They ignore it because it's not in their same YouTube queue.
02:28:22.000You know, if you look at the, you know, you're playing the Flat Earth video, all the queue to the right is like Flat Earth exposed.
02:28:29.000Some of those get hundreds of thousands of views.
02:28:31.000There's this one guy, Dr. Zach, who's, I don't know where he is, like a foreign guy who does these...
02:28:36.000Yeah, he does these Flat Earth videos, and they're all mathematically showing things in AutoCAD with drawing lines and stuff, and he gets like 400,000 views.
02:28:47.000Well, it's just amazing that so many people get into this, and they buy into it.
02:28:52.000Do you see that one where that young man took a spirit ruler, a spirit level on an airplane, and was flying around in an airplane and was convinced?
02:29:16.000Where he puts up something about how the moon is cooling things and he has this thermometer thing where it's showing that the moon is actually making things cold.
02:29:28.000Then I put up a video explaining why it's just a reflection because these infrared thermometers don't work that way.
02:29:35.000And then he puts another thing like Debunk this, Mick West!
02:29:42.000Well, the weird thing is that they see all these other planets as round, but they decide that the Earth is flat, that it's some sort of a flat disk.
02:30:27.000But it's just, to me, it's such a strange thing to concentrate on, that this is like, their identity is wholly invested in proving this thing to be some sort of a massive conspiracy.
02:30:55.000And then here's the thing that people send me.
02:30:58.000People, like, I don't know if they're trolling me or if they're serious.
02:31:01.000They'll send me a picture of a glacier and they'll go, there's your fucking ice wall.
02:31:06.000Yeah, they show you the Ross Ice Shelf or something like that.
02:31:09.000Like an actual ice shelf in Antarctica.
02:31:12.000Yeah, you can look up the picture and see what it actually was.
02:31:15.000And they think there's a government, the government is like guarding the ice wall all around so you can't get near it and take pictures of it.
02:31:36.000Looking in completely different directions, and they're both actually, because they're both fairly close to each other, really, they're looking at the same stars in the sky.
02:34:15.000So if you get like an air hose and you point it in that direction and you're standing on ice or something, you'll move in the opposite direction.
02:35:17.000My concern about all this, in particular the flat earth stuff, is young kids wasting their time on stupid shit when the world is filled with massive real mysteries and incredibly fascinating things that you should be diving in and learning about.
02:35:36.000I think there's a great opportunity for teaching kids with things like flat Earth.
02:36:03.000Yeah, well, that one was so stunningly stupid to me.
02:36:07.000And then, I don't even want to go into the flat earth thing anymore, but it's the thinking behind it that's the problem.
02:36:15.000The thinking that every single airline pilot, everyone involved in Um, commercial shipping, everyone involved in aerospace, everyone who makes satellites, everyone, all those people are lying.
02:36:30.000Every cartographer, everyone, all the map makers, everyone, they're all full of shit.
02:36:35.000Everyone has agreed to not tell everyone else about the ice wall.
02:36:39.000If the earth was flat and there was an ice wall, scientists would detail it and they would explain why the earth was flat and they would show you a working model of the earth being flat and that's what they would teach in school.
02:36:51.000There's no benefit whatsoever to describing the Earth in a shape that it doesn't exist in.
02:36:58.000And it would be obvious that the Earth was flat because you'd be able to do like really simple tests yourself.
02:37:02.000You would see boats not going over the horizon.
02:37:24.000Yeah, it's just the way your brain works.
02:37:27.000If you take photographs of it, like on the horizon, and then another photograph of it when it's right up there, and compare them side by side, if you're the same zoom settings, it's exactly the same.
02:37:36.000That's interesting, because it really does look larger when it gets lower.
02:39:21.000At this stage of my life, it seems when there's so many incredible things to pay attention to that are real, This is what I feel like about all this stuff where people are looking into conspiracies that they're just nonsense.
02:39:53.000And it's one of the reasons why I continue to talk about these things and I really want to shine as much light on them as possible.
02:40:01.000There's a real pattern that you could fall into and you can waste a tremendous amount of time in your life if you start looking at things incorrectly.
02:40:12.000And flat earth to me is the best example of it.
02:40:15.000It's the best example because it's so stupid.
02:40:17.000I mean, it's so utterly preposterous that everyone is lying and that there are no images at all of this flat earth, but yet this one guy or a couple guys...
02:40:27.000And I had heard that it had started all out as a as a troll on 4chan is that they they had started doing this like way back in you know like It could have been, but the Flat Earth thing goes back to the 1800s.