On this episode of the UFO Junkies Podcast, we have a guest on the show who is a film director, producer, writer, and podcaster who has been in the business for over 30 years. He is also a writer, director, and actor who has worked with some of the biggest names in Hollywood, including Mickey Rourke, Robert Downey Jr, and many others. We talk about how he became interested in UFOs, how he got into the field, and how he ended up making a movie about Area 51 and flying saucers. This episode is a must listen! If you like the show, please HIT SUBSCRIBE and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts and we'll read it out to the world. Thank you so much for being a part of the podcast and supporting the show! Stay up to date with all things UFO related! Timestamps: 1:00:00 - How to get back into the UFO game? 4:30 - How I got back in the game 7:00 How to become a filmmaker What is Area 51? 8:00- How to make a film about UFOs 9:15 - My experience with Area 51 11:40 - My first UFO experience 12:30- How I became obsessed with UFOs 13:20 - Why I started making movies 14:30 15:00 My first film 16: How did I get into the film business 17: How I started the film career 18:00 After the movie 23: How my first UFO Experience 19:00 What I got me interested in the UFO podcast 22:00 Why I got into this job 27:00 How I Became Obsessed with UFOs ? 26:00 Thoughts on Area 51?? 29:00 Is this guy a gentle person? 32:00 Can I have a UFO Experience? 33:30 What do I do with UFOs? 35: What do you think I would you like to see in the future? 36:00 Do you like a UFO podcast? 37:00 Are you interested in a UFO sighting? 39:00 I would like to learn more about my UFO podcast ? 41:00 Would you like me to talk about it? 45:00 Could you help me make a movie?
00:02:14.000And I thought, who better to do this, like, controversial story than the controversial Mickey fucking Rourke talking poetry, you know, through the film.
00:02:25.000So he was kind of that voice of our curiosity in the film.
00:04:51.000After that episode, man, things started really going crazy.
00:04:55.000And this is where our Senate and Senate Intelligence Committee and our Congress and our Senate was like, we want a preliminary report.
00:05:05.000We now know that there were these UFO programs, ASAP and AATIP. We want a report.
00:05:11.000And remember that was like pending, that was looming, a report's coming.
00:05:14.000So George and I made a little plan to poke the bear.
00:05:19.000You know, we're like, what can we put out that is like good, solid evidence that shows we need to talk about this?
00:05:26.000So that's when we took the opportunity to make those drops, right?
00:05:30.000And those drops were nine pieces of visual evidence that were filmed by our military.
00:05:35.000So if people were watching along that time, you'd see that in a series of a month, I think, we released images from an F-A-18 out the window where they're saying they're seeing these things every day, photographs from an iPhone.
00:05:49.000I obtained and released video of That was confirmed by the Pentagon in a rare move the next day on some of these drops, that these are real unidentifieds, that they're being studied, and they were filmed by our military.
00:06:03.000They could have just denied it forever.
00:07:57.000It's like, maybe someone just wants me to make a mis- Everybody would love for me to be wrong on shit, and make a misstep, and then they can discount everything else I've ever released.
00:08:04.000Has anything ever sent you something where you're on the fence about?
00:08:08.000Where you're like, I don't know if this is legit or not?
00:08:09.000You know, I sit on stuff for years, vetting it, and having other people vet it.
00:08:13.000Yeah, I've got tons of stuff For years, really?
00:09:01.000Now, what it shows, that's up to other experts.
00:09:05.000I reported what I was exposed to in classified briefings that I shouldn't have seen, and what I released is completely legal for me to release.
00:09:15.000It was unclassified, but it was contained in a classified briefing.
00:09:18.000Now, if somebody sends me shit, You know, I open my email, I can't...
00:09:22.000We should probably tell people, like, what some of these videos are.
00:09:46.000The pyramid ones were the ones that were in the lower...
00:09:49.000If you see that lower column, right below there to the left, the green, right there, that's it.
00:09:55.000So that's the ones that they were seeing.
00:09:58.000Well, there's good video, and we should go through the pieces of footage, but the one on the left is what they're seeing every damn day on the East Coast.
00:10:06.000That one would be considered one that has a payload or could have a payload.
00:10:38.000Over active war zones right now, there is such an increased frequency of what they call UAP or UFO that they have these rules whether or not they fire upon them.
00:10:50.000And people got so mad at me for saying publicly on the news that we do fire at UAP, UFOs, because we fucking do.
00:10:58.000But why we do is not what people think.
00:11:01.000So when you have an active war zone, specifically the area of the world that I'm talking about in the Middle East, anything within 27 to 30 miles of ground troops gets fired upon.
00:11:45.000And there's been such an increased frequency since 2021 that it has been pushed up to kind of like critical, where they're like, okay, these things are in our airspace.
00:15:41.000That's one of the weirdest things about Commander David Fravor's account, is that when he was talking about being in radio communication with the Nimitz, and they were saying, we see these things every day.
00:15:52.000And he was like, what the fuck are you talking about?
00:15:56.000You see these tic-tac-shaped things that shoot off faster than you can see, and that literally can go from above 50,000 feet Above sea level.
00:17:23.000The problem is, all of it is so exciting and so interesting that you get lost in the excitement and it's very difficult to get an objective mindset, to achieve an objective mindset.
00:17:36.000It's very hard for me to be objective, because I love it so much.
00:17:39.000But we got a UFO there, we got a fucking alien up there.
00:17:43.000We've got shooting stars in the ceiling.
00:17:47.000But I have this bizarre feeling that the more we understand about reality, the more we're going to realize that these physicists, these string theorists that create these models of the universe based on multiple dimensions that we can't Access.
00:18:05.000I mean, there's, I think they think there's 11 dimensions, right?
00:18:12.000Let's see if it's up to 26. There's 11, like, agreed upon, but there's, I've read that it goes up to, there could be up to 26. I don't even know what that means.
00:18:31.000I mean, this is like some Doctor Strange type shit.
00:18:34.000I mean, are there, you know, the thought of alternative timelines, that there's consistently different timelines that are happening simultaneously, like an infinite number of them.
00:18:45.000And that you accessed all of them depending upon your choices and how you live your life and what you do.
00:18:50.000And that we think of this as being like a static state of existence, but it's actually not.
00:18:56.000That we float back and forth between all these different potential timelines and existences.
00:19:03.000I see those things, the way they travel and the way they move, and I wonder, like if there were interdimensional travelers that had access to technology that just violated all of our understanding of how you could travel, that's kind of what it would look like.
00:19:20.000There's evidence to support that, and there's evidence to support the extraterrestrial thing, and there's also evidence to support that they're showing us whatever they want us to see.
00:19:31.000So this idea that you could pop in to our timeline, that is consistent with what we see with these things, In that they seem to, it's like there's a bubble around an area, and they seem to kind of come in.
00:19:44.000Some people can see it, some people can't.
00:19:47.000Sometimes it's on radar, sometimes it's not.
00:19:49.000Sometimes you can see it in thermal, but you can't see it in the IR. A lot of military guys see that when they track these things on radar.
00:19:55.000Can't see it visually, but it's fucking there.
00:19:58.000So this idea, there's consistency with the idea that they kind of pop into place right there.
00:20:06.000There's also data that would suggest that these are extraterrestrial and that our satellites pick these up.
00:20:14.000Now, head of, I don't remember what, John Ratcliffe, who was the deputy director of defense, I think, he talked about that.
00:20:45.000Nothing public yet that I know of, but I am hyper aware of footage, sonar-based evidence undersea.
00:20:53.000If you noticed in the congressional hearings on UFOs, first time in 50 fucking years, by the way, When they brought that up, the undersea thing, they said close session.
00:21:47.000Grabbing a hold of space and time and pulling itself towards whatever destination it wants to go to.
00:21:53.000Yeah, and that was the thing that really flipped my script is the idea of like when I heard him say that when I was a kid instead of pushing to get somewhere because look the argument has been Of course, there's life out in the universe.
00:22:05.000Look at the fucking web, you know, photograph.
00:22:08.000Of course, there's gotta be life homogeneously out there, but they're never coming here.
00:22:13.000That was the Einsteinian thought, right?
00:22:16.000We can't travel faster than the speed of light.
00:22:37.000That's where the transmedium craft, they believe, the people researching this, within our government, believe that these craft are gravity propelled.
00:22:44.000That's why there's the new programs called All Domain, because it's space, air, and sea.
00:22:52.000And in the congressional language for the UFO whistleblower stuff that's going on, where people can come forward, it's going to be set into law.
00:23:01.000People are going to be able to come forward and talk about how they worked on legacy UFO programs, like reverse engineering programs.
00:23:08.000So when you say people are going to be able to, it means the government is going to drop the restrictions that people were former employees?
00:23:15.000I feel like I'm doing a horrible job of getting people up to date with what's happening in the UFO, because so much has happened, it's like overwhelming, but yes.
00:23:21.000So what's happened is, if we follow the steps, All of a sudden, George and I release all this content.
00:24:02.000And Congress got even more pissed as the way I read it.
00:24:06.000I mean, I know some of the people involved and their minds have been blown by what they've seen in these classified briefings.
00:24:12.000It changed their whole way of thought and they realized that there are programs being hidden, illegal programs being hidden from congressional oversight related to UFOs.
00:24:23.000So their language now is It wasn't created in a void.
00:24:27.000When you read in the National Defense Authorization Act for 2023, UAP. It is UFO whistleblower language.
00:24:34.000If you've ever signed an NDA relating to one of these illegal programs without oversight dealing with UFOs, not only can you come forward, but they have changed it so that if there's any reprisal on you for coming forward, like let's say you work at Lockheed and you've been tinkering with some fucking UFO,
00:24:53.000and there's any reprisal on you, You have ways to defend yourself.
00:24:59.000They took away the cap of $300,000 of what has to be awarded to you if there's reprisal.
00:25:45.000So that's why they're calling upon these people that have NDAs to come forward and that they'll protect them?
00:25:51.000I think it's a perfect storm and I'm just gonna, this is just, you know, I'm not part of Congress and shit, so I'm gonna make an assumption from people I've talked with, right?
00:26:00.000I think what's happening here is the world has kind of become aware that UFOs are not fantasy, that there is a technological aspect,
00:26:15.000and that they fly within our skies with impunity.
00:26:20.000And I think that this was stigmatized before, and I think we're talking about it now.
00:26:25.000And I think having that conversation has really made people say, hey, I want to fucking find out if it's true.
00:26:31.000And then when you read classified briefings and you see the data, even the preliminary shit, I think it changes your worldview.
00:26:37.000So what's happening is, let's say Lockheed, because Senator Harry Reid has said in his interviews with George publicly, I heard for decades that they had, you know, Kraft at Lockheed.
00:26:49.000And he goes, I asked, Senator Harry Reid, I asked to get in there and to see it.
00:26:54.000And he goes, they wouldn't give me the clearance.
00:27:19.000Kind of like what Lazar said happened to him, but this is much more public.
00:27:23.000They're saying he never worked in these programs.
00:27:25.000Harry Reid had to go defend him in a letter.
00:27:29.000There's other people that are not public, that also have had their careers try to be squashed because they're poking around on this stuff too much.
00:27:38.000They have gone internally to say, this has happened to me.
00:31:36.000I mean, it was within a hundred mile radius because all the ships that were in this area were experiencing most of them simultaneously what they call swarming.
00:31:44.000But the thing is, is that I know for sure we don't know yet whose these were.
00:33:15.000With this case, man, I never hang my hat on one UFO case.
00:33:19.000What's interesting to me is the people involved, they feel like they failed at their duties.
00:33:24.000They didn't know precisely what to do in this situation, because right off our coast.
00:33:29.000The thing is, is this is happening everywhere, man.
00:33:31.000Do they have a protocol for what to do in those situations?
00:33:34.000Like if you do encounter a UAP or UFO or whatever you want to call it, and they think it might be from an alien planet or whatever the fuck they think it's from, do they have a protocol?
00:34:20.000They believe that it ends up going into the water.
00:34:24.000That's what the documents said and the documents I was exposed to that I read...
00:34:31.000Made it made an argument for that made a case for that.
00:34:33.000So it looks like now that it's hovering boys a shitty footage Well, see that's my money back Navy.
00:34:39.000I know I know spend your goddamn camera money on but do you understand that this is why I could release it is because this is an unclassified Platform that's being filmed otherwise that would not be cool of me to release it So there it looks like it just went into the water.
00:37:07.000Yeah, he said that there was one that they had spoken about at S4 that they said they had recovered from an archaeological dig and they said it was a long time ago and it's really old.
00:37:21.000I think people need to not feel like they have to believe one thing to believe the whole thing.
00:37:28.000I think there's a cumulative weight here, and I think that we're prying open the doors.
00:37:33.000If you read this language in Congress and Senate about the UFO immunity, Our world is about to change if we stick to our guns, if we push to get these answers.
00:37:45.000We're going to find out one way or the other.
00:38:38.000That's the other thing that Bob said that I thought was really fascinating was that there was some documentation that they were showing him that claimed that we are the product of accelerated evolution.
00:38:49.000He was shown a lot of shit and he doesn't like talking about it because he doesn't know if it's just total fucking nonsense.
00:40:08.000Explain the element 115 to people because people who don't know what we're talking about that haven't seen the documentary or haven't seen the podcast we did together.
00:40:18.000So the way Bob understood it was that he was working on power and propulsion, right?
00:40:23.000So of one of these, we call them flying saucers, you know, fucking alien vehicle.
00:40:43.000I'm like, maybe that's just what he saw.
00:40:45.000But anyway, so the 115 was the power source, he said.
00:40:48.000And basically, you put it in, and it releases antimatter and creates a gravity propulsion, a gravitational field, and then you had three-directional emitters.
00:41:02.000Look, that's how they think these things operate.
00:41:05.000Traveling faster than the speed of sound with no sonic boom, transmedium, all domain.
00:41:11.000These things seem to defy typical propulsion.
00:41:16.000It's not outside of the realm of what we understand.
00:41:18.000It's outside of the realm of what we can replicate now.
00:41:25.000And this Element 115 that Bob talked about powering this spaceship was only theoretical back in the late 1980s when he first started discussing it.
00:43:14.000Proven by a particle accelerator and Bob Lazar's claim was that they had a stable Amount of this element 115 that had come from this other place and did they know where this other place was where this Element 115 supposedly come from what another planet yeah,
00:43:33.000I mean again, this is like what he was told so he's kind of allergic to but You know he said that the documents said zeta reticuli like you know I guess a binary star system or something that's what we're in the documents now if that's true or not look remember he thought it was the US he thought this vehicle was ours right and then he until he walked inside of it that's his whole thing it blew him away You know,
00:44:00.000it's hard to buy what someone like Bob is telling you if you don't know the person.
00:44:10.000Imagine being him and that actually happening to you and then you having to go back to reality and tell people or not tell people, just live your life And have the burden of this information,
00:44:45.000Most people almost instantaneously, other than a real journalist like George Knapp, most people are going to think you're out of your fucking mind.
00:46:11.000He went out and he showed people a craft that didn't look like any normal craft, come up right when he said it would, over a base that wasn't even known then really well, and a sub-base, an area, not area 51 proper.
00:46:25.000Again, he's the luckiest motherfucker in the world.
00:46:28.000He did it three weekends in a row until he got caught.
00:46:39.000The only thing that people have ever called bullshit on him is that he said he might have seen an actual alien.
00:46:46.000But he said he was walking down a hallway and looked through one of those little tiny windows that's in a door.
00:46:52.000You know, those little tiny, like, 12-inch square windows.
00:46:55.000And he peered in it quickly as he was walking by and it seemed like there was a small thing that was sitting on a chair and there's people standing over it.
00:47:14.000If you work on top-secret stuff, apparently, everything's very compartmentalized.
00:47:18.000Like, the people that work on metallurgy don't have access to the people that work on propulsion, that don't have access to the people that, if there is a biological entity, that they examine it.
00:47:27.000Which frustrated the fuck out of him, right?
00:47:30.000Because he said that's not how you do science.
00:50:31.000No, he gets really, like, crushing migraines, but, you know, people that are gonna call bullshit on that, we're talking about fucking UFOs.
00:50:37.000If you're gonna call bullshit on a migraine, what are you even listening for?
00:50:56.000There's a consistency in people's lives.
00:50:59.000And the deeper I got in, chilling with his mom, chilling with his family, chilling with friends that have known him forever, new friends, every single person.
00:51:08.000And he doesn't talk to them about UFOs, by the way.
00:52:24.000Do we have to believe any one single person to understand that this is a real phenomenon?
00:52:32.000No, but he's one of the more interesting cases.
00:52:35.000Because if he's telling the truth, that means that the government has been working on these things for decades and decades, and that they have gotten this They've gotten themselves in this pickle where they can't publicly disclose what they know and what they have access to because they've had all these people work on these things secretly and they sort of have a long history of Hiding information right now think about this right like I've been down this path myself mentally
00:53:06.000I happen to know that there was I happen to trust that there was A reverse engineering project, separate from Lazar and everything he told us, right?
00:53:17.000A separate thing from a Russian UFO crash that dealt with laser weaponry.
00:53:23.000There was a derivative exploitation project on the laser as a weapon.
00:53:29.000I know somebody that worked in that program.
00:53:36.000Imagine the derivative technologies that you could get from something like highly advanced, just working on it.
00:53:43.000You're not going to be able to make a UFO, because the material science, we haven't caught up yet how to perfectly layer atoms to make the...
00:54:31.000I like Jamie just goes, this is weird.
00:54:33.000It's not a joke, nor a hoax, nor a sign of mental instability, nor an attempt to drum up local tourism by drawing the curious the Soviet press agency TASS insisted today in discussions of what it called an extraterrestrial visit to southern Russia.
00:54:48.000Residents of the city of, how do you say that, Voronezh, how do you say it?
00:54:57.000It's V-O-R-O-N-E-Z-H. Good luck with that.
00:55:02.000Insisted today that lanky, three-eyed extraterrestrial creatures had indeed landed in a local park and gone for a stroll, and that a seemingly fantastic report about the event carried Monday by the official press agency TASS was absolutely true.
00:55:19.000It was not an optical illusion, said Lieutenant Sergei A. Matveyev of the, however you say that, District Police Station, who said in a telephone interview that he saw the landing of the UFO on September 27th.
00:55:36.000Lieutenant Matveyev confessed that he had not actually seen the aliens, but that he saw the spaceship, and there was certainly a body flying in the sky, moving noiselessly at a very high speed and a very low altitude.
00:55:53.000To be honest, Lieutenant Matveev said he was a little skeptical himself when he first saw the object.
00:55:58.000I thought I must be really tired, but I rubbed my eyes and it didn't go away, and then I figured in this day and age, anything is possible.
00:56:09.000Using the sensational tone that has lately infected the once-stayed task, the press agency today provided more details of the UFO landing in Voronezh, a city of some 300 miles southeast of Moscow.
00:56:25.000I mean it stands to reason that we know that these there are machines, right?
00:56:32.000We know they can do things that we're incapable of creating right now Like there's got to be somebody controlling them look at this look at this statement A three-eyed creature about nine feet tall and fashionably dressed in silvery overalls and bronze boots with a disc on its chest disappeared then landed and came out for a promenade with a companion and a robot.
00:56:58.000The aliens seemed to communicate with each other producing the mysterious appearance of a shiny triangle and activated the robot with a touch.
00:57:40.000You know with like one satellite in like two weeks if we decided to do it and you said to me Maybe it's fucking easy to get here You said that to me and it made me think if Maybe it is just easy to get here.
00:57:55.000Whatever these things are, maybe they're not from far away.
00:57:58.000Well, or maybe it doesn't matter if they're from far away because their ability to transcend space is very different than what we understand.
00:58:06.000Like, if you talk to someone from the 1400s and said, you know, oh, I live in California, but I want to visit Italy.
01:00:04.000He wrote this paper and it, well, he wrote it a long time ago and kind of worked on it, I guess, but it was published yesterday in a scientific journal, and it proposes This idea of the ultra terrestrial so like something that's been here a long time Maybe like aliens got here and got stuck or a civilization that was so advanced and there was some world catastrophe So it hit itself and now just kind of lives here with us and maybe they have investment that we don't fuck up the planet that we don't blow ourselves up,
01:00:34.000you know, maybe that's hmm Maybe they have some investment other than your crop theory, you know the idea that we're just a commodity and Well, I don't think we're necessarily a commodity, but I don't think we would have a problem with going to a planet and planting life.
01:00:51.000Like, imagine if we found a planet, and it's like Earth of three billion years ago, right?
01:00:58.000There's like some plant life and some fungus, but there's no animal life, no marine life, and we just Planted life there and monitored it and watched it grow and evolve and maybe they have an understanding of there's a process Maybe there's a process that like I said process not process I kind of like that super fancy man Maybe there's some sort of process where they understand that all life takes a very specific path and And that is
01:01:28.000a path of increasing complexity, right?
01:01:32.000If you want to really simplify life on Earth, you would go back to the earliest form of life, which is single-celled organisms, right?
01:01:41.000Well, why did single-celled organisms become multi-celled organisms?
01:01:46.000They're becoming more complex and then they ultimately become hominids that create tools and they ultimately lead to the industrial age and they ultimately lead to the technological age that we find ourselves in right now.
01:02:00.000The thing that they have that's clear is it's constantly a path of ever-increasing complexity.
01:02:09.000Now, when you look at the work of Graham Hancock and Randall Carlson and Dr. Robert Shock and all the people that have studied ancient civilizations and the possibility that there's been a reset along the way, it seems that perhaps there's been some periods of great growth and then some sort of cataclysmic disasters,
01:02:31.000you know, asteroid impacts and the like that has...
01:02:35.000Sent civilization back down and then it rebuilds back up again.
01:02:41.000It always seems to be on the path of ever increasing complexity and constant innovation, at least amongst the most sophisticated of creatures which we like to think of ourselves as.
01:02:52.000Maybe that is just a course in the universe for life.
01:03:13.000So he, you know, Stanford professor, he's, you know, been working for 10 years studying MRIs of the brains of people like pilots who have had close encounters.
01:03:23.000And what they found over this 10 year study, there was a CIA study, but he just openly talks about it now.
01:03:28.000It's all out in the open, which is cool.
01:03:41.000Yeah, fucking white matter damage to their brains from having close proximity to a UFO or UAP. Like, when you say close, are you talking like Commander David Fravor close?
01:04:24.000Maybe these people that have been examined, maybe the damage is what caused them to see these things in the first place.
01:04:30.000Okay, now we're gonna get real fucking weird because check out what they discovered.
01:04:34.000They discovered in doing these studies on damaged brains that there is a part of the brain that that in a lot of these UFO encounter people their neurodensity in that area of brain is like one in a hundred and they've found out through this study that that part of the brain that it deals with intuition impulse decision making so your intuition you know like hunters right they need like really good intuition to have so the
01:05:04.000impulse just knowing when to do something They've studied it in, I guess he said, like a Japanese form of chess.
01:05:42.000It's just—now, even weirder than that.
01:05:47.000I think Gary should tell you this, but even weirder than that, they found that couples are partnering who have these neurodense areas, like, more than would be random.
01:06:03.000I don't know exactly what it does, but that correlation is so interesting.
01:06:08.000So Gary was saying this this morning, cool breakfast conversation, that he thinks...
01:06:13.000Having that neuro-dense area about intuition allows them to see something that's there that other people's minds would just make them ignore.
01:06:28.000Well, what's interesting, I'm reading an interview with him about this, and as he was saying everything, I'm kind of reading along.
01:06:35.000They get to this part where the brain scansor looked very similar to people that had the Havana syndrome, and so they were comparing people to that, and then he says he got locked out of the files because it's now a serious incident, and...
01:06:50.000Yeah, he said there was a lot of crossover where people that were, because it's an intelligence community thing and military thing, and he said he saw a lot of patients with him.
01:06:58.000Let's read this because this is pretty fascinating.
01:07:00.000It said, there's the question asked him, did the people who claimed they'd had an encounter, especially the pilots, describe any perceivable decrease in neurological capacity?
01:07:10.000Said, of the 100 or so patients that we looked into, about a quarter of them died from their injuries.
01:07:16.000The majority of these patients had symptomology that's basically identical to what's now called Havana Syndrome.
01:07:23.000We think amongst the bucket list of cases, we had the first Havana Syndrome patients.
01:07:28.000Once this turned into a national security problem with Havana Syndrome, I was locked out of the access to the files because it's now a serious potential international incident if they ever figure out who's been doing it.
01:07:41.000That still left individuals who had seen UAPs.
01:07:46.000They had a smorgasbord of other symptoms.
01:07:50.000The next question is, how does the impact of electromagnetic frequencies factor into your hypothesis of what exactly transpired here?
01:07:59.000One of the patients, it happened on Skinwalker Ranch, given how deep into their brain the damage went, we can actually estimate the amount of energy required in the electromagnetic wave someone aimed at them.
01:08:14.000We don't think that has anything to do with UAPs.
01:08:18.000We think that that's some sort of state actor.
01:08:23.000And again, related to Havana Syndrome somehow.
01:08:26.000So, Havana Syndrome was dismissed initially, right?
01:08:30.000And then they're recognizing that, no, something is really going on and it might be some sort of microwave or targeted attack on people that they're experimenting on some new ability to disable people.
01:08:44.000Yeah, it's all Department of Defense people.
01:08:46.000I mean, it's obvious something is happening.
01:08:49.000Well, at least if they do know, it's not public.
01:08:59.000What we do know about UFOs, the one fucking thing we know for sure about UFOs is that they're high energy in a small amount of space.
01:09:10.000This is classically, it's been documented, the radiation effects of these when they're around.
01:09:18.000So the injuries people get, you know, you've heard like the sunburns on one side of their face and shit, the radiation, the hair falling out.
01:09:25.000So that's like from Close Encounters of the Third Kind.
01:10:09.000I mean, if that guy's telling the truth, or maybe it would be repaired because they took him aboard the craft and supposedly did some medical procedure to him.
01:10:18.000I mean, look, we should study this stuff.
01:10:21.000I think that's the big takeaway of this moment in our history because we're repeating history.
01:10:30.000And Congress was interested 50 years ago.
01:10:33.000Multi-nations were studying it openly.
01:10:36.000Now we're back at this point where I feel like there's an opportunity just to be open.
01:10:42.000We should study this scientifically, man.
01:10:45.000The problem is I feel like Even though there's people that have sightings, and even though there's some kind of metallurgy evidence, there's so little stuff.
01:10:58.000It's not like if I want to study sea turtles, I can go find the sea turtles and go study them.
01:12:02.000That there was a way to bait every single time these UFOs would come in when they were transporting nuclear weapons or something like that.
01:12:10.000Now, if that information is true, then you would have a method, you would have a way to study this, right?
01:12:16.000See, I think we're reinventing the wheel so much, like Avi Loeb at Harvard and NASA just, I think this is true, NASA just announced they're gonna repurpose their satellites to look for UFOs.
01:12:29.000I think that's a real article, Jamie, if you can find that.
01:12:33.000Repurpose their satellites to look for UFOs.
01:13:10.000Okay, so last month, the U.S. Space Agency announced it was launching an eight-month inquiry to investigate hundreds of unexplained UFO sightings.
01:13:20.000The inquiry is being held by Dr. Thomas.
01:13:30.000Dr. Thomas Zurbuchen of NASA's Science Mission Directorate, who has been investigating whether satellites in space could be repurposed to give another view on strange aerial phenomena reported from Earth.
01:13:44.000Speaking to journalists in London this week, Colonel Pam Melroy, the Deputy Administrator of NASA said, the team is going to be looking at questions like, do we have sensors that can see things?
01:13:58.000You know, take another look at the evidence.
01:14:00.000One of the big questions that Thomas asked is, we have a ton of satellites looking down at Earth.
01:14:08.000I mean, before you build a rover that's going to Mars, you ask yourself, what's a sensor I have to build to detect the most interesting things?
01:14:14.000So they're really going to focus on that.
01:14:19.000How would you get the evidence you need to be able to determine if it's an optical phenomena or some other kind of phenomena?
01:14:26.000Even the greatest scientists were ridiculed.
01:14:28.000Bill Nelson, a NASA administrator, told journalists that he had read all the classified documents relating to UFOs and was convinced that nobody knew what they were.
01:14:38.000Question as to why NASA was embarking on such a seemingly fringe subject, Nelson said that one of the space agency's remits was to hunt for life outside of Earth, and that in the past, even the greatest scientists have been disbelieved and ridiculed.
01:14:54.000Remember that one of our missions is to reach out to see if there is life, he said.
01:14:59.000That's why we're digging on Mars right now.
01:15:01.000Is the possibility of life in something as big as the universe?
01:15:06.000Of course, there's a chance in somewhere as big as that, conditions similar to Earth existed and some other kind of life form developed.
01:15:20.000It kind of drives me crazy, though, that they're like, oh, we're going to repurpose our satellites and look for UFOs.
01:15:27.000It's my understanding that we can well track UFOs.
01:15:32.000Think about NORAD, and the joke is you can't throw a softball in our atmosphere without it being tracked and targeted.
01:15:43.000It's my understanding, like, what else captured the Tic Tacs above 80,000 feet?
01:15:48.000Did we have any other optic systems or targeting systems that captured those Tic Tacs?
01:17:14.000Yes, I am convinced that the National Reconnaissance Office And the Geospatial Intelligence Agency will analyze the data from the devices that the National Reconnaissance Office has, and that we have great data on UFOs,
01:17:29.000and that that is being suppressed even to NASA. But imagine if they did have that data.
01:17:39.000What would be the benefit of leaking it to the public?
01:17:42.000And this is one of the things that's always driven me crazy about all this Pentagon stuff.
01:17:45.000And the Pentagon comes out and says, these are not of this world, these crafts.
01:17:50.000Like, what is their motivation for doing that?
01:17:59.000I think some of it is they have drones that are spectacular, that have unbelievable ability to travel at preposterous speeds, hypersonic speeds.
01:18:08.000Beyond hypersonic without signature, though?
01:18:18.000So I wish to be wrong on this, but I don't see the evidence for what you just said that we have that technology yet, and I'm not told that, and that's never been what I've asked at the highest levels that I can ask at.
01:19:14.000Like, perhaps, when you're talking about UFOs and the wide variety Like you're talking about this circle that exists, or the cube, rather, that exists in the translucent circle?
01:19:30.000Yeah, right now, and for years, in war zones, it's like, I call them the jellyfish, the cube in a sphere that a lot of pilots talk about, and even, as I said, pyramids.
01:19:41.000I've heard of pyramids in spheres, man.
01:19:43.000Right, and then there's a video of those seemingly pyramid-like things.
01:19:51.000What I have seen imagery of really fucking supposedly really fucking big ones and they look pretty fucking big So when you said you've seen have they sent it to you they just allow you to look at people that I know have allowed me to see these images and I can't have them and They look impressive.
01:21:02.000It's not like a person from within the government.
01:21:04.000It's like a fucking shit ton of people, and then I get different angles of the same shit, and I'm like, ah, now I trust it.
01:21:10.000I always have to be thoughtful in that there might be something in this footage other than the UFO that's sensitive, because this is military footage.
01:23:15.000And on their personal radar system, and these things are under intelligent control, and they're oftentimes maneuvering in ways that are incredible, but also their duration to sit out there, you know, 100 miles offshore.
01:23:28.000Like, whose are these magical devices that, like, do this?
01:23:41.000But is it because the distance they are, how far away they are, and the kind of equipment they're using to monitor these things in jets that all they have is cell phones?
01:24:00.000And, by the way, Ryan Graves, this other pilot, he says sometimes we'd have him right there on radar, but we couldn't see him with our eyes.
01:24:08.000Other times they wouldn't be on radar, and bam, these two went right, and this fucking cube in the sphere went right between two jets.
01:24:16.000That's when they got, oh, this is serious, like, we're gonna have a collision.
01:24:19.000So sometimes you get them on radar, And you don't see them.
01:24:24.000And other times you see them, but they're not on radar.
01:25:19.000The third one is hypersonic capability without signature, so like we talked about.
01:25:26.000The fourth one is the ability to, I guess you'd say, cloak, or the ability to have a I don't know the exact words they used, but to not be seen, right?
01:26:45.000So he's walking to his car, and next thing he knows, it almost appears like it flashes, and then, bam, about 100 feet from him over this power source is what he described as two plates mashed together and this gold glow.
01:27:03.000He'd never seen this color gold before.
01:30:54.000For at least a month, thinking about the fact that there's footage here, I told my buddy, I was like, don't think for one second that guard didn't film that screen.
01:31:58.000They look a little different than that object.
01:32:00.000But if the pilots, like Ryan Graves' good friends with the guy that actually captured, filmed that, and that object actually moved back on itself.
01:35:02.000They're like, you know, there's a whole fleet of them.
01:35:07.000And the duration of these, like they would sit out there, and they do sit out there for these huge durations of time, like just the energy consumption it takes to do that.
01:35:18.000Right, because a fighter jet runs out of gas in a fairly short amount of time.
01:35:23.000What do they have, like 30 minutes of fuel or something crazy like that?
01:36:01.000Have you seen that footage of that dude?
01:36:02.000He had, like, a Razor phone, like, back in, like...
01:36:06.0002000 something and he's like a carpenter and he's like I don't know where he was I'm gonna say it wrong Brazil or something and he just Grabs his shitty ass razor phone and there's this fucking it looks like a disc that just goes Turns like its belly and shit available online.
01:39:13.000I suspect we get footage of this stuff on a regular basis.
01:39:19.000And I suspect because of bureaucracy and because people don't want to deal with this shit and it's not an immediate threat, they just push it under.
01:39:39.000The bigger question is, have we actually been working on something?
01:39:42.000If that gets revealed, if this UFO whistleblower thing works and the NDAs are just out the window, I have people that I can put forward, nominate them to go talk.
01:39:53.000I actually have nominated some people.
01:39:58.000It's so fascinating that you're this lightning rod for this shit just by virtue of the fact that you're one of the most prominent UFO documentary guys.
01:40:06.000That they're coming to you and wanting to discuss these things with you.
01:40:30.000So I guess it starts with like, you know...
01:40:32.000What's interesting too is like if you are a guy and you want to get out the information and you want to get it to someone who is going to leak it where people are going to follow them, you are that guy.
01:41:20.000Out of respect and responsibility have seen a lot more than I've ever put out that my point is never to put shit out We were poking the bear at that time me and George was just trying to get the conversation lit up man Because everybody always says we wish you know, it's always like one source especially civilian footage.
01:41:37.000But with these military ones I gave people thermal radar Deck footage and within a classified briefing a slide that shows and reveals that they believe this thing to be transmedium.
01:41:48.000It was like the perfect military case because it showed all these pieces of evidence.
01:41:53.000So you can't say, oh, it's just a balloon because I gave you deck footage that shows it lit up like a Christmas tree.
01:41:59.000You can't say it was just an optical illusion of thermal because you have the radar.
01:42:04.000So all these things together create a compelling case That we should know what's fucking flying in our restricted airspace and is doing things that we can't do.
01:42:30.000My understanding is the people that kind of have been read in on some of this in the classified briefings, some of them, it completely fucking changed their lives.
01:42:38.000The whole way they think about this stuff.
01:42:54.000And then the second thing is that when someone's fucking lied to and they feel like they should have oversight, like the Senate Intelligence Committee or whatever, they feel like they should have oversight and they find out there are programs they don't have oversight about, then you get like the Church Commission of 1975. Do you remember that?
01:43:18.000They busted all the intelligence agencies for a whole bunch of shit, including MKUltra, testing drugs on civilians.
01:43:26.000They said, real thing, Senate Intelligence Committee, I think it's called the Church Commission, and they fucking railed the intelligence agencies for doing terrible, hidden, illegal shit.
01:43:41.000That's what we're seeing today about UFOs.
01:43:45.000They are saying, if you have been hiding this shit, And it has been not in our oversight.
01:44:21.000Well just at the very beginning, like what is the church committee?
01:44:27.000Church Committee, formerly United States Senate Select Committee to study governmental operations with respect to intelligence activities, was a U.S. Senate Select Committee in 1975 that investigated abuses by the Central Intelligence Agency, the National Security Agency,
01:44:42.000the Federal Bureau of Investigation, and the Internal Revenue Service, chaired by Idaho Senator Frank Church.
01:44:48.000The committee was a part of a series of investigations into intelligence abuses in 1975, dubbed the Year of Intelligence, including its House counterpart, the Pike Committee, and the Presidential Rockefeller Commission.
01:45:01.000The committee's efforts led to the establishment of permanent U.S. Senate Select Committee on Intelligence.
01:45:09.000The most shocking revelations of the committee included Operation MKUltra involving the drugging and torture of unwitting US citizens as a part of human experimentation on mind control.
01:45:22.000COINTELPRO involving the surveillance and infiltration of American political and civil rights organizations.
01:45:29.000Family Jewels, a CIA program to covertly assassinate foreign leaders.
01:45:36.000Operation Mockingbird as a systematic propaganda campaign with domestic and foreign journalists operating as CIA assets and dozens of US news organizations providing cover for CIA activity.
01:45:52.000It also unearthed Project Shamrock in which major telecommunications companies shared their traffic With the NSA while confirming the existence of this signals intelligence agency to the public for the first time.
01:46:08.000So the church committee is saying, what the fuck is all this secret shit going on?
01:46:18.000I hope we're seeing that now with UFOs.
01:46:21.000So that there may be some secret shit with no oversight that is about...
01:46:27.000Either back-engineering UFOs or studying UFOs.
01:46:31.000I am extremely confident in making that statement that we have exploitation programs, which is just you got physical material and you've been working on it.
01:46:42.000And I'm extremely confident in saying that there has been ongoing durational studies in every branch of our military about UFOs that don't have oversight.
01:46:52.000And, you know, look, maybe I'm wrong, but I think we're about to find out.
01:46:56.000As long as we keep pressing about this, I think we're going to find out because they're hot and bothered about it right now.
01:47:02.000The Senate Intelligence Committee, Congress, Senate, they're really pushing to make it available that people can come forward and break their NDAs.
01:47:11.000But what about the repercussions that people might experience in their personal life if they did do something like that?
01:47:16.000Even if they break their NDAs, there's still going to be people that are furious at them, right?
01:49:53.000You have to imagine that someone like Bush Sr. who was head of CIA and then his son had some high-level understanding of this as a national security issue, right?
01:50:04.000The thing is, even if he does have that understanding, what do you do with it?
01:50:08.000Like, what do you do if they come to you and they say, this is what we know?
01:50:12.000I mean, do you feel like you have this obligation to release it to the public?
01:50:15.000Because it's not going to change much.
01:50:17.000They're not going to have any control over it.
01:50:18.000The worst case scenario is people go crazy.
01:50:22.000The best case scenario is it sort of prods these agencies to release more and we get more transparency and we get more of an understanding of what's real and not real.
01:50:32.000And then perhaps more people will come forward with real stories.
01:50:36.000Is there anything in your mind that would...
01:50:39.000I always thought there's nothing that could be said that would make it worth not telling the basics.
01:50:49.000Is there anything in your mind of why you wouldn't tell the public the basics?
01:50:55.000Well, I mean, they've already kind of told basics now, but previous to this, I would say the one thing that I would say I would worry about is people losing their shit and society falling apart and maybe some people capitalizing on the fact that people have become very vulnerable.
01:51:13.000Do you think people would lose their shit if we were told UFOs are real, that we have a couple of them in our possession, at least a couple?
01:51:39.000It's gonna get in the way of understanding and examining these things because you're gonna have to somehow or another prepare some sort of talk where you have a slideshow and you show what we have and what we don't have and what we know and what we don't know.
01:51:57.000And then also, if we're not the top dog, if we have to admit that there is something that's so superior to us that it can avoid detection, that it's here constantly, they've probably been here forever, and that these things, whatever they are,
01:52:13.000have the ability to shut down our nuclear weapons, they have the ability to control essentially whatever they want to.
01:52:20.000They can shut down the power grid, they can do whatever they want.
01:52:24.000I always wondered what that thing was doing that Fravor saw, the Tic Tac.
01:52:29.000It wasn't like Hey, buddy, and just came up to him, hey, how you doing?
01:54:09.000Okay, so here's a lie that was propagated through the media and I watched like a slow-moving fucking train because I had the information, absolutely went against this.
01:54:21.000People said a ship called the Bass Strait was what was launching these, it's like an international company or whatever, like, you know, these Chinese, you know, whatever, drones.
01:54:33.000You know, that was kind of the lie that started spreading through the media.
01:54:37.000Well, I'll tell you, man, there was an investigation of the Bass Strait in port.
01:54:45.000So this lie started being pushed through mainstream media that this was the source of these drones in 2019. It's like they're trying to just make it all go away.
01:54:56.000The UAPTF, our government, did an investigation on that ship while it was in port the day after.
01:55:02.000But I have talked to sailors who their job at the time of these swarms, I'll just say from the Paul Hamilton, another ship that was involved, they were watching the Bass Strait to make sure they were not the origin of these launches and landings.
01:56:59.000Our technology is better at picking them up, and there is a physical increase in frequency of these unidentifieds in areas they shouldn't be, from our operational standpoint.
01:57:12.000And then the discussion, I think once you start thinking about this, it's so exciting that I think people like to talk about it because it opens worlds to us.
01:57:26.000It's a unique time in history, right, that we can have this conversation and not be laughed out the room just because we're doing a thought puzzle here.
01:57:44.000That's part of the problem with the UFO narrative, the UFO story, is that it makes people look ridiculous and foolish because it's so crazy.
02:00:24.000We know they have a history of actively trying to dismiss these stories.
02:00:29.000Oh yeah, to the point where part of the operation, like you read about that church committee, where they'll put people into communities to disrupt them.
02:00:38.000The words would be to shape the emerging UFO narrative to this day.
02:01:22.000You know, they have an us versus them mentality.
02:01:24.000And I definitely think that lawmakers and, you know...
02:01:27.000And the like would have that as well, especially people involved in intelligence agencies.
02:01:32.000I mean, that's part of the gig is that you have access to stuff that the average person does not because you can handle it.
02:01:39.000And, you know, you're trained this way and this is how you behave.
02:01:44.000And so that information comes along that's really fucking wild.
02:01:49.000Like, there's this interdimensional spacecraft that can just appear over the ocean and disappear, and you go to fucking chase it faster than your eye can follow.
02:02:15.000First of all, I got a no-douchebag policy.
02:02:17.000Everybody I know in government is fucking cool as shit.
02:02:18.000They're not like some ego-tripping maniacs.
02:02:21.000A lot of people think this information, the basics should be public.
02:02:24.000They think it's a crime that it's been held back.
02:02:26.000But there's just policies in place that they can't violate.
02:02:29.000Yeah, there's policies in place, and the main thing is their security clearances are their jobs, even when they're out, right?
02:02:34.000So if you lose that, even when you're out, it changes your fucking life.
02:02:39.000You've had this whole career that you're doing, but people I know in these positions that have access to this information, whether we believe them or not, they're good people.
02:02:48.000I think they want this information to be public, and they think it's bigger than themselves, but that's what we're seeing.
02:02:53.000We're seeing Finally, representative government representing the public's interest to know about this.
02:03:00.000Now, is there anything under the hood?
02:03:03.000Do you think that them releasing information and having these discussions is their way of preparing us for the inevitable?
02:03:12.000That maybe this is the best way to do it.
02:03:14.000To get some information out there and say, we have recovered off-world crafts and we're seeing things that are not ours and the propulsion systems are not based on any known physics that we have a grasp of.
02:03:32.000That when they're telling us this, it's because they think that it's going to blow up in our face.
02:03:39.000And so we've got to get some information out there to prepare people.
02:03:43.000Otherwise, we're going to have a collapse of society.
02:03:45.000We're going to have a UFO landing on the White House lawn and panic in the streets.
02:03:49.000And that they think that somehow or another they can mitigate some of the more negative aspects of that by releasing some data now.
02:03:57.000A lot of people have said that to me and even said, you know, maybe you're a part of that and don't even know and that's why you're getting videos and shit and all that.
02:04:06.000The thing is that the reality though, if someone could just see that, you know, the reality is the people I know that are fighting for this inside and creating the language and trying to get this to happen, it's not organized from the diabolical or even like,
02:04:58.000We're talking about it now and it's not fucked to talk about it now.
02:05:02.000You can have these conversations because people I favor come forward, you know?
02:05:06.000Do you ever feel like some of the stuff that you've been shown that you're not supposed to show that it would really benefit society to release that stuff?
02:05:16.000To the point where you almost feel compelled?
02:05:19.000Like how much difference do you, how much different do you think the conversation would be about UFOs if people saw and knew what you know?
02:05:41.000I did not believe his last thing about not being interested in UFOs, by the way.
02:05:46.000Well, I feel like that might have been motivated at least slightly by the fact that he smoked weed on my show and got in trouble with NASA. Oh, don't do that, huh?
02:05:58.000When he was so quickly dismissing it, well, they sure are subtle, you know, when he was saying that.
02:06:03.000I was like, well, wouldn't they be subtle?
02:06:05.000Like, what would they be doing unless they're trying to freak us the fuck out?
02:06:09.000But when he smoked weed on the podcast and got in trouble with NASA, I would imagine that you'd want to show yourself as a respectable ball player.
02:06:26.000I'm curious if they film the launches.
02:06:30.000If they have any footage of those launches being observed by what we call UAP or UFOs because I have a pilot and he gave me footage from he was in this lucky position during one of these launches Mm-hmm.
02:07:10.000But I am curious if Elon's company probably films the shit out of every part of those launches.
02:07:17.000Wouldn't it be interesting if these unidentifieds, whatever they are, were kind of observing us playing with these rockets?
02:07:23.000Maybe Elon needs to strap a nuke to one of those things just to see how much...
02:07:50.000When it comes to stuff like UFOs and non, you know, I mean, if there was a secret that, like, affect mankind, you know, people are going to die.
02:08:02.000Let's say this all goes well, and there is actually something under the hood with the UFO thing, and that this congressional language does bring forward people.
02:08:11.000Like, fuck, you know, Bob's already said everything to George in 1980. But people that have security clearances, let's pretend this goes well.
02:08:18.000I would like to sit down with Bob again because I wonder what the experience has been like for Bob with the documentary coming out and then being on the podcast.
02:10:08.000Well, there's a lot of people that are paranoid schizophrenics that are just running around accusing everybody of being a spy and being part of government agencies and what have you.
02:10:18.000But isn't it just easier to dismiss what somebody says if you can just dismiss them as being genuine or honest?
02:10:39.000Everything is he said, she said, and here's some data, and there's a thing that's going faster than the speed of sound by a factor of 20 or something like that.
02:14:11.000That things become really well known and then they become a thing that a person sort of formulates in their head when they have a questionable experience.
02:14:43.000Weren't really there or that were inaccurate like their version of it that they when they recount it is all fucked up because the mind gets scrambled by period by moments of extremely high stress high adrenaline worried you're gonna die you know explosion like everybody has like fucked up stories and Yeah,
02:15:06.000we try to explain these experiences that are so outside of our norm that how do you describe it?
02:15:14.000You have to take things that you know in order to describe those things.
02:15:20.000I'm trying to think of a good, concrete example of that.
02:15:24.000It is my understanding when I listen to people that I do believe had these close encounters that they can't find the words to describe the experience because they've never had an experience like this before.
02:15:43.000A lot of times when people describe psychedelic experiences, they sort of tend to describe them the way they've heard other people describe them because it makes it more comfortable and easy.
02:15:53.000And I think that one of the more interesting things about this whole idea of UFOs happening or, excuse me, encounters happening to people while they sleep is Is that, you know,
02:16:09.000you could dismiss one aspect of it by saying that it's an endogenous dump of naturally produced psychedelic chemicals, which we know the mind creates.
02:17:28.000It was interesting because they were like, fuck you.
02:17:31.000Because I think what I was trying to do was maybe control my thoughts during the experience instead of just letting go.
02:17:38.000And maybe I had some sort of an elevated idea of Bringing back my experience and telling other people and seeming profound and they were just like fuck you.
02:17:50.000And it was it was interesting that these jokers and they were jesters like court jesters with the hats and everything.
02:17:57.000And I think it was to sort of let me explain to me in some way that I have a very unique job and that part of my job is what's what's important is not take myself too seriously.
02:18:25.000Instead of just thinking that what you do is probably a gift and you're very fortunate, so don't Don't take yourself very seriously, but you're just a very fortunate person that's in this unique position.
02:18:36.000But it's not like that you're special.
02:20:13.000It felt, like, it was a miraculous thing that I never even heard of happening with people.
02:20:20.000But it was like, from that moment on, like my older brother, you know, was around just to, you know, because I didn't know this shaman guy, right?
02:20:28.000So like, I wanted someone to have my back.
02:21:20.000Yeah, it was like, it was the only time that I ever felt my body possessed by something other, you know, something else.
02:21:27.000And then it, like, did a system check.
02:21:30.000Like, imagine you have a billion drawers of number two pencils, all different colors at different lengths, and it opens each drawer and looks that you've used that, you know, one quarter amount, and they shut the drawer.
02:21:41.000It was like, like, it just did a system check.
02:22:40.000Yeah, yeah, but these are indicators that like whatever it is the universe is giving you that you're not on the path that you're supposed to be on Yeah, man because our past like the minds been very varied I'm always finding my place my place in life in what I didn't think I would do you know I always thought I would you know train judo or boxing or you know that I would always do like a martial art or When I started making films,
02:23:04.000and I started making art, fine art, and then making films, I never thought I'd be in that.
02:23:08.000I had a loss of identity, a loss of my spirit.
02:23:11.000I was so off course, I got so sick from something called valley fever, I couldn't train anymore.
02:23:19.000You inhale a fungus or a spore, and it attacks your lungs, and typically people could feel like they got a cold, or they fucking die, or something like that.
02:23:28.000And what happened was I was overseas and I had been harboring it in my body for about two and a half months.
02:23:34.000And I look at myself in the mirror and I'm fucking like skeleton.
02:23:37.000And an emergency came home, went to special disease at UCLA, and they treated me for it, which is you take this whole body antifungal.
02:23:45.000But the problem is it had gone into my lungs, my kidneys, near my heart, like it got into my bloodstream.
02:23:52.000So I started getting like an abscess in my arm.
02:23:59.000But when that happened, it took from me the ability to do what I thought I was, and I had to completely re-understand my life that I am not just the things that I do, that the things I do come from who I am, where my passion is.
02:24:16.000So that was a learning lesson for me, is going through an illness that stopped me from doing what I loved to do and thought that's all I would ever do.
02:24:26.000So the path is like curvy, but I accept that as long as I'm being true and I'm not feeling that anxiety and pain.
02:24:37.000With your fascination of the UFO experience and then you having psychedelic experiences, did you feel like there's any sort of connection between psychedelic experiences and UFO experiences?
02:24:50.000Did you think that those realms that you access through psychedelics in any way are related to extraterrestrial intelligence?
02:26:00.000So we're by where I live, and we're just hanging out, and we're going on a walk, and it's just as the sun is kind of setting, just, you know, talking shit.
02:26:11.000And he makes some fucking joke, and he's like...
02:26:14.000Oh, coming out to see the UFO expert, I figured I'd see a UFO. I really wish we could see one.
02:29:48.000He also writes, I should point out the white lights at the front of the craft, assuming that it was moving forward, and those lights pulsated separately from the body of the craft, which also pulsated.
02:31:09.000Almost like the uniqueness, the novelty of it, that it was so wild and that you knew you were seeing something unique to the point where it captivates you.
02:31:29.000I'm the guy, you know, hunting UFOs, talk to all these people every day that have encounters that I believe, and I never saw shit.
02:31:35.000I would always be the guy going in to get the night vision goggles to look at the sky and everybody starts screaming, oh my god, did you just see that?
02:31:42.000I was the guy always with his back turned.
02:31:57.000Like, when you have an experience yourself, there's probably this pause where you don't really want to talk about it because you don't want everybody to think you're a loon.
02:32:28.000I think that if it is what we think it is, if there is a presence, let's just call it non-human intelligence, and it is engaging humanity and has been for a long fucking time since the beginning of recorded human history, if not before, if any of this is true,
02:32:43.000it seems reasonable that in some way they want to be seen on a personal level.
02:32:53.000If any of this is true, If you look up, man, just look the fuck up.
02:33:00.000You know, I believe if you really want it and you look up, there's something to this UFO thing, man.
02:33:05.000Well, I know that there's been a series of sightings in Southern California and that a lot of people saw things, particularly off of Catalina.
02:33:25.000That's an interesting area of the world.
02:33:26.000There are some places that seem to have higher activity of these UFOs.
02:33:32.000Do you think maybe one of the explanations would be that Catalina is off the coast of California and that they use the water as like a place where they have a base or where they meet or where they...
02:33:54.000I was told a long time ago by an admiral that I trust, like family, that this is important to look into, that there's meat on the bone, And that every branch of our military studies this current day,
02:34:14.000and this was 10 years ago, having this conversation.
02:34:17.000I was asking him, should I waste my time on this Lazar guy?
02:34:21.000Specifically, because this is a person that would know.
02:35:23.000The movie The Abyss was fascinating, right?
02:35:25.000Because that opened up people's ideas to the idea, or opened up people's minds to the idea that there could be a spaceship in the water and aliens in the water.
02:35:35.000And that, of course, you would have no idea that they were there.
02:36:33.000That's your interdimensional theory right there.
02:36:35.000The idea that there's popping into timelines across space and time.
02:36:42.000Well, I think if you were an incredibly advanced being, you know, if you think about the human race, if the human race doesn't blow itself up and we move on and continue to advance for another million years,
02:36:58.000you would assume that we would have...
02:37:02.000The ability to do all kinds of things that are just science fiction now.
02:37:07.000And one of them might be interdimensional travel, access to realms that are previously unseen that we just don't understand because we're just too primitive.
02:37:17.000It was preposterous to fly like a bird at one time.
02:37:36.000So maybe what we're witnessing is just nature.
02:37:39.000See, that's my whole thing with this UFO thing is if this is just nature, if this is part of the ecosystem of the world we live in, We're just like, UFOs are part of our reality.
02:37:49.000There's nothing we can do about that anymore.
02:38:53.000So they're allowing us to formulate new thoughts based on these experiences and contact and sightings.
02:39:01.000I mean, it's such an altruistic way of looking at it, but if I was this hyper-intelligent species, whether being here on Earth or just being here a long time, maybe I got stuck here, or I'm from somewhere else, bringing people, adapting people to your presence and helping an evolution,
02:39:17.000a technological evolution, these craft that crash, Like, maybe that's to inspire the next leap for us.
02:40:29.000But people are seeing things in the sky that seem to be machines.
02:40:33.000I mean, no matter what, they describe that.
02:40:35.000There's also these ancient depictions and paintings of what looks like people in spacecraft flying around.
02:40:42.000One of the first posts I ever did on my website is an image of a painting from pre-flight days, and it shows this fucking disc, and it's shooting down light onto John the Baptist or something.
02:45:13.000It's like the inconsistency is confusing to me.
02:45:17.000And the idea that they wouldn't be interested in us is, to me, preposterous.
02:45:24.000If we found something like us somewhere else, we would be so...
02:45:28.000If we found frogs on Mars, just frogs, you know?
02:45:34.000I mean if you believe the messaging that people talk about like that I'm friends with these two ladies.
02:45:40.000They were at the aerial school And they you know were with that's where the craft landed and Like a bunch of kids 60 kids or something They see it John Mack went and studied it all this stuff so that the two Females that I know that were their closest proximity to what they said was a being that came out They're like We were mesmerized by it like looking in the eyes of this thing they were mesmerized by it was the words and
02:46:11.000It put these images in their head which at the time Didn't mean anything much to them.
02:46:17.000It was like destruction of the earth like this whole thing But talking to him now They're like maybe we're supposed to talk about this It's still with them like what they saw if you believe their story or not they believe it'll tell you that much and You know,
02:46:33.000that they got these visual messages, and I've heard this over and over and over.
02:46:37.000I wonder what they're up to, these fucking weird things, man.
02:46:40.000Putting ideas into people's heads, man.
02:49:02.000I think the idea would be that we're lab rats.
02:49:06.000I think that's what's scary to me, is that somehow or another we're being examined.
02:49:10.000And we are such a preposterous, yet super advanced civilization.
02:49:15.000I mean, we're governed by politicians that are clearly corrupt and also full of shit.
02:49:21.000We allow those same people to control various aspects of the way we interact with other governments that could lead to mass deaths and often do.
02:51:52.000Other legislative people from other countries have reached out to me, saying that they want to replicate what the U.S. is doing in their country.
02:52:01.000So the U.S. is doing it most openly now?
02:52:04.000Right now, I would say that is a correct statement.
02:52:07.000I mean, fast and hard, this language, the UFO language in the National Defense Authorization Act of 2023, UFO whistleblower language?
02:54:23.000I got that evil bad feeling where I thought something bad was going to happen.
02:54:27.000I think anytime there's any kind of an organization, any kind of an organization, someone from the federal government infiltrates it and tries to get them to do something fucked up so that they can invade and then take people down and arrest them.
02:54:42.000But it was kind of beautiful, though, to see people be able to get close to this, like, super secret gate that normally you'd be thrown on the ground in front of.
02:55:32.000I've talked to a lot of employees, a lot, like former employees, current employees, and it's so compartmentalized.
02:55:40.000But the one place, I don't think I should say this because then maybe they'll stop doing it, but the one place where the word on the wash is strong, as they say, is the bar at 51. There's a bar there?
02:56:05.000But it's like, it's always the bar, right, where people talk, so that's where all the rumors go.
02:56:08.000So Site 4, all that stuff, after talking maybe, you know, 30, 40 people, current, past, all that stuff, you know, people know that there's a facility at Papoose.
02:56:20.000So, if you think that they moved everything out of there when Bob started opening his mouth in the late 80s, is there any speculation as to where they would have moved it?
02:56:29.000I have no speculation, and I don't know they did move it.
02:56:42.000Actually, somebody that I've spoken with on record has gone there because they had access to...
02:56:49.000The second they hit Papoose Dry Lake, out of nowhere, civilian contractors with machine guns and black attire...
02:57:00.000Put him face down, and he's a Navy guy.
02:57:03.000He's a Navy guy with like a good access to the land of 51, because it's so compartmentalized, usually you couldn't run around, but what he was doing, which I... It's not important, but he had access to more of the land.
02:57:32.000I don't know if people know this, but the U.S. would never sell satellite time to take photos of Papoose Lake in 1989, 1990. So he hired a Russian satellite to take photos.
02:58:29.000If it's as Lazar described, which, by the way, I've had so many confirmations that it is, there is a facility there like Bob described, right?
02:58:49.000And if you know what you're looking for when you fly in to Switzerland, you can see markings on the roads where the planes come out of hills that are completely disguised as foliage and that.
02:59:00.000The planes come out, taxi onto the roads and take off.
03:01:16.000Footage there's you can see roads down to the lake, but that just means people drive down there.
03:01:20.000And Papoose Lake is a dry lake bed, correct?
03:01:22.000Right, so it's just south of Area 51. Area 51 is the box, right?
03:01:27.000So it is a designation within the Nellis base, and they're all numbered and labeled Papoose.
03:01:33.000So there's Area 51 proper with the runway.
03:01:36.000And then where Bob, you know, would get on the bus is from Area 51, and I have people that saw him get on a bus and drive south, and then, you know, drive down to Papoose Lake.
03:01:48.000And is there a road that leads to Papoose Lake?
03:01:50.000There's two, so that one that goes along there.