In this episode of the Joe Rogan Experience podcast, I sit down with my good friend and long time martial arts student, Joe "The Beast" Rogan. We talk about his journey to becoming a black belt in Brazilian jiu-jitsu, how he trains on the road, and what it's like being a martial arts instructor in the big city. We also talk about some of the crazy things he does to keep himself in shape, and how he got into jiu jitsu in the first place. I hope you enjoy this episode, and don't forget to subscribe on your favorite streaming platform so you don't miss the next episode! I'm looking forward to seeing what you guys have to say about it in the comments section below! Tweet me if you have any questions, suggestions, or suggestions for topics or topics you'd like me to cover in future episodes. Timestamps: 3:00 - What s your favorite thing you do to keep yourself in shape? 4:30 - How do you train? 5:15 - How often do you do jiujitsu? 6:00 What do you go to sleep? 7:20 - How much money do you spend on your training? 8:40 - What does it take to be a good martial arts coach? 9:30 10:00 | What santa? 11:15 | What is a good training day? 12:30 | What's your favorite piece of equipment do you use? 15: What sana? 16: What are you looking for? 17:40 | Should you need? 18:40 19:20 | How much do you need to get better? 21: Should you practice? 22:15 23:20 26:00 // 27:30 What s a good piece of advice? 27:00 Is it a good thing to learn? 29:00 Do you want to learn a new piece of jiu Jitsu podcast? 32: What is your favorite jiuJitsu Podcast? ? 33: 35:00 / 32:00 What szn 36:00 Thoughts on a good place to practice Jiu Jitsu Podcast 39:00 & 35:10 40:00 + 35:40 / 45:00 A little bit more? 45:50
00:00:29.000No luck with that company, so we just...
00:00:31.000It's like, oh, that company doesn't exist anymore.
00:00:33.000And so, had to get a different one in there, but it's fine.
00:00:36.000We just got done putting a bunch of the oil on it, sauna oil, because Arizona, the sun just cooks the fucking wood, so it was cracking in spaces.
00:00:49.000The real hardcore folks, they use the wood-fired sauna, old school, like you're cooking pizza.
00:02:05.000Rather than allowing them to go, hey, I got this cool thing where you go upside down and stand on your head and do a backflip and, like, buggy choke.
00:02:14.000Don't, please, I don't, I'm 58, please don't try to tell me what a buggy choke is right now.
00:02:20.000I might, someday, but right now I just want to Fucking get the triangles right.
00:02:24.000Buggy joke's a good thing to learn, though.
00:02:26.000Yeah, I want to learn it, but let me learn it when I'm going to spend three weeks on it and focused on it with somebody who understands the details, somebody who also understands the counters.
00:02:39.000Because the counters end up being as important as understanding the actual...
00:02:44.000Somebody caught a buggy choke recently in MMA, I think it was in Bellator, and the dude picked him up and slammed him.
00:03:39.000For jujitsu, it's been around for years, rather.
00:03:42.000But for MMA, it's just starting to be applied.
00:03:46.000But the beautiful thing about, especially that high level of MMA, is that somebody's going to figure out how to counter it or prevent it, and then it's gone.
00:04:00.000I mean, for a while, all of a sudden, people were catching the Von Flu, and then all of a sudden, people were like, no, no, we're going to counter that now.
00:05:02.000Like if you said, I want a guy who was a professor of philosophy at Columbia University, who's a genius, who fell in love with jujitsu and is dedicated to it so much so that he walks around with a rash guard every day.
00:05:39.000You know, like there's certain techniques that you just, you know, when you get trapped in them, you really have to mind your P's and Q's when you get out if you have a gi.
00:05:48.000And, you know, I like training both because I like kind of training my mind to not rely on the gi.
00:05:55.000But then when there's something like a lapel or, you know, a jacket or a gi available, then I've trained how to deal with that piece of fabric that's now a tool for you.
00:06:07.000Well, I got very fortunate that I learned Gi from John-Jacques Machado.
00:06:11.000And John-Jacques Machado only has one hand.
00:07:39.000So you're, like, you're trying to get a solid seven, eight hours sleep, but you end up having to get 11 hours of sleep because three or four of that is you waking up in the middle of the night because you hit bumps.
00:09:33.000He has left us and gone on to the next stage of existence.
00:09:37.000But that machine he developed because Louis was like a world famous power lifter and his back got fucked and they told him to get his back fused because it was compressed and so he figured out a way to decompress the spine With active decompression.
00:09:51.000So that thing, as it swings down, and you'll feel it, I'll show it to you afterwards when we go into the gym, that thing decompresses your spine on the downswing, and then on the upswing, it actually strengthens the muscles around the back.
00:10:04.000Anybody that has the room for it and has some issues with their lower back, even if you don't have issues, if you don't want to ever have issues, I can't recommend that machine enough.
00:10:45.000So even just going to do jujitsu during harvest is, like, nearly impossible because you're doing 10-hour days, and so I just don't have the time.
00:10:52.000And you're in the sun, so by the time your day is done, you're like, I need a beer and I need to go to sleep.
00:11:42.000I think the combination of the things that you do is so unique.
00:11:47.000You know, the fact that you run this winery and you're very serious about it, you make this amazing wine, and yet also you're making this fucking killer music, and you're doing the two of them together.
00:12:38.000When the whole lockdown shit happened and we couldn't tour, it sucked because I just released the Tool album and then on the heels of that I released the poster for Existential Reckoning and we couldn't tour Existential Reckoning.
00:12:56.000So what we did, we figured out, okay, screw it, everybody's doing these streaming events, pay-per-views.
00:13:30.000We did Billy Dee and the Hall of Feathered Servants, which was all of the Money Shot album and all the luchador stuff that we shot at the Mayan Theater.
00:13:41.000So we went ahead and did this still during lockdown before we actually got back on the road.
00:13:45.000We did Conditions of My Parole, the whole album, called Parole Violator.
00:13:50.000So it's a bunch of stuff that's got Billy Dee and Major Douche and a bunch of the characters, Hildy and everything, along with everything from Conditions of My Parole.
00:13:58.000And we did a bunch of the V is for Vagina era songs, reworked them completely and shot that all in the Sunset Sound studio in Hollywood.
00:14:09.000There's some bits in that one as well.
00:14:12.000But those are two pay-per-views that are coming out this coming weekend, Halloween weekend.
00:14:17.000And do you do these pay-per-views off your website?
00:14:20.000Well, yeah, Pusser4TV.com is where they're going to live for now as a temporary thing.
00:14:26.000Eventually, we'll release them on Blu-ray and through iTunes and all that stuff.
00:14:35.000Yeah, so it's just such a fun, when I figured out what it was and how we can do it, and how we were like duck to water with it, which is, all of us are really good with just the concepts, putting it all together.
00:14:50.000Matt Mitchell's an incredible, not only just a producer for the record and an engineer, but also his approach to figuring out how to put all these things together.
00:15:00.000And our team, his girlfriend Elisa, You're living a fun life, dude.
00:15:28.000Yeah, but I think, you know, a friend with Mark Brooks, who used to be a part of Metalocalypse, and conversations I'd had with him, and various other people that have been involved in those things, they're like...
00:15:39.000As soon as you go down that path with somebody like Adult Swim or Comedy Central or whatever things, they just own that thing now.
00:15:45.000So imagine me getting in the wrong contract and now all these characters that I've developed, I can't even take these on the road now because some other douchebag owns them.
00:15:57.000What about doing a series, you know, doing it yourself?
00:16:01.000Well, I think my attention span, I think being the full hour and change thing, that makes sense.
00:16:10.000Doing the small episodes and having to build in all those stories for an entire season and have somebody expect following through with the next season.
00:16:21.000You have to kind of manage, you have so many interests, you kind of have to manage your time wisely, don't you?
00:16:28.000Because the vineyard, the winery requires so much focus and so much attention, as does the creation of the music.
00:16:36.000And I couldn't do, with the winery, the success of the winery, I couldn't do it without people like my wife and Tim White and Calvin and The various people that are involved, Aaron Weiss, in kind of handling their jobs, the delegation of what you guys do.
00:16:53.000I have to be there to make the decisions when it comes to the winemaking.
00:17:00.000Deciding what's going to go in what tank, because everything ends up making, changes the outcome of what's happening.
00:17:07.000And that's just the approaches of when we're picking the grapes, what grapes are we planting?
00:17:11.000All those things come back to me, but the follow-through, if I didn't have...
00:17:17.000Jen and Tim and Calvin and Aaron and all my vineyard managers, Chris and Jesse, if I didn't have those people in place, I couldn't do it at all, at all.
00:17:27.000So it's not just a matter of me organizing my time.
00:17:32.000It's also about me delegating to people that I can trust to make the decision beyond the initial framework that I've set in place.
00:17:41.000Now, when you make wine and you grow these grapes, the grapes vary seasonally.
00:17:49.000Does the flavor vary depending upon the weather conditions and what you do and don't do to the soil?
00:18:20.000Every completely untrackable thing that you could think of in terms of the levels of moisture, when that moisture hits that soil, how deep does that moisture go in, the content, the geology of the soil, the weather patterns in that area and how they shift year to year.
00:18:39.000What actual clone did you plant in that spot and how that clone is going to react differently to all of those infinite variables of just the soil, never mind the infinite variables of the weather.
00:18:50.000And then when you choose to pick how you choose to prune, how many clusters you decide to set on that particular vine, how you decide to train that vine, is it going to be a unilateral, is it going to be bilateral, is it going to be just a Bush pruned, all these different variables about how you're going to do that farming,
00:19:11.000In general though, if there's a particular region that does well with a particular grape, like Oregon with Pinot Noir, there might be various ways that they're pruning and adjusting how they're training and growing that fruit.
00:19:28.000But generally speaking, it's going to be Pinot from Oregon.
00:19:32.000It's going to have a particular profile across that state.
00:19:37.000Variations from region to region, from site to site, from producer to producer.
00:19:41.000But in general, it should have a signature that suggests Oregon Pinot.
00:19:52.000Do you follow like other types of, do you follow like cigar growing or coffee growing or all these other different things that vary so much on the soil and things along those lines?
00:20:19.000I just picked up, it's not here yet, we picked up a nice modern roaster.
00:20:25.000Because once I move the Osteria that's in Cottonwood up to the new Hill Project, that building in Cottonwood will become a coffee roaster and breakfast brunch place.
00:20:38.000So we're actually pursuing relationships with beans and importers of coffee beans.
00:20:46.000So when you do that, like, I'm good friends with Evan Hafer from Black Rival Coffee, and he'll travel all over the world and try out different beans and try out different things, and that's what this stuff is right here.
00:21:15.000So, you know, so I have my, you know, Todd Fox is basically my go-to guy.
00:21:21.000He actually has that eye of the tiger on those kind of things, and he'll point out things, because I'm just, dude, I'm living and I'm going, and he'll go, Check out the difference between these Colombian beans and these Brazilian beans.
00:21:49.000He goes, those are the Brazilian beans.
00:21:51.000So he's starting to help me kind of identify what it is that I like in a coffee, in an approach, because I don't Like a band, I don't have to sound like Pink Floyd or Led Zeppelin.
00:22:04.000I just have to sound like me and express the way I'm going to express.
00:22:08.000So I don't need to be able to make every kind of coffee from every part of the world.
00:22:14.000I just need to figure out the ones that I like because I'm kind of, in a way, I'm making it for me, but I'm also selling it.
00:22:36.000And he, we went down like a three-hour rabbit hole of coffee where he explained to me all the beans initially came from Ethiopia and how their flavors changed as they moved them to South America and grew them in Colombia.
00:23:27.000I was at I went to do a an article and a training session out at gun site and in Outside of pre and paulden Arizona.
00:23:37.000It's an old-school training facility and And I went there, you know, early morning, we were going to do this whole gun range thing, and this guy named Charlie, sitting at the table, he goes, you want some coffee?
00:24:12.000I do a little bit of cream, and I've been pretty consistent with that lately because now I'm focusing on what beans I like.
00:24:21.000And for me, I know it's going to change once I remove the cream, but that's the lens that I see the coffee through is I have to have the cream in there because that's how I'm going to drink it.
00:24:33.000So I'm trying to figure out what ones I like and with that lens.
00:24:36.000I know that if I remove that lens, it's probably going to change my perception of what coffees I like.
00:24:43.000It's funny, the cream debate, whether or not you should put cream in coffee.
00:25:02.000I like a little cream in there, but generally I just drink it black now.
00:25:05.000Yeah, I'm planning trips to Hawaii because I want to establish some relationships with some Maui growers so that I can actually make that be part of what I'm doing in Arizona, but also because I get to go train with Luis.
00:26:33.000But those days, like those early days of the UFC were so interesting because, like, there's nothing like MMA in that regard or jiu-jitsu where you can go back just 25 years and you go and look at the difference between the art form then and what it is now.
00:26:50.000It's just evolved in leaps and bounds.
00:26:56.000Yeah, we could go on for hours about it, but when I first started at Pico, you could tell that there was a club within the club, and I was never going to have access to that information.
00:28:39.000Well, I mean, that's where it becomes fascinating where a guy like John Donaher kind of like leaps to the top of this thing with just this analytical perspective that's completely free of dogma.
00:28:51.000All he cares about is what is the correct way to do things.
00:28:54.000What's the most effective in tried and true competition format.
00:28:59.000Like, this is what we've learned without any bullshit.
00:29:05.000And, you know, that's been great for me to be on the road training with somebody like John, like my friends at Easton and Denver and, you know, Dave and Dan Camarillo.
00:29:17.000They all have a slightly different approach to the things.
00:29:20.000Some of the guys are going to be a little more self-defense oriented, so they're going to be looking to check your position and make sure you can't get hit in the face.
00:29:42.000At the end of the day, it is about me taking you offline and advancing.
00:29:47.000But really it's about you and your self-discovery and your ability for self-control.
00:29:53.000Me being able to control my body to do a thing.
00:29:57.000And if you don't have that self-awareness of understanding that this isn't just you flopping around like a fish accidentally kneeing some dude in the face while you're going for a move, you're not really progressing if you don't understand that it is about your self-control.
00:30:10.000So Okay, yeah, that's a self-defense approach to the jiu-jitsu, but I'm also conscious enough to know, okay, I'm going to do this.
00:30:18.000I'm going to play around with X card and see what happens because I've never done it, and I want to see what that is.
00:30:23.000How much does training in jiu-jitsu help just your mind, the way you approach life and the way you think about things?
00:30:32.000Well, like I've mentioned before on your show, this is the hardest thing I've ever done in my life.
00:30:40.000A klutzy dude who this is not natural for me to do.
00:30:47.000And because of that, because of that, forever it was stressful.
00:30:52.000And so you're activating your mind in a stressful situation and you're still getting oxygen in your blood and you're moving and you're opening up things.
00:31:01.000But at some point it became more like chess.
00:31:06.000Instead of this, oh my God, this guy's going to tap me.
00:31:10.000Well, of course he's going to tap you.
00:31:12.000If you just get that in your head like, I might lose today.
00:31:18.000Be comfortable in that moment of understanding how to be conscious and aware in that moment so that you can recognize the moment before you get to the moment now for next time.
00:31:30.000That was a weird shift for me, getting to a position of, like, I'm in a compromised position, but I'm going to get to a safe position within the compromised position, take a deep breath, and pay attention to what he does next, so that next time I can be ahead of what he does next.
00:32:27.000These are things that apply to every area of your life.
00:32:30.000If you can find one that's more difficult for you than the other ones, you'll improve the things that come naturally to you by focusing on the thing that doesn't come naturally to you.
00:32:41.000Yeah, it's the great quote from Miyamoto Musashi.
00:32:44.000Once you understand the way broadly, you can see it in all things.
00:32:54.000And that's the thing that's missed by people that don't practice it, that think of it as like some sort of brutal endeavor for, you know, macho brutes, assholes.
00:33:05.000Yeah, I mean, but, you know, we know those guys.
00:33:53.000I think things like jujitsu, things like growing food...
00:33:58.000Resigning yourself to nature and having to navigate farming those kind of things they start to reset you in a way where like it's not this not everything has to be an argument mm-hmm sometimes it's you just having to navigate the fucking weather yeah if you can get to that mindset you get a lot more done honestly and you'll survive shit that some people won't because they're so focused on the petty dumb shit that they're gonna miss the bigger picture I think a lot of the petty stuff is people also want you to agree with
00:34:32.000You know, so many people, they have an opinion and they feel like if they can't convince you that they're correct or they can't force their opinion on you, that somehow or another it invalidates their own perspective.
00:34:53.000Well, I just watched this guy beat the shit out of everyone at ADCC, and he's not doing the things that you're telling me that you're supposed to only do.
00:36:18.000And getting them to understand, like, when you walk in the room and you see a dude shaped like you, that might not be the biggest sniper in the room.
00:36:27.000It might be that geeky kid in the corner who looks like he probably works in a library.
00:40:30.000Doesn't really happen anymore, but the kind of guy that you wish you were at the end of the bar in some scenario where two dudes or one guy is just fucking with the nerd at the bar.
00:42:22.000If you're just going to force your will on some other dude, then it's just two idiots trying to force their will on each other and you're going to gas out.
00:42:30.000You have to see what this thing is and this person, how they're approaching you.
00:43:10.000So for me, there's not really a blank slate.
00:43:11.000It's me going to, maybe it's me going to Matt and going, okay, just in general, I'd like to see what we can do with, there's some sounds that I heard on this, you know, Maybe it was a movie soundtrack.
00:43:29.000You know, maybe I'm picking out, like, mandolin or, you know, some kind of a particular pedal from a guitar or a film that has, like, a Rykoot or a riff going through it or something, a vibe.
00:43:41.000And maybe Matt has picked up, in the case of Existential Reckoning, he picked up a bunch of amazing old synths, like Fairlight and Sinclair and all this kind of cool shit that's, in a way, it's...
00:43:55.000Yeah, so old school, like, you know, Kraftwerk, you know, Yes, old, like, you know, Michael Jackson's, like...
00:44:02.000Like, that familiar sound that's from a very specific...
00:44:09.000And you can manipulate those sounds to a point, but you're kind of boxed in on what those things can do in some cases.
00:44:18.000Like the Fairlight, it's going to give you a very specific sound.
00:44:23.000Now there's the framework, and he'll come up with a melody or a thing, and he'll throw it to me, and I'll just drill, drill, drill that thing into my head, driving around with it in my car, truck.
00:44:36.000You know, putting headphones on on the plane and just listen in the cellar.
00:44:40.000I'll put it on while I'm working on stuff just to just to put that thing on loop and drill it into my head of what it is so that I can figure out how to go through around or over this thing, work with it, work against it intentionally.
00:44:57.000So it's it's a it's a mathematical three dimensional geometric puzzle.
00:45:03.000So when you're listening to it and you're just like going over in your head, you're just like allowing it to talk to you?
00:45:21.000Or is the riff cutting me off on a particular rhythm or a melody?
00:45:25.000Because, you know, you might have a melody in mind, but you get closer to the end of that riff and it might have changed directions, then your note is sour.
00:45:33.000So you have to pay attention to what note goes with that thing, and rhythmically as well as sonically, like, you know, melodically.
00:45:42.000So it's you getting used to this thing, and he might be able to move it.
00:45:46.000I might go, hey man, can we adjust a few things in here and move forward?
00:45:50.000So it is definitely a step-by-step piece.
00:46:03.000And then at some point, I'll go to Karina and go, hey, I'd like to hear, before I go too far, I want to hear what you would do over what I've done, over what he's done.
00:46:14.000And now it's a triad of us navigating that sonic landscape.
00:46:21.000So it must be an interesting dance in that you have to do it with people that have sort of the same engagement that you do, the same level of discipline, the same...
00:46:32.000Same level of discipline, but strengths where I don't have strengths, I have strengths where they don't have strengths.
00:46:38.000So you're kind of filling in each other's gaps with a common goal.
00:46:46.000So yeah, we definitely have common things that we like, but we also bring different strengths to the table to make it work as a whole.
00:46:54.000That's one of the more challenging things I would imagine about a band, is that you kind of have to get everybody on the same sort of...
00:48:00.000I found that when I started listening more and reacting more as a listener, the reinforcement of that behavior was that there was a better thing that came out the other end rather than just sounding like something I'd already done before, jammed over something that somebody else has already done before.
00:48:20.000And then the behavior is reinforced because the thing, not from somebody externally, but from the thing that you're hearing, you go, I've never heard me do that before.
00:48:56.000I will definitely, you know, probably already, you know, I have my head up my own ass, but, you know, I won't be relevant to the TikTokers of the world because it's just not on their radar.
00:49:09.000It's not those people that listen to the things they listen to and the people that respond to the things they respond to now.
00:49:45.000Because you'll start being desperate and getting plastic surgery and looking like a fucking alien and trying to insert yourself into some stupid fucking thing.
00:50:26.000And I think that's one of the strengths of you, is that with Tool and Pussifer and, like, you know, Perfect Circle, you've done so much different stuff.
00:52:07.000I think just that, you know, it could be written off to like midlife crisis, but I think it's also just understanding that chaos and change is part of life.
00:52:19.000And if you can kind of get yourself to recognize that things aren't, you're not going to just get to a spot and it's going to be that for the rest of your life.
00:52:30.000It's always going to be something changing.
00:52:32.000I think it also speaks to the complex aspect of thinking itself because like You know, what are our thoughts and creativity and how do you keep them inspired and engaged?
00:52:47.000And I think one of the ways to do it is to become a beginner again.
00:53:31.000Yeah, but that kind of a reset, where you're jolting your brain into understanding a whole different thing you're not familiar with, the reset is huge.
00:53:54.000Not a lot of people can think in terms of their entire career or a reset of their entire career because there might not be something for you.
00:56:38.000What a salmon trip up the fucking waterfall that is.
00:56:42.000Yeah, because there's so many people with their hands out, so many people that have a piece of that, so many people that don't want you to branch out because, you know, anything you do that's not that they think could ruin the gravy train that they're enjoying,
00:57:27.000If all of a sudden, you know, if I can name five huge pop celebrities of actors and musicians, if they go, hey, we want to come to your show, like, what did I do?
00:57:41.000What is what I'm doing of any interest to you?
00:57:48.000I don't know what that would look like.
00:58:34.000Five or six people at once decided to come, you know, like, you know, Gwyneth Paltrow and fucking Brad Pitt and somebody, somebody, somebody wants to come to your show.
00:58:41.000I'd be like, were they promised something?
00:59:10.000Well there's a really wild one with Miley Cyrus and in this one she has like this evil aunt who's like controlling her career and they download, spoiler alert, they download her mind.
00:59:25.000Into this little doll, like this robot doll that you can buy.
00:59:30.000And it's like your little Miley Cyrus friend, but it actually is her inside this thing.
00:59:45.000But it's her trying to escape her pop lifestyle, but she's being controlled by all these people that have a vested interest in her making extraordinary amounts of money with that genre.
00:59:57.000And then she gets out of it eventually.
01:02:12.000And also it speaks to, especially like older music is like a time map.
01:02:18.000It's like a map of the culture when that song was created, who this person is, how they fit into the culture, whether or not they're around anymore.
01:02:27.000Like whenever I listen to Hendrix in particular, it's like a Hendrix, to me, is like a map of the 60s in a lot of ways.
01:02:34.000It's like the rebellion from the Vietnam era.
01:02:57.000Like, Janis Joplin does that for me, too.
01:02:59.000It brings me to that time, you know, just like trying to imagine the context of When it was created, who she was.
01:03:08.000So going back to your original question of how we write, you have to be true, to me, for the way that I write, is I'm trying to be true to who I am today.
01:03:20.000Because those are waypoints, as you pointed out.
01:03:23.000Those are waypoints along your particular history and your experiences.
01:03:28.000So if I can be in the present moment when I'm writing those things about what's happening, how I'm feeling...
01:03:35.000Even though some of the experiences are lifelong experiences, how I perceive those experiences today and how I can attach those to a bed of rhythms and sounds and melodies will end up hopefully being what you're talking about.
01:03:51.000It's a waypoint for that moment in time that now you can go back and revisit.
01:04:38.000This is such an awful thing and such an amazing thing, depending on how you're dealing with it.
01:04:46.000You can use it to gain more control, more money, or you can use it to share things with people and help them find a way.
01:04:58.000And also, like, having a level of discipline is so important when engaging with that thing.
01:05:03.000Because that thing can, you know, we were talking about TikTok earlier today, about how the parent company of TikTok is using TikTok to specifically monitor the locations of American individuals and how fucking crazy that is.
01:06:07.000So I read that over and one of my kids came home and she said that her friend was mad because her mom listened to me talk about the terms of service and made him delete TikTok from his phone.
01:08:20.000But that's because of that, trying to make my own user manual.
01:08:25.000I find that the reason I'm on it more than I would be is because three bands, three wineries, you know, all the businesses that I have going on, I end up being on it a lot more than I want to be just because I'm answering questions or inspiring plans or whatever.
01:09:24.000We're playing Texas with the new version two of the Pussyford Tour.
01:09:28.000And I find that when I'm in the break after soundcheck or before training jujitsu with whatever person I can find in that town, I end up, rather than going to those things that I should, like you're talking about, I'll just go back and I'll be watching in my dressing room just old episodes of stuff.
01:09:49.000So it's almost like, for me, it's like I'm turning my brain off with my Apple TV. I'm just gonna zone out and have whatever light lunch I'm gonna have before the show, play with my dog and just let that kind of be almost background noise.
01:10:23.000I'm going to watch that many more times.
01:10:24.000But, like, that kind of thing, just being there on the background as a familiar comfort, you know, blanket, you know, to have it on so that I'm not thinking too much.
01:10:36.000So in a way, I'm putting that on, so I'm not on this.
01:10:40.000I'm learning to just put a movie on that, like, it's going, and meanwhile I'm cleaning out a drawer in the road case of shit that I didn't need.
01:10:55.000I intentionally didn't bring you anything today, because, like, I always, like, I feel like you're probably just every fucking time somebody comes in there, they're just giving you shit.
01:11:04.000Yeah, but, you know, every now and then you get good shit.
01:11:56.000Again, right back to this and right back to a podcast like this, I say, oh, I love Nashville, and that now people are going to, you know, there's going to be, even if it's five people that decide to go to Nashville because of hearing you say you like Nashville or me saying I like Nashville.
01:12:13.000You know, when did somebody say something about Austin that made you move to Austin?
01:12:18.000Because, you know, somebody said something and inspired you to move to Austin, which, when I used to be here, it was a much different town when I hung out here in 1985 at what's now Elysium is the club now on Red River.
01:12:36.000It used to be, it might still be, it was like a gay bar.
01:12:40.000And on one night a week, it would have a thing called Club Iguana.
01:12:44.000And it was like a kind of a goth, punk rock night in that location.
01:12:50.000And that area was, you know, it was like the sketchy 7th Street was all the, you know, kind of cool alternative gay bar, punk rock thing.
01:12:59.000And the 6th Street was all the frat boy things.
01:13:57.000By day, I had my army cap on and my full BDUs.
01:14:02.000And then as soon as we had the weekend hit and we had the time off, hat comes off, two-tone hair, mohawk, wear some Adamant-looking, Sgt. Pepper-looking jacket.
01:17:02.000Yeah, but when I was at that club, it had come here in its purest form, and I was still in the military, and I'm like, yeah, I'm not going to chance that.
01:18:26.000I forget what his – but he was like a super straight-laced guy who someone turned him on to it.
01:18:31.000It's like Jack Harrow, the guy who wrote The Emperor Has No Clothes.
01:18:34.000That guy was a – Like a Goldwater Republican and got divorced, met some new gal, they smoked pot together, and then all of a sudden they became this like hemp activist and, you know, became this like super open-minded hippie who's writing books on mushrooms and marijuana.
01:18:58.000Because those things are, you know, they alter your perspective and they open up neural pathways that hadn't been open to you before.
01:19:07.000Now, I wonder if you're a kid who grew up in that thing as a young kid and you tried it.
01:19:14.000If it wouldn't have the same effect because you're not—that consciousness shift, that near-death kind of thing in your body or whatever that shifts your perspective, that opens up new possibilities, if that was always kind of present in you,
01:19:31.000are you a person who would build something interesting or go down some interesting path, or would it take you— Trudging along in the world that you live in and all of a sudden having that moment, that consciousness opening thing that you've already established what you think the world is and then it changes your perspective.
01:19:52.000Yeah, I've met some people that started out that way.
01:19:56.000They started out like very liberal, open-minded, progressive, drugs and free thinking.
01:20:03.000And then they got annoyed with all the negative aspects of it and they eventually became conservative.
01:20:09.000They eventually realized like, hey, hard work and dedication and discipline are very important components of a successful existence.
01:20:46.000It's like there's so many – I mean there's different ways to live your life and there's different cities that you can go to and they'll help you with that.
01:20:55.000They'll feed that vibe or destroy it or turn you into them or, you know, turn you jaded like the New York City vibe.
01:21:08.000I grew up in a small town, so that's kind of where I resonate more.
01:21:12.000I feed off of a larger city vibe when I'm there in it for those temporary moments.
01:21:21.000But then I got to retreat back to population 500. Yeah, even when I lived in LA, I didn't live in LA. I lived outside of it in Ventura County and just, you know, dealing with coyotes and shit.
01:21:40.000I mean, I have friends that love to be on top of it.
01:21:42.000They love living in Manhattan on the 34th floor.
01:21:46.000I always kind of lived right in that kind of near between Cahuenga and Wilton in the Hollywood Hill area where you get like coyotes the size of fucking Buick area.
01:22:02.000The Hollywood Hills, it's always been weird, because it is kind of urban, but it's kind of not.
01:22:08.000Like, it's really quick to get into, like, you get to Chateau Marmont in, like, five minutes.
01:22:16.000Like, that's right there, and Chateau Marmont's right there, and then, like, the Gucci's right there, and then there's, like, a coyote and, you know, fighting over a fucking raven and fighting over a rabbit.
01:23:02.000And I guess my retreat is to try to grow more food, to teach my friends how to grow food, and to understand how to, you know, distillation, roasting coffees, like growing things,
01:23:21.000That's my default of understanding, like, whatever's going to happen, unless it's a meteor or something crazy that interrupts, you know, what we recognize to be as weather patterns and growing seasons and those kind of things.
01:23:36.000Whatever's happening politically, financially in the world, if we can just remember how to secure fresh water and grow things and survive whatever this is, I don't have any answers other than that.
01:23:50.000That's, you know, that's my default, is to grow things and to not hoard, to actually be active and conscious, aware, in the space to figure out how to survive this thing.
01:24:06.000It might be the only thing you can do.
01:24:08.000Because it doesn't seem to me that anybody has real answers.
01:24:11.000They have opinions and they express those opinions and some are more confident than others.
01:24:16.000But it doesn't seem like there's any real clear path as to how things...
01:25:20.000Yeah, I would like to think, because I'm an idiot and romantic, I'd like to think that we would—most of us would choose the right way to do a thing.
01:25:28.000But when faced with impossible situations, I think that we're probably going to go back to our primitive— I think many of us will choose the right way.
01:25:38.000But the problem is there's been so many people that developed in sort of a— An environment where you didn't really have to have earned character, you know,
01:25:54.000where you don't really develop the concepts of discipline and of, you know, of postponing pleasure and, you know, to farm off All the important things that need to be done to have society function correctly on other people but yet expect it to work.
01:26:21.000And then it goes away and you never really developed the discipline or the skill or the understanding of what's required.
01:26:30.000Yeah, just understanding, you know, and I don't, this is of, I don't know, I'm just kind of making this up, but it seems like that 40-hour work week, I know that's kind of a standard, like, you know, that's your weird corporate,
01:26:45.000that's the way we've grown up, but if you can do a thing and focus on doing a thing where you're, you know, you're working your 30- to 60-hour week of something that you're doing...
01:26:58.000That I feel like as long as it's feeding you in some way, that's what I do.
01:27:18.000That moment where you're starting your workout and your heart rate's going up and you're like, man, I don't know if I'm going to be able to do this today.
01:27:26.000Well, you've got to just get past that first five minutes of getting to the next thing.
01:27:33.000And then you can do that thing for fucking 70 hours a week.
01:27:37.000You can get past that little initial...
01:27:45.000That's the thing that people don't learn how to do.
01:27:47.000And, you know, now people are struggling with remote work because they don't want to go back to an office where they're forced to actually get past the resistance.
01:27:56.000You can kind of like fuck off and you use an app that pretends your cursor is moving around and you get caught jerking off on Zoom.
01:28:37.000I want to say accomplishment, but that's not really the word.
01:28:40.000It's like engagement where life becomes rewarding and stimulating.
01:28:50.000It's like you have these robust moments, these exciting things that are happening in these endeavors, these things that you're choosing to do that are complicated and difficult to do and if you can get past that initial resistance.
01:29:03.000But some people just never develop that and that's what's unfortunate to me about people that just work.
01:29:10.000They just have a job and the job doesn't engage them and they just want to get out of there.
01:29:15.000It's like there's other ways to live life and if you could find a life that is engaging and if you could find things that do stimulate you and find things that you do Get real satisfaction out of the complexity of them and the learning and the growing and the constant stimulation of those things.
01:29:37.000I think part of it, and this is just my upbringing, I don't know that this was everybody's, but my dad and my stepmother were very inspirational for me to be able to always Yeah.
01:30:15.000And at the end of the day, you're not going to know what you just did.
01:30:19.000We're not going to know until like next week or four weeks from now or six weeks from now.
01:30:23.000Now we're weeding that spot to make sure that this thing survives.
01:30:28.000And then you're harvesting that thing and we're going to have that thing for dinner.
01:30:31.000When you start connecting that all the way back to the cause and effect, that was a very important lesson in how some of the things I did wrong so we don't get to have this part.
01:30:44.000So understanding everything you had to do for your day to enjoy the thing you're doing, but also understanding you're doing it for a bigger purpose.
01:33:44.000The amount of work involved, you talk to a real farmer, a real get-up-at-five-in-the-morning farmer, work till dark, and be exhausted, and then do it all over again, and not get rich!
01:33:58.000And, you know, all the challenges come along with it because now I'm getting my phones blowing up the last couple days because we're spotting a bobcat in the neighborhood.
01:34:07.000Well, that means now I've got to bring...
01:34:09.000I'm not even there and I've got to make sure that I'm checking with Jen and make sure she's bringing the ducks home early and paying attention in the morning.
01:34:17.000Don't let them out too soon because we want to make sure there's people around.
01:34:21.000And I'm literally doing things like peeing into a fucking water bottle and spreading it around the perimeter of the fence because some of those predator cats, they don't like...
01:34:33.000They think that that territory's been marked.
01:35:09.000So you just have to pay attention to when the ducks are by themselves and do things like pee on your fence line and, like, hope that they just pick...
01:35:17.000Are you allowed to chase the bobcat off?
01:35:47.000Just mark your calendar because eventually, like, in about, you know, a year you're gonna, like, the video surface where I'm out there half-naked peeing on a fence chasing off a bobcat, you know, with a fucking paintball gun.
01:36:27.000So when you say licensed falconer, do you use that falcon to go do stuff?
01:36:32.000Is that falcon going to snatch some quail for you?
01:36:35.000Well, yeah, it loves the quail, but we can take it around the vineyards eventually, and it'll chase off ground squirrels and rabbits out of the vineyard.
01:36:44.000I was at a Tohono Ranch recently, which is in central California, and there's more ground squirrels than you could possibly imagine.
01:36:54.000They were telling me that the body mass The biomass of ground squirrels is greater than the biomass of cows they have.
01:37:54.000And when you fuck that balance up with, like, a giant pack of ducks that are all in this one, it's like, this is so much food in this one spot.
01:38:44.000We'll use a couple of yolks, but mainly like an egg white with some yolks, quiche base.
01:38:49.000We were talking about this before I know, but are you getting your wheat from other sources?
01:38:54.000Like you getting it from outside the United States?
01:38:56.000Yeah, the best, generally speaking, the best wheat flour is an Italian milled flour, but a significant portion of that flour is actually hard wheat,
01:39:18.000All the wheat that gets grown around the Midwest and Arizona ends up going to a central commodity, so it goes to a central area.
01:39:28.000Then it gets shipped to a place like Italy, and they mill it and blend it and sell it back to you.
01:39:33.000And what's the benefit of adding the Arizona wheat?
01:39:37.000Just the way that it works with pasta, the gluten structure of the pasta, that hard winter wheat from Arizona is a good ingredient to make it.
01:40:19.000We were using quite a bit of heirloom flour from Arizona, but the combination of the blend, whatever the Italians do to blend that thing together, it just ends up being better.
01:40:30.000So we're trying as much as we can to use Arizona wheat blended in.
01:41:53.000So we're doing our best to not, you know, we use as much as we can just, you know, manual weeding or we use the ground cover in the vineyard to eliminate that part of the process.
01:42:06.000Do you pay attention to people like Joel Salatin from Polyface Farms or any of these people that have, like, regenerative agricultural practices where they...
01:42:14.000It's interesting because I don't know if it's scalable.
01:42:25.000Too many people not growing food, which is the big problem in cities.
01:42:28.000Too many people not growing food, too many people in general, or just the scale of doing that thing with the current, the way we do farming.
01:42:38.000Like, you know, the debate of, you know...
01:42:40.000Migrant workers coming in and working on things.
01:42:48.000So that's why you end up defaulting to things like Roundup and those things because they're trying to make the margin and cut the corner to get the thing done.
01:43:57.000That's the weirdest thing about cities, is that we've figured out this way to make these centers where you have extraordinary populations with, you know, cement structures and, you know, water piped in underground, but there's no food.
01:44:56.000They will turn on each other and they will eat each other.
01:44:58.000I've read a study once where we're talking about rat population density studies that their behavior mirrors the behavior of high population cities.
01:45:07.000That you have a certain amount of mental illness that occurs, a certain amount of violence that occurs.
01:45:15.000And then, you know, we would get in the shipment of the new hamsters this week, and I would have to take this aquarium, move it away, put a new aquarium there, put fresh shavings and stuff in it, and then move those hamsters and those and put them in together that way.
01:45:30.000If I put the new hamsters in with the old hamsters in their environment that they've been pissing in for a couple days, they fight.
01:45:38.000You have to basically introduce them to a new environment so that it's new to all of them, and it's new smells, and then they won't fight as much.
01:45:46.000So we need to start a new country, as you're saying?
01:47:14.000They don't have the sustainable population for their future of what they're doing?
01:47:17.000Yeah, the thought is that people are having so few children that ultimately, at one point in time, you're going to see a population decline.
01:47:27.000And that there's going to be this sort of an implosion.
01:47:30.000Like Elon's actually talked about that, the importance of...
01:47:33.000Having children, you know, like so many people aren't having children that live in these urban areas that you're going to see a collapse.
01:47:41.000You know, I'm sure there's a mathematician out there that can say, okay, for every person, how many kids should I have?
01:49:53.000That's the beautiful thing about living in a place where it doesn't have light pollution.
01:49:57.000There's a humbling aspect to staring out at the cosmos that really lets you know, like, hey, we're a part of this enormous, impossibly big thing.
01:50:24.000That environment where you have extreme light pollution and no access to the stars, it's very unnatural and very unusual in terms of a human history.
01:50:44.000So people had sort of a, there was a humbling aspect to the night that allowed people to just like get a perspective and also just the beauty and the majesty of the sky and the looking at the cosmos and looking at the Milky Way.
01:51:02.000It put things into focus in a way that I don't think people in cities have access to now.
01:51:50.000So, you know, that's, you know, when you're at night on my porch, that's, I can see that.
01:51:58.000That's a little intense because they've definitely, like, done more of a time lapse, so it's kind of, like, really sunk in, but, like, on your average night in Arizona, I can see all those things.
01:53:51.000And it's just a remote viewing from a future time when they can actually, like, peak.
01:53:58.000They can't meddle, they can't touch, they can just look.
01:54:01.000And it's just an anomaly in our simulation.
01:54:05.000I was reading this thing about quantum computing today.
01:54:09.000And you could probably relate to this because you've done some music with the Fibonacci sequence.
01:54:14.000And where they entered the Fibonacci sequence into quantum computing and they found it had something to do with different ways that time expresses itself.
01:54:28.000So you can find this because I'm going to butcher this.
01:54:30.000But I was reading it and I remember here it is.
01:54:32.000Scientists fed the Fibonacci sequence into a quantum computer and something strange happened.
01:54:37.000You can have the system behave as if there are two distinct directions of time.
01:54:43.000I think it's just a matter of time before they figure something like that out.
01:54:50.000Aren't there movies that start this way?
01:54:52.000There are, but there are movies that start that way because we understand how the human mind works.
01:54:56.000This constant lust for technological innovation is never going to be quenched.
01:55:02.000And I think if we continue to stay alive, we're going to come up with something that's going to change everything about the way we interact with reality.
01:55:13.000And it's probably going to happen within our lifetime.
01:55:30.000We live in an amazing time because both things exist.
01:55:35.000You have wine, and you have farmers and people cultivating food and creating art, and you also have these disruptive technologies that are being implemented in a way that we really have no idea what the consequences are.
01:55:50.000And it's all happening simultaneously.
01:55:53.000And it makes the hikes in the mountains more attractive.
01:55:57.000It makes the staring at the sky in Prescott more interesting.
01:56:02.000That you do live in these simultaneous sort of timelines.
01:56:36.000We're all just talking about it like, yeah, you're right.
01:56:38.000That's why we're in a constant state of invading some other area that has some natural resources because we've got to get to the 16, right?
01:56:47.000Gotta get to the Tesla that goes zero to 60 instantaneously.
01:56:52.000That, you know, operates on some fucking gravity drive that allows you to punch a hole through space and time and pop up in Australia in half a second.
01:57:36.000Those FJ40s, like Icon out of California makes those where they do the V8 swap and it's just, when you're in one of them, they're so satisfying.
01:57:47.000It's so mechanical and everything about it is like it speaks to you and it's so robust and Yeah, mine has little ammo boxes.
02:00:59.000I think by the time he actually had sold it to a guy, sold it to a guy, and they actually took it to the dump, and, like, they picked it up and it broke in half because, like, the engine was still good.
02:03:21.000So you're not going to see your first grape.
02:03:23.000And even if you get your grape, now you got to wait, you know, you got to make it, you got to age it, you got to bottle it, you got to sell it.
02:03:28.000So from your first, assuming you own the acres, and assuming you have power and water and it's been graded, and you're $30,000 in for your first, for that first planting, that first year, you're not going to see your first dollar for at least six,
02:04:16.000Today, in this very moment, I'm wondering what the fuck did I do and what am I doing?
02:04:22.000How many people do you have working for you now if you have that many different farms?
02:04:26.000Between Pucifer, the Pucifer store, all of our distribution people, our retail people, our behind-the-scenes seller workers, I'm about 110 families that we employ around Arizona.
02:04:47.000And so when you develop a piece of land, say if you want to start and expand into a new piece of land, Who do you have?
02:04:58.000Does the person have to relocate there?
02:05:00.000Do you have to have someone that can commute to the spot and make sure it's running okay for the four years?
02:05:06.000So down in southern Arizona, Jesse lives on site with his wife, and we have a couple full-time people.
02:05:13.000And if you're farming it properly, you need seasonal work, you need people to come in, like a large number of people to come in and prune, a large number of people to come in and do...
02:05:24.000And then for picking, of course, you've got that season.
02:05:28.000You have people around that you have to do the pick and you have to work with a labor contractor to make sure that you have those numbers of people there to do that.
02:05:35.000But annually, year round, those two or three people are on site all year round.
02:05:41.000I would imagine that is always in the back of your head, that you have all these different moving parts going on constantly.
02:06:43.000There's a couple people in our genre, not even really our genre, just like musicians.
02:06:49.000There's a couple people that are doing stuff.
02:06:51.000I think Pink is involved in her wine production in some way.
02:06:57.000But other than her and a couple people, not anybody here that has a wine label, generally speaking, is...
02:07:05.000They're just putting their name on it, or they have somebody doing it for them, and they might be kind of involved, but they're not as involved as I am.
02:07:25.000I don't really see any reason to give up either one, because they can coexist.
02:07:29.000There's definitely time for both, especially if you're Organized like I am and create those spaces for creating music and touring, but knowing that it's not up to you when it's harvest season, this is harvest season.
02:07:45.000So I like that balance of like, I had to respond to what Mother Nature says on this front, but on the music side I can kind of have a little more flexibility and create when the spirit moves me.
02:07:58.000It has to be a wild challenge though to figure out how to scale that.
02:08:02.000As it was happening, how did you figure out how to make it all work?
02:08:18.000It's very complex, but it makes for a very unique experience, I would imagine, in life.
02:08:28.000Well, again, going back to, like, you started this thing, and seven years later, and then I put that wine in a bottle, and I try to forget about that bottle, to then open that bottle another ten years later, to go, oh, fuck, man,
02:09:26.000Have you ever heard of a book called The Immortality Key?
02:09:29.000There's a guy named Brian Murorescu who became obsessed with the Lucidian mysteries and the ancient Greeks who drank wine and invented democracy and invented all these different things in this like one particular area of enlightenment.
02:09:47.000And he started studying this and found very distinct evidence that the wine, what they were calling wine back then, was wine that was mixed in with a bunch of different things.
02:10:01.000And a lot of it was like ergot, and a lot of it was psychedelic compounds.
02:10:07.000And through this, they've actually developed a field of study at Harvard Okay.
02:11:24.000Some instances I do, depending on the fruit coming in, and if I'm observing there's going to be maybe some problems with that particular batch of fruit.
02:11:32.000Yeah, maybe I'll do an inoculation for that thing, but we're 95% wild ferments.
02:11:39.000But I do also do mead, which is honey, water, yeast.
02:11:45.000So we do that fermentation to do canned.
02:11:54.000It's really wild tasting, like different than anything I think I'd ever drank before.
02:11:58.000Yeah, but that we also were about to can it.
02:12:00.000But I actually did a fermentation with the mead where I did one with lavender, One with hibiscus, one with bergamot, and one with star jasmine.
02:12:10.000Just to see what that would lend as far as a floral nature in that mead.
02:12:44.000I think if you're a champagne person versus like an Italian sparkling, now I'm getting all geeky with people that are wine drinkers, but what we're doing in Arizona is far more like a filtered drink.
02:13:01.000Ancient method, Italian sparkling, because it's Malvisia, Bianca, and Chardonnay, 50-50.
02:13:08.000So if people are, for people listening, if you're wondering what kind of sparkling I'm doing, that's a pet nat.
02:13:14.000It's very much an Italian sparkling approach, rather than a champagne.
02:13:20.000The reason why I brought up the Brian Murray Rescue book, because I've always been fascinated, like if that was what wine used to be, that wine was the fermented grapes mixed in with psychedelics and all these other compounds that they're sort of discovering, when did modern,
02:13:35.000what we think of as wine now, which is like what you make, when did that start?
02:13:53.000But, you know, I know that there's people that have done like botanicals where they're kind of doing almost like beer, beerish, wine-ish botanical fermentations.
02:14:04.000Various, you know, varying results, but I don't know.
02:16:56.000And that's, of course, from an established region that has a history that you can kind of track it to a point through time, and having maybe had that wine.
02:18:19.000You have to have some sort of a palate.
02:18:23.000Yeah, but you know, at the same time, I don't have to sound like Led Zeppelin, I just have to sound like me.
02:18:28.000So I'm only expressing, these grapes are going to tell me what they're going to do, and I'm going to try to get out of the way to make sure that these grapes grow from grapes to wine.
02:18:37.000And I'm going to do everything that I know how to do to get out of the way to make sure that thing is that thing.
02:18:42.000Now, me describing that thing to you like a psalm describes it, I can't do that for you.
02:18:48.000But I can get out of the way to make it get to the thing that you can describe.
02:19:37.000Did you go through any sort of education in terms of what is involved in the creation of a wine that you appreciate?
02:19:44.000I just thought time in cellar, spending time in Adelaide Hills at Penfolds for a very short amount of time.
02:19:53.000Seeing it happening around the world, going to wineries while on tour, while they're trying to time it where I can go when they're going to actually harvest today to see, what's the equipment they're using?
02:20:29.000It's like, you know, going back to, I was talking to Donald today, like he walked into Hickson's place on Pico back in the day.
02:20:38.000Henry Ankins walked in the same week that I walked in to Hickson's Academy back in 95. Henry Akins is one of the best black belts I've ever met.
02:21:13.000And then slowly backing up and understanding the chemistry of it, working with people to go action-reaction and logging that in to develop that constantly.
02:21:25.000But the process, just the basic logistics of making wine made sense to me almost instantaneously.
02:21:50.000You start to all of a sudden went from a dude who grew up in a lower middle class family with parents at a teacher budget, cutting wood for the winter, to being on tour with a band and all of a sudden I can afford a bottle of wine that was more than $50.
02:22:13.000Seeing all the agents and the lawyers and the fucking promoter and the manager and the fucking accountant all backstage having a nice glass of wine while I'm drinking Bud Light over here.
02:23:45.000Tim and I are like the logistics Nazis.
02:23:50.000There's a way to do it to not get in your own way to understand the 16 steps.
02:23:56.000Like today, dealing with that triangle, I kept getting my foot caught up and trying to get the leg around the head because I was getting in my own way.
02:24:03.000I didn't shift enough to make it so that I wasn't in my own way.
02:24:09.000I'm thinking five steps ahead, and I'm not going to put a thing down in the way that I have to move and add six steps to getting to the next step.
02:24:16.000And this is a thing that you get better at?
02:24:18.000I get better at with every harvest, but I was already naturally inclined that way as far as logistic.
02:24:30.000That's wild because there's nothing like that in my mind that I'm fascinated by, that I would want to go and start developing a company that makes these things.
02:24:40.000It seems like it's just so rare that something like a light bulb goes off and you're like, I need a wine press.
02:25:20.000But, you know, there's adjustments that I've made over the years that have made it so that there's a higher percentage of success for that year.
02:26:13.000Get a couple new, but buy some neutral ones from somebody instead, so that there was just a kiss of oak on it rather than a lot of new oak.
02:26:21.000So this is a company that specializes in creating barrels?
02:26:25.000No, you just go to some of the other wineries that are cycling through some of their barrels and you can buy used barrels from reputable wineries.
02:26:32.000I was going to ask you next, do you reuse your barrels?
02:26:35.000I use as much as I possibly can because I don't necessarily want the oak influence on the wine.
02:26:41.000Does the wine that was in the barrel influence future wines?
02:26:45.000No, you're rinsing it out pretty good.
02:27:21.000No, I think because when it comes to...
02:27:24.000Tim and I are probably going to develop a gin, but that will be 100% us just coming up with a label, coming up with a concept, coming up with maybe a recipe, and then handing that to some...
02:28:13.000To make it a gin, juniper is one of the botanicals that comes into either during the distillation process or post-distillation, juniper is involved.
02:28:23.000But you can also do other things and other botanicals and things to make it a more unique gin.
02:28:32.000Tequila is agave, but I don't know the process on tequila that much.
02:28:38.000I'd like to know, but I think gin is going to be more accessible to me because just the process of over-farming and tearing up land, if I can put in agave, I don't know what that sounds like.
02:31:30.000We want to expand because a healthy wine region has a healthy bulk wine market.
02:31:38.000So if I can make wine out of all those grapes, but I only need 80% of it, I sell my 20% of juice to other winemakers just so they can supplement their programs.
02:31:50.000That's a healthy winemaking environment.
02:31:55.000You're familiar with the wine The Prisoner?
02:32:04.000It's a very popular bottle of wine called The Prisoner.
02:32:10.000For the most part, that was all bulk wine.
02:32:13.000That's a California project that took off, that made fucking distributors and people a shitload of money because the person was just basically going around initially to just get bulk wine from all these different houses that had bulk wine that put a cool blend together,
02:32:29.000and it was priced perfectly, and wholesalers made a shitload of money on that thing because it hit.
02:33:14.000How do they even know what it's going to taste like?
02:33:16.000They're putting together, because they're only buying it if it goes with the blend.
02:33:21.000So they're getting samples, samples, samples, blending, and then picking the samples, the blend, and buying that wine in bulk and putting it together.
02:33:30.000Is this the most you've ever talked about wine in the two and a half hour period?
02:33:42.000I'm fascinated by anything that anybody is deeply interested in.
02:33:46.000And it's clear that you're deeply interested in this.
02:33:48.000Yeah, so to answer your question, I wouldn't mind expanding the vineyard so that I have flexibility because what happens if I get hail and it takes out half my vineyards?
02:33:56.000If I have way more vineyards than I need, then I can kind of, in that year, I can kind of massage what I have Maybe use bulk wine from the year before to supplement into a blend.
02:34:06.000But if I've made all the grapes from the vineyard we didn't get, whether that wine is always valuable to somebody else to sell as a bulk product.
02:34:14.000Hale can take out half of your product?
02:34:45.000Well, those vines are probably, if they're not dead completely, they're definitely not getting any grapes off those vines for the next three years.
02:36:43.000The look on his face at the end, I was like, he normally runs his mouth pretty good as a good old Arizona boy, but he had that look on his face like, Did I win that?
02:38:26.000But one of the problems is that I feel, and I've said this ad nauseam, that I feel that we're very limited by this 10-9 This 10-point must-scoring system.
02:38:35.000Because someone can win a round 10-9 and it can be a very close round.
02:38:40.000And someone can win a round clearly and it can be 10-9.
02:38:44.000And that doesn't make any sense to me.
02:38:46.000And I feel like the system is designed for boxing and it's a good system for boxing.
02:38:53.000I don't think it's a good system for MMA. I think MMA needs a much more comprehensive system.
02:38:59.000Like, if a guy can hold you down with no damage at all for three minutes, versus a guy who holds you down and damages you for 30 seconds, what's worth more?
02:39:09.000You know, what hits you with three or four good hard shots, is that worth more?
02:39:12.000Or is, like, the predominance of a round, like, if you spend the majority of a round on top of a guy, even if you're not damaging him, how much is that worth?
02:41:22.000I was always impressed with him, but, I mean, I was saying, leading up to him getting a shot at the world title, he's the boogeyman of that division.
02:41:30.000He was the guy that everybody was saying, like, is the most dominant of all the contenders.
02:41:35.000And then when he tapped Dober, that was a big one.
02:41:37.000When he tapped Dan Hooker, that was a big one, too.
02:41:39.000It's like the way he's tapping these guys who are these world-class fighters.
02:41:43.000He's just fucking running through them.
02:41:45.000But the fact that he got on Oliveira and mounted him and then submitted him with an arm triangle, head and arm choke like that.
02:43:41.000You get a thing that's like, not just us doing our thing.
02:43:44.000I'm going to deliver what I'm going to deliver.
02:43:46.000I'm not going to not sing the song, but I'm going to run over here and you should be laughing at the fact that I have this weird fucking obsession with UFC for your show.
02:46:24.000Anderson Silva is one of the greatest combat sports athletes of all time, one of the greatest MMA fighters of all time.
02:46:31.000And as a boxer, even though he's 47 years old, he did beat Julio Cesar Chavez Jr., who was a legitimate former world champion, and he knocked out Tito Ortiz to show you that he's got power.
02:46:55.000So I'm very precious about Anderson as a fan.
02:47:00.000Well, I was very fortunate to be able to commentate against while, excuse me, when Anderson was competing in his prime against the best in the world.
02:47:10.000When Anderson was in his prime, he was a magician.
02:47:16.000To see him fight in his prime, like when he knocked out Vitor with that front kick to the face, when Anderson beat Chael Sonnen with a triangle in the last round, a fight that he was losing, when he just beat the shit out of him in the rematch, Anderson during his prime was something extraordinary.
02:49:15.000And I was like, we're getting Anderson when he came into his own, and that's when he entered into the UFC. So people got to see this just perfect striker.
02:50:54.000The arena was packed to the gills and it was nuts.
02:50:58.000The energy in the place was incredible.
02:51:01.000And to be there, like, to have it this popular, it's not a coincidence that it's this popular while Gordon Ryan is at his peak, who is the greatest jiu-jitsu athlete of all time, at 27 years old, which is so crazy to say.
02:51:29.000It was impressive to see because most of the things that he was doing were very simple, methodical, cutting off all your fucking exits and trapping you into a thing.
02:52:38.000And it's pretty amazing as a jiu-jitsu lover to be able to see jiu-jitsu get the attention that it deserves and to see this fucking rabid fan base.
02:52:46.000Because basically everyone in the audience trains.
02:52:48.000So there's like 12,000 people who are jiu-jitsu trainers and fans and practitioners that are there enjoying that.