In this episode of the Joe Rogan Experience, we talk about the new snack food: Sriracha Cashews. They re the official snack food of the Joeson Experience, and they re so good, they re the only snack food you need to have delivered to your office, home, or home office to make it the best snack you ve ever had. Enjoy this episode and don t forget to save 50% off your first box with discount code Joesonsoup! Subscribe to Joesoneysoup.co/TheJoesonExperience to get 10% off first box and save $50 off your second box! That s $10 off the first box, plus free shipping anywhere in the U.S. and free shipping on all orders. Joesonesoup is a way to get delicious, healthy snacks delivered straight to your home, office, or office. They re as good for you as you like and as cheap as you can get them. Onnit is a human optimization website that sells tools that you can use to optimize your health, your life, your fitness, and your fitness. We sell things like strength and conditioning equipment, like kettlebells, and battle ropes, and mace balls, and all these things that we use for strength & conditioning workouts. as well as health and nutrition tools to help you get the nutrients you need for your body and mind to be the best you can be the healthiest you can possibly be. All you need is a healthy, balanced life and mind, and you deserve it. OrAC Score. ORAC is the best chance to get the most out of everything you need. It s a healthy and balanced, balanced and balanced. It s the rest of your day to be your best possible day. And it s better than most of the rest and rest you can achieve the best possible life you ve got in your day, so you can optimize your best day and get the rest you deserve. If you re ready to take care of your body, you re gonna get a good night of rest, rest, hydration, recovery, and hydration and recovery, you ll feel the most of what you need, you can do it all day, day after day, and have the rest that you need it and you ll be able to sleep the most important day of the day you can rest up for your day and sleep the best of your life.
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00:05:58.000That's O-N-N-I-T and use the code word ROGAN. Alright, Randall Carlson is here.
00:07:36.000You first, I don't remember what we first started talking about, but you blew my mind when you started talking to me about the Holocene Crater.
00:07:44.000And that this pretty distinct evidence that, you know, there's been more than one events on this earth besides the one that everybody knows about, the 65 million year ago one where the big chunk of rock hit the Yucatan and killed the dinosaurs.
00:08:04.000But there's been a series of those, and that these things may very well be responsible for a lot of the cataclysmic stories that are in Epic of Gilgamesh, the Noah's Ark story.
00:08:15.000All these different fables and tales of ancient traditions may be based on these cataclysmic disasters.
00:08:23.000Since we've spoken, science has started to validate a lot of your theories and ideas, even more substantially, the discovery of this nuclear glass that they find all throughout Europe and Asia.
00:08:40.000Well, did you catch the thing about a month ago?
00:08:43.000I think it was in the New York Times, most of the major newspapers, a group of former NASA astronauts and scientists came out and said new evidence was showing that we were probably somewhere between three and ten times more likely to encounter things than anybody had previously been estimating,
00:09:17.000Yeah, and what was really interesting about that is because everybody was, at least people who are interested in this sort of thing, were kind of looking to the sky anyway because this was the closest Pass of an asteroid coming within 17,000 miles of the Earth.
00:09:34.000At the same time, this object totally out of the blue came in and exploded over Chelyabinsk, Siberia.
00:09:40.000So it was very interesting and coincidental if There are such things as coincidences.
00:09:46.000Here, when we're expecting this very close flyby of an asteroid, a near-Earth asteroid, coming actually within our geosynchronous satellites, within the orbits of those satellites, at the same time that this object is coming within 17,000 miles of the Earth,
00:10:04.000suddenly, unexpectedly, here comes this second object and explodes With the force of about a, I believe it was about a 50 kiloton nuclear weapon.
00:10:14.000And of course it had exploded quite high, about 20, I believe about 18 to 20 miles in the atmosphere.
00:10:25.000However, the thing to bear in mind is if that object had been just a little bit bigger, or it had been a little bit denser, or the angle of approach had been a little steeper, instead of 1,600 injuries there probably could have been 1,600 or more casualties.
00:10:40.000At that point I think the world would have really sat up and taken notice.
00:10:44.000But it was basically just a warning shot.
00:10:48.000It seems to me that our knowledge of asteroids and meteor impacts and things of that nature, our actual experience on it is based on this short window that we call human history, which is, for the Earth, such a brief,
00:11:08.000Although I like to point out there, you know, when you say human history, we're talking, you know, 4,500 to 5,000 years ago.
00:11:16.000Generally, I think most historians of ancient history will usually say that the emergence of cuneiform writing in the Middle East marks the beginning of official recorded history.
00:11:32.000But you've got to bear in mind that we modern humans have been around a lot longer than that.
00:11:38.000Right now, as far as the hard evidence goes, which is what I like to refer to, Which means skeletal remains.
00:11:46.000Skeletal remains of humans that as far as we know are basically no different than modern humans.
00:11:53.000If you put flesh on them and dressed them up in modern clothes and they walked down the street, you wouldn't think they were anything unusual.
00:12:01.000Modern skeletal remains of modern humans are now dating between 150,000 and 180,000 years.
00:12:07.000So when you think about that, you know, compared to what we actually have of our record of history, our record of history is 120th, 125th, 130th of the actual time that we humans have been here.
00:12:21.000Now, it could be that modern humans have actually been here much longer than 180,000 years.
00:12:27.000We have no way of knowing at what point we moderns first appeared on this planet.
00:12:32.000But when you think of 180,000 years compared to, let's say in round numbers, 5,000 years, it means that there's a lot of the human story missing.
00:12:43.000The thing that's always intrigued me is that given the assumption that they would have had the same intelligence as us, they've got the same brain case size, the same cranial capacity, so one would assume that with brains as big as our modern brains,
00:12:59.000they were able to think, they had forethought, they were able to plan ahead, presumably have some kind of a tradition that could be passed on from generation to generation and accumulated learning.
00:13:13.000But what we see is that there's basically no record to speak of of what people were doing culturally.
00:13:22.000And that has led a lot of scientists to assume that for all those tens of thousands of years and hundreds and hundreds of generations, that people were essentially living nothing more than a subsistence, kind of hunter-gatherer existence,
00:13:38.000But what they haven't taken into account is the extremity of some of the global changes that have occurred in the interval that we humans have been here.
00:13:49.000And as we go through our discussion today, and we'll pull up some images, I think you'll begin to get an idea of how extreme and how sweeping some of these changes have been and why in the aftermath of those changes we shouldn't expect to find a whole lot of hard cultural evidence.
00:14:10.000Because what you'll hopefully begin to appreciate is that were some of these events of the scale and magnitude that have happened probably a dozen or more times in the 150 or 200,000 years that we've been here, were those events to occur today,
00:14:26.00010,000 years from now, archaeologists would be sifting through the rubble looking for any kind of evidence that we had ever been here.
00:14:35.000And that's the thing we have to get into our consciousness.
00:14:39.000I guess if there's any implication to the work that I've been doing is that we certainly can't take our present position for granted.
00:14:48.000It seems very difficult for us to put into perspective numbers like 10,000 or 100,000 or a million.
00:14:57.000We know that the universe has been around allegedly for 14 billion, so the Earth is 4.6 billion.
00:15:16.000It's like, I don't think we could really wrap our head around the idea that 10,000 years is such an incredible length of time that if you left a car out for 10,000 years, within, you know, 3 or 4,000, it would be absorbed completely by the Earth.
00:15:37.000I mean, if you look at steel-bodied cars, I remember very well as a kid, not far from where we lived, there was an auto graveyard.
00:15:45.000And all the teenagers around there who were racing cars back in the 50s and crashing them up and everything, they seemed to end up there.
00:15:53.000And as a kid, I used to like to go and kind of hang around there and play in some of the old cars.
00:15:57.000But They were already, after sitting out there for 10 years, I mean, already well on their way to rusting away.
00:16:04.000I mean, once that process of oxidation begins to take place, it accelerates.
00:16:10.000Not far from where I live in Atlanta, there was an old iron bridge that had been built around the 1890s.
00:16:18.000And it's no longer there, but by the 1980s, it had almost rusted to nothing.
00:16:24.000Within a century, it almost rusted to nothing.
00:16:27.000Yeah, metal does not last long when exposed to the elements.
00:16:31.000There was an interesting series of shows a few years ago.
00:16:35.000It had to do with the idea of, what if humans just suddenly departed?
00:16:40.000What if we took humans out of the equation?
00:16:42.000What would happen to all of the infrastructure left behind?
00:16:45.000Just under normal, kind of gradualistic change that we're used to within the last few centuries.
00:16:52.000The upshot of it was that 10,000 years from now, It's pretty much gone.
00:16:57.000You know, I mean, if you look at the great buildings that make up all the metropolitan areas now of the world, most of them are steel frame structures, and they're clothed in a skin that will keep the elements out maybe for a half a century.
00:17:15.000But without maintenance, I mean, you know that the Golden Gate Bridge up in San Francisco is constantly undergoing maintenance.
00:17:24.000Because if you stop maintaining it, immediately it starts decaying.
00:17:30.000And interesting, if you think about, if we suddenly, if humans left the planet 10,000 years from now, some interstellar anthropologists arrive, what would they see that would indicate that we had been here?
00:17:46.000What do you think would still be left after 10,000 years?
00:17:48.000There's actually two things that they named in this particular program.
00:18:03.000Now, when you now begin to factor in, the thing that I've been basically working with is the idea that we have these intermittent, I call them non-linearities, discontinuities within the normal orderly progression of things,
00:18:22.000Superimpose a few of those in the process and basically 5,000, 10,000 years from now, You're not going to find much to show that we had been here.
00:18:33.000And when you see structures like Gobekli Tepe, which is within the last couple decades been unearthed in Turkey, Which has really thrown a giant monkey wrench into the timeline of the hunter-gatherer transition into the modern agricultural city.
00:18:52.000We're in a weird state because people are starting to dig up these things and Gobekli Tepe was a completely unknown structure until this one farmer or herder I think?
00:19:20.000It was purposely covered up 12,000 to 14,000 years ago, which means that who knows how long it was there before.
00:19:29.000It could have been several thousand years old when they decided to cover it up, but it was purposely filled in, an enormous area, purposely filled in somewhere around 12,000 years ago.
00:19:41.000Could it have been purposely covered up in order to protect it and preserve it?
00:19:46.000That we were hoping, or they were hoping rather, that someone like us would come along, not us, like definitely not me, maybe you, but someone would come along and uncover it and then go, whoa, what's this all about?
00:19:59.000Like maybe they knew that there were going to be moments in time where these things happen, these impacts, these asteroidal impacts, and that there needed to be some sort of a way of keeping track or some sort of a way of preserving.
00:20:16.000Well, that would probably be one way of preserving it, for sure.
00:20:19.000And the other thing would be, just like you mentioned, the two things, Mount Rushmore and the Great Pyramid, of course, are both built of stone, which is obviously much more durable than steel or the fabricated materials that we're making today.
00:20:47.000And, you know, we're looking at something like...
00:20:49.000You just made an interesting point about how much previous to the burial had it actually been there.
00:20:57.000And, you know, it's difficult to date stone.
00:20:59.000The way you would date stone is, you know, you can use various...
00:21:04.000Or cosmogenic ways where when you expose stone to atmosphere, it's going to accumulate cosmic rays, which cause changes within the stone that can actually be measured.
00:21:16.000But if it's buried, it's not going to be subject to cosmic rays.
00:22:22.000A lot of the monumental stonework that we find, like at Baalbek where you have these monstrous megaliths, probably go back to Pleistocene times.
00:22:34.000And when I say Pleistocene, I'm talking about the period from like 10,000 years back to about two and a half million years ago.
00:22:41.000The time during which there has been this succession of glacial ages and interglacial ages.
00:22:48.000And you know, you mentioned the term Holocene.
00:22:51.000Holocene is essentially the modern geological epoch.
00:22:55.000We've been in this Holocene epoch for, generally, they say 10,000 years in rough numbers.
00:23:02.000Although it's becoming much more precisely dated, now you'll find a lot of references in the scientific literature that gives the date 11.6 or 11,600 years as being the onset of the Holocene.
00:23:16.000Which is an interesting date for me because I don't know if you've ever read Plato and his accounts of Atlantis.
00:23:22.000There's two of his dialogues, Critias and Timaeus, in which he describes Atlantis.
00:23:26.000And he gives the dating in there at least on three separate occasions.
00:23:31.000And he always places it, you know, there's this whole lineage of the story that goes back to Solon.
00:23:38.000Who was a historical character, an authenticated historical character, who lived at about 600 BC. And he was a lawgiver and poet in Athens and due to political pressures and stuff, he went into a 10-year exile and during that 10-year exile he went to Egypt.
00:23:54.000And it was there that he presumably heard the tale of Atlantis from elderly Egyptian priests.
00:24:02.000And he was told and came back and then told the story to his grandson who told it again to...
00:24:11.000Several individuals before it actually got to Socrates and then Plato, who presumably wrote it down.
00:24:16.000But what it's interesting is that in Plato's account, he gives the dating for the demise of Atlantis as 9,000 years prior to Solon's exile to Egypt.
00:24:28.000Well, given that that took place in, give or take, a decade or two, 600 B.C., We go back, that's 2600 years ago, okay, add that to the 9,000 years and we've got 11,600 years ago.
00:24:41.000Now according to Plato's account, he says that it was shortly after this great war between the Atlanteans and the Proto-Athenians that there was this tremendous cataclysm and Atlantis sunk beneath the waves.
00:24:57.000So he's giving that date at 11,600 years ago.
00:25:01.000We now know from the scientific record that at 11,600 years ago there was a major climate transition and there was a catastrophic warming spike that was associated with a A mega-scale meltdown event of the great ice sheets that were covering North America.
00:25:20.000It was this event at 11,600 that essentially jerked the planet out of the depths of this ice age that it had been in for thousands and thousands of years.
00:25:30.000With that melting, you had a rapid rise of sea level.
00:25:36.000So it's very interesting that the date that he gives is precisely now the date that the scientists are giving for this transition from what's called the Younger Dryas.
00:25:49.000I think Graham has mentioned that in some of your interviews with him, the Younger Dryas, which was this climate spasm that ended the last ice age.
00:26:00.000So if we look at the chronology of events, Around 26,000 years ago, we were in the latter phases of what appears to have been an interglacial period, not too much different from what we're in now.
00:26:16.000Around 26,000 years ago the climate rapidly degenerated and these massive glaciers had expanded during this what they call the final phase or the late Wisconsin they refer to it because initially they were looking for this evidence in the state of Wisconsin so they named this last final phase the late Wisconsin.
00:26:38.000So around 26,000 years ago we see the launching of this final phase of the ice age The late Wisconsin.
00:26:46.000Then at around 13,000 years ago, as the dates are now giving it, there was this enormous spasm of warming.
00:26:54.000And this seemed to be associated with rapid melting and the first real rapid sea level rise.
00:27:01.000What happened is after a very short interval of time, the climate snapped back into the full depths of glacial cold.
00:27:09.000Now, what had happened was, if you go back 18,000 years ago, this was the coldest part of the Ice Age.
00:27:17.000I mean, this was a bitterly cold period of time.
00:27:22.000Where I live, in Georgia, was the forests that grew there were like the forests you find in Canada now.
00:27:29.000You had tundra up in northern Kentucky and southern Idaho.
00:27:38.000So it was a really, really different climate.
00:27:41.000And once you got to northern Ohio and the northern United States, where New York City is, Chicago, the Great Lakes, the Dakotas, all of that was under this massive ice sheet, thousands of feet thick.
00:27:52.000When you go up into Canada, over Canada, the ice sheet was up to two miles thick.
00:28:01.000And it reached from the Atlantic to the Pacific Ocean and from the northern United States as far south as the 45th parallel all the way up to the Arctic Circle.
00:28:10.000Now that is a drastically different world.
00:28:13.000Bear in mind, too, that with that much ice piled up on the surface of the land, sea levels, which contributed to the water that formed that ice, had to go down.
00:28:24.000And it's now well documented that sea levels during the depth of the Ice Age were at least 400 feet lower than now.
00:28:31.000Which means that the continental shelves of the planet were basically exposed now.
00:28:37.000Where I live in Georgia, if you go out and stand right now on the beach, like at Cumberland Island, which is a beautiful wilderness preserve, you stand there on the beach, If you were suddenly transported back to the depths of the ice age, you'd be in the middle of a boreal forest, meaning a northern forest with spruce trees,
00:28:53.000larch trees, alder trees, the kind of trees you find now in the northern United States, Canada, that area.
00:28:58.000And the beach wouldn't have been anywhere close.
00:29:02.000It would have been another 50, 75, 100 miles further to the east.
00:29:10.000And so when this final phase of the Ice Age came on, sea levels began to drop.
00:29:17.000And so what it did was it exposed all of the shallow marine ecologies that Rimmed all of the continents to the atmosphere and basically would have caused enormous ecological havoc.
00:29:30.000Well then, within a millennia or so, the forests had expanded and had now grown out.
00:29:38.000So now off the eastern seaboard of the United States, they constantly will find the remains of tree stumps and forests that had been growing there 14, 15, 16 thousand years ago.
00:29:50.000Now, the ice begins to melt, sea level begins to rise.
00:29:53.000Now, it's important to realize that if we look at the way modern civilization has evolved, what do we see?
00:30:12.000Okay, so if you had major cities during the Ice Age, as Graham has pointed out, they're now 400 feet underwater.
00:30:21.000So you begin to appreciate, when you begin to really look at the history of our planet, what you realize is that it's been just almost unimaginably dynamic.
00:30:31.000An alteration from an interglacial to a glacial age is an extreme process.
00:30:38.000And so I guess the upshot of it is that when we look now at the climate record that we have in hand now, which has been Pretty much reconstructed with a fair amount of accuracy back to about 400,000 years and these are primarily based on ice cores extracted from Greenland,
00:30:58.000extracted from Antarctica, extracted from mountain glaciers and mostly mostly mostly Antarctic and Greenland though.
00:31:06.000When you pull out that ice core It's layered.
00:31:09.000Think of cutting down a tree and looking at the annual layers, where you can actually count the number of layers in a cross-section of a tree log and you'll know how old it is, right?
00:31:21.000Well, it's very similar in In an ice core, you've got layers, annual layers, because each year there's snow that falls.
00:31:28.000It gets compressed into FIRN, F-I-R-N, which is the transitional phase between snow and glacial ice.
00:31:35.000And it eventually gets compressed into glacial ice.
00:31:37.000And when you look at a cross-section of the ice core, you'll see these fine layers in there.
00:31:41.000So they can go back and they can look at these layers.
00:32:00.000But what we see is that the climate has constantly oscillated back and forth.
00:32:05.000And when we look at the Holocene, going back 10,000 years, And then we take that comparatively and we go back 250,000 to 400,000 years.
00:32:16.000We can now begin to reconstruct these intervals of glacial periods, interglacial.
00:32:23.000And here's the thing that should be sobering to everybody on the planet today as we think about climate change and all of this, because obviously it's constantly in the news and all.
00:32:34.000The longest interglacial period now on record for at least the last quarter million years, the longest one, the longest unbroken period of interglacial warmth is the Holocene, the one we're in now.
00:32:49.000We've already exceeded by several millennia the longest previous period of interglacial warmth.
00:32:58.000I don't hear Al Gore talking about that.
00:33:01.000I don't hear anybody talking about that in mainstream media, but it's hard scientific fact.
00:33:07.000Yeah, we would be shitting our pants way more if it was a global cooling than if it was a global warming.
00:33:14.000Let me tell you, we're going to pull up another graph.
00:33:17.000We'll pull up a graph in a minute which shows you that even within the last couple of thousand years, periods of global cooling Have not been pleasant times.
00:33:26.000Periods of global warming is when we see human population expanding, when we see cultural advancement, when we see life spans increasing, when we see infant mortality decreasing.
00:33:40.000Periods of global cooling are when we see populations going into decline, when we see life spans diminishing.
00:33:49.000You know, we had a period of global cooling that began between 536 and 540 AD. It was this period of global cooling that launched what we know as the Dark Ages.
00:34:03.000And this has now been well documented by dendrochronologists.
00:34:07.000Mike Bailey is one of the leaders of this, who's been looking at the climate changes of the last couple thousand years as preserved in the tree ring record.
00:34:17.000Between 536 and about 544 A.D., we find that forest growth in the northern hemisphere almost came to a stop.
00:34:29.000One of the consequences of that was it was associated with a global cooling and for multiple years running, there were agricultural collapses where because of the cold and the damp that came on with this, you know, the historical record is interesting because you read some of these accounts that were preserved from that period.
00:34:48.000They talk about Weeks at a time where they couldn't see the sun.
00:34:52.000They talk about when it did show up, it was just a feeble imitation of itself.
00:34:56.000They talk about, you know, years with no summer, basically.
00:35:00.000So what you had was succession of crop failures that led to people becoming malnourished, Once they became malnourished, their immune systems became weakened.
00:35:11.000And in 542 A.D., about six years after this well-documented transition occurred, we had the onset of the Justinian plague, which wiped out a third the population of Europe.
00:35:23.000And it took 300 years to recover from that.
00:35:27.000And we didn't recover from it until the climate shifted again, and we went into what's known as the medieval warm period.
00:35:35.000And the medieval warm period was the time when the Scandinavians were farming on the west coast of Greenland where now it's perennially frozen.
00:35:44.000And for about the next couple of hundred years the climate was, according to some researchers and some scientists, as much as two degrees warmer than now.
00:35:54.000And you think it had to have been warmer if they were farming in Greenland where it is now frozen ground It had to have been warmer.
00:36:03.000And one of the things that happened was with this warming, you had an expansion of the growing season.
00:36:11.000And you also had the latitude belt at which viable farming or agriculture could be practiced shifted three to four hundred miles north of where it had been, which meant that for the first time, England actually had a flourishing wine industry.
00:36:27.000Which didn't exist previously and it has only existed until recent times because of genetically modified crops.
00:36:33.000It's now allowing them to grow grapes where they haven't been able to grow wine grapes until we go back to the medieval warm period.
00:36:42.000So what happened was now there was a lot of food for people to eat, right?
00:36:54.000We began to carry on commerce and trade.
00:36:57.000After this 300 years of dark ages where learning receded into the monasteries and life was very unpleasant, very short, very brutal, very unpleasant.
00:37:12.000With the expansion of agriculture and the abundant food supply and the prolific harvests, people were getting strong, healthy again.
00:37:23.000Stature, and it's been well documented that during this two or three hundred years of the medieval warming period, human stature actually increased by inches, average human size.
00:37:35.000By 1150, This accumulated wealth that had ensued from the benign climate of the medieval warm period is what allowed the great cathedral building era.
00:37:52.000To ensue, which began between 1130 and 1150 A.D. And what we see is these magnificent cathedrals.
00:37:59.000Have you been to Europe and visited any of the cathedrals?
00:38:03.000Get there and look at some of these extraordinary works of art that were Built during the High Gothic or High Middle Ages between, like I said, about 1150 and the early 1300s.
00:38:16.000They built about 80 of these gigantic, magnificent cathedrals that required the organizing of thousands of Highly, highly skilled craftsmen.
00:38:34.000You had stonemasons and carpenters and glaziers and astronomers and geometricians and all of these people brought together to create these incredible cathedrals.
00:38:45.000And it was made possible by the fact that European society had become relatively wealthy.
00:38:51.000And this wealth was brought on by this global warmth.
00:39:33.000Culturally, it was a very extraordinary time, those high Middle Ages.
00:39:37.000Well, a lot of those Gothic cathedrals were never finished.
00:39:40.000And what we see is that some of them have the appearance, you know, I'm a builder by profession.
00:39:47.000And, you know, I've looked at some of these and what it's very much like is they're going along building and then all of a sudden one day nobody shows up to work.
00:39:56.000And there's still tools laying around, there's still materials that are often a pile that were waiting to be incorporated into the structure.
00:40:04.000And what happened was that the climate began to cool again between 1315 and 1320. Precisely when we see the end of this tremendous gothic building boom is when the climate began to cool.
00:40:19.000And it cooled for the next several decades.
00:40:21.000And what we then see is a repeat of what happened between 536 and 542 AD. Agricultural collapses, crops rotting in the fields, people going hungry, I think it was around between 1340 and 1345,
00:40:40.000And once again, the population of Europe was decimated.
00:40:44.000And it took 150 years basically to recover from that.
00:40:49.000And what we see is that what was happening is the planet was shifting into what's called the Little Ice Age.
00:40:55.000You probably heard that term, the Little Ice Age, right?
00:40:57.000There was two phases to the Little Ice Age, and the first phase began, like I said, around 1320, lasted about 150 years, and then there was a break.
00:41:07.000And it was during that break, that warm period, that basically the Renaissance kicked in, and we began to really move forward.
00:41:14.000The second phase of the Little Ice Age came in during the 1600s, and it was actually even colder than the first phase.
00:41:22.000And worldwide, glaciers expanded to the largest they had been in 10,000 to 12,000 years, since the end of the Big Ice Age.
00:41:31.000Throughout the whole Holocene, glaciers had been smaller.
00:41:35.000Now during the Little Ice Age, they grew.
00:41:38.000And they grew to the biggest that they've been in 10,000 years.
00:41:42.000It's important to have that context of understanding when we talk about glacier recession.
00:41:47.000Because the glaciers began to recede around the middle of the 19th century, worldwide, as the Little Ice Age began to wane and global warmth began to return to the planet.
00:42:12.000They've been pretty much contracting uniformly since then.
00:42:16.000So when we're talking about Glacier Recession, it's important to understand that the Glacier Recession really began a century and a half ago or more, and has basically continued more or less uniformly since then, With no real change with the advent of human fossil fuel to the atmosphere,
00:42:38.000human carbon dioxide, which began really in earnest during the Second World War, is when we begin to add significant amounts of carbon dioxide to the atmosphere.
00:42:49.000It's important to realize that the glaciers had been receding almost a full century before that point.
00:42:57.000So when you see all this modern hysteria about global warming and the human-created global warming that we keep hearing about in the news and our influence on the atmosphere, does it drive you crazy?
00:43:24.000Now, but you've got to bear in mind that carbon dioxide is only one variable in a very complex equation.
00:43:30.000There are many factors influencing climate, of which carbon dioxide is only one.
00:43:36.000My problem with so much of the stuff that's coming out in mainstream media, which is coming through the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, is simply that when they were instituted back in the early 90s by the United Nations, the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change,
00:43:54.000basically gave them a mandate, which is demonstrate that humans are causing climate change.
00:44:46.000And what that means is that when the solar wind is in a more intense phase, like when the sunspots, for example, are very active, the solar wind is much stronger.
00:45:00.000What that does is it serves as a buffer that prevents cosmic rays from penetrating the atmosphere of the Earth.
00:45:11.000Also the geomagnetic field of the earth acts as a buffer.
00:45:14.000So here's two things that are completely Not included in the scenarios of the IPCC, but probably have a very profound effect on global climate.
00:45:27.000The Earth's geomagnetic field is, you know, probably know that the geomagnetic field has periodically throughout Earth's history disappeared completely.
00:45:36.000Sometimes it's disappeared and come back with reverse polarity.
00:45:39.000Well, that geomagnetic field acts as a buffer.
00:45:44.000Which helps to reduce the amount of cosmic rays penetrating the atmosphere.
00:46:10.000And for whatever reason, throughout the history of the Earth, it has completely disappeared at some points and has reversed polarity.
00:46:19.000It was the reversing of the polarity of the geomagnetic field that helped prove the reality of continental drift.
00:46:27.000Because as the mid-Atlantic ridge separates and lava flows out, it crystallizes and locked into the crystalline structure of the lava is the direction of the magnetic field and the polarity of the magnetic field is imprinted in there.
00:46:46.000If you look at the research going back to the 1950s, they realized that you had stripes effectively as you moved away from the mid-Atlantic ridge.
00:46:57.000As the lava flowed out and crystallized, locked in the geomagnetic field, they looked at it and they could see that there were times when it had completely reversed itself.
00:47:08.000And so this was like very powerful evidence that the theory of continental drift was right.
00:47:16.000The Atlantic Ocean had been spreading.
00:47:19.000And getting back to this whole Atlantis thing, which is interesting to me, is because when you look at Reed Plato's account, he describes Atlantis as being west of the Pillars of Heracles, which of course is the Straits of Gibraltar, the mouth of the Mediterranean.
00:47:36.000He describes how if you go, you come to some islands, then you come to some more islands, and that was the island complex of Atlantis, and beyond that was another whole continent.
00:47:49.000If you look in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean, you've got the Azores Plateau.
00:47:53.000Which is now a couple of thousand feet under the sea.
00:47:57.000The Azor Islands are the tops of mountains that emerge from the surface of the ocean, right?
00:48:07.000And they sit right on the Atlantic, the Mid-Atlantic Ridge.
00:48:12.000Now the Mid-Atlantic Ridge Some of the thinnest crust on the planet, right?
00:48:18.000And it's like a giant suture or a giant crack that runs up halfway around the planet.
00:48:24.000Well, when you have an ice age and you start piling ice up onto like the North American continent, What happens is the weight of that ice begins to crush the crust of the earth down into the mantle.
00:48:39.000It's called isostasy, which is a vertical movement.
00:48:43.000You know, continental drift is horizontal, isostasy is vertical.
00:48:47.000Now it's just like right now, you're sitting on that soft chair, right?
00:48:52.000And your ass is creating a depression in the cushion of the chair, right?
00:48:59.000That your ass is creating isostatic depression, right?
00:49:03.000And when you get up, And you walk away, then you will have isostatic compensation.
00:49:07.000You'll have isostatic rebound because the cushion will now rise because the weight has been removed.
00:49:13.000It's the same thing with the ice mass on the continent.
00:49:16.000The ice mass was hundreds of billions of trillions of tons of ice.
00:49:22.000It pressed the center of the North American continent, or the center of at least Canada, down perhaps as much as several thousand feet into the mantle.
00:49:32.000With the removal of that ice, the land begins to rebound.
00:49:37.000Hudson Bay is the depression left over from the thickest part of the ice, right?
00:49:45.000We could probably even pull some up here in a minute.
00:49:47.000There are photographs taken where you can see the elevated shorelines surrounding Hudson Bay because it's still rising, right?
00:49:55.000What's interesting too is if you look at the distance between these shorelines, you'll see that Early on, there's a greater distance because the land was rising faster.
00:50:08.000As the millennia have gone on, the distance separating each shoreline has diminished.
00:50:13.000But now you have to think that all of that weight is being transferred back into the ocean basins.
00:50:19.000A lot of it was dumped directly into the Atlantic Ocean, either via like the St. Lawrence River up there, the Hudson River up in the New York area, or via the Mississippi River into the Gulf of Mexico.
00:50:32.000Now you've got all this water dumping back into the ocean.
00:50:35.000Like I said, ocean levels are coming up hundreds of feet, right?
00:50:39.000So now you're adding all of this weight to the ocean basin.
00:50:42.000And now you've got the Mid-Atlantic Ridge, which is some of the thinnest crust on the earth, right?
00:51:02.000When the ice melts, the water goes in, sea level rises, it subsides, right?
00:51:08.000Now, you look at the Azores Plateau as a chunk of the African plate that got left over when the continents separated around 70 to 80 million years ago, right?
00:51:21.000You've seen the maps and showing how you can fit the continents together.
00:51:26.000If you fit these back together, if you reverse continental drift Go back about 70 or 80 million years, and it all fits together like a piece of the puzzle.
00:51:35.000But when it's separated, a piece of the African plate got left behind.
00:51:41.000And this is what is the Azores Plateau.
00:51:43.000And it sits right there astride the Mid-Atlantic Ridge.
00:51:46.000It's maybe a little bit smaller than Iceland, which is considered to be an island, but a pretty good-sized island, right?
00:51:55.000If you're doing this, and you have as much as 2,000 or 3,000 feet or maybe more of this vertical movement, right, and you add to that the 400 feet of sea level rise, now you can, I think, begin to get a scientific rationale for how you may have had a large island in the mid-Atlantic Back during the Ice Age.
00:52:15.000Also, additional evidence has suggested that the Gulf Stream, which now basically brings subtropical warmth up to Northwestern Europe.
00:52:26.000I mean, if you were to terminate the Gulf Stream, England would have some pretty malignant times.
00:52:35.000So would Northwestern Europe because the warmth is being brought up by that Gulf Stream, right?
00:52:41.000Well, during the Ice Age, the Gulf Stream diverted to the south at about 45 to 46 degrees, which was hundreds of miles farther south than it now goes.
00:52:51.000So essentially, if you look at the Azores Plateau, a big chunk of that Azores Plateau would have been above sea level during the Ice Age, and that Gulf Stream, with its warmth, would have just basically embraced it, see?
00:53:04.000So if you suddenly, Joe, found yourself transported mysteriously back to the Ice Age, That's probably where you might want to go, is the Azores Plateau.
00:53:13.000It might have been one of the most benign places on Earth to live during the Ice Age.
00:53:17.000And if there was a place where civilization could evolve, that would be a very logical place for it to occur.
00:53:24.000There's nothing really pseudoscientific now about assuming that there could have been some type of historic reality behind these stories of Atlantis.
00:53:34.000Of course, the problem is the woo-woo factor that has gotten so grafted onto these stories, but You know, crystals and aliens and flying ships.
00:53:44.000I mean, we don't know, but we don't have any hard evidence.
00:53:47.000But the hard evidence does suggest that there could have been some very benign, habitable islands, large islands in the Mid-Atlantic during the Ice Age.
00:54:03.000It's so crazy to think How much things have changed while human beings have been here.
00:54:10.000The idea that during Gobekli Tepe, which is 12,000 years ago, that North America was covered with ice.
00:54:18.000And this was when these people in Turkey had created this incredible structure.
00:54:24.000So when you see this, the modern hysteria about global warming, which has really essentially been like a wrestling match between the left and the right.
00:54:33.000It's this weird thing where the right wants to support like burning coal and they don't want to diminish the economy by putting all these environmental regulations on natural resources.
00:54:46.000And then the left, which is screaming at the top of their lungs that the sky is falling, the oceans are going to rise, and people are going to drown.
00:54:53.000When you know so much about what has happened over the course of the Earth, when you've studied this for a great deal of time like you have, what is your take on all this stuff?
00:55:05.000Well, I guess my take is fairly simple.
00:55:10.000I tend to think that, you know, if you look at the whole process of, if you look at the carbon cycle, for example, what you see there is interesting.
00:55:21.000If you can, talk to this as much as possible so we can have as little variation in the tone as possible.
00:55:28.000You know, putting this into context, we have to say right now we're approaching 400 parts per million of the ambient amount of CO2 in the atmosphere.
00:55:40.000At the beginning of the Industrial Revolution, it was about 100 parts per million less.
00:55:46.000You could say basically that over the last century we have increased the amount of CO2, measurable CO2, into the atmosphere, assuming that it's all from us now.
00:55:55.000I mean, there's questions about that too, because if there are other factors inducing global warming, such as changes in solar irradiance, the amount of insulation penetrating the atmosphere and so on, it means that the oceans are warming as a result of that.
00:56:10.000Oceans are a gigantic carbon dioxide sink.
00:56:13.000When they're warm, they exude carbon dioxide.
00:56:17.000When they're cold, they absorb it, right?
00:56:20.000So if you have a natural warming, it's going to expel some carbon dioxide.
00:56:25.000So it's not even clear necessarily that that 100 parts per million is totally the result of fossil fuel burning.
00:56:32.000But for the sake of argument, let's say that it is, okay?
00:56:36.000100 parts per million, that's Minuscule trace of this very important constituents of our atmosphere.
00:56:44.000You know that carbon dioxide is what fuels photosynthesis, right?
00:56:49.000And if you start reducing the amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and you start, once you start dropping below 200 parts per million and you get down to about 150 to 100, photosynthesis, plant photosynthesis starts shutting down.
00:57:02.000I mean, it's kind of like the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere right now is at the very bottom of the scale.
00:57:09.000You know, if we look at history going back when you mentioned the Cretaceous Tertiary, when the dinosaurs ruled, There have been many times more the amount of CO2 up to well in excess of a thousand parts per million, several thousand parts per million in the atmosphere.
00:57:27.000But if we have increased the amount of CO2 by 100 parts per million in a hundred years, it means we've, for every million molecules of air up there, we add one molecule of CO2 every year.
00:57:43.000Or to maybe try to make it a little bit more comprehensible.
00:57:47.000If for every hundred thousand molecules of air up there, every ten years we add one molecule of CO2. I'm not convinced that that's going to lead to global catastrophe.
00:58:34.000When you have, though, a major government-funded program, like climate change research, which is funded to the tune of about $2 billion per year, You're going to have a large vested interest in basically...
00:58:52.000I mean, if these guys came out and said, nah, CO2 is really not a big deal.
00:59:22.000If you look at those projections back in the 50s and 60s, and then you realize that in the ensuing period of time, we've now got exhaustive, highly accurate satellite surveys that can actually count the number of hectares of forests What's interesting is in the 90s when they really started looking at this data of just how much forest there was compared to what the projections were,
00:59:46.000there was like 25 to 40 percent more forests worldwide than anybody had predicted.
00:59:54.000What fueled this prolific forest growth?
00:59:57.000Well, it's very likely that at least part of it was because of the slight increase in CO2 as a result of our fossil fuel burning.
01:00:08.000Now, we put in, every year we burn about, introduce into the atmosphere about 6 billion tons of CO2. Well, there's about 750 or 760 billion tons of CO2 in the atmosphere naturally.
01:00:24.000And at least a third of that is cycling through from atmosphere into the biosphere into the oceans and so on.
01:00:32.000So our contribution isn't really that significant.
01:00:36.000But another part of the argument is that, and this has been admitted right in the IPCC reports, is that based on the amount of fossil fuel that we're burning, there should be twice as much CO2 into the atmosphere, in the atmosphere, as we're now measuring.
01:00:53.000So what they have been talking about for about 15 years now is where's the missing carbon?
01:01:01.000Well, probably some of it's going into the ocean, but most likely a lot of it is going into fueling plant growth and forest growth worldwide.
01:01:09.000And there's a lot of studies that are beginning to come out now that shows that perhaps some of the desert areas of the planet, rather than expanding, are actually contracting.
01:01:21.000So, you know, at this point, there's a lot of things we still have to learn.
01:01:26.000When it comes down to understanding the climate, we're in the infancy.
01:01:31.000You can't talk to a single climatologist and come up with one single coherent answer or agreement on what has actually provoked the planet to go into a full ice age or what has caused it to come out of an ice age.
01:01:44.000If you don't know that, We still have a hell of a lot to learn about how the climate works.
01:01:51.000So, I get really frustrated when I hear this claim that the debate is over.
01:01:56.000Because the debate hasn't really even begun yet.
01:01:59.000You see, we need to really look at all of these other factors as well.
01:02:04.000I mean, when you look at wind currents and ocean currents, you have the El Nino Southern Oscillation, you have the Indian Ocean Dipole, you have the Pacific Decadal Oscillation.
01:02:15.000All of these things have a very profound influence on the climate.
01:02:18.000But they're essentially being ignored within the Within the government-funded science, to a large extent.
01:02:26.000And you have a lot of scientists who have objected to some of the claims of certainty made by the IPCC scientists.
01:02:35.000And for the most part, the left likes to demonize them.
01:02:39.000This is people like, I think, probably the leading demon of climate deniers is Fred Singer because he once was given a $10,000 unsolicited donation from Exxon years and years ago.
01:02:54.000But you've got guys like Roy Spencer and Craig and Sherwood Idso and Robert Balling and Timothy Ball and the list goes on and on.
01:03:03.000These are distinguished climate scientists that have devoted their lives to understanding Climate science, who say, well, there's a lot of flaws in the methodology of the IPCC. But by saying that, now they have entered the spawn of hell,
01:04:07.000And seeing these fucking things that we've...
01:04:10.000grown to be accustomed to on television, where you have a guy on the left who has one point of view, and a guy on the right who says something wacky, and then everybody fights about it.
01:04:21.000And then the YouTube clips, you look at the comments, and it's filled with, this guy's a faggot, and that guy's a faggot, this guy, you eat shit, I hope your house goes underwater, you fucking climate denier.
01:04:32.000And when I'm listening to you, and this podcast has been over an hour already, and It's incredibly complex.
01:04:41.000We have barely scratched the surface and you're never going to hear anything like this on any television show because most people feel that the general public does not have the attention span to absorb all of this information.
01:04:54.000This really complex explanation of the known science of the changing of the atmosphere of the earth.
01:05:02.000So when people start talking about Climate denying and what is going on with climate change, what they're really doing is establishing their position on what side?
01:05:15.000I'm a rational person who believes in science and education, but how much of this have you actually explored?
01:05:24.000How much of it has anybody actually looked at?
01:05:26.000Well, I'm a person who supports industry, and I'm a person who believes the United States needs to recover from our Economic disaster, and if we've got to frack a few wells, so be it!
01:05:39.000There's these two very distinct and oftentimes shallow ideological perspectives.
01:05:45.000And when I say shallow, I mean shallow from the point of the general public, a person like me who's not a scientist, observing it and just picking a side.
01:05:57.000I would like to grab the average person, the average lefty, and the average righty that thinks that they have an opinion on global change, and just do me a favor and just write down what you know.
01:06:27.000I mean, I don't remember who said it, but it's the enemy of free thinking.
01:06:32.000You get in these ideological clusters, and then anything outside of this thing, these predetermined patterns of behavior that you've subscribed to, anything becomes...
01:06:54.000You see it with any isms, with feminism, with men's rights.
01:07:01.000You see it with With people who subscribe to the right, people who subscribe to the left, any variables that don't fit into their equation that they've already subscribed to, they don't want to be labeled as that other side.
01:07:13.000And any time they don't want to be labeled, they start ignoring any evidence or any ideas that don't fit within this really rigid description.
01:07:29.000People get locked into these ideological paradigms and then from that point on basically their perspective is modified more by emotion and rationality.
01:07:38.000More by their feelings rather than real information.
01:08:28.000When James Hansen gave his testimony before Congress in the summer of 1988, you know, and proposed these potential tipping points and catastrophic outcomes of our burning of fossil fuel, We've gone from there to the United Nations getting involved and the United Nations setting up the whole – the IPCC and channeling all of this funding to it.
01:08:53.000And I think the consequence is that, you know, when you say – again, excuse me.
01:09:00.000We went from global warming to climate change.
01:09:04.000Why do they not really use global warming as a term anymore?
01:09:08.000It's mainly because for 15 years, the average global temperature has flatlined.
01:09:13.000And this is based upon, you know, the most accurate satellite surveys.
01:09:18.000The IPCC generally focuses only on ground-based sensors, which are subjected to perhaps some considerable bias.
01:09:26.000Because, you know, you picture ground-based sensors, most of them are sitting at airports.
01:09:30.000When these things were being put in post-World War II, The bulk of them, 40s and 50s into the 60s, many of these airports were rural.
01:09:39.000They were, you know, adjacent to small towns.
01:09:42.000They were surrounded by fields and farms, forests.
01:09:45.000What's happened is the urban area has encroached.
01:09:49.000When you create streets, pavement, buildings, all of this absorbs heat, right?
01:09:56.000And no one has really done an exhaustive study of the potential bias that's introduced into the ground-based sensors.
01:10:05.000That at least part of the warming of these ground-based sensors may have nothing to do with carbon dioxide at all.
01:10:12.000It may just have to do with the fact that they're sitting next to a huge parking lot.
01:10:16.000I mean, you know yourself, if you're walking in a field and then you walk onto an asphalt parking lot, immediately it's much, much hotter.
01:10:27.000You see, Anthony Watts, who's another one of the dissenters who's demonized, is the only one who has really attempted to exhaustively document the accuracy of the ground-based sensors.
01:10:42.000And what he's come up with is that perhaps as much as 30 to 50 percent of the perceived warming of the last century, which is about eight-tenths of a degree centigrade, It's probably as a result of that bias that's been introduced by what's called the urban heat island effect.
01:11:02.000LA has an urban heat island mitigation program underway.
01:11:07.000All of the major metropolitan cities are now trying to mitigate the effects of this Because of all of the cement and the buildings and the pavement and the parking lots, they're always hotter than the surrounding rural areas.
01:11:24.000So the question has been legitimately raised, how much of a bias has been introduced into the into the ground-based sensors.
01:11:32.000Well, when we turn to the balloon sensors, the radiosonde balloon sensors and the satellite sensors, basically what they're showing is that the average global temperature has been flat for 15 years.
01:11:44.000Well, because of that, and many of the key scientists like Phil Jones of the IPCC has basically publicly admitted, yeah, When you look at the average temperature from that perspective, it hasn't warmed in 15. Now,
01:12:00.000there are regional pockets of warming and records being set all the time because local conditions will affect change enormously.
01:12:10.000Just like I was talking about the urban heat island effect is a local or regional condition.
01:12:16.000But because of the fact that the climate hasn't warmed statistically significantly in 15 years, Now, we don't talk about global warming, we talk about climate change.
01:12:29.000But those two terms are not interchangeable.
01:12:32.000Global warming is a very specific model of climate change, which is that you've got this 15 micron wavelength of CO2 in the atmosphere that's trapping infrared radiation emanating from the Earth,
01:12:48.000Okay, but if you're talking about climate change, now suddenly You know, our umbrella goes much, much huger, and it now encompasses all of these other things that I was talking about.
01:12:59.000And to question the consensus idea, to question that CO2 is the primary or sole driver of climate, is not to be a climate change denier, see?
01:13:12.000Because no, I would challenge anybody who even uses that term, well, show me an example of any climate scientist, no matter where they fall in the argument, That is denying that the climate is changing.
01:13:24.000I mean, anybody who has studied the climate at all knows that it has changed dramatically and dynamically on any scale you can look at, whether it's the decadal scale, the centennial, or millennial, or beyond.
01:13:36.000It changes on every level, and that's the thing we have to recognize, that if we stop burning fossil fuels tomorrow, we didn't drive another car, we shut down all the coal plants, I'm going to tell you this, the climate would not stop changing.
01:13:54.000When you see a story, like here's one, it's in the news, about U.S. Senator Marco Rubio's denial of man-made climate change should play well with his Tea Party base, whose support he'll need if he indeed runs for president in 2016. But in taking this position,
01:14:14.000Florida's junior Republican senator ignores the vast majority of the world's climate scientists who say human activity is contributing to climate change and rising sea levels.
01:14:24.000Human activity is contributing to climate change.
01:14:28.000There's no doubt that human activity contributes to climate change.
01:14:32.000Human activity, again, is one variable in a very complex equation.
01:14:36.000I wish Marco Rubio would keep his mouth shut until he goes and spends about six months or a year really doing the homework, because then he could talk a little bit more intelligently about it.
01:15:27.000I'm so thankful not only that you've gone down, but that you're willing to exchange this information with us or impart it on us because it's...
01:15:36.000It's a very different perspective because I know you're not a right-wing lunatic, you're a very science-based guy, but you're looking at this and the way you're explaining it is incredibly rational and incredibly frustrating to me that there's not that many people that are saying this.
01:15:54.000Well, the upside, I think, of the whole global warming issue or the climate change issue is this, that The thing is, I made the point that even if we stopped all fossil fuel consumption tomorrow, the climate is still going to change.
01:16:11.000And it's going to change dramatically, it's going to change sometimes even catastrophically.
01:16:16.000What we need to do from here on out is basically think about strategies of adaptability.
01:16:21.000If, as a result of this whole issue, even though I think it's mis-based, misapplied, if part of it that comes out of this is that we begin to develop strategies of adaptability, that would be a good thing.
01:16:38.000If, however, we focus so exclusively on carbon dioxide to the exclusion of everything else, that could be a bad thing.
01:16:47.000Because the climate is going to change.
01:16:49.000No matter what we do or where we go with it, the climate is going to change.
01:16:53.000So you can put up solar panels until the cows come home.
01:16:56.000The houses that are on the beach in Malibu are still going to be underwater in 100 years.
01:17:05.000Well, see, the thing is, if you look at the...
01:17:09.000I mentioned earlier that there was a break in the Little Ice Age of about 150 years that basically led to the Renaissance, right?
01:17:17.000Well, we've been in a recession of the Little Ice Age, an interruption of the Little Ice Age for about 150 years.
01:17:26.000And right now, you know, and again, the IPC, one of the things that frustrates me is that they basically exclude solar physicists and solar scientists who are essentially saying that insulation levels, insulation, the amount of solar energy penetrating the atmosphere, is at one of the lowest levels in thousands of years.
01:17:45.000And I mean, there are solar physicists that are saying, you know what, we could be at the beginning of another phase of the Little Ice Age.
01:17:53.000Now, if our CO2 is helping to ameliorate somewhat a return to the Little Ice Age, that would be a good thing.
01:18:32.000And I consider myself a conservationist in the respect that we basically need examples of pristine nature, because ultimately nature is the most powerful teacher.
01:18:57.000Nobody has the right to dump shit in the air that other people have to breathe.
01:19:01.000Nobody has the right to dump shit in the water that other people have to drink.
01:19:05.000To me, those are different questions and really where the more of our focus should be rather than these abstractions.
01:19:13.000I have found, of course, I've gotten some flack over the last few years by saying some of the things I've been saying here, you know, that I've had people stand up and accuse me.
01:19:22.000You say we can just do anything we want.
01:19:30.000And when we begin to look at the bigger context of this thing, and we begin to understand the extraordinary changes that this planet has been through, and even some of the lesser things in recent years, Mount St. Helens, you remember when that erupted in 1980?
01:19:46.000Tens of thousands of acres were turned into a lunar landscape, right?
01:19:51.000Well, if you read the Accounts of the scientists, the biologists, the zoologists, the ecologists that have been studying what happened to that decimated landscape in the aftermath.
01:20:04.000What you find out is they're surprised and almost shocked at how quickly nature recovered from that.
01:20:12.000And how quickly, you know, colonizer plants moved in and was followed by the whole succession, the ecological succession of reclaiming that land.
01:20:24.000If you look at the Exxon Valdez disaster up in In Alaska.
01:20:33.000That was, over the short term, devastating to the local ecology.
01:20:37.000And yet, what's interesting, again, there have been several books written by some of the lead scientists involved in that.
01:20:45.000I'm talking about how remarkably quick nature began to reclaim and recover from that.
01:20:52.000Where the government forced Exxon to go in and do its cleanup has actually suffered more than the areas that were just left alone For nature to reclaim.
01:21:03.000So the chemicals that they used in order to break up, that was the issue with the Gulf as well, right?
01:21:09.000With those dispersants that they were spraying over the area?
01:21:13.000They probably should have just left the Gulf alone.
01:21:15.000Because, you know, when you have submarine earthquakes, they can expel huge amounts of hydrocarbons into the ocean.
01:21:25.000Nature has been dealing with massive expulsions of hydrocarbon Into the oceans and into the marine ecologies for millions and millions of years.
01:21:37.000But I think, you know, what we'll see is that the recovery time has been faster than most people believed possible.
01:21:46.000You see, I think what's really going to Um, turn out in the end, looking at all this is that nature is robust.
01:21:53.000And when we begin to look at the number of times that nature has been disrupted by, we've been talking about asteroids and comets and here's, here's a perspective for you.
01:22:05.000You know, at the peak of the cold war, When U.S. and the Soviet Union were eyeball to eyeball with our nuclear weapons on high alert, and we had 10,000 weapons on our side,
01:22:20.000they had 10,000 weapons on their side.
01:22:23.000The total nuclear arsenal at the times had about 18,000 megatons of energy.
01:22:35.000Now that means 18 million tons of TNT. The bomb that destroyed Hiroshima was about 10,000 tons of TNT. So a hundred times, a hundred Hiroshima bombs would be one megaton,
01:22:52.000Now, there was about say 15 to 18,000 megatons total in the arsenal of the superpowers during the height of the Cold War.
01:23:01.000Had we unleashed an all-out nuclear war and fired every warhead that we had in our arsenals at each other, 15,000 warheads, you know, 20,000 warheads, 15,000 megatons,
01:23:17.000it would have been an environmental disaster unprecedented in history.
01:23:21.000You remember the scenarios about nuclear winter, right?
01:23:24.000Because of all of the fires and the soot and the particulate matter thrown into the atmosphere, It could literally bring on a mini ice age, right?
01:23:34.000And probably cause, without even the radiation, cause major collapse of the human population, right?
01:23:42.000Get this number in your head, 15,000 megatons.
01:23:45.000Okay, now, even a small asteroid impact, or let's say the asteroid impact that struck the Yucatan.
01:23:54.000There's a simple formula that you can use.
01:23:56.000When you look at the crater size, you take The size of the crater expressed in kilometers, raise it to the power of 3.4 and multiply the result by 2.4 and what it's going to give you is the energy yield in megatons of that object striking.
01:24:14.000If I put in 180 kilometers into this calculator here, which is the diameter of the Yucatan Crater and I raise it to the 3.4 power and then I multiply that by the 2.4 power,
01:24:34.000That number comes up to be 111 million megatons.
01:24:42.000I divide that by 15,000 and basically what we have there is about equivalent to the entire nuclear arsenal of the superpowers 8,000 times over.
01:24:59.000Now what kind of an environmental consequence would there be to that?
01:25:03.000Well, we saw that global firestorms, you know, the studies of the amount of soot at that boundary layer shows that the amount of biomass that went up in firestorms at the KT boundary was about equivalent to every plant on earth today going up in fire.
01:25:23.000You had tsunamis that were perhaps a thousand feet in height.
01:25:28.000You had global earthquakes, probably measured 10 to 11 on the Richter scale.
01:25:33.000And you know how the Richter scale works, it's logarithmic.
01:25:35.000So that An 8.0 earthquake is 10 times more powerful than a 7.0.
01:25:41.0009.0 is 10 times more powerful than an 8.0.
01:25:45.000An 11.0 earthquake is going to be unimaginable.
01:25:48.000The whole framework of the globe would have shaken.
01:25:50.000You probably would have massive failures on every fault line on the planet.
01:25:55.000Now, the KT event was the middle of the five great extinction events, right?
01:26:02.000There was Ordovician-Silurian, there was the Permian-Triassic, there was a couple more.
01:26:08.000Two of them were more extreme than that.
01:26:10.000Now, even much smaller than that, right?
01:26:14.000You know, when they talk about a tipping point, you know, are we talking about a tipping point that could trigger a climate change, a disastrous catastrophic climate change, as being a few parts million more of CO2? Or is a tipping point really a mile-wide asteroid slamming into the earth at a hundred times the speed of a rifle bullet?
01:26:37.000That could be a tipping point, my friend.
01:26:39.000And that has happened thousands of times.
01:26:42.000And hundreds of times since we humans have been here.
01:26:52.000There's evidence emerging now that the collapse of the late Bronze Age civilizations around 4,200 years ago may have been precipitated by a series of impacts.
01:27:00.000There's evidence emerging that the climate downturn that occurred between 536 and 540 A.D. that I talked about earlier may have been triggered by a series of multiple impacts.
01:27:11.000One that looks like it occurred off the coast of Norway and another one that looks like it occurred off the coast of New Zealand, like tandem impacts, right?
01:27:19.000Around 536 A.D. And we're basically faced with the idea now that Literally, impacts from things from space may be hundreds of times more likely than anybody was even imagining, you know,
01:27:36.000So we're essentially this civilization that is banking on the knowledge that we've accumulated over a very small amount of time, and as we're uncovering more and more evidence, more and more information, we're starting to realize our ignorance.
01:27:52.000We're starting to realize how little we know about our own history, the history of this particular species, and how it's interacted in this crazy, volatile environment of Earth, and how many times we've been hit by rocks.
01:28:41.000What I'm referring to is there was a mainstream report about all these pieces of this very similar material to what they find at nuclear blasts.
01:28:52.000And that it was all over the place when they did the core samples around 12,000 years ago.
01:28:57.000Yes, then that's exactly what Graham's talking about.
01:29:00.000And yes, the evidence is getting stronger and stronger each year that there may have been a multiple impact event that terminated the Ice Age.
01:29:09.000And this is still a very controversial idea because the gradualists just don't want to go there.
01:29:16.000And this is probably what killed off mass extinction of the woolly mammoth, mass extinction of the saber-toothed tiger, and a series of animals that They really have not figured out why.
01:29:27.000There's been all sorts of theories about why the woolly mammoth went extinct, and some of them are ridiculous, like that people did it.
01:29:37.000Well, it's ridiculous when you think about what kind of people were around 12,000 years ago and what kind of weapons they had and what a fucking mammoth looks like.
01:29:44.000Like, Jesus Christ, how many of them were?
01:29:47.000And the other thing that's ridiculous about, obviously, when I say ridiculous, I'm ridiculous.
01:29:51.000I shouldn't even be making that statement.
01:29:54.000But the research that I've read and the people that have questioned it have talked about the mass graves where they've found these animals that have died instantaneously, thousands of them, and not consumed either.
01:30:08.000They don't show signs of predation or of butchering.
01:30:20.000You know, for centuries, pristine mammoth tusks, ivory, have been hauled out of the permafrost of Siberia in train load lots.
01:30:30.000You know, and this has gone into the global ivory market literally for three or four hundred years.
01:30:36.000Some estimates are that there may have been as many as four to ten million woolly mammoths worldwide.
01:30:41.000Most people don't realize that right here in North America, there were three species of Probocidian or three species of elephants during the Ice Age.
01:31:53.000This was how the woolly mammoth was found.
01:31:56.000So they took photos of it when it was found like this and then they left it alone and the wolves came and got it?
01:32:01.000This is a reconstruction, I believe, in the Leningrad Museum.
01:32:05.000So what they did was they took the remains of the woolly mammoth and then taxidermists came in and reconstructed.
01:32:11.000But this shows the position in which he was found sitting on his haunches like that.
01:32:18.000At the time that the woolly mammoth met his demise, he was eating flowering plants, right?
01:32:24.000Now it's important to keep that in mind.
01:32:26.000His stomach was full of about two dozen different varieties of plants and sedges and things that he had been munching on up in Siberia at the time that he met his death.
01:32:46.000The fact that his flesh was still edible, at least by wolves.
01:32:50.000You know, the stories about, you know, the scientists eating mammoth burgers is probably made up.
01:32:55.000But the wolves definitely were able to eat the flesh, right?
01:32:59.000It was described as still being marbled, almost as if it had just been frozen You know, a week ago.
01:33:05.000But since the time that the woolly mammoth died, it had its whole carcass.
01:33:10.000Now, this was a six-ton woolly mammoth.
01:33:12.000So it had been frozen for how many thousands and thousands of years, and so thoroughly frozen that the contents of the stomach had not putrefied.
01:33:23.000Now, a woolly mammoth of six tons has a lot of internal heat, right?
01:33:31.000Clarence Birdseye, the founder of Birdseye Foods and the inventor of the fast freezing of foods for preservation, got involved in examining and speculating about this woolly mammoth.
01:33:46.000His conclusion basically led to something like this.
01:33:49.000In order to prevent the contents of the stomach from putrefying, the entire carcass of the woolly mammoth would have had to have been frozen through and through in 10 hours or less.
01:34:00.000Now, bear in mind that this woolly mammoth was eating flowering plants, right?
01:34:04.000Now, how cold would it have to be to freeze a six-ton woolly mammoth in 10 hours or less?
01:34:12.000His estimate was probably somewhere around 150 degrees below zero.
01:34:16.000So, from flowering plants to 150 degrees below zero in 10 hours?
01:34:32.000The speculation that I found most interesting was possibly volcanic gases that had been ejected up into the stratosphere, approached absolute zero and because of the cold, fell back to Earth.
01:34:47.000I think you could get the same effect perhaps with gases released from a disintegrating comet nucleus.
01:34:56.000I mean, anything that anybody says at this point is purely speculative.
01:35:00.000However, it's clear that whatever this mammoth underwent was disastrous in the extreme.
01:35:06.000You saw him sitting there on his haunches, right?
01:35:09.000Both of his hip bones were broken, which means that he was slammed back onto his haunches very violently.
01:35:15.000He was also found with an erect penis, which means that he died by suffocation.
01:35:23.000Which meant that he was entombed virtually instantly by the material that later became the permafrost.
01:35:29.000We were talking about the Little Ice Age earlier, and I was talking about how the Little Ice Age ended around 1850. Well, this guy was found about 1901 after the climate in Siberia had been warming somewhat, see?
01:35:41.000And what happened was part of a cliff that had been next to the Beresovka River, the Beresovka River had shifted its channel and eroded Some of the cliff face back and then one year, one warm spring, there was a collapse of the cliff face that exposed this mammoth to the atmosphere.
01:36:02.000And at that point is when the wolves came in and began to devour the flesh on the skull.
01:36:07.000So clearly this wooly mammoth is an example of or indicative of some type of a catastrophe.
01:36:15.000Whether it was a global catastrophe or a local catastrophe, nobody knows.
01:37:34.000I was about to go to bed and I was just flipping through the channels and they were going over this thing about a caldera volcano in Yellowstone.
01:37:41.000I was like, what the fuck's a caldera?
01:37:43.000And then they started talking about, what was it, something like 600 kilometers wide or something crazy like that, which is something like 300 miles.
01:37:51.000And they were saying that they didn't even discover it until they started doing satellite imagery of Earth, and then they realized that, oh, this was a giant volcano that was so violent in its eruption that it blew the mountain off of it,
01:38:06.000and it became this massive crater that And that it happens every 600,000 to 800,000 years ago and that the last time it happened was 600,000 years ago.
01:38:15.000So hopefully, keeping our fingers crossed, we got another 100,000 years.
01:38:21.000But see, that's another aspect of this component of the dynamic history of planet Earth is these gigantic volcanic eruptions.
01:38:30.000There's been some interesting work linking asteroid impacts with giant volcanic eruptions as well and it would make sense that That the energy injected into the earth by a major impact could trigger volcanic eruptions.
01:38:46.000We know that during the great meltdown event of 11,000 to 13,000 years ago that there were enormous, massive volcanic eruptions.
01:38:57.000And Mount St. Helens, for example, was massively erupting at that time.
01:39:04.000And I have photographed, I have some photographs right here, I don't know how much time we have to look at some of this, but where I have gone out and found Thick layers of white volcanic ash from Mount St. Helens sandwiched in between these flood layers.
01:39:20.000And it undoubtedly had to have been a response to the fact that you had this enormous mass transfer of weight that we were talking about earlier from the continents back to the ocean.
01:39:32.000And when we go through, maybe it's time to go through a few of these images that I brought so you can begin to see some of the consequences of this melting.
01:39:42.000You begin to appreciate that, yeah, there were these just enormous mass transfers of weight.
01:39:48.000Unloading in certain areas, loading in other areas, this would clearly have a profound effect on the subterranean stability and could easily lead to major eruptions.
01:40:01.000And there was a spasm of major volcanic eruptions globally.
01:40:06.000At the time of the transition out of the Ice Age, which would only have added to the havoc of that transition.
01:40:13.000And why, you know, half of the great species of megafauna disappeared.
01:40:18.000A megafauna is basically defined as any animal In this case, mostly mammals, over 44 kilograms in body weight, which is about a hundred pounds, right?
01:40:30.000And if you started thinking about all of the animals globally, worldwide, there are more than a hundred pounds.
01:40:36.000Depending on how you divide up the species, there might be a hundred to twenty, a hundred and thirty different species.
01:40:41.000And I'm talking about the, you know, lions and tigers and bears and elephants and rhinos and hippos and moose and caribou and dot to dot, right down the line, right?
01:41:21.000So if you were going to try to effect an equivalent mass extinction of species today, you'd basically have to eliminate every animal on Earth over 100 pounds in body weight in order to get the equivalent of that mass extinction episode of 12,000,
01:41:49.000Okay, you brought up the idea of, it's called overkill, which has been the dominant theory for decades, which is that human hunters exterminated the woolly mammoth.
01:42:00.000And in some vague way, the extermination of the woolly mammoth being at the top of the food chain somehow had a ripple effect down the You know, through the ranks of species and somehow, perhaps, in an unaddressed way, resulted in the loss of all these other species.
01:42:19.000And the more you said that theory is ridiculous, that's an understatement.
01:42:24.000I mean, you're talking about, you know, perhaps bands of a few hundred or maybe even a thousand individuals, migrant bands, human hunters coming in and somehow able...
01:42:36.000See, you've got to bear in mind that the estimates of human population during this time globally is less than the estimates of the population of woolly mammoths.
01:42:45.000But somehow, our ancestors were able to wipe out 4 million to 10 million woolly mammoths so fast...
01:42:55.000So there was only like 10 million people back then?
01:42:58.000That's, well, see, that's based upon more or less the conventional interpretation.
01:43:03.000Now, of course, what we've been talking about implies, opens the door to their possibility of there being a lot more people.
01:43:10.000And then mass extinction also including a massive amount of human beings as well.
01:43:15.000Yeah, and there is some interesting evidence emerging now that there perhaps was a population collapse between what is called the Clovis culture and the Folsom culture.
01:43:24.000The Clovis culture appears in North America to be...
01:43:27.000What is believed to have been the earliest culture.
01:43:29.000And there's a site in New Mexico that was the first discovery of the association of human artifacts, meaning spear points and arrowheads and things like that, along with extinct mammals.
01:43:46.000I visited there about six or seven years ago because I was looking for this so-called black matte layer, which has now been documented at dozens of Clovis sites around North America.
01:43:57.000The black matte layer is this unique layer that essentially separates the Pleistocene from the Holocene.
01:47:44.000So is this something that they just haven't formed any theories about, or they don't try to, or it's been ignored because there's not enough information?
01:47:57.000At the dawn of earth science, geological science, in the early 19th century, To a man, every one of the founding fathers of geology, whether it was William Buckland or Cuvier or Sir James Hall or Rodney Murchison,
01:48:13.000Adam Sedgwick, you could go right down the line.
01:48:15.000All of these guys from 1820 up to about 1860. Every one of them was a catastrophist.
01:48:22.000Because these were guys, basically, who had not been indoctrinated into any particular interpretation of world history.
01:48:29.000They went out and they looked at evidence in the landscape, and their conclusion was, you know, something really catastrophic has happened.
01:48:37.000And then what happened was you had Charles Lyell Playfair and James Hutton, these three guys came along and basically established the doctrine of uniformitarianism, as it's called.
01:48:53.000And basically the idea of uniformitarianism was this, is that we look at modern processes to explain Ancient processes.
01:49:01.000So if we see a river eroding its bank, moving sediment, creating a sandbar with that, if we see like during the early 19th century, we were in the last phase of the Little Ice Age, so glaciers were receding, and these guys could essentially go up there and look on a year-to-year basis and see what was happening as the glaciers were receding,
01:49:21.000So basically what they then did was extrapolated from modern processes to try to explain all the ancient processes.
01:49:29.000This is the doctrine of uniformitarianism.
01:49:31.000Okay, it's a very powerful model for understanding ancient change.
01:49:36.000However, it became ensconced as dogma, so that by the turn of the century, as we come right up to the threshold of the 20th century, it was now considered unscientific to try to explain anything in the past that we couldn't see happening today.
01:49:57.000As we go into the 20th century, this gradualist dogma became ensconced in academia.
01:50:04.000And every geologist from about 1900 up to about 1980 was thoroughly indoctrinated into this idea of the gradualism.
01:50:14.000That all of the earth change that we see going on on the planet today has occurred one grain of sand, one drop of water at a time.
01:50:21.000And it was considered to be very unscientific.
01:50:26.000To begin to invoke things, because initially some of the founding fathers of geology, a lot of them interestingly were theologians.
01:50:36.000A number of them, like Adam Sedgwick is a good example of somebody who was a traveling theologian, a traveling minister, right?
01:50:42.000He was traveling around England, and he was seeing things like the Thames River Valley, and he was seeing that the Thames flowed in this gigantic channel that was completely outsized relative to the river that was flowing in it.
01:50:56.000And he says, that must have been from a huge flood.
01:51:18.000In the 1800s, they assumed that if you saw effects of gigantic floods, it had to have been Noah's Flood.
01:51:26.000Well, at the same time that you had geological gradualism on the ascent, biological gradualism came along in the form of Darwinism.
01:51:36.000And the two sort of complemented each other and mutually supported each other.
01:51:41.000Well, if we've got infinite time, you know, millions and millions of years of gradual geological change, Now that allows us millions and millions of years for gradual biological change.
01:51:53.000And these two paradigms were mutually reinforcing.
01:51:56.000So now we come to the 20th century, and for the first three quarters of the 20th century, that was the dogma that was indoctrinated into the minds of every Earth scientist, right?
01:52:08.000And to vary from that was to be pseudoscientific, and you're trying to revert back to biblical fundamentalism if you start talking about giant floods.
01:52:18.000Well, what happened was, and then it was left to people like Immanuel Velikovsky, who was not an Earth scientist, he was a psychoanalyst, and he wrote several books in the mid-1950s where he had gathered together in one place all of this anomalous evidence from the Earth history that did not fit the uniformitarian paradigm.
01:52:38.000Now, his books were popular successes, but mainstream science just slammed them, slammed them and said, this guy's a nutcase, right?
01:52:46.000Well, he did make some serious missteps in trying to explain this anomalous geological evidence for catastrophe.
01:52:54.000And it was those missteps that they were able to focus on to try to discredit him.
01:52:58.000However, the amassing of evidence for catastrophes in Earth history has held the test of time.
01:53:05.000And what we see is, 1980 was a pivotal year.
01:53:08.000That was a year that three separate teams published evidence showing that the Cretaceous-Tertiary boundary, the dinosaur boundary, was profoundly catastrophic.
01:53:20.000And that opened the door to begin a reconsideration of Earth history.
01:53:26.000Now at the same time, With the advent of the space program, we are beginning to realize that near-Earth space is not a completely empty place.
01:53:36.000It's actually densely populated by all kinds of things.
01:53:41.000Prior to the Apollo moon program, it was believed that most of the craters on the moon, if not all of the craters on the moon, were volcanic.
01:53:57.000Now you look at the surface of the Moon, and I think the last image on the Joe Rogan images there is going to be a picture of the Moon, and you'll see that it's littered.
01:54:30.000So it's simply a matter of time and perspective that we really, well, thankfully there's people like you that are paying attention to this, but with the amount of time that people have been videotaping things and writing books,
01:54:47.000this tiny little window, there just hasn't been enough time to really get a real account of how often this takes place because that That amount of time, although it's a grand amount of time compared to our lives, to the life of an individual, for the life of the planet,
01:55:09.000And this is one reason why I'm an advocate for moving forward and essentially becoming a cosmic civilization.
01:55:17.000You see, I came of age during the heyday of the Mercury and Gemini and Apollo programs.
01:55:25.000And, you know, that was the one thing, when I look back and I go, you know what, one of the last times that I was really proud of my country, Was when we put those men on the moon, you know, when we planted our American flag on the moon.
01:55:36.000And I really believe back in 1969, 1970, that we were, America's destiny was to move the human species into this grander cosmic environment.
01:55:47.000Then, of course, you know, the Vietnam War came along and other priorities and money got shifted.
01:55:52.000The Nixon administration shifted huge amounts of money away from the space program.
01:55:56.000The timetable that was set out that we were going to have a permanent lunar base by the end of the 70s, first manned mission to Mars before the 80s was over, perhaps independently self-supporting colonies in space by the year 2000. Mayor,
01:56:13.000I was a junior in high school when Kubrick's 2001 A Space Odyssey came out.
01:56:21.0001968, nobody had any, it was no stretch of the imagination to assume that by 2001, yeah, there were going to be orbiting hotels in space, right?
01:56:32.000But we lost our vision, we lost our will, and we just got sidetracked.
01:56:38.000You know, I remember in the 70s talking to people about the potential of colonizing space, using the materials and resources found in space.
01:56:47.000And the knee-jerk response I always got was, well, we've got too many problems here on Earth.
01:56:53.000We've got to solve those problems first.
01:56:56.000Well, my response to that was, well, good luck, because you're basically talking about altering human nature, right?
01:57:03.000And it's going to take something more than just some policy to alter human nature.
01:57:08.000What it's going to take is some serious consciousness excursions, Perhaps people going to space.
01:57:17.000You know, here we had these astronauts.
02:00:55.000Leftover meltwater puddles from the recession of the glacier.
02:00:58.000So I can still remember being like six or seven years old and my dad telling me, you know, once upon a time, this was thousands of feet under the ice.
02:01:06.000And that's how we had land on the edge of this lake.
02:01:09.000And as a kid, I used to sit in my backyard and fish for, you know, Sunfish and crappies and bullheads.
02:01:51.000I mean, Northern Pike, you go to Saskatchewan, people fly in from all over the world to go fishing up there because they have this massive population of beautiful Northern Pike.
02:02:18.000But in 1969, I went to an outdoor rock concert that was at an airport called Eden Prairie that's just outside of the Twin Cities, Minneapolis.
02:02:29.000It's on a series of bluffs that overlooks the Minnesota River Valley, right?
02:02:35.000Of course, I'm stoned out of my gourd.
02:03:34.000Scale invariance, meaning that the river at the bottom, obviously you see the lines all around it where it indicates that there was a much, much larger body of water at one point in time.
02:03:50.000At the end of the last ice age, the river here was about 30 to 40 million cubic feet per second.
02:03:57.000So was that because of the melting glaciers, the force of the river?
02:04:01.000This particular was not directly fed by the melting glaciers.
02:04:04.000It was the result of the catastrophic overflow of Lake Bonneville, Which was the result of massive, prolonged torrential rainfall that just drowned all the deserts of the western and southwestern United States.
02:04:21.000And there was an overflow, a spillway, out of the Lake Bonneville Basin in northern Utah, and it spilled over into the Snake River Plain of Idaho, 30 to 40 million cubic feet per second.
02:05:19.000And I realized, I saw then, That this channel, that this bluff I was standing on, had once been the bank of a gigantic river, thousands of times bigger than the modern Minnesota River.
02:05:32.000But I didn't know it rationally in the sense that it took me another 10 or 15 years of study and research before I could go back and say, yeah, What my initial instinct, looking out and seeing this matching set of bluffs,
02:05:48.000four or five miles on the other side, and seeing this small version of it in the modern river, that I was right.
02:05:56.000I remember one time in the 80s, I was giving a talk on that, and there was a geologist in the audience, and he got up and he goes, no, no, no, no, no, no.
02:06:05.000That big channel, that was millions of years.
02:06:07.000Millions of years it took for that channel to form.
02:06:13.000And what happened was, is by him challenging me, it really, you know, I said, okay, you know, like an MMA fighter getting challenged, says, okay, I'm going to take you on, you know.
02:06:24.000I rose to the occasion, and I spent literally years doing research on...
02:06:30.000Glacial geomorphology on paleohydrology and of course at the end of the thing I knew that I was my instincts were absolutely correct that yes now there is solid scientific documentable verifiable evidence that this whole channel of the Minnesota River Valley Was filled brimful with water at the end of the last ice.
02:06:49.000So when he was saying it was millions of years, he's saying that same exact channel of water had never varied and that it had just cut through over millions and millions of years very slowly.
02:07:09.000So this goes along with what you were talking about earlier, that the ideas of science were that everything had taken place, much like evolution, on a very gradual pace.
02:08:31.000The gradualist mode that we've seen dominating through the last few hundred years, at least since the advent of modern science, and then if you want to call it the catastrophic mode, where as much change is compressed into a few years or months or sometimes even days or weeks as normally would take thousands and thousands of years.
02:08:53.000When I look at the Grand Canyon, what I'm seeing there is episodes of catastrophic erosion, probably stretching back over two and a half million years.
02:09:02.000Remember I said the Pleistocene was about two and a half million years.
02:09:06.000What characterizes the Pleistocene from the previous Pliocene is this alternating succession of glacial and interglacial ages, this swinging back and forth between these two extremes.
02:09:18.000Those episodes of transition appear to be profoundly catastrophic.
02:09:23.000And they are associated with things like massive storms, massive rainfalls, rising and falling of sea levels on an extreme basis.
02:09:34.000And I think it's that that has created the Grand Canyon, predominantly.
02:09:41.000In fact, the inner channel, I don't know if you've ever seen Grand Canyon?
02:12:03.000Because just like everybody else died, or most things died, and most of the species died, a few people figured out a way to make it, and then they decided to have babies.
02:12:54.000It would make sense if the human population crashes in the wake of a global catastrophe and we're down hovering at the threshold of viability where, you know, we could become extinct if just anything else happens.
02:13:53.000You've got to be born before it takes you years and years to actually get where you can survive on your own because you've got these big fucking brains.
02:14:02.000So, we're kind of like nature's answer to all of this.
02:14:06.000You know, only one species right now has the ability to intercede and prevent the next global catastrophe, and that's us.
02:14:17.000Do we rise to that challenge or do we say, well, we're going to let nature run its course and if 50% of the species disappear, civilization is over, we go back to the Stone Age, struggling for existence, well, so be it.
02:14:31.000Or do we say, you know what, We could within one generation be harvesting the resources of asteroids, which we could be, if we had the will and the vision.
02:14:41.000And the thing is, is that the most dangerous asteroids that are out there is the closer they get to the Earth, the more accessible they are.
02:14:49.000And you see, we already could be harvesting the resources of asteroids.
02:14:53.000I mean, asteroids are loaded with precious metals and ores and hydrocarbons.
02:14:58.000There's virtually nothing that we are now mining from the Earth that we couldn't mine from asteroids.
02:15:18.000Okay, discovered in March of 1996, within about eight weeks of observations, the astronomers were able to predict that these fragmenting pieces were going to orbit the Sun and come back and be crossing the orbit of Jupiter at exactly the time that Jupiter was there,
02:15:35.000There was going to be a t-bone collision.
02:15:37.000It was like two vehicles coming to the intersection at the same time.
02:15:40.000And they were able to predict that, right down to almost to the minute, to the hemisphere, What if we discovered that there's an asteroid orbiting the Sun out there that's got our number on it and it was going to strike the Earth in 3 years or 10 years or 20 years or whatever?
02:16:05.000The scientists from China and Russia and all these different various countries that have vast technological capabilities would probably get together and have some sort of an agreement.
02:16:15.000I would think that that would have to happen.
02:16:17.000And in fact, it would probably make our petty human conflicts pale into insignificance.
02:16:25.000If we were faced with the demise of our civilization or even possibly our species.
02:16:32.000But suppose we discovered it and it's coming in a couple of years and there's no time to respond.
02:16:57.000See, that's all we would have to do is just nudge it a little.
02:17:00.000And there's various potential technologies whereby we could do that.
02:17:03.000But what if we didn't have enough lead time and we knew that it was going to slam into the earth and for a thousand years going to be havoc?
02:17:14.000Well, perhaps we could go build a base on the moon.
02:17:17.000Or build something in space that would allow humans to survive at least until the dust settled enough that we could return and begin to replenish the earth.
02:17:27.000Do you know what a bummer it would be if you had a base on the moon and everyone was living there and you watched the earth blow up?
02:17:33.000But it would be an even bigger bummer if you didn't have it and you were sitting on the earth knowing that that's it, man, that's all she wrote.
02:17:42.000How many different times do you think this has happened while human beings are alive?
02:17:47.000The great speculation has always been when they see the pyramids or when they see any incredible structures that we really haven't totally explained how they built.
02:18:00.000Like Baalbek in Lebanon, how advanced were they?
02:18:06.000How advanced were they before the shit hit the fan?
02:18:11.000It seems to me that in order, you know, you gotta go, why would primitive cultures move rocks that weighed 200 to 1,000 tons apparently with impunity?
02:18:25.000They were doing it all over the planet, right?
02:18:30.000I mean, you know, like again, I'm a builder, so I know how much work it takes to move even a, you know, without a crane, without modern technology, to move a beam into place that weighs a ton, right?
02:18:42.000Well, you know, we've got stones in some of these ancient temples that weigh hundreds of tons.
02:18:48.000And again, all over the world, It seems to me difficult to imagine that they didn't have some kind of a technology that we've forgotten.
02:18:59.000What that technology is, I couldn't say.
02:19:03.000But it would sure seem to me that there would be no motive for moving 500-ton stones unless you had some convenient way of doing it.
02:19:13.000Or if not a convenient way of doing it, just explain how an inconvenient way they could have done it.
02:19:22.000When you get to something like the Acropolis or the Parthenon, That's on the Acropolis, right?
02:20:18.000That's one vision of it, or a picture of it, but if you search for others, there's actually a close-up of the actual stones themselves, and they show people standing next to the stone, so you get a perspective of it.
02:21:25.000So when you see the constructions of the Great Pyramids, which is one of the great wonders of the world, and to this day, they're always trying to come up with ways that they did it, but the sheer size, and to put it into perspective, if you cut, I think the number is 10 stones a day.
02:21:41.000There's 2,300,000 plus stones in the Great Pyramid of Giza.
02:21:47.000And if you cut and place 10 a day, it would take you 664 years.
02:21:55.000Yeah, having seen the Great Pyramid and many of the temples in Egypt, I'm convinced that they had to have some means that we've forgotten about for transporting these stones.
02:22:08.000They may have used fairly primitive methods to quarry the stones, but when it comes to transporting the stones, You know, I mean, we could imagine that they're putting them on rollers and dragging them over, you know,
02:22:37.000And we can invoke explanations that are basically designed to avoid the implications of admitting that there may have been advanced knowledge, scientific knowledge, in prehistory.
02:22:50.000And that somehow or another that knowledge was lost, whether it was because of the burning of the Library of Alexandria or whether it was just a cataclysmic event that wiped out a massive amount of the population and what was remaining was buildings like that.
02:23:07.000Those things survived and then people tried to recreate them.
02:23:11.000People eventually figured out some of the techniques and made similar structures.
02:23:17.000But not over a period of 1,000 years or 2,000 years, but maybe 20, 30,000 years.
02:23:25.000That's always been the work of Graham Hancock, the ideas.
02:23:47.000And he concluded that the Temple of the Sphinx, the enclosure where it was cut out of, shows thousands of years of erosion by rainfall, which there wasn't rainfall in the Nile Valley before 9,000 years ago,
02:24:04.000which predates the pyramid construction, the average Or the conventional dating of the pyramid, there it is right there, some of his explanations, predates what the conventional date of the pyramid is by more than 5,000 years.
02:24:22.000And I've had conversations with Robert where he will basically say he's got one number for public consumption, but he's perfectly willing to admit that perhaps the Sphinx is much, much older than that.
02:24:44.000Now, it was kind of crazy when that Charlton Heston documentary was around, but now that they found Gobekli Tepe, and they know that 14,000, 12,000 years ago, whatever it was, they were absolutely building these enormous,
02:25:12.000The conventional dating of the Great Period of Giza is 2500 BC, which may be correct, but it still doesn't mean that the Sphinx wasn't way, way older than that.
02:26:22.000This stuff is so unbelievably fascinating.
02:26:25.000Because there's no way that you can attribute all of this stuff, all of these ancient structures, there's no way you can attribute it to what we know about their culture.
02:27:54.000You got to remember what the Sphinx is that originally it was a yardang, which is a limestone outcrop that sticks above the surrounding landscape.
02:28:03.000The yardang was the head of the Sphinx.
02:29:20.000Okay, this kind of shows the methodology that they use.
02:29:23.000They would create these separation trenches.
02:29:26.000They would usually go by the natural bedding layers of the rock.
02:29:32.000Go to the next slide, and you'll see here, here's The presumed process where they're cutting a separation trench, and there's a block about to be quarried there, and then you can see there would have been a stack of four blocks there.
02:29:47.000And these blocks are enormous, several tons.
02:29:49.000Oh, yeah, that block there would be, looks like it's probably about four by eight by probably ten, so like 320 cubic feet at 160. Per, so, or 180. So you're looking at about 57,000 pounds divided by 2,000.
02:30:18.000Okay, now, the reason I'm showing you this is because this is the process they would have used to quarry the blocks away from the...
02:30:26.000The surrounding the Sphinx and exposed a quarry wall.
02:30:30.000Well, at the time that quarry wall was exposed, it would have been essentially a flat surface with this slightly stepped profile like we saw in the photograph, right?
02:31:14.000Okay, here's stone pick marks in a quarry from the early New Kingdom, circa 15. So 3,500 years ago, you can actually determine the type of tool that they used to quarry the rocks, the picks or the chisels.
02:31:32.000And here you see that the chisel marks or pick marks made by stone picks in an Old Kingdom limestone quarry 2,000 years BC. So here's a 4,000 year old quarry that's been sitting exposed to the desert elements and the pick marks are still visible on the face.
02:32:34.000It certainly looks to the layman, and I'm clearly a layman, but it certainly looks like water fissures, like fissures that are from rainfall.
02:32:43.000Even to the trained eye, it looks like water.
02:32:46.000But some legit Egyptologists and even legit geologists have tried to attribute this to wind and sand.
02:32:56.000Well, again, you know, Robert has shown pictures of the comparison of wind erosion to sand erosion or water erosion.
02:33:04.000So the only reason to attribute this to wind and sand, it's not based on the scientific evidence of what it looks like when there's water erosion.
02:33:12.000It's to confirm or to conform with the known or established timeline of construction.
02:34:25.000And those have been eroded as well, but unfortunately they've covered that up with this reconstruction.
02:34:31.000Well, most likely, most likely, and I think Robert would confirm this, that the limestone blocks that formed those temples were sheathed in hard granite.
02:35:03.000And the more African, what we think of as traditional African, obviously Egypt is part of Africa, but the more traditional looking African faces is what you see in the current face in the Temple of the Sphinx.
02:35:16.000So probably what had happened is a later date pharaoh said, you know what, fuck this lion, I want my face up there.
02:36:06.000Yeah, there was an earthquake that flattened Cairo and you know they had attempted to penetrate the Great Pyramid prior to that without success.
02:36:14.000But apparently the earthquake, which I think it happened in the 12th century, loosened a few rocks from near the top of the pyramid that allowed them to get some levers in there and begin to pry them loose.
02:36:28.000I've read a bunch of fucking assholes.
02:36:33.000Whether this is true or not, we have no way of knowing.
02:36:35.000But there are many, many Arabic accounts and counts of early travelers and pretty much they all unanimously declare that the entire outside of the pyramid was inscribed.
02:37:19.000It's amazing that they're still there.
02:37:21.000I mean, if that thing existed, if Robert Schock is corrected and that thing existed before the Holocene events, those are the only types of structures that would still be here.
02:37:43.000All over the world we have traditions about catastrophes and cataclysms and giant floods.
02:37:50.000All over the world they've come down to us.
02:37:54.000And there's a lot of deviation but there's also a lot of similarity in them.
02:37:59.000The idea that a small group had some kind of foreknowledge, you know, whether it was Noah in the Bible or Deucalion in the Greek myths or Utnapishtim in the Sumerian myths or Zisithris or Manu.
02:38:10.000I mean, the culture heroes that survived these great cataclysmic floods are in the dozens and dozens, right?
02:38:18.000American Indians had prolific We're good to go.
02:38:50.000They all had one thing in common, that they were descended from survivors of some gigantic cataclysmic event.
02:39:08.000I mean, it's around the entire planet, this idea.
02:39:12.000And now, modern science is confirming what we assumed was merely some kind of superstitious nonsense of, you know, Pre-scientific illiterate barbarians.
02:39:24.000And we're realizing that those myths and those stories and epic tales that have been handed down for centuries and centuries actually contain hard scientific truth from surviving eyewitnesses.
02:39:34.000Well, if these craters actually do exist, and they do, right?
02:39:55.000And just like, you know, if three-quarters of the species of animals in North America went extinct, do you think that the 25% surviving came through completely unscathed?
02:40:06.000No, it simply means that there's a threshold above which a species is viable.
02:40:21.000Serious habitat loss which would have diminished food supply and they just died out.
02:40:26.000But either directly or indirectly as a result of these catastrophic environmental changes that accompanied the ending of the Ice Age.
02:40:34.000Humans had to have been affected by this and All of the myths and the stories would totally concur with that idea, you know, that there were humans, and they're all consistent with this one detail, that there were some humans that had foreknowledge.
02:41:36.000But Enoch, the story of Enoch in Masonic tradition says that Enoch had, you know, he was in the patriarchs before Noah, had this foreknowledge that the world was going to be destroyed either by fire or flood.
02:42:03.000Unless you had the key to how to access this vault, which was now like a time capsule that preserved the science and the knowledge and the wisdom of the pre-diluvian world or pre-flood world, He then set up two pillars,
02:42:20.000a pillar of brass and a pillar of marble.
02:42:22.000The pillar of brass designed to withstand the effects of the cataclysm, the watery destruction.
02:42:27.000The pillar of marble, if I'm remembering it right, was to withstand the destruction by fire.
02:42:34.000So there were these two pillars that basically informed any survivors that there was this nine-chambered underground vault that contained the secrets of the previous World Age that was coming to a pass.
02:42:47.000And that's an intrinsic part of Masonic tradition.
02:42:50.000In fact, the whole Masonic symbolism is based around that idea.
02:42:54.000And it has parallels throughout other traditions as well.
02:42:59.000Well, what I'm getting at here is if there were some people who had foreknowledge of it and took steps to survive, they were the ones who preserved the knowledge of the anti-Diluvian world order.
02:43:16.000The other survivors just survived by the luck of the draw, like that tree standing there, right?
02:43:21.000They just happened to be in the right place at the right time.
02:43:23.000They survived, but now they are going to be the ones who are going to be wholly preoccupied simply with the task of surviving, finding enough food to eat and shelter because clearly the planetary environment was going through all kinds of changes.
02:43:39.000Whereas the other group had taken actual steps to survive and preserve knowledge.
02:43:44.000Now, when we look at the beginning of recorded history, 4,000 to 5,000 years ago, we're basically halfway back through the Holocene, right?
02:43:53.000Okay, let's, for purposes of conjecture, assume that at the end of the Holocene, human population crashed.
02:44:02.000Well, if you want to build a pyramid or a great temple, you've got to have a labor force, right?
02:44:07.000Well, if you've got scattered bands of survivors, you basically aren't going to be able to accomplish that.
02:44:14.000Now, let's assume that you've got two groups of humanity, one that's sitting there with all of this knowledge at their disposal.
02:44:20.000Just like, imagine it if our modern society was wiped off the face of the earth, but somebody somewhere in some deep cave underground was able to preserve our knowledge of physics and chemistry and the various sciences.
02:44:33.000Well, obviously, in order to run this computer that we're running here, to do this broadcast requires an intact, huge intact infrastructure, right?
02:44:41.000Well, we could know how to build a computer, we could know how to broadcast, but if we don't have the infrastructure, we're just sitting on information, right?
02:44:50.000Well, let's assume that you have a group that survived, right?
02:44:54.000And they're the custodians of this body of knowledge, right?
02:44:59.000Now it takes 3,000, 4,000, 5,000 years for the human population to reconstitute itself, and now you've got a labor force.
02:45:08.000And let's suppose that there's going to be another cataclysm impending.
02:45:12.000You know, such as the one that perhaps caused the NOAA's flood, which, you know, there's evidence now that around 5,000 years ago, there was an asteroid impact into the Indian Ocean, right?
02:45:24.000That plunged through two miles of ocean water and blasted a 12-mile-wide hole on the floor of the Indian Ocean.
02:45:39.000Well, on the island of Madagascar, on the southern island of Madagascar, and it should be in this program that we've got open right here, Jamie.
02:46:55.000What that is, is it's water, ocean water that washed on land and washed up and you see it kind of comes to a point and then it washed back out.
02:48:47.000And over on the other side, at the same age, if we look at the southwestern coast of Australia, I think the next slide will get a closer in view.
02:50:27.000Most likely what we would see on the other side of the planet is extreme weather events, hurricanes, torrential rainfalls, things like that, winds.
02:50:36.000Kill a huge amount of people worldwide.
02:50:38.000Could kill a huge amount of people worldwide, yes.
02:50:42.000And so that is probably the most recent one.
02:51:04.000See, that's what we're beginning to realize now, is that these events have happened with a much greater degree of frequency than anybody had imagined.
02:52:09.000Go to sacredgeometrieinternational.com And there are links there.
02:52:14.000I've got another website that's linked from there.
02:52:18.000In Sacred Geometry International, I deal with a bunch of different stuff, not directly connected necessarily with what we're talking about here, but there will be links to another website that I've got where I'm really exploring the catastrophic stuff.
02:52:35.000Yeah, because I've done lots and lots of field exploration.
02:52:40.000They have thousands of images of just awesome stuff.
02:52:44.000Does sacred geometry have anything to do with this stuff or is that a totally different subject?
02:52:48.000Sacred geometry, put it this way, as we've inherited this corpus of ancient knowledge, sacred geometry is one of the keys for deciphering these ancient traditions because all of these ancient temple structures, which are the textbooks in stone,
02:53:03.000if you will, have several components in common.
02:53:08.000Astronomical and geometrical being the two predominant.
02:53:12.000And if you understand the geometry, you realize the geometry is like a universal code whereby you can preserve certain types of information because geometry is universal.
02:53:23.000It doesn't matter what your spoken language is.
02:53:25.000The principles of geometry are what they are.
02:53:28.000You know, the relationship of a radius to a circle is the same and it doesn't matter what culture you come from, you see.
02:53:35.000And so geometry is a critical means of deciphering the knowledge that, and I think that the predominant way of preserving ancient knowledge is in the temple structures.
02:53:48.000And they have to be looked at as textbooks in stone.
02:53:51.000And once we begin to realize that, then we can go...
02:53:53.000It's like when you go to Egypt, it's not just the hieroglyphs.
02:53:57.000But it's also the geometry and the astronomy that's encoded there.
02:54:01.000And we can see the same astronomy at work whether we're looking in Egypt, whether in geometry, or whether we're looking at megalithic structures in ancient England, or whether we're looking at monumental earthworks up in the Ohio Valley, or we're looking at the...