On this episode of The Ultimate Fighter: Afterlife, the guys talk about their favorite Pride Fighting Championships events, their favorite fights of all-time, and some of the craziest things they've ever done in the cage. Plus, a little bit of everything you could ask for in a Pride event. Plus, we get into the crazy things we've seen in Pride, including a 2x4 being used in a fight, a woman being attacked by a 2X4, and more! This episode is brought to you by Native Creative, a division of the Ultimate Fighting Championship. Subscribe to Native Creative on iTunes and leave us a rating and review on Apple Podcasts and we'll read out your comments and thoughts on the next episode. Logo by Courtney DeKorte. Theme by Mavus White. Music by PSOVOD and tyops. Art by Cody Rhodes. Our theme song is Come Alone by Suneaters, courtesy of Lotuspool Records. We are a proud member of the Native Creative Podcasts Podcast Network. Thank you for listening and supporting this podcast! If you like what you hear, please consider leaving us a five star rating and a review on iTunes! We'll be looking out for you in next week's mailbag! Subscribe, review and subscribe to our newest episode of Afterlife! in the coming weeks! we'll have a new episode featuring some of our favorite podcasters, John Rocha, Jeff Perla, and much more. of course, you can't ask us a question! and we're listening to us in the comments section! so we'll be hearing from you, too! Thanks for your thoughts and reviewing us on the podCast and reviewing our work! ! Subscribe and reviewing the pod... in your thoughts, too, we'll get back to the pod? of the pod! on the PodCast! & much more! <3 - John RACY! - The Crews . John R. & The Crew & the Crews Podcasts - Tom Bellator Podcasts, , John Ransdell, AKA: Thank You, John Corman, The Best of the Morning Show, & John Rourke, and the Crew Outtro, and so on & , and so Much More!
00:00:20.000I used to tell him every time after a single fight, I say, because at the time it was six billion people, I go, hey, understand, two in six billion people just did the commentating for this show.
00:02:03.000It was, again, the marriage of pro wrestling and pride in many ways, the larger-than-life storylines and production could lead to things like that.
00:03:50.000Pride Fighting Championships, the genesis, it was that, you know, bringing the biggest, the so-called toughest, best pro wrestler against Hicks and Gracie, the mythic Vali Tudo jiu-jitsu fighter.
00:04:02.000The UFC had a similar but more rational approach to it recently with CM Punk versus Mickey Gall.
00:04:10.000They said, well, let's give this CM Punk guy a kid with one fight.
00:04:15.000I think he had at least one amateur fight and one fight in the UFC. Showed some promise, choked a guy out, and he said, okay, you're going to get a tough kid.
00:04:23.000You're going to get a tough kid, but you're going to have to fight a real fighter, but you're not going to fight Hickson Gracie.
00:04:49.000That sounds way more believable than a perfect 400 and 0. What's crazy is when you see these TIE fighters who They literally do have 200 fights, and they're 20 years old.
00:04:58.000Like there's some kids that fight for the lion fight.
00:05:00.000Yeah, and Siddichai Sitsong Pinong, who's the lightweight champion now in Gloria.
00:05:05.000In fact, many years ago in Canada, doing Muay Thai on TSN, the ESPN equivalent up there, same thing when you brought in the Thai fighters.
00:05:15.000But they were, as you know, Joe, and there's a good documentary, Shameless Pugs Showtime is going to be showing a documentary about fighting in Thailand and Muay Thai, where these kids literally, that's how they survive, right?
00:05:28.000You start at eight, nine years old, and you're on your way to hopefully...
00:06:46.000See, this is the one I was talking about, boss.
00:06:48.000Including those convicted of murder and sexual assault have been freed and in some cases fully absolved of their crimes through their participation in prison fights.
00:06:59.000That's crazy that anybody would allow this.
00:07:02.000All you have to do if you're a violent criminal is prove that you're more violent than the other violent criminals and you get your freedom?
00:07:24.000Yeah, but when someone did something to your sister or your daughter or your mom, and then they get out because they beat the fuck out of all the other rapists.
00:09:32.000Just take him down, knock him out on the ground.
00:09:38.000What a compelling career for Scott Smith too, right?
00:09:43.000Headlining events on CBS, major network exposure.
00:09:47.000I remember what we called the Christmas miracle when he came back and knocked out Kung Lee.
00:09:52.000And again, a guy who's, I think, back working hands of steel back in the factory.
00:09:59.000It's interesting how the sport in such a short period of time, of course, we've seen the explosion, but what could have been even with Elite XC and we saw what happened with Kimball, but it's just interesting for me now, as we reminisce about stuff, how so many organizations had opportunities and yet...
00:10:17.000It fell by the wayside for one reason or another.
00:10:43.000But then you can understand why, though, with Kimbo Slice, you know, taking what was necessary to bring, it was the first organization to make it to major network TV. And I think there were some decent fighters along the way as well.
00:10:56.000Were you a Kimbo fan at all in terms, I know you're pure martial arts, and that's why I respect and sit here bowing down at the altar or the erudite one, but did you like what Kimbo Slice represented at the time?
00:11:09.000I think Timo Slice was a tough guy, and he was a fun guy to watch, but the reality of what he represented as a mixed martial arts fighter at that time was he was fairly novice.
00:11:19.000He didn't really have a ground game, and he really couldn't stop a good wrestler from taking him down, but he was a good puncher who was really good in those backyard brawls.
00:13:21.000But there's no exact science, I guess, is what I'm I'm saying in terms of how it comes to matchmaking and putting together championship fights and what do you market?
00:13:29.000The freak, the star, the dominant fighter.
00:15:41.000Like I said, we just mentioned on our podcast, it's like, it was almost like he was holding back And he said, okay, I'm going to pull it out once I fight for the title.
00:15:50.000That's what I'm really going to show what I can do.
00:15:52.000Because he looked like a completely different fighter.
00:15:54.000He was always good, but this was a whole different level.
00:15:57.000But the way he dominated Dominic Cruz mentally, especially leading up to the fight where it appeared that Cruz had gotten under his skin when he stormed out of the interview.
00:16:05.000But from the opening bell, like you say, the taunting and stuff, and yet able to back it up and show...
00:16:13.000Whether it's evolution or whether it was already there, a masterful performance, man.
00:16:18.000Well, he grew up in tough environments, and I think that what he said after the fight, when I asked him about it, like, was it taunting?
00:17:06.000That's as admirable as putting out the correct game plan and winning.
00:17:13.000There's something incredibly admirable about a guy who can take a loss like a man or a woman.
00:17:19.000Anyone who can just accept what happened and that's just what it is.
00:17:24.000You know, it's very unfortunate when you see someone that's saying some things that don't really make sense, like after a fight or blaming it on other people or blaming it on their camp or blaming it on an injury, and it's just...
00:17:37.000And I think you did bring this up, and I agree with you in terms of when someone has been knocked out.
00:17:43.000Or someone has been in a very grueling, tough fight.
00:17:47.000I don't know why we are forced to interview them.
00:18:34.000So it's, yeah, and that's, you know, too unfortunate that, and I don't see what it accomplishes anyway.
00:18:40.000Yeah, it made me feel bad too, and I had to give him the opportunity, and then I had to give him an opportunity again, because you couldn't see it the first time, so we had to watch it from another angle, and the other angle revealed that it didn't happen, so he was kind of stuck.
00:20:16.000I think even our good friend Big John said that was the biggest, you know, he owned up to it too, but that, you know, the guy doesn't make many mistakes, but that one I know that he, in the book, regretted greatly, obviously.
00:20:27.000But yeah, and so you were saying Murillo Bustamante.
00:21:20.000No, it was just it was everything was crazy, you know That's the thing because but there were also at the time these were the best of the best, but you're right It was also the mix of the what we already talked about, but we were talking on the way here Mauricio Shogun Hua,
00:21:36.000remember 23 years old goes through Quinton Rampage Jackson Antonio Rogerio Nogueira, one of the best fights in Pride history and then in one night Alistair Overeem and Ricardo Arona to win that Grand Prix and you know, say what John Jones did at 23, God bless him man,
00:21:51.000one of the best, but Mauricio Shogun who a beast at that age man.
00:21:54.000Oh yeah, I mean there was a lot of guys and it's almost like I would have loved to have seen what Noguera in his prime would have been able to do in the UFC and I would have loved to have seen with Fedor in his prime because essentially when Noguera fought Fedor he was in his prime.
00:22:36.000He piledrived him head first and he's 350 pounds.
00:22:40.000It's similar with the Monsterplex, right?
00:22:42.000Our dearly departed friend Kevin Randleman when, fresh off of upsetting Mirko Krokop, he goes and drops Fedor on his head.
00:22:49.000And again, Fedor Emelianenko, like you say, would have been very good to see what we would have done in his prime because even despite being dropped on his head, calmly, coolly, regrouped, And then submits Randleman with the arm bar a minute and a half later.
00:23:31.000Well, we did get to see Mirko and Fedor, which at the time, I mean, that was the most anticipated heavyweight fight in MMA history in 2005. What's most amazing about that fight is Fedor beat him standing.
00:24:05.000Remember the headbutt with Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira in the final of the tournament?
00:24:09.000But yeah, the way he would enter the guard, and I think that's what Fabrizio Verdum did his homework, because remember, Verdum almost baited him.
00:26:25.000But, okay, well, there you go, though.
00:26:27.000The UFC used to have the ramp and the elaborate entrances, and I know they wanted to separate from my other line of employment, WWE, and the wrestling aspect, but I know Bellator does a pretty decent job with their entrances and stuff.
00:28:40.000Combat sports is the one, forget football, baseball, hockey, everything else, I don't care if I know the result, I will watch a fight.
00:28:47.000Yeah, if I know the result, I'll watch a fight too.
00:28:49.000It's just, I think it's the art, Meryl Streep.
00:28:53.000No, it's not as good, but it's still, I don't know, maybe because it's a more digestible size, but I just, I find fighting to be something, you know, I will watch, other than if I record a hockey game and I know the score will end, screw it, I'm not watching it.
00:29:08.000Yeah, man, I was reading some of the responses to Meryl Streep.
00:29:25.000Hey, love me some Meryl Streep, but why do you have to trash MMA? I'm wondering if she didn't even ever, you know, know what mixed martial arts was.
00:29:32.000Someone gave her the word with arts in it, and she made the time, well, it's not even arts.
00:29:36.000But football doesn't say football arts, right?
00:34:29.000He stands on one leg, and then he jumps up, leaves him in the head, knocks him out, and I go, dude, I'm telling my students about this, that you can do this, but I never did it.
00:36:47.000And then all of a sudden, almost on cue, it hits me.
00:36:51.000And I end up, Ensign Inouye was there with us as well visiting, and I end up for some reason going into my old pro wrestling manager heel mode and going right up to Ensign and go, hey, I think I can take you, bro.
00:37:04.000I think I can take you, and I'm doing this, and I'm really just kind of needling him.
00:39:36.000That's right, the very first Bushido was the first time five members of the Gracie family had ever competed on the same card, although Daniel by marriage, right?
00:39:43.000So you had Henzo and Carlos Nunes, so you had Henzo, Haiyan, Rodrigo, Daniel, and who was the other one I'm missing now?
00:39:52.000No disrespect, but the Daniel thing is a weird one.
00:40:40.000Like you say, a tortured soul, but to us anyway, always a good one of the few, not few, a lot of guys, but he always went out of his way to make me, I mean, you're a legend, but to make the, you know, the mean nothing announcer feel good.
00:40:51.000He always came up, Morrow, good to see you, and very tense.
00:40:54.000Well, once you challenged Ensign, you probably got to respect pretty much everybody.
00:40:58.000Now I'm thinking of the whole crazy altercation we had with all the bounces.
00:42:21.000And suddenly, Randleman starts jumping up, and he starts getting angry, and he hits a mailbox, and then Ryan starts, and I'm trying to keep both these guys down, and I go, no, no, no, you guys, relax, relax.
00:42:32.000I just go, shut up, my friend, I say to Ryan, and Ryan goes, don't talk to me like this, come on, man, are you really doing this right now?
00:42:39.000And we get this whole fight goes on, I said, no, no, we got to relax, stay relaxed, just smoke a little weed, we're going to go back.
00:42:56.000And they say, oh, we need to wait because they're bringing it right now.
00:42:59.000So right away already, we're looking back.
00:43:01.000And sure enough, there's two big guys coming also, same clothes as they have.
00:43:05.000And you see them very sturdy walking up to us, and as soon as they see us, they make a 180, and they talk back, and the phone goes from the guy, and I go, those are the guys calling you right now, telling you, you gotta give it up.
00:43:17.000And he goes, he opens the phone, and the guy, he says, okay, and he puts it down, and he gave us a whole mountain.
00:43:23.000You guys recognized him as being the prime fighting badass.
00:45:12.000It's like there's human skulls everywhere.
00:45:14.000There's pictures of books killing people.
00:45:16.000This guy, you come in, he starts screaming, and all the people who are getting tattooed at that moment, they all get up, and they run out to this place, they lock the door, and I look at Mars, and I'm like...
00:45:26.000Yeah, I'm like, I'm getting out of here.
00:45:27.000You know, because this is a really weird situation.
00:45:30.000But no, he put me on the table, put the tattoo on.
00:47:03.000Mercer was with akimbo in the MMA thing, but who was the fighter that went to Japan, the American boxer, and took one kick and stopped, got out of the ring?
00:47:40.000There you see Phillips is already starting to wear down.
00:47:43.000And Masato was a good boxer, too, man.
00:47:45.000It's like you couldn't deny his hands.
00:47:46.000I mean, he might not have been the same boxer that Vince Phillips was in his prime, but with all those leg kicks, it makes such a difference.
00:47:52.000Do you remember Gomi and Pulver at Shockwave?
00:47:56.000I thought that was some of the best MMA boxing boss we'd seen at that time.
00:48:14.000Sergei Heritonov early in Pride showed good boxing.
00:48:17.000I mean, everyone has that debate and argument about, oh, boxing, how are they doing MMA? We know it's two different sports, but when it comes to that aspect of MMA, the boxing...
00:48:50.000One of the scariest stoppages that I ever saw was against Semi Schilt.
00:48:57.000Do you remember when he mounted Semi Schilt and got on top of him in like a mounted triangle and started smashing his eye, smashing keraton off, got on top of him, and he just punched him.
00:49:09.000He's just punching him in one eye over and over and over again.
00:51:11.000But they still see here, the basketball boards, the people on the floor, they can at least see the cage, the bottom of the cage, but if somebody sits in front of them, they can't see anything.
00:51:21.000Well, if you have tiered seating, if you have tiered stadium-style seating, and then there'll be a front row, and then there's got to be some sort of dividing line, because you don't want to get run over if you're in the front row.
00:51:46.000But as long as they keep people from piling into the crowd.
00:51:49.000Because if you could have that, you would be able to watch something happen with no cage.
00:51:54.000There's one thing that I see over and over again.
00:51:56.000It's a very grueling aspect to MMA when guys are tied up against the cage and they're clenching and they're throwing knees to the body and they're throwing elbows in tight.
00:53:47.000Well, it happens in Lion Fight 2. I was watching one of Kyle Hollenbeck's fights, and he fell out of the ring and smacked his knees on the edge of the apron as he was falling out.
00:53:56.000I remember Marvin Eastman falling out of a ring in Vancouver, almost seriously hurting himself as well before he got the goat's vagina.
00:54:03.000Why don't they have like a netting in between the ropes to prevent people from falling through?
00:54:08.000It would still serve the same purpose.
00:55:25.000We'll never see knees to the head, right, under the unified rules?
00:55:28.000They just implemented some more rules.
00:55:30.000You wanted to get rid of the midnight or 12 to 6 rule stupid, but they haven't changed that, right?
00:55:37.000We should explain to people what it means.
00:55:39.000In mixed martial arts, you're not allowed to drop an elbow down from vertical.
00:55:43.000You can't drop it from 12 to 6 on a clock.
00:55:45.000And the only reason why that was invented is back in the day when the commissions were approving MMA, Big John McCarthy had a meet with them and they wouldn't let anybody do that because they had seen people break bricks on ESPN by dropping elbows like that.
00:55:59.000Like if someone could break a brick they could kill a person.
00:57:54.000Melvin was coming up in his prime, and Sakuraba was on the way down, and Melvin was arguably one of the scariest knockout artists of all time.
00:59:43.000In half guard, if I sit in half guard, in somebody's half guard, right, and if I sit in it, I grab him by the head, I can literally bounce his own knee into his face.
00:59:50.000That's a legal move in MMA. And it's a real easy thing to do.
00:59:56.000Imagine, the knee is right over here, I grab the head, I just thrust my hips forward, his own knee will bash in his face.
01:00:02.000And I ask Big Joe McCarthy, he says, yeah, that's a legal move.
01:00:05.000I go, man, I haven't seen anybody do that.
01:00:07.000Matt Lindland knocking himself up a different way.
01:00:09.000So you're pushing his head into his knee?
01:00:12.000No, I grab his head by the top, you know, so he cannot push me backwards.
01:00:16.000And then I drive my hips forward, and his own knee, because his leg is here over, his own knee sits here, I jam it into his own face.
01:00:24.000And he's going to stop my hip power, which is going to be very hard to do for him in that sort of position.
01:00:49.000You know, like for a long time, guys would go and they would go and throw underhooks on, like from the half guard, and then they would try to like snake up to your body and then work their way in.
01:00:58.000But then people started darsing people.
01:01:10.000We saw it in the early days with the kickboxing, Thai boxing, Rubble Deckers, you know, in the clinch, pushing somebody away, boom, high kick.
01:02:37.000People thought, oh, that would never work.
01:02:39.000And all of a sudden, everyone's, you know, for a while, the front kick to the face.
01:02:42.000Well, you've seen that with Wonderboy.
01:02:45.000You know, Wonderboy is a perfect example of what I thought was going to be the next stage of evolution is these sport karate guys.
01:02:51.000The guys, you know, like Michael Venom Page, Machida, Raymond Daniels, Daniels, love Daniels.
01:02:58.000And what these guys are doing is they're showing that if you have all those other skills, well then those traditional martial arts techniques become very novel and people don't know what to do with them.
01:03:07.000Like with Wonderboy, when he starts stabbing people with that front leg side kick and then throws that front leg round kick, people don't know what to do with them.
01:03:14.000And he's also got that crazy style of leaning back and forth like a snake and popping back in.
01:03:20.000It's going to be very interesting, the rematch though, because I think even though it was a draw, and I guess according to the scorecard it would be a draw, when you look at who did more damage, it's clearly Woodley.
01:03:33.000In two rounds, he had Wonderboy in some serious shit.
01:03:38.000And also, for whatever inexplicable reason, and he doesn't even know why, I asked him about it after the fight, he didn't take him down after the first round.
01:03:45.000He was like, if you ask me right now, I have no idea why I didn't.
01:03:49.000He's like, I got 20 years of wrestling, you would think I would use it.
01:03:52.000And he had so much success in the first round taking him down.
01:03:55.000But then again, he almost knocked him out in the fourth round, too.
01:03:58.000Remember, he stunned him in the fourth round.
01:04:02.000It was an interesting fight because Wonderboy did regain some points and regain some ground, but he never really had Woodley in any real trouble.
01:05:48.000He's such a fucking giant dude, too, with those long-ass arms.
01:05:51.000You know, you should see him doing, like, lifting cars and all that stuff that he did in Holland and walking with, like, 150 kilos, you know, 75 kilos in each thing, and then running with it.
01:06:02.000Again, another guy represents redemption in the sport, and you hear, you know, now what's going on with Ronda and everything, but even Mark Hunt, like, there's MMA. You know, I spent a few years now doing boxing where one lost...
01:06:14.000Ruins your career, it seems, for whatever stupid reason.
01:06:17.000But in MMA, there are so many redemption.
01:06:20.000Even Overeem has been up, down, up, down.
01:06:22.000There's still a bad narrative in boxing, unfortunately, that someone who loses a fight doesn't come back and wins.
01:06:37.000Dan Gable, we were interviewing him, and he saw these records with Randy Couture record and other records, and he goes like, these are world champions?
01:06:54.000He said, well, many ways to win, many ways to lose, right?
01:06:56.000Yeah, way different world when people are throwing their punches and kicks and catching you with knees when you're trying to take them down.
01:07:03.000And Mirko Krokop was the guy who told us in Japan that if you don't lose in MMA, you really haven't fought.
01:07:08.000I mean, he was trying to make the point of, you know, it's so tough and different and tough guys, it's going to happen, man.
01:07:26.000I mean, Fira Sahabi, and I mean, the list can go on, but that's what, to me, that's what I've become now a bit more of a nerd because you call so many fights and you try to have a life as well, but I'm really now getting back into, okay, let's catch up and see what these different minds are saying.
01:07:40.000Well, and you yourself, sir, even, you know, listening to this.
01:07:42.000It's just always so cool to hear different perspectives and, okay, what's going to work?
01:08:03.000And that's why when you put people like that under pressure, they get tired because they never experienced that in the ring because he's so way ahead above everybody else.
01:08:10.000So if they want to do extra three rounds with him and he doesn't want to do it, he's going, ah, I'm not going to do it.
01:09:29.000He was just a different animal back then, but it was only sustainable for a few fights.
01:09:37.000I think with BJ, for whatever reason, it was hard for him to get totally motivated to get into that kind of shape again.
01:09:44.000When he described it, it sounded hellacious, like he couldn't hold his daughter, literally so tired after working out that he couldn't even...
01:09:53.000And they have a very specific training philosophy, too.
01:09:55.000The Mirinovichs, in a lot of ways, some of the guys, like Nick Kurson, who trains under his philosophy and speed of sport in California, they want strength and conditioning to be number one, priority number one.
01:10:34.000On the bus back when Tito lost to Frank, I was in the same bus going back to the airport, and Tito jumped next to me and he starts asking me questions about stamina because I always said, it's the most important thing.
01:10:47.000So he started asking drills and doing all these things, and then he became that crazy psycho cardio monster, and he started beating everybody.
01:10:54.000He transferred that to Kendall Grove and a lot of the guys he trained under the Ultimate Fighter.
01:10:59.000You know, Kendall came out of that show, and that's what he told me.
01:14:35.000Which would be a good thing because the way the levels show in your skin and the way it stays in your fat, like, if you got high the night before a fight, you're not going to feel it during the fight.
01:15:37.000Ten years back, and I crack one because they're heavy cookies, and while I'm eating, a little crumble falls on the ground, and I see the dog right away running over, and I want to stop it, and I go, you know, let the dog relax.
01:17:11.000Yeah, so what they say is, if you take a fire, a water hose, if you squeeze it, less water comes out.
01:17:15.000That's the same with the nerve, less action comes out.
01:17:17.000And that, apparently, they made this special picture that they only could do in Santa Monica, and they saw that it was blocked there, and he can, apparently, he can inject me there, and it will take the pressure off, and he believes that that's very possible it will come back then.
01:18:02.000Once the nerve is broke, you take that out.
01:18:04.000It's gone, and then the atrophy comes, you know, because people go like, how can you then be paralyzed?
01:18:08.000I say, what happens with people who break their back, right?
01:18:11.000I say, no more nerves going to the legs, can't walk anymore.
01:18:13.000That's the same thing what I have right now, only the nerve is still there, it's just pressure.
01:18:17.000I ran into some kid after a show the other day, and we were talking about neck injuries and jujitsu, and he was asking me a question.
01:18:24.000He's like, my arm doesn't work under here, my triceps starting to fade away, and I'm like, dude, go to a doctor yesterday.
01:18:31.000You've got to get an MRI. As soon as you start seeing atrophy and as soon as you start feeling numbness, you've got to get on it right away.
01:18:39.000Because there are some ways that they can sort of relieve the pressure and spinal decompression and a bunch of different platelet-rich plasma-type injections, like Regenikine and stuff.
01:19:55.000It stands like this and I'm standing it up and I'm pushing something and of course when I push, the ladder stands like this, I push myself away and I'm falling all the way down.
01:21:18.000I had to actually, I crumpled it up because when I brought brand new bills, I mean, obviously they could tell it wasn't counterfeit, but they'd always look and go, what is this?
01:21:28.000Literally every show, brand new $100 American bills.
01:21:33.000There was always that, in the back of your head, you'd go like...
01:21:46.000Every fighter from like they say okay from 10 a.m.
01:21:49.000Tomorrow morning you can come and pick up your fight There was only one room and every single fighter would in go to even guys like Miracle Kroko who I know made like two million bucks or something They made a lot of money at the time, you know, and they will go into cash They gave everybody cash Yeah, so I assume they gave him cash as well.
01:22:36.000Like a criminal without being a criminal.
01:22:38.000If Mirko actually got $2 million in cash from the Heavyweight Grand Prix and then put that in a suitcase and went back to Croatia, that's one of the most gangster fucking things I've ever heard in my life.
01:27:09.000The video workout, I did the whole workout at noon, in the sun, on the top, and I wanted to look good on the camera, so I was hitting the thing as hard as I could.
01:27:19.000Of course, I took all potassium, I tried everything because I knew this was gonna happen, but still, I started cramping crazy, so I went to the hospital, They put like two bags in me.
01:29:20.000You know, the hardest thing is to go in.
01:29:22.000So what you need to do is when you have the cut, like for instance, if the one side, here's the cut and here, right?
01:29:28.000You have to put your finger underneath, so make your finger underneath, and then you have to stab the needle there because otherwise, every time what happens is this, it slips off.
01:32:38.000Yeah, and then we do Rutan and Ranallo, which is more us just riffing on pop culture events and try to add some positivity, try to find some good news stories to share in this deeply divided world of ours.
01:32:49.000So yeah, we just, we enjoy working with each other and it's been a blessing to be reunited with the man here.
01:32:57.000Are you still doing boxing commentary as well?
01:32:59.000So you're doing WWE, boxing, and two podcasts.
01:33:02.000And the podcasts, and well, maybe not so much any longer, although Glory will always remain very near and dear to me.
01:33:10.000Timing and they were upset that I didn't go to Germany because I had a boxing event that night and Showtime is first priority so we'll see but yeah I'm doing a championship doubleheader on Saturday at Barclays on Showtime where a unification fight which I think this year in boxing because not a great year last year for the Sweet Science and We're going to try to hopefully see more of the best fighting the best,
01:33:33.000And I think, again, you know, people can say what they want about MMA matchmaking and everything else, but the one thing I've always liked about MMA, eventually you will see those the best fight the best.
01:33:42.000And boxing, the politics and the money, kept that from happening.
01:33:47.000Well, that was always the thing that kept Fedor out of the UFC. They wanted his organization.
01:34:49.000But there is something to be said for competition, for sure.
01:34:53.000First of all, I'm glad there's other combat sports that are getting more and more popular, like Bellator Kickboxing, like Glory Kickboxing.
01:35:01.000Well, your support of Glory is very...
01:35:04.000We know, but you helped push that needle as well, my man.
01:35:08.000And I'm glad, because I think, for me, Bud, calling all these combat sports that we've called...
01:35:13.000In this society, in the 21st century, kickboxing at the highest level, I pick it over everything.
01:35:20.000It's one of the most exciting sports in the world, for sure, without a doubt.
01:35:23.000And one of the things about Glory is that, you know, even though it's an organization that maybe a lot of people have not...
01:38:20.000I think when Forrest Griffin and Stephen Bonner went to war in season one, and that whole cast with Kenny Florian, Diego Sanchez, it was something special.
01:38:32.000But then, that was also before the Real Housewives and a million different fucking shows.
01:39:28.000And that's why, to me, kickboxing or even MMA, you can go on your phone right away, here's, okay, I got three minutes, boom, what a fight, great stuff, okay, I'm done.
01:39:36.000It's digestible in those tiny morsels, but how do you monetize it?
01:39:40.000How do you build an audience that's consistent?
01:39:44.000Well, I think it's going to be a slow build.
01:39:46.000It's not going to be like the UFC, which kind of exploded from the Ultimate Fighter.
01:39:52.000They take a long time and several generations to build up.
01:39:56.000MMA was so unusual in that the excitement level from watching a high-level fight was irrefutable to the point where when people would watch fights on TV, they'd be so crazy and so exciting that it was almost like undeniable.
01:40:42.000Yeah, I mean, I think the sport is still in its growing phases.
01:40:46.000I think as far as the talent level, you're definitely seeing what's going on in women's MMA. Women's MMA is changing pretty radically and quickly.
01:41:35.000But in order to make the really big money, you've got to go outside of those folks and get that casual fan and also generate interest in 100% of the hardcore fans.
01:41:46.000Because there's some hardcore fans that, quite honestly, will look at a fight and go, you know, I don't really give a fuck about that fight.
01:41:51.000You know, just for whatever reason, that fight's not my fight.
01:41:55.000And so if that's a big pay-per-view night for the UFC, there's a certain percentage of even the hardcore fans that'll say, you know what, I feel better saving my 60 bucks, and then I'll find out an hour later who won anyway.
01:42:06.000And unfortunately, most of the time, before McGregor came, it's always the lighter weight classes.
01:42:34.000So if I said that, I would really have to do research before I say if the roster's too big.
01:42:38.000But if they don't fight in this roster, the question then becomes, where do they fight?
01:42:46.000Because they have to get fights somewhere.
01:42:48.000And would it be better for some of these lighter, not lighter, but lighter inexperienced guys, like a Mickey Gall, for instance, who just right away now is fighting in the UFC, beat Sage Northcutt, so holy shit, now the kid's a star.
01:45:11.000Well, you know, once you're a fighter and you slap on something and you think you got it, and you put all your effort in it, and then you lose it, it does a little bit to some fighters, too, their mental states.
01:45:21.000They get depressed, and then when you...
01:45:25.000You know, that's the moment you want to start turning it up because then you destroy the fighter and then you can actually go for a submission.
01:45:30.000So I think that's what happened there.
01:45:32.000That was a unique fight too in that Jon Jones dropped Vitor with a front leg sidekick to the body.
01:45:37.000I was like, that is a great technique for him because he's so long.
01:47:13.000I mean, I think that if someone is shooting for a takedown, here's a question.
01:47:17.000Say if a guy is in the process of a double leg and someone's knee touches the ground.
01:47:23.000The guy's shooting for that double leg, the knee touches the ground, and as his knee touches the ground, the opponent is already launching into a knee, a counter-knee, which is the perfect technique for that position, right?
01:47:37.000If someone shoots a total power double on you, and as they're sliding in, their knee is hitting the ground, and you catch them with a knee and put them out.
01:47:45.000Is that a knee to a grounded opponent?
01:48:32.000He said that expression that everybody uses, three points, more than three points, like two hands.
01:48:37.000Or two feet, rather, and a hand, it's illegal to hit the person when they're down.
01:48:42.000But he says it's the bottom of your feet.
01:48:44.000Anytime it's not the bottom of your feet, you're a grounded opponent.
01:48:47.000So even if you have one knee on the ground and no feet, like you're just balanced on the knee moving towards, you're still a grounded opponent.
01:50:23.000I don't know, but it's up to you, right?
01:50:24.000I mean, it seems like if we're talking about the art of actual fighting, we know that a headbutt is a real martial arts technique.
01:50:32.000You know, I know why that is, and it was one of the reasons I would headbutt somebody if there was a lot of onions when I was fighting at the club, if I had to fight.
01:50:40.000I almost never fought there, because I just talked my way out of it.
01:50:43.000I would tell the people, hey, there's nothing going on.
01:50:45.000But if I did, I used it on purpose, headbutts.
01:50:50.000And I would make sure that all the people who are watching, that they would understand that, you know, we can accept that kind of behavior there.
01:50:57.000And a headbutt, that will freak people out, you know?
01:50:59.000And I truly believe that it's for, you know, for the sport to make the sport more attractive, take the headbutts out.
01:51:05.000Once a normal person watches a fight like Mark Coleman, start headbutting somebody into oblivion, you know, they're going to go, is this a sport?
01:52:21.000The Sports Illustrated cover jinx is an urban legend that states that individuals and teams who appear on the cover of Sports Illustrated magazine will subsequently be jinxed.
01:52:29.000But does it say anything in terms of actual results?
01:55:13.000But that's the problem, and they start focusing on it, at least because they can give it a reason, and then let's hope that the next weight class is going to do better.
01:55:21.000We've already lost main events, we've lost shows, and we will lose lives.
01:56:04.000I mean, I wish there were more weight classes for men and for women.
01:56:07.000I wish there was a ton of weight classes, like in boxing.
01:56:10.000I think the one thing that boxing has that people don't like is that they have so many champions because they have too many weight classes.
01:57:01.000You can't go to 205, so you're like 220, and you have a really hard cut, and then you face a guy who's 285. Although the early morning thing, I guess, has been successful, right?
01:57:25.000Just because they want to get the edge, the safety?
01:57:27.000It gives people more time to rehydrate themselves, but the problem is it gives them less time to lose the weight.
01:57:32.000So if you're starting off early in the morning, like if your weigh-ins are at 4 o'clock and you know you're not going to eat all day, you're going to lose weight all throughout the day.
01:57:39.000But if your weigh-ins are at 8 o'clock in the morning, when are you getting up that you're going to lose all that weight?
01:59:23.000You know, put the fear in them, and then they're really going to do it.
01:59:26.000I think Calvin should fight at 85. I mean, I think he could win at 70. I think he can make 70, but he doesn't always make 70. No, you're right, 185. Yeah, I mean, unless he wants to lose a ton of body fat and then try fighting at 170. You know, really clean his diet up, really go hard on the cardio.
02:00:05.000Yeah, I wanted him, and I said a long time ago, if I was his coach, I would just tie his left hand to his body, and I put him, after every workout, you go three or four rounds on the back, you know, just using your right hand.
02:00:16.000Can you imagine if you developed a right hand on top of that?
02:00:23.000That, you know, now you open a whole new door, you know?
02:00:25.000You know, and it's unfair to question someone whether or not they tested positive for anything, or whether they took anything if they haven't tested positive.
02:00:33.000So he never tested positive for anything, so you can't look at it.
02:00:56.000He's like, he just was not focused on that fight.
02:00:59.000If that's the case, that's why he looks like that.
02:01:02.000It has nothing to do with USADA or anything else.
02:01:04.000He just doesn't have the hunger anymore.
02:01:05.000That's it, and that's where you put yourself at great risk.
02:01:08.000But also mentally going into the fight, if you know that another guy trained ten times a week and you trained four, what are you going to do with four?
02:01:16.000It's just weird that his power went away.
02:03:39.000With, like, sitting down on vicious punches on the end of it, you know?
02:03:43.000But, you know, his stance, and because he's a southpaw, but I thought, you know, with Aldo, if I was Aldo's coach a year ago already, I would have said, we're going to trade southpaw.
02:03:53.000Because there's no way he can block those low kicks.
02:03:56.000If left low kicks come, there's no He can block him.
02:03:58.000Because his stance is too wide and his knees are pointing inside.
02:04:37.000I keep hearing all this crazy shit like Aldo might go up and fight Habib for the interim title, and I'm like, goddammit, you've got to have Max Holloway fight Aldo.
02:05:12.000Anytime I post something on Instagram, I get 150 fucking Russian dudes who write Habib time, and then they just post Habib time in the credits.
02:05:20.000My fucking credits are overrun with people that say, or not credits, comments, rather, are overrun with people who say, Habib time, Habib time.
02:07:07.000And you see him wrestling a bear when he was like six years old, and then he starts talking about his father who was already a really good judo guy.
02:09:41.000And Nunes also leans all the way over, so it's hard to take her down.
02:09:45.000And Ronda should also, and maybe she's doing it, I'm just saying what I don't see, maybe start wrestling as well.
02:09:51.000Because a girl like that with so much talent, she'll pick that up so fast, but if she suddenly shoots Well, she went for the clinch, but she'd already been rocked, so I think that, because remember, she shucked her off quite easily.
02:10:03.000Her clinch is always upper body clinch, and she always reaches in with the left arm.
02:10:06.000It's like this, you know, Greg Jackson and I talked about it after the Holly Holm fight, that they had seen every single one of her fights.
02:10:11.000She comes at you, she's got that left arm extended, tries to get a hold of the girls with the left arm, hip tosses them, gets them on the ground, arm bars them, and they just were so prepared for that.
02:10:20.000But isn't, I was going to say, interesting that Holm, She came from boxing to MMA, just trained for a Ronda Rousey fight.
02:10:27.000Well, she was a kickboxing champion too.
02:10:29.000Well, kickboxing and boxing champion, but I'm saying in terms of her MMA prep, the goal was Ronda Rousey, right?
02:10:34.000And now with Cody Garbrandt, he talked about in high school, Dominic Cruz, and you think, you wonder, well, the laser focus, right?
02:10:40.000The television, obviously you have to work on everything, but if that's your target and you see what he did to Cruz, it's crazy.
02:10:46.000Well, there's a lot of fighters like that that attract greatness.
02:10:49.000Like, I think Anderson Silva attracted greatness, and I think one of the reasons why Weidman became as great as he was, is he knew that Anderson Silva was at the top of the mountain.
02:10:57.000Like, you see that assassin, you know, and Weidman caught him, like, right at the right time, and, you know, knocked him out, and then the broken leg in the second fight, and I think...
02:11:07.000When you have a dominant champion like Anderson was for so many years, all those young kids coming up, that's who they aspire to, and it raises the bar.
02:11:15.000I'm really curious to see what the flyweights look like in a few years, because of how good Mighty Mouse is, because his bar, he's raised it so high.
02:11:24.000You know, Anastasia Silva getting too comfortable, planting two feet next to each other, having no forward, backward side, lateral movement whatsoever.
02:11:32.000You can only lean as much backwards, right, for that left hook what he received from Weidman.
02:11:38.000Weidman had a very clever move that a lot of people missed.
02:11:41.000And what he did was he threw a right hand and then behind the right hand he threw a back fist.
02:11:46.000So there was a punch coming from the left and then he moved towards it and another punch coming towards the left because it was a left hook.
02:11:53.000So Anderson is doing his bobbing and weaving stuff, but when a punch comes at him and then a back fist, he's got to go that way.
02:14:50.000That downside is if a guy like Weidman didn't shoot for that and, you know, was constantly wearing on him, constantly grinding on him, and had him in a bit of trouble like Tim Kennedy had him in his second round, then, you know, we'll see what happens.
02:15:56.000He won the decision, but the decision was overturned because of the drugs.
02:16:01.000Yeah, he had some sort of peptide that they found in the supplement that he was taking, so they only gave him like a nine-month suspension.
02:16:09.000It was the same one as Joe's took, if I understand that.
02:16:11.000That's why that was, to me, that was kind of weird because he is managed by the same guy.
02:17:24.000And there's all these different standards.
02:17:27.000I mean, there's certain protocols that people follow when it comes to vitamin replacements, and they do IV vitamin drips, and Extreme concentration on their nutrition and they have results like those results they they tend to show that there are benefits in Supplementation and there's definitely benefits in clean diet and making sure that your nutritional balances It's like at what level should it be illegal?
02:17:54.000I mean you can't how you father fuck are you getting so much b12 out of nature?
02:17:58.000You have to take it in a pill and it gives you energy.
02:18:02.000You know, and you could take some caffeine.
02:18:04.000Like, Chael Sonner used to take caffeine pills to make sure that he got the exact amount of caffeine, because he's like, you don't know, because you get a Starbucks, you might get a venti Starbucks, and they might have fucking packed it in tight and chewed the shit out of it.
02:18:16.000You know, every now and then you get a cup of coffee, and you're like, whoa, this is some strong coffee.
02:18:39.000The testosterone, the epitestosterone, I've talked to medical professionals and everyone's saying, men, you produce supposed to be around one to one.
02:19:09.000Is there a way to monitor that where even the banned steroid thing where you can allow a person to at least make a living without making it...
02:19:22.000Not only is it going to be an enhancement, but if you take steroids while you're, like say if you have a knee surgery and then you take steroids and you're lifting weights the entire time, you're going to keep some of those gains.
02:19:32.000You're going to keep a certain percentage of it.
02:19:34.000But on the flip side, your endocrine system is going to be fucked up and it's going to take you a while to get back to normal testosterone production if you do wind up testing and you do go back on USADA after the injury.
02:19:44.000So there's an argument that said that you're taking a risk, you do recover quicker, but it might not be better for your overall hormone system.
02:19:52.000You know, I remember I was talking about it, we did it on the podcast, I don't have it memorized, but there was a test with testosterone, what they did in the Olympics, pre-steroids and after steroids, and they start really testing everybody.
02:23:41.000You know, I knew a guy from there, and he would say to me that in the morning he would take a huge rinse of testosterone because it made him really angry in the fight.
02:24:40.000And as Joe mentioned earlier, I mean, there are health...
02:24:44.000You're going to pay risk, but I think, not even health risks, I think, doesn't it damage your system when you do steroids?
02:24:50.000Well, it depends on how much you're doing, but if you're going super hyperhuman levels, like I'm sure a lot of those guys were, yeah, it's super bad for you.
02:24:59.000And it's one of the real clear indicators that a lot of guys were on it, were how they got off of it and came to the UFC and looked like mortals.
02:25:05.000You know, they looked like human pit bulls.
02:25:07.000We saw it right away with a lot of them.
02:26:52.000The worst story I've ever heard, some guy, I was talking, I'm not going to mention names, and he said, and we were talking about that, and I go, oh, man, that's got to be really horrible.
02:28:07.000So, do you think that when you guys look at Ryzen right now, do you think that Ryzen has the possibility of coming, they're putting on some fucking big shows, they've got some good fights, you know, Krokop just wins the heavyweight tournament, you know?
02:30:35.000That was the one time in all the fights and everything we've seen.
02:30:38.000I remember I was there when Jose Pelley, Landy Johns, against Brian Gassway in Canada, John McCarthy and I, when he broke his leg.
02:30:45.000But for some reason, Saki and Spong, I was broke down just to see because it was so visceral.
02:30:52.000All of this, everything that it took for him to come back and put in, and then boom.
02:30:56.000Well, it was crazy because Tyrone Spong and him are both super high-level kickboxers, and you only really saw that mostly in MMA. You really didn't see it that much in high-level kickboxing.
02:31:09.000Matt Embry, this kid from Canada who's now going to be fighting in Los Angeles next week.
02:31:14.000There's Canada, too, where the sport is banned in so many of the provinces, but Joseph Valtellini had to retire because of the concussion issues.
02:39:49.000Yeah, like someone blows their ACL out, and you go, okay, well, the title is now going to be suspended for a whole year.
02:39:54.000Because it's going to take six months before you can even start training again, and then nine months before you can start training hard, and then three months to go through a camp, you need a year.
02:40:04.000And then you've got Cruz, which took even longer.
02:40:07.000Or do you simply say, listen, the title is going to be taken away from you.
02:40:14.000You know, you're not the champion anymore, but you are the first one in line as soon as you come back.
02:40:18.000And that's usually the case a lot of the time, right?
02:40:21.000When they do recover, they do get the...
02:42:18.000But now Aldo, I mean, I don't know if it's true, but Nurmagomedov said it was bullshit.
02:42:22.000They were talking about Aldo fighting a super fight with Nurmagomedov in Russia.
02:42:26.000And of course Tony Ferguson's like, what?
02:42:28.000Well, Tony Ferguson wanted more money than his contract stated, and unfortunately for him, he's in a weird position right now because there's so many fights to be made at 55. And the big one, of course, is Conor.
02:42:39.000Anybody who Conor fights, if Nurmagomedov decides to fight Conor, and they decide that's the big fight, and they put it on in Russia, Put it anywhere, but Russia for sure.
02:42:47.000Good luck with those Irish guys and the Russian guys.
02:43:05.000It's just one of those things where Russians are way ahead of the game in terms of knowing who he is, and he's a giant star over there, but he could be a giant star over here too.
02:43:50.000When you say it medically like that, you know what I'm saying?
02:43:53.000Well, apparently the doctors are very convinced that they can open up that pathway a little bit, and whatever's pressing down on the bone spurs or anything, they're pressing down the nerve, they can remove those, and that'll alleviate his issues.
02:44:16.000Because you put Bob Bennett and the Nevada State Athletic Commission in a terrible position because you're saying that you're compromised.
02:44:22.000And so then they ran some tests on him, and I guess his doctor cleared him, but the Nevada State Athletic Commission was like, look, you're going to have to have a cortisone shot and numb everything up.
02:44:30.000And even though you might have some, you don't have really a problem as far as the structure of your back, you might be compromised.
02:45:48.000He was worried that Gonzaga was just trying to take him down and that he wasn't going to stand with him so he couldn't get his revenge from the head kick knockout.
02:46:06.000Also, when you get a guy who's that level of striker like Marco is, throwing elbows from the guard, you see how much force he can generate.
02:46:13.000He's retired again after winning the Ryzen thing.
02:46:18.000Great way to go out on an epic career.
02:46:21.000One of the all-time faves of course the whole the prank you pulled but I mean the fight with Fedor just he was one of them for me the guy right away when you were around him was like holy shit I'll never forget his stare down with Vandele for that first fight.
02:46:35.000The first fight someone finally out stared Vandele.
02:47:58.000So I'm already, before this, I'm thinking, okay, I've got to do something.
02:48:01.000So I went to Krokop and I said, listen, I'm going to interview Waterman, and then it's like, oh no, you know, it's an oh no moment, you're going to have to interview Mirko Krokop.
02:48:41.000And he starts telling, hey, you know, Warren Waterman, he said something about a funeral, and Mirko is thinking for a comeback, and he says, a funeral is when somebody passes away.
02:48:52.000And then Mirko goes, I know what a funeral is!
02:48:54.000So it starts like that, and slowly but surely, and suddenly Mirko stops and he says, you know, I didn't like the way you were commentating on my fight last time.
02:49:02.000And it wasn't him commentating, it was somebody else.
02:49:33.000He's going back, and he sits down again, and he starts going, and Mirko suddenly, Mirko gets up and says, you know what, this is it, and he walks straight up to Mauro, and Mauro starts pissing his pants off, because he thinks, oh, this is over, and Mauro comes out, he says, no, no, okay, I don't want to do it, you need one more question,
02:49:48.000we need one more question, he goes, no, no, I don't want to do it, and he's walking away, and he's walking away, and I go, uh-oh, uh-oh, and Mirko came out of the dressing room, and he started walking straight, Straight up to Mauro, Mauro, you see him shrinking, and he goes, dude, this is all just a joke.
02:50:05.000It was like Kaiser Suse, remember unusual, miracle coming out, he's gonna fucking left kick my head off, my career's done, I'm finished, and then he was in on it, but yeah, you guys, it was terrifying.
02:50:17.000Well, that was when he was the head of the anti-terrorist squad in Croatia.
02:50:58.000Vandele was heavier than him back then.
02:50:59.000Vandele was 218 and Kokop was 214. Remember Vandele and Mark Hunt with Randy Couture doing the commentary?
02:51:07.000There's a small cunt over his right eye.
02:51:14.000Think about the weight difference there!
02:51:16.000A lot of people thought that that fight kind of ruined Vandele, but Hunt cracked him a couple of times and had him stunned in that fight, and that was one of Vandele's last fights in his prime.
02:51:30.000Just him and Quentin, Rampage Jackson.
02:51:32.000How about that for a dramatic KO? Halloween, Pride 28, when Jackson did very well in the rematch, and then Vanderlei catches him again, the knees and stuff, and he's between the ropes and blood flowing from his...