Ali Dawah - August 16, 2025


HE DID'NT EXPECT THIS BY MUSLIM - HUMBLING END


Episode Stats


Length

15 minutes

Words per minute

202.71742

Word count

3,163

Sentence count

368

Harmful content

Hate speech

2

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

Jazakum Waraikum Al-Khalilah: From Nothing, Nothing Comes. Why does God exist? What does the universe have in common with the rest of the universe, and how can we prove that God exists?

Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
00:00:00.120 So just answer my question.
00:00:02.640 The universe cannot, you cannot have an infinite regress of dependent things.
00:00:06.040 So it has to rely on something that's independent.
00:00:08.340 I thought so.
00:00:11.780 Assalamu alaikum warahmatullahi wabarakatuh, dear brothers and sisters.
00:00:14.800 As we watch what is unfolding today in Gaza, we have to understand
00:00:18.560 that opposition is counting on us to lose attention, to become fatigued,
00:00:23.240 and to move on with the new cycle.
00:00:25.080 And just as we can't allow them to dictate our attention,
00:00:28.220 we also can't allow them to dictate the pace of our solidarity.
00:00:31.500 And part of that solidarity is going to be there to rebuild Gaza short-term, long-term.
00:00:37.060 I am proud to give my support, my word of support,
00:00:40.460 to trusted brothers and sisters in the United Kingdom
00:00:42.900 that have started a waqf, that have started an endowment
00:00:45.440 to make sure, inshallah ta'ala, that we're there for the long run.
00:00:48.280 It's going to be long-term, and we will not forget our cause in Palestine.
00:00:52.860 We will not forget the cause of al-Aqsa. 1.00
00:00:54.520 And we will not forget our brothers and sisters in Gaza.
00:00:58.600 Jazakum Allah, khaira, wassalamu alaikum warahmatullahi wabarakatuh.
00:01:01.440 From nothing, nothing comes.
00:01:08.660 You cannot have us, you cannot have matter, time, space, energy from nothing.
00:01:13.860 You can't have these things popping out of nothing.
00:01:15.760 Well, maybe we can.
00:01:17.160 Okay.
00:01:17.780 But then you can also ask, can the creative pop out of nothing?
00:01:20.620 Okay, so just on that point,
00:01:22.520 the onus of proof that something can come from nothing
00:01:25.460 is not on me, it's on you.
00:01:26.440 Because we've never experienced anything like that in our lives.
00:01:30.320 So the onus is on you, not on me, to prove that that's true.
00:01:34.180 Can you prove it?
00:01:35.140 Okay.
00:01:36.580 Can, no, wait.
00:01:38.700 Okay.
00:01:39.700 You, you, you, you, you've way more used to talking to this than I am,
00:01:43.320 so I'm going to have to think for a moment.
00:01:45.440 What's the definition of nothing?
00:01:46.600 I, I can't give you a good, concise definition.
00:01:53.060 No, it's a definition.
00:01:53.740 It's the absence of something.
00:01:55.140 You could say that.
00:01:56.300 I mean...
00:01:56.400 Not me, not me.
00:01:57.780 That's a good definition.
00:01:59.000 I'm, I'm sure there's a better one in the Oxford English station.
00:02:01.340 No, no, not from me.
00:02:02.220 It's a future, okay, anyway.
00:02:03.160 Nothing is the absence of something.
00:02:04.880 Yes, yes.
00:02:06.300 But we, we just fundamentally don't know how the universe was created.
00:02:10.480 And, and maybe it occurred from nothing.
00:02:12.300 Maybe it occurred from a creator.
00:02:13.500 Maybe it came from something else.
00:02:16.440 We just fundamentally don't know.
00:02:18.300 Because there was nobody, there was nobody there to see it.
00:02:21.080 If I was to ask you a question,
00:02:23.720 you're talking about underdetermination right now, right?
00:02:25.800 There's many different possibilities.
00:02:27.720 You previously said evolution is the explanation for why we're here.
00:02:32.620 Yes.
00:02:33.000 Yeah.
00:02:33.900 We chose evolution amongst a group of other options.
00:02:40.000 Yes.
00:02:40.280 Why don't we look at the universe and look at the different options and then decide which
00:02:45.180 one's more rational?
00:02:46.520 Rather than saying there's too many options.
00:02:48.560 Would you agree with that?
00:02:50.300 No.
00:02:50.680 I mean, I just, um...
00:02:53.680 Let me, let me give you three categories.
00:02:55.420 Okay, no, let's...
00:02:56.000 I, I, I guess maybe you're right.
00:02:59.080 I don't know.
00:03:00.240 I just don't think that question is very interesting.
00:03:02.920 Okay, so...
00:03:03.240 I think the question of why the universe is here, how it was, how it occurred or was created
00:03:08.000 in the first place is...
00:03:09.340 Okay, these people are all right.
00:03:11.120 I, I just don't find it interesting.
00:03:13.080 There's so many interesting things happening in the world between people.
00:03:16.660 Or whatever.
00:03:18.000 It's like, I don't, I don't really care.
00:03:19.700 Okay.
00:03:20.340 What if I was to ask you something that you said earlier on in the conversation?
00:03:23.800 You said, it wouldn't make a difference to you if God existed or not.
00:03:26.860 You said something like this.
00:03:27.860 Yes.
00:03:28.180 Yeah, okay.
00:03:29.120 What if I was to say I disagree with that?
00:03:31.680 Because if God exists, then we have a purpose, which is objective.
00:03:35.880 If God doesn't exist, this life is meaningless.
00:03:39.180 So it does have an existential impact on our lives.
00:03:42.040 But, but, but, but, that statement may be true, but that just makes the existence of a
00:03:47.720 God more desirable.
00:03:49.000 It doesn't make it more probable.
00:03:50.400 Okay, good, good.
00:03:51.140 Very good.
00:03:51.780 I really like you said that.
00:03:52.900 The reason why I said this is because now the question of God is important.
00:04:00.280 I'm not saying God exists because God is desirable.
00:04:03.060 I'm saying it makes the question of God important.
00:04:05.580 Wait, wait, wait.
00:04:06.120 You said there was a, God made sure there's a purpose.
00:04:09.680 What is that purpose?
00:04:11.080 Okay, the purpose of life, according to Islam, is to have a relationship with God.
00:04:15.300 Yes.
00:04:15.660 And that relationship with God is what's going to give us happiness.
00:04:18.560 I'll ask you a simple question.
00:04:19.740 I ask everyone that comes here.
00:04:20.740 If I gave you a billion dollars and you had one year to spend it, what would you do with
00:04:25.200 those billion dollars?
00:04:25.940 I have to spend it all in one year.
00:04:35.820 I might go skiing.
00:04:38.200 I don't know.
00:04:38.700 Is that it?
00:04:39.400 I, I, I...
00:04:40.340 You look at the type of person that will go and find a cave and get a bunch of mutants.
00:04:46.180 I'm joking.
00:04:46.920 Anyway, like do scientific experiments, buy yachts, get cars, do other stuff.
00:04:50.900 I mean, I, I, like a billion dollars.
00:04:54.360 Like if I was allowed to invest it, then I could like make sure I live like very comfortably
00:04:58.960 the rest of my life.
00:05:00.040 Fine.
00:05:00.640 But, but you, you asked me to spend it in one year and I'm like, it's just the limit to
00:05:05.040 how much I can spend in one year.
00:05:07.460 You can spend it on...
00:05:08.760 Maybe I'll donate most of it.
00:05:10.300 I don't know.
00:05:10.560 Okay.
00:05:10.800 Okay.
00:05:11.640 But say you had not one year, you had a hundred years.
00:05:14.060 You could spend it for the rest of your life.
00:05:15.680 That's it.
00:05:16.120 You do everything that you found desirable in your life.
00:05:20.340 Yes.
00:05:20.960 Would you say that you have now maximum happiness?
00:05:25.580 There's no more happiness beyond these material things.
00:05:29.220 No, no, I, I wouldn't.
00:05:30.940 I think, I think I would probably take a few steps up what you call like the hedonic treadmill
00:05:36.620 and now I would get used to a higher standard of living and, and I would just set higher goals
00:05:41.340 for myself of what to achieve because now I should be able to achieve more because I, I
00:05:45.460 have like, what did you say, a billion pounds and then, and then I probably wouldn't achieve
00:05:50.100 those things and maybe I would be less happy.
00:05:52.000 Are you familiar with Maslow's hierarchy of needs?
00:05:54.600 Okay.
00:05:55.120 What was right at the top?
00:05:56.900 Self-realization, right?
00:06:00.940 That was the original, that was the original sketch.
00:06:05.640 What was right, what was right at the bottom?
00:06:07.400 Right at the bottom.
00:06:07.800 It was like food, shelter, sleep, things like that.
00:06:11.960 As you go up the ladder, your physical needs are being left for something more transcendent.
00:06:18.600 Yes.
00:06:19.100 Okay.
00:06:19.840 The ultimate transcendent being is God and true happiness, the Quran says, is when you
00:06:26.380 have a relationship with that God.
00:06:28.080 And this is, you know, you said it's not desirable or it doesn't impact your life.
00:06:32.940 It's on the minimum, I hope today you've seen from my perspective that God has a meaningful
00:06:37.640 impact in our lives.
00:06:39.020 So that's why the question of God is important.
00:06:40.980 It's not just an abstract discussion, just a nice fancy way of, you know, passing time
00:06:46.420 and doing philosophy.
00:06:47.400 It has a real world impact on people's lives.
00:06:51.140 This is why people turn towards God.
00:06:52.880 And we can prove God exists.
00:06:54.140 I'm sorry?
00:06:54.860 We can prove God exists.
00:06:56.020 How would you prove God exists?
00:06:58.200 Me personally?
00:06:59.320 Yes.
00:06:59.660 I would use the argument from contingency.
00:07:01.000 So I would say there are three types of possibilities or three types of existence.
00:07:05.400 We have impossible existence.
00:07:07.260 We have possible existence and we have necessary existence.
00:07:11.060 Yeah.
00:07:11.500 And I'll define them for you.
00:07:12.540 Yeah.
00:07:12.840 The first one is an impossible existence, like a triangle square.
00:07:15.820 Yeah.
00:07:16.180 We cannot have a triangle square.
00:07:17.260 Would you agree?
00:07:18.540 Yes.
00:07:19.040 By definition.
00:07:19.620 Yeah.
00:07:19.740 Yeah.
00:07:19.840 Good.
00:07:20.240 So we have, we're left with two existence.
00:07:21.700 Number one is possible existence, which is contingent, something that relies on something
00:07:25.540 else for its existence.
00:07:26.400 And number two is a necessary existence that is independent of any need.
00:07:30.100 So would you agree that me and you are dependent?
00:07:33.960 Yes.
00:07:34.420 Okay.
00:07:34.660 So we are contingent on other things for our survival?
00:07:36.780 Yes, of course.
00:07:37.500 Good.
00:07:37.720 So eating, food, shelter, et cetera.
00:07:39.480 All those things, yes.
00:07:40.360 Yeah.
00:07:40.520 Good.
00:07:40.740 So would you agree that planet Earth is dependent on other factors for its survival?
00:07:45.140 Yes.
00:07:45.980 Good.
00:07:46.140 Would you accept that our solar system is dependent on other things?
00:07:50.000 I don't think I know enough about like astrophysics to answer that question.
00:07:54.520 No, it's not a matter of knowing about astrophysics.
00:07:56.460 It's knowing that, for example, in our universe, we are a planet within our galaxy.
00:08:00.880 Yes.
00:08:01.240 So we depend on what?
00:08:03.400 Well, the fact is to survive.
00:08:04.380 I mean, like you have planets that are wandering and don't have a sun, right?
00:08:10.240 So I don't know.
00:08:11.360 Are they dependent?
00:08:12.560 Are they dependent on something else for its survival?
00:08:14.920 I don't know.
00:08:16.120 I don't know the answers to this.
00:08:17.780 No, no, no.
00:08:18.320 I just don't.
00:08:19.100 No, no, no.
00:08:19.420 But would you agree that they are dependent?
00:08:21.700 I don't.
00:08:22.920 Like, I know what you want me to answer, but I just don't know enough about the topic.
00:08:26.700 No, no, I want you to answer.
00:08:27.800 To me, my definition is this for something that is contingent.
00:08:30.240 It depends on something else for its existence.
00:08:32.720 It can be any other way and it's composed of pieces.
00:08:35.120 Would you agree that other planets are composed of pieces?
00:08:38.080 Sure.
00:08:38.640 Okay, then I say that it's dependent.
00:08:40.180 Anything that is composed of pieces is dependent.
00:08:42.180 Okay.
00:08:42.540 Okay, good.
00:08:42.900 So what I would say is, for example, do you accept that, for example, our universe,
00:08:46.980 is it dependent or independent?
00:08:49.480 I would guess the universe is independent.
00:08:51.980 Good.
00:08:52.240 So that's good for me because you know what?
00:08:53.900 Because you accept that we require an independent thing.
00:08:57.120 All you do is you ascribe that to the universe.
00:08:59.280 Now, is the universe composed of pieces?
00:09:01.460 Yes.
00:09:01.980 Good.
00:09:02.300 Can it be any other way?
00:09:03.640 The universe?
00:09:04.480 Yeah.
00:09:04.960 Can you have more galaxies, less galaxies?
00:09:06.980 Sure.
00:09:07.560 Good.
00:09:07.720 So, number three, that shows me that it is dependent.
00:09:11.400 Because it's composed of pieces, it can be any other way.
00:09:13.580 No, no, you're making up all these definitions and saying all these words,
00:09:17.000 but like, it doesn't, like, we just agreed the universe was independent.
00:09:21.100 Yeah, yeah, exactly.
00:09:21.660 The universe might just be its own thing and there might be no other things.
00:09:24.600 No, no, no.
00:09:24.780 We just don't know that.
00:09:25.780 No, you said it's independent, which, to me, remember we said there are two types of existence.
00:09:30.340 Impossible existence, possible existence, and necessary existence.
00:09:33.060 All you've done is, you've accepted that there are possible existence and there's a necessary existence.
00:09:37.820 You ascribe the necessary existence to the universe.
00:09:40.880 My argument is the following.
00:09:42.240 If I can prove the universe is not independent-dependent, the question I will ask you is, what does it depend on?
00:09:47.640 You said it's dependent on the pieces it's made of, that makes it dependent on itself.
00:09:52.340 No, that's my whole point.
00:09:53.400 If it's composed of pieces, and it can be any other way, it is dependent, it's not independent.
00:09:57.800 Dependent on what?
00:09:59.380 Those pieces, like, for example, you know they say the part comes before the whole.
00:10:03.240 That's like saying I'm dependent on myself, and therefore I'm not dependent.
00:10:07.400 No, I never said that, you're dependent.
00:10:08.720 If you depend on your heart, you're dependent.
00:10:11.940 No, my heart is part of me.
00:10:14.240 Good, you depend on it.
00:10:15.580 Yes.
00:10:15.980 Good, so you're dependent.
00:10:18.180 Like, that's just circular logic.
00:10:20.080 That's a circular logic.
00:10:20.780 You depend on your heart to be for you to exist.
00:10:23.120 It's just circular logic, and it does not in any way prove the existence of a God.
00:10:27.660 Well, I didn't even go to God yet.
00:10:29.840 To me, it seems like you know where it's going.
00:10:32.920 I'm saying to you, very simply, do you depend on water to survive?
00:10:36.660 Yes.
00:10:37.180 You're a dependent being.
00:10:38.160 You're a dependent being.
00:10:39.000 That's fine.
00:10:39.360 So, I'm saying to you, the universe within itself, it is also dependent.
00:10:44.020 It's not independent.
00:10:46.240 We don't know that.
00:10:47.080 Because the universe is not self-sufficient.
00:10:48.580 You do know that.
00:10:49.240 For example, we require that the universe...
00:10:52.080 The universe might very well be self-sufficient.
00:10:55.020 How?
00:10:55.400 Prove it to me.
00:10:55.920 How?
00:10:57.220 As I said before, I'm not an astrophysicist.
00:10:59.160 You don't need to be an astrophysicist.
00:10:59.920 I can tell you that...
00:11:00.680 No!
00:11:01.260 Yes, I actually need to be an astrophysicist to answer these questions.
00:11:04.260 I'm not an astrophysicist.
00:11:05.260 I know, for example...
00:11:06.020 You also can't answer these questions.
00:11:07.220 No, no, no, I can.
00:11:07.560 Very simply.
00:11:07.960 We know the universe is composed of pieces.
00:11:09.720 It can be any other way.
00:11:10.740 You can have more galaxies, less galaxies.
00:11:12.580 Therefore, not only that, we don't have infinite in the real world.
00:11:15.640 Can you prove to me infinite in the real world?
00:11:18.380 There's like an infinite number of real numbers.
00:11:22.560 No, no.
00:11:22.860 That's called potential infinite.
00:11:24.960 You don't have actual infinite.
00:11:25.760 There's an infinite number of real numbers.
00:11:33.440 No, no, no.
00:11:34.480 There's potential infinite numbers going on.
00:11:36.580 But there's no infinite.
00:11:37.680 Infinite has no number.
00:11:40.240 I mean, now we're just having a semantics discussion.
00:11:42.080 Not really, not really.
00:11:42.800 What I'm saying to you is the following, yeah?
00:11:44.500 You cannot have an infinite regress of dependent things.
00:11:46.860 You require an independent, self-sufficient, necessary being that gave rise to all the dependent things.
00:11:52.340 And that was the Big Bang.
00:11:54.380 You can't...
00:11:55.120 You're calling something that began to exist.
00:11:58.960 You're calling something that exploded.
00:12:00.840 That's dependent.
00:12:01.960 The fact that it exploded is dependent.
00:12:03.280 So you require what?
00:12:06.760 If the Big Bang...
00:12:07.560 No, the explosion might be independent.
00:12:10.100 No, how can it be independent?
00:12:11.020 The fact that it exploded and needed all those forces.
00:12:12.940 We don't know...
00:12:13.520 We don't know how it works.
00:12:14.660 We don't know...
00:12:15.420 You don't know how it works.
00:12:16.060 And I'm tired of you being like...
00:12:17.240 No, it's not.
00:12:17.560 These anti-science religious fanatics.
00:12:20.100 I'm so fucking tired of you.
00:12:21.580 No, you're just upset because you...
00:12:22.640 I'm showing you logically and rationally.
00:12:25.140 No, you're talking nonsense and then you say...
00:12:26.240 No, you're upset because you can't rationally bring anything to the table.
00:12:29.940 I understand you're upset because the thing is,
00:12:31.460 when we begin a logical, rational argument,
00:12:33.560 you start having a tantrum.
00:12:35.120 I didn't swear at you.
00:12:35.860 I didn't...
00:12:36.180 If I'm the religious fanatic,
00:12:38.440 you sound like a religious fanatic
00:12:39.360 because you feel like they bring it to the table.
00:12:40.600 I'm having a rational, rational discussion politely.
00:12:43.500 You're having a breakdown.
00:12:45.280 So again...
00:12:46.240 You're just talking nonsense.
00:12:47.660 That's fine.
00:12:48.160 You're just talking nonsense.
00:12:49.360 That's fine.
00:12:49.820 It makes no sense.
00:12:50.720 If it doesn't make sense, answer it.
00:12:51.700 Maybe you should go to school and learn some science.
00:12:53.800 Okay, that's fine.
00:12:54.460 If you know science better,
00:12:55.260 you be my teacher.
00:12:56.200 That's fine.
00:12:56.820 So I'm asking a simple question.
00:12:57.800 The Big Bang, how did it explode?
00:12:58.980 I mean, I don't know how many times
00:13:01.660 I have to repeat myself
00:13:02.700 and say I'm not an astrophysicist.
00:13:03.760 Maybe three more times.
00:13:05.460 What's it got to do with that?
00:13:06.720 It's simple logic and rationality.
00:13:08.460 The argument is the following.
00:13:09.720 It's hard, difficult science
00:13:11.620 that we don't know the answers to.
00:13:13.500 No, no, no.
00:13:13.780 One second.
00:13:14.260 Not knowing the answers,
00:13:15.280 that's a cop-out.
00:13:15.840 That's not saying,
00:13:16.480 I don't know the answers.
00:13:17.460 Okay, that's fine.
00:13:18.000 But I'm saying,
00:13:18.720 logically and rationally,
00:13:19.560 you accepted
00:13:20.120 there is a necessary existence
00:13:22.360 and a possible existence.
00:13:23.720 We said...
00:13:24.440 I said to him,
00:13:24.880 is the universe dependent or independent?
00:13:26.020 He said, it's independent.
00:13:27.000 Good.
00:13:27.120 That's good for me.
00:13:27.900 Which means you agree
00:13:28.960 we need an independent thing.
00:13:30.420 You ascribed it to the universe.
00:13:32.100 I proved to you
00:13:32.960 why the universe cannot be independent
00:13:34.280 and is dependent.
00:13:34.960 You did not.
00:13:35.700 Yes, yes, I did.
00:13:36.780 Yes, I did.
00:13:37.420 That's the reason why, look,
00:13:38.280 you depend on your foul language 0.92
00:13:39.840 because you have nothing
00:13:40.720 to bring to the table.
00:13:41.680 So therefore,
00:13:42.600 if the universe is dependent,
00:13:43.600 what does it depend on?
00:13:44.400 You've been repeating yourself
00:13:45.620 for 10 minutes
00:13:46.260 and I got tired
00:13:47.400 because you're just repeating,
00:13:49.080 starting,
00:13:49.660 you say nonsense.
00:13:50.120 I'm tired.
00:13:50.580 I'm tired.
00:13:51.780 So answer my question.
00:13:54.180 The universe cannot,
00:13:55.480 you cannot have
00:13:55.840 an infinite regress
00:13:56.540 of dependent things.
00:13:57.560 So it has to rely
00:13:58.540 on something that's independent.
00:13:59.780 I thought so.
00:14:00.800 Bye, Magnus.
00:14:01.580 It's been a pleasure.
00:14:02.780 As you can see,
00:14:03.520 you know, you know,
00:14:04.180 look,
00:14:04.860 I admire,
00:14:05.700 I admire
00:14:06.620 Sabur's patience.
00:14:08.640 Okay.
00:14:09.200 I was listening,
00:14:10.480 yeah,
00:14:10.720 and I was like,
00:14:11.860 Salamu alaykum.
00:14:12.860 Yeah,
00:14:13.100 I have to admire,
00:14:14.260 admire Sabur's way of Dawah,
00:14:16.120 but this guy just
00:14:16.820 chatting waffles,
00:14:17.620 man.
00:14:17.760 You know what I did?
00:14:18.140 I just shut my mouth.
00:14:19.260 I thought,
00:14:19.460 look,
00:14:19.700 Sabur did a fantastic job,
00:14:21.380 but you know,
00:14:22.240 the moment you just
00:14:23.580 put them to a corner,
00:14:25.260 ask a rational,
00:14:26.440 logical question,
00:14:27.120 inshallah,
00:14:27.420 he was trying to dodge it,
00:14:28.680 et cetera.
00:14:29.440 No problem.
00:14:29.960 Sabur was making
00:14:30.400 fantastic points
00:14:31.560 and he's like,
00:14:32.360 I hear this,
00:14:32.880 I hear that.
00:14:33.160 Okay, no problem.
00:14:33.840 I'll tell you something
00:14:34.380 funny that you did.
00:14:35.220 That was really funny.
00:14:36.500 When he was cornered with me,
00:14:38.300 he simply said,
00:14:39.460 it doesn't matter to me.
00:14:40.800 So then I went into
00:14:41.440 why God matters.
00:14:42.440 Exactly.
00:14:42.580 With you,
00:14:43.100 you said,
00:14:43.480 no, no, no,
00:14:44.060 I'll prove it to you.
00:14:45.320 And that's why.
00:14:45.920 And you did a good one
00:14:47.660 because it showed
00:14:48.180 that you need
00:14:48.860 in Maslow's hierarchy,
00:14:50.220 you need the top,
00:14:51.160 the top is what?
00:14:52.140 The top self-transcendence.
00:14:53.640 Self-transcendence.
00:14:54.620 So he understood that.
00:14:56.360 The moment,
00:14:56.980 I'm asking,
00:14:57.520 I didn't insult him.
00:14:58.480 I didn't insult him.
00:14:59.160 I just made the rush argument.
00:15:00.480 No, you know why?
00:15:01.480 Because you can sense
00:15:02.380 these kind of guys,
00:15:03.420 it's the ego.
00:15:04.180 They worship him.
00:15:04.640 You know,
00:15:04.800 Allah says in the Quran,
00:15:05.260 have you seen the one
00:15:05.720 that takes his own desires as God?
00:15:07.040 I didn't insult you.
00:15:07.900 I didn't swear at you.
00:15:08.540 I'll tell you why it happened.
00:15:09.500 Yeah.
00:15:10.480 He knew he was filming
00:15:11.680 and I said,
00:15:12.400 are you okay with that?
00:15:13.000 He said, yes.
00:15:13.760 He wanted you to be on camera.
00:15:14.840 Yes.
00:15:15.860 And then he realized
00:15:16.660 it looked bad.
00:15:17.580 Exactly.
00:15:18.060 And I showed him the channel.
00:15:19.200 Magnus played Russian Relate
00:15:21.240 with a Magnum
00:15:22.060 and it didn't end well.
00:15:23.780 And he intellectually lost.
00:15:24.720 He got pissed off.
00:15:25.480 He got, he got,
00:15:26.080 I'm not here to have
00:15:27.000 one over the other.
00:15:27.600 It's not about that.
00:15:28.080 It's about honesty.
00:15:29.520 No, but Ali,
00:15:29.960 I would tell you one thing though.
00:15:31.980 I was trying to be
00:15:32.900 as polite as possible.
00:15:33.740 He was, yes.
00:15:34.620 However,
00:15:35.120 there was a lot of arrogance in it.