Ali Dawah - October 22, 2020


MUSLIM TEACHES ATHEIST A LIFE LESSON - SMART RESPONSE

Hosted by
Ali Dawah
Mentioned
Mohsin
RONALDO SAYS INSHA'ALLAH TO KHABIB - CHRISTIANO RONALDO KHABIB LEADS SALAH - UNSEEN FOOTAGE

Episode Stats


Length

6 minutes

Words per minute

232.3

Word count

1,448

Sentence count

226

Harmful content

Hate speech

1

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

In this episode, I explain why you don't need empirical evidence to believe in God. You need pre-supposition, not empirical data. God is beyond the physical, so why do you need empirical data to believe that God exists?

Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
Hosts, guests, and mentioned names generated with spaCy (en_core_web_sm), reconciled against Wikidata.
00:00:00.000 Okay, what's your position? Do you believe there is a creator?
00:00:03.000 I believe there could be, but I don't see any empirical evidence and nothing could be otherwise.
00:00:07.000 Why do you assume there has to be empirical evidence for everything?
00:00:10.000 Because otherwise it's irrational.
00:00:12.000 Do you have parents?
00:00:14.000 Hold on, if you were blind and I just turned around and told you that the sky was green, would you believe me?
00:00:19.000 Okay, listen, do you have parents?
00:00:22.000 Yes.
00:00:23.000 Do you believe your parents are your parents?
00:00:25.000 To the best of my degree, yes.
00:00:27.000 Okay, do you have any?
00:00:28.000 Without a DNA test, I can't be sure.
00:00:29.000 So you know, till this day, how old are you?
00:00:31.000 30.
00:00:32.000 You're 30 years old and you don't know if your parents are your parents till this day.
00:00:35.000 No.
00:00:36.000 Have you done a DNA test?
00:00:37.000 I've assumed.
00:00:38.000 Have you done a DNA test?
00:00:39.000 Have you done a DNA test?
00:00:40.000 Okay, now you're strong.
00:00:41.000 No, no, hold on.
00:00:42.000 I'm asking you, I'm not strong man, I'm asking you.
00:00:43.000 I haven't done a DNA test.
00:00:44.000 Okay, but you don't find it necessary to do a DNA test right now because right now you don't believe in your own parents?
00:00:48.000 No, because they're taking care of me.
00:00:50.000 No bro, you're not being, this is called being disingenuous.
00:00:52.000 Of course you believe your parents are your parents.
00:00:54.000 You've cherry-baked me.
00:00:55.000 Bro, you know what, you're going around in circles.
00:00:58.000 I'm just trying to highlight to you now that empirical data is not the only way to truth.
00:01:05.000 What I'm trying to tell you is that you believe your parents are your parents, not based on empirical data.
00:01:10.000 It's not based on empirical data.
00:01:11.000 It's based on a pre-supposition.
00:01:12.000 What's it based on?
00:01:13.000 Tell me.
00:01:14.000 It's based on my idea that I believe the two people.
00:01:15.000 No, no, where did the idea come from?
00:01:17.000 How did you develop the idea that your parents are your parents?
00:01:19.000 See, now you're deconstructing you.
00:01:20.000 No, no, I'm asking you, how did you develop the idea?
00:01:21.000 I pre-supposed, I just assumed.
00:01:23.000 That is a pre-supposition.
00:01:25.000 No, it's based on the testimony of your parents.
00:01:28.000 It's based on testimony.
00:01:30.000 Yeah?
00:01:31.000 It's not based on empirical data.
00:01:32.000 Of course you can get a DNA test, no doubt.
00:01:34.000 I agree.
00:01:35.000 But you haven't got it yet.
00:01:36.000 Right now you believe your parents are your parents.
00:01:38.000 Hopefully you do, based on a testimony.
00:01:40.000 Yes, because I have no reason to believe otherwise.
00:01:42.000 Proving my point exactly, which is that you don't need empirical data to believe in things.
00:01:46.000 Always.
00:01:47.000 Empirical, the root, empiricism is one root to knowledge.
00:01:51.000 I agree.
00:01:52.000 It's not the only root to knowledge.
00:01:53.000 You've just proven that.
00:01:54.000 I've also told you.
00:01:55.000 Do you understand what you've done?
00:01:56.000 I understand.
00:01:57.000 Okay, good.
00:01:58.000 I also accept you.
00:01:59.000 I pre-suppose the parents.
00:02:01.000 And that's a logically inconsistent point.
00:02:02.000 What do you mean pre-suppose, bro?
00:02:04.000 Define your, define...
00:02:05.000 You don't pre-supposition.
00:02:06.000 Yeah, I know.
00:02:07.000 But you're not pre-supposing your...
00:02:08.000 You're not just saying, oh, I believe these are my parents.
00:02:10.000 Because I can just say, I believe my neighbors are my parents.
00:02:12.000 You don't do that.
00:02:13.000 No, you don't do that, bro.
00:02:14.000 You believe your parents are your parents based on testimony.
00:02:17.000 You have good reasons to believe that.
00:02:19.000 I'm not denying that.
00:02:20.000 But what I'm showing you is your reasons for believing your parents are your parents
00:02:23.000 aren't empirical reasons.
00:02:24.000 You can do DNA tests, but you don't believe in your parents right now based on a DNA test.
00:02:28.000 So then you're showing that it's irrational and there's nothing...
00:02:30.000 No.
00:02:31.000 What I'm showing you, if you listen to me, what I'm telling you, I'm highlighting,
00:02:34.000 is there are many roots to knowledge.
00:02:36.000 Empiricism is one of them.
00:02:37.000 It's not the only way to truth.
00:02:39.000 Therefore, hear me out.
00:02:40.000 Yeah.
00:02:41.000 Therefore, when you try asking for empirical data for God's existence, you're holding a flawed position.
00:02:45.000 Why?
00:02:46.000 You don't need empirical data.
00:02:47.000 First of all, God is beyond the physical.
00:02:49.000 You don't need empirical data.
00:02:50.000 Do you believe China exists?
00:02:52.000 Yes.
00:02:53.000 Have you been to China?
00:02:54.000 I have.
00:02:55.000 You have? Okay.
00:02:56.000 Do you believe Africa exists? 1.00
00:02:57.000 Yeah.
00:02:58.000 Have you been to Africa?
00:02:59.000 I have been to South Africa.
00:03:00.000 Yeah.
00:03:01.000 Okay, but have you been to the heart of Africa?
00:03:02.000 No.
00:03:03.000 No.
00:03:04.000 But you believe it exists?
00:03:05.000 Why do you believe it exists?
00:03:06.000 Because it's data.
00:03:07.000 What's the data?
00:03:08.000 Give me a specific one.
00:03:09.000 How do you know the satellite image is actually the heart of Africa?
00:03:11.000 How do you know someone has not just told you that?
00:03:13.000 See, now you're not being consistent because now you're saying it.
00:03:15.000 No.
00:03:16.000 What I'm highlighting to you is that although you've seen a picture of the heart of Africa,
00:03:19.000 someone is telling you that this is Central Africa.
00:03:22.000 It's, again, testament.
00:03:23.000 It's not empirical data, bro.
00:03:25.000 It is empirical.
00:03:26.000 Are you saying maps are empirical data?
00:03:27.000 They are.
00:03:28.000 They are empirical data.
00:03:29.000 They're cryptography.
00:03:30.000 They are maps.
00:03:31.000 No.
00:03:32.000 Maps are physical things which you observe, but you believe they're a map of a particular
00:03:36.000 thing based on the testimony of someone telling you.
00:03:38.000 No.
00:03:39.000 Based on the input data.
00:03:40.000 No.
00:03:41.000 It's based on the testimony of someone telling you this is the map of this place.
00:03:43.000 Originally.
00:03:44.000 Yeah, sure.
00:03:45.000 Yeah, exactly.
00:03:46.000 But since we've developed satellite imagery.
00:03:47.000 That's fine.
00:03:48.000 That's fine.
00:03:49.000 But it proves my point anyway, which is that there are many routes to knowledge.
00:03:51.000 Well, no.
00:03:52.000 Because...
00:03:53.000 Do you acknowledge that?
00:03:54.000 Because you're using a straw man now.
00:03:55.000 Satellite imagery.
00:03:56.000 Can you stop by now?
00:03:57.000 Sorry, madam.
00:03:58.000 I know you've been waiting.
00:03:59.000 But I'm going to be here with you.
00:04:01.000 Can I get someone else to speak to you about that question?
00:04:03.000 Mohsin.
00:04:04.000 Mohsin.
00:04:05.000 Mohsin.
00:04:06.000 Mohsin.
00:04:07.000 Mohsin.
00:04:08.000 Mohsin, can you speak to this lady, please?
00:04:09.000 She's got a question.
00:04:10.000 The last thing I'm going to say here...
00:04:12.000 Bro, do you acknowledge that there are other routes to knowledge?
00:04:14.000 No.
00:04:15.000 Sure.
00:04:16.000 Prior to the existence of empirical data in the form of map making, through satellite imagery,
00:04:19.000 through planes, through drones and stuff.
00:04:21.000 Yes, it was taking the opinion of someone else.
00:04:24.000 However, now that we've been able to prove it with empirical data...
00:04:26.000 No, no, no.
00:04:27.000 Hold on.
00:04:28.000 Even today, let me give you a modern example, bro.
00:04:30.000 Within the field of science, the empirical field, right?
00:04:34.000 Most scientists base their work, their current work, on the testimony of previous scientists.
00:04:41.000 Do you acknowledge this?
00:04:42.000 Do you understand this?
00:04:43.000 That's why it's called theoretical physics.
00:04:44.000 No.
00:04:45.000 Bro, you're not understanding what I'm saying.
00:04:46.000 Call it whatever you want.
00:04:48.000 What I'm saying is that it's based on the testimony of the work of previous scientists.
00:04:52.000 Testimony is an integral route to knowledge you can't dismiss.
00:04:55.000 That's what I'm saying to you.
00:04:56.000 Because you came with the presupposition that empiricism is the only way to truth.
00:05:00.000 It's not.
00:05:01.000 Do you acknowledge that?
00:05:02.000 I never said it's the only way to truth.
00:05:03.000 Okay.
00:05:04.000 So, fine.
00:05:05.000 We agree then, on that point, right?
00:05:06.000 Now my point is that when it comes to God, why do you assume that there has to be only
00:05:10.000 empirical...
00:05:11.000 Why do you ask for empirical data?
00:05:12.000 Why?
00:05:13.000 When you acknowledge there's other roots to knowledge.
00:05:14.000 Why can't I ask?
00:05:15.000 I tell you why not.
00:05:16.000 Because God is not a part of the physical universe.
00:05:18.000 He's distinct and disjoint from the physical universe.
00:05:22.000 He created the physical, not a part of the physical.
00:05:24.000 Therefore, you can't physically prove it.
00:05:26.000 You cannot empirically prove or disprove God's existence.
00:05:29.000 Simple.
00:05:30.000 So then why believe it?
00:05:31.000 Why do you see other reasons now?
00:05:32.000 Because you're open now to understanding there's other roots to knowledge.
00:05:34.000 Would you like other reasons?
00:05:35.000 Not right now.
00:05:36.000 Because I actually have to go.
00:05:37.000 You have to go?
00:05:38.000 Yeah.
00:05:39.000 Okay.
00:05:40.000 Maybe when you're here next time, you can have that discussion.
00:05:41.000 Have you read the Quran?
00:05:42.000 I have not.
00:05:43.000 Do me a favor.
00:05:44.000 Do me a favor.
00:05:45.000 Read some of the Quran.
00:05:46.000 Yeah.
00:05:47.000 By our next discussion.
00:05:48.000 Read the 112 chapter, if anything.
00:05:50.000 If anything, just the 112 chapter.
00:05:51.000 Next time.
00:05:52.000 And then we'll discuss it.
00:05:53.000 But at least, can we conclude on this point?
00:05:54.000 So we can carry on the discussion.
00:05:56.000 You agree there's other roots to knowledge other than empiricism.
00:05:58.000 Yeah.
00:05:59.000 And that we as human beings are rational enough to have a discussion.
00:06:02.000 I want an answer from you next time as to how you account for rational faculties on your
00:06:08.000 worldview.
00:06:09.000 I can't.
00:06:10.000 Maybe next time, when you come back next time, you can come with something.
00:06:12.000 Yeah.
00:06:13.000 Thank you.