Ali Dawah - March 23, 2021


TOMMY & THE DARK FAR RIGHT - EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW - CAOLAN & ALI’S


Episode Stats


Length

9 minutes

Words per minute

205.40233

Word count

2,043

Sentence count

155

Harmful content

Toxicity

13

sentences flagged

Hate speech

11

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

In this episode, I speak to Ali Dawood, who has been on the receiving end of abuse from Tommy Robinson over the last few years. He tells us about the abuse he received from the far-right activist and how he dealt with it.

Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
00:00:00.720 So it's been a bad week for Tommy Robinson.
00:00:03.200 The Home Affairs Correspondent Lizzy Dearden from The Independent released multiple stories
00:00:07.560 about him and about the abuse that she suffered.
00:00:09.880 You claim you're very confident that there are these 109 verses in the Quran that says 0.99
00:00:14.480 kill the infidel wherever you find him. 1.00
00:00:15.880 I said no problem, let's meet and let's talk about these specific verses. 0.95
00:00:19.240 Then this all led up to May 2018 which was Day for Freedom which is where Tommy and loads
00:00:25.320 of other people from the international far right all spoke on stage.
00:00:27.800 It was a huge crowd.
00:00:30.480 Just talk us through what happened leading up to that event and then on the day.
00:00:53.780 So it's been a bad week for Tommy Robinson.
00:00:56.180 The Home Affairs Correspondent Lizzy Dearden from The Independent released multiple stories
00:01:00.300 about him and about the abuse that she suffered when he turned up at her house at 10 o'clock
00:01:05.400 at night, threatened to call her husband a paedophile and said that he would come back every single
00:01:11.080 night.
00:01:11.360 And this has started a huge conversation online about the type of abuse that people have been
00:01:16.980 on the receiving end from Tommy over the last few years.
00:01:19.500 There's people been speaking out about it for the first time in the last couple of days.
00:01:22.420 And one of the most shocking cases of this is something that happened in 2018 to Ali Dawa
00:01:29.960 who joins me here today.
00:01:31.640 What was your first communication with Tommy?
00:01:34.640 Tommy?
00:01:35.640 Firstly, I want to thank you for having me here.
00:01:37.760 I saw you last time.
00:01:39.760 A year ago.
00:01:40.760 Yeah.
00:01:41.260 So the thing is with specifically Tom Robinson.
00:01:43.180 I used to come across him on YouTube.
00:01:44.180 So social media, you know, especially with the far right and Britain first going to specific
00:01:49.080 Muslim communities and bullying individuals things. 1.00
00:01:51.620 Oh, your book says this, your book says that.
00:01:53.760 You know, these people don't really know what's going on, you know, so I found that a bit irritating
00:01:57.640 because I was like, okay, that's not really fair.
00:01:58.920 And me, I don't like injustice done to anybody.
00:02:01.380 I don't care if it's a Muslim or a non-Muslim. 0.99
00:02:02.760 So I was keep watching these videos and I felt really irritated.
00:02:05.800 I was like, come on, you know, if we're going to have a dialogue, let's have a discussion,
00:02:08.360 you know.
00:02:09.360 And I think I tweeted him on Twitter, Tommy Robinson.
00:02:13.360 And I said, look, let's have a dialogue.
00:02:15.400 You know, you claim you're very confident, you know, that there are these 109 verses in the 0.94
00:02:19.660 Quran that says kill the infidel wherever you find him. 1.00
00:02:21.400 And I said, no problem, you know, let's meet and let's talk about these specific verses.
00:02:25.580 And it's when he said that there was an attack in Manchester, the attack that happened in
00:02:30.080 Manchester by one of these ISIS guys.
00:02:33.220 And I was, I'd done a separate video of Drake.
00:02:36.360 So Drake done a, he was, he was in a concert and he said to somebody, take your scarf off.
00:02:42.640 So I think he was talking to a Muslim girl in the crowd who has a hijab on.
00:02:45.960 And I thought that's a bit disrespectful.
00:02:47.900 So I'd done a video to Drake saying that, you know, basically that's wrong, you know,
00:02:52.280 and et cetera.
00:02:53.740 So he picked that up and merged the two.
00:02:56.580 Yeah.
00:02:57.580 And I was like, wow.
00:02:58.580 So I said to the Muslim audience, guys, you shouldn't be going to these concerts anyways. 1.00
00:03:02.080 Yeah.
00:03:03.080 Cause there's all the kind of things that are not permissible in Islam.
00:03:05.420 So he got that.
00:03:06.420 And he said, look, he was warning people to not go to this certain event because he knew
00:03:12.180 that some kind of attack was going to happen.
00:03:13.960 So he merged the Manchester attack with the whole Drake thing.
00:03:16.900 Yeah.
00:03:17.540 And he was calling me a jihadi. 0.89
00:03:18.660 And I was like, what the hell? 0.98
00:03:20.460 Like, like, how could you, how could you slander me like that? 0.85
00:03:22.780 Because the thing is, you're putting my life in danger now.
00:03:24.720 You know, you've got a maniac crowd that's watching you, the far right.
00:03:27.560 And we know what they could do.
00:03:30.020 Now you're putting my life in danger.
00:03:31.260 So I actually called Met Police.
00:03:33.200 Stating, and I think I heard you say, is it jihadi Ali, is that right?
00:03:37.260 Yes.
00:03:37.520 Yes, he's claimed.
00:03:38.060 Well, I don't know.
00:03:38.640 This has caused people to think you were involved in the Manchester bombing, yeah?
00:03:42.800 Yes. 1.00
00:03:43.280 I will shoot this filthy mix if I ever had the chance. 1.00
00:03:46.040 Yeah. 1.00
00:03:46.280 They should be with you within the hour.
00:03:47.800 Okay.
00:03:48.180 Because you're getting serious threats.
00:03:49.920 So yeah, it just, it just, it just started from there really.
00:03:52.020 Yeah.
00:03:52.500 And then this all led up to May 2018, which was Day for Freedom, which is where Tommy and loads
00:03:58.980 of other people from the international far right all spoke on stage.
00:04:01.540 It was a huge crowd.
00:04:03.780 Just talk us through what happened leading up to that event and then on the day.
00:04:08.240 Yeah.
00:04:08.480 So basically, I can remember I heard that there was a Freedom of Speech event happening.
00:04:13.600 And there was a specific individual who was going to speak there as well.
00:04:16.840 He's from a Sikh background, but he supports the far right, yeah?
00:04:20.280 And the Sikh community kind of said to him, look, we've got enough to do with him.
00:04:23.520 However, when I heard as a Sikh, he's going to be there.
00:04:25.840 And I think I heard statements of, you know, everyone, it's open to everyone.
00:04:29.160 I thought, that's good.
00:04:29.680 You know, if it's open to everyone, I'm sure it's open to a Muslim as well, you know?
00:04:32.720 And I thought, you know, I treated it a bit like a social experiment because I do social
00:04:36.080 experiments every now and then.
00:04:37.260 So I thought, let's see.
00:04:38.740 Would they let me talk?
00:04:39.840 Yeah.
00:04:40.200 So I think I got in contact with, what's her name?
00:04:45.300 Lucy?
00:04:45.880 Lucy.
00:04:46.320 I got in contact with Lucy.
00:04:47.120 I, I'll be honest, you see all this, you see the organisation for all this, the videos.
00:05:06.420 None of this.
00:05:13.620 And the people were thanking me.
00:05:15.120 I had loads of people coming up saying thank you for the day.
00:05:17.160 I didn't do anything.
00:05:18.060 That's the truth.
00:05:19.200 They've done it all.
00:05:19.780 And I said, look, can I come?
00:05:22.200 Like, and then she was like, oh, that's a great idea.
00:05:24.320 And I think she spoke to George and, and then they would say, we'll confirm, we'll confirm.
00:05:28.000 But they said, why not?
00:05:29.260 Yeah.
00:05:29.440 Because I think you guys genuinely believed what you, you had principles.
00:05:33.260 You believed in the freedom of speech.
00:05:34.420 So I thought, I need to make a speech.
00:05:35.600 Yeah.
00:05:35.820 And I'm, I'm not really good at, like, I do a lot of YouTube videos here, but like speaking
00:05:38.980 with hundreds of people looking at you, it's not the same.
00:05:41.440 Yeah.
00:05:41.900 So I thought, okay, let me get the speech ready.
00:05:43.340 So I called Mohammed Hijab and we went to a internet cafe near his house and then we
00:05:48.420 were just putting this together and then we wrote it all down.
00:05:51.560 And I thought like, to me, I was like, oh man, it's going to be, it's nerve wracking,
00:05:55.920 isn't it?
00:05:56.740 So I thought, anyways, we'll go.
00:05:58.260 And I thought, you know, we're being invited.
00:06:00.280 If we was not being invited, it's, it's wrong for us to go there because it's a hostile
00:06:03.920 environment.
00:06:04.580 You know, it's silly to go there and just, you know, provoke, even though us being there
00:06:09.540 might provoke people, but we was invited.
00:06:11.480 So if we're invited and I'm on the list, you know, and there was some YouTube videos
00:06:14.680 by some other people where my name was on the list and I was like, bro, that's official.
00:06:19.120 So me and Hijab, we walk, we went through the other side and then we walked past, it was
00:06:25.300 calm.
00:06:25.600 I thought, you know, just walking past the crowd, we would have not made a life to the
00:06:28.260 other side, but it was okay.
00:06:29.520 Some people were like, oh, that's Ali, that, oh yeah.
00:06:31.080 And I was like, yeah, I'm talking.
00:06:32.000 And, and I was like, okay, I just ignored him.
00:06:33.740 I just walked on.
00:06:34.620 And then one of the security came and he's like, Ali, what are you doing here?
00:06:37.960 I was like, what do you want me to do?
00:06:38.620 I'm invited, you know, it's like being invited to a party.
00:06:41.220 And I said, I'm going to speak.
00:06:44.920 They're like, no, no, you're not.
00:06:45.900 Wait, wait, Ali, Ali, you're not talking today.
00:06:48.960 You're not talking, are you?
00:06:50.880 I spoke to Tommy.
00:06:51.840 Tommy don't know nothing about it, okay?
00:06:54.880 What's that?
00:06:56.860 I was like, yes, I am.
00:06:57.660 And then you've got someone else saying, I think Lucy was there.
00:06:59.640 Lucy was like, no, no, he is, he is.
00:07:01.480 They're just talking to each other.
00:07:03.760 And I started to realise there's an infight happening, you know, there's a definite infight 1.00
00:07:08.080 happening.
00:07:09.020 So they said, wait here.
00:07:10.360 Now, when you're making us wait behind the barriers, that's dangerous to us because we
00:07:15.280 want to be at least in the barriers, yeah?
00:07:17.300 And there's security, even though those security might be with the same people who attacked
00:07:20.440 us rather than protect us.
00:07:22.840 So they said, wait here.
00:07:24.280 We said, okay, we'll wait here.
00:07:25.340 And then we'll wait in, we'll wait in.
00:07:26.600 And we're not hearing nothing.
00:07:27.380 From there onwards, I realised that basically, as far as I know, Tommy was told that basically,
00:07:33.980 this was told to me directly, that if you let him speak, he's not going to leave that
00:07:38.000 stage.
00:07:38.520 Meaning he's going to go up, but he's not going to come down, yeah?
00:07:40.700 And they said to him, basically, you're not allowed to do that.
00:07:45.500 So Tommy, obviously knowing, he had to throw people under the bus.
00:07:49.660 And you can see that they were just, you know, hostile.
00:07:52.020 Everyone was hostile.
00:07:52.700 We were always having debates left, right, centre.
00:07:54.200 They didn't like it, you know, when things were turned back on them.
00:08:12.600 Because I was saying, look, you're calling me a paedophile, yeah?
00:08:15.320 I'm so sorry, like, I'm not trying to be generalised here, but I said, most paedophiles 0.73
00:08:18.340 look like you, you know? 0.74
00:08:19.200 I'm so sorry, middle-aged white men. 0.86
00:08:21.700 I'm not saying all of them, but I said, if you're going to use that on me, and then
00:08:24.640 they didn't like that.
00:08:25.640 So it was getting hostile.
00:08:26.600 It was getting hostile.
00:08:27.960 And, yeah, and then from there onwards, what we saw was that basically, I'm not allowed
00:08:32.560 to come in.
00:08:33.460 Now, that's well and good, but now when you're crowded, they're surrounding us, yeah? 0.68
00:08:37.660 These thugs, they're drunk, they're shouting, abused, they're swearing.
00:08:41.640 Now, how are you going to get out? 0.93
00:08:42.540 You can't get out of there.
00:08:43.320 You know, you go, they're going to follow you.
00:08:44.960 So, yeah, they were just swearing at us.
00:08:48.160 And Lucy just said to us, look, when I say 3, 2, 1,
00:08:51.240 just go.
00:08:52.420 Like, basically, you follow the security guard, and just go.
00:08:54.920 And I said, okay.
00:08:55.460 I told the same to Hijab, and that's exactly what we did. 1.00
00:08:58.500 But what I didn't realize is that as we're going, I'm thinking, okay, Hijab's behind 1.00
00:09:01.260 me, and we're going together.
00:09:02.260 Like, we're just getting out of here.
00:09:03.300 I didn't know that the attack happened behind me, because everyone's shouting anyways.
00:09:08.080 So I went to the other side of the stage, and Hijab was being attacked on this side.
00:09:12.440 And I was just standing there, and I was just thinking, oh my gosh, man, like, I don't
00:09:30.720 know if they have a knife, what were they going to do?
00:09:32.660 But thank God the officers came and surrounded me and took me, you know?
00:09:37.040 Yeah, and that's what happened.
00:09:38.160 And it's a crazy story, because I can confirm you were invited right up until the moment
00:09:43.080 that you turned up.
00:09:43.860 You were on the list.
00:09:45.240 We really, really pushed for it.
00:09:47.100 I mean, for so long, people like Tommy have constantly pushed that the left are the real
00:09:51.720 violent ones.
00:09:52.920 It's Islamists. 1.00
00:09:54.000 It's communists.
00:09:54.900 It's Antifa.
00:09:55.400 And it...