TOP QURANIST VS ALI DAWAH - FULL DEBATE
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Summary
Jummah Kutbahayah: How did the quran come to be? How did it come to us? How was it propagated by the prophets What was the role of the prophet and how did it came to us Is this an interrogation or a discussion?
Transcript
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propagation dhikr look the dhikr is the kitab of allah the proper
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my friend my friend are you telling me if okay if the sahaba did not propagate it would the quran
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be preserved yes how because it would literally stay in the same condition that it came in because
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the prophet wrote it down how how how look there's no sahaba the prophet man the revelation came down
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there was no sahaba how would the quran be preserved and come to us listen it's if the people didn't
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brothers and sisters it is the winter season in the uk today in my house my boiler broke and the
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house was freezing cold my kids are wearing jackets i'm trying to find heating and as a father i'm
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trying to make sure my kids my wife are warm imagine people around the world i'm working with one of my
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brothers is 100 donation policy charity who are helping syria lebanon and afghanistan people who
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are freezing to death intense brothers and sisters donate whatever you can because today's experience
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with me showed me subhanallah how vulnerable we are and just made me remember those people who are
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in need whatever you donate guys even if it is one pound help those people in those countries
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listen to me mohammed mohammed listen to me yeah is that an interrogation or a discussion no no no
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mohammed we we said very clearly we're going to ask you one simple question one simple question if
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someone said to me how did you come here today and i go one second one second maybe let me explain
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you from the beginning brother how it's not from the beginning you want me to you want me to quote
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some people i don't believe in no no no no you're being like the christians you're like you're being
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like the christians it's very simple so the people who give in the book and the ummy
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you and there's your juxtaposition by god himself and that you know um to the kitab
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you don't take from the facility no problem okay i'm asking a simple question and i will ask you
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because if i'll be honest with you to me it seems that i'll be honest with you look i'm an expert on
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this i don't know this topic i will not even talk to a quranist yeah there's only one thing you're
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talking to one right no no i know you know why because there's only one thing i'm really confident
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about and it is this question which is what otherwise you know i'm a guy but you never let
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us answer you're going to say how the quran came to you but you never let us finish the answer you
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you interrupted me three times i you're waiting for you're waiting for an answer you want i have
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an answer that's different than yours you have to hear my answer and then you can try to take shots
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you're not qualified to give to give no he's not qualified to give exegesis
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i don't but as if you as if as if the exegesis that came from your side is qualified to explain
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the quran when it's it's wrong and contradictory mohammed okay let's forget about exegesis for a
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second can i look i i believe i'm a layman i'm alini's dawah i'm a layman i'm not a student of
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knowledge i wouldn't even call myself a da'i i'm a youtuber i'm a simple youtuber muslim who does his
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basic that's what honesty is good that's what i am that's what i am i don't need to make myself something
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i don't think i'm not i do okay right let me finish uh i confront the far right i do be a
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nasiyah i do a dawah to the non-muslims i love my name i'm on the hard shoulder yeah the hard
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shoulder is yeah okay i'm asking you a simple question because i believe this question intellectually
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knocks you out how did the oran come to me how did it come to us the prophet wrote it down and people
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propagated it okay the prophet wrote it down the process cannot read or write so the process
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according to who okay no problem let's go with it you have hadith you have hadith can i can i
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okay okay surah al-a'raf surah al-a'raf allathina yettabi'una rasoola nabiyya
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al-ummiya al-ladiya jidunahu maktuban indahun fi tawrati wal-injid
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unlettered unlearned unlearned unlearned unlearned unlearned no no but let me prove the point you ask a
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question and then you don't let me speak this is this is really weird this is really weird this is
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an interrogation this is not a discussion this is how you guys don't show your civil side for us to
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have a proper good discussion it's not fair you're doing what mohammed the hijab does you just say
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mohammed mohammed mohammed you don't let me listen or you don't let me answer you don't listen
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no i follow i follow the prophet your your name is ali you your name is ali and you follow abu huraira so
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maybe you should name your change your name to abu huraira you're taking shots at my name when you
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said you don't want adhan minutes yeah don't you wait wait what didn't is it in your hadith that
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allah chose my name like abu huraira i mean i mean okay so one more time yeah did it didn't allah
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didn't allah give me the name mohammed according to your hadith he said to me the process and wrote
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it down i'm gonna i'm gonna go with that for the same argument so the process it down and now
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the the propagation is whoever wanted to uh work in the way of god so there was propagation but
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it's not preservation the preservation was with god okay so how did yeah so how did the quran get
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preserved by god and his messenger okay how done but i would like to explain the position when god
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clearly no let me i already answered you i already answered you i already answered you
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ali god and his messenger yeah oh i got i got i got my quran i got my quran from fedex driver
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i got i got my quran from a fedex driver should i take his hadith i'm a layman mohammed you can
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quote quran ayah i can't even i got i got my quran from fedex delivery mohammed can you quote the quran
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yeah yeah some of it okay okay so why are you debating me if you don't know the quran you're
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calling me a quranist and you don't know the quran why are you here and that's my point you just
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made my point for me you are okay why are you debating me if you clearly don't know i haven't
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even finished two you know you are not debating i haven't even finished two sentences okay i'm saying
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to you you are you can call the quran in arabic this stuff okay i don't even have i can't read the
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the quran etc i can i've got it from memory as well as well not all of it but i'm saying someone
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like me the reason i've brought the camera to me is to show people people look at me and go ali
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is not advanced for this topic i'm even showing you that even i can ask you a question you cannot
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answer now i just answered it but you're not you're not you're not letting me explain the answer
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because you are a person who wants to just justify your scholars not god the word of god for you
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is circular reasoning how did the quran get preserved by god and his messengers done
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one second ali ali one second one second we both know that the hadith and the quran were not
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preserved in the same manner there is no weak verse or sahih verse or hassan verse that's all correct
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one two one two two okay one second yeah so so when god when god says in the quran that when people
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used to hear the quran they believed that it's true they knew from it it's from god so now when
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we're hearing the quran we know it's the truth from god and now god within this book the content
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itself is telling us he's preserving the remembrance so now you want me to doubt it or or wait one second
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we both know that the preservation is a miracle just like how jesus is birthed is a miracle so you're
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telling me prove to me how jesus has no father this is the same question you asked me prove to me how
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that quran stayed preserved not how did it get preserved we know how it got preserved by god you're
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saying how did it stay preserved that's the miracle like you're saying how to america how did moses
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how did moses split the sea i'm waiting for you tell me how moses split the sea okay what the what
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what moses miracles miracles was a supernatural thing the quran is also its preservation can be
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supernatural it is supernatural as well can be or it is it is it is correct but i'm telling you okay
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how once i listen to you i'm asking the question again you're not answering i said to you
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how was it preserved for example moses split in the sea it's a supernatural event that's happening
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the quran's preservation it's a promise from allah subhanahu wa ta'ala which is a miracle
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but i'm seeing how did that preservation happen because there's a methodology to it you accepted
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and said the hadith and the quran the way it was narrated was different of course the quran is
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now i'm asking a simple question i said to you how did the quran come to us and how was it preserved
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the first one you accepted which is that the process and they propagated it propagation is the following
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but you missed you missed you missed you missed something the prophet preserved it he's he wrote
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it why are you stopping me look let me finish propagation is the following i'm going to propagate
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now that my apple juice that i make is the best apple juice i'm going to go tomorrow and tell
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everybody brothers ladies and gentlemen i want to say that this apple juice i have here is the best
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apple juice you would ever have in your life i'm propagating it now those people are going to be asked
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what did you do today oh i was instructed today in the shopping center and a gentleman you know you
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know it was quite handsome gentleman i mean let's you know chef you know it was propagating like apple
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juice was the best apple juice and now they're going to go and tell somebody else it's going to
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tell somebody else they're going to tell somebody else now it will be a mass conspiracy to come and say
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we've got a thousand people saying and the news coverage they're like okay who's this man complaining
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saying that his apple juice the best apple juice now it will be a mass conspiracy to come and say all of
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those people that said they witnessed ali saying was a mass conspiracy they came together and lie
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you said propagation now that if that is the case that means when the process came and said
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bismillahirrahmanirrahim alhamdulillahi rabbil alameen arrahmanirrahim maliki yawmiddin
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iyyaka na'budu wa iyyaka nasta'in ihtira sirata al-mustaqeem sirata al-lazina an-amta alayhim
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qayri al-maktoubi alayhim wala al-dhalim ameen people heard this okay now the sahaba do you accept there was
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a sahaba that lived of course there's people around the prophet here once again the sahaba heard this now
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hundreds heard it thousands heard it it became a tawati now they go and tell the tabi and the tabi tabi
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and it all the way comes back to us these are presumptions it comes back to us unless you come
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to come and say this is a mass conspiracy now if you accept you accept the quran was preserved like
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this yes or no no i preserve the quran was preserved by the hand of the prophet himself and
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the people propagated you even have hadith in your own books that state that do not take the
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or listen listen let me say let me answer there's a difference between propagation and preservation
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okay something preserved and someone propagating is different now the way you said how it was
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preserved uh preserved not how it was propagated the propagation is for no people they strive in the
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way of god now if someone is telling me a hadith in your books that the prophet ordered not to take
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copies of the quran to hostile territories that means it was written down because it's not like they're
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going to surgically remove it from their brain and by the way the longest surah on the longest verse
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in the quran is the one in surah baqarah in regards to writing debts so are you telling me the people
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around the prophets were hearing that they have to write down debts but they would not write down the
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quran okay would you do you accept that propagation is preservation no no it's not tell me can you can
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tell me how propagation is not preservation if that's the case how do i have the quran in my hand today
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well the preservation factor is the miracle from god what propagation is copy paste
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okay one second allah said he would preserve the kitab you said i said to you propagation
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preserve the zikr the zikr one second one second propagation dhikr look the dhikr is the kitab of
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allah the propagation my friend my friend are you telling me if okay if the sahaba did not propagate it
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would the quran be preserved yes how because it would literally stay in the same condition that
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it came in because the prophet wrote it down how how how look there's no sahaba sahaba doesn't exist
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the prophet mahmad peace be upon him okay then the revelation came down the revelation came down there
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were no sahaba how would the quran be preserved and come to work listen it's if it's if the people
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didn't one second if the people didn't do the work then the quran wouldn't come to you you're right
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but that does not necessitate that they preserved it no i'm telling you about propagation people worked
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it no no no let me finish because you think you got me in a catch but you're not listening the
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problem is you're not listening let me finish let me finish the point let me finish the point okay
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what i'm saying is that god knew that the people will be working in the way of god as god clearly
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states in the quran okay well he didn't say now i want to take you to a very simple thing very
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simple easy thing if you're claiming that if it's oh sure sure sure uh uh if we if we go to a very
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simple verse where you guys keep claiming that the hadith and the quran go hand in hand in unison
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and the hadith is the hikmah right and the quran here that's the book of god so is the quran
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is is the hadith and obviously the rasul can uh abrogate the word of god but let's go to the
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verse in chapter two when glad says uh why is it why is it singular not so it's not two things it's
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one thing because both of them are revelation from allah i asked you a question yeah look i said to
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you if i need to look look this is this is a debate question you're confusing preservation and
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propagation i can't i can't hear you people are talking i can't hear you
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guys guys okay okay now i repeat again i asked you a simple question two questions how the quran
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came forth and how it was preserved i said to you propagation is preservation you didn't answer
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but that doesn't make sense let's let's look up the word propagation what it means it does not mean
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preservation no my friend my friend one second simple question no i'm propagating a preserved book
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doesn't mean i preserved it it's not a part of proper i did answer you you're just defining words as
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you want the fact that you couldn't answer me a youtuber a simple day-to-day muslim i asked you a
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simple question the quran is revealed to the person there is no sahaba how will the quran come to me
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today so i'm i'm looking i'm looking at the definition of propagation it has nothing to do with
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preservation let's read the definition of propagation the action yes the action of widely
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spreading and promoting an idea theory a life devoted to the propagation of the catholic faith
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so is that this is the example of promoting an idea or a theory good can you read the example can
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you read the example that they put can read the example a life devoted to the propagation of the catholic
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faith yeah the catholic faith is preserved according to your definition the catholic faith
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is the uh preserved they're propagating a false idea oh actually he's giving an example thank you very
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much yes yes so the catholic faith according to your definition means that it's been preserved that
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then now you're saying that jesus is the son of god and he died for your sins good job bro you you just
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you just embarrassed yourself with the definition now we're going to see who actually got embarrassed
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you know they say that the one who laughs the last laughs the best you're the ones laughing the whole
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day i'm gonna laugh on the day of judgment when god shows you that the quran is sufficient
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thank you that was emotional you touched my heart now no it wasn't it wasn't it wasn't it wasn't
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uh yeah i'm debating two and a half men because you called me a half man would beat me i'm debating
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the half man can i look listen listen i i'm i'm the half man here and you're getting finished
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yeah you're not okay yeah yeah according to you the catholic faith is preserved because it's been
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propagated can i can i can i reply of course it is the catholic faith is preserved so that means what
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they're saying is truth can i can i reply can i reply thank you thank you so now this is the last
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laugh here this is giving you an example of how you could use that and it gave the example of
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christianity could have been judaism it could have been hinduism it could have been islam
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do you see what i mean so don't laugh too early but but but let's talk let's talk about the word
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propagation when someone's propagating he can propagate falsehood and manipulate it it's still
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propagation now i know yeah no no no you're just running away from the quran
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i'm going to the quran the wahi has come down there is no sahaba how did the quran come to us
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well if you want to talk about theoretical questions then it's the same thing that can be applied to the
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hadith the simple question the simple answer is that the prophet wrote it down and because people
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embraced islam because of the truth from god because the content of the book so when people
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heard the quran when the prophet was talking when he was reciting the quran people will say this is
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the truth they didn't have an isnad they didn't have proof the only proof that they had was the
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content of the book so the content of the book is what drives people to islam you know this very well
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when you're doing dawah you give a free copy of the quran because if you gave them nine books of
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bukhari the person will go through a hundred walls and they have to accept this falsehood for them to
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accept your religion the quran is pure and simple so when the quran is saying that itself has been
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preserved by god that's not circular reason i follow the prophet and i use the quran as a criterion and
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as a judge between people so when i when i quote the quran i'm quoting the word of god that is the final
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quote the word there is no circular reason god is telling me he preserved the book so i'm reading a
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book that's preserved it's very simple i don't know why you're asking a disbeliever question if
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an atheist comes to me and he tells me how do you know the book is from god i'm not going to say
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because of this magic is nad i'm going to say because of the content the way that god is being
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described the way that your relationship has to be with god the way that your relationship has to be
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with your parents and the way that you're supposed to approach the your life is very extremely well
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detailed in the quran it's teaching you a psyche a psychology to teach to uh to react with other
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disbelievers and mushriks and to act with the believers it's very simple the book is simple
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you guys make it very complicated all right guys i just want to tell you guys that you can order a
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guided pray about for free inshallah learn how to pray salah with uh getting some donations inshallah
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you can donate uh towards the project we'll teach you people how to pray salah how to do wudu
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uh how to memorize the quran inshallah um so i just felt i just sorry i had to add that there quickly
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and we're doing a fundraiser but i just felt like me asking a christian about the trinity and then he
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gives me a sermon you literally gave me a sermon about you know being able to mothers one second
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one second let me finish bro one second man i listened to you i listened to i didn't interrupt
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you i asked you one simple question and the more i ask a simple it's like look if i go to somewhere
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and say did you steal the cookie from the cookie jar and they go yeah but you know what happened to my
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life and i was going there my mom hurt me and then yeah i'm asking a simple question and i'll ask again
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how did the quran get preserved the prophet wrote it where's the next story
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look i've been respected i didn't call your name look nothing you you call me a half a man i accept
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i'm a half a man call me a kutaman i'm a kutaman you you're insulting me before i came on listen listen
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listen okay okay now i'm asking a simple question as you want the prophet allah subhanahu wa ta'ala sends
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wahi to the prophet muhammad and i'm going to ask you this for the last time
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sheikh you know what from now on i can debate quranists i'm confident because he is there
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what if if i told i'm not trying to say i'm arrogant mohammed one second mohammed the wahi
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sent down to the prophet muhammad how and there's no sahaba how did the wahi the quran's
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preservation reach us buddy if there is no sahaba if there's no sahaba then he's not a messenger do you
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understand that if nobody if nobody if no if nobody believed the messenger then he's not a messenger
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that's the point no no no no no problem you're making you're making a fear you're asking you're
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asking wallahi wallahi this guy is asking listen listen this guy is asking can god create a rock
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he can't carry this guy just clearly states he clearly just asked can god create a rock he can't
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carry can a messenger be sent to nobody believe him perfect you just accepted that there has to be
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someone he came to but he revealed or and to that can preserve and he wrote it down that's the
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preservation i'd spare the quran which i've heard you let me speak now he just okay brother i'm i'm
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propagating the quran will you take my hadith i'm propagating the quran will you i'm propagating
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quran will you take my hadith listen listen the fedex the fedex guy he's he's giving me a copy of
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the quran should i take his hadith now what are you doing you're now interrupting me you know why
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because you know you because no i didn't get caught wallahi this is so easy for anyone with logic with
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anyone with logic you're asking you're asking kufur why are you interrupting a quota man let the quota
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man says quota no because because i actually want to talk about the quran let me speak look i'm gonna give
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you another three minutes can we talk can we talk about the quran or you just want to talk about how
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the prophet wrote it down i know you're no you're not from your body language you're you're habibi
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no no no it's not it's it's not uncomfortable it's stupid i'm telling you i want to talk about
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what's inside the quran you want to talk about history i have to no you haven't let me ask a
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question or are you interrogating me i did answer your question listen i did answer your question
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exactly i did answer your question but you don't like my answer let me speak now you admitted i
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asked you and said number one how did the quran come to us you didn't know that how was it preserved
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you said for example that i told you the fedex driver gave it to me how did i ignore it let me
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finish my friend you don't even have a fedex driver because you're saying there was nobody there
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then you came and said i said if you're saying how did it came to me if the wahi came down i said and
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there was no people how would it come because you're talking about a miraculous way it would be
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preserved with no people the prophet ma'am gets the revelation then you said oh no i can't get out
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of you you're confusing you're confusing propagation you're confusing propagation and preservation
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i answered these but i answered it you're going in a circle let me finish and then you can talk if
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you are confident about your position i listen to you i'm like okay let me hear him out okay you are
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keep interrupting me which means you are uncomfortable that's why you're moving around because you're doing
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this uh exercise uh shoulder stretches uh this that you're uncomfortable your body language you
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you know the right you know the right go ahead okay good i said to you the wahi was revealed the
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first two process because you're talking about miracles miracle okay there is nobody how did it come
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to us what did he say he changed it and then he said there could be no messenger if there's no one to
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give the message to which means that if the message has to be given and propagated to somebody
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and that means what that there has to be people that it was revealed the told to that what did
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those people do did they keep it to their self no it's the quran you want to share it me i love
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talking about the quran i want to share it with people propagated then what does that mean propagation
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is preservation so the question no let me let me answer it let me answer oh my god and did the quran
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come to us how did the quran come to us please answer this okay so so you may you may you made a fallacy
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here because obviously the torah the gospel and the psalms they were also books from god that people
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also propagated but it failed preservation and it's the exact same thing with your hadith the reason why
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the quran is different because it's literally a miracle there's absolutely no book in history that
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can take the exact same love and care that the quran did because it's outside of the people's hands
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propagation is not preservation propagation is propagating what you have but people have
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manipulated the other books of god but this is the problem with you people you ask questions and
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then you don't hear the answer you don't listen and you keep going around in circles i wanted to
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talk about the content of the quran how the quran proves that it's sufficient you want to talk
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about history and theoretical questions to prove credences to people that i i will not be questioned
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about is the quran here yes it is how did it get here is irrelevant what i need to do is follow the quran
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yeah so one second one second one second one second you took my confidence with the quran is from
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this to this no sheikh answer what does the word ma'jiza mean guys he said how the quran came
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oh you see sheikh sheikh why don't you answer the question what does ma'jiza mean something that
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cannot be explained right no no no no you're you're an idiot because you're you're not letting me speak
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the quran is about the content do you understand what that means god is not going to ask me who's
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the fourth person in the line do you believe in the last two verses of surat tauva of course
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you believe in them yeah yeah uh the falsehood does not come between its hand or behind it so
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there's no there's no how do you know where the qibla is how do i know the qibla is because god clearly
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states in surat just like how in chapter 29 well just one second let me finish let me finish
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let me finish let me finish let me finish let me finish let me finish this guy does
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yeah yeah that's it that's perfect so god says in chapter 29
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so recite what has been revealed to you and perform the prayer and god is saying to musa
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I'm going to keep speaking, because it does not necessitate for you to face Nebka.
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You don't know what the meaning of Qibla means.
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I'm not telling you to make your house Qibla, you weirdos.
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You guys are inviting me to associate to God what I don't have knowledge in.
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But you guys have a very big problem with the Qur'an being sufficient.
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So do you get revenge from us because we believe in God and what has been revealed to you and what has been revealed to us?
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Do you really think we're Kafir because we believe in the Qur'an?
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You think we're Kafir because we want to defend...
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You know, you are going to be famous for saying that it's not relevant for us to know how the Qur'an is written to us.
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No, I'm telling you, I said it a million times that the Kafir wrote it down.
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I ask Allah to guide you to give me confidence for the Ba'at of Qur'an.
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I mean, on camera, I am running away from an aql like yours.
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Okay, in my country, they say, my friend, away from me, close to Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala, but even that subhanahu wa ta'ala.