America First - Nicholas J. Fuentes - American Identitarianism feat. Patrick Casey | America First Ep. 213

00:00:02.000 Good evening, everybody.

00:00:03.000 You're watching America First.

00:00:05.000 My name is Nicholas J. Fuentes.

00:00:06.000 We've got a great show for you tonight.

00:00:09.000 Joining us this evening, we have a very special guest.

00:00:12.000 He is the leader of Identity Europa and a good personal friend of mine, Mr. Patrick Casey.

00:00:18.000 How are you doing tonight?

00:00:20.000 Thank you for inviting me onto your show.

00:00:20.000 Hey, I'm doing well, Nick.

00:00:23.000 Yeah, thanks for being here.

00:00:24.000 You know, you've been in the news this week, it's been very exciting.

00:00:28.000 And I've been watching your leadership of Identity Europa, and I know there was some.

00:00:34.000 Turmoil in the beginning of last year, or almost exactly a year ago after Charlottesville.

00:00:40.000 But I have to say, I think you've really turned things around because we've seen a lot of great activism this year.

00:00:46.000 I think just a lot of great management in general.

00:00:48.000 And I think to top it off, and this is the reason I wanted to get you on the show, this, your latest activism, the two demonstrations in New York City, a banner drop and the demonstration in front of the Mexican consulate.

00:01:02.000 I mean, just excellent work.

00:01:03.000 And we saw.

00:01:04.000 There was some reaction from the Mexican government as well.

00:01:07.000 And so I just wanted to really congratulate you.

00:01:10.000 I know a lot of people have seen what's been going on for the past year, and I think they're very excited about it.

00:01:15.000 People tell me all the time that it's really great stuff.

00:01:19.000 And so we just wanted to say thanks and good job.

00:01:21.000 I mean, you're really doing well out there.

00:01:25.000 Well, it's high praise, Nick, and thank you for the kind words.

00:01:28.000 Yeah, absolutely.

00:01:28.000 And so I kind of wanted to get into that a little bit.

00:01:30.000 Just tell us about what happened in New York City this weekend.

00:01:34.000 I mean, I know I mentioned it just a moment ago.

00:01:36.000 You guys did the banner drop and you also did the protest in front of the Mexican embassy as well.

00:01:43.000 Just tell us a little bit about what happened.

00:01:43.000 Is that correct?

00:01:46.000 Sure.

00:01:47.000 Well, we basically had a very action packed weekend.

00:01:49.000 Everyone arrived at the house that we were staying at on Friday.

00:01:53.000 I think it was Friday evening.

00:01:55.000 And so we were hanging out.

00:01:56.000 We had dinner.

00:01:57.000 We kind of went over the game plan for Saturday and then everyone got some sleep.

00:02:01.000 Saturday, we woke up and went through a dry run of the first demonstration, which was the consulate demonstration.

00:02:07.000 So then everyone got in their cars, drove from the house into the city, and we arrived.

00:02:13.000 We met up at a park in New York, in NYC, about 15 minutes away on foot from the consulate, and we all walked there.

00:02:23.000 And pretty much as soon as we arrived there, we just went into formation.

00:02:27.000 You know, we had one of our members create a bunch of, I think there were four feet tall letters, as you saw, that spelled out build the wall.

00:02:35.000 And everyone holding one of these letters was wearing a construction uniform, right?

00:02:39.000 So we wanted to make it a little fun.

00:02:41.000 Obviously, The things that we discuss and the things that the organization is concerned with are very serious, but I think that having a sense of humor and a sense of levity helps to not make you look like total cranks and weirdos, right?

00:02:54.000 I think that's, you know, previous nationalist movements in America and elsewhere have definitely suffered from, you know, looking like cranks and weirdos.

00:03:00.000 And honestly, many nationalist things going on in America now totally have that issue.

00:03:06.000 But anyway, so we arrived there, we had a bunch of people holding up, you know, these letters that said, build the wall.

00:03:12.000 And we just proceeded to go into about a five to 10 minute demonstration.

00:03:17.000 I wasn't really keeping track of the time, but I gave a speech.

00:03:20.000 We had three different chants that we did throughout the speech.

00:03:22.000 The first one was Make America Great Again.

00:03:25.000 The second one was Build the Wall.

00:03:26.000 And the third one was No, sorry.

00:03:30.000 First was America First.

00:03:31.000 Second was Build the Wall.

00:03:32.000 Third was Make America Great Again.

00:03:34.000 So obviously, very Trumpian.

00:03:36.000 I know that's something that you're pretty big on, too.

00:03:38.000 Since I've taken over, I've wanted to take us, I've wanted us to be, Identitarian, but I also want us to be an identitarian in a way that is palatable to your average white Trump supporter, because that's kind of the demographic that we're going for.

00:03:51.000 So the demonstration was really high energy.

00:03:53.000 Just being there was doing any kind of activism when you have 50 to 60 people shouting these chants.

00:04:00.000 It feels really powerful.

00:04:02.000 It was a great time.

00:04:03.000 We had a few hecklers.

00:04:04.000 We had one really low energy guy holding up a Stalin book, telling, you know, we talked to him afterwards and he told me that Bernie's still going to win.

00:04:12.000 Bernie's going to win.

00:04:13.000 So our days are numbered.

00:04:15.000 Trump better hurry.

00:04:16.000 He gets, you know, all of his policy goals done because Bernie's just going to clean up shop in 2020.

00:04:23.000 We had another guy on the other side of the street who was swearing at us.

00:04:28.000 He was giving us the finger, told us to go get laid.

00:04:30.000 You know, these things, it's all very, very juvenile.

00:04:33.000 Right.

00:04:34.000 But we did have some supporters, right?

00:04:35.000 There were some MAGA moms, I guess, that walked by when we were doing the build the wall chant.

00:04:40.000 And they were kind of pumping their fists along as we did it.

00:04:44.000 And I missed this part, but everyone told me that there was an Uber driver who was holding up traffic to give us the thumbs up.

00:04:51.000 And he was honking this one.

00:04:53.000 So this guy's probably.

00:04:55.000 Dealing with who knows what as an Uber driver in New York City.

00:04:58.000 And, you know, I think we brightened his day.

00:05:00.000 So that's definitely a good thing.

00:05:02.000 So we ended up going back to the house, going back to our home base.

00:05:06.000 And then we, you know, had lunch.

00:05:07.000 Everyone hung out.

00:05:08.000 Then we went out for the second action.

00:05:11.000 And I actually had it wrong.

00:05:12.000 I thought the first action would be the hardest and the most challenging.

00:05:15.000 But it turns out that the second one was definitely a little more tense.

00:05:18.000 And I'll go into why in a minute here.

00:05:20.000 So we went to Fort Trine Park.

00:05:22.000 Everyone, you know, congregated there.

00:05:25.000 And I think the main issue was that.

00:05:27.000 From getting from the parking lot to the drop location was about a 15 minute walk.

00:05:33.000 And, you know, it'd be one thing if we were just, it was just five people walking.

00:05:37.000 That's obviously pretty inconspicuous.

00:05:39.000 But when you have a crowd of like 60 to 70 people and it's like 90% male, right?

00:05:44.000 And everyone's fit, people wearing Trump hats, that really sticks out.

00:05:47.000 And by the way, being in New York City, I stayed a few extra days.

00:05:51.000 We stayed in Brooklyn, went into the city just to kind of see the sights.

00:05:54.000 We had five people in that group and we still stuck out. 0.68

00:05:57.000 We were just kind of at the point where if there was like a group of white people in one of these major cities, it's people are just like, You know, you don't see it.

00:06:03.000 You don't see it that often.

00:06:04.000 But so we're walking through Fort Trine Park.

00:06:06.000 We had 20 people carrying this enormous banner.

00:06:10.000 And yeah, we came around the corner and there was a black Israelite meetup.

00:06:13.000 Oh, wow. 0.86

00:06:15.000 Whoops.

00:06:16.000 And yeah, it's, you know, the simulation managers decided to throw one at us. 1.00

00:06:21.000 But we, you know, my guys are trained enough to not say anything stupid. 0.99

00:06:24.000 I'm sure we could have gotten into some dumb altercation. 0.96

00:06:27.000 The way I was talking to IE members afterwards is that, you know, there are all of these black Israelites compilations on YouTube where they like get into fights with people and, And it's just, and I just wanted to make sure we didn't end up in one of these compilations. 0.95

00:06:40.000 Um, we didn't, they just ignored us as we walked by, so we ended up going up there.

00:06:43.000 We dropped the banner.

00:06:44.000 Um, we don't like to any demonstrations unless we're like right by a road for obvious reasons.

00:06:52.000 It just makes it look cool, it kind of makes it look a bit more theatrical as well.

00:06:56.000 And um, the place at Fort Trine Park where we dropped the banner was uh separated by a row of bushes, so the people that were at the park saw us walk behind the bushes and they kind of knew something was going on.

00:07:08.000 We had a few people heckle us, nothing really that we were concerned with. 0.83

00:07:11.000 But I was told by people who we had a few of our guys on the other side of the bushes just to keep track of what was going on, seeing if anyone was going to try to do something stupid. 0.99

00:07:20.000 Right.

00:07:21.000 And they apparently, when we detonated these smoke flares, and they were green smoke flares, people on the other side thought that we were detonating poison gas.

00:07:29.000 They thought it was a terrorist attack.

00:07:31.000 They thought we were getting gas, but obviously we weren't.

00:07:33.000 So they called the cops.

00:07:35.000 Cops ended up showing up after we had already left.

00:07:37.000 And when we told them we were just doing, we were like, oh, we're a Patriot group, we're nationalists, we were just doing.

00:07:43.000 An anti illegal immigration demonstration.

00:07:44.000 They're like, oh, that's awesome. 1.00

00:07:46.000 Oh, wow.

00:07:47.000 Yeah, they said if you want to, and if you decide to do this again, just give us a call and we'll come by and make sure no one messes with you.

00:07:54.000 Wow, really?

00:07:55.000 Yeah.

00:07:55.000 Wow.

00:07:56.000 Yeah.

00:07:58.000 Identity Europa, we're identitarians, so that's obviously a bit more controversial than, say, if we were just a normal Patriot or Magapete group or whatever.

00:08:07.000 So perhaps if they really knew what we were about, they would maybe not agree as much.

00:08:11.000 But the point being is that if you present well and just kind of toss away some of the more esoteric, weird ideas that.

00:08:19.000 The average right wing conservative person can get behind it at least to some extent.

00:08:23.000 And at the very least, they understand that you're not these boogeymen that the SPLC and the ADL would like people to believe us to be.

00:08:32.000 But yeah, we had one minor issue with the banner drop, and that was that it got hooked on a tree in the corner.

00:08:40.000 I don't think the demonstration would have had any different effect if that minor thing hadn't happened.

00:08:46.000 But we're perfectionists and we always want to make sure that everything goes perfectly.

00:08:51.000 And it rarely does, but it's always a learning process.

00:08:55.000 So that's a pretty good overview of everything that happened.

00:08:58.000 I think people are probably mostly aware of the fact that it was condemned by a city, a New York City council member.

00:09:07.000 It was condemned by, I believe, a congressman too.

00:09:10.000 And then it was condemned by the Mexican government.

00:09:12.000 So if these are the people that we are irritating and annoying with our activism, then I think we're definitely doing something right.

00:09:19.000 Absolutely.

00:09:20.000 Well, and everything about that, I think, is.

00:09:23.000 So refreshing to hear because I think what we saw with a lot of the activism last year and some of the initial phases after the Trump election was people making it harder on themselves, people making and erecting obstacles that didn't need to exist between us and your average right wing conservative white person, erecting obstacles that shouldn't exist with the police or getting in fights with people or bringing on people who are unruly.

00:09:52.000 And so I'm just listening to that story, and just every step of the way, I'm thinking this is so great to hear because that's the way it's supposed to be done.

00:10:00.000 I mean, for starters, I think what I really like is when you talk about having it be a little bit tongue in cheek with the construction uniforms and you got these fun big letters.

00:10:11.000 That's really great because, I mean, that's exactly what Donald Trump used to carry a lot of young people over to the right wing movement.

00:10:18.000 I mean, how many of us got involved because of funny things we saw on the internet or funny people we like on YouTube or something like that?

00:10:26.000 And so it's really great to hear just every step of the way.

00:10:29.000 There's obviously a thought process here on your part that you are thinking through how can we craft a message in such a way and how can we present ourselves and even operationally?

00:10:41.000 What are the things that we can do?

00:10:42.000 What steps can we take to make sure that these demonstrations are having an effect and they go off without a hitch?

00:10:48.000 And so it's just really great because I saw that the letter from the Mexican embassy or rather from the Mexican government and the condemnations by the politicians.

00:10:57.000 And I think what you've shown is that you can have.

00:11:01.000 A demonstration that is controversial and it attracts media attention and it gets your name out there, but at the same time, that doesn't get you completely ruined and blacklisted.

00:11:11.000 And maybe it already does because it's Trump in New York City, but it's not something that would turn away a normal conservative person.

00:11:19.000 Like you said, you got the MAGA moms, you got the Uber driver who I am hoping that's not Patrick Little, right?

00:11:26.000 We got to see if he was in New York City that day, but I mean, you're getting regular passerby.

00:11:30.000 He's off jaywalking somewhere else, I think.

00:11:33.000 That's, yeah, he was probably jaywalking that day in Skokie, right?

00:11:36.000 So, but I mean, really, I love what you guys are doing because it's so.

00:11:41.000 I really think you, in particular, and I think many people horizontally across this movement over the year or the last year have learned the lessons of the shortcomings and maybe some of the not so good things and are putting it to good use.

00:11:56.000 I mean, do you feel like what you're doing in these demonstrations has had a bigger effect?

00:12:02.000 Do you feel like the extra steps and the extra thought, do you feel like that is going farther?

00:12:08.000 Yeah, absolutely.

00:12:09.000 I think that the more planning, the better, generally.

00:12:12.000 And I think that we learned quite a bit in 2017.

00:12:15.000 I think that most people, we do have the occasional person that comes over from the left and has a left wing activist background, but doing right wing activism, doing nationalist activism is an entirely different game.

00:12:28.000 So I think a lot of the chaos that defined 2017, particularly with the Charlottesville rally, was the result of us being kind of green, of the alt right being a little green when it comes to activism.

00:12:40.000 But we've learned quite a bit.

00:12:42.000 And obviously, ultimately, Charlottesville, what happened there is the blame lays on the feet of the city council, the police department, and so forth.

00:12:52.000 But all I'm just saying is, in general, I think we have learned as an organization quite a bit.

00:12:57.000 We've learned from our own failures, our own successes, and also the failures and successes of others as well.

00:13:03.000 And I think the people that want to keep replicating kind of the Charlottesville model, which is you say, hey, Antifa, we're going to be at this park in three months.

00:13:13.000 And you tell your guys to bring shields, so forth.

00:13:15.000 We didn't tell our people to bring shields at Charlottesville, but some of these other groups might be doing that.

00:13:20.000 And you just get ready for a brawl, right?

00:13:24.000 Well, you go out there, you might get your head cracked open by some guy with a hammer.

00:13:29.000 And what are you going to do when you have to call out of work?

00:13:32.000 People have gotten doxxed for things like this.

00:13:35.000 But also at the same time, if you end up beating up that guy who's this lunatic that's waving a hammer at you when you're just trying to do a demonstration, well, If that person's a minority, then all of a sudden you're going to be, you know, the media is going to put the obvious spin on it.

00:13:47.000 There are people who attended Charlottesville who are, I think they've been convicted and they're going to be in prison for like 10 years for beating up DeAndre Harris, who was the obvious aggressor there.

00:13:57.000 So, I mean, if people want to charge into artillery fire and talk themselves up like they're really heroic for doing it, that's fine.

00:14:04.000 But I think what we've seen is that that is not a sustainable way to do things.

00:14:09.000 And also, we're not, you know, we're not X number of fistfights away from like the ethnostate or defeating globalism.

00:14:15.000 So we just have to, I think, in a Senate Europa, we've reassessed what we want to accomplish, how we want to get there.

00:14:25.000 And I think everything that you're seeing now is a result of that.

00:14:28.000 Definitely.

00:14:29.000 Well, and that's so true about the sustainability.

00:14:32.000 Those are some of my biggest criticisms right after the rally, we saw Charlottesville, and I agree with you.

00:14:38.000 It's an important distinction to make because we were both there, and obviously IE was there.

00:14:44.000 And we were perhaps more of the benign elements, I'm sure, than some of the others.

00:14:50.000 Certainly, some people that may or may not have been driving at that event.

00:14:54.000 I think it's an important distinction to make that that was ultimately at the feet of the city council.

00:15:00.000 And that was a point that I've been making since then because people to this day will hang that over my head as you went to that Nazi rally or whatever.

00:15:08.000 But it is so important to maintain we had a right to be there, we had our permit.

00:15:12.000 Now, by the same token, we have to acknowledge that even though it was technically the fault of the city council and they were abridging our constitutional rights.

00:15:22.000 Is it the best tactic, even if it is legal, even if it is permissible, that we announce a time and a location for people to meet us there and to prepare?

00:15:31.000 Probably not.

00:15:32.000 And I think that's why a lot of IE's activism has been so effective.

00:15:36.000 Groups like your own, groups like Generation Identity, where it's smaller, it's controlled, it's members only, they're vetted, it's a small group that carries out the function, it's clean, and then they get out.

00:15:49.000 And I think that's the way to do it.

00:15:50.000 And obviously, your story about the New York City banner drop is, I think, a great illustration of that, where it was obviously not the best situation, where you run into a black Israelite demonstration and you run into people that are calling the police and everything.

00:16:06.000 I mean, because people are trained and vetted and they handle themselves, it doesn't escalate into anything more than it is.

00:16:12.000 It doesn't take away from what should be a great event, which is the banner drop.

00:16:16.000 And I think that's why I was so successful.

00:16:18.000 And so you guys have been doing great stuff this year.

00:16:20.000 And then I guess my next question would be where do you hope to see Identity Europa in a year or in five years?

00:16:28.000 What do you hope to see as the role for this organization moving forward?

00:16:31.000 Because I know a big division, perhaps, in the leadership earlier in the year was exactly about this question.

00:16:38.000 Is it going to be the vanguard for certain people?

00:16:41.000 Are they going to be the security force for a college event or are they going to be a political force?

00:16:46.000 I mean, what do you envision as the role moving forward?

00:16:52.000 Well, I can say with some certainty that we're not going to be the security force for anyone outside of IE by any means.

00:16:59.000 We're also not going to be organizing people to go out and get into fights.

00:17:04.000 And that's actually never been part of our model.

00:17:07.000 Every time we've gone to a rally and things have gone.

00:17:09.000 It's been because of Antifa and it's been because of the establishment.

00:17:09.000 Poorly.

00:17:13.000 If you look at, you know, we did a free speech rally in, I believe it was June or July of 2017, and it went pretty well.

00:17:20.000 It went pretty well.

00:17:21.000 It was late June of 2017.

00:17:23.000 And, but it's because we did it in DC and the DC cops don't mess around, right?

00:17:27.000 So I think that, you know, there is the potential for doing rallies that you plan and you announce in advance, although you just have to be very careful where you do them.

00:17:36.000 And also, you run into the same issue of, okay, you know, even if the cops do their job and keep leftists, Communist terrorists away from us, then you're still going to have to worry about the kind of people that show up, right?

00:17:47.000 You know, people come to these views for the right reasons, the wrong reasons, and quite often a combination of the two.

00:17:53.000 And the people that come to, you know, far right views, or I don't even consider identitarianism far right, people that come to nationalism and identitarianism for the wrong reasons, they end up not being the kind of people you want to be associated with.

00:18:06.000 And so that the public rally model still has that weakness.

00:18:09.000 But back to where I see us going, I would like to, I mean, we just want to grow.

00:18:14.000 Honestly, we want to grow.

00:18:15.000 Financially, we want to grow in terms of people that we have in the organization.

00:18:19.000 I'd like to see us double, triple our membership.

00:18:22.000 And I'd like to see us grow in complexity too.

00:18:25.000 There's a lot of the progress that we've made that has occurred behind the scenes, right?

00:18:30.000 So when you see these bigger actions and you see us doing flash demonstrations with more people than we've ever done, and it's worth noting, we had about 70 people for the banner drop.

00:18:39.000 When we're doing demonstrations back with Richard Spencer, with kind of the broader alt right during the second half of 2017, We were getting like 20 to 30 people.

00:18:49.000 So the fact that we're able to get far more than we ever did back then, only with people in the organization, is definitely a very good sign.

00:18:56.000 So I'd like to see us be able to do like 300 person flash demonstrations, right?

00:19:01.000 Wouldn't it be amazing if we just showed up somewhere and did a 10, 20 minute demonstration with 300 people and then left?

00:19:08.000 Because even just having 70 people together, that's a pretty sizable crowd.

00:19:12.000 But I want us to go to the point where we can have, we can even just do rallies, but we don't need to announce them ahead of time because that totally cuts out Antifa.

00:19:20.000 You can tell it gets to them.

00:19:21.000 They always complain that they're not invited to these things.

00:19:25.000 But there's no need to involve them, right? 0.51

00:19:27.000 I think the number of people who are willing to go out there and just get rocks thrown at them while the leader, who it's me or someone else, is whisked around with private security to safety, the number of people that are willing to be useful idiots and get rocks thrown at their head are, I think that group of people has definitely dwindled in recent months.

00:19:47.000 But yeah, I mean, to answer your question, to summarize, we just want to grow.

00:19:50.000 We want to be a bigger organization.

00:19:51.000 We want to be better funded.

00:19:53.000 We want to have infrastructure, right?

00:19:55.000 We want to have.

00:19:56.000 Chapter houses.

00:19:57.000 We already have a few unofficial ones, but we're looking at getting a headquarters somewhere in the DC area here because that's kind of the greater area where I live.

00:20:05.000 And, you know, we want to have places to hang out in every city.

00:20:08.000 That's definitely a big step forward.

00:20:09.000 But those are just some of the examples of ways that I would like to see the organization grow.

00:20:14.000 Well, very good.

00:20:15.000 And I think it is a very useful infrastructure to have because nationalists, identitarians, whatever label you go by, I mean, we have nothing, right, in terms of.

00:20:28.000 It's been two years where we've seen a very flourishing of this dissident right movement, a very viable opposition to establishment politics.

00:20:37.000 And I think our biggest obstacle right now, in the way of making actual institutional progress or in the ways of laws or politics, is the fact that we're on the outside looking in, whether it's Young Americans for Liberty or these college groups or the campus Republicans or anything like that.

00:20:54.000 And not like it's strictly a juvenile thing, but across the board for the institutions, we're on the outside looking.

00:21:01.000 And we rely on the system, we rely on the establishment for that kind of organizing power.

00:21:06.000 So, that we have an organization like IE, and should they grow, and I hope that they grow, I hope that they grow very much in the next couple of years.

00:21:13.000 Should we have a good number of people in every state that we can rely on for a rally or, you know, for whatever else?

00:21:20.000 I think it's a great idea that it's just a fraternal organization where there's membership, where people can feel like they belong and talk about politics and things like that.

00:21:29.000 I think there's literally nothing bad about that, there's no downside to that.

00:21:35.000 And this is something I talk about on the show all the time think about political activism in your state.

00:21:40.000 If instead of going to these dangerous fight rallies where you're bringing a shield and you're wearing a helmet and these goofy things, if instead we had a real infrastructure of 50, let's just say 50 people in every state, that's a lot of people, but let's say 10 or 15 or 50 people in every state, that kind of organization, that kind of infrastructure can really get you a long way.

00:22:05.000 In terms of just about any kind of organizing.

00:22:07.000 So I think that's really great for Identity Europa.

00:22:10.000 Now, another question I think a lot of people have, not just myself, but I think a lot of people would talk about is my favorite question, the optics question.

00:22:19.000 Now, you guys are very good on optics in terms of a lot of the rallies.

00:22:24.000 I see the American flag, and like you said, very Trumpian in terms of the slogans and the look.

00:22:29.000 But a lot of people have asked, and I'm one of them, admittedly, and I hope this doesn't come across as like a criticism or, you know, I'm not trying to be nasty or butt in there.

00:22:38.000 I already knew what you were going to ask.

00:22:39.000 Right, right.

00:22:41.000 People ask about the color scheme, the logo, and Europa.

00:22:45.000 People look at your organization and they say, well, you know, will that really be relatable to Americans if it's this teal and white, if it's this triangle logo and it's Europa instead of America or something?

00:22:58.000 Now, I don't really know the answer.

00:23:00.000 I kind of see both sides.

00:23:02.000 And I think you know this.

00:23:03.000 Initially, I was in the Identity America camp.

00:23:07.000 Now, as I've seen your interview, I saw your interview at the Identity Europa conference.

00:23:11.000 My former partner interviewed you.

00:23:14.000 And I heard your answer.

00:23:15.000 And so I kind of understand where you're coming from.

00:23:17.000 I kind of understand both sides.

00:23:18.000 But I would be remiss if I didn't ask on this platform.

00:23:22.000 What do you say to those people who ask, why isn't it Identity America?

00:23:26.000 Why does it go on as Identity Europa?

00:23:30.000 Right.

00:23:30.000 Well, I think the name for Identity, the name for the organization was created.

00:23:36.000 Nathan came up with that before, I think it was before the Trump phenomenon, or at least before Trump really caught on.

00:23:41.000 So back then, within the more identitarian nationalist sphere of things, people weren't too big on America, maybe.

00:23:49.000 Hmm.

00:23:53.000 Thinking that that was too fruitful or whatever.

00:23:54.000 Now you can think what you want with that.

00:23:56.000 But now I definitely think that being more American, more pro America, the better, right?

00:24:03.000 We want white Trump supporters to come to our way of thinking and to join our organization, watch and donate to shows like America First.

00:24:11.000 And so the more easily, we need to make it easy for them.

00:24:16.000 We need to facilitate them being able to have a shift in views and to come to our side.

00:24:20.000 So I definitely understand where people are coming from.

00:24:23.000 I'll say two things here.

00:24:24.000 First is that I do kind of like, I understand why people say that.

00:24:28.000 And, you know, if I were to create an organization right now, would I create it?

00:24:31.000 Would I do Europa?

00:24:32.000 I'm not sure about that.

00:24:33.000 But, you know, at the same time, I like pushing the European heritage angle because if you're in an organization that is only for white people, which Identity Europa is and will forever remain, then if it's framing it as a European heritage group, you know, it allows you to bypass some of the programming.

00:24:49.000 I've gone around college campuses talking, just talking to, you know, pulling people aside, talking to them.

00:24:54.000 And, you know, You know, if you ask them something like, how would you feel about a whites only organization on campus? 0.63

00:24:59.000 They're just kind of like, ah, that sounds like, you know, Nazi stuff or whatever.

00:25:03.000 But you ask them, like, yeah, would you feel about, you know, a European heritage organization?

00:25:07.000 I think it kind of, when you talk about European heritage, people of European heritage, sure, some Americans might, that might not do anything for them, but it does allow you to bypass some of the conditioning, some of the roadblocks that come up when you try to talk to people about issues like identity and race.

00:25:22.000 But on the other side of things, yeah, again, if we had a more American aesthetic, then perhaps it would make it easier for the average white American who is.

00:25:29.000 A civic nationalist, but has some doubts about certain things and could be convinced to come to our side.

00:25:35.000 Maybe having a more American aesthetic could convince them.

00:25:39.000 I will say, I don't want to say too much here, but we have talked about these things, the highest levels of IE leadership.

00:25:46.000 And I can't say anything right now, but changing the name would be a massive thing.

00:25:56.000 It would require changing so many things.

00:26:00.000 We're selling merch, right?

00:26:02.000 Everyone that we just sold merch to, well, they no longer have a shirt or anything like that for an existing organization.

00:26:08.000 We have all these flags and so forth.

00:26:11.000 So it's something that we're probably going to continue considering in the future, and I totally understand where people are coming from.

00:26:18.000 But what's still though is that I think the biggest reason, the biggest argument that I see for changing the aesthetics and changing the name is to have a broader appeal to the average white person, right?

00:26:33.000 The average American is what I hear so often.

00:26:36.000 Well, I think I kind of already went over why I think it's useful to have an American aesthetic, right?

00:26:40.000 It can help bring people over.

00:26:41.000 It makes it a little more accessible to them.

00:26:43.000 At the same time, I would disagree.

00:26:46.000 I don't think it's aesthetics that is the main reason why Joe Sixpack and the average guy on the street, the average Trump supporter, doesn't want to or isn't interested in Identity Europa.

00:26:55.000 I think when you look at what these people actually believe in, they believe the Democrats are the real racists.

00:27:00.000 They believe that, you know, they believe all of the Janesh D'Souza stuff.

00:27:05.000 They're not even aware of how races vote by demographics.

00:27:09.000 They're not.

00:27:10.000 They're the kind of people that think that demographic change quite often is okay, so long as people come here legally.

00:27:16.000 And I've even seen this among, you know, more like even like, you know, masculine, really hardcore Trump supporters.

00:27:21.000 They all have these same ideas.

00:27:22.000 So ultimately, there is an ideological difference.

00:27:26.000 And I think that once people come to identitarian consciousness, things like the color scheme, the logo, you know, what angle the dragon's eyes at and the name, I think those things matter a little less.

00:27:37.000 But insofar as changing the name and changing the aesthetics would help people, would facilitate that ideological shift, then I would be in support.

00:27:46.000 Support of it.

00:27:47.000 But again, it's not as if we just start waving the flag more, change the color, change the name.

00:27:53.000 All of a sudden, we're going to have 50,000 members overnight.

00:27:55.000 The average Trump supporter, again, is not ideologically where they need to be to be in Identity Europa.

00:28:02.000 But obviously, we're here to change that.

00:28:05.000 Well, I think that's a good answer.

00:28:06.000 I think that's a smart answer because, like I said, initially, I was all for it.

00:28:12.000 But by the same token, I get where you're coming from in the sense that calling it Identity Europa and having it be a little bit different.

00:28:20.000 Have kind of a different flavor, I think is important to distinguish from the Boomer Con, like you said, the Dinesh D'Souza type of thing, because you're right.

00:28:31.000 You know, if you did totally co opt the Trumpian flag, it's hard to say that in some way you wouldn't accidentally co opt a large part of the message and who you would attract with that kind of thing.

00:28:43.000 And I think that is an argument in favor of remaining Europa.

00:28:47.000 Now, the color scheme, the logo, I think, like you said, these things are a little bit more.

00:28:52.000 They're a little bit less solid as the name because, you know, it's the name of the organization.

00:28:57.000 But I do get where you're coming from. 0.57

00:28:58.000 And the European heritage is a great angle as well because at the end of the day, it is a whites only organization.

00:29:05.000 Now, if you lead with that, like you said on a college campus or with anybody, the first thought is racist. 0.64

00:29:11.000 You know, if it's whites only, anything for white people is wrong.

00:29:15.000 It should be diversified.

00:29:16.000 But if you posit it as, well, no, it's European and it's about heritage and it's about history and ancestry and that kind of thing.

00:29:24.000 I definitely think that's a much more persuasive lens as well.

00:29:27.000 So I think it's something that can go both ways.

00:29:30.000 And I hope people do consider that because, I mean, people know me.

00:29:34.000 I'm the America First guy.

00:29:35.000 It's red, white, and blue all day long.

00:29:37.000 And it's, as Spencer might call it, it's patriot-tarted, proudly patriot-tarted on the show, right?

00:29:44.000 And so initially, I only saw that way.

00:29:47.000 But as I've heard you explain it, I can kind of see both sides of the coin.

00:29:51.000 So I get it, and it's smart.

00:29:53.000 Now, we've kind of covered Identity Europa as an organization, but now I kind of want to pick your brain on.

00:29:57.000 Some things that are going on.

00:29:59.000 And you did mention Dinesh D'Souza.

00:30:01.000 This is something that I did want to talk to you about.

00:30:03.000 It's kind of convenient that you're coming on the show tonight, which is the Spencer tape today.

00:30:08.000 Apparently, Richard Spencer's going to be in the big movie tonight.

00:30:13.000 I think it premieres tonight.

00:30:14.000 And the movie is, what is it, like Hillary's America or some goof?

00:30:18.000 I don't know.

00:30:20.000 I can't remember all the different names of it.

00:30:22.000 But his new movie's coming out tonight.

00:30:24.000 And in the interview, and I'll just summarize for people, he interviews Richard Spencer.

00:30:28.000 And the goal of the interview is to show that.

00:30:29.000 People like Richard Spencer and the so called alt right or white nationalist or whatever is not Trumpist.

00:30:36.000 It's not Republican.

00:30:37.000 It's not conservative.

00:30:38.000 It's liberal.

00:30:39.000 It's Democratic.

00:30:40.000 And so, in order to do that, he talks about Andrew Jackson and natural rights.

00:30:45.000 And basically, he implies that, well, because Richard Spencer believes that rights come from the state instead of God, and because Richard Spencer likes Andrew Jackson and James Polk, who are both Democrats, well, that means that Spencer's a Democrat.

00:30:59.000 And so, have you seen the clip?

00:31:00.000 And what are your thoughts on it?

00:31:02.000 I actually haven't seen the clip.

00:31:04.000 But that, you know, it's pretty bread and butter, Janesh D'Souza.

00:31:08.000 You know, sometimes I wonder if he even believes half of the stuff that he's saying.

00:31:12.000 I think he's tapped into such a market for like the Dems are the real racist content. 0.99

00:31:18.000 I think he's, I mean, some of the stuff he posts on Twitter, I imagine him just like posting it with a shit eating grin. 0.99

00:31:24.000 Like it's just that absurd that I can't imagine that this guy takes it seriously. 0.97

00:31:28.000 But I mean, who knows?

00:31:29.000 I think the thing is, I mean, he's correct to point out that Spencer and others are not Republicans, really.

00:31:37.000 I mean, Richard has criticized free speech and has supported.

00:31:41.000 Now, regardless of what you think of those things, those aren't in line with the modern American understanding of conservatism and the values and ideals of the Republican Party.

00:31:52.000 But I mean, to say that just because someone leans left economically means that they are overall a leftist, it's just a bit odd.

00:32:01.000 And the issue is that I think as time has gone on, Republicans and conservatives have really just shifted their focus to economics.

00:32:09.000 They've lost so much ground.

00:32:11.000 Culturally and socially, to the left, that they've just really just tunneled down on what the left will allow them to have, right?

00:32:18.000 You won't lose your job for being a free market guy, at least not yet, but you will lose your job for being a racist or a misogynist or a homophobe in many situations.

00:32:27.000 So I think the left has really, really pushed the greatest taboos are on the social side of things, right?

00:32:33.000 To be socially conservative is far more taboo than to be economically a fiscal conservative, right?

00:32:40.000 So I think that's why you have the TPUSA stuff, and that's why you see people.

00:32:43.000 Flock to it because it's like, okay, this is our little thing that we are allowed to have.

00:32:49.000 But yeah, I mean, Dinesh D'Souza wants to blame, you know, it's like they call the communist fascist, right?

00:32:57.000 That's another way to blame, to shift the blame onto the right, in a sense.

00:33:02.000 It's very historical.

00:33:03.000 And it's also worth pointing out that the first classical liberals, right, the people that champion, that originally championed the very same enlightenment based ideas that Dinesh D'Souza and other modern Republicans and conservatives.

00:33:16.000 Love, those people were the first leftists.

00:33:19.000 During the French Revolution, the National Assembly, the people who supported the king sat on the right of the National Assembly.

00:33:28.000 These were the reactionaries, the monarchists, and on the left side of the National Assembly were the more classical liberals, the people who, again, supported Enlightenment era thought.

00:33:37.000 And that includes free markets, individualism, all of these things.

00:33:42.000 So they sat on the left, they were the first leftists.

00:33:45.000 So Dinesh D'Souza believes all the same things.

00:33:47.000 That they did.

00:33:49.000 And he's the kind of guy that would look back on these monarchists and be like, oh, wow, these monarchists are real.

00:33:55.000 They're Democrats, they're leftists or something.

00:33:57.000 So it's totally ahistorical.

00:33:59.000 I don't know how much of it he actually believes, but he's found a good niche. 0.93

00:34:02.000 He's probably making a killing, peddling this nonsense.

00:34:04.000 So I don't know.

00:34:06.000 What are you going to do?

00:34:07.000 Yeah, well, and that's fair.

00:34:08.000 I mean, it's funny you say that because I know a lot of people who say exactly the same thing about Dinesh being like people having this begrudging respect for him because he's. 0.91

00:34:20.000 Found a great way to swindle boomers out of their money, you know, getting them to show up to these ridiculous movies where. 0.74

00:34:27.000 And I saw one of them. 0.94

00:34:28.000 I saw the one in 2016 with my grandma.

00:34:31.000 It was like Hillary's America or America, imagine the world without her.

00:34:36.000 And it was like so much of it was documentary.

00:34:39.000 It was like reenacting historical scenes.

00:34:41.000 And I'm thinking this would be bad on like Discovery Channel.

00:34:44.000 This would be bad on the History Channel, and it's a major motion picture.

00:34:47.000 So you're right.

00:34:48.000 You got to hand it to him.

00:34:49.000 He comes out with a book.

00:34:50.000 And it's a $30 book, and then he comes out with the movie, and then it's, you know, you got to see the movie.

00:34:55.000 So you're right.

00:34:55.000 But what really set me off, and I'm not obviously a huge defender of Spencer, we don't agree on many things.

00:35:03.000 And I know you guys have kind of a rift, but I will say the one nuanced take that I have to make, and I think this is something that you would probably relate to as an American nationalist, is this takedown of great heroes like Jackson or Kennedy or Polk or people like that because they're Democrats.

00:35:23.000 And that's the one thing that I have to hold off on.

00:35:25.000 Because I understand the argument that, well, Democrats are the real racist is rhetorically useful.

00:35:31.000 It might be totally ahistorical, it might not be totally true.

00:35:35.000 However, If we're trying to convince people to vote in elections, we're trying to convince people not to be Democrats or liberals or whatever, it can be a useful argument simply on practical, pragmatic grounds.

00:35:46.000 But I feel like there is a limiting principle to that, which says that at a certain point, you're not winning anymore.

00:35:52.000 At a certain point, you're convincing people to become.

00:35:56.000 It's not winning at that point.

00:35:57.000 You know, if you have to convince people to reject their history, hate their ancestors, hate their heroes, so that they vote Republican, you know, can we say that that constitutes a win?

00:36:08.000 And I've talked to many alt light figures about this, or several of them, where they say, you know, oh, we love the Dinesh stuff. 0.91

00:36:14.000 We love the DR3 type stuff. 0.93

00:36:16.000 We love to call them Nazis and all that. 0.99

00:36:19.000 And I don't think they understand that detail, that it is important that Americans can look back on their history.

00:36:26.000 And when we can love a character like Andrew Jackson, who fought the bankers and all the rest, I mean, Donald Trump's got a portrait of Jackson hanging above his office.

00:36:34.000 And so, do you feel the same way?

00:36:35.000 Do you feel the same way about American heritage and history and heroes and all that?

00:36:40.000 Or do you think that, I mean, I probably know what you're going to answer, but I mean, what do you think about that rhetorical message of saying that, well, Jackson's a Democrat? 0.99

00:36:49.000 He sucks. 0.99

00:36:50.000 We shouldn't like him. 1.00

00:36:53.000 It's totally repugnant. 0.78

00:36:55.000 I understand some people are doing, you know, they're trying, they're just looking on the short term side of things.

00:36:59.000 They're trying to say, oh, if we, you know, if we prove we're not racist, then we'll totally win.

00:37:04.000 And I understand you have to do a little bit of that.

00:37:07.000 Trump does a little bit of that.

00:37:08.000 He does far less of that than, you know, these all light people, which they should really take note of.

00:37:13.000 And I'd wager he's, he probably looks at some of this alt light, you know, gems of the real racist stuff, and is just, you know, finds it goofy, honestly.

00:37:21.000 But yeah, no, I, there's, I don't see there's much, I don't think there's too much strategic merit.

00:37:27.000 I think that the Republicans and conservatives should stop worrying so much about being called racists, stop shaping these, you know, grand political strategies around, around just proving how not racist they are.

00:37:41.000 It's not going to last forever.

00:37:42.000 And that's only giving, you're still remaining within the paradigm that says that.

00:37:47.000 Racism, which is identity politics for white people, is bad.

00:37:51.000 I mean, that's something we need, you know, killing words have so much power. 0.78

00:37:58.000 And by, you know, yeah, they're getting to the point now where they'll probably condemn George Washington for some reason.

00:38:04.000 Maybe he was secretly a Democrat.

00:38:05.000 I don't know.

00:38:06.000 But yeah, I just find it unacceptable.

00:38:09.000 I'm tired of it, honestly.

00:38:09.000 It's time to move things one step further.

00:38:11.000 It's time to stop letting people like Dinesh D'Souza, I mean, we've got a guy named Dinesh D'Souza in America shitting on our history.

00:38:19.000 But, you know, at the same time, without sounding crude, if you're someone like Dinesh D'Souza, do you really look back at all of these white people, these great white men, and really feel a sense of camaraderie? 0.88

00:38:19.000 Right. 0.88

00:38:29.000 I mean, if I raised my kid in India, he's probably not going to look back at all these great Indian rulers and be like, that's just, you know, that's, you know, my, it's like the meme, my ancestor.

00:38:38.000 No, it's not your ancestor, Dinesh. 0.90

00:38:40.000 These aren't, these aren't your people.

00:38:41.000 And it's, you're just kind of a guest here. 0.97

00:38:43.000 So I don't have much respect for people that are going to shit on our, our history, part of my language for, Just so that they can avoid being called racists. 0.96

00:38:52.000 Well, it's so true. 0.97

00:38:53.000 And that's a great point that you make about Republican politics effectively being constructed to evade or dodge that word, you know, the political correctness type stuff.

00:39:03.000 And I think that's really when people start to come around to the truth.

00:39:06.000 I think the moment that people reject this idea that we have to concern ourselves with appearing not racist and not being racist and we allow the left to dominate the paradigm in terms of how we think about politics, I think the moment people reject that, they start to come around to our way of thinking.

00:39:24.000 Because once you put aside that notion that, Identity politics is horrible.

00:39:29.000 And if we could just all live together in happiness and harmony, like buying cheap products at Walmart, and it doesn't matter what language or race or religion or any of that stuff, I think once you get past that kind of thinking, you're already halfway there.

00:39:43.000 And that's the biggest problem because we looked at people, and funny enough, too, it didn't even win before.

00:39:49.000 You know, I think they like to think of it as, well, that's just what you have to do to get by as a Republican.

00:39:55.000 And we've seen that that's obviously not the case.

00:39:58.000 We've seen that the Republicans that have been most concerned about that kind of thing are the ones that lose.

00:40:03.000 People like John McCain, people like Mitt Romney.

00:40:06.000 Donald Trump, was he so concerned about appearing not racist?

00:40:10.000 I mean, people would ask him, Are you a racist?

00:40:12.000 And they'd say, I'm just not going to take that question.

00:40:15.000 And he was able to win a great landslide.

00:40:19.000 So I think you're right on the money on that one.

00:40:21.000 And Dinesh, like we say, it's good that he's making money, but probably not the best thing for our cause.

00:40:27.000 I think it's time for white people to move beyond the guilt.

00:40:29.000 Finally, resolve that and say, okay, we probably have some kind of stake in the future of this country if we have ancestors going 100, 200, 300 years back.

00:40:39.000 And I guess that leads me to a broader question.

00:40:42.000 This is something I ask a lot of people who come on the show, Jared Taylor, the thought leaders in the dissident right who are a big part of the election, which is what do you think of Donald Trump and the work he's been doing so far?

00:40:54.000 Because I know this question probably would have been different for a lot of people maybe five or six months ago when it was just tax reform.

00:41:02.000 And it was DACA negotiations and the Syria strikes.

00:41:05.000 But, I mean, here we are all the way out in July, or rather August now.

00:41:10.000 What do you think has been Trump's so far?

00:41:12.000 How has the job been going?

00:41:13.000 Do you think he's lived up to the expectations?

00:41:16.000 Do you think he's shown that politics is viable, or maybe the reverse?

00:41:20.000 I mean, what's your overall take on where we are right now with this guy?

00:41:23.000 Well, I'm feeling pretty good about the Trump administration at this point.

00:41:26.000 I think that people were very impatient, right?

00:41:30.000 You know, the 2016 election was just.

00:41:33.000 In the whole campaign was such a profoundly transformative process for so many people.

00:41:39.000 And, you know, we just felt like the energy was rising and rising and rising.

00:41:43.000 And, you know, there were people that literally thought Trump was going to build the wall on day one.

00:41:46.000 There weren't going to be any illegals in America by, like, you know, the first month or something.

00:41:56.000 Highly unrealistic expectations, or at least they were very impatient, right?

00:42:00.000 Now, there's an argument to be made that we should hold Trump accountable, whatever.

00:42:03.000 And I'm obviously have no intention of.

00:42:07.000 Defending things that I think he does poorly, but we do have to put it in perspective.

00:42:12.000 There is still time, he's done quite a bit now, and there's still plenty of time for him to accomplish other major policy goals before the end of his first term.

00:42:20.000 I think we are going to see significant construction on the border wall done before the 2020 election.

00:42:20.000 I think he will.

00:42:27.000 Ryan Dawson theorized that, he was the first one I heard throughout this idea, that Trump's going to wait till the end of his first term and then just have it fresh to do the wall and then just have it fresh.

00:42:36.000 So it's fresh on everyone's minds so we can really use that to run on.

00:42:40.000 I would really be surprised if he's just not going to make any significant progress on the wall by the time he's running for reelection.

00:42:48.000 You know, the guy's definitely very strategic.

00:42:50.000 He's a good deal maker.

00:42:52.000 So, I can't imagine that he's just going to like, you know, have that be like, oh, we're going to build the wall the next election, you know, the next term, right?

00:42:59.000 I don't think that's going to work.

00:42:59.000 But yeah, there are things that he's done well and there are things that I disagree with.

00:43:04.000 I think the things that I disagree with have to do with some of his foreign policy. 0.69

00:43:08.000 He's a little more, a little too, you know, pro Israel than I'd like. 0.58

00:43:12.000 But at the same time, I understand that you can't, you know, you're not, realistically, you're not going to upset some of these geopolitical frameworks overnight.

00:43:22.000 And he is nevertheless working towards that, I think, just.

00:43:25.000 Trying to make amends with Putin. 0.94

00:43:26.000 The stuff he's done in North Korea is quite good.

00:43:29.000 And while he has made concessions to Israel, I think that under virtually any other president, we would have seen far more concessions to Israel.

00:43:36.000 You might have even seen regime change in Syria.

00:43:39.000 So, yeah, I'm feeling good about the Trump administration.

00:43:43.000 Whether or not he, I do think that he needs to continue making progress.

00:43:47.000 If he just accomplishes what he's done now, and these are all of his accomplishments thus far are his main accomplishments by the end of his first term, I think that's going to be a problem.

00:43:56.000 But there's definitely, what do we have, like two years before?

00:43:59.000 You know, the end of his term, I think that he's going to be in a far better position then.

00:44:03.000 And I think we're going to look back on some of these periods in his first term when things weren't going well, when, you know, we thought he was cucking, when he thought he was going to, I don't know, some people thought that every time, you know, think that every time he does something, it's World War III is right around the corner.

00:44:18.000 You've done a good job of, you know, dispelling those, that kind of fear mongering that some people like to do.

00:44:24.000 But yeah, I mean, I'm feeling good.

00:44:26.000 And I think I've got high hopes for the rest of his administration.

00:44:29.000 But again, if he doesn't make, if he doesn't continue to make progress, And I think his first term will be some par.

00:44:35.000 Well, yeah.

00:44:35.000 Right.

00:44:36.000 And I think that's, I think it's important to acknowledge that he's basically demonstrated that he is competent, strategic, and that he is still on our side.

00:44:46.000 And I think that was the biggest hurdle over the course of a year.

00:44:50.000 And I think a lot of the evolution of people on Trump has reflected that in the sense that when it was April 2017 and there was a serious strike, at that point when people doubted Trump, I didn't doubt.

00:45:03.000 Because I looked at everything that was going on, but when people looked at that and there was a knee jerk, I think it was more understandable at that point because he was just in, it was three months into the presidency, and there he was bombing Syria.

00:45:14.000 It wasn't a good look.

00:45:15.000 But I think what people have seen over the course of the last two years is like you said, if we are patient, if we look at all the details, if we wait for things to resolve themselves, just about in every case, we come out ahead.

00:45:28.000 We looked at the first serious strike and it didn't turn into anything.

00:45:32.000 We looked at the second serious strike and And by the time the bombs stopped dropping, we found out no civilian casualties, didn't make any strategic difference on the ground.

00:45:40.000 If it did, it actually consolidated support behind Assad among the Syrian people.

00:45:45.000 It turned out that it was nothing more than a couple of buildings and no further intervention.

00:45:49.000 And you see this with DACA, you saw this in many cases.

00:45:53.000 And so I think that's been, I think, a very positive development that people like myself and others have been vindicated on these issues because, and tell me what you think about this. 0.99

00:46:03.000 I see a lot of the black pillars out there.

00:46:05.000 And we call them black pillars, but you said people who think the sky is falling, the hysteria every time he does something wrong.

00:46:13.000 I see that as not just like a subtle disagreement or like, I'm right, I'm right, you're wrong, you're wrong.

00:46:19.000 But I see that as something that is demoralizing to our side.

00:46:23.000 Because to me, and particularly in my development, I'm a younger guy, I'm 19.

00:46:28.000 Donald Trump was so important to me in my development because he's the reason I'm even on this side.

00:46:32.000 If it weren't for Trump, I'd be a Milton Friedman, I'd be an Israel of Cassie Dillon right now, writing for the Daily Wire.

00:46:39.000 You know, and if it weren't for Trump. I'd run with Will Nardi or something.

00:46:42.000 That's right.

00:46:43.000 Yeah, we would.

00:46:44.000 That's right.

00:46:44.000 I'd be third wheeling for them, right?

00:46:46.000 And all that.

00:46:48.000 And without Trump, I wouldn't have any faith in politics.

00:46:51.000 If that hadn't happened, I mean, the world would be so different.

00:46:54.000 He's such an important figure.

00:46:56.000 And what he represents, not just for the future in 100 years, but for the viability of politics, to me, can't be understated in terms of the value for people.

00:47:05.000 And do you agree with that assessment that the blackpilling is more than just holding accountable or that kind of thing?

00:47:12.000 Because this is something I've debated with people like Alex Władysławski, among others. 0.62

00:47:17.000 And I get what they're saying about the accountability.

00:47:19.000 Where would you fall in that gradient along accountability versus maintaining the myth, so to speak?

00:47:28.000 Huh, I guess I'm somewhere in the middle.

00:47:30.000 If I see Trump doing something I dislike, I'm going to be open about it and freely discuss it.

00:47:36.000 Now, I don't think Trump's like reading my Twitter account.

00:47:37.000 You never know.

00:47:39.000 So I don't think that we should just totally vent our negativity and say that we're totally done with Trump every time he does something we dislike because that's going to hold him accountable.

00:47:48.000 I just think we need to keep consistency within.

00:47:51.000 You know, our movement, or perhaps our, our, our, you know, multiple smaller movements that are nevertheless similar.

00:47:58.000 But we need to, it's good to remember what we're about, right?

00:48:02.000 So if Trump is, Trump goes out there and says he decides to invade Syria, we need to be, obviously, so many people would be up in arms.

00:48:07.000 But the reason to do that, it's part of it would be to maybe send a message to Trump, but also to remind everyone else and maybe people who are a little less info, people a little newer to things coming to us that, hey, this isn't something that we're about.

00:48:18.000 Trump might be doing this, we don't support it.

00:48:20.000 And it's a good way of maintaining our own consistency and our own values, right?

00:48:23.000 Because we don't want to turn into Bill Mitchell's. 1.00

00:48:25.000 We don't want to just cheerlead Trump when he does everything stupid, when he does something stupid. 1.00

00:48:30.000 I know that people accuse you of being Bill Mitchell quite often. 1.00

00:48:34.000 I think you're more than used to it by now.

00:48:36.000 But I mean, I have seen you call out Trump on a number of occasions, not as much as others, but that's okay.

00:48:42.000 Obviously, there's going to be some disagreements over what's bad, what we need to wait on, and so forth.

00:48:47.000 But I think to answer your question, I think I'm somewhere in the middle.

00:48:52.000 I think that on the subject of blackpilling, I think there is an issue.

00:48:56.000 Some people are actually.

00:48:58.000 Or at least for a time, wanted people to turn against Trump so that, like, you know, the alt right or whatever could be, you know, more of a monolithic thing, I guess. 0.95

00:49:07.000 But we have to just keep in mind that when there's a big difference between saying Trump is doing this and I think it's bad for this reason versus saying, oh, Trump is done, Trump is cucking, Trump is a Zio shill or something like that. 0.55

00:49:20.000 I mean, that's not really constructive.

00:49:22.000 And you can just tell by, like, the level of emotion behind it.

00:49:25.000 If it's like a sober intellectual analysis, oh, maybe he shouldn't be doing this, you know, maybe some kind of Patrick Buchanan esque analysis of the situation versus, yeah, just some screed where you're talking about how, you know, we're all going to die because Trump was our last hope.

00:49:39.000 And, you know, by signing this bad, you know, tax deal or something, it's all over.

00:49:44.000 So that's kind of where I stand on things.

00:49:46.000 Yeah.

00:49:46.000 Well, that's a good point.

00:49:47.000 I think that's a fair assessment, especially in terms of the criticism, because that is what you see so often.

00:49:54.000 And I've often said that I don't think there's anything wrong with the criticism.

00:49:57.000 Like you said, if you're to offer a constructive criticism of a specific policy and you outline, Well, here's why it's bad, and we don't agree with that.

00:50:07.000 Well, at least that gets us somewhere, you know? 1.00

00:50:09.000 But so much of what we see is the opposite the Zio shill, the cucking, that kind of thing. 0.99

00:50:15.000 And to me, that just achieves very little, and it may actually do harm. 1.00

00:50:18.000 So I think that's a sober and fair take.

00:50:20.000 I think that's basically what me and the Black Pillars, or maybe like loose critics, have come to that consensus over the last six months.

00:50:30.000 I know, Alex Wadaslawski, we kind of had it out for the first time, and we basically came to that conclusion as well, which is.

00:50:37.000 The fair and constructive criticism.

00:50:39.000 And especially, it's a good thing, what you said about the serious strike, to demonstrate who we are and what we stand for.

00:50:47.000 That it's important to voice that, if not for any other reason than to say that that's a way to distinguish and to create distinction.

00:50:54.000 That, well, we're not the same neocon Republicans as the establishment or as this particular action.

00:51:00.000 So I think that's a fair assessment.

00:51:02.000 And we're winding down here.

00:51:05.000 My last question this is not so much of a serious question.

00:51:09.000 This may be the most controversial question.

00:51:11.000 You know, you might not get a lot of DMs or whatever for what you said so far, but this one might take the cake.

00:51:17.000 And maybe you don't want to answer this one before we wrap it up, which is I've seen you interact with certain people on Twitter.com, certain people that are not popular in this movement, people who come to mind like Beardley Beardson, Sean, Prince Hubris, Paul Town.

00:51:34.000 Now, it's ironic because the irony bros are so divisive.

00:51:39.000 They're supposed to be funny and goofy, and yet this is a huge contention where it's like the biggest criticism I get from people is lose the irony, bro.

00:51:48.000 Stop talking to them.

00:51:49.000 Disavow them, this kind of thing.

00:51:51.000 And I see you interact with them sometimes.

00:51:53.000 What is your take on that whole issue?

00:51:55.000 Because this is the issue compared to so many others, which seems to split people right down the middle.

00:52:01.000 What is your take on that?

00:52:04.000 Well, Sean was in Identity Europa, and he was one of my first friends in the organization.

00:52:08.000 What was that?

00:52:10.000 It was the October 2016 flash demonstration that we did at Pier 14 where Kate Stanley was murdered.

00:52:17.000 And then we had the Showtime documentary crew along with us.

00:52:20.000 You can go to Showtime, check out, I think it was Darknet, season two, episode four.

00:52:25.000 But so I've known Sean, and then he introduced me to those guys, I guess, via Twitter back then.

00:52:25.000 We're in that.

00:52:30.000 So I've known them for a little bit.

00:52:31.000 And I like those guys.

00:52:32.000 What I will say, though, is I don't agree with them on everything, and that's okay.

00:52:35.000 We don't have to agree.

00:52:37.000 Best way to understand the irony, bros, is that they're just there to have fun on the internet, right?

00:52:40.000 They obviously do have like actual political views, but they're not just, you know, There are plenty of other accounts that you can follow if you just want humorless, very serious, grim content about immigration or something like that.

00:52:52.000 But those guys are there to have fun.

00:52:54.000 They like making fun of people.

00:52:55.000 You can just block them or mute them if you dislike it.

00:52:57.000 But I think that they have, in the past six months to a year, they've done a good job of critiquing and really, really relentlessly criticizing things in the alt right that are worthy of being criticized.

00:53:09.000 I think the alt right, I think the brand is pretty much dead.

00:53:12.000 We can disagree on that.

00:53:13.000 I don't think you might actually agree with me on that.

00:53:16.000 Other people in the broader movement.

00:53:18.000 You know, might disagree.

00:53:20.000 But the point being is that I think within the past six months to a year, there's just been things have just kind of gone wild.

00:53:27.000 Certain segments of the movement have just fallen apart and done absurd things and doubled down on those absurd things.

00:53:33.000 So it's good to have people that maybe aren't part of the movement or whatever who are able to just speak freely and not have to worry about being too diplomatic or whatever.

00:53:43.000 So I can't say the same things that they say just because I'm held to a different standard because I'm, you know, and it's kind of the same thing with you, right?

00:53:50.000 You can't say the same things.

00:53:51.000 Because you're trying to take a little bit more of a serious approach.

00:53:57.000 Paul Town, Beardson, Beardley, Sean, if they want to go on and just make fun of people for a few hours on the weekly sweat, I don't see any issue with that.

00:54:06.000 And again, I think I would even say that some of it has been pretty constructive.

00:54:09.000 There is a lot that deserves to be mocked.

00:54:11.000 I think part of the reason why the alt right was so good at the beginning is because we were the ones doing the mocking.

00:54:15.000 We were the ones that were making fun of the left, making fun of establishment conservatives for being fuddy duddies, for being totally, for being squares, people that were very.

00:54:25.000 Very sensitive and so forth.

00:54:27.000 And I think the issue is that a lot of people who join the alt right, and then they ended up becoming the ones that are just totally humorless, uncompromising, unwilling to hear criticisms, light humor just totally set them off.

00:54:42.000 And if you establish yourself as the kind of guy that's easily offended on the internet, you can't beat people up.

00:54:46.000 So if you just get mad at online, then you lose.

00:54:49.000 It's that simple.

00:54:50.000 And so I think that these people have, I think a lot of them mean well, the people that really hate the Irony Bros, right?

00:54:58.000 At the end of the day, we just need to have a sense of humor about things that we can't be sensitive, right?

00:55:04.000 If we're just at the point where people, you know, the slightest ridicule of us just sets us off and makes us mad, it's going to make us look bitter.

00:55:11.000 And looking bitter is probably the worst look.

00:55:13.000 So, there are a lot of people out there that make fun of IE.

00:55:15.000 Some of this is good hearted humor.

00:55:18.000 Other times it's not, but I go along with it.

00:55:20.000 Sometimes I retweet it.

00:55:21.000 I don't let it get to me.

00:55:23.000 And I think that that's kind of the best attitude to have.

00:55:27.000 And going back to the beginning when we were talking about the consulate demonstration, We do need to have a sense of humor and we do need to have a sense of levity.

00:55:34.000 Otherwise, we're just going to come off as humorless weirdos who are just, you know, obsessed with immigration and refuse to talk about anything else.

00:55:41.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:55:41.000 Well, I think that's very well said. 1.00

00:55:43.000 I think there's a lot of good points in there because, you know, you're very right about joking around and the levity and all that because it's a movement for human beings, you know, not a movement for, you know, when you talk about people, because I know I can know exactly who you're talking about when you talk about humorless.

00:56:05.000 People obsessed with immigration online. 0.66

00:56:07.000 And that's so true.

00:56:08.000 We don't want to be those kinds of people.

00:56:10.000 And I think that's so important.

00:56:12.000 How this movement got off the ground in the first place and how it's going to continue to go far is maintaining that sense of fun and being, what did Kellyanne Conway say, being cheerful warriors?

00:56:23.000 She said that about the Trump campaign.

00:56:25.000 And that's, I think, a big part of it.

00:56:27.000 But it's been great having you on.

00:56:28.000 We're running out of time here.

00:56:30.000 Before you go, just tell us, plug whatever you want.

00:56:34.000 I mean, tell people where they can.

00:56:36.000 Find out more information about IE, maybe where they could apply and where they could find more of your content.

00:56:42.000 Sure.

00:56:43.000 Well, my personal Twitter is twitter.comslash Patrick KCIE.

00:56:47.000 You can go to identityEuropa.comslash apply if you want to fill out an application.

00:56:51.000 You can apply under a pseudonym.

00:56:52.000 You can pay your dues anonymously.

00:56:54.000 It's pretty easy.

00:56:55.000 You don't have to do activism or show your face.

00:56:56.000 A lot of people join IE just for the social network.

00:57:00.000 So those are important things to keep in mind.

00:57:02.000 Also, we are in this lawsuit related to Charlottesville.

00:57:05.000 We have to pay a certain amount per month to our lawyers.

00:57:07.000 I have the utmost confidence that we can win, but we need to continue to afford our legal defense.

00:57:11.000 So, if anyone feels so inclined, they can go to identityropa.comslash donate.

00:57:15.000 Fortunately, we have been removed from virtually every form of payment processing on the internet.

00:57:22.000 We're working on something, but for the time being, you can send cash check or money order to our PO box.

00:57:27.000 I want to encourage more and more people to start really, really pushing that because that's something that they can never really take away from us unless Hillary wins in 2020 and she breaks the post office against us or something.

00:57:38.000 But that's not going to happen.

00:57:40.000 And that is a very anti fragile way of fundraising, of corresponding, and so forth.

00:57:44.000 So, yeah, there you go.

00:57:46.000 Thank you again, Nick, for having me on.

00:57:48.000 I'm a fan of your program.

00:57:49.000 You do a good job, and I have enjoyed this talk.

00:57:52.000 All right.

00:57:52.000 Well, thanks so much for joining me.

00:57:53.000 Keep up the good work, and we'll have to do it again sometime.

00:57:55.000 All right.

00:57:56.000 Take it easy.

00:57:57.000 All right.

00:57:57.000 Sounds good.

00:57:58.000 Bye bye.

00:57:59.000 Well, there you have it, folks.

00:57:59.000 All right.

00:58:01.000 Very fun interview with old Patrick Casey of Identity Europa.

00:58:05.000 Finally, get to take the headphones off.

00:58:10.000 That's the most comfortable part, right?

00:58:11.000 When you finally, because I tell you, it really yanks on the ears.

00:58:14.000 But.

00:58:15.000 Hope you enjoyed that.

00:58:16.000 A very fun interview, I think.

00:58:18.000 Very smart guy, Patrick Casey.

00:58:19.000 He's a young guy, but a very smart guy.

00:58:21.000 Well, he's older than me, so I can't really say that.

00:58:23.000 But a very smart guy and very mature, which is funny because the movement has a lot of older people in it who are very immature, and yet it has a lot of young people who tend to be more mature in their worldview.

00:58:36.000 Perhaps, I think, just generally in the worldview and the tactics and the strategy, it's a much more mature political movement, I think, ironically, for some of the younger people.

00:58:44.000 So it was great to have him on, and it's good that we're able to come together.

00:58:49.000 I have to say, this is the second guest we've had on this week, and.

00:58:54.000 How many guests this month?

00:58:55.000 I mean, like crazy.

00:58:56.000 We had on two in the second week.

00:58:59.000 We had on one in the first week.

00:59:01.000 And just like crazy.

00:59:02.000 We had Ali.

00:59:03.000 I mean, we have alt-right, alt-right.

00:59:05.000 I mean, everyone in between.

00:59:06.000 And I think it's been really great that we've been able to bring people together, bring together this coalition of like-minded people.

00:59:12.000 And I've been saying this for a long time.

00:59:14.000 What has been emerging from this year and maybe from the collapse of the old guard alt-right or the 2016 guard of the alt-right has been that.

00:59:25.000 The cream truly has risen to the top.

00:59:27.000 I really feel, and I'm so encouraged by this, so energized by this, that we've seen that the old kind of ineffective, goofy stuff has basically flamed itself out.

00:59:38.000 And in its wake, a phoenix truly is rising of people.

00:59:43.000 And you've seen them all on this show people like Patrick Casey, people like the Red Elephants, Faith Goldie, Jake Lloyd, Jared Taylor, all kinds of people, people I'm probably forgetting right now.

00:59:54.000 And it's really remarkable to see that you have people that are smart.

00:59:58.000 That are competent, that have the right ideas, and after the year that we've had, that have learned the lesson.

01:00:04.000 They present well, they are able to communicate the ideas effectively.

01:00:09.000 And so I'm very happy with what I'm seeing.

01:00:11.000 It's been great that we've been able to get these kinds of people on the show and hear them out, and you can find their content.

01:00:17.000 And who knows, maybe by 2020, there's some kind of an infrastructure bringing these people together.

01:00:22.000 I really believe that, well, who knows, maybe it's decentralized, maybe not, but I really think the future is the America First nationalistic kind of thing.

01:00:32.000 Because you know that people like myself, people like Patrick, people like Faith Goldie, people like Red Elephants, you know, we know.

01:00:39.000 You know, we know the score.

01:00:42.000 But we're putting it out there and we're growing the movement in a way that is constructive, in a way that will lead to solid gains.

01:00:49.000 And so it can't be understated that when you bring these people on and they talk about, well, we're putting thought into being funny.

01:00:56.000 We're putting thought into activism that is efficient, it's vetted, and all the rest.

01:01:00.000 We're putting thought into content where the ideas are expressed in such a way that.

01:01:05.000 You can share it with your boomer dad or your uncle or your neighbor, whoever.

01:01:10.000 And there's a lot to be said for that.

01:01:11.000 So I'm very excited by what I'm seeing.

01:01:13.000 Don't go anywhere.

01:01:14.000 We still have to read off our Streamlabs and Super Chats.

01:01:18.000 So we're going to check those out right now.

01:01:20.000 And then we'll call it a night.

01:01:22.000 But it's been a good show.

01:01:23.000 I really, really like Patrick, you know.

01:01:26.000 And it was like I said it, I think, the other day.

01:01:29.000 There was this period where we weren't getting along so well.

01:01:32.000 He kicked me out of IE.

01:01:33.000 I didn't bring that up because I don't know if it's still a little sore.

01:01:36.000 Maybe I want to.

01:01:37.000 Become better friends before we get into that.

01:01:39.000 But he did kick me out.

01:01:40.000 It turned into a whole thing.

01:01:43.000 But I always maintained that I really loved what he was all about.

01:01:46.000 I really admired what he was doing with the organization, even though we were in a personal rift.

01:01:51.000 And I always said I liked him and he was a smart guy.

01:01:54.000 And so I'm really glad that we were able to patch things up and put our best foot forward for the good of the movement.

01:02:00.000 Similarly, me and James Alsop are working on coming back together.

01:02:05.000 Now, I don't mean that in like a We're going to be doing a podcast or collaborating or anything like that.

01:02:11.000 But we are patching things up.

01:02:11.000 I mean, who knows?

01:02:15.000 We're mutuals on Twitter again.

01:02:17.000 And I think that's a good thing.

01:02:18.000 I think that's a step in the right direction that after a year of turmoil and conflict and infighting, some of it justified, some people might contend, some of it was not.

01:02:29.000 I think we're finally pulling things back together with a unified goal, with a unified front, a unified strategy, and it's a beautiful thing.

01:02:37.000 So I'm very pleased to see it.

01:02:39.000 We're all smiles here.

01:02:40.000 It was a very angry year, but I think we're going to be very happy this year.

01:02:43.000 I think things are looking up finally.

01:02:45.000 Big white pills.

01:02:47.000 So let's take a look at some of our stream labs here.

01:02:49.000 We've got Rawhide76 who says, Funny to see how boomer conservatives like Dinesh D'Souza try so hard to prove to the left they aren't racist through interviewing Richard Spencer.

01:03:01.000 Goes to show they are defined by their enemies, not good people to follow.

01:03:05.000 Very true.

01:03:07.000 And that's what the racist paradigm does it lets the enemy define you.

01:03:11.000 And that's the most pernicious thing about it.

01:03:13.000 I'm a very smart person in terms of rhetoric and strategy.

01:03:17.000 This is why I've never lost a debate.

01:03:19.000 I've never lost a debate because I know how to frame.

01:03:22.000 I know how rhetoric works.

01:03:23.000 I know how persuasion works.

01:03:25.000 And, you know, don't get me wrong, I'm young, but I have a pretty good intuitive grasp.

01:03:30.000 And on the subject of racism, what this does, in effect, is it puts conservatives, Republicans, white people always on the defensive.

01:03:39.000 And when you're on the defensive, you are defined in terms of the attack.

01:03:43.000 This is what people truly don't understand if you are defending yourself, You are using energy.

01:03:50.000 You're using time that people are paying attention to you.

01:03:53.000 You're using words or characters online if you're tweeting, talking about how the enemy is framing you.

01:04:00.000 If you're saying, I'm not a racist, that's time that you could have been spending saying that the Democrats are pedophiles or the Democrats want to remove and replace you in your own country.

01:04:10.000 But instead, when we devote all these resources to defending, to blocking an attack, we're not getting an alternative, compelling message out for our own.

01:04:21.000 Positive values, and I mean that in the propositional sense.

01:04:24.000 So that's really the takeaway you should never be on the defensive and use this.

01:04:29.000 If you're ever in an argument, it doesn't even have to be political.

01:04:33.000 You'll know that this is true if you use this strategy. 0.99

01:04:37.000 If you're even in a stupid fight, and I'm the expert of this because I'm great at antagonizing people, even if you're in a stupid fight where people are like, oh, like you're short or something, or you're dumb, or you know, even just a goofy thing, never defend, always attack and see how it works out for you. 0.99

01:04:53.000 If you're debating your wife or something, About, oh, you never take out the garbage, honey, or something like that. 1.00

01:04:59.000 Just go on, well, maybe not with your wife, okay?

01:05:01.000 But if it's a friend or something like that, a roommate, always go on the attack.

01:05:06.000 Find which button to press.

01:05:08.000 Just keep throwing out diverse, different attacks and constantly, relentlessly, and find which one sticks.

01:05:15.000 Find the one that makes them mad.

01:05:17.000 Find the one that makes them go back on their heels and attempt to defend.

01:05:20.000 If they say, oh, that's not true, or no, that's not fair, I'm not that way, then just keep pounding on that one.

01:05:26.000 That's the weakness.

01:05:27.000 And that's how you win, that's how you do it.

01:05:29.000 That's how you do it in an interpersonal argument.

01:05:32.000 That's how you win the national argument always attack.

01:05:36.000 Find the attack that is effective, which hits a nerve, and then keep hitting it.

01:05:41.000 That's why the Democrats always use the racist thing.

01:05:43.000 Well, that's part of it.

01:05:45.000 But a big part of it is that they know that we, oh, I'm not racist.

01:05:48.000 I'm not racist.

01:05:49.000 Look at this.

01:05:50.000 Look at that. 0.99

01:05:50.000 No, no, you're the racist. 0.99

01:05:52.000 And it's never as effective.

01:05:53.000 Ignore, give an equally compelling message.

01:05:56.000 You know, people say, Nick, you're this, you're that. 1.00

01:05:59.000 You're an anti Semite. 1.00

01:06:00.000 You're a racist. 1.00

01:06:01.000 You're a white nationalist. 1.00

01:06:02.000 You're a Nazi. 1.00

01:06:03.000 I don't say, no, I'm not.

01:06:04.000 No, I'm not.

01:06:05.000 You can't say that.

01:06:06.000 Actually, I'm not, even though none of that's true. 0.99

01:06:09.000 I say, okay, well, and you're a pedophile. 0.99

01:06:12.000 And so, what about that? 0.98

01:06:13.000 You know, Vic Berger, who makes fun of me.

01:06:15.000 A neo Nazi, Nick Fuentes, blah, blah, blah. 1.00

01:06:17.000 Okay, you look like a pedophile. 1.00

01:06:19.000 You defend pedophiles. 1.00

01:06:21.000 And who's worse, a pedophile or somebody who's a racist, honestly? 0.92

01:06:24.000 If we could, if we had to make the tabulation and not saying that I am, who's worse, you, pedophile, or me, alleged racist? 0.98

01:06:31.000 Anybody's going to say pedophile. 0.72

01:06:33.000 But that's how you have to do it.

01:06:35.000 That's how it has to work.

01:06:36.000 You're in a debate with a left wing person. 1.00

01:06:38.000 You're a racist. 0.98

01:06:39.000 Yeah, so what? 1.00

01:06:40.000 You defend people that literally molest children.

01:06:43.000 Done.

01:06:45.000 So let's see.

01:06:46.000 What else do we have?

01:06:47.000 True Bell Thomas says Hey, Nick, what do you think is the effect of having high IQ immigration versus low IQ immigration? 0.90

01:06:55.000 Canada seems like it's being taken over by high IQ immigrants from Asia and elsewhere. 0.99

01:06:59.000 Do you think Canada will be better off or worse than the U.S. in 50 years? 1.00

01:07:04.000 That's a good question. 1.00

01:07:06.000 And really, the ideal solution is no immigration, right?

01:07:11.000 Because we don't want to determine immigration simply by IQ. 0.72

01:07:15.000 You'll find that if we replace white people with Asian high IQ immigrants, you're still replacing white people. 0.74

01:07:21.000 You're still going to have a heterogeneous country that is unstable and has civil unrest as a feature. 0.89

01:07:29.000 So it's not purely about IQ, it's about homogeneity, it's about cohesion, identity.

01:07:36.000 And the reason we bring up the low IQ is just to say, you know, look, these are in practical ways how we can understand, number one, that groups are different. 0.91

01:07:46.000 And so when we talk about bringing in Italians, Being able to assimilate versus Mexicans, well, it's different because they're different peoples. 1.00

01:07:54.000 They're not equal. 1.00

01:07:55.000 That's not to say one's better than the other, but one is certainly going to cause less problems than the other, integrating or assimilating for a number of reasons, but that's one of them. 0.96

01:08:04.000 And so I think on the one hand, it's an argument about tribes being real, race being real, but by the same token, it says in a very tangible way, well, if we're bringing in these people, it tells us that they can't build a functioning society. 0.84

01:08:19.000 And they won't build one here.

01:08:20.000 And it's not because they didn't have the right culture.

01:08:23.000 It's because they're literally unable to. 0.91

01:08:25.000 You know, if we trot out this talking point of, yeah, the immigration, this is the Jason Rich wine, the immigration from Mexico is low IQ, and low IQ means you're not able to participate in a liberal democracy. 0.85

01:08:38.000 Well, then the question is not about assimilation. 0.59

01:08:41.000 It's about, well, I mean, that's just not even on the table.

01:08:44.000 If they can't be assimilated, it's how much are we willing to tolerate of barbarism? 0.82

01:08:50.000 Graham says, My father is a 66 year old boomer, watches Fox News, says the migrant crisis in Europe and in North America is fine because they'll assimilate in a generation and their birth rates will go down and will level off and not largely impact demographics. 0.83

01:09:05.000 Well, I mean, and here's a perfect example of this assimilation, I mean, that's just not true.

01:09:11.000 When you look at IQ, and I referenced Jason Richwine like three sentences ago, he said in his report, I think he was at Harvard, he wrote in his doctorate thesis or something. 0.86

01:09:23.000 In one of his college papers, that if you, and he did all the research for this, the IQ does not change after three generations.

01:09:32.000 So these people come over here.

01:09:34.000 Average IQ in America is 100. 0.99

01:09:36.000 Average IQ of Mexico, 88. 1.00

01:09:38.000 They come over here and they're a whole standard deviation lower. 1.00

01:09:41.000 Now, 88 is like dull.

01:09:43.000 I think that's literally how they classify it in terms of IQs dull.

01:09:48.000 They come over here for three generations.

01:09:50.000 This is the case.

01:09:51.000 For three generations, this was found in Sam Huntington's book. 1.00

01:09:55.000 Not only do the Hispanics not get smarter or their IQ doesn't raise, but by the same token, not only do they not get more educated, they get less educated. 1.00

01:10:05.000 You can look it up. 1.00

01:10:06.000 It's in the book, Who Are We by Sam Huntington.

01:10:08.000 He does all the research for this.

01:10:10.000 He found that actually third generation Hispanics are less educated than the first generation, if you can believe it. 0.94

01:10:17.000 Lower rate of high school graduation, or maybe than the second generation.

01:10:21.000 But it's not like the trend doesn't, it's not like the trend, not only does it not get better, it doesn't stay the same, it goes down. 0.97

01:10:29.000 And so this assimilation kind of stuff, I think a great example of it is black people. 0.77

01:10:34.000 Can we say that black people have really assimilated? 0.89

01:10:36.000 Can anyone truly say that?

01:10:38.000 Now, some might take it for granted.

01:10:40.000 But I've often used the argument the murder rate in Chicago, or the murder rate for African Americans at large, is more comparable to West Africa than it is to Europe or America or any other Western country. 0.50

01:10:54.000 If you take the white murder rate, it's the same as Europeans. 0.53

01:10:56.000 So you tell me is that assimilation? 0.84

01:11:00.000 They have a certain dialect, by and large.

01:11:03.000 Now, some people say that's its own language, some people call it Ebonics.

01:11:07.000 Can we say that that's truly assimilated?

01:11:09.000 You look at Asian immigrants. 0.96

01:11:11.000 Who are second generation, and they're almost indistinguishable in terms of the way they talk from a regular English speaker, a native speaker, because they are a native speaker. 0.99

01:11:20.000 Now, what about people who are. 0.94

01:11:23.000 They talk in a totally different way? 0.97

01:11:24.000 Is that assimilation? 0.81

01:11:26.000 I mean, they have a totally different culture. 1.00

01:11:28.000 And look, that's fine.

01:11:29.000 It's American, it's African American culture.

01:11:32.000 But can you say that they've assimilated into an Anglo Protestant?

01:11:35.000 Not really, not at all.

01:11:37.000 Now, that's not to say that African Americans haven't been a part of this country since the founding, and they've been here forever, and.

01:11:44.000 I think they have a right to be here.

01:11:45.000 Of course they do, and they have a right to be a part of the country.

01:11:47.000 They're American.

01:11:49.000 That's how it's been forever.

01:11:50.000 And I don't even say that, like, reluctantly.

01:11:52.000 That's the fact of the matter. 0.66

01:11:53.000 But when people try and say that, well, they're assimilating, just look at all the congressmen that showed up to Trump's State of the Union in African garb. 0.82

01:12:00.000 Is that assimilation?

01:12:01.000 I don't think so.

01:12:02.000 So, look, if they want to assimilate, by all means.

01:12:06.000 But they're going to have to drop this anti-America thing, African garb thing, we're different, we're special, all this kind of stuff.

01:12:14.000 They don't even want to assimilate in many cases.

01:12:16.000 Now, some of them do, and some of them have. 0.87

01:12:18.000 But you see it largely in the mainstream culture, it is a message of anti America and black power.

01:12:26.000 And that's not assimilation.

01:12:28.000 So, you know, for all this talk about, well, you know, we'll just bring these people in. 1.00

01:12:32.000 And then the last thing I'll say on the matter with Mexican immigrants is they actually don't assimilate. 1.00

01:12:38.000 That's the funny thing. 1.00

01:12:39.000 Even if you could say blacks have assimilated, Mexicans have not, not at all. 0.94

01:12:43.000 I've assimilated because my Mexican ancestors came here 120 years ago. 0.98

01:12:48.000 You know, they were in Texas.

01:12:49.000 So, they were here longer than the Americans, right? 1.00

01:12:52.000 But anyway, when Mexicans come here now, what do they do? 1.00

01:12:57.000 They go to LA or they go to Texas or they go to Arizona. 1.00

01:12:59.000 I think it's something like 60% of them are in the Southwest, or 70% of them are in like 100 counties across the country.

01:13:06.000 So, it's very concentrated.

01:13:08.000 And what do they do when they come here? 0.91

01:13:10.000 They concentrate in Mexican communities where they speak Spanish, where it's a constant flow of illegal and legal immigrants into the same place. 0.97

01:13:18.000 And so, they never have to assimilate. 0.98

01:13:20.000 Assimilation is not something that happens organically.

01:13:23.000 When it happened 100 years ago, when we had big waves of immigration, you had awesome infrastructure, institutions dedicated to actively assimilating people, English speaking and teaching them the creed, teaching them American history, all this kind of stuff.

01:13:39.000 You had the Pledge of Allegiance. 0.98

01:13:41.000 You couldn't do anything if you didn't speak the language.

01:13:43.000 But now they don't have to assimilate, they have a parallel society.

01:13:47.000 Go to Miami and tell me that Mexican people who go to Miami have to assimilate. 0.59

01:13:52.000 They have to assimilate to a South American country, basically, is what it is down there, or in L.A. 0.79

01:13:59.000 So, I don't know where he expects them to assimilate into, but I mean, these are some of the arguments that can be used.

01:14:05.000 It's a pipe dream.

01:14:07.000 Joe the Boomer says, It's a me, Joe the Boomer.

01:14:10.000 Brosif convinced me to get on Twitter at The Daily Brap.

01:14:14.000 Tune in for show updates and Joe the Boomer takes.

01:14:17.000 I noticed I got a follow from The Big Kahuna.

01:14:20.000 Can you guess who it is? 0.57

01:14:22.000 It's the handsome Spanish King reading this.

01:14:24.000 P.S. Check your P.O. box, Nick. 0.93

01:14:26.000 Much appreciated, big guy.

01:14:28.000 We'll check the P.O. box.

01:14:30.000 And yeah, I guess check out The Daily Brap, right?

01:14:33.000 If you bring it back on my server, I can endorse it, but you can't be doing it on the alternative server. 0.99

01:14:40.000 We love Jill the Boomer.

01:14:41.000 Great guy.

01:14:42.000 And let's look at our super chats.

01:14:44.000 Only a few here, so that's good.

01:14:46.000 We can call it a night quickly.

01:14:48.000 Eric Wright says four foot tall letters.

01:14:50.000 That's as tall as Ben Shapiro. 0.70

01:14:51.000 Yeah, very true.

01:14:53.000 Cyrus Irena says thoughts on the Pope's stance on the death penalty.

01:14:59.000 You know, it's really unfortunate with the Pope because you try and defend him.

01:15:04.000 You try and you try and you try to defend this guy, and the problem is the pattern.

01:15:11.000 If there was one or two things, it'd be like, okay, well, you know, the usual arguments.

01:15:15.000 But, I mean, he clearly does not give a damn about Catholic tradition, about Catholic dogma, about the sacred magisterium, about scripture, or any of that.

01:15:26.000 The death penalty has been approved of and been accepted as amoral, not immoral, not moral, but amoral, meaning it's permissible by Catholic teaching.

01:15:38.000 All the early church fathers said it was okay.

01:15:40.000 You had dozens of popes say it was okay.

01:15:43.000 The church teaching.

01:15:45.000 For millennia, it has been okay.

01:15:48.000 And so clearly, he has no regard for any of that.

01:15:51.000 And by the way, he's not, when he says that it's no longer church teaching, the catechism is not a part, thank God, is not infallible, is not a part of official doctrine.

01:16:02.000 It's not the sacred magisterium.

01:16:05.000 So technically, it's not a reversal. 0.99

01:16:08.000 And Catholics are getting so sick of the technicalities because it's bullshit. 0.99

01:16:12.000 You know, believe me, I'm not like, oh, no, no, Protestant. 0.99

01:16:16.000 Technically, it's not that. 0.76

01:16:17.000 I mean, we're mad as hell, too.

01:16:21.000 He's really doing a disservice to the church, and I'm sure driving the faithful away because people take their faith very seriously. 0.81

01:16:28.000 People make very tremendous sacrifices to play by the rules, right, that are laid out by the Catholic Church, which certainly are more strenuous than being a Protestant.

01:16:37.000 You know, if I were a Protestant, do you know how much I could get away with if I were a Protestant?

01:16:42.000 I wouldn't have to be guilty with if I were just a Protestant. 0.55

01:16:45.000 If I were a Protestant, how I could eat. 0.67

01:16:47.000 Like a pig, I like McDonald's all day long, and I could hoard all my wealth and go into church on Sunday.

01:16:54.000 Yeah, maybe, maybe I'll just watch a podcast or something. 0.85

01:16:57.000 You know, if it were that simple, I wouldn't have to get all dressed up.

01:17:01.000 I could go on a t shirt and flip flops to the municipal looking building if I was a Protestant.

01:17:08.000 But I'm a Catholic because we believe that Peter's the foundation of the church, and so we respect the rules, we respect all that comes a part of it.

01:17:16.000 And when Pope Francis turns around and says, Yeah, I basically don't care about this, I'm just going to give the Finger to the faithful is very difficult.

01:17:24.000 So it's causing a little bit of a crisis of faith for me, I have to say.

01:17:27.000 I still believe that's what would be faith if it were so easily called into doubt.

01:17:33.000 But it's very hard because you do try and be a good Catholic, and when you're not, you certainly feel the shame and all that.

01:17:40.000 You try and rework your life so it's consistent with the rules.

01:17:44.000 And then the leader of the faith is like, Yeah, I'm just, yeah, anyone can get into heaven, and anything goes basically.

01:17:51.000 Who cares?

01:17:53.000 It's very hard, very hard.

01:17:56.000 It'd be like if you had a teacher like that, you know, a teacher in school.

01:17:59.000 Do as I say, not as I do.

01:18:01.000 All the rules laying down, and you follow the rules, you do your homework, all the rest, and they don't even care.

01:18:07.000 They don't even care.

01:18:09.000 Simon Skola says, IE should call themselves the Triangle Nibbus.

01:18:13.000 Yeah, well, I'll suggest that to Pat next time I see him.

01:18:17.000 The Triangle Nibbus, yeah.

01:18:19.000 They got to change the logo.

01:18:21.000 I will say, the name I like, the color scheme I'm not wild about, the logo I'm not wild about.

01:18:28.000 I get why they do it, but the triangle, to me, it's like, Why?

01:18:32.000 It doesn't resonate.

01:18:33.000 Make it an eagle.

01:18:34.000 Make it an effing eagle or something, you know?

01:18:38.000 Anyway, those are all our Streamlabs and Superchats.

01:18:43.000 I think that's everything.

01:18:45.000 No, I'm sorry.

01:18:45.000 We got one more from JK Hoffi who says Hey, Nick, I unironically would pay for a book written by you teaching people how to debate.

01:18:53.000 I'd pay even more money if you called it The Art of the Knife.

01:18:55.000 It would have to be an original.

01:18:56.000 I wouldn't make it like a tongue in cheek thing.

01:19:02.000 I don't know.

01:19:02.000 Maybe, perhaps.

01:19:04.000 I will say that.

01:19:06.000 Like, I'm not an expert.

01:19:08.000 Most of my knowledge just comes from an intuition, just comes from instinct.

01:19:12.000 I'm very much against systematic people who say, well, in order to talk about something, you have to have gone through the process and gone through the steps and read this book cover to cover and that book and know X amount of things.

01:19:28.000 I'm not a systematic type person.

01:19:30.000 I'm very based on intuition, instinct.

01:19:32.000 I just kind of go with what I think feels right intuitively, instinctually.

01:19:37.000 And so I wouldn't.

01:19:39.000 I would not write a book about politics for a while because I need to read more, because I need to know more things before I could adequately contribute something that's new and contextual.

01:19:51.000 But on something like speaking or debating, the intuition is all really that there is, is the instinct of it.

01:19:59.000 You don't really need an empirical knowledge or an education and that kind of thing to just know what works.

01:20:04.000 And so I don't know, maybe I'd have to think about it really hard, but who knows?

01:20:08.000 Maybe I'd do it.

01:20:08.000 Maybe I'd put together a video series or something, perhaps a book.

01:20:14.000 Because it is a skill set.

01:20:16.000 It's something that I think you're born with.

01:20:18.000 It's something that's natural, but it's certainly something that people I think would find useful.

01:20:23.000 It's one of the most asked questions.

01:20:24.000 I get emails, curious cat questions, people saying, you know, how do I give a speech?

01:20:29.000 How do I be less nervous?

01:20:30.000 How do I debate?

01:20:31.000 This kind of thing.

01:20:32.000 And I don't know.

01:20:33.000 Maybe I'll make videos about it.

01:20:35.000 Who knows?

01:20:36.000 But it looks like that's everything.

01:20:37.000 I think those are all our Streamlabs and Super Chats.

01:20:40.000 I think we're going to call it a night.

01:20:43.000 My tummy is growling.

01:20:44.000 I'm hungry.

01:20:45.000 I got this fluoride on my teeth because I just went to the dentist.

01:20:48.000 And that was, I hate the dentist.

01:20:51.000 I mean, I don't hate the guy, but I just hate going.

01:20:55.000 I mean, they're messing around in there and it hurts.

01:20:58.000 And then you hear it, it like hurts your ears.

01:21:01.000 Because I don't mind the pain.

01:21:02.000 I can take the, I have a pretty high threshold for that kind of pain.

01:21:07.000 But the problem is the noise.

01:21:09.000 Oh, it just really gets to you. 0.85

01:21:11.000 And she's just digging around in there.

01:21:13.000 I want to be like, lady, are you finished?

01:21:14.000 I can't even talk.

01:21:15.000 I got drool all over the place.

01:21:18.000 You know, you're completely immobilized.

01:21:19.000 You got, you know, your mouth is dry.

01:21:21.000 It's horrible.

01:21:22.000 It's so unpleasant.

01:21:23.000 Why can't we figure something else out?

01:21:26.000 You know, and so then they put the fluoride on.

01:21:29.000 I think they said I had a cavity, but the guy said it so cavalierly, I don't even know.

01:21:34.000 He's like, Yeah, that's most definitely a cavity.

01:21:37.000 I'm like, What?

01:21:38.000 What?

01:21:39.000 I couldn't even really react to it at first because he's, you know, digging around in there.

01:21:43.000 And then I'm like, Well, which tooth is it?

01:21:45.000 He's like, Back left.

01:21:46.000 All right, you're all set.

01:21:47.000 Have a good one.

01:21:48.000 I'm like, Well, wait, if I have a cavity, aren't you going to schedule an appointment?

01:21:52.000 Are you going to tell me something?

01:21:54.000 So, I'm just going to leave it alone.

01:21:55.000 I'm just going to leave it.

01:21:56.000 I'm going to brush my teeth really well.

01:21:58.000 I'm going to floss and all that.

01:21:59.000 But he put the fluoride on there.

01:22:01.000 Maybe that's good enough, right?

01:22:03.000 Maybe I don't need to go in for an invasive procedure.

01:22:06.000 I have to go dig around and inject me with something.

01:22:09.000 Not about that.

01:22:12.000 So we'll see.

01:22:13.000 I had another dentist tell me that I had a cavity like two years ago, and it was a different tooth.

01:22:20.000 Didn't detect it this time, huh?

01:22:22.000 So I think it's a big ripoff.

01:22:24.000 Because like two years ago, never had a cavity, by the way.

01:22:27.000 Two years ago, I go to this dentist, different dentist.

01:22:30.000 And he's like, oh, yeah, you have a very small cavity.

01:22:32.000 But he said it was a different tooth than this one that the guy said, back left.

01:22:36.000 He said it was a different one.

01:22:38.000 He's like, oh, so we'll set up an appointment to get it filled.

01:22:40.000 I'm like, no, I'm not going to.

01:22:42.000 If it's a small cavity, we'll figure it out.

01:22:44.000 All right, I'm not about to, because it costs a lot of money and it's all the rest.

01:22:50.000 And so two years passes.

01:22:52.000 I brush my teeth well, going to the dentist.

01:22:54.000 Oh, funnily enough, they don't detect that cavity this time.

01:22:57.000 So what's going on, right?

01:22:59.000 You know, it's like with Santa Claus.

01:23:01.000 When you want to prove Santa Claus isn't real, You just say in your head, Well, I want this for Christmas.

01:23:05.000 And when you don't get it, it's like, Well, obviously, it's not real.

01:23:08.000 Same thing with the dentist.

01:23:10.000 You see one dentist, they tell you where the cavity is.

01:23:12.000 Then you see another dentist.

01:23:14.000 And hey, if they see the same cavity, maybe you have a problem.

01:23:17.000 If not, it's a guessing game.

01:23:18.000 They're ripping you off.

01:23:19.000 And that's what I think is happening.

01:23:21.000 So that's our show.

01:23:23.000 That's our show.

01:23:24.000 Don't trust your dentist.

01:23:25.000 Remember to sign up for America First Premium at NicholasJFuentes.comslash membership.

01:23:30.000 It's only five bucks a month.

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01:23:59.000 There's like 30 or 20 hours of additional content on SoundCloud for you as well, like 10 episodes of World Report and Election HQ.

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01:24:22.000 We've had it back for about a month, a little over a month.

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01:24:34.000 So be sure to check that out.

01:24:35.000 The link is in the description, NicholasJFuentes.comslash.

01:24:40.000 What is that?

01:24:42.000 Oh no, slash membership.

01:24:43.000 That's right.

01:24:44.000 Sometimes you just blank out when you're high IQ like that.

01:24:46.000 NicholasJFuentes.com slash membership.

01:24:49.000 Very quick sign up.

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01:24:59.000 We're on the air Monday through Friday, 7 p.m. Central, 8 p.m. Eastern Standard Time.

01:25:03.000 I'm Nicholas J. Fuentes.

01:25:04.000 This was America First, as always.

01:25:06.000 Thank you guys for watching.

01:25:07.000 Thank you to Patrick Casey for joining me.

01:25:10.000 For a great conversation.

01:25:11.000 Thank you to all our stream labbers, super chatters, premium members, and anybody who watches the show.

01:25:17.000 We love you folks.

01:25:19.000 And we'll see you tomorrow.

01:25:20.000 What's tomorrow, Friday?

01:25:22.000 Yeah, we'll see you tomorrow.

01:25:23.000 I don't think there's anything planned.

01:25:24.000 We'll see you tomorrow for just a casual Friday episode.

01:25:27.000 Until then, have a great rest of your evening.

01:25:31.000 Americanism, not globalism, will be our credo.

01:25:39.000 It's going to be only.

01:25:41.000 America first, America first. 0.97

01:25:43.000 The American people will come first once again. 0.98

America First - Nicholas J. Fuentes - August 02, 2018

American Identitarianism feat. Patrick Casey | America First Ep. 213

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