Tonight's episode is part 5 in our epic volsunga saga series. We start on chapter 22 of the Volsunga Saga. This episode is dedicated to the memory of the late, great, great folkbuilder, and all-around great man, Urda, who passed away at the age of 76.
00:06:34.880I'm looking forward to sharing that with everybody and meeting any of you I haven't met and getting together with those of you who I haven't seen in a while.
00:06:44.480So if you are able to make that, please contact your local folk builder, then get you all squared away.
00:06:53.460Update on our efforts to pay off Njordsov.
00:10:32.000we have started to get those regularly we load those up we make sure we answer all your questions
00:10:37.440we really appreciate them we've got two of them for tonight yep we've got some loaded up so
00:10:44.320that is always an option for you guys please remember to do that if you'd like and it's fun
00:10:51.920uh does anybody need to know anything as we prepare to go into the text this evening
00:10:57.280um for those a brief recap um sigurd has uh slain fafnir he also decapitates um rayon the
00:11:13.220blacksmith who was plotting against him who was basically using him as a pawn to get rid of the
00:11:19.300dragon. Um, and, uh, because he consumes the blood, um, he, of the dragon, he can hear the
00:11:28.300birds speak and they tell him, oh, this poor kid doesn't even know that he's about to get,
00:11:32.720uh, bushwhacked by his friend. And he, uh, ends that. And then, you know, he takes the gold
00:11:40.760And he makes his his move. And then he gains the word of knowing that there is a Valkyrie, a Valkyrie that is on top of a mountain ringed in fire.
00:11:57.760so he decides i'm gonna go there and i'm going to uh break through there and he does
00:12:04.080and he awakens from her slumber which again huge fairy tale uh kind of trope there in the sense
00:12:15.360that uh you can kind of see where a lot of these fairy tales most likely got their um
00:12:22.800this inspiration from he wakes her up and when he does she tells him why she was in slumber
00:12:31.120she had went against the edict and the will of lord othen and was punished but then she breaks
00:12:38.480out so much lore to help him and this is a huge arian uh story concept is the the um
00:12:50.560The feminine power is in a place that is cordoned off, and it takes a great feat to get through it.
00:13:01.660And then once you do, there is this gaining of knowledge.0.60
00:17:13.080And the image of a dragon is drawn thereon.
00:17:16.000and the same was dark brown above and bright red below and with even such like image was adorned
00:17:25.620a helm and saddle and coat armor and he was clad with a golden bear knee which is a chainmail shirt
00:17:35.000uh usually stopping mid bicep and going down just above the knees um and was often either
00:17:43.560donned by going over the head or uh tying and pinching together um and all of his weapons
00:17:53.180were wrought with gold so now we have the emblazoned warrior um his colors you know the
00:18:02.420red and brown with the red gold images of the dragon all over his helm on his shield and
00:18:09.040And then he's wearing, and they say, you know, he has a coat armor, and I don't know if this perhaps is lending to a different type of armor placed over the bernie, perhaps like a robe-like garment, leather, perhaps metal ensconced in leather that's kind of placed over the bernie.
00:18:35.940But they seem to be two separate things.
00:18:39.040And now for this cause was the drake drawn on all of his weapons, that when he was seen of men, all folk might know who went there.
00:18:52.620I, all those who had heard of his slaying of that great dragon, that the Vor-rings call Thafnir, and for that cause are his weapons gold-wrought and brown of hue, and that he was far above other men in courtesy and in goodly manners, and well nigh in all things else.
00:19:15.280And when as folk tell of the mightiest champions and of the noblest chiefs, then ever is he named the foremost, and his name goes wide about on all tongues north of the sea of the Greek lands, and even so shall it be while the world endures.
00:19:37.480So all the way south to the land of the Greeks or the Mediterranean and northward to the vaulted lands of the Norse Germanics.
00:19:55.780now the hair of this sigurd was gold red of hue fair-fashioned and falling down in great locks
00:20:08.000thick and short was the beard and of no other color he was high-nosed broad and high-boned
00:20:17.360of face so keen were his eyes that few durst gaze up under the brows of him
00:20:24.440His shoulders were broad to look on as shoulders of two. Most dually was his body fashioned betwixt height and breadth.
00:20:38.240So he has fair and reddish blonde hair laying down in locks, and he has a short beard that's cut close but thickly.
00:20:57.080And he is not too tall, and he is not too stout.
00:21:03.180He is the perfect admixture of the two for himself.
00:21:06.560And his eyes are keen and driving so that it was rare that people would lock eyes with him.
00:21:53.160Now, seemliness, and this kind of correlates to a question that's in the queue. Seemly is the Germanic word for honorable. So to do something unseemly is to do something of no honor, or at least in a social sense.
00:22:12.700It may not necessarily be in a criminality sense, but, um, a lot of the Latin and Germanic, uh, conjunction of, or not conjunction of words, but usage in certain ways.
00:22:28.440And this writing certainly has a lot more of the Germanic usages.
00:22:34.720We were talking about victory and the Germanic equivalencies.
00:22:41.900So that's why I just saw that seemliness.
00:22:44.900He was wise and was of the seemly seemliest.
00:22:48.500And this is the sign told of his height, that when he was girt with his sword, Grom, which same was seven spans long, as he went through the full-grown rye fields, the dew shoe of the said sword smote the ears of the standing corn.
00:23:13.740And for all that, greater was his strength than his growth.
00:23:17.120So the the do shoe, I looked into that a little bit.
00:23:23.880And the only thing I can ascertain from that is the bottom of the sheath, the metal piece that keeps the sword from poking out of the bottom of the sheath is touching the top of the rye grass that he walks in.
00:23:44.060kind of again giving him just a massive stature um and i mean i would guess probably around six
00:23:53.640foot five um and but his strength was just as strong if not stronger than his his mass and
00:24:03.420this shows the perception of our ancestors they did know that there were people who were tall
00:24:08.360but not strong. That there was people who were perhaps short and round, but exceedingly,
00:24:15.640you know, strong or stable. And they're saying his proportions fit to where he was all of these
00:24:23.680things. Well, could he wield a sword and cast forth a spear? He could also shoot a shaft or
00:24:33.840an arrow and he could hold a shield bend a bow um back a horse and do all the goodly deeds that he
00:24:42.560learned in his youthful days so again these are also just markers of things that warriors should
00:24:52.160know and for a lot of folks you know they wonder about the usage i think uh most of uh the nordic
00:25:00.000um our ancestors or just germanic in general are not generally seen as using bows up until the
00:25:06.800english longbowmen of the middle the medieval uh or middle ages and um no they were clearly used
00:25:14.000and it speaks of the fact that they were probably of a good strength if the testament of being able
00:25:20.160to bend a bow was uh impressive so um but yet not only was his strength it was his mind wise he was
00:25:32.160to know things yet undone and the voice of all fowls he knew and that again kind of also comes
00:25:38.960from the fact that of the blood obviously clearly being able to understand the birds um where a few
00:25:45.920things fell on him unawares so he was uh understanding of both fate and of the the
00:25:52.720songs of birds of many words he was and so fair of speech with all that whensoever he made it his
00:26:04.160business to speak so again uh ferret with words meaning that he didn't speak over much um but
00:26:14.160when he did speak he never left speaking before that to all men it seemed full sure that no
00:26:21.600otherwise must the matter then be said so he would speak and then uh
00:26:28.960there was no over talking from it he would settle conversations um his sport and pleasure it was to
00:26:38.240give aid to his own folk and to prove himself in mighty matters and to take wealth from his
00:26:45.920unfriends found that as an interesting translation and give it to his friends um
00:26:54.640i would not want to be an unfriend um never did he lose heart and not was he a dread
00:27:02.560so he was not prone to bout of depression or um darkness he was a man of action um
00:27:14.960and and fulfilled that i think in in every again this is a slice of
00:27:24.480what you should aspire to nobody in the room or in the audience as the skull is speaking this story
00:27:31.120Nobody in there should be tearing Sigurd down. No one is like, well, you know, he isn't as big as they say. No, this is the aspiration to drive towards.
00:27:49.740And again, that aspiration has been culled from mortality into semi-divine.
00:27:57.960And every warrior should seek to be that, is kind of the laying of that.
00:29:13.580I don't want folks to ever think that that's locked in a historical period these things
00:29:27.660were exemplary about him his stature his power his skill his knowledge of things but also his
00:29:43.580his bearing his countenance his attitude on things and it's hard because it's not our lore
00:29:52.740is not itemized in like the most accessible way to download information you have to absorb it
00:30:01.140from a lot of different fragments a lot of different places and kind of integrate it into
00:30:06.700your your worldview and your understanding over time but it's talked about again and again about
00:30:13.980how noble people how great warriors how heroes how princes sons ought to be the bearing they
00:30:22.860ought to have what we see consistently is this idea of battle might um
00:30:37.420and i know that that might seem harder to access or harder to conceptualize
00:30:45.340today in in the same way we don't have the same need to uh throw spears or to loose arrows
00:30:56.380or to wield swords as our ancestors did but the capability of
00:31:05.340being formidable to the challenges that present themselves matters. The ability to face opposition
00:31:20.460with skill and with might. The physical bearing that speaks of health, that speaks of being
00:31:30.200strong and mighty and fit for physical challenges is every bit as relevant today as it once was.
00:31:39.520And it is useful, I think, to realize that and really absorb that.
00:31:47.360But also, more than that, what's spoken about, and we see a little glimpse of it here,
00:31:53.260is the idea of being joyous and being courageous.
00:32:00.200in our lore it's spoke well about being joyous through your struggles to be able to keep glad
00:32:12.880men it's described in the have them all to have you know
00:32:18.060To be able to hold your head up under adverse conditions and to not just kind of grit your teeth and bear through it, but be able to be cheerful and happy to be around through the struggles in your life and through the challenges that you face.
00:32:43.480You know, in the saga of Ragnar Lothbrok, there's his, you know, his death song where he's laughing even under the face of death.
00:32:58.780And it's particularly important in a day and age to where mental illness affects our people a lot now.
00:33:07.240But more than like clinical mental illness, overall depression and feeling beat down affects us tremendously today, especially young men in this day and age.
00:40:23.220She knows how to do things that better the home and better the folk there.
00:40:29.860And Heimir and Beckhild had a son and his name was Alsvid.
00:40:36.740says owls wid in english but also meaning um all fast or or very swift all swift and he was the
00:40:47.380most courteous of men now at this stead were men disporting them abroad but when they see the man
00:40:57.140riding there too they leave their play to want to wonder at him so here they're they're having sport
00:41:05.140they're doing something afield um you know playing playing some sort of game and when
00:41:11.940they see him crest over the hill they all run to see who's who's coming um
00:41:20.180for none such had they ever seen arist so that went they went to meet him and gave him good
00:41:27.380welcome all smith bade him abide and have such things at his hands as he would and he takes his
00:41:36.260bidding blithesomely due service with all was established four men bore the treasure of gold
00:41:46.820from off the horse and the fifth took took it to him to guard the same so all of the treasure of
00:41:54.500fafnir is on um sigurd's horse he's bedecked out in gold and and and steel and they run forward
00:42:06.340and they greet him kindly and four of them take the treasure relieve the goal like take the gold
00:42:15.060off the horse to relieve the horse and then a fifth man swears to sigurd that he will defend
00:42:22.100his property he will defend his treasure um and there's you know not a moment where they're like
00:42:28.560they're kind of coming into pilfer no this kind of great sense to to want to be able to help a great
00:42:36.940warrior um so they they bear the treasure and the fifth took took it to guard the same therein
00:42:45.520were many things to behold things of great price seldom seen and great game and joy of men
00:42:52.400had to look on bernies and helms and mighty rings and wondrous great gold stoops and all
00:43:00.480kinds of war weapons so there dwelt sigurd long and great honor holden and tidings of that deed
00:43:08.120of fame spread wide through all the lands of how he had slain that hideous and fearful dragon
00:43:14.560so good joints had they together each was leal to the other and their sport was arraying of the
00:43:24.160weapons and the chafing of arrows and the flyings of their falcons so he comes there and he's you
00:43:34.860know seeing the weapon i can i can just relate in the sense of like somebody showing up with just a
00:43:41.840big old bag of guns and it's like guns you've never seen before and your eyes get like saucers
00:43:47.880and um and and you want to test them out you want to shoot the arrows and so he is uh greeted there
00:43:56.960and uh the warriors do as warriors do and he is celebrated um yeah well there's a couple of things
00:44:07.780First, in the side chat, Pacific Northwest, he mentions a have them all verse relevant to what we were talking about at the end of the last chapter.
00:44:34.800So, yeah, no, that's a stanza that I like a great deal and that I think all of our men, Swan and myself included, will all do well to frequently take to heart and use as a measuring stick of how we carry ourselves and how we behave.
00:45:01.260And I like the juxtaposition of these two things or the pairing of these two things, I suppose, to be both brave and joyous, to bravely and gladly do a task or go through life's struggles.
00:45:20.680That means a lot, and it is much easier said than done.
00:45:24.100But, you know, carrying yourself in a joyous way and a brave fashion is so very important and is such an inspiration to those around you, be they your family, be they men and women who are in your presence and look to you, for example.
00:45:46.460One of the other things I think is just kind of interesting about this passage, you know, Spahn talks about how these guys are excited to be helping out a great hero and to be in his company.
00:46:00.480Yes, the stories that make it to us are the lays of heroes, but they realize that everybody in society is not sicker there.
00:46:11.500But there is a tremendous honor and benefit and something to aspire to be in the company of great men, to be in their retinue, to be in their service, to be led by them, to be with them.
00:47:02.540figured out their place in the pecking order you aspired to the best things you could achieve
00:47:08.640but you took great honor in being in the service of someone who is great of a great king of a great
00:47:16.320lord in the in the band of a of a great hero was a tremendous honor whether or not you're the hero
00:47:22.540or whether you're playing more of a support role there's a tremendous dignity in that
00:47:27.280yeah i think i i'm uh definitely prone to bouts of darkness and grimness after the fact of things
00:47:38.940i think when i'm in the middle of really hard times i can be almost inappropriately be when
00:47:46.500other people are very stern um but then afterwards i can go into these great bouts of darkness and i
00:47:54.380You know, battling that is, I think, very important. I think there was a wise man that said that you live through a crucible, but are defeated by the ghosts of that event.
00:48:10.180And he was saying, how could you imagine that you you you go through this crucible that makes you stronger, makes you who you are, but then you are destroyed by the ghosts of it.
00:48:22.700and that's almost an insult to the moment.
00:48:48.960But a lot of the things that are common sense and ought to go without saying slip under the radar because nobody stops to ponder them or stops to realize there's success in life and doing the right thing.
00:49:15.600living ausitru it's part of there's a there's a lot of meta in the title of this show one of the
00:49:23.940ideas of victory never sleeps is that there is a daily work to be done to achieve to accomplish
00:49:34.420to earn worth through doing these things working at being more courageous or continuing to be
00:49:45.160courageous working at finding gladness even when you don't feel inclined to do so even when you
00:49:54.540want to be grumpy or you want to be down in the mouth or when you find yourself slipping it's a
00:49:58.820constant effort to stay you know just out of the jaws of the wolf uh like like uh soul and money
00:50:08.880we need to always be moving forward you can't rest on your laurels you have to stay vigilant
00:50:15.720to not let these things creep in and to check yourself to make sure you're the best you can be
00:50:22.180and when I say that you know you need to do that I mean we all need to do that it's something that
00:50:27.400I try to be very conscious of uh each day and you know sometimes I succeed sometimes I don't
00:50:34.640Sometimes it's a mixture of the two. I like to think that I come out ahead more often than I don't. But that's certainly my intent every day. And I think that no matter where we are on the scale of victory or defeat, we could all be better.
00:50:55.280we can all do more and be more, and we owe it to ourselves and to those around us to strive for
00:51:03.920those things. So checking in on these things time and time again is a never-ending cycle that
00:51:09.700should strengthen us and help move us forward.
00:51:23.920they um fly their falcons of course the translation is hawkham or hawks um so
00:51:34.780interesting there too they i assume the falcon word is perhaps maybe latin derived but
00:51:42.360hawk was kind of probably utilized for all manner of birds um and there there again is a reference
00:51:50.480to falconry which i kind of like that stuff again and two it's not really talked about so much in
00:51:58.360um uh our ancestors day and age of the the viking age and you know generally seen as something
00:52:09.160done more in the medieval times, but no, they had hawks and really cool weapons and were
00:52:20.180all about that stuff. Let's see, chapter 24. Sigurd sees Brynhild at Klimdel. In those
00:52:34.140days came home to hamer brinhild his foster daughter and she set in her bower with her maidens
00:52:45.420and could do more skill in handicraft than other women so now you know she's good at battlecraft0.95
00:52:53.580but she doesn't she's not she's not uh slacking in the the duties that you know make a household0.97
00:53:01.420good it's just that her sister's better at it um but then it goes again into almost
00:53:10.120unbelievable levels it's it's it's uh the met the uh extraordinary for sure um she sat she
00:53:20.820overlaid cloth with gold and sewing therein the great deeds which sigurd wrought the slaying of
00:53:27.880the worm and the taking of the wealth of him and the death of ray rayin with all so she's making
00:53:35.560a tapestry and she's telling that story now tells the tale that on a day sigurd rode into the wood
00:53:47.180with his hawk and hound and men thronging so he had a good hunting party and when as he came home
00:53:57.020his hawk flew up to a high tower and sat him down on a certain window then fared sigurd after his
00:54:06.140hawk and he saw whereas sat a fair woman and knew that it was brinhild and he deems all things he
00:54:16.040sees there to be worthy together so he he sees the synchronicity he sees the beauty of the hawk
00:54:25.040and bring hills and it strikes him um both her fairness and the fair things that she wrought
00:54:36.160and therewith he goes into the hall but has no more joyous in the games of men and folk
00:54:42.960Then spoke Alsvid. Now, Alsvid is the prince of this land, Heimir's son.
00:54:56.420Actually, in essence, he would also be Brynhild's nephew.
00:55:01.880Then spoke Alsvid, why art thou so bare of bliss? This manner of thine grieveth us, thy friends.
00:55:10.920why when wilt thou not hold to the glee some ways lo thy hawk's pine now and thy horse
00:55:19.580granny it droops and long will it be air we are booted thereof and sigurd answers in return
00:55:28.540good friend hearken to that which lies on my mind for my heart flew up to a certain tower
00:55:35.160And when I came thereto and took him, lo, there did I see a fair woman, and she sat by needlework of gold, and did thereon my deeds that are past and my deeds that are to come.
00:55:51.460And then Alsvid said, thou hast seen Brynhild, Putley's daughter, the greatest of great women.
00:56:00.420I, verily, said Sigurd, but how came she hither?
00:56:08.180Auschwitz answered, short space there was betwixt the coming hither and the twain of you.
00:56:15.300Sigurd says, I, but few days ago I knew her for the best of the world's women.
00:56:23.080Auschwitz said, give not all thy heed to one woman.
00:56:28.380Being such a man as thou art, ill life it is to sit lamenting for what we may not have.
00:56:37.880I shall go and meet her, says Sigurd, and get from her her love like my love and give her a golden ring in token thereof.
01:13:28.680no i think that's a little too dark in the skin on that
01:13:37.480hmm uh it's funny i went to uh when i was in sweden visiting our members there
01:13:46.920i could just pick that you know we were with a group of people and there was one
01:13:51.000guy that had black hair and dark eyes and he'd be the guy in the group that's like you know
01:13:58.680whatever his name might be like you know johan the black because he's the dude with the dark
01:14:06.980hair and the dark eyes not because he is um of increased melanin yeah in actuality too because
01:14:15.000the word translates from from uh svarter which means uh sooty or it's it which survives in
01:14:23.460english as swarthy but the word sooty means to be blackened by like smoke and carbon the the word
01:14:30.660that they actually used at least in the late nordic period when they had contact with people
01:14:37.220from um the continent of africa they used the word blue because yeah blue had a big meaning it
01:14:47.460could be light blue or it could be navy blue and um so they are the blue black yeah the the blau
01:14:55.460mother the blue black men um so swarthy even though it gets translated to black
01:15:05.860really just means more of yes like a countenance of of darkness in certain areas like the hair
01:15:13.860um we see it to survive with like even up into um like the age of the pirates and and things
01:15:20.500like black tom um and again it's just referring to uh the the dark actually that just made me
01:15:30.340realize something there was a scene i believe in in a movie um
01:15:35.940um Deadpool uh where he was making a joke of that there is a guy named Black Tom and he's
01:15:46.680constantly referring to him as being black even though he's clearly not and he's trying to call
01:15:52.500the other guy in the movie racist for um I guess killing him or hating on him or something um
01:16:00.000It's silly that we have to say this, but in this day and age when, I don't know, the forces of degeneracy want to destroy cultural distinction, they seize upon any reference like that to, I don't know, try to rob us of our heritage in a really despicable way.
01:16:22.880it's just dishonest um so it's important to kind of kind of keep that in mind right yeah again i
01:16:32.320think the narrative that uh race or racial nomenclatures didn't exist until uh you know
01:16:39.920folk people started using it which is not true actually i believe the native americans were the
01:16:45.280first ones to use the basic colors you know there is the red man and the white man and the black man
01:16:51.120and the yellow man and the brown man that's the first referencing i ever remember but instead you
01:16:58.480know with our ancestors who really didn't have other uh people to compare to black or swarthy
01:17:07.280meant again their countenance their hair color um or what have you and sometimes it didn't even mean
01:17:14.560that it just meant their i guess their countenance alone they were just very dark and brooding
01:17:21.120And, again, that's another reason why we use the word dark for that mental state.
01:17:30.300So, I mean, it is mentioned, too, that Grimhild is a fierce-hearted woman.0.89
01:17:36.840Not only is she wise, but very strong-willed.
01:17:43.360Now the days of the Gjukings bloomed fair, and chiefly because of those children.
01:17:50.080So they're bringing in much bounty to their family by conquest and by notoriety.
01:17:58.480And on a day, Gudrun says to her maids, to her servants or handmaidens, that she may have no joy of the heart.
01:18:14.360Then a certain woman asked her wherefore her joy was departed, and she answered, Grief came to me in my dreams. Therefore is there the sorrow in my heart, since thou must need asked thereof.
01:18:30.620tell me then thy dream said the woman for dreams often forecast
01:18:39.560but the weather so in essence she's saying dreams often forecast your future just as much as one
01:18:49.380could look upon clouds gathering on the horizon and Gudrun answers nay nay no weather is this
01:18:57.520i dreamed that i had a fair hawk on my wrist feathered with feathers of gold the woman says
01:19:08.880many have heard tell of thy beauty thy wisdom thy courtesy some king's son abides thee then
01:19:18.560guther and answered i dreamed that not was so dear to me as this hawk and all my wealth
01:19:25.760that i cast aside rather than him the good woman said well then the man thou shall have will be of
01:19:35.600of the goodliest and will shout and well shalt thou love him
01:19:43.280gudrun answered it grieves me that i know not of who let me see uh no not
01:19:50.560I lost my spot because I'm trying to move past the camera.
01:24:48.340So now not Sigurd, but Sigur, Sigur, took their one sister
01:24:54.960and burned the other house and all they may be called slow to revenge the deed why didst thou
01:25:01.840not name my brethren who were held to be the first of men at this time
01:25:09.200brinhild answers back men of good hope are they surely though little proven beyond their
01:25:17.360their kingdoms but one I know far before them and his name is Sigurd the son of Sigmund the king
01:25:28.540a youngling was he in the days when he slew the sons of Hunding and revenged his father's death
01:25:36.800and Eilin his mother's father and then said Gudrun by what token tell us thou that and
01:25:46.620Brynhild answers back, his mother went amid the dead and found Sigmund, the king.
01:25:51.940He was grievously wounded and would bind up his wounds, but he said he grew over old for war and bade her lay this comfort to her heart and that she would bear the most famed of sons.
01:26:08.720And wise was the wise man's words therein. For after the death of King Sigmund, she went to King Alf, and there was Sigurd nourished in great honor. And day by day, he wrought some deed of fame and is the man most renowned of all the wide world.
01:26:28.960So we're kind of, again, giving a recap of things, you know, especially if this was spoken in sections, this would make perfect sense to kind of reiterate and recap the hero.
01:27:11.320gudrin says i dreamed this that we went a many of us in company from the bower and we saw an
01:27:23.080exceedingly great heart a deer um that far excelled over other deer ever seen
01:27:33.100and the hair of him was golden so a golden deer and his and this deer we all feigned to take
01:27:42.560but alone but I alone got him and he seemed to me better than all things else but silence thou
01:27:51.700Brynhild didst shoot and slay my deer even at my very knees and such grief was that to me
01:28:00.940That scarce might I bear it, and then afterwards thou gavest me a wolf cub, which besprinkled me with the blood of my brothers.
01:28:14.040So she dreams of having, there is a deer that they all witness, and they all attempt to go towards the deer and calm it, soothe it, touch it, or be about it.
01:28:28.040but uh she alone is the only one that's able to get close and when she does it's then Brynhild
01:28:34.820that slays the deer up and kills it and then gives her a wolf um and then she knows that the
01:28:46.440blood that she's sprinkled with is from her brothers this is clearly allegoric for what's
01:28:51.860happening are about to happen it's the prophetic sense um and you know most likely the deer is
01:29:00.420sigurd and a great woe is about to befall her family in relation to him and brynhild and
01:29:11.140their uh relationship that's not being uh brought about fully it's it's uh again it's that that
01:29:20.020resistance um so brinhild answers back i will a read thy dream so she she's going to counsel her
01:29:35.140on this dream even as things shall come to pass hereafter for sigurd shall come to thee even whom
01:29:43.380i have chosen for my well beloved and grimhild shall give him mead mingled with hurtful things
01:29:52.100which shall cast us all into mighty strife him shalt thou have and him shalt thou quickly amiss
01:30:00.020and atli the king shalt thou wed and thy brother and shout you lose and slay atli with all in the end
01:30:08.420gudrun answers grief and woe to know such things that shall be and therewith she and hers get them
01:30:19.740gone home to king gyuki so this is just absolutely the the foreshadowing it's very similar
01:30:28.340to the characters in shakespearean plays in which you you'll see the beggar or or the
01:30:36.700the the lonely soldier and he comes out on stage and he foreshadows everything
01:30:45.660and so now it's not about what's going to happen it's about how it's going to happen
01:30:51.900uh chapter 26 secret one sec one sec okay i just want to acknowledge that since we've been doing
01:31:07.100this uh austin donated 30 or uh i'm sorry 50 towards paying off new york's off thank you
01:31:14.940austin we appreciate it i meant to do it last chapter but i didn't get to it in time
01:31:19.180yeah i think a lot of folks uh when we're covering these things we try to do stuff in
01:31:24.900between the chapters and then of course at the end of all the questions and such because we're
01:31:29.680trying to get through such a big corpus of lore um so i hope they bear with us and and or catch
01:31:37.220us on the um on the replay but um chapter 26 sigurd now comes to the gukings and is wedded
01:31:47.400to Gudrun so everything comes to pass so before we do that this isn't really a question as of yet
01:31:56.320but it sort of is and it's a comment that I think we should address um over in the comment section
01:32:04.200it says the the book uh translation that I read had said that Attlee was Attila and it always
01:32:13.000through me for a loop since it shows our folk marrying him and i think it's worth talking a
01:32:20.340little bit about that and perhaps what the ethnicity of uh attila well so that's why i
01:32:33.060brought up the point that the name atli it's very similar to like in iceland there is a name
01:32:38.780Finn, and it's clearly Gaulish in origin. So the name itself could be, I think by the time
01:32:52.020that all of this was composed, Attlee was, I mean, this is far after all of that. And
01:33:00.820And Attila and his conquering of the Eastern Germanic people greatly influenced the way that they lived.
01:33:16.140And eventually they managed to break free from the power of his kingdom because he passes away and his sons can't keep it all together.
01:33:29.940And then the character and idea of Attlee carries on into central Germany and becomes a poignant figure and a strong, really, this is the key part, a strong name, a strong association with someone who conquers.
01:33:56.600So the problem with him being literally Attlee is that the other members of the story don't quite fit into these timelines.
01:34:12.400And especially, we haven't run into him yet, but one is a gothic king who lived after the invasion of Attila.
01:34:23.860So all of these names and these folk that are being spoken of, some of them do have historical referencing, but from different times.
01:34:34.440So the name and also the kind of the overarching sense of who Attila is, is left.
01:34:47.660by this time no he's not a complete foreigner he's just dark like just like grimhild and so
01:34:59.020they it kind of alleviates a lot of that invasion from the foreign land over generations you know
01:35:06.940there's there's quite a long time between the composition of the story but still the name
01:35:14.860lives on the the the overarching purpose of what he was doing the conquering the great great war
01:35:23.600master if you will so i don't think oh i was just gonna say i don't think they equate evenly
01:35:31.180so they don't and here's the thing this isn't a work of history
01:35:38.980This is a supernatural tale that is loosely set in a historical time period.
01:35:48.340And you pick famous people from history, and he is probably one of the only non-white people that would be famous enough in the day and age of this story being composed to put in there.
01:36:12.080And he's not displayed in that context.
01:36:14.640One of the things about the Hunnic invasion that's really interesting is they're a strange mixture of people that are like roughly Mongolian steppe people, but also lots of different.
01:36:37.200because this was at that time most groupings of people were not metropolitan they were a
01:36:46.880a race of people they were tribes that were ethnic nations whereas the huns were a
01:36:54.240mob of amalgamated and absorbed peoples that swept across the step and into central europe so
01:37:03.280there was a wide range of hunnic appearance from like mongols to polish people and everywhere in
01:37:14.720between depending upon you know who was where and what kind of hierarchy um yeah there's accounts
01:37:24.240that paint attila as looking you know very much caucasian there's accounts that make him you know
01:37:32.560look chinese look northern chinese or mongolian there's any version of that in between
01:37:42.320but by the time scandinavians were writing this story
01:37:48.480i don't think they have the perspective to conceive of him as being racially diverse because
01:37:54.800they've never seen an oriental person they have no idea what that looks like
01:38:00.880It's interesting when you read medieval manuscripts, these people in Europe don't have a diverse existence with other races of people.
01:38:10.920When they paint pictures of black people, the people are white people painted black, like literally painted black because they don't know what that is.
01:38:24.260like there's um an account of a of a woman and I think it was uh um Parsifal by uh Eschenbach
01:38:35.760where you know one of the illustrations for uh one of the characters in it was uh half Moorish
01:38:43.180and and half not so the person is literally like one of those aliens in the
01:38:47.780the old series of Star Trek where half of them is black and half of them is white
01:38:52.300um people's understanding of what that would have looked like back then doesn't
01:38:59.180doesn't conform to logic or make sense because we're looking at it we understand these historical
01:39:07.480concepts at the time they didn't they understood that yeah in the distant racial memory of our folk
01:39:14.040there was a conqueror that came out of the east named attila that pushed you know all the tribes
01:39:20.460in front of him and you know existed in roughly the east and i think that's kind of where some
01:39:30.700of this is so i wouldn't get overly caught up in that these people are not writing it from a day
01:39:35.900where they have wikipedia and they're trying to make sense i think from where they're sitting
01:39:42.140most historical personages look like them because that's how they imagine their past
01:39:47.980so i don't think this is a you know meant to be an accurate ethnology of these people i think it's
01:39:56.380more to add historical elements to embellish their the level of this story because as you
01:40:04.460watch the story continues to develop as you end up reading it uh as the nibblingen league the
01:40:11.980the scale and the time period and the setting all continues to evolve and and grow so don't
01:40:22.860look at this as a work of history because that's not that was never the intention and never what
01:40:27.740it was well and there's a couple of things for folks that are interested in migration era history
01:40:36.460um two historians jordanes and procopius now bear in mind i'm not a huge fan procopius
01:40:45.820um did not like the heralds he wrote bad things about them um and uh
01:40:54.060but he did he does describe him as you know um having a flat nose swarthy skin
01:41:02.540um that showed evidence of his origin but bear in mind too they spoke very ill about
01:41:11.740um other peoples that they didn't like that were outside of the empire um
01:41:19.180so you get these kind of mixes i think it's wrong for them to immediately assume that
01:41:25.980that Attila is like Genghis Khan. And, you know, there's probably more reference to the idea that
01:41:34.040he might have been more like a Scythian than a Mongolian. An interesting point of fact, and
01:41:40.760again, I don't know if the story says that so-and-so, you know, as one person way back in
01:41:46.700ancient times involved themselves in some kind of miscegenation with, you know, this Chinaman
01:41:54.420that was conquering europe i mean is what it is that stuff happens all too often and there's
01:41:59.700nothing talked about that being good or you know the preferred way of doing things but it's also
01:42:05.780worth noting you know there's a reason that hungary is named hungary and if you look at
01:42:12.340hungarian peoples even today you have a predominantly caucasian populace but you do have asian elements
01:42:22.420in there depending on who you're looking at um and it's just worth saying i mean if you look at
01:42:30.820charles bronson something's a little bit off and i think you can kind of detect maybe that kind of
01:42:36.580influence but again these were a migratory group of people so they end up having a lot of the time
01:42:46.340where you see that if you draw a line kind of south you see things in
01:42:54.020roughly in modern turkey where you have different racial convergences of migratory peoples you have
01:43:00.340all the different semitic peoples there you have turkic asian peoples there you have caucasian
01:43:06.980people and greek people there you have a very motley mixture of humanity that ends up mixing
01:43:17.460in those kind of border areas and the migratory patterns of the huns in eastern europe at that
01:43:23.860time were were a part of that and i i do know i find it really interesting too that the name
01:43:32.260Attila or Atli has references to the Gothic language or the Gutanish language.
01:43:42.900In the Gutanish language, the word for father is Atta.
01:43:48.780And so there's even theories that, you know, he was unnamed.
01:43:54.520um and but that the the because again they they spoke um all of their traditions were passed
01:44:03.320around orally and most of the knowledge we have of of Attila is from written sources uh secondary
01:44:12.980sources and then by extension the usage of his character in um the Volsunga saga and in um other
01:44:23.780the other kind of more mystical things so yeah I don't think it's easy for us to pin him I know
01:44:32.480that a lot of folks are perhaps fascinated with the Scythians and don't look at the Scythians as
01:44:39.360necessarily being like the Mongolians but a lot of people immediately turn Attila into
01:44:47.820Genghis Khan and i i there's a there's a tendency to do both things and i want us to guard against
01:44:54.060that i want us to remember the truth is one of our virtues and you know like it's very easy to pick
01:45:03.580some of these standout peoples from different parts of the world and speculate that maybe
01:45:09.420there's some kind of you know crypto white guy there and i i can't say i can't say that he wasn't
01:45:19.740but i think it's a far leap to suggest that he is i think there's probably a mixture and a spectrum
01:45:26.940there as far as nomadic step people go i think he probably doesn't look like a chinaman but i think
01:45:34.140he probably also doesn't look like he's scandinavian either and i think there's probably some mixture
01:45:40.300going on somebody in the chat points that points out that you know medieval literature portrays
01:45:47.420him as a white man and they do because that's very much the context that he has he is a leader
01:45:54.140of largely his band of people by the time it's interacting with the roman empire and the people
01:46:00.380who are writing it's largely germanic tribes that are fighting for him at that point the original
01:46:06.060you know mongolian step horse warriors coming across have become an increasingly small minority
01:46:14.700and the amalgamation of tribes that he subjugated in eastern europe became more and more of a
01:46:21.340significant portion of his fighting force so i can't i i don't think that whatever anybody says
01:46:29.180in the chat room and whatever we say here i don't think that any of us has you know any definitive
01:46:37.340reason to say he's one or the other or exactly where in between he falls other than there have
01:46:42.620been lots of different depictions of him in literature and in i don't know depictions in
01:46:53.980in medieval europe they do tend it depends when you have you know roman authors tend to make him
01:47:03.180look more barbarous and other um medieval writers tend to make him look more and more like a european
01:47:11.660you know a barbarian but a european monarch so it's it's kind of a question you know it's one
01:47:19.020of those things that's up in the air that i don't think we're gonna have a definitive answer to
01:47:23.980Yeah, again, to his army, which was also consisting of Eastern Germanic people, they went all the way to the West, all the way into France and fought other Germanic tribes and then even went into attacking Italy.
01:47:45.660So, and the, the, the enthusiastic chat room tonight, I'm not saying he wasn't, I'm just saying, I don't think we have really solid evidence that he was. And yes, Scythians are white people. Huns are not.
01:48:04.200yeah and i thought you were leaning more towards like i was the one saying you know maybe he he
01:48:11.540he wasn't and i i don't think he was genghis khan like no our chat room is is railing that he was
01:48:18.400this like definitively white guy and again that would be cool i'm not saying that's not the case
01:48:27.180i'm just saying we don't know that to be the case and i'm not going to be sure i'm not going to place
01:48:31.540my bet on that but certainly by the time that the poems were composed he becomes a name and character
01:48:43.540that doesn't necessarily fit with the historical attila and we see that in the day and age you come
01:48:51.300up with a person out of history that becomes its own brand that's much more like a comic book
01:48:58.340character and much less like the real guy because that's what you know that's what tends to happen
01:49:05.220over time but i say that let's get back to chapter 26 i know people get hot yeah he's he was white
01:49:15.380no um people are very invested that's awesome but again maybe worse i'm not saying he wasn't
01:49:23.140but i'd have to i'd have to take a look myself yeah and i again the most important part of
01:49:29.380understanding is by the time of this story um he is not necessarily the historical figure but
01:49:39.220brought in and because now they're mentioning mother and father and marriages so clearly
01:49:49.060i mean it could even be argued that aptly in the story just bears the name that was introduced to
01:49:57.300the culture um so but it's not standalone it is worth saying no this
01:50:05.380probably is definitely attila they talk about things going on in hun land and they move on
01:50:11.860all along that theme so it's certainly in our folks memory at that point to make that reference
01:53:16.620Now off they all ride, sorry, but then Grimhild finds how heartily Sigurd loves Brynhild, and how oft he talks of her, and she falls to thinking how well it would be if he were to abide there and wed their daughter, King Yuki.
01:53:38.620For he saw that none might come anigh to his goodliness, and what faith and good help there was in him, and how that he had more wealth withal than folk might tell of any man.
01:53:54.440And the king did to him even as unto his own sons, and they for their parts held him more worth than even themselves.
01:54:08.100So these warrior sons, they love Sigurd. He's the dragon slayer. It's amazing. The king treats him well. And so Grimhild is like, I need to convince him to wed my daughter and not this Brimhild.
01:54:30.040so on the night as they sat at the drink the queen arose and went and walked before sigurd and said
01:54:42.100great joy we have in thine abiding here and all good things will be put before thee to take
01:54:49.460of us lo now take this horn and drink thereof
01:54:54.360so he took it and he drank and therewithal she said
01:55:00.280thy father shall be yuki the king and i shall be thy mother and gunner hongi shall be thy brethren
01:55:10.840and all this shall be sworn with oaths each to each and then surely shall the like of you
01:58:35.240and our sister freely and unprayed for
01:58:39.280whom another man would not get for all his prayers.
01:58:44.120And this prayer word is what they're talking about
01:58:48.760bidding for her place, bidding for her hand.
01:58:59.700And they're basically saying, you know, it would take a lot for someone to gain that, and they would have to bid very heavy to the king, my father, for the hand of my sister.
01:59:14.060But yet, we would give it to you, we would arrange this marriage freely and quickly.
01:59:21.180and Sigurd says thanks have ye for this wherewith ye honor me and gladly would I take this
01:59:31.880the same therewith they swore brotherhood together and to be even as if they were
01:59:39.920children of one father and one mother so they become it's not that they are actually blood
01:59:47.840family but that they are brought in so much and i think some people can relate to that where you
01:59:55.540have a son-in-law or a daughter-in-law that you find so well that you would just bring them in
02:00:03.400and treat them as you would treat your own children um and there a noble feast was holden
02:00:11.320and endured for many days and Sigurd drank at the wedding of him and Gudru and there might
02:00:19.700men behold all manner of gains and glee and each day the feast was better and better
02:00:26.740and a lot of people don't realize too like these kind of feasts were generally night feasts with
02:00:34.440games during the day so you know people would wake up after drinking from the you know the first
02:00:41.000night and there's music playing you know in the hall that night and there's poems being spoken
02:00:46.600and um all manners of things and then they go to bed they wake up and there's games festivities
02:00:54.520being held and then they go in for the second night and eat and drink and listen to songs
02:01:03.160his stories and they go to sleep and you know it keeps going as long as uh the hall can provide um
02:01:12.920or and the people and you know it does drain from the resources but again if you have an overabundance
02:01:20.600that's a sign it's a it's a um it's a showing of your of your power um
02:01:28.040Um, so the, uh, now fare these folk wide over the world and do many a great deeds and slay
02:12:42.620odd verb um but prodding and goading as a verb we all get and it's again poking somebody with
02:12:52.580something right this is clearly there and i just didn't think that way right away um
02:12:59.860Um, so they come to the castle of fire and, um, so now Gunnar rides up, uh, uh, rode upon his horse, Gotti, but Tony on Holkvi and Gunnar smote his horse to face the fire, but shrank aback.
02:13:25.360So there, the three brothers are attempting to go now. It's not just Gunnar, but the horse dies in the flames and he shrinks back.
02:13:43.340um then said sigurd why givest thou why givest thou back gunner he answered the horse will not
02:13:55.520tread this fire but lend me your horse grani so he goes to sigurd and says take take my horse and
02:14:04.300me borrow yours i with all my good will he says and he gives grani over then gunnar rides him
02:14:16.140at the fire and yet now no wise will gram stir nor may gunnar any the more ride through that fire
02:14:27.180So now they change semblance. Gunnar and Sigurd, even as Grimhild had taught them, then Sigurd in the likeness of Gunnar mounts and rides.
02:14:41.120So, this is kind of availing that Grimhild uses magic.
02:14:46.700She already has made a potion on Sigurd so that he forgets Brimhild.
02:14:52.660But now, Gunnar can't get through the fire.
02:14:57.840His horse, even though the horse has done it before, the rider now is lacking the fortitude of spirit to get through.
02:15:07.340So he then says, well, how about you stand in my stead, but we'll use the magic that our mother taught us, and you will look like me.
02:15:19.460This is already just not, it's not good.
02:15:34.400He leaps, grani, into the fire where he felt the spurs, and a mighty roar rose as the fire burned ever matter, and the earth trembled and the flames went up even unto the heavens.
02:15:51.540nor had any dared to ride as he rode and even as it were through the deep murk but now the fire
02:16:01.160sank with all and he leapt from his horse and he went into the hall even as the song says
02:16:07.420the flame flared at the maddest earth's fields fell a quaking as the red flame aloft licked
02:16:17.000the lowest of heaven few had been fain of the rulers of the folk to ride through the flame
02:16:24.920athwart it to tread then sigurd smote granny with sword and the flame was slacked before the king
02:16:36.520low lay the flames before the fane of fame bright gleamed the array that rayin urts erst owned
02:16:47.000Reyn, of course, being the one who put the sword together.
02:16:53.660So Sigurd then passes through the fire, and he came into that certain fair dwelling, and there sat Brynhild.
02:24:29.680And thither came Butli, the king with his daughter Brimhild, and his son Atli.
02:24:36.060And for many days did the feast endure.
02:24:38.960And at the feast was Gunnar wedded to Brimhild.
02:24:42.620But when it was brought to an end, once more has Sigurd's memory of all the oaths that he swore to Brynhild, yet withal he let all things abide and rest in peace.
02:24:55.560So he, it kind of washes away, but now the state of himself being married and her being married and him pretending to be Gunnar would all come undone.
02:25:15.460So Brynhild and Gunnar sat together in great game and glee and drank of goodly wine.0.88
02:25:25.560chapter 28, how the queen held angry converse together at the bathing.
02:25:36.660On a day as the queen, queens went to the river to bathe themselves, Brynhild waded the furthest
02:25:45.000out into the river and then asked Gudrun what that deed might signify. Brynhild said,
02:25:53.700I, and why then should I be equal to thee in the matter more than in others?
02:25:59.620I am minded to think that my father is mightier than yours,
02:26:03.620and my true love has wrought many wonders of works and fame,
02:26:08.660and also ridden through the flames and the fire,
02:26:12.020while thy husband was but the thrall of King Hjeldrak.
02:40:24.120um anyways so uh chapter 29 of Brynhild's great grief and mourning after this talk Brynhild lay
02:40:38.200a bed and tidings were brought to King Gunnar that Brynhild was sick he goes to see her there
02:40:45.840on and asks what ails her. But she answered him not, but lay there as if one dead. And
02:40:54.920when he was hard on her for an answer, she said this. What didst thou that ring that
02:41:05.600I gave thee, even the one, even the one which king body gave me at our last parting? When
02:41:15.020thou and king yuki came uh to him and threatened fire and the sword unless he had me as a wife
02:41:25.020i at the time he led me apart and asked me which i had chosen of those who had come
02:41:34.860but i prayed him that i might abide toward the land and be chief over the third part of his men
02:41:43.180then were there two choices for me to deal betwixt either that i should be wedded to him
02:41:50.860whom he would or lose all of my wheel all of my joy and friendship at his hands and he said with
02:42:00.040all that his friendship would be better to me than his wrath then i bethought me whether i should
02:42:07.400yield to his will, or slay many a man. And therewithal I deemed that it would be a veil
02:42:15.320little to strive against him. So it fell out, and that I promised to wed whomsoever would ride
02:42:23.700their horse, ride the horse Grani, with Fafnir's horde, and ride through the flaming fire,
02:42:31.560and slay those men whom i called on him to slay and now so it was that none durst ride save sigurd
02:42:44.100alone because he lacked no heart thereto i and the worm he he flew and ray in and five kings beside
02:42:54.040But thou, Gunnar, did those things not. As pale as a dead man didst thou wax, and no king thou art, and no champion. So whereas I made a vow unto my father that him alone would I love, who is the noblest man alive, and that this is none save Sigurd.
02:43:18.020Lo, now I have broken my oath and brought it to naught, since he is none of mine, and for this cause I shall encompass thy death, and great reward of evil things have I wherewith to reward.
02:43:38.440Grimhild never I wot has a woman lived eviler or lesser or of lesser heart than she
02:43:48.880so she lays out that it's finally the breaking point it was a trick she tricked him and or
02:43:59.880tricked her and forced her to break the oath. And now she's going to return the favor, if you will.
02:44:10.880And Gunnar answers in such wise that few might hear him. So he speaks quietly. Many a vile word
02:44:18.880hast thou spoken, and an evil-hearted woman you are, whereas thou revilest a woman far better1.00
02:44:27.400than you. Never would she curse her life as thou dost. Nay, nor has she tormented dead folk
02:44:37.180or murdered any, but lives here her life well and praised by all. So he says, you know,
02:44:44.340you have a lot of gall to say that you're better than my mother. She hasn't slain anyone or taken
02:44:53.260their lives and she's praised by everyone here and brynhild says never have i dwelt with evil things
02:45:00.700privily or done loathsome deeds yet most fain i am to slay thee and therewith would she slay king
02:45:09.900gunnar but hogni laid laid her in fetters but when gunnar speaks so she she goes or she moves to
02:45:19.980slay her husband gunner and gunner's brother hogmi puts her in chains uh fetters
02:45:33.500uh and gunner says nay no i will not uh that she abide in common chains then said she
02:45:43.900heed it not or why do you care for never again seest thou me glad in thy hall never drinking
02:45:54.220never at the chess play never speaking the words of kindness never overlaying the fair clothes with
02:46:01.540gold never giving the good counsel uh my sorrow of my heart that i might not get sicker to me
02:46:08.820So why not imprison me? Why not put me to death? Because I'm dead to you, and you're dead to me.
02:46:19.060Then she sat up and smote her needlework, and rent it asunder, and bade set open her bower doors,
02:46:27.900that far away might the wailings of her sorrow be heard. Then great mourning and lamentation there0.90
02:46:34.760was so that the folk heard far and wide throughout the abode but again you know if she's ripping
02:46:41.800these um needlework that stuff was far more important back then it was it was it helped0.99
02:46:51.800the household it whether it was tapestries clothing or what have you so she tears it all0.91
02:46:58.920down she's she uh breaks her loom and then opens the doors and wails in sorrow
02:47:10.200and gudru she asks her bower maidens why they sat so joyless and downcast what has come to you
02:47:19.000that ye fare as ye with like witness witless women or what unheard of wonders have befallen you
02:47:25.800Then answered the waiting lady. Her name was Svalflov. An untimely and evil day it is, and our hall is fulfilled with lamentations.
02:47:41.680Then spoke Gudrun to one of her handmaids, Arise, for ye have slept long. Go and wake Brynhild and let us all fall to our needlework and be merry.
02:47:54.500So go to her and her section of the castle and bring her to us so that we will work here.
02:48:06.400And she says, no, no, no wise may I wake her or talk with her.
02:48:13.660For many days she drunk neither mead nor wine.
02:48:18.200Surely the wrath of the gods has fallen upon her.
02:48:21.220and then Gudrun leaves and goes to speak to her brother she says to him go and see her
02:48:30.700and bid her know that I am grieved with her grief and Gunnar says nope I forbid to go and see her
02:48:40.300or to share her share in with her will or joy the wellness nevertheless he went unto her and
02:48:48.780strives in many wise to have speech to her but gets no answer whatsoever therefore he gets him
02:48:56.700gone and finds his brother hogni and bids him to go see her he said that he was lost there too he
02:49:05.900was he just dreading he didn't want to go but he went and he got no reply from her then they go and
02:49:13.580find sigurd and they pray that he go and visit her he answered not thereto and so matters abode
02:49:24.220for that night so no nothing was um availed for that but the next day
02:49:30.700when he came home from hunting sigurd went to gudrun and spoke
02:49:34.780in such wise do matter show to me as though great and evil things will be tied from this trouble
02:49:44.820and upheaving and that Brynhild will surely die so after a long day of hunting and thinking he
02:49:54.120finally decides okay I'm going to go talk to her and he says that we need to lay all of this to
02:49:59.460rest. No good will come of it. And everything is already sealed. Your marriage, my marriage,
02:50:08.480everything. And he says, I think ultimately this may endanger your life, which again
02:50:15.360implies that perhaps Grimhild, the queen, or the brothers might be bid to get rid of
02:50:25.920uh gudrun answers oh my lord by greatest wonders is she encompassed
02:50:36.160seven days and seven nights has she slept and none has dared to wake her
02:50:43.520nay she sleeps not said sigur her heart is dealing rather with the dreadful intent against me0.64
02:50:49.600then said good weeping woe worth the while for thy death go and see her and what if her fury may0.89
02:50:59.940be abated give her gold smother her up her grief and her anger therewith give her anything she
02:51:07.960wants you know again um kind of just whatever will stop but basically as she's slumbering
02:51:17.800her vitriol for this is starting to spread through the castle
02:51:24.920so sigurd went out and found the door of brinhild's chamber he deemed she slept and drew the clothes
02:51:32.360from off her and said awake Brynhild now bear in mind the clothes are not
02:51:41.160like the clothes she's wearing but cloth so most likely this is he pulls the bed the blankets
02:51:48.040off of her and he says um awake Brynhild the sun shineth now over all the house
02:51:54.840and thou hast slept enough cast this grief off of thee and take up gladness
02:51:59.960and she says and how then has thou come to me in this treason none was worse to me than you
02:52:09.720sigurd said why wilt thou not speak to the folk for what cause sorrowest thou
02:52:18.600and she answers ah to thee will i tell my wrath sigurd said as one under a spell art thou if thou
02:52:29.160demis that there might ought cruel in my heart cruelty in my heart against thee but thou hast
02:52:36.360him for husband whom did it whom thou didst choose you chose goodness if you were so in love with me
02:54:25.280Brynhild, I am not thy husband, and thou art not my wife,
02:54:29.700yet did a far-famed king pay dower to thee.
02:54:33.880Brynhild said, never looked I at Gunnar in such a wise that my heart smiled upon him, and hard and fell am I to him, though I hide it from others.
02:54:49.020So she says, I never felt love towards him.
02:54:57.420A marvelous thing, said Sigurd, not to love such a king.
02:55:01.820What angers thee most? For surely his love should be better to thee than gold.
02:55:09.880So it's an amazing feat that you don't love him. Perhaps you just love his wealth.
02:55:18.720Brynhild answers, enough and despair of Baal is in thy speech.
02:55:24.900to your overabundance with evil in your words, since thou beratst me and didst twin me and all
02:55:35.280bliss, not do I heed my life or death. Your words basically kill me. Sigurd answers,
02:55:44.720Ah, live and love King Gungner and me withal
02:55:51.340And all my wealth will I give thee if thou die not
02:55:58.160So he loved the king and I shall be your friend
03:03:03.920it is something the one percent is is arbitrary but um the concept of percentage-based giving was
03:03:10.960with the hoftoller is based on the practice of our ancestors that they used to donate towards
03:03:18.580Hoffs and Gothart, that our faith would exist and flourish in the times of our ancestors.
03:03:25.660It was lamented against, because at the time, in Anglo-Saxon England, I was reading The Elder Gods by Stephen Pollington.
03:03:35.600And he points out that, and I forget the name of the bishop, but at the time, he was very upset at the Christians in England because they were getting shown up.
03:03:46.040the Ausitruar there were generously paying their Hoftholler and the Christians were not doing
03:03:53.820their tithing. And he pointed that out by contrast. So that was something we used to excel at.
03:04:01.400So a Hoftholler in the Ausitru Folk Assembly, like I said, is a minimum of 1%. You're very
03:04:08.560welcome and it's much appreciated if you'd like to donate more than that. But we ask 1% if you're
03:04:14.460on Hoftholler. Now, a question, and it's a fair question, is the Hoftholler before or after taxes?
03:04:25.560Obviously, what I would like to say is before taxes, that gets us a bigger chunk, and it is
03:04:32.240tax deductible, as any donations to the Astro Folk Assembly are. But that said, we're not petty,
03:04:41.000and we're not trying to get into all that we're taking it on good faith uh do what you feel
03:04:46.200compelled to do if you think that's an honest one percent of your income then that's fine we're not
03:04:51.640we're not worried about um trying to twist anybody's arm at the end of the day it's not
03:04:58.360about that yes we certainly need money and donations to keep our mission going to accomplish
03:05:05.240things to get hoffs and to to do this at the level that it ought to be done at but
03:05:13.480it's not about that we would never want that to be a cause of hard feelings amongst the folk um
03:05:23.480one of the things that's cool about hoff toller is that we get to rise and fall together you know
03:05:30.120You know, when people are having hard times, then we all can adjust and cut back together.
03:05:35.660When we're all successful, then we can all benefit from, you know, the boons of that success.
03:05:42.980Off-told, it's really nice that way because it adjusts as, you know, a person's situation adjusts.
03:05:48.800If somebody, you know, makes lots of money, then cool.
03:05:53.060The Austria Focus simply swells with our ability to do so.
03:05:56.100If somebody's on hard times, then, you know, we contract and we all have to tighten up.
03:06:07.340It's one of the big reasons that we're able to get Hoffs at the rate we're getting them
03:06:12.220and to accomplish the things we're able to accomplish.
03:06:14.440So I appreciate you asking the question.
03:06:16.780And, you know, whether it's before or after taxes, it's whatever you feel is appropriate on that.
03:06:22.240We'll, you know, trust you and your noble judgment on that.
03:06:26.100Svan has returned to us. He has a question specifically from Mary. She says, Svan, I have a question about Old Norse. I wanted to know what hail victory means as victory is a Latin derived word.
03:06:42.500i found uh hail sigurd is the correct is correct and if not what is so the you are there is an
03:06:52.740icelandic innovation in old norse it's just uh sigurd without the u s-i-g-r um
03:07:03.540so swan she asked you so i let you respond to this first well um just what you said
03:07:10.020a lot of people don't, I guess, don't realize, but the best way to think of it is that the R
03:07:16.480is a syllable unto itself. And so that sig, ur, and then the Icelanders added the U as kind of
03:07:28.020a place marker. I don't know if they were doing it perhaps to teach people easy, more easily,
03:07:36.880or um or why the the motivation behind that but um yeah the uh the r itself is its own
03:07:48.200no sigur means victory um and it actually i i'm going to leave this part of the uh explanation
03:07:56.960to alzir ago because he went and looked because this question came up first and we were kind of
03:08:03.620talking about it and um he looked up the etymology origins of both victory and as and uh sigurd um
03:08:16.100so in essence he has the answer but i did want to address something else um the usage of the word
03:08:24.580One thing about the Norse versus, say, German is that the EI does not make a long I sound. It is pronounced with the E and the I combined together in a diphthong as heil instead of heil.
03:08:44.620So and I do it. I did it earlier. You know, again, it's just a matter of when your brain sees that rule.
03:08:54.620The other thing is, is I would encourage everyone to get away from the usage of heilsa or halsa. That is a descriptor of people praying or giving worship to something else.
03:09:15.780So you're a third party and you're speaking about these people doing something.
03:09:24.320And what they're doing is they're giving thanks and worship.
03:09:29.060They're giving their house up to the Godsteads or at the temple or what have you.
03:09:36.300So I noticed that a little while ago that started popping up.
03:09:41.020but people would say hailsa and um i just didn't understand that why that shift happened um
03:09:50.920but no the correct is is hail and i've seen it both with um a single l and a double l
03:09:59.920um and generally in modern icelandic when you see a double l there is a
03:10:05.940hard lateral lisp that's thrown in so for instance with with heimdallur it can be said like that but
03:10:18.440you'll hear icelanders say heimdallur it's not so pronounced it's just heimdallur but it's a
03:10:26.960soft lateral lisping of a, like a sharp turn in the L's. Um, and that could, I mean, the double
03:10:38.320L has significance. So, you know, I generally have always kind of written it with a single L.
03:10:44.380Um, but I don't know if that rule applies even today, cause that's not really a word
03:10:49.740utilized. But I, you know, I looked it up immediately in my reference books here. Sigur
03:10:57.560means victory. But Al-Syrgothi went one step further, looking at the etymology, he found some
03:11:04.420interesting differences between Sigur and victory and their origins. So I was going to pass it to
03:11:12.240on that so they're almost exactly the same but first on the uh uh hail sigurd um
03:11:22.480i don't know if it makes that little t noise at i do know if it's in the middle of a
03:11:28.000in the middle of a word it does sometimes those little idiosyncrasies work a little different
03:11:35.600when they're at the end of a word versus when they're in the middle um like the g sometimes
03:11:41.600is almost silent, but if it ends in the G, it makes a K sound. So it's tricky, and all
03:11:52.160of us are working on it. But yeah, it's pronounced Hale, even though it's spelled, and it is
03:11:57.640spelled with the two L's in the Old Norse. But both, and important to mention, Latin
03:12:07.200and old Norse are both Aryan languages they all go back to the same to the same roots and you know
03:12:16.140they deviate earlier than say you know English and German but they do ultimately go back to
03:12:24.420really similar concepts both of the things mean victory Latin is victory by like
03:12:34.180um over overtaking something whereas sigur is victory by like overcoming or overpowering
03:17:13.820having our doom or our fates meted out by the divine
03:17:17.680are a huge part of our lives but the other two that a lot of people don't talk about
03:17:23.020is the doom that is uh left by our ancestors um us wanting to be accepted by them um
03:17:34.460and so we have to look at the things that we do that might stop them from being accepted
03:17:43.560One thing, too, is worth. If there is someone who takes to slaying life with no regard for the victory that's to be gained from it, you know, they're just simply slaying for the sake of slaying.
03:18:03.180Um, again, all three of those that tripartite, if you will, the triplication there will all each hold a sense of what decrees you as a needling.
03:18:23.500Um, but it's, it's, again, it's, uh, it's hard because there's no just outright other than of course, uh, the, the, the stealing or, uh, attempting to, uh, the fornication between or stealing or cheating on with, uh, married couples is kind of viewed.
03:18:52.020and that's stated in the sagas. Snorty speaks of that. He also says breaking an oath. So breaking
03:19:00.620an oath and the solemnity of an oath dooms one to be a needling and slaying of kin. And the fate
03:19:11.720is that when you go to the gates, sorry, when you go to the bridge of hell and you are standing
03:19:18.560there. Movguv denies your access because the ancestors have deemed you a needling. And then
03:19:25.360you must take the lower path and cross the rivers and go to Naustrand, the death's beach, the gloom
03:19:34.860beach. You know, there's not like, the gods aren't in the underworld weighing your heart with a
03:19:42.680feather. No, the system's set up in an immediacy. The gods have already seen what you've done from
03:19:51.040above in the wellspring. So this kind of doom can be placed on you. It can be placed on you
03:20:00.720by the gods. It can be placed on you by men, and it can be placed on you by your ancestors.
03:20:05.680And when you show up, you're denied and you have to go to the place of disillusion and dissipation.
03:20:17.220The question that you bring about whether there is redemption is an interesting one in relation to the various things that could happen.
03:20:34.320And I don't know, you know, if you're slaying life without any concern or care, I, you know, I don't know if there's a comeback for that.
03:20:50.280um the same again with kinslaying but the point of our faith the point of our church is to attempt
03:20:59.240to take people who have crossed the threshold and try to help them return because again your
03:21:07.480deeds got you in that position to begin with then that would incline the idea that there are deeds
03:21:14.440that you can take to redeem yourself and i think all too often nowadays people get into the black
03:21:22.680face paint shoulder pelt thinking of all or nothing without considering uh you know
03:21:32.760things in our in our history and in our lore that that state that our our ancestors didn't think of
03:21:39.000this just so one way um yes the the needing good uh a villain um legally the strongest term for abuse
03:21:55.400a traitor a truce breaker one who commits a deed of wanton cruelty a coward and the like so
03:22:02.440So again, the best way to look at this is if you are considering either the acts that you have done or someone else has done, the realm in which they are looked upon, the realm of men and law, the realm of the gods and their law, which is not subjective, and the realm of your ancestors.
03:22:27.840Whatever does great harm to your folk, to your family, to your people, can get you that title.
03:23:15.740There are very legalistic faiths to where if you do this, then you are that, and you get in irredeemable categories that are impossible to get out of, and they're very legally based.
03:23:37.140Ours is much more situational and much more nuanced.
03:23:41.380It's not as though fundamentally in a religious sense, a person gets proclaimed a nithingur and then they're forever adjudicated as that thing.
03:24:00.160That might be a judgment that is passed, but just the use of the term is a pejorative for people that behave in certain ways.
03:24:09.680One of the concepts that's also very important in our lore is the idea that you judge things by their totality and not by individual moments all the time.
03:24:23.800so and I say that to say this the world of our ancestors and the way that we have reason to
03:24:33.100believe it works amongst the gods are things are judged based upon a variety of factors and you
03:24:40.000are judged by your community the idea of honor wasn't just something that you objectively looked
03:24:48.700a rubric and said oh i scored this many points therefore i have honor honor was bestowed on you
03:24:54.460by the judgment of your community and the people who had say in your community of wow this person
03:25:00.220we will bestow an honor upon them this person is honorable this other person is not
03:25:06.220if you are a dirt bag and you are known for your misdeeds your community will deem you a
03:25:11.740a nether and you are adjudicated as that but and so again if the penalty was swift if they're like
03:25:22.680hey this guy's out there you know committing dishonorable acts boom kill him then cool you're
03:25:29.380done but assuming that you have another 30 years can you redeem what you've done in that time and
03:25:36.600counterweight it with good things, maybe, I don't know what you did, but it's a bigger, it's a
03:25:44.760bigger concept than that, so, you know, Nick's definition he put up is absolutely, like, the
03:25:49.740definition, but the etymology goes back a little bit more, it's not just, it's those things, but
03:25:55.980it implies in the the proto-germanic the idea of uh hatred malice and like treachery so it's not
03:26:08.340it's the shadiness and the sliminess of it um you know spawn mentioned adultery and that's part of
03:26:19.700but it's not just that it's described in the poetic as um
03:26:29.540lest i butcher it i'll just read the passage um as far as uh now strong where the people
03:26:36.180where uh nythingers find themselves um she saw their waiting uh onerous streams men perjured
03:26:45.140and wolfish murderers and the ones who seduce another's close trusted wife
03:26:52.420it's not just that an affair is going on it's an extra element of like somebody that looks
03:26:59.860for an opportunity to steal somebody's wife and be extra shady it's not like and this isn't to
03:27:07.380you know excuse other variants and other behaviors but this is very particular like
03:27:13.060somebody who looks to take advantage um it's wolfish murderers not just murderers but somebody
03:27:20.500who's shady and stalking someone and creeping around and waiting for their opportunity and
03:27:27.140sneaking one on um it's it's perjury it's not just that you're lying about something it's that
03:27:34.660you're going to the point of making an oath to something knowingly being false the idea here
03:27:40.100isn't that you don't live up to your oath it's that you're knowingly like you are intentionally
03:27:47.700lying you are intentionally being false all of these things imply a malicious intent that
03:27:58.180it's very easy to get caught up and um judge everything as a black and a white
03:28:04.340In Ausatru, one of the concepts that we talk about with the idea of being Aryan is being noble people.
03:28:13.760When you are a noble person, the more elevated you are, the more beyond that very strict delineation you are.
03:28:25.240the more you have to factor in the nuance and the detail and make judgments in a world that we
03:28:31.880acknowledge is very messy. So that said, there's a lot of things that get balanced. So
03:28:40.160in the end, your judgment, you are not judged objectively against a rubric of behavior.
03:28:50.320You are judged with the totality based on the subjective judgments of those in your community, of your family, after death, of the gods themselves.
03:29:03.340That said, there are certainly things that you do that you can't come back from and you can't outdo.
03:29:12.000that, you know, there's sometimes in one act of betrayal or dishonor that you're, you know,
03:29:20.760it's a one and done. There's also many subtle acts of ignoble behavior that you can outdo and
03:29:32.300that you can compensate for. The, you know, the detail work on that is what makes life messy.
03:29:40.660But ultimately, it's up to your community and those you care about to judge you worthy or unworthy.
03:29:46.780If you've done something so despicable, because here's another thing in our faith, we are not obliged to forgive anyone.
03:29:54.020also with nuance you are fully capable as an Aryan man or woman to extend forgiveness
03:30:03.800out of your own generosity of spirit because you choose to because someone has compensated
03:30:11.380you in some way and you want to forgive them but you are not obliged to forgive them people don't
03:30:18.720owe the Neethinger forgiveness or trying to make them feel better it would be incumbent upon
03:30:31.120the Neethinger to redeem himself in some way to compensate whoever they've wronged
03:30:38.960and hopefully the benevolence of that person will allow them that opportunity
03:30:46.760But I don't think it's something you can bank on.
03:30:49.720I think it's something to think about, though, because we all,
03:30:53.220and I know this is kind of in the spirit of the question.
03:31:41.740At what point do you become, you know, Bill the liar? If that is your moniker is you are the liar, you are a liar. It's not because you lied once. It's because you are notorious for your lying.
03:32:00.840Either you lie so frequently that it defines your character, or maybe you lied once, but your lie was so big that that's all you are known for.
03:32:16.680And that's, you know, one of those things.
03:32:18.900I think that we all have had moments in our life where we have betrayed someone in some way.
03:32:24.800but benedict arnold has become synonymous with treason because one act of betrayal defined his
03:32:35.500legacy so it's an issue of frequency and of scope and of how much that behavior is the definitive
03:32:47.660characteristic of who you are as a person just like are you a coward or not every one of us
03:32:54.520acts out of fear at different times in our life some to much greater degrees some to lesser degrees
03:33:01.560but there's a difference between oh somebody was scared once and they are known for their
03:33:06.840cowardice thus they are a coward so i think that probably illustrates
03:33:13.720what i'm trying to say better than some of my flailing a little bit earlier
03:33:17.960the one point i would actually add too though is you mentioned like with murder and the wolfish
03:33:29.780murder where you stalking somebody where you're planning it etc etc even in american justice
03:33:34.580system we have that distinction first degree murder versus second degree murder versus third
03:33:39.100degree murder first degree murder in order to do that you have you have to have premeditated that
03:33:44.000Well, so I appreciate the point that you're making, that there are degrees of it.
03:33:49.000And we even recognize in today's world, difference of degrees and, you know, antecedents to it and mitigating factors.
03:33:58.280In the world of our ancestors, in the world of the sagas, there was a difference.
03:34:03.660If, if I were to like sneak up on you and kill you and then hide your body and pretend it didn't happen, that is a, that is a murder.
03:34:19.700If I were to kill you and then go into the nearest town within, I think a day and say, hey, Svan, you know, said the wrong thing and I cleaved his head with an ax.
03:34:31.380what that's different then there's the opportunity for his people to come after me or for me to you
03:34:38.180know express my reasons or whatever else it was a very different scenario and you'll see that i
03:34:45.220think in y'all's saga they talk about that a lot if you you know sneak up and burn somebody's you
03:34:50.980know house with them in it and then you don't tell anybody that is a crime because it's shady you're
03:34:57.220doing something that you know damn well you're ashamed of and you're not saying it out loud
03:35:03.860if you you know were to do a similar thing in an upfront way and acknowledge it and take
03:35:12.100responsibility for it it becomes a different sort of thing and i think that's kind of a note about
03:35:21.620this is it's not just doing some of these things it's doing them in a shady way
03:35:27.460it's knowingly falsifying an oath it's knowingly betraying an oath out of malicious intent it's
03:35:36.420trying to steal somebody's wife when they're not looking it's sneaking up on someone and killing
03:35:43.460them it it implies a um just a greasy shadiness and a lack of of upfront and courageous feeling
03:35:55.220that kind of defines some of that and i none of these answers are ever as clean
03:36:00.500as i think a lot of people want and unfortunately that's the burden of being a noble man or woman
03:36:08.020is you have to make these nuanced choices in life on what you're going to do it's like somebody
03:36:15.360mentioned kinslay yeah but we see in the sagas unfortunately a lot of instances where folks are
03:36:25.440put in a spot where the requirements of revenge involve slaying your own kin to avenge the slaying
03:36:37.280of your kin, and trying to sort that out is hellish, because there is no perfect answer.
03:36:46.340You have to choose between poor answers to try to figure out the best one or the one
03:36:51.600I mean, we see that in the story that we're reading earlier about, what's her name?
03:37:04.580the the sister slash wife uh or sister slash uh baby mama of uh sigmund oh earlier um yeah
03:37:20.100to avenge the murder of her father she ends up killing numerous of her sons
03:37:25.220um yeah there's stuff and obviously the the mythical more fantastical stories
03:37:38.820right in such bigger and bolder colors but in very nuanced ways there's there's things where
03:37:46.420you have to weigh different things and make responsible choices based on, you know, your
03:37:55.220wisdom and your character. And our faith encourages you to engage in doing that. It's not as though
03:38:03.060you're judging your actions by a rubric. You're judging your actions. You're putting the truth
03:38:09.860of who you are, your character, and what you've done in your life up to the judgment of in this
03:38:15.840world your community and your peers in the next well and your family and in the next world
03:38:24.720you're leaving that judgment to your ancestors and to the gods and uh
03:38:32.320again it's a it's a nuanced thing and there's there's a lot of detail that goes into it
03:38:37.120her name was signi signi i was gonna say it's signi and another thing i wanted to bring up is um
03:38:43.920Um, the, the, uh, authority of the accuser in a way, um, was very important to our ancestors.
03:38:51.520So, you know, if you make an oath and for some reason you can't fulfill it because of
03:38:58.300the way the world works out, um, and the accuser says, you know, you are an oath breaker, um,
03:39:05.900That gives a lot of personal power into the hands of someone that you might have considered your brother or friend without any recollection of the future and what all these other things pertain.
03:39:22.740So a Gothi who is versed in the law, a, you know, a third party, almost the ones who deem outlawry and all those things, that is, I think, a far greater step.
03:39:43.520But ultimately, it does lie on the doom meted out by the gods and the adherence that their ancestors had.
03:39:52.740interesting point you make there you know there if you make an agreement
03:40:01.460then yeah not living up to your agreement is bad not living up to it due to negligence
03:40:09.940is bad and is a problem and is an infraction you will be judged for
03:40:14.260not living up to it because you're devious and because you had no intention of living up to it
03:40:22.860because you don't care about your word is an entirely different type of infraction it is also
03:40:29.560bad but it's worse it's dirtier and it's sleazier and it be it bespeaks of a poor character much
03:40:37.160more than the other. The details matter in our very nuanced belief system.
03:40:49.960I don't say this intentionally to be despairing at other faiths. I say it specifically to be
03:40:55.180elevating of ours. Alistair True is a religion for adults. We live in an adult world with
03:41:02.360adult and nuanced circumstances it would be easier for us to draw everything in very
03:41:12.120legalistic black and white all the time but that's not really the way the world around us works
03:41:17.160so we're challenged to look deeper and this is a kind of a follow-up comment
03:41:22.600in the chat how about uh our values differing from those of the system based on christian values
03:41:29.320A lot of things I find in the Havamal are very different than Christian values.
03:41:34.440And this is one thing I'd like to note, and I've mentioned it on the program before.
03:41:40.180In the Abrahamic faith, your transgression isn't against the person you do something bad to.
03:41:51.520your transgression is sinning against Jehovah
03:41:56.000or Allah in that branch of the Abrahamism
03:42:01.300so you need to make it right with them
03:42:06.720and not so much the person that you did something bad to
03:44:29.900um i think that's a a very very very new idea trying to kind of be pushed um most certainly
03:44:40.140in the sagas one of the most uh like well noted runic curses was done by a woman but it was done
03:44:46.940with runes um and so bail bail working with runes is noted and remarked um say there is never noted
03:44:58.060or remarked as being in relation to um at least cursing but certainly there's reference to and
03:45:08.380again is it really say that it's generally pushed off that they've learned magic from the fins
03:45:13.660and so they know ways to make uh you know fog drop on your enemies or what have you um i think
03:45:21.740say that it has far more about communication with other worldly spirits than it does with cursing
03:45:29.660um if you were giving balefulness i would say um if your if your cause is just to call upon the the
03:45:47.820gods of your people against an enemy would be just but the first thought i initially had was lord
03:45:57.340odin the he can be the bull worker the bail worker and again the usage and knowledge of the
03:46:04.940runes to make sure that you are doing things correctly because it's dangerous if you go
03:46:10.860and do things incorrectly you could end up causing more harm on yourself or those around you
03:46:17.820but outside of that yeah i you know if your cause is just i don't see any reason why you couldn't
03:46:27.120call any of the gods but be weary of trying to associate saether magic and freya with evil works
03:46:35.860that i think is a misnomer that's been creeping up as of late i don't i don't understand it too
03:46:44.020much i think it's uh it's antithetical to what we have as evidence
03:46:51.700yeah i agree with um i agree with what's fawn said i want to you know add a couple of couple of
03:46:57.700things i think that pigeonholing lady freya or saver in general as being some kind of
03:47:10.820you know evil black magic hocus pocus is
03:47:17.000I think it's trendy and I think it's based on a misunderstanding of how that works
03:47:25.640um I tend to agree it tends there's a lot there that deals with oracular things and
03:47:34.360communication beyond the veil i don't think there's an inherent
03:47:39.160curse aspect to it certainly it could be utilized for that as as most things could be um
03:47:46.440i do think we see curses very often being something that women do and that you know um
03:47:53.720um nor near or witches do but it's not confined to that I think as time went on and when there
03:48:08.720were different options available that did get associated with women often but curse work and
03:48:15.680you mentioned the rune specifically was done by men often as well I would go with spawn if I if I
03:48:21.260to well and so here's something i wanted to mention as well in curses on stuff if you are
03:48:28.860mentioning the gods like what was a thing on rune stones would be carved like hey if you mess with
03:48:38.300this stone or if you you know disturb those entombed here may thor strike you or whatever you
03:48:46.380wishing that the gods would judge you harshly if you do something bad or transgressive
03:48:54.880within some kind of a talisman or a runic scripture somewhere I think that's appropriate
03:49:04.860but I'd be really careful what is a Wiccan thing that they like to do is think that they can
03:49:10.720And I don't know, like tell the gods what to do. There's a presumptive thing in modern Wiccan occultism thing where it's like you can somehow invoke and command gods to do stuff that you tell them to do because you've got the right crystals or whatever.
03:49:35.900And that's silly. And it's really impious to demand that the gods be, you know, your hitmen on stuff that you don't like. So don't call on any of our gods in that in that way.
03:49:50.940Now to say like, hey, this is my mom's grave. If you mess with her grave, may Thor, you know, knock you upside the head with Mjolnir. Okay, I think that's fine.
03:50:03.400but if you want to beseech the gods to take up your cause if they find you worthy or in some
03:50:15.000way you want to appeal to them along your effort of of cursing and certainly for the things that
03:50:21.780you mentioned um yeah odin would be my go-to on that i don't think that there's you know a wrong
03:50:29.440choice but if there was a god that i would appeal to to aid in rune work towards cursing the enemies
03:50:40.800of our folk uh oh then would be who i would who i would address that to
03:50:49.360he also extended on the on the comment he said i didn't mean to pigeonhole either
03:50:54.240uh and each magic does have two sides you know usually so i mean i think the biggest thing too
03:51:00.800is we're addressing that issue not simply for you white horse but for anyone else that might
03:51:07.540be doing it and or or believing in that or and it's certainly kind of also expressing the view
03:51:13.980of the church that yeah please keep that in mind i think that it naturally lends itself to that
03:51:22.100When you ask a question, it's not wrong to assume we're talking to you and we're answering it, and we are, but we're also talking to the other audience that's listening, not just now, but we have people that go back and listen to old episodes all the time.
03:51:38.260one of the things that i appreciate a lot is you guys asking questions for every one of you who
03:51:43.460comes here and actually asks a question there's you know maybe a hundred people who listen
03:51:49.620that don't ask but that do wonder that have ideas in their heads that they don't know about so
03:51:54.980sometimes your question sparks a thought that we want to just elaborate on for folks your questions
03:52:01.780kind of steer the conversation and point out areas that we could um explain different things
03:52:09.860to different folks so no we don't take anything you know by what you said and i'm sure that you
03:52:14.500know if we over answer or we start addressing worst case scenario things please know it's not
03:52:22.100aimed at the person asking the question it's because it's something that we've heard or that
03:52:27.380we know people out there are wondering because i think that you know we have all known
03:52:36.260hot topic which is that might misunderstand some of these things and we hope to disambiguate that
03:52:44.740that by by our comments um eavesdropping whore with a w horror uh i always am entertained
03:53:03.100by that name uh what are your views on uh ausgard the home of the gods and the afa's
03:53:10.620views on hyperborea as the origin of our folk uh svan what are your thoughts on those questions
03:53:18.140um one part of me that always kind of nags at me is that the greeks that
03:53:25.620that uh introduced the concept of hyperborea were referring to the mountains to the north of them
03:53:34.200uh kind of eurasian uh i forgot the name of the mountains and that it was beyond those mountains
03:53:42.520beyond the known world by the by the greeks um that kind of throws me into i don't know i just
03:53:53.200because they we know that our ancestors were already moving up through there so i mean if
03:54:01.440that's the case then yes beyond those mountains our people you know most certainly i think
03:54:10.560descended or or or grew from there um but the other concept is going further back the idea of
03:54:20.080um that there was this place in the north long before even recorded history perhaps
03:54:27.920back to the fabled times of Atlantis or Lemuria and that there was Hyperborea. I don't know that
03:54:36.060I find super fascinating, but I'm of the belief that at some point the movement southward to
03:54:44.200the central Eurasian area where our language and our people kind of spread from there and down into
03:54:55.440uh india and the middle east and over west europe um i think would have happened and
03:55:01.740the only reason why i think about that is um the receding of of glacier ice and the movement of
03:55:11.620people into um more traversable lands i don't know i find it extremely fascinating
03:55:27.040so um i'm not really sure the question about asgard um yeah that's the home of the gods
03:55:41.780that's what our lore talks about that's i i don't really understand the question there
03:55:46.480But as far as the AFA's views on Hyperborea as the origin of our folk, I think it's important to, so you guys, one thing I want folks to know, and I talked to Svon about this yesterday, I think.
03:56:07.520Um, it would be, all right. So I'm going to go on kind of a roundabout course here, but bear with me. One of the things that I see a lot in a lot of circles that we all kind of traverse in, in the internet space around us, a whole lot of people don't come from
03:56:37.520from a religious background and again I'm not aiming this the person asking the question
03:56:43.400but they theorize like what they think well you know all right cool we need to do all this
03:56:53.480you know racial identity stuff well all right but if we're going to do that then you know
03:56:58.820religion's good we should have religion so let's make one up to suit our needs and that's really
03:57:05.540cynical, and I don't always think it comes from a bad place, but it's starting with the
03:57:13.720fundamentals that you're making up religion and not that religion is an eternal truth
03:57:20.560that's being expressed to you that you're learning and acquiring knowledge of.
03:57:25.180So, it's really important to me that when we take a firm stand on something as Holy Writ, that we have significant reason to believe that it is a fact of our faith.
03:57:42.560and I'm always very hesitant and I don't want to express something as if it is a fundamental to
03:57:52.340house a true practice if it's not um yes I tend to believe that the homeland of our people is
03:58:02.120hyperborea but I don't think that is a I don't think the geography of claiming that we have a
03:58:09.620polar origin is a fundamental tenant of our faith um there's plenty of talk about where our folk
03:58:20.500originated whether it was in the caucuses you know around the caspian sea uh in the
03:58:28.260above the arctic circle i think there's a lot of things in deeper in our lore that imply
03:58:34.660a far north origin to a lot of things and i i personally think there's a lot of truth to that
03:58:41.460but if the more we understand archaeology and history and things we find out that's not the
03:58:46.820case that doesn't you know affect my my belief in ausitru or it's not a fundamental you know
03:58:54.740tenant of our existence but it is something that i tend to find a lot of truth in and that i think
03:59:01.220certainly spiritually is fascinating and something that we like to hearken to.
03:59:09.560But yeah, I do think there is truth to a northerly origin. I think a lot of it in a
03:59:16.860less mystical and more matter-of-fact way does have to do with the progression of the Ice Age
03:59:23.440and that situation. So I'll reference that a lot. I think that our folk and our faith
03:59:29.860are pre-ice age and are expressed to us certainly from the ice age forward and i do tend to think
03:59:38.720that i like a lot of points that are raised in arctic homeland in the bettas by bal tilak
03:59:47.700it's a very tedious read but i think there's a lot of really good things in there that really
03:59:53.040affected my thinking, I don't know, probably about, excuse me, 15 years ago or so.
04:00:07.740Acharya G says, one for one reincarnation is real, and that when the soul moves on to the next body,
04:00:16.460the psyche of that person remains imprinted within the material realm, which stays for a very long
04:00:22.420time and is still connected to the soul. And that's what we are interacting with during
04:00:27.380ancestral veneration. What are your thoughts on that perspective? I think Acharya G is mistaken.
04:00:36.060I don't think that is the normal case. I don't preclude the possibility of that existing at
04:00:43.760at a certain point or in a very select circumstance that's willed by the gods,
04:00:53.140but I don't think that is the typical situation that we have with people.
04:01:02.100And I don't think logic bears that out the way that he mentions it there.
04:01:08.620There are points of similarity in Sanatana Dharma and Vedic belief and Ausatru, but there's also very significant deviations.
04:01:26.620In the East, their faith developed these proto-Hindu threads that I think come out in a very big way in this particular instance.
04:01:42.820And I don't think that that's, like I said, I think he's wrong.
04:01:49.540That's one of the reasons that I'm also true and not Hindu.
04:01:52.100um i don't believe that he's correct and i you know again i think that acharya g should
04:01:59.420stop doing that and join the astro folk assembly i think he probably thinks that i should stop
04:02:05.380doing this and i should join the uh international dharma society so i i don't fault him for that but
04:02:12.760i do disagree do you have anything that you'd like to add on that yeah i think that one it's
04:02:19.700fundamentally important that we understand the soul goes to another place there isn't a psychic
04:02:27.140imprint it is the entirety of that which is that person that goes to the place that is far away
04:02:35.320from the gods in the sense that it's far away from the the edicts of time and material and then
04:02:42.980there is the returning there is a root there we have that in our symbology as a root
04:02:52.620But the processes of whether the entirety is drawn back up
04:02:57.800or whether pieces are drawn back up is up to debate.
04:03:03.020But one of the other key points of our faith is that the one for oneness,
04:03:08.020you know, our faith does not hold that you die
04:03:13.100And then you come back as someone, you know, across the world of a different peoples.
04:03:22.100A lot of our belief of the coming back comes through genealogical bloodline and the meta, the metagenetic of the people.
04:03:32.520So it's not that you die and then transfer over completely to somewhere else and some other people.
04:03:39.440No, you travel through your bloodlines and bloodlines can be expansive and very hard to completely map out.
04:03:50.820But that and that certainly, I think, explains why there are these kind of leaps of cases in which people they believe that, you know, they're a great amount of them have come back.
04:04:02.680but upon death remember the leak is lost the ek and the the uh memory go into the soul
04:04:14.200they they collapse into the soul and the soul traverses on so upon returning through a bloodline
04:04:24.120that there is the distinction of thought is brand new and the memories are
04:04:32.680not there for most of the part. Again, some people have spoken about having incidences.
04:04:40.340There's very interesting things of people saying they have memories of things and so on and so
04:04:44.820forth. But the processes for the majority is that there isn't. Or again, the do that comes out of
04:04:52.900Yggdrasil is also because again it draws up from the root is also new souls and that the gods can
04:05:03.000impart upon the new soul gifts from the ancestors that are not necessarily the entirety or the
04:05:12.100identity wholly and completely of the ancestral soul and that's very important and that's something
04:05:22.240that we, as Ausatru, fundamentally believe that differentiates us from, you know, modern
04:05:33.120There's some logic things that don't bear out, too, that I just think are worth contemplating.
04:05:38.640So, as the population of the world expands, are we constantly, you know, creating new souls while, you know, the previous generation's number of souls are reassigned to different people being born in the next generation?
04:06:03.920If that's the case, one of the things that we know to be true is our ancestors interact with us.
04:13:55.860Yes. Just like back in the late Nordic period in the Viking age, sometimes people would, you know, blood feud for just simply to gain property.
04:14:10.120So, yes, it can be maligned. It can be twisted just as much as in a society where, no, there is no death penalty, but we're going to, I don't know, either keep you imprisoned or slave labor you instead of you dying.
04:14:26.420by you know what have you we go that deep it could be looked in any direction
04:14:31.940but i think that the law of a land um that wants to not have blood feuds flowing all over in the
04:14:40.260streets looks at the possibility uh and and again our society with a great sense of finality with
04:14:48.900with the hesitation because of the lengthy due processes
04:14:54.540on top of appealments and so on and so forth.
04:14:59.500There is a great sense of wisdom in our society
04:15:03.640that doesn't just push for the state says you should die,
04:15:11.280And I think that that is clearly shown.
04:15:13.840But the fact that people leave it to no sense of finality and justice is also wrong.
04:15:23.100You can't, there is just no recompense for the trade-off of someone of your life being taken by someone else and they just get to live and be taken care of by the state.
04:15:38.300i mean i know taking care of is a interesting way of saying that but you know again when you could
04:15:45.500have the finality of ending and equaling out the the correct um measurement of of that weight that
04:15:57.660um the death of one person is the equation of the loss of the other and again this happens
04:34:37.200And that might be a fundamental in some of the things that Google says are dharmic.
04:34:47.440So that is what I've got for this evening.
04:34:50.320I appreciate you guys being with us tonight.
04:34:52.480I don't know if we've got one or two more shows to finish out this saga, but it's been really good.
04:35:01.860I think it's spurred on a lot of really good discussion, and I think that this story is fundamental to, I guess, Western storytelling in Western civilization.
04:35:15.200I think it's really important, so I'm glad that we're covering it together.
04:35:19.660I've enjoyed spending time with you guys this evening.
04:35:22.100Thank you for everybody who has donated.
04:35:24.640Thank you for everybody who has asked questions.
04:35:26.540Thank you for everybody who is listening and making this show possible.