Episode 4148： A WarRoom Christmas Eve Special
Episode Stats
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Summary
It's Christmas Eve Eve in the United States, and that means it's time for the first Christmas Eve special of the year! Join Steve and his co-host, Ben Harnwell, as they talk about the origins of Christmas carols, the carols themselves, and what Christmas really is.
Transcript
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Of all the trees that are in the wood, the holly bears the crown.
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Oh, the rising of the sun, and the running of the deer,
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The playing of the merry horn, and sit singing in the choir.
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The holly bears the blossom, as white as the milly flower,
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And very nice, O Jesus Christ, to be your sweet Savior.
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Oh, the rising of the sun, and the running of the deer,
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The playing of the merry horn, and sit singing in the choir.
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The holly bears, the bears, the bears, the bears, and the running of the deer,
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And very nice, O Jesus Christ, to be your sweet Savior.
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The rising of the sun, and the running of the deer,
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The praise of the birds, to be your sweet Savior.
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Okay, welcome. It's Tuesday, 24, December, 24 December, the year of the Lord, 2024.
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Ben Harnwell joins me as our co-host slash host today.
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I'm still coming back strong from the, from AnFest.
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Ben, thank you for joining us live today from, from, from Rome.
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I love, I particularly love and fond of the, like, King's College choir,
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And all the, all the English music of Christmas,
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That's kind of like high Victorian, high Victorian Christmas carols.
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And you had the, the, the, the, the, the lessons and the carols.
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And for many people, formally, that is the start of Christmas.
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And from that point on, even the, the most pedants,
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The most pedantic people in the world will wish one another Merry Christmas at that point.
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Or it's not before, but after the, after the lessons and carols from King's College, Cambridge,
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You know, I, I often wonder the commercial side of Christmas taken over so strongly in the United States,
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At least the run up to Christmas, cause they try to start it in October or even before Thanksgiving.
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As soon as you get Christmas day, the Christmas carols go, we, we, we have a tradition here at the show.
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I mean, when I was growing up as a kid, it didn't end on Christmas day.
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You still, we still, you know, did a lot of Christmas stuff, even up to little Christmas, you know, epiphany.
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But that seems to have stopped here in the United States over the last couple of decades, where it just kind of, it's a hard stop.
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And is that the same in Europe or does it go through more of the 12 days of Christmas?
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Well, it's still obviously sort of commercialized here in Europe.
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Probably less, I would say, in Italy than in my, my beloved homeland.
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However, it is, it is obviously getting worse and worse as I think the, the practicing Christian element of society fades out.
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And the sense of belonging kicks in, but without the actual substance of the faith to back that up.
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And then, of course, you grab onto the nearest available thing.
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And that's the whole, the commercialization, the tinsel and the trees and all the rest of it.
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But, you know, look, up until Sunday, which is the Sunday before Christmas, that's the fourth Sunday of Advent, it's really improper to start celebrating Christmas before, before Christmas Eve itself.
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And you really, you know, you're absolutely right.
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You start the carols on Christmas Eve, Christmas Day, and then you carry them on up until the epiphany.
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If you are actually commemorating in your family, in your community, even in your own heart, the incarnation of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ.
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You know, when I was a kid, we didn't bring the tree in until late afternoon on Christmas Eve.
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In fact, I don't think we got the tree until like the day before Christmas Eve, but we would never bring in the tree to Christmas Eve.
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It was kind of the family tradition for Christmas Eve and putting up the lights and everything like that.
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But then we would go to Midnight Mass and come back and have a little celebration and then get up early in the morning, the crack of dawn, and go at it.
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But it was, it was really Christmas Eve forward.
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You're there, you're a transplanted Englishman.
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Like everything in Italy, it's family orientated.
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You know, from the, from the, from the Vigilia, which is Christmas Eve, you have a huge, many families will have a larger dinner on Christmas Eve than they will have on Christmas Day itself.
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That sort of tends to, and you find a lot of people who will go to church as well, even to, to, to Midnight Mass on, on, on Christmas Eve, even though technically it might not necessarily start at midnight.
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It might be brought forward by an hour or two, depending on the parish.
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You'll, you'll go to those and the churches will be full and there'll be a lot of young people there.
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But that's clinically generally Sunday by Sunday, Steve, you've got a lot of young people as well, um, coming to church on mass, uh, to mass on Sunday, which is pretty much not the case, um, in the UK.
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Because Chris, practicing Christianity still has, it still has a large part to play in life here, Steve.
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Um, probably, probably because the Vatican's here, the home of the Catholic Church.
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Um, and the Pope is really in and of himself, almost like a, a, a, a secondary head of state, the president of Italy, the president of the public has a much minor role.
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Uh, so because of the presence of that, uh, the role of Catholicism, even if it's, if it's, even if it descends into a form of popular paganism at times, it's still, uh, quite surprisingly vibrant, uh, where it isn't in, in, in, in, in the UK, which is so secular now.
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Now, that's had a, um, it's had a, uh, with the war going on in, uh, in Israel and around the Middle East, of course, in Bethlehem, a very, uh, a very low-key, uh, Christmas there for, this is a second or third year in a row, maybe even fourth year in a row.
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Yeah, I think February's, uh, coming up to the third year anniversary, February 20, 25.
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Yes, and so the, uh, there's been a, the, the, in Bethlehem, it's been, you know, traditionally over, I shouldn't say traditionally, you know, 10, 20, 30 years.
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You're starting to get, you've had more pilgrims go.
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I know a lot of people from the U.S. have gone and tried to, and really been very moved by Christmas in Israel, Christmas in Bethlehem.
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Um, but that's been really shut down because of these wars, has it not?
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Um, obviously there's, uh, the, the whole of the Holy Land has descended, um, into a sort of a military state.
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And I don't want to get into the politics of this, uh, uh, at, at this time and, and, and give any suggestion of taking sides on that.
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And not only since the, the Hamas invasion on the 7th of October of last year, Steve, you know, Christians, you know, I know a lot of people who, who've been going, especially recently, they've said that they're being spat at, um, and they're not being particularly welcomed.
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And that's not by the Palestinians because, of course, there is a proportion of the Palestinian community, which is Christian.
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Um, so there's, there's, there's, there's a, there's a deeper story going on in there, in the Holy Land, which doesn't really break through, uh, into the mainstream media.
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Uh, Ben has got, got some fascinating guests, uh, from Europe, uh, today, uh, that he's going to, uh, address.
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Also, tomorrow will be the combat history of Christmas.
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I think this is the 12th, 13th, 14th year in a row that I've done this, starting at Breitbart Radio with Patrick K.
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O'Donnell, uh, not, um, Raheem always does Boxing Day for us.
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He's done it for the last, I don't know, three or four years did it for me over at Breitbart Radio also.
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And then, um, Dave Brat's going to be with me on Friday and maybe even again Saturday.
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We're going to talk about the end of the year roll-up to our end of the year coverage on Monday and Tuesday.
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But I think there we're trying to plan on having a number of Christian voices talk about.
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And, of course, we're going to be breaking news on all the politics.
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The, quite unseemly that they decided to drop the Matt Gaetz situation over the, uh, over the Christmas holidays.
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But, hey, you've got to do what you've got to do.
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So, um, Ben, I know you watched AmFest from afar.
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I know we were texting a lot during the, during the event itself.
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What's, what's your takeaway from, from AmFest to really, uh, go through the end of the year?
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And I, I, I think your speech also was fantastic.
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Um, but it's great to see President Trump, I think.
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So, and this was his first, uh, if I'm not, if I'm wrong, I think this was his first speech since, uh, being elected president.
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Um, and it's good to see him being so, throwing down so far, so hard, um, and, and in, during the whole of the, the, the, the conference's attention to the first 24 hours, uh, that will take place on January the 20th.
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You know, because there had been, you know, you, you see certain signs and you don't quite know what the tenor of this second administration is going to be.
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You can look, you can look at the, the leaves on the teapot and try and draw different patterns out of it.
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But, but the flow down, um, on the deportations, uh, and everything else, I think was pretty good.
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And it is interesting seeing, Steve, the, the world's media's attention to this, um, and how they're starting to adjust to the new realities.
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Specifically, Steve, I want to make this point.
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Um, some of the more intelligent voices coming out of the Democrats realize now that their strategy of just painting President Trump and this show and anyone else associated with a MAGA movement of fascists is, is, is no longer going to work.
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Um, because this, this movement has been making serious proposals.
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The regime attempted to deflect from those, um, those proposals and those issues that MAGA has been raising by just smearing.
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And the American public are no longer being, uh, convinced of that.
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I would say they've never been convinced of that, uh, by the way.
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Um, but, but watching AmFest, watching the media coverage of that, I think it's, it's, you know, look at that, that, that, that, that Roe Canna, for example, the tweet that he put out.
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Um, look at the, the, the, the, the, the, the in-depth, uh, interview they did on you in New Statesville, which is the intellectual magazine, um, of the left, the historic magazine in, in the UK.
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They're now saying they have to engage with what this movement stands for.
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And, of course, on the terms, Steve, I think, uh, you'll be pleased to hear this on, on, on your terms, that they're now realizing they have, uh, 10 years too late, but they have to come, uh, and bring some serious proposals to the table themselves.
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Because the, the, the dismissing in terms of pejoratives, um, is part of the reason they were so definitively rejected in November.
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Wow. Incredible. We'll get, hopefully, and get into that new statesman.
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And, well, Ben and I will get into it even deeper the end of the week.
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They're just one of the most intellectual magazines out there in politics, had a, just incredible piece about the war room and about, uh, kind of our populist nationalist beliefs.
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But, I don't want to say they've raised the surrender flag, but they're clearly saying that, uh, we're kind of driving the discussion.
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Real quickly, Ben, the WHO reported this morning that President Trump's already got his team working on immediate withdrawal on the afternoon of the 20th of January.
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We're going to be going through a whole laundry list and kind of a drumbeat of what President Trump's going to do.
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But, uh, quick, quick thoughts about that in your favorite town, Geneva.
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I, I think it was, it was, it was a couple of days ago, this, this first broke out into the press, Steve.
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Um, that was something else, I, I, I think that off the back of Amfest, this declaration, first 24 hours, again, coming back to this point, this is, this is putting the world, putting the United States on alert that this administration means business.
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And one can only hope, Steve, that withdrawal of the WHO, the World Health Organization, and the middle finger that that will give to Ted Ross, um, will be the start of many other.
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Withdrawals by America on the, the, the, all the corrupted apparatus of the international rules-based order.
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And I would add on to this point, Steve, I would like to see somehow, and I don't know if it's, you can make it easier if, if America withdraws or not, but I would like to see, I'd like to, you know, difficult, because of diplomatic immunity and the fact that it's, see, it is in Switzerland.
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But I want to know what Ted Ross, Ted Ross was doing back in the early days of this pandemic.
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And when did they agree to start lying to the American people?
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Also, the book from Dan Fluett, this amazing book.
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It could be a late Christmas gift or even a New Year's gift.
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The Pictorial History, the Pictorial History of the War Room.
00:14:17.320
Okay, we're going to leave you with some great Christmas music.
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Ben Harnwell will return after a short commercial break.
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welcome back folks um so i'm going to be taking over the the hosting of the rest of the show
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um and we've got a great show for the next uh hour 45 some new guests uh some old faces and the way
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we're going to do it is like this because tomorrow uh we're celebrating christmas day i was thinking
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what better way to do this um than to talk about our own private lives in one capacity and also the
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wider public sphere another what if to pick i'm gonna ask the guests what what to pick an example
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of something that they most closely think was the action of god acting in human affairs and then and
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then also the same question uh for themselves i'm going to start off with this um as i say we've got
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some catholics on the show some protestants on the show but um i'm going to start off with my answer
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to this and that's the only time i'm going to talk about myself for the rest of the show um with
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regards to the the the public aspect i most consciously think i can see the hand of god
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uh when president trump was shot in the face i think probably quite a few of the guests might go for
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that one as well shot in the face just a few million millimeters away uh from death we don't do
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to do the gory uh counterfactuals of how that might have played out um but i think that was a direct
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supernatural event as far as i'm concerned um with regards to my own personal life you know i i haven't
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really mentioned this that much on the show though we did something back in march but i i came to the
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conclusion of a number of uh legal cases against me uh three separate cases but the criminal cases
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after three or four years ended in march march the 7th um and i had been praying uh up until the very
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end i i the prosecution were trying to get me into prison for a year for 12 months uh up until the
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very moment the judge announced her sentence italy it doesn't have juries for most of 99 of its cases
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so it simply depended on on the judge um and that was obviously a big thing for me and i've been praying
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for that uh uh for four years really um and the the consequence of praying every day every morning
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and i still do by habit i go into the local church and start my day just with a few prayers but the
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the consequence of that folks is that by the time the sentence came around even though it could have
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been uh very bad for me personally i pray i obviously prayed to be acquitted but more than i prayed to god
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to give me a sense of assurance that things would be okay however it went and i did get that sense of
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assurance so this is like i'm just talking about me personally in my own personal lives but i'm very
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grateful to god for that um and the reason i thought this would be a topic to discuss here on on our
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christmas eve special is because christianity it's not really i mean it is a philosophy um but it's also
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a set of religious beliefs supernatural religious beliefs and the point about that is you have you
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can have the rules and you can say what you like about the rules you don't like them or you like
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them i love them but some people think they're a bit constraining but the point is is that the whole
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point the whole focus of god's revelation um to mankind was incarnated here in human history in
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bethlehem um so christianity is not an abstract religion it's a very concrete particular religion
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and that's why i thought i i would ask all the friends i've asked onto the show today i know are
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christian so um i thought this would be a great way to talk about this um with the war impossible just
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to say how our lives have been changed um because of the very real presence of god my first guest then
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ellen kruger fantini the editor of the european journal an old friend she's been on quite a few
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times uh when i was guest hosting over the the four month period ellen welcome back onto the show
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can i start with you then please just ask you perhaps to to give your your thoughts on on the
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opening question is there anything in the past 12 months where you could say yeah i think this was god
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acting in uh the affairs of man hi ben merry christmas um yes absolutely uh and even though
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i'm the first guest i thought maybe i'd get the first crack at this question but uh we do have the
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same answer that miraculous split second um when uh trump turned his head and wasn't murdered in front
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of the world um that miraculous split second is my pick uh not just because um it was saving a man's
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life but because of all of the things that happened after that including of course his election and
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uh i am based in europe i'm here in vienna austria and um there are ripple effects uh of the trump
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election that we're going to feel i think we're already feeling here in europe um certainly uh he's
00:21:41.280
got a chance to set things right in america but not just for america for the world for peace for
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stability and security across the world um i think his election will also embolden embolden european
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uh and finally take uh take control over the massively uh really frightening security situation uh obviously
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your your viewers will know about the recent uh christmas market attack in germany in magdeburg
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um there are 20 000 people demonstrating in magdeburg uh about what happened and the alternative for
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germany the afd um they're the ones who are addressing this this problem so i think there's a glimmer of
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hope i think trump's election really offers that um you're very interesting that you that you tie in
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the ripple effects of what happened in butler pennsylvania the ripple effects that you're seeing
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we're seeing now in in europe um staying with austria one moment i mean it's clear that the
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the afd has been given a great philip uh recently uh not only because of the the market um the
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magdeburg market uh catastrophe uh massacre uh but also elon musk's thrown his weight behind
00:23:08.800
tell me something you know in austria however the fpo the the freedom party would be the closest
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analog i think to the afd in austria is there a similar momentum there do you think can you see
00:23:20.840
well um certainly the um the the freedom party the fpo did very very well in the elections um and in
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fact should be forming a government but instead it looks like it's going to be what i like to call the
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coalition of losers which is um all the other parties who didn't do as well as the fpo because
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they've been basically firewalled out of uh being able to form a government so i don't know what it's
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going to take for austria to get it together i certainly hope uh that it doesn't take yet another
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tragedy that the country's had several uh relating to violence and mass migration but that's the issue
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on everyone's minds would you say that probably the fpo has a slightly more difficult slightly steeper
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incline to to overcome because the successive austrian governments haven't been as crazy as uh as the
00:24:26.260
successive german governments well i i suppose i suppose so i mean i guess if it takes being as bad as uh
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the the the coalition governments we've seen in germany um then that's what it takes but i i would say
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that the the coalition governments here in austria have been completely ineffective when it's come to
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uh security certainly migration which are interrelated topics of course um i'm afraid that if
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um if we don't see something extreme uh nothing's going to change here so yes it's a it's a steeper
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incline partly because we haven't had a recent horrible tragedy um we've got three minutes left
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ellen uh i know that a couple of days ago i saw the statement on behalf of the european conservative
00:25:20.820
that you're revamping both the the print edition but also the online edition perhaps just say a bit about
00:25:26.340
the the mission the work of the european conservative i declare an interest folks that i
00:25:31.520
do have a uh a titular post um in in in the um on the organogram it's and i'm absolutely delighted
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to support it it's doing fantastic work saying stuff that very few people are uh just before however
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you just say that do you have anything to say about the second part of the question about the presence
00:25:51.140
of god um in your own life well sure i mean i actually it's it's somewhat related to talking
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about the european conservative uh which is that it's been a year of massive growth for the project
00:26:05.560
and the presence of god has been revealed in in the people we've worked with so because our mission
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really is about saving the west saving western civilization um we've attracted good selfless people
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who are in it for the fight the in support of the common good and they are in it for the long haul
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um and this year we've seen it more than ever so i think um my answer is that uh in the faces of the
00:26:38.700
people who've been working with us um god has revealed of course because christ infuses all of
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these things beautiful response ellen just then quickly one minute and then before you go just say
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quick a few words then perhaps about the revamp uh the website where do people go and i strongly
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recommend that they do they're putting out uh you guys are putting out sort of great articles uh every
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single day yes so uh the project will have two divisions we'll have the online division which
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will continue with great news commentary analysis and then the print edition which is where we started
00:27:18.760
we combine art beauty culture and politics uh we're going to be growing you can look for us
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uh we'll have a landing page on the europeanconservative.com website uh do follow us on uh twitter and facebook
00:27:34.320
uh you can get all the news about our updates and um where to find new content and find out about
00:27:41.960
our uh next steps and the social media handles ellen yes uh so we're um at eurocon official um on facebook
00:27:53.080
uh on twitter excuse me and you can just look for the european conservative on um on facebook
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we're also on getter uh european conservative you can find us easily
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ellen fantini many many thanks for coming on the show wish you a very merry christmas
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welcome back folks so the next guest is a new friend of the war room
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uh anja hoffman who is the director of the observatory on intolerance and discrimination
00:28:23.880
against christians in europe now just to say a bit of uh a bit about the observatory um
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okay when i worked in the european parliament over 15 years ago when i first worked there um
00:28:38.600
a guy called david fieldsend who was basically the dean of all the pro-life uh lobbyists in the
00:28:44.780
european parliament he was on he once told me i i asked him uh who's you know what he thinks about
00:28:51.480
our efforts because he'd been there like for decades and i and he said to me the gold standard for him
00:28:57.260
what was gudrun kugler who was then representing the world youth alliance she's now in the austrian
00:29:02.740
we talked about austria just a moment ago she's now a member of parliament in austria but he said
00:29:07.100
but david fieldsend told me that it was gudrun um and the work that she did that he thought that
00:29:12.740
she was the most um the most effective advocate for for life and and all the affiliated cultural
00:29:20.480
issues that he'd ever seen working in the european parliament gudrun then then left um the world youth
00:29:27.040
alliance and she founded this observatory uh which is a great organization found it with her husband
00:29:32.160
martin great um um work detailing the um the persecution of christians around the world so anja hoffman
00:29:41.040
welcome on to the show you're now the director of of the the observatory tell us a bit uh if you
00:29:46.860
would for our american audience why is there a need for an observatory uh against intolerance and
00:29:53.480
discrimination against christians yeah thank you so much ben for having me on the show and yes indeed
00:30:00.560
the observatory was founded almost 15 years ago when many people did not yet see the problem
00:30:06.740
of discrimination against christians not just around the world but specifically in europe so
00:30:11.900
the observatory just focuses its work which is mainly um documenting cases documenting what is going on
00:30:19.260
in terms of intolerance and discrimination against christians in europe and we try to pro to provide
00:30:27.220
reliable and classifiable data on what is happening so we're collecting on the one hand hate crimes which
00:30:35.040
means mainly um arson attacks vandalism attacks on churches but also attacks on christians on persons
00:30:41.920
and then on the other hand um the sphere of discrimination that can be that can be at work
00:30:47.800
that could be against christian politicians um recently also deep banking of christian organizations
00:30:54.100
really broad field and we want to make this these problems visible and show the structural problems
00:31:01.560
behind them and also in which areas religious freedom is being limited in europe
00:31:07.320
um tell me something because i think you guys were basically the first to come along and coin the phrase
00:31:14.740
christianophobia right mirrored on islamophobia which is part and parcel of contemporary political discourse
00:31:21.800
you'll find a lot of uh politicians and media pundits talking about islamophobia but until you guys came along
00:31:27.880
very few people spoke about christianophobia which is this obviously the same concept of of discrimination
00:31:33.960
against people because they're christian um for for again for an american audience perhaps you want you
00:31:39.960
want to say something about that is actually a thing here in europe um just give a perhaps a few examples
00:31:47.960
of of what some christians have been facing here in in europe which you know it's not um it's it's not it's not the
00:31:57.320
other end of the world to find christians being persecuted for their faith here in europe ought to
00:32:02.360
be extremely alarming yes indeed so many people assume that because christians are a majority in
00:32:09.800
europe means they cannot face discrimination so kind of discrimination is only for minorities that's
00:32:14.840
what a lot of people think and this is why this concept of discrimination against christians is really
00:32:19.640
something that people don't easily grasp and we try to make this visible and as you were asking for
00:32:25.720
examples it's it's really a broad range but something that stood out to me most in the last year were
00:32:32.760
several cases of christians who for expressing their moral convictions as christians either lost their
00:32:39.720
jobs their political careers or even were facing court trials and one of the most shocking one of the
00:32:46.760
well-known cases in this area is the case of the former finnish minister of interior and also current
00:32:53.880
member of parliament pevy rossanen who was um accused of hate speech after tweeting a bible verse
00:33:01.240
and criticizing her own lutheran church about um sponsoring the helsinki pride parade and she um
00:33:07.880
she just kind of in the tweet asked the question how do you think um this sponsoring the pride parade is in
00:33:14.200
line with what the bible teaches about this and then then she was uh being prosecuted for that and and that case was
00:33:20.840
thankfully also picked up by the u.s um international commission for religious freedom as one example of
00:33:27.480
how european governments are increasingly targeting believers for peacefully expressing their religious
00:33:35.160
views which are kind of counter the mainstream views but in a not in any way of like inciting to violence
00:33:41.640
or hatred but really just christians saying this is what i believe i believe god created human beings as
00:33:47.240
male and female for each other and by just saying that it can yeah in these extreme cases even lead to
00:33:54.200
a court case but also in the job it can have immense repercussions i think it's important to underline that this
00:34:02.680
was very very close i mean that it's happening in america i think not as to a great degree as here in occupied europe
00:34:10.200
um but this is one of the um what ellen fantini mentioned uh earlier on in the show the ripple effects
00:34:17.960
of um of the trump presidency uh i think that the fact that donald trump's going to be in the white house
00:34:23.960
for the next four years is going to put a block a total block on on any progress towards this militant
00:34:31.000
intolerant intolerance of christians in america and hopefully we'll actually start pulling it back a little
00:34:36.280
bit um pulling the culture back a bit to where it used to be um tell me something anya uh here's it
00:34:42.440
because i'm asking this to all of our guests is there anything in the past year that you might um look at
00:34:48.440
and think yeah i think this was the this was god working in human events
00:34:54.760
yes indeed i mean one of the very obvious examples has already been mentioned but if i think about my sphere
00:35:00.600
about um persecution of christians and intolerance against christians i'm just thinking of something very recent
00:35:05.560
only last week after two and a half years of court trial a mother of five and a christian her name
00:35:12.760
is roda was acquitted in nigeria for alleged blasphemy after and this is super shocking sharing
00:35:20.280
a video of a girl who was slaughtered lynched for her christian beliefs in school and she shared that
00:35:26.280
video criticizing what has happened and was then accused of blasphemy and now finally last week um
00:35:32.280
through a really major legal win um she got free and she she is now yeah in a safe place and this is
00:35:38.680
one of the ways where i see this just one example how in these cases um sometimes also in the legal
00:35:44.440
sphere there can be immense victories through god's help incredible and and anything in in your personal
00:35:52.040
life that you might want to share with the warming posse yeah one thing that really uh encouraged me
00:35:58.120
personally tremendously during this year was we work a lot with students we've produced a documentary
00:36:03.160
called self-censored which talks about christian university students all across europe they are in
00:36:09.160
a conversation with one another and talk about how to share their faith in a hostile environment towards
00:36:14.680
the christian belief that they're all experiencing and during these conversations uh with different
00:36:20.360
students that i've had um following up on this project i was so encouraged how a lot of them once you
00:36:27.000
start talking about this phenomenon of self-censorship and about being afraid to to even say you're a
00:36:33.080
christian in a public sphere out of fear this will have negative consequences once you start talking
00:36:37.960
about this a lot of young people say oh i always thought i'm the only one but now i realize there's
00:36:43.400
more people out there who have the same problem and i can actually we can actually talk about it together
00:36:48.520
and we can kind of break through the spiral of silence and start talking about a belief start raising
00:36:54.600
questions about current world view that we don't find is helpful for the human person
00:36:59.240
and they really find the courage to speak out and that's something that for me is really
00:37:02.920
a huge sign of hope for our time yeah great response anya um can you tell me something how
00:37:09.720
are the institutional christian churches the catholic church uh specifically are they how how are they um
00:37:18.600
with what you're doing are they aware of it no obviously they're aware of it i think cardinal
00:37:22.840
schoenberg has given a bit of support over the years but but generally um do you find that the
00:37:29.400
institutional christian churches and i am specifically asking about the catholic church are really giving
00:37:35.400
you the support um that this cause deserves so in general we are an independent ngo we are not funded by
00:37:45.480
a church of any kind so we always have this challenge of fundraising through private donors
00:37:50.520
but in terms of um of support when it comes to the issue i do see that there is a big support for
00:37:56.920
example from the comet say the um the bishops conference at the european union that we closely
00:38:02.280
work together with who who are very grateful for our documenting work also the the holy sea obviously
00:38:08.680
there they were presented at the oc a different uh international um organization and and they do use our
00:38:14.680
work they use our report to just get this overview and have the data to work with and down to to find
00:38:20.920
responses or to raise the issue and really raise awareness about this so so talking about the
00:38:28.360
reports that you do how many times did it come out a year i think one came out like a week ago didn't it
00:38:33.080
10 days ago i seem to remember tell me about how often it comes out and the sorts of things that that
00:38:39.160
people can find in that so our report is published every year always on november 15 or 16 around the
00:38:45.720
day of international tolerance and this um the idea of this report is to really make visible what i've
00:38:51.160
just described as areas of discrimination of intolerance against christians and we really try
00:38:56.280
to give an overview our report has three sections the first is on hate crimes very specific
00:39:01.720
government data police data on how many churches have been attacked in which country
00:39:06.520
the second chapter about discrimination against christians in the work field uh in the public
00:39:11.400
sphere as i said with banking and all these uh different issues and then a third part of our
00:39:16.840
report is uh is about really religious freedom or legal restrictions that christians are facing or that
00:39:24.760
have repercussions on christians who want to exercise their faith and there we do legal analysis of
00:39:30.040
different things happening in europe and i really recommend to take a look to get this overview and for
00:39:35.080
all those who are somehow working in the field or concerned themselves i think it's very important for us
00:39:39.480
to know in which ways different laws affect religious freedom and how to raise awareness and maybe call upon
00:39:46.360
members of parliament or the responsible institution governments to really be careful to safeguard
00:39:51.720
religious freedom when making new legislation and we've got just two minutes left just you mentioned
00:39:58.120
banking there can you just uh tell um the war in posse are people in occupied europe being debanked because
00:40:06.360
of their christian faith so we've had a um a few cases now christian organization few are speaking about
00:40:13.880
it because it's always a very sensitive issue but those who do share about it say that because either
00:40:20.600
of sharing christian views there was a pro-life organization in sweden last year who faced
00:40:25.720
deep banking there were several christian ngo's who are working in the global south who do missionary
00:40:30.680
work or support christians persecuted christians around the world who are struggling with this
00:40:34.520
because the anti-money laundering regulations have been tightened and banks are very afraid now to
00:40:41.160
work with organizations who work with abroad but there's also this world review issues apparently the
00:40:46.040
christians say because their organization is very obvious uh either involved in pro-life work or in some
00:40:52.600
other pro-family work um they have faced uh issues uh sometimes the bank doesn't admit it but it's a
00:40:58.600
very sudden cut and then it just says you did the organization doesn't align with the ethics of that
00:41:04.120
cooperation so these things uh seem to be on the rise and we're trying to look into this more and we
00:41:09.560
think it's a very important uh issue to to keep on track on it's a huge issue my my own organization
00:41:17.480
the dignitatis humane institute was debanked here in italy about three or four years ago we weren't
00:41:22.280
given any reason any explanation whatsoever just given a perfunctory email saying that our bank
00:41:28.280
account was being closed and by the way i think we had a couple of hundred euros in that account they
00:41:34.440
never they never gave it to us they cut the they shut down that account pocketed the money and there's
00:41:40.040
really very little that you can do about it and i'm very glad that you're bringing this to people's
00:41:44.440
attentions so quickly aniel where do people go 20 seconds where do people go to learn more about
00:41:49.800
the observatory on intolerance and discrimination against christians in europe our website is
00:41:55.480
intolerance against christians.eu and there you can find all recent cases our publications our reports
00:42:01.960
but we are also on social media twitter instagram facebook it's at oidac europe which is the abbreviation
00:42:08.440
at oidac welcome back folks well i'm particularly delighted to introduce our next guest he's been
00:42:18.840
on the show quite a few times over the past year also when i was guest hosting pastor john armand
00:42:23.800
true crew senior pastor john you always uh had this ability to infuse everyone whenever you come on the
00:42:29.400
show and i know you you're a great hit with the war in posse i'm going to cut in straight into my two
00:42:34.360
questions to you if you could pick an event over the course of the last year which you think uh you
00:42:41.080
can say i think this was god acting in the affairs of of man you know i can't overlook what happened on
00:42:48.360
july 13th um as a deranged human being sought to snub and take out the life of now president donald j trump
00:42:58.440
um when you think about that the bible tells us that the heart of the king is in the hands of the
00:43:07.000
lord and he turns it into whatever direction that he desires we found out on july 13th that not only
00:43:14.680
does god turn the hearts of kings but he also turns the heads of kings president trump turned his head
00:43:23.480
at the right time avoiding avoiding a catastrophic incident only almighty god can do that god turns
00:43:34.520
hearts but he also turns heads and i believe that god has ordained this time for him to lead this
00:43:42.280
country you know i was just in phoenix arizona for the amfest event under turning point usa and president
00:43:50.840
trump walked up to the microphone in the beginning and he said that today now more than ever we want
00:43:57.720
to say things like merry christmas you know in the past many presidents obama biden potentially harris
00:44:06.040
didn't want to say merry christmas but we now have a president who's not afraid to say that
00:44:10.280
i believe that president trump has been ordained for god and by god for such a time as this
00:44:15.320
perfect response pastor john um anything from your personal uh life that you would think uh that
00:44:25.560
you'd want to share with us um to which you're particularly grateful to god for there's so many
00:44:31.720
things that come to mind number one i'm thankful that over the course of this year as i've traveled to
00:44:37.400
now um 16 different school board stops this year but a total of 18 states in total i'm thankful for
00:44:46.520
my wife who held down the home who took care of the children who made it easy for me to go and to
00:44:53.240
transition and to do all of the work that god has called me to do for my children who have stood by me
00:44:58.680
as well and for many of my funders and supporters who have donated to my work through inogod.us i'm
00:45:07.320
thankful for turning point usa and dr bob who has come alongside me as well to support my efforts
00:45:14.280
in this national campaign to fight against woke tyrants at school board meetings all around the
00:45:19.480
country we're fighting against gender theory queer theory and critical race theory and we have the
00:45:25.480
opportunity to defund to defund the department of education and to send resources back to the
00:45:31.080
state and to protect our children i am gratefully and amazingly thankful for them pastor john tomorrow's
00:45:42.120
christmas day and the world will either recognize or commemorate or or pray along with the the
00:45:51.160
commemoration of the birth of our lord and savior jesus christ in the general political battle um
00:45:57.400
and i know i think i think we should we share the same view that the political battles that we
00:46:01.640
have here on earth is basically a reflection of the of what's going on in the wider spiritual battle
00:46:07.320
you know ephesians 6 12 and all the rest of it but what would you just say just in a couple of
00:46:11.880
minutes what would you just say how do you tie the the the incarnation of god himself to the the the
00:46:18.760
greater political battle that we're fighting here um in the secular world well i'm telling people
00:46:25.880
all around this country and i said this in phoenix that the election is over but the rapture the coming
00:46:32.600
of christ is pending and so we have much work to do but we cannot overlook the reason for this season
00:46:41.320
the bible tells us in john 3 16 for god so loved the world that he gave his only begotten
00:46:48.680
son that whosoever believeth on him might not perish but have everlasting life he gave us the
00:46:57.240
ultimate gift and that gift is available for anyone regardless of your past regardless of the things
00:47:04.840
that you've done christ is for you and so we can take solace in that message knowing that the birth of
00:47:13.960
christ is what brings true liberty and freedom freedom from the pain of death freedom from damnation
00:47:26.920
father john um 90 seconds excuse me um we've got about two minutes would you just um would you kindly
00:47:33.560
lead us in prayer it's christmas eve would you lead us in prayer um and give us a blessing
00:47:38.200
yes lord your word tells us that righteousness exalts a nation but sin is a reproach towards any free
00:47:47.240
people you also say in your word that you are coming back for a church without a spot or wrinkle
00:47:55.320
so god we we know today that you care for us you're concerned about us you love us and that you want to send
00:48:03.480
your redemption upon this nation mankind has rejected you but god we believe that there is revival yet
00:48:10.440
upon this land we pray for eyes to be open for hearts to be tender and for people to understand
00:48:16.920
the significance of this season we thank you oh god for smiling upon our nation and giving us a president
00:48:24.040
that will soon take office on january 20th of 2025 who has the mindset to do things that uplift the word of
00:48:32.200
god and that speak clearly to the thing that you're most concerned about we thank you and
00:48:37.320
we bless you for this time to spend with our family and friends we pray that you will be with us and
00:48:41.800
keep us in jesus name we pray amen amen father john that's very very kind of you uh before you bounce
00:48:50.760
where do people go on social media to stay in touch with your interventions yes they can go to my youtube
00:48:59.800
channel it's at r-e-v-w-u truth that's rev wu truth at r-e-v-w-u truth follow me there and i appreciate your support
00:49:16.680
father john i'm an true senior thank you very much as always for coming on the show uh uh and sharing your
00:49:24.600
particular uh unique uh spiritual insights with us as we contemplate the political events on a
00:49:30.680
day-to-day basis i take this moment to wish you a very merry christmas thank you brother john
00:49:35.480
thank you stay with thank you stay with us folks we've got a cracked hour coming up just after this
00:49:41.240
short break we've got jenny holland we've got um bob moinehan and patrick k o'donnell as well
00:49:47.640
answering the same sorts of questions as uh to the presence and active role of god in our lives
00:49:55.560
stand by folks we'll be back in two weeks after this short break don't go away
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