Bannon's War Room - Episode 4486： Mass Momentum Behind Habeas Corpus

00:00:00.000 Isolating Iran, if you get all these people to start working together with the United States, 0.97

00:00:05.140 I mean, you are really putting Iran in harm's way with a bunch of arrows pointing at them.

00:00:11.680 They got nowhere to go.

00:00:13.980 The biggest line yesterday in the speech, that speech was historic.

00:00:17.840 Of course, the mainstream media is barely talking about it.

00:00:20.700 He gives this historic speech two days ago.

00:00:23.400 And the power of the speech, or yesterday, the power of the speech,

00:00:26.760 the most important line where he says, you know, he wants countries to develop by their cultures and their societies.

00:00:33.200 We're not going to get involved in that, in democracy, you know, forcing democracy on people.

00:00:37.300 But then he says, under no circumstances will we allow the Persians basically to get a nuclear weapon.

00:00:44.300 That got thunderous applause, and he's not speaking in the Knesset.

00:00:48.120 That's among the most senior Arab leaders in the world.

00:00:51.460 They're 100% with us on this.

00:00:53.180 Now, no one wants military intervention, but President Trump's laid it down

00:00:58.080 and actually talked about in the speech what the war room does.

00:01:01.340 Let's cut the oil off.

00:01:02.760 90% of their cash flow comes from selling the Chinese Communist Party two million barrels a day.

00:01:08.900 You got two carrier battle groups in Red Sea, move one over to the Straits of Hormuz,

00:01:13.120 and say, hey, guys, you got to turn the ships around.

00:01:15.740 You're not going to China.

00:01:17.160 And let's see what they look like in 100 days after that.

00:01:19.840 Yep, that's China's Achilles, the oil, energy. 0.99

00:01:22.280 Steve, we took a couple minutes of your time.

00:01:23.820 Appreciate your time.

00:01:24.560 Good to get you back in our E block.

00:01:27.900 Tomorrow we have a little bit more time.

00:01:29.100 Hey, if you're here Friday, we've got a game to play with you.

00:01:31.580 You're going to like it.

00:01:34.440 By the way, you're the best opening an E block I got.

00:01:37.940 So, I mean, come on.

00:01:39.000 I'm using you.

00:01:41.120 Don't have your agent call me, okay?

00:01:43.000 I don't have an agent.

00:01:43.700 We're using this as a freebie.

00:01:45.460 Sig is my agent. 0.76

00:01:46.580 I think he might be yours, though.

00:01:47.860 All right, have a great show, Steve.

00:01:50.120 Sig. 0.86

00:01:51.220 Love you, Eric.

00:01:51.980 Thank you for doing it.

00:01:52.540 Thank you, brother.

00:01:53.720 Okay, you're in the war room.

00:01:54.800 We're going to pack this afternoon.

00:01:55.940 Let's go.

00:01:56.280 We've got a great cold open for you,

00:01:57.660 put together by the crack war room production team.

00:02:01.080 Let's let it rip. 0.99

00:02:03.040 Hold on.

00:02:03.560 There's a question back there for us.

00:02:04.720 I have two quick questions.

00:02:06.640 First, you know, President Trump has talked about potentially suspending the escorpus

00:02:11.260 to take care of the illegal immigration problem.

00:02:14.140 When could we see that happen, do you think?

00:02:15.800 Well, the Constitution is clear, and that, of course, is the supreme law of the land,

00:02:20.740 that the privilege of the writ of habeas corpus can be suspended in a time of invasion.

00:02:26.420 So I would say that's an option we're actively looking at.

00:02:28.920 Look, a lot of it depends on whether the courts do the right thing or not.

00:02:32.500 At the end of the day, Congress passed a body of law known as the Immigration Nationality Act,

00:02:38.120 which stripped Article III courts, that's the judicial branch of a jurisdiction over immigration cases.

00:02:44.140 So Congress actually passed, it's called jurisdiction stripping legislation.

00:02:48.380 It passed a number of laws that say that the Article III courts aren't even allowed to be involved in immigration cases.

00:02:54.500 Many of you probably don't know this.

00:02:55.560 I'll give you a good example.

00:02:57.100 Are you familiar with the term temporary protected status, or TPS, right?

00:03:00.740 So by statute, the courts are stripped of jurisdiction from overruling a presidential determination or a secretarial determination on TPS,

00:03:12.340 when the Secretary of Homeland Security makes that determination.

00:03:14.780 So when Secretary Noem terminated TPS for the illegals that Biden flew into the country,

00:03:19.560 when courts stepped in, they were violating explicit language that Congress had enacted, saying they have no jurisdiction.

00:03:25.880 So it's not just the courts aren't just at war with the executive branch.

00:03:29.760 The courts are at war, these radical rogue judges, with the legislative branch as well, too.

00:03:34.220 So all of that will inform the choices the president ultimately makes.

00:03:37.640 Yes.

00:03:37.900 Mr. Miller.

00:03:38.840 Ms. Noem, are you familiar with Article I, Section 9, Clause 2 of the Constitution,

00:03:43.660 that covers the suspension of the writ of habeas corpus?

00:03:46.760 Yes.

00:03:47.080 It says that the writ of habeas corpus shall not be suspended unless, when cases of rebellion or invasion, the public safety may require it.

00:03:59.320 Are you aware of which presidents have suspended the writ of habeas corpus?

00:04:03.760 I know that President Lincoln did.

00:04:05.780 Yeah.

00:04:06.220 Also Roosevelt and President Grant.

00:04:08.800 You testified under oath, I believe, that the Biden administration allowed an invasion into our country.

00:04:14.500 Is that correct?

00:04:15.220 That is correct.

00:04:15.880 So do you think it falls under the constitutional guidelines that I just read to you?

00:04:21.260 I'm not a constitutional lawyer, but I believe it does.

00:04:26.500 You've also witnessed that the Democrats here today, and also radical activist judges,

00:04:31.240 are trying to halt and deny the president's agenda to carry out his constitutional duties to keep Americans safe

00:04:37.880 and carry out his promise to the American people to secure the border

00:04:41.100 and carry out mass deportations of those who have entered the country illegally.

00:04:45.880 Knowing this, are you open and supportive of this constitutional option to suspend the writ of habeas corpus to keep Americans safe

00:04:54.040 and carry out the president's agenda?

00:04:55.960 Well, this is something that's not in my purview to weigh in on.

00:05:02.840 This is the president's prerogative to pursue, and he has not indicated to me that he will or will not be taking that action.

00:05:09.740 I want to thank Rogan O'Hanley for his efforts to bring this constitutional solution into the national conversation.

00:05:16.120 This is the primal scream of a dying regime.

00:05:22.780 Pray for our enemies, because we're going medieval on these people.

00:05:29.200 Here's the reason I got a free shot at all these networks lying about the people.

00:05:33.480 The people have had a belly full of it.

00:05:35.380 I know you don't like hearing that.

00:05:36.820 I know you try to do everything in the world to stop that, but you're not going to stop it.

00:05:39.500 It's going to happen.

00:05:40.540 And where do people like that go to share the big line?

00:05:44.160 Mega Media.

00:05:45.080 I wish in my soul, I wish that any of these people had a conscience.

00:05:50.980 Ask yourself, what is my task and what is my purpose?

00:05:54.700 If that answer is to save my country, this country will be saved.

00:06:01.100 War Room.

00:06:01.920 Here's your host, Stephen K. Band.

00:06:04.300 Wednesday, 14 May, Year of Our Lord, 2025.

00:06:12.020 Absolutely packed today from the cutter all the way to the United States, all the way across the country.

00:06:18.300 Got so much to go through.

00:06:19.080 But this, I'm telling you, as we had Matt Gaetz on here today, of the converging crises in the second hundred days of President Trump's presidency,

00:06:27.740 this will be the definitional part.

00:06:30.880 But this, the radical judges, judicial supremacy over the commander-in-chief or the chief executive officer of the government,

00:06:41.480 over the chief magistrate and chief law enforcement officer, that would be the Article II powers of the presidency,

00:06:47.560 are hurtling towards a catechismic, I think, was it Denimoire?

00:06:54.660 Rogan and Hanley joins us.

00:06:56.040 Rogan, now in Congress, they're asking the head of DHS, that's at the White House, this behind scenes is starting to pick up a lot of momentum.

00:07:06.340 Mike Davis and, of course, Matt Gaetz, think we got a lot more runway before you got to get there.

00:07:14.700 Walk us through where you think we stand right now with the suspension of the writ of habeas corpus, sir.

00:07:20.780 Well, I think you nailed it.

00:07:23.880 There's just a lot of momentum, you know.

00:07:26.200 I very much appreciate Representative Eli Crane for the shout-out.

00:07:30.980 But, you know, this is the war room.

00:07:33.480 The credit goes to the war room posse because if it weren't for you bringing me on to discuss it and the war room posse spreading this message,

00:07:41.300 supporting it, sharing it,

00:07:42.800 everyone watching this is the reason this may end up happening.

00:07:47.020 And I do agree there is a process that needs to play out, which is what, you know, I've noticed it in the change in President Trump's phrasing, right?

00:07:57.440 He's calling it an invasion in all caps and saying, I don't know why that's not being included in all our legal filings, that this is an invasion.

00:08:05.380 20 million people coming across the border, if you ask anyone with a brain, they're going to say, yeah, that's an invasion.

00:08:12.040 And if not, what is?

00:08:13.480 30 million, 40 million?

00:08:15.720 And so there is a process that needs to play out before I think the American people will be like, OK, let's do this.

00:08:21.980 But every time the deep state, these corrupt institutions weaponize themselves against President Trump, he emerges victorious.

00:08:31.620 They did it with the impeachment.

00:08:32.920 They abused it.

00:08:33.640 He came out more popular.

00:08:35.060 They did it with the indictments.

00:08:38.060 OK, he came out more popular.

00:08:39.900 And now they're doing it with a judicial coup, right?

00:08:42.500 People are wisening up to the fact that this is not normal to have this many national injunctions and for these judges to fight tooth and nail to keep violent cartel members inside this country when they didn't lift a finger to stop the 10 to 20 million coming across our border under Joe Biden.

00:09:00.660 The American people are not dumb.

00:09:01.900 They voted across the board, full control of the government for a president that touted mass deportations. 0.83

00:09:08.620 And now these radical activists in robes are trying to stop them.

00:09:12.460 What else?

00:09:13.180 At a certain point, what else can we do?

00:09:15.360 And I ask people to look ahead a little bit.

00:09:17.760 OK, say we don't do mass deportation.

00:09:19.860 Say we only deport 2 million in his term.

00:09:22.680 Guess what happens under President Gavin Newsom?

00:09:24.700 Another 10 to 20 million come in.

00:09:27.560 Now we're 30, 40 million deep.

00:09:29.980 And if he wins reelection because of rigged elections or whatever, 50, 60, we don't have a country anymore.

00:09:36.460 It will be toast.

00:09:38.360 It will be done.

00:09:39.300 So it's not even a, oh, we want to just get these illegals out. 0.98

00:09:43.360 This is for the survival of the country, which is why I think in hindsight, in historical hindsight, President Trump will look and emerge as one of our best presidents if he does this because he will truly have saved the republic.

00:09:54.820 Three just facts.

00:09:57.500 I want to go back over how driving this.

00:09:59.020 Number one, let's leave the ones that folks came before. 0.84

00:10:01.980 Just on Biden's watch, we know from every bit of analysis and assessment from DHS and others, 10 million illegal alien invaders just here in those four years.

00:10:11.480 Number one.

00:10:13.060 Number two, you've got $170 billion in these budgets, $170 billion to replace them.

00:10:22.040 That's a fact.

00:10:22.860 I mean, how do people look the other way?

00:10:24.460 That is the definition of invasion.

00:10:26.160 Just to deport these takes $170 billion.

00:10:30.100 Fact number three is that it was supposed to take us decades, the Langford bill, 2 million more invaders here before anything kicked in. 0.94

00:10:36.680 Trump shut that down in 60 to 90 days.

00:10:40.100 That's secure.

00:10:40.800 He's going to build the wall and other things.

00:10:42.620 But we've stopped the invasion because it was an invasion.

00:10:46.020 People are like, you know, the mainstream media don't want to address it.

00:10:48.160 You stop the invasion in 60 to 90 days of which even Republicans said best case is going to be 2 million, like 2 million new folks a year before any of the stuff to stop them kicked in in the Langford bill.

00:11:02.000 You've got $170 billion in the reconciliation bill to deport these people, to set up the logistics chain, right?

00:11:10.220 And it's been demonstrated that there's 10 million here.

00:11:14.140 How much more evidence do you need that it's an invasion and it's his right as commander-in-chief to remove these people, sir?

00:11:20.280 I couldn't agree more, Steve.

00:11:23.420 And we've seen, you know, it's not just the border wall.

00:11:26.460 Even with strong immigration enforcement, it just takes one radical Democrat president to completely disassemble it and basically tie Border Patrol's hands behind their back.

00:11:36.460 We cannot rely purely on a border wall, but we can rely on these deportations because as much as they open the border, they can only get, as we've seen, about 10 million in per term before people rise up.

00:11:49.980 So a lot of this has to do with the 2030 census, OK?

00:11:54.020 And it's not just the survival of the country.

00:11:57.080 This is about power, pure and simple.

00:11:59.780 Let's call it what it is.

00:12:01.460 Democrats, they don't give a hoot about the charitable aspect of this, about giving these people a better life.

00:12:08.780 This is purely about power.

00:12:10.820 We've seen how they're freaking out when 59 South African farmers come into this country. 1.00

00:12:16.240 Oh, you guys want to save people who are under actual persecution?

00:12:20.600 Unless they're, you know, stable families who come in the legal way, right?

00:12:25.780 We've seen them flip out.

00:12:26.680 This is purely about power.

00:12:28.380 Blue states have done such a terrible job at maintaining residence. 0.99

00:12:31.900 Everyone's fleeing to red states that they're getting depopulated.

00:12:34.880 They're going to lose electoral college votes.

00:12:36.740 There's 12 electoral college votes that are going to swing to safe red seats in the 2030 census.

00:12:41.660 There's if you if you deport 15, 20 million illegal aliens, that's 26 congressional seats worth of representation, which unfortunately our Supreme Court allows illegals to be counted in the census.

00:12:55.240 So this is about 2030.

00:12:57.840 That is a massive turning point in our country.

00:13:00.240 But you know what I want to do, Steve?

00:13:01.640 I call it Operation Martha's Vineyard.

00:13:03.960 All we want is what they did on Martha's Vineyard.

00:13:07.000 When 48 illegals touched down, they mobilized the National Guard within 48 hours and booted them all without a trial. 0.99

00:13:14.200 If it's good enough for Martha's Vineyard Democrats, it's good enough for the rest of us.

00:13:18.220 Rogan, can you hang on for a second?

00:13:21.520 I want to go back and tie something together.

00:13:25.020 You brought up this quite brilliant about the 2030 census.

00:13:28.640 Rogan O'Hanley is the author of this idea of suspending the writ of habeas corpus, taking it from history from three presidents.

00:13:39.520 Kind of, you know, random FDR, General Grant and President Abraham Lincoln during the Civil War.

00:13:45.840 All three of them suspended it.

00:13:47.280 Pretty big names, right?

00:13:49.300 Short commercial break.

00:13:50.280 Rogan's going to be on the side.

00:13:51.700 Also have a new MAGA candidate that just won big in the New York City area.

00:13:57.420 He's going to be here.

00:13:58.540 E.J. and Tony, man, Senator Johnson, they lit it up, talking about, what, $60 trillion by 2035 or something.

00:14:06.860 People's heads are blowing up.

00:14:08.580 Exactly where we're heading on this financing.

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00:14:38.240 So President Trump's got this issue with the Constitution.

00:14:40.800 It's got to be settled, I think, by the end of June.

00:14:43.100 You've got the Rio Reset, getting rid of the dollar in July.

00:14:46.620 And then you've got the debt ceiling.

00:14:48.360 We're going to talk more about that.

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00:16:27.980 Here's your host, Stephen K. Bannon.

00:16:30.480 So, Rogan, take a second here.

00:16:37.340 I want to go back to the 2030 census.

00:16:40.260 Demographically, the country is moving south and southwest to red states.

00:16:45.080 Arizona, Texas, Alabama, Mississippi, Florida, Georgia, North Carolina.

00:16:51.500 It's just overwhelming how they're going south and going to areas of the southwest

00:16:55.480 and even some of the other parts of the west that are MAGA, you know, MAGA-centric.

00:17:02.220 Talk to me about the 2030 census because the Democrats are playing the long game here.

00:17:05.980 They understand that the time that census is done,

00:17:08.940 and remember I was the guy along with a couple of others in the White House

00:17:11.840 that tried to force the issue of commerce to make sure that the illegal aliens here did not count. 0.59

00:17:19.820 He thought it was outrageous, but go ahead and walk us through the 2030 census.

00:17:23.060 Why is this so important?

00:17:24.060 Why are you talking about basically 12 new congressional seats that will give us a big spread in the House?

00:17:29.220 Also, add electoral college votes that may be insurmountable to the Democrats.

00:17:34.460 Yeah, absolutely, Steve.

00:17:35.780 I mean, this is the grand prize.

00:17:38.580 This is what Democrats are fighting for, you know.

00:17:41.640 I would say second best is to get illegals to actually be able to vote, right, to get them amnesty. 0.76

00:17:47.700 That's their dream, but they'd be happy with just having bodies in states, and that's what they're playing for.

00:17:54.540 That's why they flooded the zone with 10 million illegals because they said, 1.00

00:17:58.780 even though we know this is probably going to smoke us in the election, we're playing for the 2030 census

00:18:04.840 because if they don't, if they don't remain here, they stand to lose over 12 electoral college seats in California,

00:18:15.800 in New York, in Massachusetts, in Pennsylvania, in Michigan, in Wisconsin, and they're going to red states. 0.63

00:18:23.440 They're going to Florida.

00:18:24.420 They're going to Georgia.

00:18:25.560 They're going to Texas.

00:18:26.740 They're going to Nevada and a few—North Carolina.

00:18:32.200 And what that would mean, Steve, is we would not—Republicans would not even need to campaign in Pennsylvania,

00:18:38.960 Michigan, or Wisconsin to win the White House.

00:18:42.240 Only the safe red states would need to be won, and they'd cakewalk into the White House with a very comfortable House majority 0.68

00:18:48.820 because when they lose these electoral college seats, those are congressional seats.

00:18:52.480 Now we're redistricting again, and you're going to add two more seats to Florida, maybe three.

00:18:58.000 Remember, they stole three to five seats in this last census, right?

00:19:03.020 We saw that.

00:19:04.160 Biden got to kind of clean up right at the last minute after the 2020 census,

00:19:09.920 and they found out that Massachusetts kept the seat they shouldn't have.

00:19:13.400 California kept the seat they should because of errors in calculations, right?

00:19:17.820 We're already operating at an unfair disadvantage.

00:19:21.300 But, yeah, this is what it comes down to.

00:19:24.040 And Trump, even if—I hate to say it, but even if we lost in 2028,

00:19:30.320 if he actually deported 10 to 15 million illegal aliens,

00:19:34.000 they could not stack the country quick enough by the 2030 census to have that impact.

00:19:38.160 But this is why your habeas corpus on the commander-in-chief is so important

00:19:41.080 because they're trying to delay us to deny.

00:19:43.460 Just math and math to get 10 million out.

00:19:45.400 Now, the clock's—they want to make it so painful on the worst of the worst of the criminals,

00:19:50.660 the terrorists, and draw every process out.

00:19:54.180 And this is why President Trump's eventually going to go to your solution.

00:19:57.760 Rogan, where do people go to find more about your thinking on this

00:20:01.040 and more about your amazing social media platform?

00:20:03.960 Thank you, Steve.

00:20:06.060 You can find me, DC underscore Drano, on all the major platforms.

00:20:09.680 And I will say, a new policy that's kind of given me hope is what Governor DeSantis has been doing in Florida.

00:20:13.980 He's proposing—I think they call it the Florida Plan—to deputize JAG lawyers in the National Guard

00:20:19.680 to act as immigration judges, right?

00:20:21.800 Like Stephen Miller said, this is not an Article III issue.

00:20:25.060 This is Article II.

00:20:26.480 And the immigration judges work for President Trump.

00:20:30.200 Let's get a lot more immigration judges or whoever it can be

00:20:33.320 and start processing these people and sending them out.

00:20:36.880 Right there.

00:20:37.540 Put them right at the border.

00:20:39.000 Rogan, fantastic.

00:20:40.100 Thank you.

00:20:40.480 DC Drano, amazing.

00:20:41.900 Thank you, Steve.

00:20:42.200 It's changing the course of American history.

00:20:43.800 This shows you the power of your agency, your thinking.

00:20:47.660 You know, put it on social media.

00:20:48.860 And we're in posse.

00:20:49.940 You guys jumped on this.

00:20:51.760 You were forced multipliers.

00:20:53.140 Next thing you know, everybody's talking about it, including the President of the United States.

00:20:56.940 We've got some other big news taking wins every day.

00:20:59.760 Let's go ahead and get a short clip. 0.78

00:21:00.940 I'm going to bring in Frank Marino.

00:21:02.580 Hello, everybody.

00:21:03.620 Councilman-elect Marino, at least for a little while longer,

00:21:06.880 because I'm about to go to City Hall to be sworn in.

00:21:10.620 We're on the Staten Island Ferry now.

00:21:12.540 About to head to Manhattan to go to City Hall.

00:21:14.940 Of all boats, what boat do we end up on?

00:21:18.320 The only boat that's still in service, well, one of only two boats,

00:21:22.080 that's still in service was somebody that I actually knew.

00:21:24.700 Guy V. Molinari.

00:21:25.720 That's right.

00:21:26.120 We're on the Guy Molinari.

00:21:27.480 Hopefully, that's a good omen that I'll be able to win 10 or 11 elections just the way that Guy did.

00:21:33.500 In all seriousness, very excited about this.

00:21:35.560 I'm with Carmine and Rachel.

00:21:37.540 Carmine's right now very fixated upon looking out the window of the ferry.

00:21:40.760 Thank you again for the opportunity to serve, and I promise not to let you down.

00:21:45.280 I, Frank Morano, do solemnly swear, that I will support the Constitution of the United States, and the Constitution of the State of New York, and that I will faithfully discharge, the duties of the Office of, Councilmember, in the New York City Council, for the 51st Council District,

00:22:14.500 for the 51st Council District, in the borough of Staten Island, in the county of Richmond, in the city of New York, according to the best of my ability, Councilmember Morano.

00:22:41.220 Frank, why is this such an important win right now for MAGA?

00:22:45.200 Huge for a few reasons.

00:22:46.380 One, because it's in the heart of New York City, and it shows that even in New York, people don't like defunding the police, people don't like cashless bail, people don't like the revolving door of criminals being let out so that they're home in time for dinner.

00:23:02.440 It's important because even in New York, people believe in the same things that they do in the rest of the country.

00:23:09.200 And it's important in Republican circles, because I think my victory shows, I ran on a very populist platform, my victory shows that the future of the Republican Party, the future of the conservative movement, is not the Bush, McCain, Romney style of so-called conservatism.

00:23:27.580 It's Trumpian, Bannon style, populist conservatism.

00:23:32.200 That's what I want to bring to the Republican Party and to the New York City Council.

00:23:36.320 And look, we've got another election coming up in 41 days.

00:23:39.460 This time it's a Republican primary.

00:23:41.260 And if people want to be part of the solution to making the GOP, the grand old populist party, join our mission at MoranoForCouncil.com.

00:23:52.200 Frank, Charlie Spearing, one of the best reporters out there, used to work for me at Breitbart's Now at the Daily Mail.

00:23:56.880 He had an amazing piece that led the Daily Mail's website for half a day, going through polling that Daily Mail had done with one of the top polling firms in the country, showing that actually New York is actually shifting right on MAGA values.

00:24:12.840 And he's basically saying it's teed up for Hochul to be turfed out in the next election.

00:24:18.700 Do you think there's any chance that really MAGA types can make a run at more council seats, actually take out maybe the local DA, even the mayor, the governor?

00:24:28.120 Is this real?

00:24:29.020 Is New York going MAGA?

00:24:31.020 Absolutely.

00:24:31.880 I mean, I think it's a long way before Manhattan elects a Republican or a conservative or a MAGA DA.

00:24:37.520 But everything else that you just described is very possible.

00:24:41.620 I think there's a real—look, you see what's going on in the mayor's race.

00:24:44.740 You see the incumbent Democratic mayor, Eric Adams, who four years ago ran on a platform of being Al Sharpton's best friend.

00:24:53.020 Now he went from being the Biden of Brooklyn to the Trump of City Hall.

00:24:57.580 He's running on a Trumpian platform.

00:24:59.640 Even Andrew Cuomo, who couldn't bash Trump enough during COVID, he is going out of his way not to alienate Trump or Trump supporters.

00:25:09.280 And on a lot of criminal justice issues, he's running a very different campaign from the one that he did when he was governor.

00:25:17.260 Now, I don't think these guys have really changed their tune all that much.

00:25:20.020 But I think it's a reflection and a realization on their part that the voters are waking up, that the voters have changed their tune.

00:25:27.340 Not only do I think there's a real chance to get Governor Kathy Hochul out next year,

00:25:31.280 I think there's a great chance to pick up more MAGA city council seats in New York City.

00:25:36.920 But I think there's a fighting chance that we could actually see someone like a Curtis Lee will win the mayor of New York City this year,

00:25:43.480 which would be a political earthquake, the likes of which we haven't seen since Giuliani won in 93.

00:25:49.600 Wow.

00:25:50.280 Frank, as you know, this is—I don't need to tell you, because you know him so well, that this is very close to President Trump's heart.

00:25:57.380 We've got about a minute.

00:25:58.300 What do you think we need to do as a movement to help our brothers and sisters and our MAGA brothers and sisters in New York, sir?

00:26:07.860 A couple things.

00:26:09.080 One, you can go to my website, moranoforcouncil.com, make a contribution, help us out.

00:26:13.880 But also, don't be fooled into labels.

00:26:16.820 Don't be fooled because someone says they're a Republican into thinking they believe the same things that you believe in.

00:26:23.660 The point that you and others have made, that there are times when somebody that's been a Republican elected official for the last 30, 35 years,

00:26:31.960 they have a lot more in common with the Democratic establishment than they do with Donald Trump and the populist conservative right.

00:26:39.480 This is such an exciting time, but it's only an exciting time, and it's only a promising time if we wake up and take this party from the D.C.

00:26:48.220 swamp creatures that have done such a miserable job running it in a Bush era. 0.53

00:26:53.900 The Bush era is dead.

00:26:55.740 Let's have the Trump era, and let's make this party into a populist party with a big tent that we can all be proud of.

00:27:02.880 Frank, social media and website, where do people go?

00:27:06.620 moranoforcouncil.com, moranoforcouncil.com, or Frank Morano on Twitter.

00:27:11.300 Frank Morano on Twitter.

00:27:12.320 Brother, thank you for coming on.

00:27:15.220 Thank you for fighting, fighting on to victory.

00:27:17.320 Fantastic.

00:27:17.820 Everybody's jacked up.

00:27:18.820 Thank you, sir.

00:27:19.420 Thank you for having me.

00:27:20.520 Just being on your show really gave me such credibility with conservative and Trumpy in circles.

00:27:26.340 I can't thank you enough for that.

00:27:27.560 I'm going to be in your debt for a long time.

00:27:30.180 No, sir.

00:27:31.580 Every day, you guys are getting it.

00:27:33.760 You're taking the incoming.

00:27:35.120 It's really incredible, and keep fighting.

00:27:36.760 And we're going to get Pam Bondi to shut down this Sanctuary City joke that New York City has become and end New York City's Sanctuary City status. 1.00

00:27:48.080 That was my first act since being elected, is to sign on to that letter asking the Attorney General to do just that.

00:27:53.920 We're hoping she does.

00:27:55.520 Amen.

00:27:56.040 Thank you, sir.

00:27:56.560 Appreciate you.

00:27:57.060 Thank you, sir.

00:28:27.060 Health isn't just a personal issue.

00:28:28.980 It's a family issue, a community issue.

00:28:31.620 We're living in unpredictable times.

00:28:33.380 Supply chains can break down.

00:28:34.660 Hospitals can get overwhelmed, and let's not even start on the natural disasters.

00:28:39.320 These aren't hypotheticals.

00:28:40.520 They're happening.

00:28:41.140 You see it here in the war room, and we all know it.

00:28:43.960 The question is simply, are you ready?

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00:29:33.880 If you take a look at my bottom lines of budget reconciliation, the first principle, when we're $37 trillion in debt, according to CBO, will be about $59 to $60 trillion in 2035.

00:29:47.080 My first principle would be, let's bend that curve down.

00:29:50.740 Let's make sure that whatever we do, we don't increase the deficit.

00:29:54.220 But right now, I think we're on track to increase the deficit.

00:29:57.000 But are they listening to you?

00:29:59.340 Do you feel like they're potentially going to accommodate you?

00:30:02.120 Yeah, what's interesting is they all agree with me.

00:30:04.300 Literally, they say, well, I agree with what you're saying, but that ship has sailed.

00:30:09.940 What I reply, we'll call it back to port.

00:30:14.080 Because I think that other ship with the big, beautiful bill, I think that's the Titanic.

00:30:17.180 I think that's going down because I think I have enough colleagues in the Senate that this has resonated with that are saying,

00:30:23.460 yeah, we've got to return to a reasonable pre-pandemic level spending.

00:30:27.060 But I always add this, plus a process to achieve it and maintain it.

00:30:32.520 Okay, E.J. and Tony.

00:30:36.180 E.J., we had Senator Johnson on this morning.

00:30:40.740 He's warning about, hey, we're going to blow.

00:30:43.100 First off, he makes the point that you make.

00:30:45.440 The debt's not going up because Besson's doing a great job of bailing water out of the boat.

00:30:52.420 But as soon as we get the debt ceiling passed, there's going to be another $500 billion to a trillion on the official debt that gets counted up.

00:30:59.680 So we're north of 37 right now.

00:31:02.660 He's saying, hey, look, every senator agrees that the glide slope we're on or the path we're on gets a $60 trillion in 10 years.

00:31:11.460 And the country's over.

00:31:13.260 What say you, sir?

00:31:15.480 Well, Steve, I think that's right.

00:31:17.120 And the senator really hit the nail on the head here when he said, everybody agrees this is a problem, right?

00:31:21.960 You're not going to find anybody who just shrugs their shoulders at this problem and says, oh, no, don't worry about it.

00:31:27.040 It's going to be fine.

00:31:28.040 No, literally nobody says it's going to be fine.

00:31:30.660 Everyone knows we're going over the fiscal cliff.

00:31:32.740 But what's everybody's answer?

00:31:34.560 Start cutting spending.

00:31:36.040 Just don't start with my stuff.

00:31:37.840 You can't cut my pet projects.

00:31:39.740 You can't cut stuff from my district or my constituents.

00:31:43.320 You have to cut everywhere else.

00:31:44.520 Well, when that is everyone's attitude, then absolutely nothing gets cut.

00:31:48.500 And that's how we got to where we are today.

00:31:51.380 And I think that's part of the holdup right now with the current tax cut bill is everybody, both whether it's Democrat or Republican, doesn't matter.

00:32:00.200 Almost every member of Congress, there's very few exceptions, are genuinely willing to cut the things that need to be cut.

00:32:07.160 And it's becoming not just problematic.

00:32:10.300 It's going to become catastrophic.

00:32:12.040 So what then is to be done?

00:32:15.760 I mean, he says, and he came on today, that behind closed doors, all of the senators agree we have to go to pre-pandemic.

00:32:23.880 We've got to go back to Trump's golden year of 2019.

00:32:27.800 One, do you think that's feasible?

00:32:29.800 And two, then why are we not doing the work right now to make that happen?

00:32:34.900 Well, it's certainly feasible, Steve.

00:32:38.160 I just can't for the life of me understand why the leadership in both the House and the Senate are not making that a reality.

00:32:45.780 I mean, my goodness, 95 percent of the spending that you would cut out to get us back to those 2019 levels is all stuff that the Democrats did.

00:32:54.760 It's not stuff that the Democrats or that the Republicans voted for, that you can repeal the entire IRA, for example.

00:33:01.640 That would save hundreds of billions of dollars, and that's not an exaggeration.

00:33:06.640 The only exaggeration was when the Democrats passed the darn thing, and they told us that it was going to have a relatively small impact on the budget, and they were off by over a trillion dollars.

00:33:16.140 So those were the folks that exaggerated. 0.72

00:33:18.880 You can save a lot of money just by repealing the things that the Democrats passed on their own over the last four years.

00:33:27.180 And again, for the life of me, why aren't they doing that?

00:33:29.620 I don't know, Steve.

00:33:31.100 It is beyond frustrating.

00:33:34.240 So Johnson says there's a half a dozen votes up there or more right now that view this thing as the Titanic.

00:33:40.720 Give me your assessment of where you think the House stands because it's kind of very convoluted.

00:33:44.580 You got people working on pieces of this.

00:33:47.800 You had them to taxize ways and means.

00:33:50.460 They won't put forward or let anybody see an overall number to see what their projected deficits are.

00:33:56.280 But I can tell you, and we've never been wrong on this, it's going to be over $2 trillion this year or close to it.

00:34:02.640 In fiscal year 26, which the reconciliation bill is, I don't know how they get – I don't know how they avoid another $2 trillion deficit at least.

00:34:12.540 And that blows through the debt ceiling increase before Election Day in the midterm elections.

00:34:18.960 Do you think my math is that far off?

00:34:22.140 No, Steve, you make a lot of really great points, including what you started with, saying that we're already over $500 billion essentially in the hole,

00:34:31.120 meaning Treasury has been blowing through its cash account at the New York Fed in order to keep the government going with the debt ceiling being in effect this entire year.

00:34:40.160 And so as soon as that debt ceiling is lifted, we're immediately going to borrow additional money.

00:34:45.440 The debt's immediately going to go up so that we can replenish that missing cash from the Treasury's account.

00:34:51.400 So that essentially wipes out, again, $500 billion out of the $4 trillion.

00:34:57.260 That's an eighth of it right there.

00:34:58.920 And then you're going to have that $2 trillion deficit overall.

00:35:03.160 You're going to have another $2 trillion, like you mentioned.

00:35:05.660 And so this isn't even enough to get us through the president's current term.

00:35:10.560 And that doesn't speak to the fact that we need to raise the debt ceiling even further.

00:35:15.060 It speaks to the fact that we need to cut spending much more.

00:35:18.020 I mean, the spending cuts in this latest bill, they're basically microscopic.

00:35:23.340 I'm sorry, but there's just no other way to put it.

00:35:25.820 We need to cut much, much more spending.

00:35:29.060 In terms of the question that I think you were getting to, what is the coalition here that's going to be willing to pass this?

00:35:39.180 Steve, I'm not sure there is one, especially once you consider how many Republicans we have from blue states like New York.

00:35:47.480 I know you were just saying New York's going to go red, and I'm not saying it won't eventually.

00:35:51.720 But right now, you have a lot of Republicans, even if it's a red district, it's a blue state, it's a high-tax state, and they want that SALT deduction big time.

00:36:02.060 They want it so bad.

00:36:03.680 And the problem is with the current version is they're not interested in having a SALT deduction for low- and middle-income Americans.

00:36:12.020 They want a SALT deduction for very high-income earners, which is not what the current bill has.

00:36:17.140 The current bill has essentially a phase-out, so it doesn't help the millionaires and billionaires at all.

00:36:22.180 That's not what these Republicans want.

00:36:24.080 They want a big SALT deduction that makes money for the millionaires and billionaires because that's their donor base. 0.97

00:36:30.180 That's the donor class.

00:36:31.220 And that's who those Republicans are interested, apparently, in helping, not the average American.

00:36:35.380 You've been – and you know Scott Besson well.

00:36:40.760 You know him before as Secretary of Treasurer.

00:36:42.360 You know him well now, the team around him.

00:36:44.380 Scott has warned that this is the last chance for a supply-side tax cut.

00:36:48.760 One of my concerns – and I've got tons of concerns about ways and means, including the fact that they're not doing a snapback right now on the wealthy,

00:36:55.400 which I'd say is going to have to happen at some point because the math just doesn't work.

00:36:59.980 But on the supply-side part of it, I'm really concerned that none of those supply-side cuts are really permanent.

00:37:06.820 Am I missing that, or is it the stuff that we actually have in there that could help business and help us productivity, create jobs, make capital available?

00:37:15.720 They're also temporary, so when Trump leaves, they leave, sir.

00:37:20.880 Steve, that's exactly right.

00:37:22.160 Like the most pro-growth part of this bill, things like the expensing for business where you get that tax deduction, that tax write-off,

00:37:30.600 those things, again, the most pro-growth supply-side parts of this bill are the ones that are temporary.

00:37:36.580 They're not permanent.

00:37:37.900 I mean, it's just absolute nonsense, and that happened, again, because they couldn't agree on enough spending cuts to, quote-unquote, pay for this.

00:37:45.520 Now, going back to your point on the rich paying more, look, I join you in that.

00:37:50.520 I wish we could see more money coming in from the highest income earners in terms of those tax receipts.

00:37:58.880 I just think that the way to do it is going to be not increasing marginal tax rates but getting rid of all these deductions.

00:38:05.740 And for crying out loud, start with things like SALT, things which are not at all supply-side tax reductions.

00:38:13.440 Instead, these are things that essentially function as loopholes for high-income earners.

00:38:19.740 In the case of SALT, it's a loophole for people in high-tax states.

00:38:24.680 It's not an exaggeration that very high-income earners in places like Manhattan saw their income tax liability go up by several million dollars,

00:38:32.880 by two or three million dollars, because of the cap on the state and local tax deduction.

00:38:38.480 I want to see more of that.

00:38:39.780 I want us to get rid of essentially all the exemptions, all the deductions in the code.

00:38:47.380 Talk to me real quickly.

00:38:48.700 You keep saying don't focus on the marginal tax rates for the upper bracket.

00:38:51.940 Focus on the deductions.

00:38:53.020 What other deductions would you get rid of?

00:38:56.420 Steve, literally everything.

00:38:58.240 I would get rid of all the deductions, all the exemptions.

00:39:01.740 I'm not exaggerating there.

00:39:03.200 Even things that a lot of people really love, like the deduction of mortgage interest.

00:39:08.640 I would get rid of everything and just reduce all of the tax rates.

00:39:12.760 The problem with any kinds of deductions, Steve, in the code is the fact that once you get beyond about a 25% top marginal tax rate,

00:39:22.180 then the wealthy just start using all of these to get their effective paid tax rate back down to, again, about 25%.

00:39:31.700 And we've seen this pretty consistently for the last 100 years, the entire history of the income tax.

00:39:38.620 So what you end up doing is you benefit the accountants, you benefit the lawyers, and you benefit, to a certain extent, the wealthy at the expense of everyone else

00:39:48.940 because everyone else now has to shoulder the tax burden of that lost tax revenue.

00:39:54.300 I want to get rid of all of that.

00:39:55.940 Just go to a low rate with a broad base.

00:40:01.500 You mentioned we've got other issues, too.

00:40:04.640 Talk to me about student debt.

00:40:06.060 I just heard we got a bombshell about the student debt.

00:40:09.500 Yeah, and Steve, this was actually something that we talked about last year on your show,

00:40:14.040 the fact that the Biden administration, not only did they get shot down by the Supreme Court over and over again

00:40:20.800 for their unconstitutional attempts to bail out student loan borrowers,

00:40:25.820 but then the court eventually told them, look, you have to get people repaying again.

00:40:31.060 You can't just keep going with these pauses where you're not forgiving loans,

00:40:36.580 but you're also not requiring them to be repaid.

00:40:38.660 Essentially, it's an effective forgiveness if you just do that indefinitely.

00:40:44.060 So the Biden administration said, OK, fine, we'll have people start repaying their loans.

00:40:48.600 But if they don't repay them, wink, wink, then we're not going to report those delinquent accounts to credit bureaus.

00:40:55.100 And that's what happened.

00:40:56.680 So for the last year of the Biden administration, we had no idea how bad the student loan situation was.

00:41:03.200 In other words, how many millions of people had fallen behind?

00:41:06.420 Well, now we have a Department of Education who is actually willing to report these numbers honestly.

00:41:12.260 And what we found is that it's not a fraction of one percent of student loans that are seriously delinquent.

00:41:18.300 In other words, more than three months behind on payments.

00:41:21.040 But in fact, the actual number is almost eight percent.

00:41:24.860 It's over a thousand percent higher than we were told it was.

00:41:28.700 It's just yet another example of how the Biden administration misled the American people on the economic situation

00:41:35.840 and tried to gaslight everybody to make us think that the situation was so much better than it was,

00:41:41.620 when in fact it was pretty darn terrible.

00:41:44.860 Hold it. You're saying that eight percent of the total face amount of the student loans are kind of in arrears?

00:41:52.060 It's exactly right, Steve.

00:41:53.520 And again, the really insane thing here is that this has been the situation for well over a year now,

00:42:00.560 but the data was purposely hidden from credit bureaus.

00:42:04.800 So we had no idea what the exact situation was.

00:42:08.600 And furthermore, you have you have literally millions.

00:42:11.320 That's not an exaggeration.

00:42:12.420 Millions of people now whose credit ratings have taken a triple digit hit just this year.

00:42:18.860 And they're going to have now a very tough time getting other kinds of credit extended to them.

00:42:23.380 Whether it's a mortgage, you know, another student loan, an auto loan, credit cards, you name it.

00:42:29.660 So you now have a ton of people whose credit rating has really gotten hammered because they were essentially told by the Biden administration,

00:42:37.340 look, you effectively don't have to pay because there's not going to be any consequences.

00:42:41.420 Well, guess what?

00:42:42.060 The adults are back in charge and now there are consequences again.

00:42:46.520 E.J., can you hang just for a short commercial break?

00:42:48.620 I just got to ask you about the future of the big, beautiful bills that winds itself through on the economic side.

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00:43:26.620 Short commercial break.

00:43:27.880 Return to the war room in just a moment.

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00:44:59.980 Here's your host, Stephen K. Bannon.

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00:45:54.820 If you don't think we're going to go through some turbulence, just listen up to E.J. and Tony, because right now this thing's a dogfight.

00:46:01.680 So E.J., given your assessment, which kind of dovetails with Ron Johnson and other people, and these are some of the biggest supporters.

00:46:08.460 You're one of the biggest supporters of President Trump.

00:46:12.060 Just where do you think this thing stands in the head?

00:46:13.980 Let's leave the Senate out for a second.

00:46:15.420 It was just in the House, this process of going through these committees, trying to pull this together, the tax cut.

00:46:21.800 Have you seen an overall model from anybody that's presented that shows you what this looks like in fiscal 26 and beyond, sir?

00:46:30.220 Not really in depth, Steve.

00:46:31.880 The reason for that is because we just don't have enough of the details yet.

00:46:35.820 So, look, let's take a high-level view of it then.

00:46:40.280 Let's do the 30,000-foot.

00:46:41.800 But as the senator was saying, this does not solve the problem, right?

00:46:46.820 We are still headed in the wrong direction.

00:46:49.580 Now, if our only two choices are between what we currently have and doing absolutely nothing, then what we currently have on the table, at least, would be the better option.

00:46:59.600 Because if we do nothing, then you will see some of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act provisions expire.

00:47:05.920 You will see a demonstrable tax hike on the American middle class.

00:47:10.500 So that will definitely be worse.

00:47:13.780 Again, I wish we could get a lot more.

00:47:16.200 Hopefully, in the future, we can.

00:47:17.800 Hopefully, with future bills, we will be able to claw back more of that spending, and we will get more Republicans with a spine in Congress.

00:47:25.120 But as of right now, if this is the best we can get, it is at least better than doing nothing.

00:47:30.620 But, look, that means that the president was not served well by the Republicans in Congress.

00:47:37.260 And if we want to continue supporting President Trump, I think that means you have to turn up the pressure even more on the Republicans in Congress.

00:47:44.760 In other words, if these folks weren't willing to actually put a good bill on the president's desk, if they weren't willing to work with the White House, then, frankly, they need to go.

00:47:54.980 And I don't know if that happens in the primary or in the general next year, but whatever the case, we have to, I think, hold these Republicans accountable if they're not willing to support the president and his agenda, which he was overwhelmingly elected to pursue.

00:48:14.760 Do you agree – the 10-year bond, I think, is 4.5.

00:48:17.800 I think it ended there today.

00:48:19.880 I haven't looked at – it started the show, but it was – I keep saying the bond market is going to get a vote here.

00:48:25.220 Clearly, they are – this is not because of President Trump's tariff policy or trade, which the mainstream media – this is about their understanding this bill, and they see the spending, and they see the inability to raise taxes or cut deductions on the wealthy, so you're not going to have additional revenue generation.

00:48:41.400 Are you concerned that the further we go down here, that even the decisions of President Trump and his ability to enforce and implement his program may be taken away from us as the bond market starts to respond here?

00:48:56.640 Well, absolutely, Steve.

00:49:00.240 Look, the bond market is not something you want to go toe-to-toe with because as big as the federal government is, even as big as the Treasury is, the bond market ultimately gets the last say.

00:49:11.700 We do not want to get into a position where literally nobody is willing to hold U.S. Treasuries, and then the Fed just has to print every dime that the government spends.

00:49:20.940 I mean, that's Weimar Republic territory.

00:49:23.660 That's how you get to hyperinflation scenarios.

00:49:25.840 But that is what is eventually going to happen, to your point, if we don't start heeding the warnings that the bond market is giving us.

00:49:33.920 Look, as much as there's been a ton of drama and a ton of market turmoil, and there has been regarding the president's tariff policies, I understand all that.

00:49:42.700 But guess what?

00:49:43.520 Virtually everything now, after conducting pauses on essentially every country, we're basically right back to where we were before August 2nd.

00:49:52.440 Equities are nearly back.

00:49:53.800 The bond market is nearly back.

00:49:56.320 So the difference that we're seeing right now, and it does track, again, to your point, it tracks very closely with the progress of discussions on the Hill and how the bill has been evolving.

00:50:05.960 The bond market is right now signaling they are not happy with the insufficient level of spending cuts in this bill.

00:50:14.180 And if it goes through and if we do nothing in the future to fix it, the bond market is going to continue to voice that concern, and it's going to get louder and louder over time.

00:50:24.040 And as talented as Scott Besson is, eventually there's going to be nothing he can do about the problem because nobody wants to buy what he's selling.

00:50:32.300 And it's not because we have a bad salesman who's trying to auction this stuff off.

00:50:37.180 It's because the quality of the debt is just going to go down.

00:50:41.460 Wow.

00:50:42.420 E.J., where do people go on social media to get you?

00:50:45.400 Best place to find me is on Twitter.

00:50:47.180 The handle there is at real E.J.

00:50:49.300 And Tony.

00:50:51.260 Thank you, sir.

00:50:52.080 Appreciate you.

00:50:53.460 Thank you, Steve.

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Bannon's War Room - May 14, 2025

Episode 4486： Mass Momentum Behind Habeas Corpus

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