Episode 5020： WarRoom Christmas Eve Special 2025
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Summary
In this Christmas Eve special, we are joined by the Denver crew, our team in Bethlehem, and our team at the Vatican. We talk about the early church, the decline of the church, and the end of the world as we know it. We also hear from Jason Jones in Bethlehem and Ben Harnwell in St. Peter's Square.
Transcript
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Come, O coming, Emmanuel, and ransom captive Israel,
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until the Son of God appear, rejoice! Rejoice! Emmanuel shall come to thee,
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for he is my land. O come, Lord, Israel, come, and cheer us in it by thy hand,
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and destruction was put to Christ. Rejoice! Rejoice!
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Emmanuel shall come to thee, O Israel. O come, thou King of David, come,
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and open wide our heavenly home. Make safe the way that leads on high,
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and close the path to misery. Rejoice! Rejoice!
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It's Wednesday, 24 December, in the year of our Lord, 2025. It's Christmas Eve,
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and this is our Christmas Eve special. We are live, both in Bethlehem and at the Vatican,
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throughout the morning. And we want to thank our Denver crew. Great open, their guys and our team
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here at the War Room, Real America's Voice Denver operation. Our guys, fantastic. Also,
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we've got Jason Jones and his team in Bethlehem. We'll be going there momentarily. We have Ben Harnwell.
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In Clement Weather at St. Peter's Square, we're going to Ben also. I think that Saban Howard and Tracy Slayton
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are actually also in Rome. If we can't get them today with an interview, the great sculptor,
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Saban Howard, is there. If we can't get him today, we're going to get him over the next couple of days
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on the holiday weekend. Dave Bratt is with me, though. Dave, it's Christmas Eve. We're trying to set
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politics aside. We're still going to be talking about the news, trying to set politics aside,
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although there is breaking news last night out of Georgia, where the judge down there has ordered
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the start of these ballots that were, I guess, illegitimately not counted. We'll get to the
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bottom of all of it over the next couple of days, but big breaking news out of Georgia. Also,
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the Supreme Court not allowing President Trump to federalize the National Guard and send him into
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Chicago, although President Trump ordered late last night the National Guard federalized into
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New Orleans. Dave Bratt, it is Christmas Eve. You're our resident theologian. Bratt, you got a PhD
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in theology from Princeton Seminary? Yeah, I met a master's in divinity. Three years, I was going to
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be an academic and teach systematic theology, and people say, why didn't you do that? And I said, I did.
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I said, I want to explain God's work in the economy. So when I went on to study systematic
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economics, which is very much linked to the Western tradition, it all happened at the same time,
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right? The opening of James Madison and Adam Smith, it's all 1776. And that's just the epitome
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of Western civilization all coming together right there. The last century was a century of evil's climb
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in the United States and around the world. Mass slaughter in wars in the 100 million category.
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And that comes with the decline of the church. I feel there is an ascendancy now going on. The
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young people are returning to the truth. To have St. Peter's in the background on the war room
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says about all you need to see, right? Thank God.
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Yeah, so really, it's just serendipity that Jason Jones is really taking the entire Christmas and
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New Year's period to be in Israel and actually was going to be in Bethlehem. And it's always,
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as you know, there's not as many pilgrims, since they've had a pretty brutal conflict there for the
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last couple of years. There's not as many pilgrims, Dave, as normal. You know, it also shows you,
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the reason we want to juxtapose, it shows you the difference which a lot of people are spending
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focus now on the early Christianity, right? The primitive church of those first years or first
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century, where, you know, the Bethlehem kind of represents in Jerusalem. I think Jerusalem is only
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nine miles away, that it shows you the, from the Jewish Christianity, which was really the first,
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what the apostolic age was, the first three, five, seven, eight years, to the Church of the Gentiles,
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which was Rome and was always St. Paul's goal, and then later St. Peter's, to take the word of
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the risen Christ to the Gentiles, sir. Yeah, no, absolutely. We've got one of
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the world's superstars at Liberty University, a friend of mine. He's up in age beyond me and
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probably you, and just unbelievable guy, Gary Habermas, who's writing a four-volume tome right
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now on proof of the resurrection, and it's proof. He's got the unreligious saying, yes,
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there's more proof of the resurrection of Christ than there is against it, historically speaking,
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given the historical documents, and he's also done massive research. You can go Google him
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on the early church creeds, and the earlier, the stronger they were, and the shorter, the stronger
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they were, you know, they're the kind of the fragments that led even to the writing of the
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Gospels, but just simple formulations in early, go Google early creeds, C-R-E-E-D-S, right? Christ is
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Lord, right? And these simple little things, they're not so simple, and very early on, 40 AD, they're
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circulating all around. That leads to the writing of the canon, and then to the early creeds, where the
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Catholics were absolutely central with the Nicene Creed and Nicaea, and, you know, folks, go take a
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peek around the map, right? All these great councils were right around Israel, Greece, Ephesus, Thessalonica,
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all these books of the Bible. If you don't know that stuff, it's a fascinating, go Google St. Paul's
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tours. It's a great way to really see the link between the truth of God incarnate in Jesus coming
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to earth to save us from our sin. If you got another way to get out of sin, please let me know. I haven't
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heard of anything, but it juxtaposes that in history. You know, it was like at AmFest, it's one of the
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reasons I gave the speech. I said, look, there's all this, you know, to-ing and fro-ing, and who's
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going to be in it, who's going to be out, and people fighting, and, you know, saying things about each
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other, and I said, man, that's not, this is nothing. This is junior high school compared to the early
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church. If you look at these councils, they were, it was intense. It was very intense. I mean, one of the
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biggest, you know, fights they had was right after Christ was crucified, and then rose from the dead
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was this whole thing about, do you have to be Jewish first? Do you have to embrace the old covenant
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to be part of the new covenant? And remember, up until 36, I think it was, three or four years
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till the church in Jerusalem came together for that conference, you had to be Jewish to then convert
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to Christianity. It was only, I think, in three years afterwards, and they had this conference,
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and one of the reasons was is that, you know, James was in charge of the church in Jerusalem,
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and it just wasn't getting traction. They weren't converting a ton of people to Christianity. That's
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why St. Paul, you know, Paul of Tarsus, when he came on and really took the church to the Gentiles
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and became kind of the leaders of the church of the Gentiles, whether it was in Turkey, whether it's in
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other parts of the Middle East, but particularly Rome, I mean, they, it was very evident he wanted
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to go play the big rooms. He wanted to take this to the, where the empire, the center of the empire,
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right? Obviously, Rome at that time, not just the most important city on earth, but if you look back
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in history, one of the most important cities in the history of the world, and still carries a lot
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of that power today, Dave Bratt. Yeah, no, absolutely. I've referred people to
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Alistair McIntyre, M-A-C-I-N-T-Y-R-E, Alistair McIntyre. I think he had a upbringing on the Marxist
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left, and then he converted over to Aristotle, but he's written a book called The Brief History of
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Ethics, which is much more than A Brief History of Ethics, but the juxtaposition of Rome, right,
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with the crucifixions, the barbarity, the Roman legions, they could do to you at any time what
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they wanted to, mega, mega empire, right? And into the middle of that empire comes a man named Jesus
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who offers these people who are beaten down love from God the Father. God, your Father loves you.
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I'm here to testify to that. John the Baptist preceded me, and Jesus said the key is love God
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the Father, right? Don't forget that part, right? This modern love stuff with, you know, emotion and
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all these adjectives, you know, that are modernist that began 100 years ago. Love God, right? And that's
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the first commandment also in the Hebrew text. And then love your neighbor as yourself. And out of
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that, Constantine, the Roman Empire's Christian by about 325, and Constantine says in this sign of
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the Christian flag, we conquer. But you see, when we conquer, and the U.S. is the epitome of this,
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is the highest of the heights, we offer rights to, minority rights to all. We have rights to freedom
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of speech, freedom of expression, freedom of religion, freedom of gathering. And the rest of
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the world does not know that because it's rooted in Christianity, right? There's a few countries that
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follow all the United Nations charter with respect to human rights, but that's our gift to the world.
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Now, unfortunately, others and other religions who do not believe that love is the central command,
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nor do they believe that there's a loving father in heaven in several traditions out there.
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They don't have a human rights tradition at all. And speaking of Islam, most concretely,
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Allah is so transcendent that there is not this fatherly love for you. And they do not have a
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human rights record. They had very smart people back at about 1300, right? Avros, Avincenna,
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with Maimonides in the Jewish side, with Aquinas. You're having great debates. But since then,
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it's the West that developed Oxford and Cambridge and Harvard and all the great Christian universities.
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And where are the Islamic scholars and thinkers in universities? That's a sign.
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Dave, hang on. I know you got to bounce, but I do want to hold you for another segment.
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We're going to go live as soon as we get set up. I believe we were a little delayed in Bethlehem
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because of the Muslim call to prayer. I'm not making this up. The Muslim call to prayer.
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Jason Jones. Jason Jones is in the heart of Bethlehem, right next to Manger Square.
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We've got Ben Harnwell is getting set up in inclement weather at St. Peter's Square. Dave Bratts with us.
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We're going to talk about Christmas Eve in the place where it all started in Bethlehem,
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in Israel, and at the Vatican today. And we're going to hopefully saturate this show with some of the
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incredible music of the Christmas season. Short commercial break. You're in the war rooms.
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It's our Christmas Eve special. We'll be back in a moment.
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The holly bears are prickle as sharp as any thorn. And merry, poor, sweet Jesus Christ on Christmas
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And merry, poor, sweet Jesus Christ on Christmas day in the morn.
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O the rising of the sun and the running of the deer, the playing of the merry organ, sweet singing in the choir.
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The holly bears are as big as any thorn. And merry, poor, sweet Jesus Christ on Christmas day in the morn.
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It is Jesus the thought of the village. Christ is born and there is all in love.
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Ah, beautiful is the mother. Ah, ah, beautiful is the child.
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It is long when the baby is sleeping. It is long to speak so loud.
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Lest you awaken little Jesus. Ah, ah, beautiful is the mother.
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Skies are glowing, the heavens are cloudless bright.
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Peace and come who will see little Jesus shining bright as yonder star.
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Ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah.
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Ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah.
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Ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah ah.
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Ah, ah ah, ah ah ah. ah, ah ah ah ah, ah ah ah. Ah ah ah ah, ah ah. ah ah ah ah ah ah ah. ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah ah
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on the war room uh dave brett is riding shotgun with me for a while um i want to go to uh live
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to bethlehem jason jones you know jason from all these years jason you've really been in some of
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the toughest places whether it was in iraq with the kurds you you have dedicated a huge part of
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your life in fact i think now all of it i've known you you were a close friend of andrew breitbart's
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but you've dedicated your life to really protecting christians whether it's in sub-saharan africa or
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the desert church which has been essentially been eviscerated uh you've been in some of the toughest
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uh the toughest spots ever and you've been covering this this kind of war for many many years give me
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give me your perspective where are we uh today what what is the shot you've got explain a little
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bit about bethlehem because i'm sure many of most of our audience has never had an opportunity to be
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there and probably know very little about the geography or actually what is historical bethlehem
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like how close is it to jerusalem uh where does it sit on the map sir
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just i get i'm looking at you right now on the screen and just yeah first of all mary green and
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just share um bethlehem is walking distance to jerusalem and it's quite a privilege to be
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right over my shoulder if you look over to the left you see the church of the nativity you can
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actually see the door into the church and you can also see the christmas tree here in bethlehem
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and you mentioned that i've i've served the persecuted church around the world
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and it is quite a tragedy that these first century christian communities
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have been facing ethnic cleansing and genocide whether it's the christians in iraq syria just
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yesterday in india christian community that was brought the gospel was brought there by
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the apostle thomas saint thomas the doubting apostle suffering brutal attacks we see in egypt
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first century church first century christian communities facing existential peril so it is
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a privilege for me to be here at the birthplace of our lord and savior jesus christ to my right
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is the very road that the blessed virgin mary and saint joseph walked along looking for a room at the
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what what is um i don't where is explain the audience bethlehem in the occupied territories
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part of israel because correct me if i'm wrong we were trying to get this shot up earlier
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uh to test and we really didn't have opportunity to test because
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the muslim call to prayer is the muslim call to prayer go all over is it broadcast all over bethlehem
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yeah well there's a mosque right to my right so if you can see over my right shoulder there's a mosque
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what's interesting we're in the west bank which is under the palestinian authority
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and the um the christians and the muslims here in bethlehem the bethlemites
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as they call themselves have been here together for centuries in fact both the christian and the
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muslim communities descend from the people that were here at the time of jesus we know in the book
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of acts it says they they were jews they spoke arab arabic there were arabs there were medes there
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were greeks there were egyptians in the upper room at pentecost and so when you think of palestinians
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whether they're muslim or christians and then even the misrahi jews the arab jews they've been here
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together since the time of christ and as we are as human beings in a way they're really one genetic
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the the the is islam though didn't come to this area to what 600 700 a.d i mean at the time of christ
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it was it was essentially jews or arabs that believed it believed one of these you know mithras
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or one of these other pagan cults and then a small group of christians correct
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yeah correct this was christian and of course we also had the arian heresy and then arianism swept
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across um north africa in the middle east and in many ways i see islam as a continuation
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of the arian heresy um and so many of those palestinian christians became muslim
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but they see themselves as one community one family that i was on you know out today for the
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parade as scouts came from all over the west bank and cardinal pizzabala came and gave a very powerful
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speech but there were christians and muslims and i interviewed uh dozens of people and they all said
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that their favorite day of the year here in bethlehem is christmas and muslims of course is it is
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i mean jesus is a prophet yeah right let me is the um what do we have is are pilgrims starting to
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return at all are tourists starting to turn at all i know for obviously after october 7th everything
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was shut down for a couple of years is there any beginning of even allowing people in whether they
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have the courage enough to go or they're they feel that there's enough safety but where do we stand
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with because i remember years ago you would do these you know broadcast tv or bbc would pick it
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up at midnight mass and it it was pretty packed manger square was was packed and pretty robust
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international crowd tell the audience what's happening now are there pilgrims pilgrims starting
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to come back are there tourists starting to come back they're trickling in most of the pilgrims
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were migrant workers whether indians or filipinos that work in israel uh but still it's a trickle i
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maybe saw a handful of americans or maybe uh 20 or 30 americans here that i've seen and so it's quite
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sorrowful but it is extremely safe i was here last christmas and i was the only person who was not from
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bethlehem in bethlehem and it was quite sorrowful to be um the very place of the nativity the very place
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where christ was born and i was able to pray for hours alone and it was safe but but people had
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fear but there's no fear come to bethlehem come to the west bay it's it's it's beautiful it's safe
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i i feel too at home i'm a little embarrassed at how home i feel here but uh i'm really committed to
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coming as many christmases as i can and i have two of my sons here now i'm bringing my entire family
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here for easter and they need they're longing for pilgrims their economy desperately needs
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pilgrims to return i interviewed the mayor yesterday and today the the director of tourism
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and they're really eager to see the return of pilgrims to the whole land including bethlehem
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because that's that's basically their their income is almost i take it 100 or close to 100
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predicated upon tourists or things that they make they sell to tourists or sell internationally
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online but all all predicated on people on pilgrims coming and actually seeing these holy sites
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i mean definitely it's a big it's a huge part of their economy but it's also their cultural identity
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they're very proud of bethlehem they want to share it with the world they long for pilgrims to come
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to me it's quite a tragedy that the most important site for christians there's a billion of us
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that maybe less than a hundred had to the initiative or the courage to come here yeah this year
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um or maybe it's you know uh maybe i don't want to go there but yeah i just i don't understand
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please come here please come to the holy land come to bethlehem uh and you know when you come here
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i look at our faith steve i'm so grateful to be a christian i'm so grateful to be a catholic
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you know the romans believed that they descended from the trojans and they never wanted to see what
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happened the joy happened again they became obsessed with building roads their mission was to build
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roads the greeks socrates um gave us the concept of logos and then the jews were promised the savior of
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the world the messiah you had jews walking roman roads using greek language to share the world the
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truth about god but the second person of the trinity the logos became man right over my shoulder
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and it was the fullness of time in the perfect place it's right over my left shoulder and
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you really want to come here and experience this
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fantastic i tell you what jason hang on you're we have a bunch of guests that you've uh that you've
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helped book today we're going to go we're going to go between bethlehem and the vatican ben
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the weather in bethlehem looks uh looks terrific in rome not so much it's a very inclement but our
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intrepid uh indefatigable ben harnwell is setting up dave bratz riding shotgun with me
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we're going to have a combination of uh tremendous photography great interviews and of course
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christmas music uh we're going to uh take leave now for a short commercial break we're going to
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return dave bratz jason jones ben harnwell stephen k bannon christmas eve special on the war room
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waiting for ever ceasing never over us all to rain
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star of wonder star of night star with royal beauty bright