In this episode, Father Jason Jones, the head of the Church of the Nativity in Bethlehem, takes us through the history of the city of Bethlehem, from its pre-Christian past to its modern day incarnation as a city of pilgrims and tourists.
00:17:10.000Jason, here's, I think, what the audience would like to know is, since our guest is the priest that's head of the Church of the Nativity, can you walk us through what Bethlehem was like at the time of the birth of Christ, when a very pregnant Mary showed up with Joseph looking for a place to stay?
00:17:30.040And the evolution of it, as we see today, you've got a square with pilgrims and tourists coming to witness this tonight. You've also got a mosque in the Church of the Nativity, all of it. So just take your time and walk us through this.
00:17:43.940All right. Thank you, Steve. So, Father Isa, Steve would like to know, and the audience would like to know, what was it like when the Holy Family, when the Blessed Mother and Joseph walked down that little road and found no room at the inn?
00:18:00.460What was Bethlehem like then? And how did it evolve into what it is today with the pilgrims, the church, the mosque over my shoulder? So it's the history of the living stones of the church, right?
00:18:12.140Exactly. So when Mary and Joseph came from Nazareth to Bethlehem, it was an old house. Actually, it was barely places that you can see, like houses, small houses, and it's not actually, you can live in it. So they found no place as to give birth in it. So they found just in a place which is stable for animals. And that's why they went inside there. But it has a reason for that.
00:18:41.440So as to God born in a place with, like, to be as with the poverty people and to simplicity, to live with simplicity. And that's why the door of the church of nativity is called humble door. So when we bow inside, as to go inside for the place for the king of the kings was born in a place like in a stable of animals.
00:19:03.760So all the other religions, they were pharaohs and emperors.
00:19:12.080And here's the king of kings born in a stable.
00:19:14.680Exactly. And that's the meaning of that. It's just to live, as simplicity as it is, to live with love and peace. Because from nothing that we can be something.
00:19:25.660So it's in the Bible says, and you, Bethlehem, will not be small. So Bethlehem was a small town. And now we can see it, actually, all the eyes of all of the world looks in this small city of Bethlehem.
00:19:40.160And that's where Jesus was born, as to give this love and peace. And so if we can say, like now, it's the same Bethlehem. We can see all the houses. We can see the cave where Jesus was born.
00:19:56.080And we can see the simplicity people and hospitality people of Bethlehem, that they're still living, and continue the message of peace and love until now.
00:20:05.480You know, one of the things, Father, that I've noticed in my time working with the Palestinians, whether it's the church in Gaza or here in the West Bank, is there is this magnanimity. There's this charity, this forgiveness. And I've prayed about it. And what is the source of it?
00:20:19.480And I thought, as Catholics, our theology tells us that grace builds upon our nature. And it dawned on me that grace has been building upon the nature of this Christian community for 2,000 years.
00:20:30.540That's right. And that's why we still actually are the living stones. I call the Christian community in Bethlehem the living stones, not the church. The church may be 2,000 years and still exist.
00:20:41.100But the church doesn't mean anything with the faithful people, the Christians, who keep it alive, you know, with the prayers every day, to keep the services and liturgy, and helping get people coming from all over the world to visit this place, and also actually to give blessing and grace from it.
00:20:57.200You know, I was an atheist until my late 20s. And when I would hear Christians talk about the good news, the gospel, I thought that's an awful strange expression, good news.
00:21:05.880But when you look back, what good news is it that the Caesar is not God, the Pharaoh is not God, but I, I could be a humble peasant, I can be a slave, but I am made in the image of God.
00:21:19.840That's right, God, an image of God. That's why we are daily services in the church where Jesus was born, exactly in the spot, where the light shined all over the world.
00:21:30.960We just celebrate masses every day for Christians, like Orthodox, Catholics, and Armenian.
00:21:36.900And we continue to celebrate this, because in Bethlehem, it's almost like Christians and Muslims living together, and we are united in Bethlehem as one.
00:21:46.580Like when you see, like, last two weeks ago, when we lit the Christmas tree, all people together were Christians, Muslims from different backgrounds.
00:21:55.960They were celebrating Christmas and loving, as to see, like, the love, charity of people, the happiness of them.
00:22:04.300Like after two years, you know, no celebration, no festivities.
00:22:07.340It's just amazing to find this Bethlehem again, back again to life.
00:22:14.560Can I ask you about St. Joseph? You look at St. Joseph, it's kind of quiet, kind of hidden always.
00:22:20.080But I look to him as what a man should be. He had calloused hands. He was a callous.
00:22:24.100See, if you talk about muscular Christianity, I think of St. Joseph. He was muscular, but he had calloused hands.
00:22:30.020He was a carpenter. He was amiable. He was kind. He was gentle.
00:23:25.700This is what people actually usually do when you are in the right place and you're doing the best thing.
00:23:30.880So that's why we have, as Christians or as a young man, to have to look at St. Joseph, how he dealed with this issue and how he continued, because he knew he has a vision.
00:23:44.800What Father just said, I think, is kind of shocking to an American audience, because we've followed your work for years, and where we've seen throughout the world is where Islam has helped eradicate the church, the desert church in the Middle East.
00:24:00.920Why is it that there seems to be cooperation in Bethlehem, where throughout the rest of the world, there's not just not cooperation, there's actually conflict, whether it's in Western Europe or now in the United States, sir?
00:24:16.400Father, Steve's question was, it's surprising to a lot of American audiences to hear that Muslims and Christians, Bethlehemites, get aligned together.