Bannon's War Room - Episode 5242： America Is Closing In On A Fiscal Cliff

00:00:00.000 This is the primal scream of a dying regime.

00:00:07.000 Pray for our enemies.

00:00:09.000 Because we're going medieval on these people.

00:00:12.000 Here's one time I got a free shot at all these networks lying about the people.

00:00:17.000 The people have had a belly full of it.

00:00:19.000 I know you don't like hearing that.

00:00:20.000 I know you try to do everything in the world to stop that,

00:00:22.000 but you're not going to stop it.

00:00:23.000 It's going to happen.

00:00:24.000 And where do people like that go to share the big lie?

00:00:27.000 MAGA Media.

00:00:29.000 I wish in my soul, I wish that any of these people had a conscience.

00:00:34.600 Ask yourself, what is my task and what is my purpose?

00:00:38.360 If that answer is to save my country, this country will be saved.

00:00:44.560 War Room. Here's your host, Stephen K. Bannon.

00:00:53.280 Okay, Tuesday, 24 March, Year of Our Lord 2026.

00:00:55.860 thank you for the second sticking around for the second hour first hour we did uh oil markets

00:01:02.280 commodity markets and uh these negotiations president trump's trying to get rolling i want

00:01:06.740 to pivot now to something that i think just like artificial intelligence kind of the the big issues

00:01:12.100 that don't get taken head on uh neil irwin joins us from axios neil i remember coming first

00:01:18.260 acquainted with your writings back in the financial crisis of 2008 uh and things have only gotten worse

00:01:24.080 and the political class have really not ever addressed what the situation is with our fiscal

00:01:29.120 crisis as you talk about you talk about a fiscal cliff now Scott Besson when Scott came in and you

00:01:34.380 know he was a contributor here for years at the war I mean he used to talk about hey my plan is

00:01:40.280 you know I can't this whole debt and the debt spiraling control but if I can get the annual

00:01:44.620 deficit the three percent of GDP through cuts and revenue increases then somehow I think we've got

00:01:51.980 something manageable we can go forward as we look through the first year given a whole host of

00:01:56.640 reasons it looks like we're not going to hit that so what is your concern your article just walk

00:02:01.480 people through it why america appears to be you know with the pedal to the metal driving over the

00:02:08.340 fiscal cliff sir yeah so uh we're running deficits about six percent of gdp that's the largest we've

00:02:15.020 ever seen other than in major wars, financial crises, depressions, recessions. So what's

00:02:22.140 unprecedented is to be running 6% deficit of GDP in a time of not having those huge one-off

00:02:28.140 expenses. And Scott Besson's exactly right. If you got to 3% of deficit of GDP, that would be

00:02:33.200 a manageable target that would be sustainable given the growth path the U.S. is on. What's

00:02:38.100 not happening in Washington is any sense of urgency getting there. Look, if the tax law

00:02:42.680 from last year unleashes amazing growth, deregulation, all these great things, create the kind of rapid

00:02:46.980 growth that people in the administration want to see. That's fantastic. That would help solve

00:02:51.040 the problem. But what we're seeing so far is those numbers are not coming in that way. We're seeing

00:02:54.940 numbers more like 6%. And you see it on both sides of the aisle. You see Democrats wanting to kind of

00:02:59.280 cut taxes for their base. So there's not a lot of incentive and urgency around in Washington around

00:03:04.280 the idea that these deficits are unsustainable and Social Security is going to hit a point in the

00:03:08.560 early 2030s when its finances are strained.

00:03:12.680 that's what i think it was the um the wharton center they have this budget center and the guy

00:03:18.600 came out the other day and say hey look and everybody talks about 38 trillion and you know

00:03:22.660 100 days later 180 days later we're 39 trillion but he makes the calculation that our number is

00:03:28.240 really 100 trillion and that's what we have to be focused on do you believe that that and we just

00:03:33.720 had this article i'll get it up i'll put it up after the show of another take on things that

00:03:39.000 says, hey, America's insolvent. It kind of does our balance sheet, right? And it's maybe not

00:03:43.460 totally accurate because it looks like it's government accounting, maybe not gap accounting,

00:03:47.160 but there are a lot of smart people coming out right now and saying, hey, this time we mean it,

00:03:52.880 it looks like we could hit the wall. How would you break all that down?

00:03:56.840 Yeah. So think about entitlements, Social Security, Medicare. We know because you can

00:04:01.260 project these things out pretty accurately over long time horizons. By 2032, 2033, those trust

00:04:06.940 funds are empty, Congress has to do something. It either has to cut benefits. That's what happens

00:04:11.780 automatically if they don't do anything. Nobody really wants to see that. Or they have to find

00:04:15.260 some way to make those programs solvent and pay for them. And then you have Social Security and

00:04:19.160 Medicare in competition with the rest of the budget, the Defense Department, everything else

00:04:22.300 the government does. And so that's not that far away. That used to be this distant problem.

00:04:27.320 But, you know, the people being elected to the Senate this coming November are going to be

00:04:30.960 dealing with that problem at the end of their six-year term. So this is not some far-off problem.

00:04:35.160 This is a here and now kind of problem. And again, the discourse wouldn't reflect it.

00:04:39.480 You know, we're about to have a $200 billion Defense Department request for the Iran conflict.

00:04:44.380 This is a situation where you wouldn't guess that we're facing this real cliff, this real difficult situation from the way people talk about financial options in Washington.

00:04:55.660 You know, Scott had said before he became Secretary of Justice and then after he said, hey, look, this is our last chance for a supply side tax cut.

00:05:02.480 And whether you believe that theory is supply side or not, but the theory was, hey, we get a tax cut to bring jobs back, increase manufacturing.

00:05:08.980 We have to grow our way out of this.

00:05:10.800 We get growth of 5% or more.

00:05:13.220 I get the deficit down to 3%.

00:05:15.420 That's the way you start chipping away at this thing.

00:05:19.320 It's one of the reasons that you see the lack of urgency.

00:05:22.420 I mean, the bond market.

00:05:23.420 Now, the 10-year treasuries are, what, 4-4 or 4-3.

00:05:26.300 It's kind of popped since this war, particularly since it shifted to the Persian Gulf away from Tehran.

00:05:32.480 But is it the bond market? And is it because we're still the prime reserve currency and people just have to, hey, suck on this, no matter what the BRICS nations say or whatever the alternative, like you see right now, as soon as the guns start firing, they all come to the U.S. dollar?

00:05:45.920 Is the lack of urgency of the political class because the capital markets really haven't forced their hand here?

00:05:52.480 I think there is a lot of that. Look, we're still historically, as you say, 4% and change on the 10-year Treasury. That's not a crisis. That said, the debt service costs are going to be creeping up year by year. As we run these $2 trillion deficits every year, that increases the total stock of debt.

00:06:11.600 And so whatever rate the U.S. is paying, the government's paying, is coming out of everything else. So in the CBO forecast, 10 years from now, 2035, 4.6 percent of GDP, nearly 5 percent of GDP going to just pay interest on the debt.

00:06:23.940 That's going to squeeze everything else. Again, whatever you care about, whether it's on the defense side, whether it's on retirement benefits, things like that, will be squeezed by these interest costs if we keep rising total debt on the path we're on.

00:06:35.740 And that's assuming there's not a fiscal crisis. There's not a reset of rates significantly higher. That's assuming they stay in the kind of moderate range they've been in the last couple of years. And there are no guarantees that's the case if the bond market starts to freak out and say, you know, we're afraid there's going to be financial repression. We're afraid there's going to be inflation that the U.S. is going to try and inflate its way out of this crisis.

00:06:54.120 how do you what do you think it's going to take because we've had commissions you know every

00:07:00.240 last year when mccarthy got tossed for cutting the deal with biden people were talking we have

00:07:04.720 to have another commission come together we've had a series of commissions they've made reports

00:07:09.220 that have implemented might have helped to stave this off but they were just they were they were

00:07:14.500 never taken seriously they didn't become part of any political action plan of either party what do

00:07:20.180 you think it's going to take absent a fiscal crisis where then you have to go into crisis mode

00:07:25.660 to get uh to get not just both parties but any one party to take it seriously right now because

00:07:31.940 the democrats their spending thing is is out of control of course they want to they want to tax

00:07:36.600 uh the wealthy but their spending is really the problem that's what scott besson keeps saying but

00:07:42.100 on capitol hill we see this at every appropriations process the republicans just kind of tap this

00:07:47.700 along. And these commissions don't work because people have done it for years, done it for decades.

00:07:53.280 They come out with these good results and they're just put into the file. What do you think it's

00:07:58.060 going to take to get the political class to focus on something has to be done here?

00:08:03.660 Yeah. Do you remember Erskine Bowles and the Simpson Bowles commission in 2010? In the last

00:08:08.080 20 years, that's kind of the closest there was to a big deal on entitlements. But ultimately,

00:08:12.340 then as now, if there's not a crisis moment, if there's not a sense of urgency,

00:08:15.860 why would you make that unpopular vote? If you're a Democrat looking to, you know, having to cut

00:08:20.380 benefits, if you're a Republican looking to raise taxes, those are not votes you want to make

00:08:25.380 unless something forces your hand. And that's why I think, look, there are different forms of

00:08:28.900 crisis. Crisis doesn't have to be something like 2008, where it's a catastrophe. But, you know,

00:08:33.040 if rates rise, even a couple hundred basis points, if we get the 10-year Treasury up to 5%, 6%,

00:08:40.060 that might be the thing that forces attention. And if not that, look, once again, Social Security

00:08:44.580 Trust Fund is up in 2032, 2033. Something must be done in order to keep there being, you know,

00:08:51.140 if you don't do anything, there's a 25% cut to Social Security benefits. That would be catastrophic.

00:08:54.920 That would be bad for a lot of retirees. That would be unpopular in both parties. So that may

00:09:00.300 be the thing that forces a deal absent a kind of fiscal crisis of the types you see in emerging

00:09:05.380 markets. You see, right now, I think when the rates popped over 44344, mortgages went to seven,

00:09:14.580 I think you're saying, hey, if these go to five or six, not saying it is, but if it does mortgages

00:09:19.000 popped at nine or 10 percent, that's when the folks back home are going to say start burning

00:09:23.900 up the phone line saying something's got to be done here. That's when you may see some movement

00:09:27.340 on this. I do. I mean, we saw a little of this in the fall of this fall of 2024 when yields did

00:09:34.020 rise, the 30 year got to five percent, I believe. And and that really did actually know the tenure

00:09:39.640 got to five percent. The 30 was higher than that. You know, and you did see a focusing of attention.

00:09:44.060 You saw a lot of people saying, you know, maybe this is the thing that is the bond market telling us we need to reset the finances going forward.

00:09:53.260 You know, look, there are ways out of this that don't involve, you know, the AI revolution.

00:09:56.940 There's a productivity surge.

00:09:58.300 You could see things on the revenue side.

00:10:00.180 I mean, that's what you mean when you say a supply side burst that really helps solve this problem.

00:10:05.940 And it would be great to see some of that.

00:10:07.320 It would be great to see supply side improvements that really help the math.

00:10:12.100 But if you cut through it, this is what I say all the time, we're like a leveraged buyer.

00:10:17.800 We're a highly leveraged play on artificial intelligence right now.

00:10:21.620 I mean, is that not the business model of our country?

00:10:23.820 And even the executives in the country, they just had Dario on from Anthropic.

00:10:28.420 I'll play the clip later.

00:10:29.380 It says 50% of all entry-level, which we have said here, all entry-level white-collar managerial jobs, legal, all of that are going to be wiped out in the next couple of years.

00:10:38.780 Aren't we just right now a highly leveraged bet on artificial intelligence?

00:10:43.720 And if artificial intelligence doesn't come in with productivity, which means young generation wiped out with their jobs when they need them the most in their 20s when they're learning their craft or their profession, that's essentially the business model.

00:10:58.580 It's a dice roll of a highly leveraged company making a bet on a new technology that could turn their business model around.

00:11:06.200 Is that not where this country is right now?

00:11:08.780 Yeah, I think there's something to that. If you look at the GDP numbers, if you take out investment in software, investment in data centers, it's basically flatline. We're treading water. The growth we're having is coming from this AI investment surge. And look, that's good in terms of the GDP accounts. That's if you're a white collar worker, worry about losing your job, that's more worrying.

00:11:27.680 The question is, is this set of advances going to play out similarly to the invention of the personal computer, the electricity rollout, is the kind of thing that generates broad benefits and higher wages, higher incomes, or is the job loss so rapid it's more like the China shock, right?

00:11:42.940 It's more like you have a situation where lots of people lose their jobs, the reallocation process is slow, it doesn't happen rapidly, people are not able to recapture the income they once had, it hollows out certain communities, certain industries.

00:11:55.080 That's the fear, is that this is less the personal computer, less electricity, less the railroads, and more like the China shock in the early 2000s.

00:12:04.180 Last thing, as long as we can sell the bonds, I mean, Scott's got to refinance a third, I think, of the national debt every year.

00:12:10.720 as long as the dollar, even though it's had a massive drop in purchasing power during the

00:12:17.000 inflation of Biden years and then some, as long as people have to need dollars, as long as the

00:12:23.140 dollars are prime reserve currency, can we stagger through this? I think so. There's no reason to

00:12:28.880 think this is going to flip overnight. I mean, one thing I'm watching with this Iran situation is, 1.00

00:12:32.520 does this accelerate the pursuit of alternatives for other countries for trade in oil and other

00:12:38.160 commodities. If you're China and the U.S. is in a war with Iran, does that make you all the more

00:12:44.660 add urgency to trying to create alternatives to the dollar? And does that weaken the dollar's

00:12:48.920 role in the global economy? That's speculation at this point. The dollar is holding up reasonably

00:12:53.760 well on currency markets. It's actually up since the war. So that's not happening today,

00:12:57.800 but it's something around the corner that I think we're all watching for.

00:13:01.600 No, that's a flight to safety. And you're right, that alternative to the petrodollar,

00:13:05.460 or particularly the Chinese, these long-term contracts they did in their own currency

00:13:08.980 with people hedging the risk is key.

00:13:12.900 Neil, where do people get you over to Axios?

00:13:14.640 What's your social media?

00:13:15.480 You've been doing this for a long time and been pretty accurate in those years.

00:13:20.460 Eventually, people are going to listen to the warning.

00:13:23.160 Where do folks go?

00:13:24.920 Go to axios.com.

00:13:26.900 Axios Macro is a daily newsletter.

00:13:28.400 I write with Courtney Brown on global economic trends.

00:13:32.760 It's free every day at noon.

00:13:36.420 Thank you, sir. Appreciate you. Appreciate the reporting and the thinking.

00:13:41.740 I want to make sure everybody gets that. It's free at Axios. I want to make sure everybody

00:13:46.400 gets this article today about going over the fiscal cliff and everything's associated with it.

00:13:50.700 Also, I'm going to put up right after the show this Yahoo Finance article about insolvency.

00:13:56.900 Like I said, it's not totally correct because I'm kind of looking at the balance sheet.

00:13:59.740 I think unlike you would do it if you're using gap accounting. But the point they're trying to

00:14:05.140 make uh and the point that the wharton i'm trying to get the wharton guys on if you can't do it this

00:14:10.480 week at cpac next week to uh say there's maybe the 39 train is just what's the iceberg above the

00:14:18.840 water the part of the iceberg above the water if you don't want to be the titanic you've got to

00:14:23.880 understand the entire part of the iceberg particularly under the water as you know we've

00:14:29.800 tried to

00:14:30.880 use this to walk you through. That's what the

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00:16:22.820 Here's your host, Stephen K. Mann.

00:16:27.580 Okay.

00:16:29.740 The President Trump just reposted moments ago as we were talking on the fiscal situation.

00:16:36.920 Shabazz Sharif, a tweet.

00:16:39.200 Pakistan welcomes and fully supports ongoing efforts to pursue dialogue to end the war in the Middle East

00:16:44.360 in the interest of peace and stability in the region and beyond.

00:16:48.180 Subject to the concurrence by the United States and Iran,

00:16:51.300 Pakistan stands ready and honored to be the host to facilitate meaningful and conclusive talks for

00:16:57.460 a comprehensive settlement of the ongoing conflict and the president of the United States commander

00:17:02.240 in chief of the armed forces reposted that I think folks we ought to get that out to the war

00:17:07.000 and posse and just put that in your in your file about this war because like you said today and

00:17:12.500 that's why we open up with Kurt all these different alternatives just once again the um the president

00:17:18.100 is very close to field marshal i think it's mirin he was at the white house when i was back there in

00:17:23.440 june he was at the white house with the president spent a lot of time with him president uh he's the

00:17:28.320 chief of staff of the uh field marshal and chief of staff of the pakistani army armed forces and

00:17:32.800 president trump thinks very highly of him and i think that may be one of these paths that president

00:17:37.440 trump is pursuing michael kunzler uh the founder of all family pharmacy uh so we had war the rumor

00:17:43.340 war global oil markets which ain't looking great uh then the physical cliff oh that by the way we're

00:17:50.000 driving off of with the pedal to the floor you're my upside baby you're the you're the you're the

00:17:55.940 sunlit uplands and the reason is michael uh you know we monitor the feedback of the war and posse

00:18:02.440 and uh once they go to your site and learn a little bit but really talk to one of your customer

00:18:06.620 service reps the feedback's been tremendous so just walk us through the company what's the idea

00:18:12.180 behind it and why should people go today and start to get involved and talk to your customer

00:18:18.160 service reps, sir? Yeah, so All Family Pharmacy is a pharmacy here in Boca Tone, Florida based

00:18:24.800 on medical freedom, giving access to patients on medications that are essential to their needs,

00:18:31.080 whether it be a cosmetic medication or emergency medication or just a traditional maintenance

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00:18:46.260 return as well.

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00:18:52.920 And today we're going to have a 25% off coupon.

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00:18:57.080 We're actually going to extend this to the end of March due to all this war talk, energy

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00:19:05.160 We're going to try to bring a little bit of positive light to it.

00:19:07.440 If you want to stock up on essential medications because you're worried about this war in Iran, now is the time to do it, 25% off the entire order, whether it's ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, whether it's a thyroid drug, a maintenance medication, or maybe it's a weight loss drug, or NAD Plus or methylene blue, one of our anti-aging drugs.

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00:19:50.960 And you've got physicians and pharmacists that approve this to make sure people get the medicines and drugs that they need.

00:19:58.480 When I first met you and we were doing due diligence, you told me something that stuck with me.

00:20:02.060 It was very powerful.

00:20:02.640 I want you to explain it to the audience. You say, hey, look, Steve, as much as people, you know, bitch and moan about Big Pharma and all this, you don't have true medical freedom until you have the ability to deal with a pharmacy that you can actually talk to people about what you need.

00:20:16.420 that the farmer, the, the, the, you know, the McKessons of the world, the big, you know,

00:20:20.740 distribution companies, and then the individual pharmacies, all these big chains work against

00:20:25.340 your medical freedom. Explain that to me for a second. Cause I think as I talk to people

00:20:29.240 and we talk to you and talk about all family pharmacy during the week, it resonates with

00:20:34.160 people. What do you mean by that? Yeah. Uh, when you walk into your doctor's office,

00:20:38.480 when you walk into one of these chain pharmacies was the last time you had an in-depth conversation

00:20:42.800 with a medical professional that you're essentially paying for, right?

00:20:47.300 And so here at All Family Pharmacy, you have full access to what we have, pharmacists,

00:20:52.600 customer service, pharmacy technicians, as well as medical providers or physicians who

00:20:58.360 are licensed in every state here in the United States.

00:21:01.720 So we push medical freedom because we want you to come to us with questions, with concerns,

00:21:07.000 because we want to guide you in the direction that's going to have your medication safe

00:21:12.080 and effective. It's not going to hurt you. It's only going to help you. So having access to a

00:21:16.520 pharmacy that is willing to have a conversation, I don't know when the last time people have been

00:21:22.140 able to walk into a chain pharmacy and have a conversation outside of vaccines. You go to

00:21:26.780 Publix, you go to CVS, you go to Walgreens or Walmart, 90% of the conversations the pharmacist

00:21:31.800 is going to bring up is, have you been vaccinated recently? That should not be the topic of

00:21:35.800 conversation. The topic of conversation should be, how's your health? What's going on? What do you

00:21:40.140 need? How is this drug helping you? Are you seeing side effects? There are more questions

00:21:45.800 that need to be asked other than, do you need updated vaccines? It's kind of

00:21:50.000 furiating to see that when you walk into a pharmacy.

00:21:54.620 No, this is what the people that have made contact with you guys are so enthusiastic about. So where

00:21:59.540 do people go right now? If they want to do this, what's the phone number? What's the website?

00:22:03.140 and what do they do phone number is 561-717-6794 and the website is allfamilypharmacy.com

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00:22:57.600 appreciate you holly kessler okay so there is some good news there's good news all over number

00:23:03.980 one in virginia the grassroots in virginia are hammering i think it's 21 april this uh special

00:23:11.920 referendum we're going to have jeff rye hopefully on in the next couple of days the grassroots there

00:23:16.040 are hitting new poll out paxton up by eight in texas uh that follows i think polls maybe internal

00:23:23.900 17 18 but pax now there's a trend ken paxton's up uh folks are fighting all over the place

00:23:30.540 there's a lot of good news out there uh where people have been so grim about the midterms and

00:23:37.100 guess what the midterms are going to be brutal and going to be tough and going to be a fight

00:23:40.220 but in georgia holly kessler joins us holly you've been recommended by caroline jeffers and so many

00:23:45.860 people is like somebody's got their hand on the pulse in georgia we have a huge hearing on friday

00:23:51.040 on the evidence because the Abby Lowell's of the world and the MSNBC's in the Mark Elias has got

00:23:58.480 to get that evidence back. So we're going to be covering that. We're going to get all the experts

00:24:01.400 on that. But what is happening in Georgia? It seems like, are the Kemp guys not on board with

00:24:05.940 this? Because the situation down there is pretty dire, not just for the 2020 elections, but what

00:24:11.560 happens going forward, ma'am? It is. You're right. And we do have the evidentiary hearing coming up

00:24:18.080 on Friday in Fulton County. That's in regards to the FBI raid. We are in a very critical emergency

00:24:24.340 situation because we had passed a bill back in, gosh, what was it, 2022, 2023. It was

00:24:31.320 making the QR codes illegal. They're illegal. And that was part of Burt Jones in the Senate

00:24:37.420 that did that, Senate Bill 189. And so now we're coming up to July 1st of 2026, and we still don't

00:24:43.680 have a fix. And so, yeah, you talk about Kemp, Raffensperger, AG Carr. I mean, all of them.

00:24:50.080 It's the entire executive branch minus the lieutenant governor. He's the only one that's

00:24:54.260 actually been fighting for it, you know, and trying to help on the election front. But

00:24:58.620 we have a big problem here. And so now all they're wanting to do is continue to kick the can down the

00:25:03.960 road. And I don't know what it's going to take. It's very frustrating. You know, we had ES&S on

00:25:09.300 the ground uh the other day and they were you know giving their little demo and and of course

00:25:13.720 i'm sitting here thinking okay so we're getting rid of one and we're going to get another um

00:25:17.340 you know the the machines really they just they got to go president trump wants it you talk about

00:25:22.020 the grassroots we have a very active grassroots group here in georgia um we've been pushing it

00:25:26.700 we've shown them all the issues they've seen it complaint after complaint and again the secretary

00:25:31.420 of state just acts like everything is wonderful and chris cars all you know he's he's just silent

00:25:37.100 and, you know, missing in action half the time.

00:25:39.620 So he doesn't really do anything when it comes to election integrity,

00:25:42.920 but there are clear issues.

00:25:44.980 And one of the biggest concerns is Fulton County.

00:25:47.560 You know, we keep seeing what they're doing,

00:25:49.180 and they keep trying to hide information, cover up information,

00:25:52.920 delay giving the state election board information,

00:25:56.040 and they've had problems forever. 0.86

00:25:58.860 You know, so they're pretty consistent in the clown show that they have going on.

00:26:03.160 But, yeah, we have a problem, Mr. Steve,

00:26:05.660 And I don't know how we're getting out of this, but like you said, the midterms are coming up, and we've got to get this thing figured out quick.

00:26:15.340 Holly, the leftists sent a flare-out.

00:26:19.140 I'll get to what's going on with the TSA because this has been a resounding success with ICE there.

00:26:25.880 But they sent a flare-up.

00:26:27.020 They wouldn't send Norm down there, and they wouldn't send Abby Lowell, two of their biggest top guns.

00:26:35.660 to have this massive fight uh norm eisen and lowell have this massive fight over getting the

00:26:42.880 evidence back of the stolen 2020 election right and president trump's made this a priority you've

00:26:48.560 got tulsi gabbard's made a priority cash patel has made a priority we know that the grassroots

00:26:53.740 and the grassroots in georgia kind of dominate the situation and they're pure maga

00:26:58.340 what is the political class why are they holding back on this what what is it is is it because

00:27:05.260 elections have been running been won in the past and they're part of that uh that they not want

00:27:10.940 the scandal it's just shocking that you got burt jones and one or two others but it just seems to

00:27:16.720 be quiet when this is an issue it's on fire at the grassroots level ma'am it is and here's the deal

00:27:24.000 you know we we're pushing we're educating i get it some people don't want to touch it but when it

00:27:29.040 comes to those that are not willing to actually do something about it um and stand up and fight

00:27:34.740 for it there's only one thing that i can think of at this point because you know mr steve we've been

00:27:38.540 doing this for how many years and so it's the cover-up it's part of the cover-up i think um

00:27:43.720 you know when you really start looking at things and tying it all in together and looking at it

00:27:47.640 from a timeline perspective um it's very interesting to see and just like you said

00:27:51.940 they would not bring in the big dogs, you know,

00:27:54.760 to fight this fight if there wasn't more to it.

00:27:57.100 So, and those guys, they're, I mean, they're good. You know,

00:27:59.580 we've got good, good counsel on our side too, but you know, they're,

00:28:03.080 they're crafty and creative. Although I will say Garrett Ziegler did beat

00:28:06.980 Abby Lowell.

00:28:08.040 Hang on one second. I want to give the punchline on the other side.

00:28:14.680 Holly Kessler with us on this situation in the great state of Georgia.

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00:29:37.200 Here's your host, Stephen K. Bannon.

00:29:39.780 okay if you want to look at positive uh developments in politics it's grassroots

00:29:46.260 it's you this audience that are making things happen we got the sharia law prop 10 passed in

00:29:51.740 overwhelmingly in in texas and there's going to be so many more developments this week in cpac

00:29:56.460 big part of cpac is going to be talking about that what's going on in texas ken paxton's up i

00:30:00.800 don't know eight points in the latest poll 16 and 17 i think in other polls so the grassroots

00:30:05.820 making a difference there i cannot compliment enough the grassroots effort in virginia in the

00:30:11.060 commonwealth overwhelmed with money spent uh they've self-organized jeff ryan i think it's just

00:30:17.000 such a a great thing to see where they get a grassroots guy into the chairmanship of a

00:30:22.420 republican party and great things happen we're gonna spend more time on that and of course we're

00:30:26.800 hurtling towards this evidentiary hearing georgia i think is the key that picks the lock here you've

00:30:32.420 had john solomon on we know tulsi's on it uh this stinks to high heaven this 2020 election was stolen

00:30:38.220 there's no doubt about that holly we're going to have you back on i just once again want to give a

00:30:42.500 shout out to the patriots have been fighting this for six years now uh against threat of jail

00:30:47.940 bankruptcy all of it uh you guys are the best and the reason we even have a fighting chance here is

00:30:52.960 not the political class down in georgia that somehow something's fishy why they haven't stepped

00:30:59.200 in here while they're avoiding this. And I think when everything's revealed, there's going to be

00:31:04.620 a lot of accountability that's going to have to happen. Holly, your social media, where do people

00:31:08.720 go and get you, ma'am? So I'm on, uh, X Facebook sub stack. I've been whipping out some sub stacks

00:31:15.140 lately, but yeah, my X account probably is, is the easiest and the best, but it's all the same

00:31:19.420 Holly Kessler, same picture and everything. So yeah, I would appreciate the follow and I'll keep

00:31:24.040 everybody updated thank you ma'am appreciate you coming on here thank you okay uh the chinese

00:31:36.120 communist party their active participation in the media's cover-up of their torment of lao

00:31:40.980 baijing in china but also the united states ying chan chan joins us this morning and uh levy uh

00:31:48.700 brody um yank tell us first off what is your position how do you fit in this story because

00:31:55.120 the new york post it was the lead for a while yesterday kind of a shocking development of the

00:31:59.800 chinese communist party trying to shut down this classic kind of ballet opera dance that's gone

00:32:07.760 throughout the nation with seven or eight troops that talks about china before communism and the

00:32:13.220 CCP can't handle that. So they're taking active measures to torment you all and to shut it down.

00:32:18.940 Can you explain to us what's happening? Yes. Thank you, Steve. So my name is Ying Chen. I'm a

00:32:25.680 conductor and vice president with Shen Yun Performing Arts. And Shen Yun is actually an

00:32:30.580 American company created in New York in 2006. And our mission is to revive our authentic

00:32:37.380 traditional culture, which has been suppressed by the CCP for decades. We want to really show

00:32:44.780 the world the beauty and wisdom in this amazing culture. At the same time, our performances always

00:32:51.460 also present the human rights atrocities that are still ongoing in China. Shen Yun was actually

00:32:58.320 created at the time when many of our family members, myself included, and our friends in

00:33:03.700 the Falun Gong community were severely persecuted in China. And actually, that persecution is still

00:33:09.960 going on. So for the last 20 years, this year, Shen Yun is celebrating our 20th anniversary.

00:33:16.180 And we've grown tremendously from one troop to eight troops that are performing simultaneously

00:33:22.080 in the major continents everywhere, basically in the world, seen by over a million people every

00:33:29.420 year. But because of what we talk about in the show, we are not subject to the CCP's censorship.

00:33:38.640 We definitely talk about the issues in today's China as well. So we have been under attack for

00:33:44.440 the last 20 years. We have faced bomb threats for so long that we've almost gotten used to it,

00:33:51.260 which is not right. And this year, the last two years have been especially crazy. I think recently,

00:33:58.500 six states, heads of state, including Canada, Denmark, and Australia have received bomb threats

00:34:07.460 and basically saying, if you allow Shen Yun to perform, we'll blow up your residence and something

00:34:13.000 like that. And as a result, the Australian prime minister was forced to evacuate from his

00:34:19.040 his uh residence so but these things have been i i feel like the shen yun story is truly a

00:34:27.640 coincidental story of how beijing tried tries to dictate uh what stories are told here what

00:34:35.600 the narratives uh they're trying to impose their narratives on the american people

00:34:40.220 hang over one second because if you look at the histories have been written by a lot of fellow

00:34:48.480 travelers about everything came out of the chinese communist party you know china was just a backward 1.00

00:34:54.120 uh run by corrupt emperors for thousands of years uh the peasants were abused that the reason you 0.55

00:35:01.840 have this modern industrial middle class that's building every year is all because of the chinese 1.00

00:35:07.440 communist party you're you in shen yun which has this all this beautiful traditional dance and

00:35:12.800 music your your your tagline is china before communism what do you mean by that and how do

00:35:20.160 you counter them by saying when they say look everybody was starving it was oppressed the

00:35:25.340 emperors were the worst people on earth and we have been we essentially gave freedom our chance

00:35:30.520 for freedom to the chinese people to laobajing ma'am yeah because i think when the communist

00:35:36.600 Party wanted to impose communism on people, they had to do away systematically with all the real

00:35:43.480 culture of China, all the spiritual foundations. You're talking about Buddhism, Daoism, and

00:35:49.640 Confucianism. Those have been the pillars of Chinese civilization for thousands of years.

00:35:55.880 So in order for them to impose Marxism on people, they had to do away with all these.

00:36:00.600 Both of my parents were with the Central Philharmonic Orchestra in Beijing for 30-some

00:36:05.080 years. There were first-class musicians in China. However, we knew firsthand that everything is 1.00

00:36:13.560 censored and basically even all these performing arts companies in China were propaganda tools

00:36:19.400 for the CCP. So it was not until I came to this country and gradually realized, wait a minute,

00:36:27.720 this is not our true culture. I grew up in China and I had no appreciation of the Chinese 0.86

00:36:33.560 traditional values and culture when i you know when i was there until i came to this country and

00:36:39.420 learned the truth about our true history and the the spiritual foundation of all of that

00:36:45.580 so with shen yun we're trying to revive all of those amazing heritage and share it with the world

00:36:53.160 yeah that's why the ccp hates it i mean the cultural revolution was to destroy 1.00

00:37:00.560 any connection with the chinese people was that the the the five bad so there to any connection 0.98

00:37:06.740 to their traditional culture hangers levi there's a film coming out tonight you guys are going to be

00:37:12.280 part of the premiere you've got uh this story the new york post and it's by shadwick chadwick

00:37:18.360 moore who did the great biography of uh tucker carlson we had on the show a year or so ago the

00:37:24.240 story in the new york post it also implies that american media companies particularly some big

00:37:28.900 american media companies have not because we do this story a lot and we know it has huge traction

00:37:34.340 with the war and posse particularly as they have these strong feelings for lao baijing or kind of

00:37:39.740 the the the war and posse of mainland china uh but major media companies have actually gone out of

00:37:46.380 their way to suppress this story is is that true absolutely and this unfortunately this goes back

00:37:52.880 to the beginning of when falun gong was first persecuted you know falun gong the buddhist 0.70

00:37:56.240 based spiritual practice that you can mention one history that people forget is it widely popular in

00:38:01.660 china tens of millions of people were practicing it was ubiquitous around the country it was sort

00:38:05.980 of their renaissance in in many ways their spiritual and cultural renaissance and it wasn't

00:38:11.160 until 1999 that the the dictator at the time jen zemin ordered it eradicated and one of the really

00:38:16.920 sad chapters of the last 26 years aside from the atrocities rampant detention torture death by

00:38:22.560 torture and, of course, forced organ harvesting, one of the real tragedies has been American media

00:38:28.440 and Western media by and large have really dropped the ball or in some cases seem to behave in a way

00:38:34.660 that's complicit, taking Beijing's propaganda points and using that to frame the story,

00:38:39.200 ignoring the forced organ harvesting atrocity almost entirely. And so a lot of the problem

00:38:45.360 of the world not understanding what has happened to Falun Gong and why that's very important

00:38:50.180 for understanding the CCP really, I think, lies at the feet of Western media, unfortunately.

00:38:57.540 And the movie tonight, as you mentioned, is this very deep investigation. I mean,

00:39:02.200 it's both a human story looking at the artists of Shen Yun and how they go through going on tour,

00:39:08.160 facing bomb threats, facing Chinese spies that have been put in jail by our government because

00:39:13.360 they've tried to bribe U.S. officials to open up an investigation against them, how they've faced

00:39:18.100 all that on a human level but then also looking at the failures or the really performing worse

00:39:24.060 than failures on some of the major media including the new york times and this entire campaign that

00:39:30.320 now xi jinping it appears is is behind um trying to sabotage and destroy shen yun on the world stage 0.94

00:39:37.360 do you think the new york times went out of their way with their moscow correspondent back in the

00:39:42.940 1930s when in ukraine you had this massive things called the holodor five million people starved to

00:39:48.860 death and essentially what is kansas of europe um do you believe it's at that level the new york

00:39:54.100 times has gone either way and with certain reporters to actually suppress the reality

00:39:59.060 of the brutality of the dictatorship of the chinese communist party particularly against

00:40:03.340 falang gong but broadly against all of lao baijing sir i think it's approaching that i mean here's

00:40:10.440 one thing that's undeniable, and look, I'm not in the back rooms of the New York Times when I'm

00:40:13.760 making these decisions, but what is crystal clear is that they have achieved, wittingly or not,

00:40:19.340 the propaganda goals of Beijing. And I think if I were at the New York Times and my newspaper had

00:40:24.860 done that, I think there needs to be some real soul searching. How did we get here? How is that

00:40:30.060 now the end result that we're having on the American readership and the global readership?

00:40:34.960 But if you look more broadly at the Times coverage, this wasn't just a Shen Yun issue or in the last

00:40:39.440 few years, we did, my nonprofit did a huge study studying every single article from 1999 to the

00:40:45.820 present on the New York Times coverage of human rights issues, Falun Gong issues, and the results

00:40:51.580 are shocking. They're shocking in terms of how many times they frame things in terms of from

00:40:56.280 Beijing or standpoint on the victims, how they've just rewritten some basic facts of the Falun Gong

00:41:02.640 history, how they've completely swept under the rug, the forced organ harvesting atrocity in the 0.65

00:41:08.120 face of overwhelming evidence. And so there is a systemic failure at the New York Times and to

00:41:14.500 some extent, some other medias, but particularly the New York Times, when it comes to Falun Gong

00:41:18.500 specifically. And that is undeniable. That's crystal clear that that's happened.

00:41:25.360 Well, this goes back to the New York Times in the 1940s, when the United States of America handed

00:41:30.780 to the to these to this this small uh group the chinese communist party china when it didn't have

00:41:38.120 to happen i mean that's one of the great scandals of the 20th century um i want to have you guys

00:41:42.680 back on about the premiere tonight we'll get in a second but shen uh ying just before and i want

00:41:47.580 you guys to hold through the break everybody i've sent to shen yun comes out with kind of a glow

00:41:53.180 it's a beautiful evening the music is beautiful the dance is unparalleled people just have a great

00:41:59.460 feeling about it. Why is the Chinese Communist Party so obsessed with destroying what really

00:42:05.680 gives, I think, people a really good feeling about China overall and the Chinese people?

00:42:11.200 That's right. When people see this show, they're like, oh, I'm so proud of your culture. And it's

00:42:16.940 so amazing. And we are too. We just by sharing this with the world, it gives me so much joy

00:42:23.140 and inspiration to be part of this process. So it's unthinkable, you know, why somebody would

00:42:29.380 hate this show. But the pure fact that in the show that we are, we're not shy about telling

00:42:36.480 people that people of faith are still being persecuted in China, to the extent of taking

00:42:42.160 organs from live people and to make money from it. It's just unspeakable crime. So we do talk

00:42:49.440 about that. And of course, it's not, you know, we've been on the side of the CCP for all these

00:42:54.260 years as a result but we have you know continued undeterred and we really i think it only

00:43:01.940 strengthens our resolve to share these stories with the world's people and uh and they need to

00:43:08.220 see what the true nature of the ccp we just if i can interject we look at it is well hey leave i

00:43:14.580 leave i leave i hang on one second i'm just take a short commercial break i don't want to run you

00:43:18.500 guys up against the heart out we'll have you back here in a minute just stick around

00:43:22.140 The Chinese Communist Party 0.84

00:43:24.580 Evil always hates the good 0.78

00:43:28.060 And the Chinese Communist Party 0.83

00:43:29.960 Maybe the most evil of all 0.86

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00:45:10.020 Okay, if you want to look at positive developments in politics, it's grassroots.

00:45:19.220 it's you this audience that are making things happen we got the sharia law prop 10 passed in

00:45:24.580 uh overwhelmingly in in texas and there's going to be so many more developments this week in cpac

00:45:29.300 big part of cpac is when we talking about that what's going on in texas ken paxton's up i don't

00:45:33.700 know eight points in the latest poll 16 and 17 i think in other polls so the grassroots making

00:45:38.980 a difference there i cannot compliment enough the grassroots effort in virginia in the commonwealth

00:45:44.420 overwhelmed with money spent uh they've self-organized jeff ryan i think it's just such a

00:45:50.280 a great thing to see where they get a grassroots guy into the chairmanship of a republican party

00:45:55.940 and great things happen we're gonna spend more time on that and of course we're hurtling towards

00:46:00.640 this evidentiary hearing georgia i think is the key that picks the lock here you've had john

00:46:05.620 solomon on we know tulsi's on it uh this stinks to high heaven this 2020 election was stolen

00:46:11.060 there's no doubt about that holly we're going to have you back on i just once again want to give a

00:46:15.340 shout out to the patriots have been fighting this for six years now uh against threat of jail

00:46:20.760 bankruptcy all of it uh you guys are the best and the reason we even have a fighting chance here is

00:46:25.780 not the political class down in georgia that somehow something's fishy why they haven't

00:46:31.800 stepped in here why they're avoiding this and i think when everything's revealed there's going

00:46:37.340 be a lot of accountability that's going to have to happen holly your social media where do people

00:46:41.540 go and get you ma'am so i'm on uh x facebook sub stack i've been whipping out some sub stacks

00:46:47.980 lately but yeah my x account probably is is the easiest and the best but it's all the same holly

00:46:52.580 kessler same picture and everything so yeah i would appreciate the follow and i'll keep everybody

00:46:57.280 updated thank you ma'am appreciate you coming on here thank you

00:47:03.920 okay uh the chinese communist party their active participation in the media's cover-up

00:47:12.460 of their torment of lao beijing in china but also the united states ying chan chan joins us this

00:47:18.820 morning and uh levy uh brody um yeng tell us first off what is your position how do you fit

00:47:27.320 in this story because the new york post it was the lead for a while yesterday kind of a shocking

00:47:31.700 development of the chinese communist party trying to shut down this classic kind of ballet opera

00:47:38.660 dance that's gone throughout the nation with seven or eight troops that talks about

00:47:43.540 china before communism and the ccp can't handle that so they're taking active measures 1.00

00:47:49.200 to torment you all and to shut it down can you explain to us what's happening

00:47:52.980 yes um thank you steve so my name is yin chen i'm a conductor and vice president with shen

00:48:00.520 and Performing Arts. And Shen Yun is actually an American company created in New York in 2006.

00:48:07.160 And our mission is to revive our authentic traditional culture, which has been suppressed

00:48:12.920 by the CCP, you know, for decades. We want to really show the world and the beauty and wisdom

00:48:19.720 in this amazing culture. At the same time, our performances always also present the human rights

00:48:26.940 atrocities that are still ongoing in China. Shen Yun was actually created at the time when many

00:48:32.900 of our family members, myself included, and our friends in the Falun Gong community were severely

00:48:39.340 persecuted in China. And actually, that persecution is still going on. So for the last 20 years,

00:48:45.180 this year, Shen Yun is celebrating our 20th anniversary. And we've grown tremendously from

00:48:51.320 one troop to eight troops that are performing simultaneously in the major continents everywhere

00:48:58.340 basically in the world, seen by over a million people every year. But because of what we talk

00:49:05.240 about in the show, we are not subject to the CCP's censorship. We definitely talk about the

00:49:13.220 issues in today's China as well. So we have been under attack for the last 20 years. We have faced

00:49:19.900 bomb threats for so long that we've almost gotten used to it, which is not right, right?

00:49:25.780 And this year, the last two years have been especially crazy. I think recently, six states,

00:49:33.420 heads of state, including Canada, Denmark, and Australia, have received bomb threats,

00:49:40.740 and basically saying, if you allow Shen Yun to perform, we'll blow up your residence,

00:49:45.200 Something like that. And as a result, the Australian prime minister was forced to evacuate from his residence.

00:49:54.660 So, but these things have been, I feel like the Shen Yun story is truly a coincidental story of how Beijing tries to dictate what stories are told here, what the narratives, try to impose their narratives on the American people.

00:50:15.200 Hang over one second, because if you look at the histories have been written by a lot of fellow travelers about everything came out of the Chinese Communist Party.

00:50:24.980 You know, China was just a backward run by corrupt emperors for thousands of years. 0.99

00:50:32.120 The peasants were abused.

00:50:33.900 That the reason you have this modern industrial middle class that's building every year is all because of the Chinese Communist Party.

00:50:41.740 In Shen Yun, which has all this beautiful traditional dance and music, your tagline is China before communism.

00:50:51.300 What do you mean by that?

00:50:52.620 And how do you counter them when they say, look, everybody was starving.

00:50:57.160 It was oppressed.

00:50:58.080 The emperors were the worst people on earth.

00:50:59.760 And we essentially gave freedom or a chance for freedom to the Chinese people, to Lao Ba Jing.

00:51:06.140 Ma'am.

00:51:07.400 Yeah, because I think when the Communist Party wanted to impose communism on people, they had to do away systematically with all the real culture of China, all the spiritual foundations.

00:51:20.460 You know, you're talking about Buddhism, Taoism and Confucianism.

00:51:24.380 Those have been the pillars of Chinese civilization for thousands of years.

00:51:28.900 So in order for them to impose Marxism on people, they had to do away with all these.

00:51:33.180 Both of my parents were with the Central Philharmonic Orchestra in Beijing for 30-some years.

00:51:38.500 So they were first-class musicians in China.

00:51:41.480 However, we knew firsthand that everything is censored.

00:51:47.120 And basically, even all these performing arts companies in China were propaganda tools for the CCP.

00:51:54.500 So it was not until I came to this country and gradually realized, wait a minute, this is not our true culture.

00:52:02.120 I grew up in China and I had no appreciation of the Chinese traditional values and culture when I was there until I came to this country and learned the truth about our true history and the spiritual foundation of all of that.

00:52:18.900 So with Shen Yun, we're trying to revive all of those amazing heritage and share it with the world.

00:52:26.000 And that's why the CCP hates it.

00:52:31.300 I mean, the Cultural Revolution was to destroy any connection with the Chinese people, was it the five bads to any connection to the traditional culture?

00:52:41.480 Hang on a second.

00:52:41.840 Levi, there's a film coming out tonight.

00:52:44.340 You guys are going to be part of the premiere.

00:52:46.440 You've got this story in the New York Post, and it's by Chadwick Moore, who did the great biography of Tucker Carlson we had on the show a year or so ago, the story in the New York Post.

00:52:58.040 It also implies that American media companies, particularly some big American media companies, have not, because we do this story a lot, and we know it has huge traction with the Warren Posse.

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Bannon's War Room - March 24, 2026

Episode 5242： America Is Closing In On A Fiscal Cliff

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