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Bannon's War Room
- February 09, 2024
WarRoom Battleground EP 469: Preview Of Tucker Carlson Interview
Episode Stats
Length
1 hour
Words per Minute
145.24838
Word Count
8,796
Sentence Count
16
Hate Speech Sentences
12
Summary
Summaries are generated with
gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ
.
Transcript
Transcript is generated with
Whisper
(
turbo
).
Hate speech classification is done with
facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target
.
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this is what you're fighting for I mean every day you're out there what they're doing is blowing
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people off if you continue to look the other way and shut up then the oppressors the
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authoritarians get total control and total power because this is just like in Arizona this is just
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like in Georgia it's another element that backs them into a quarter and shows their lies and
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misrepresentations is why this audience is going to have to get engaged as we've told you this is
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the fight all this nonsense all this spin they can't handle the truth war room battleground
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here's your host Stephen K Bannon welcome Thursday 8th February year of our Lord 2024 okay this is
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gonna be very special uh Tucker is doing this historic um really first interview I think by
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western journalists of Putin since the uh since the uh the great war in Ukraine started this
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couldn't be uh more timely because just a couple hours ago the Senate kind of flipped themselves
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they flipped themselves and they are now going to put Ukraine on a fast track uh to try to get the
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60 billion dollars from of course Rand Paul and others have said they're going to fight it obviously
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the war room posse we're all going to the ramparts that's going to start tomorrow uh we've got time
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on that and we're going to get you updated on everything that's going on Darren B is going to
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join me we're going to set this in its historical context uh with Tucker because he's taking a lot
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of grief in the mainstream media but this is a quite frankly a bold and courageous move on his part
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first I want to go because the big two problems going on I'm hearing this from people in the specter
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of kind of angst and anxiety one is the credit cards right two is the taxes and I want to bring in
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Josh Joshua Hanna from Tax Network USA for a few minutes because here's it's very important
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and Joshua you were the first guys to alert me to this they've got all these new IRS agents they're
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sending out all these letters if you get a letter and you just look at the 800 number and you call
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and make an information request or whatever correct me if wrong once you make that call you've kind of
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waived your rights you're then in the system you're in the process so it's very important and I know a lot
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of people out there worried maybe they didn't file right maybe they got back taxes they put in the
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drawer and think it's going to go away it ain't going to go away okay particularly since they're hiring
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tens of thousands of new agents and they're not going after the rich on that okay just write that
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down they're going after you if you get the letters the first thing you do is do not call
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and essentially waive your rights you got to call Tax Network USA so walk us through the process
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Joshua because I've heard a lot of people are now freaking out about this
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yeah the last thing you want to do obviously is sit on hold for three hours and end up on in a
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pressure cooker with the treasury officer who wants to collect as much money as possible
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once you've waived your rights they can really have their way with you and put you in a situation where
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you're paying a lot more on the front end and also on the back end the interest and penalties
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compound daily so you don't want that to happen at all the best way to handle it is to have a private
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conversation with a tax professional someone who's licensed and understands the process from tip to tell
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and how to get you the best deal with the government so just walk me through the process so when you get
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the letter what you don't do don't call the IRS 800 number that gets you into the process and
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essentially the implication ways you're right you got to call Tax Network USA in fact you should do
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that today don't wait for a letter now walk me through the process totally free the first is of
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totally free consultation right just walk people through the process it's totally uh private you're
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not going to have to worry about any of your financial information getting out there uh we'll walk you
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through an in-depth consultation it takes about 15 minutes to understand what programs are best for you
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and what way to handle it understanding your status with the IRS and putting together a strategy to
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reduce settle and resolve the tax debt uh there is a form that you would fill out it's a declaration of
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representatives it allows our attorneys and licensed tax professionals to speak on your behalf
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request transcripts uh appeal uh uh any any collection efforts that the government has filed against
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you uh place the account in a collective hold status where we can uh put together a package for
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relief and get this balance settled um the IRS is really banking on these new collection efforts uh
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originally the Biden regime uh said they're gonna they're they're gonna collect five dollars for every
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one dollar spent now the IRS is saying that they're gonna be able to collect six dollars for every one
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dollar spent I think it's gonna be a lot more because the pandemic uh that they you know threw on us
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and uh all the people who haven't filed for those years and haven't paid so I think it's gonna be
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much larger than that well Joshua's talking about the billions of dollars they're putting in the
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hundreds of billions of dollars they're putting a new IRS they're gonna get they're promising six
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dollars back for every one remember they're not going after the wealthy this thing they said
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because the wealthy have tax lawyers they got tax accounts they get they specialize to protect these
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guys they're coming after you and they have to close the deficit somehow they ain't gonna raise taxes
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on the wealthy they got to close the deficit they're not going to cut spending they think
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the low-hanging fruit is you so last time where do they go uh Joshua to talk to you guys what's the
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website what's the 800 number uh the 800 number that they're going to going to want to call is 800-245-6000
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or they can visit tnusa.com uh slash bannon uh and fill out a form and they'll get a call uh during
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normal business hours within a few minutes and they can speak with a licensed tax professional and
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understand the best strategy to reduce settle and resolve their tax balances and unfiled returns
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Joshua thank thank you so much for doing this audience don't let the specter of fear and anxiety
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engulf you there's help the tax network usa guys are the best they'll go right to work so make sure
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you check it out okay darren beady from revolver news man what a show i had boris cash loomer mike
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davis raheem gassam ben burkwam now i got darren beady i mean that may be the best seven i'm on a roll
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right now to put in perspective this guy has gotten so much this way i don't understand we just had the
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senate flipped the entire rules and leave a vote open for 24 freaking hours so they they were losing
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58 to 41 they strong-armed guys for 24 hours got nine people to flip all because it's all about
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ukraine the whole the whole bogus us going up there with the uh with with all this non-boy you know the
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the invasion authorization bill turns out it was just a joke that was all to get money to the ukraine
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number one what is this fetish as jd vance calls it this obsession with getting this money into
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ukraine and number two let's talk about the patriotism and heroism of tucker carlson and what
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he's doing sir do i have uh darren i don't have him i'm here hello no oh darren i that was that was
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question was for you brother i'm sorry i thought you were there yeah ask me again very i was team
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i was teaming you up okay
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they they just flipped this ukraine situation so that now they can actually get to it the whole the
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whole thing on the border was just a fig leaf it was just a misdirection play to get to ukraine the
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only thing they ever wanted to do was get to the 60 billion in ukraine why are they obsessed with that
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number one why is victoria newland they just announced before he came on air by the way the
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news is so intense we couldn't that zelensky did fire the beloved general he fired that today okay so
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it's basically a military coup going on and and tucker carlson's heroism and patriotism in going to
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moscow to hear from putin and let us be the judges of it let us weigh and measure as adults what the
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guy says darren beady oh 100 look i mean the the situation from the standpoint of the regime which
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has done everything in its power to just funnel money into the coffers of the corrupt ukraine
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leadership and even more so into the corrupt leadership and military industrial complex united
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states which ends up gobbling up um the overwhelming majority of of these funds um but yes they're
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down on the ropes they understand the situation looks bad and like you know the proverbial monster
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from the movies they're making a an attempt to revive their efforts and you saw that in fairly recently in
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that tragic display really pathetic display of newland speaking on the empty street in ukraine the
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empty street that you know she must have felt nostalgia for the days that those streets were filled up
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as a result of her own engineered color revolution in euromaidan and she's just aching for a reprisal of
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this and i think that's partially driving this new push for yet another multi multi multi billion dollar
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package to ukraine which again just makes things worse for the ukrainian people just prolongs the
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you know the conflict in which you know that's foregone conclusion anyway there's no point of it other than
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to enrich and empower the corrupt leadership in the u.s and the corrupt leadership in the ukraine
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with which they're tied at the hip regime leadership in the uniparty the party of davos and in its media
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propaganda department has a special place and it's hard for the hate on tucker carlson i mean they
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hate me they hate you they hate lindell they obviously hate trump at some psych you know some
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psychotic level but there's something about tucker that triggers them or so i mean he's been called
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everything he's going over to see a world leader and to interview a world leader and let the american
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people kind of listen to hear it we're big boys and girls we know the guy's a kgb officer we get the
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joke he's in the line of stalin we understand that but we're adults what is it about this hate of
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tucker carlson even for him to try to do this it's been four days of total meltdown well you know it's
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it's clear why that would be the case you know he's the only western journalist who would ever be in a
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position to do this and it's frankly telling you know during his tenure on fox there were certain
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occasions where he was the only person in western media who would do this or that thing he was the
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only person in western media for instance who would um call into question the narrative that the syrian
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uh chemical attacks were coming from assad there were certain moments where he wasn't just deviating
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from the you know standard line at fox he was deviating from the consensus across the board across the
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entire sweep of western media as such um and because he was willing and able to do that on such a big
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stage he drew the ire the consternation the fear the anger of um the regime media and you know they were
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hoping that okay you know now that he's taken off of fox he might have a large following but at the end
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of the day he's just going to be another guy on the internet there's not that imprimatur of cable news
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of fox news especially remember fox news has always you know been to fox news and it's true like the
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network is the star there the network itself is bigger than any individual talent but when it was fox
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news combined with trump in the white house when everyone knew that trump was also watching the
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president was also watching that was just such a powerful synergy that gave the fox shows and in
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particular tucker so much clout so much influence and so they're hoping okay trump's out of office now
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now we booted tucker off of fox so he doesn't have the imprimatur of cable and you know there are a lot
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of older people who are not informed high informed people watch war room they're not watching fox but
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the you know default low information person is watching fox it just beams into everyone's household
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they're habituated to watch cable so it's very powerful for that reason um but now tucker's not
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on that anymore and they thought okay he might have a huge following even on twitter you know okay elan likes
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him but at the end of the day he's just another person with a huge following on the internet and
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a sea of influencers in a sea of voices i think that this putin interview is the winning chess move
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the decisive move that only he was really in a position to do that definitively takes him out of
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that category as just another guy on the internet and re-establishes him as just a major mover in
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politics and media like it's such a big deal this is the first western interview of a major world leader
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after a major world conflict i mean the fact that no western journalist had done this before
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um is really astonishing and frankly quite damning
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let's go ahead and play by the way go to tucker's site you can join up and come to tucker.com you can
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get to all the information he's putting out articles every day they put up videos every day this thing's
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very special let's go ahead and see the start of this and then darren and i will come back for some
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comment it is primarily about the war in progress the war in ukraine how it started what's happening
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and most presently how it might end one note before you watch at the beginning of the interview
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we asked the most obvious question which is why did you do this did you feel a threat an imminent
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physical threat and that's your justification and the answer we got shocked us putin went on for a
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very long time probably half an hour about the history of russia going back to the 8th century
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and honestly we thought this was a filibustering technique and found it annoying interrupted him
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several times and he responded he was annoyed by the interruption but we concluded in the end for
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what it's worth that it was not a filibustering technique there was no time limit on the interview
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we ended it after more than two hours instead what you're about to see seem to us sincere whether
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you agree with it or not vladimir putin believes that russia has a historic claim to parts of western
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ukraine so our opinion would be to view it in that light as a sincere expression of what he thinks
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and with that here it is mr president thank you on february 22nd 2022 you addressed your country in a
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nationwide address when the conflict in ukraine started and you said that you were acting because
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you had come to the conclusion that the united states through nato might initiate a quote
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surprise attack on our country and to americaneers that sounds paranoid tell us why you believe the
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united states might strike russia out of the blue how did you conclude that
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it's not that america the united states was going to launch a surprise strike on russia i didn't say that
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are we having a talk show or a serious conversation here's the quote thank you it's a formidable series
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because your basic education is in history as far as i understand yes
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so if you don't mind i will take only 30 seconds or one minute to give you a short reference to history
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for giving you a little historical background please let's look where our relationship with ukraine
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started from where did ukraine come from the russian state started gathering itself as a centralized
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statehood and it is considered to be the year of the establishment of the russian state in 862
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when the townspeople of novgorod invited a varangian prince rurik from scandinavia to reign
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in 1862 russia celebrated the 1000th anniversary of its statehood
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and in novgorod there is a memorial dedicated to the 1000th anniversary of the country
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in 882 in 882 rurik's successor prince oleg who was actually playing the role of regent
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at rurik's younger son because rurik had died by that time came to kiev
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he ousted two brothers who apparently had once been members of rurik's squad
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so russia began to develop with two centers of power kiev and novgorod
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the next very significant date in the history of russia was 988
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this was the baptism of russia when prince vladimir the great-grandson of rurik baptized russia
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and adopted orthodoxy or eastern christianity from this time the centralized russian state
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began to strengthen why because of the single territory integrated economic ties one in the
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same language and after the baptism of russia the same faith and rule of the prince the centralized
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russian state began to take shape back in the middle ages prince yaroslav the wise introduced the
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order of succession to a throne
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but after he passed away it became complicated for various reasons
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the throne was passed not directly from father to eldest son but from the prince who had passed away to
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his brother than to his sons in different lines all this led to the fragmentation and the end of russ as
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a single state there was nothing special about it the same was happening then in europe
00:19:17.020
but the fragmented russian state became an easy prey to the empire created earlier by king ishan
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his successors namely batuhan came to ruse plundered and ruined nearly all the cities the southern part
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including kiev by the way and some other cities simply lost independence while northern cities preserved
00:19:45.740
some of their sovereignty they had to pay tribute to the horde but they managed to preserve some part of
00:19:53.500
their sovereignty and then a unified russian state began to take shape with its center in moscow
00:20:03.180
the southern part of russian lands including kiev
00:20:07.900
began to gradually gravitate towards another magnet the center that was emerging in europe
00:20:13.180
this was the grand duchy of lithuania it was even called the lithuanian russian duchy because russians
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were a significant part of this population they spoke the old russian language and were orthodox
00:20:34.380
but then there was a unification the union of the grand duchy of lithuania
00:20:39.260
and the kingdom of poland a few years later another union was signed but this time already in the
00:20:48.220
religious sphere some of the orthodox priests became subordinate to the pope thus these lands became
00:20:56.140
part of the polish lithuanian state
00:20:58.220
during decades the poles were engaged in polandization of this part of the population
00:21:09.180
they introduced their language there tried to entrench the idea that this population was not exactly
00:21:15.580
russians that because they lived on the fringe they were ukrainians
00:21:20.460
originally the word ukrainian meant that the person was living on the outskirts of the state along the
00:21:29.500
fringes or was engaged in a border patrol service it didn't mean any particular ethnic group so the
00:21:37.660
poles were trying to in every possible way to polonize this part of the russian lands and actually
00:21:45.260
treated it rather harshly not to say cruelly all that led to the fact that this part of the russian
00:21:52.220
lands begun to struggle for their rights they wrote letters to warsaw demanding that their rights be
00:21:58.700
observed and people be commissioned here including to kiev i beg your pardon can you tell us what period
00:22:05.260
i'm losing track of where in history we are the polish oppression of ukraine it was in the 13th century
00:22:21.100
now i will tell you what happened later
00:22:26.060
and give the dates so that there is no confusion
00:22:28.380
and in 1654 even a bit earlier
00:22:38.380
the people who were in control of the authority over that part of the russian lands
00:22:45.340
addressed warsaw i repeat demanding that they send them to rulers of russian origin
00:22:51.340
and orthodox faith when warsaw did not answer them
00:22:55.260
and in fact rejected their demands they turned to moscow so that moscow took them away
00:23:06.460
so that you don't think that i'm inventing things
00:23:14.140
i'll give you these documents well i i it doesn't sound like you're inventing it i'm not
00:23:19.740
sure why it's relevant to what happened two years ago but still these are documents from the archives
00:23:26.620
copies here are the letters from bogdan chmielnitsky the man who then controlled the power in this part
00:23:34.940
of the russian lands that is now called ukraine he wrote to warsaw demanding that their rights be upheld
00:23:42.620
and after being refused he began to write letters to moscow asking to take them under the strong hand of
00:23:51.020
the moscow tsar there are copies of these documents i will leave them for your good memory there is a
00:23:57.740
translation into russian you can translate it into english later russia would not agree to admit them
00:24:03.980
straight away assuming that the war with poland would start nevertheless in 1654 the pan russian
00:24:11.260
assembly of top clergy and landowners headed by the tsar which was the representative body of the power
00:24:21.020
of the old russian state decided to include a part of the old russian lands into moscow kingdom
00:24:27.420
as expected the war with poland began it lasted 13 years and then in 1654 a truce was concluded
00:24:41.980
and 32 years later i think a peace treaty with poland which they called eternal peace was signed
00:24:48.620
and these lands the whole left bank of dnieper including kiev went to russia and the whole right
00:24:57.820
bank of dnieper remained in poland under the rule of katharina the great russia reclaimed all of its
00:25:05.020
historical lands including in the south and west this all lasted until the revolution before world war one
00:25:13.660
austrian austrian general staff relied on the ideas of ukrainianization and started actively promoting
00:25:21.500
the ideas of ukraine and the ukrainization their motive was obvious just before world war one they
00:25:34.060
wanted to weaken the potential enemy and secure themselves favorable conditions in the border area
00:25:40.620
so the idea which had emerged in poland that people residing in that territory were allegedly not really
00:25:47.660
russians but rather belong to a special ethnic group ukrainians started being propagated by the austrian
00:25:54.860
general staff as far back as the 19th century theorists calling for ukrainian independence appeared
00:26:02.780
all those however claimed that ukraine should have a very good relationship with russia
00:26:11.420
they insisted on that after the 1917 revolution
00:26:21.020
the bolsheviks sought to restore the statehood and the civil war began including the hostilities with poland
00:26:27.420
in 1921 peace with poland was proclaimed and under that treaty the right bank of dnieper river once again
00:26:39.420
was given back to poland in 1939 after poland cooperated with hitler it did collaborate with hitler you know
00:26:52.300
hitler offered poland peace as we head toward a presidential election in november one thing you
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much worse and a treaty of friendship an alliance demanding in return that poland give back to germany
00:31:47.900
the so-called dancing corridor which connected the bulk of germany with east prussia and konigsberg
00:31:54.780
after world war one this territory was transferred to poland and instead of danzig a city of gdansk emerged
00:32:12.460
hitler asked them to give it amicably but they refused of course still they collaborated with hitler
00:32:19.580
and engaged together in the partitioning of czechoslovakia but may ask you you're making the
00:32:28.060
case that that ukraine certainly parts of ukraine eastern ukraine is in effect russia has been for
00:32:33.660
hundreds of years why wouldn't you just take it when you became president 24 years ago you have
00:32:40.860
nuclear weapons they don't if it's actually your land why did you wait so long sure i'll tell you
00:32:47.900
i'm coming to that this briefing is coming to an end it might be boring but it explains many things
00:32:57.500
good good i'm so gratified that you appreciate that thank you so before world war ii poland
00:33:06.540
collaborated with hitler and although it did not yield to hitler's demands it still participated in the
00:33:13.260
partitioning of czechoslovakia together with hitler as the poles had not given the dancing corridor to
00:33:19.580
germany and went too far pushing hitler to start world war ii by attacking them why was it poland against
00:33:28.220
whom the war started on first september 1939 poland turned out to be uncompromising and hitler had nothing
00:33:36.780
to do but start implementing his plans with poland by the way the ussr i have read some archived documents
00:33:45.980
behaved very honestly it asked poland's permission to transit its troops through the polish territory to
00:33:53.580
help czechoslovakia but the then polish foreign minister said that if the soviet plans flew over
00:34:02.060
poland they would be downed over the territory of poland but that doesn't matter what matters is that
00:34:09.100
the war began and poland fell prey to the policies it had pursued against czechoslovakia as under the
00:34:16.460
well-known molotov-ribbentrop pact part of the territory including western ukraine was to be
00:34:24.540
given to russia thus russia which was then named this ussr regained its historical lands after the
00:34:34.220
victory in the great patriotic war as we call world war ii all those territories were ultimately enshrined
00:34:42.380
as belonging to russia to the ussr as for poland it received apparently in compensation the lands which
00:34:53.420
had originally been german the eastern parts of germany these are now western lands of poland
00:35:04.460
of course poland regained access to the baltic sea and danzig which was once again given its polish name
00:35:18.140
so this was how this situation developed
00:35:22.940
in 1922 when the ussr was being established the polsheviks started building the ussr
00:35:30.220
and established the soviet ukraine which had never existed before right
00:35:39.740
stalin insisted that those republics be included in the ussr as
00:35:45.900
autonomous entities
00:35:50.060
for some inexplicable reason lenin the founder of the soviet state insisted that they be entitled to
00:35:57.100
withdraw from the ussr and again for some unknown reasons he transferred to that newly established
00:36:06.620
soviet republic of ukraine some of the lands together with people living there even though those lands had
00:36:13.260
never been called ukraine and yet they were made part of that soviet republic of ukraine those lands
00:36:20.060
included the black sea region which was received under katharina the great and which had no historical
00:36:26.620
connection with ukraine whatsoever even if we go as far back as 1654 when these lands returned to russian
00:36:36.140
empire that territory was the size of three to four regions of modern ukraine with no black sea region
00:36:43.740
that was completely out of the question in 1654
00:36:47.020
exactly i'm just you obviously have encyclopedic knowledge of this region but why didn't you make
00:36:55.100
this case for the first 22 years as president that ukraine wasn't a real country the soviet union was given a
00:37:07.260
great deal of territory that had never belonged to it including the black sea region
00:37:12.220
at some point when russia received them as an outcome of the russo-turkish wars
00:37:21.740
they were called new russia or nova russia but that does not matter what matters is that lenin
00:37:29.580
the founder of the soviet state established ukraine that way
00:37:33.820
for decades the ukrainian soviet republic developed as part of the ussr and for unknown reasons again
00:37:43.900
the bolsheviks were engaged in ukrainianization it was not merely because the soviet leadership was
00:37:50.220
composed to a great extent of those originating from ukraine rather it was explained by the general
00:37:56.620
policy of indigenization pursued by the soviet union same things were done in other soviet republics
00:38:03.820
this involved promoting national languages and national cultures which is not a bad in principle
00:38:09.580
that is how the soviet ukraine was created after the world war ii ukraine received in addition to the
00:38:15.820
lands that had belonged to poland before the war part of the lands that had previously belonged to
00:38:21.500
hungary and romania so romania and hungary had some of their lands taken away and given to the soviet
00:38:28.460
ukraine and they still remain part of ukraine so in this sense we have every reason to affirm that
00:38:34.140
ukraine is an artificial state that was shaped at stalin's will do you believe hungary has a right to take
00:38:39.980
its land back from ukraine and that other nations have a right to go back to their 1654 borders
00:38:45.180
i'm not sure whether they should go back to the 1654 borders but given stalin's time
00:38:59.180
so-called stalin's regime which as many claim saw numerous violations of human rights and violations of
00:39:05.980
the rights of other states one may say that they could claim back those lands of theirs while having
00:39:20.140
no right to do that it is at least understandable have you told victor orban that he can have part of
00:39:25.740
ukraine never i have never told them not a single time we have not even had any conversation on that
00:39:41.020
but i actually know for sure that hungarians who live there wanted to get back to their historical land
00:39:49.900
moreover i would like to share a very interesting story with you
00:39:58.380
i digress it's a personal one somewhere in the early 80s i went on a road trip in a car from then
00:40:07.180
leningrad across the soviet union through kiev made a stop in kiev and then went to western ukraine
00:40:14.940
and all the names of towns and villages there were in russian and in the language i did not understand
00:40:26.220
in hungarian in russian and in hungarian not in ukrainian in russian and in hungarian i was driving
00:40:35.340
through some kind of village and there were men sitting next to the houses and they were wearing
00:40:41.260
black three-piece suits and black cylinder hats i asked are they some kind of entertainers i was
00:40:47.900
told no they were not entertainers they're hungarians i said what are they doing here what do you mean
00:40:54.380
this is their land they live here this was during the soviet time in the 1980s they preserved the
00:41:00.540
hungarian language hungarian names and all their national costumes they are hungarians and they feel
00:41:07.100
themselves to be hungarians and of course when now there is an infringement well that that is and
00:41:13.740
there's a lot of that though i think many nations are upset about transylvania as well as you obviously
00:41:17.580
know but many nations feel frustrated by the redrawn borders of the wars of the 20th century and wars
00:41:23.420
going back a thousand years the ones that you mentioned but the fact is that you didn't make this
00:41:29.500
case in public until two years ago february and in the case that you made which i read today you you
00:41:36.380
explain at great length that you felt a physical threat from the west in nato including potentially
00:41:41.420
a nuclear threat and that's what got you to move is that a fair characterization of what you said
00:41:46.780
i understand that my long speeches probably fall outside of the genre of the interview
00:42:00.460
that is why i asked you at the beginning are we going to have a serious talk or a show you said a serious
00:42:08.380
talk so bear with me please we're coming to the point where the soviet ukraine was established
00:42:17.420
then in 1991 the soviet union collapsed and everything that russia had generously bestowed
00:42:25.260
on ukraine was dragged away by the ladder i'm coming to a very important point of today's agenda
00:42:33.020
thank you after all the collapse of the soviet union was effectively initiated by the russian
00:42:39.820
leadership i do not understand what the russian leadership was guided by at the time but i suspect
00:42:49.180
there were several reasons to think everything would be fine first i think that then russian
00:43:00.700
leadership believed that the fundamentals of the relationship between russia and ukraine were in
00:43:06.620
fact a common language more than 90 percent of the population there spoke russian
00:43:15.020
family ties every third person there had some kind of family or friendship ties common culture common
00:43:22.380
history finally common faith coexistence with a single state for centuries and deeply interconnected
00:43:30.140
economies all of these were so fundamental all these elements together make our good
00:43:39.900
relationships inevitable the second point is a very important one i want you as an american
00:43:50.380
citizen and your viewers to hear about this as well the former russian leadership assumed that the
00:43:57.660
soviet union had ceased to exist and therefore there were no longer any ideological dividing lines
00:44:06.860
russia even agreed voluntarily and proactively to the collapse of the soviet union
00:44:12.940
and believed that this would be understood by the so-called civilized west as an invitation for
00:44:19.500
cooperation and association that is what russia was expecting both from the united states and the so-called
00:44:28.300
collective west as a whole there were smart people including in germany egon bar a major politician of the
00:44:37.500
social democratic party who insisted in his personal conversations with the soviet leadership on the brink of the
00:44:44.700
collapse of the soviet union that a new security system should be established in europe help should
00:44:52.460
be given to unified germany but a new system should be also established to include the united states canada
00:44:59.740
russia and other central european countries yes but nato needs not to expand that's what he said
00:45:07.340
if nato expands everything would be just the same as during the cold war only closer to russia's borders
00:45:15.900
that's all he was a wise old man but no one listened to him in fact he got angry once
00:45:26.460
if he said you don't listen to me i'm never setting my foot in moscow once again
00:45:31.260
everything happened just as he had said well of course it did come true and i and you've mentioned
00:45:39.020
this many times i think it's a fair point and many in america thought that relations between
00:45:44.940
russia and the united states would be fine with the collapse of the soviet union at the end of the
00:45:48.780
cold war that the opposite happened but you've never explained why you think that happened except to
00:45:54.940
say that the west fears a strong russia but we have a strong china the west does not seem very afraid of
00:46:02.060
what about russia do you think convinced policymakers they had to take it down
00:46:11.420
the west is afraid of strong china more than it fears a strong russia because russia has 150 million
00:46:18.140
people and china has 1.5 billion population and its economy is growing by leaps and bounds or five percent
00:46:26.140
a year it used to be even more but that's enough for china as bismarck once put it potentials are the
00:46:33.100
most important china's potential is enormous it is the biggest economy in the world today in terms of
00:46:39.660
purchasing power parity and the size of the economy it has already overtaking the united states quite a
00:46:46.140
long time ago and it is growing at a rapid clip let's not talk about who is afraid of whom let's not
00:46:52.540
reason in such terms and let's get into the fact that after 1991 when russia expected that it would
00:46:59.260
be welcomed into the brotherly family of civilized nations nothing like this happened you tricked us
00:47:05.660
i don't mean you personally when i say you of course i'm talking about the united states the promise
00:47:11.580
was that nato would not expand eastward but it happened five times there were five waves of expansion
00:47:17.900
we tolerated all that we were trying to persuade them we were saying please don't we are as bourgeois
00:47:24.940
now as you are we are market economy and there is no communist party power let's negotiate moreover
00:47:31.900
i have also said this publicly before there was a moment when a certain rift started growing between us
00:47:42.780
before that yeltsin came to the united states remember he spoke in congress and said the good
00:47:48.780
words god bless america everything he said were signals let us in remember the developments in
00:47:56.220
yugoslavia before the yeltsin was lavished with praise as soon as the developments in yugoslavia started
00:48:02.380
he raised his voice in support of serbs and we couldn't but raise our voices for serbs in their defense
00:48:08.380
i understand that there were complex processes on the way there i do but russia could not help raising
00:48:14.220
its voice in support of serbs because serbs are also a special and close to us nation with orthodox
00:48:20.940
culture and so on it's a nation that has suffered so much for generations well regardless what is
00:48:27.340
important is that yeltsin expressed his support what did the united states do in violation of international
00:48:34.300
law and the un charter it started bombing belgrade it was the united states that let the genie out of
00:48:40.060
the bottle moreover when russia protested and expressed its resentment what was said the un
00:48:47.900
charter and international law have become obsolete now everyone invokes international law but at that
00:48:54.700
time they started saying that everything was outdated everything had to be changed indeed some things need
00:49:01.340
to be changed as the balance of power has changed it's true but not in this manner eltsin was immediately
00:49:08.460
dragged through the mud accused of alcoholism of understanding nothing of knowing nothing he
00:49:14.780
understood everything i assure you well i became president in 2000 i thought okay the yugoslav issue is
00:49:23.100
over but we should try to restore relations let's reopen the door that russia had tried to go through
00:49:30.060
and moreover i said it publicly i can't reiterate at a meeting here in the kremlin with the outgoing
00:49:39.820
president bill clinton right here in the next room i said to him i asked him bill do you think if russia
00:49:49.820
asked to join nato do you think it would happen suddenly he said you know it's interesting i think
00:49:57.820
so but in the evening when we met for dinner he said you know i've talked to my team no no it's not
00:50:07.340
possible now you can ask him i think he will watch our interview he'll confirm it i wouldn't have said
00:50:15.580
anything like that if it hadn't happened okay were you since it's impossible now would you have joined
00:50:22.620
nato look i asked the question is it possible or not and the answer i got was no if i wasn't sincere
00:50:31.740
in my desire to find out what the leadership position was but if he had said yes would you have
00:50:37.580
joined nato if he had said yes the process of reproachment would have commenced and eventually
00:50:46.060
it might have happened if we had seen some sincere wish on the other side of our partners but it didn't
00:50:52.300
happen well no means no okay fine why do you think that is just to get to motive i know you're clearly
00:50:59.020
bitter about it um i understand but why do you think the west rebuffed you then why the hostility
00:51:06.620
why did the end of the cold war not fix the relationship what motivates this from your point of
00:51:12.380
view you said i was bitter about the answer no it's not bitterness it's just a statement of fact
00:51:22.780
we're not bride and groom bitterness resentment it's not about those kind of matters in such
00:51:29.100
circumstances we just realized we weren't welcome there that's all okay fine but let's build relations
00:51:37.660
in another manner let's look for common ground elsewhere why we receive such a negative response you
00:51:44.700
should ask your leaders i can only guess why too big a country with its own opinion and so on
00:51:51.020
and the united states i have seen how issues are being resolved in nato i will give you another
00:51:59.660
example now concerning ukraine the u.s leadership exerts pressure and all nato members obediently vote
00:52:10.060
even if they do not like something now i'll tell you what happened in this regard with ukraine in 2008
00:52:17.740
although it's being discussed i'm not going to open a secret to you say anything new nevertheless
00:52:25.900
after that we tried to build relations in different ways for example the events in the middle east in
00:52:33.100
iraq we were building relations with the united states in a very soft prudent cautious manner
00:52:39.980
i repeatedly raised the issue that the united states should not support separatism or terrorism in the
00:52:46.780
north caucasus but they continue to do it anyway and political support information support financial
00:52:56.460
support even military support came from the united states and its satellites for terrorist groups in the
00:53:03.180
caucuses i once raised this issue with my colleague also the president of the united states he says it's
00:53:12.300
impossible do you have proof i said yes i was prepared for this conversation and i gave him that proof
00:53:20.300
he looked at it and you know what he said i apologize but that's what happened i'll quote he says
00:53:27.500
well i'm gonna kick their ass we waited and waited for some response there was no reply i said to the
00:53:36.620
fsb director write to the cia what is the result of the conversation with president he wrote once twice
00:53:44.860
and then we got a reply we have the answer in the archive the cia replied we have been working with the
00:53:52.540
opposition in russia we believe that this is the right thing to do and we will keep on doing it just
00:53:59.580
ridiculous well okay we realized that it was out of the question forces in opposition to you so you're
00:54:07.340
saying the cia is trying to overthrow your government of course they meant in that particular case the
00:54:14.060
separatists the terrorists who fought with us in the caucuses that's who they called the opposition
00:54:22.540
this is the second point the third moment is a very important one is the moment when the u.s missile
00:54:31.820
defense system was created the beginning we persuaded for a long time not to do it in united states
00:54:42.540
moreover
00:54:43.100
after was invited by bush jr's father bush senior to visit his place on the ocean i had a very serious
00:54:55.500
conversation with president bush and his team i proposed that the united states russia and europe jointly
00:55:03.260
create a missile defense system that we believe if created unilaterally threatens our security despite the
00:55:11.340
fact that the united states officially said that it was being created against missile threats from iran
00:55:18.300
that was the justification for the deployment of the missile defense system
00:55:23.020
i suggested working together russia the united states and europe they said it was very interesting
00:55:29.900
they asked me are you serious i said absolutely
00:55:39.180
i don't remember it is easy to find out on the internet when i was in the usa at the invitation of
00:55:46.220
a bush senior it is even easier to learn from someone i'm going to tell you about
00:55:51.260
i was told it was very interesting i said just imagine if we could tackle such a global strategic
00:55:59.740
security challenge together the world will change we'll probably have disputes probably economic and
00:56:07.500
even political ones but we could drastically change the situation in the world he says yes
00:56:14.220
and asks are you serious i said of course we need to think about it i'm so i said go ahead please
00:56:23.180
then secretary of defense gates former director of cia and secretary of state rice came in here in this
00:56:31.020
cabinet right here at this table they sat on this table me the foreign minister the russian defense
00:56:37.900
minister on that side they said to me yes we have thought about it we agree i said thank god great no but
00:56:48.140
with some exceptions so twice you've described u.s presidents making decisions and then being undercut
00:56:56.140
by their agency heads so it sounds like you're describing a system that's not run
00:57:01.660
by the people who are elected in your talent that's right that's right in the end they just told us to
00:57:11.260
get lost i'm not going to tell you the details because i think it's incorrect after all it was
00:57:17.580
confidential conversation but our proposal was declined that's a fact it was right then when i said look but
00:57:26.220
then we will be forced to take countermeasures we will create such strike systems that will certainly
00:57:31.980
overcome missile defense systems the answer was we are not doing this against you and you do what
00:57:39.020
you want assuming that it is not against us not against the united states i said okay very well hello
00:57:46.780
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