Bannon's War Room - WarRoom Battleground EP 514： Gutting The American Economy

00:00:00.000 this is what you're fighting for I mean every day you're out there what they're doing is blowing

00:00:11.620 people off if you continue to look the other way and shut up then the oppressors the authoritarians

00:00:19.380 get total control and total power because this is just like in Arizona this is just like in

00:00:24.840 Georgia it's another element that backs them into a quarter and shows their lies and

00:00:29.280 misrepresentations is why this audience is going to have to get engaged as we've told you this is

00:00:33.560 the fight all this nonsense all this spin they can't handle the truth war room battleground here's

00:00:40.600 your host Stephen K Bannon it's Monday 15 April in the year of our Lord uh 2024 something we have

00:00:49.360 it's tax day make sure that they get paid you've got to underwrite remember you're underwriting

00:00:54.760 uh your own destruction so why not just go and pay up underwrite send the big check right

00:01:01.600 because we know the check's going to be big because they're you're getting financially hosed

00:01:06.880 uh minute by minute by this government we've got a lot to go through this afternoon of course we've

00:01:11.780 been covering non-stop the fiasco of President Trump's the persecution of Donald J Trump I want

00:01:17.380 to pivot here and pull the camera back to make sure we can understand uh reset exactly where we are in

00:01:23.300 this debacle that the Biden regime and our sociopathic overlords have put us we're going to actually

00:01:29.140 have in a in a moment uh I've got Joe Allen here and Dave Walsh uh to uh play um a part of a podcast

00:01:37.060 from Kara Swisher if you have or you're not familiar with her name she's one of the best I guess it's

00:01:43.260 business journalist in the tech side she has a pod she has a couple of podcasts she's written a bunch

00:01:48.360 of books I think she's the editor over there at New York Magazine but she's incredibly influential

00:01:53.740 influential the sociopathic overlords in Silicon Valley look at her as like the end all and be all

00:01:59.420 of kind of modern uh business journalism I mean she's been all over Elon Musk she knows all the ins and

00:02:06.120 outs of all the sociopathic overlords business and they frequently on her show uh she actually had

00:02:13.220 the author Isaac Arnsdorf a finish what we started because guess what what are the sociopathic overlords

00:02:20.620 fear before we cry before we go from late stage capitalism finance capitalism and crater into uh

00:02:28.120 into um tech feudalism well they fear MAGA and they fear uh the war room posse the America first

00:02:36.760 movement all of it all the little men and women out there the common man and woman that are part of

00:02:41.480 this movement they fear you uh before we start that I've asked Dave Walsh to jump on here Dave

00:02:46.140 Dave Walsh there's two two well there's an article over the weekend I asked you to drill down on it

00:02:51.800 because you're the first guy to actually tell the American people this about the Chinese capacity

00:02:55.960 of coal-fired uh electricity of coal-fired plants which they're they're they're in the process they're

00:03:02.460 the leaders of uh the criminal leaders in Beijing are smart people and they're tough people

00:03:08.380 they're figuring out uh particularly with the whole world going to um electric vehicles and and

00:03:15.540 data centers and the need for electricity as Dave Walsh has shown the need for electricity is going

00:03:20.620 to be like exponential of course the leaders in the west they're de-industrializing in Germany

00:03:25.820 and the leaders of the United States are doing everything possible to take out continual cheap

00:03:31.040 electrical uh uh production offline uh so the business model is insane it just makes no sense

00:03:39.220 rationally well the Chinese Communist Party doesn't have a problem with that they're they're

00:03:42.580 and they don't care what they put in the atmosphere whatever they put in they put in

00:03:45.560 they want electrical capacity and they're going to do it oh by the way just announced today

00:03:51.240 massive layoffs at Tesla now they're saying it's because of all the competition from China

00:03:56.880 etc for his electronic vehicles number one the demand side of the equation the bottom's falling

00:04:01.700 out because they can't charge the things the batteries run out there's no capacity it's just

00:04:06.720 a grab bag here in the United States as the Biden regime who can't run anything right shows you but

00:04:12.480 also the Chinese Communist Party that is the financing part of Elon Musk and this is one of the reasons I

00:04:18.560 have such a big problem with Elon there's one's transhumanism and the other is uh the other is uh his

00:04:24.560 controlled by the Chinese Communist Party they've set up all kind of alternatives in case he gets

00:04:28.800 off the reservation that uh they've got now got letting a million flowers bloom and they're affecting

00:04:34.360 the EV business so Dave Walsh let me turn it over to you I want to go with Tesla first and the implosion

00:04:39.720 of the Tesla business model and the wipeout of the Tesla stock uh and then talk about how the Chinese

00:04:45.320 Communist Party remember these guys are known to be on every side of every trade right they they want

00:04:51.540 to be in control what instrument they control through is kind of irrelevant for them Dave Walsh your

00:04:57.760 thoughts about uh bad day for Elon Musk in the electrical electrical vehicle industry well Musk

00:05:06.260 announced today laying off 10 percent of his global workforce in his global EV business Tesla which would be

00:05:13.340 about 13,000 people because for the first time since 2020 year-on-year demand in units is down

00:05:21.340 it's down about eight and a half percent deliveries down eight and a half percent uh from last year year

00:05:26.560 on year first time a decline since 2020 in their in their published demand data and yet another issue

00:05:33.980 on the global competitive front uh they're dwarfed by Chinese capacity to make cars the Chinese capacity

00:05:41.240 to make end-to-end vehicles and then export them massively globally which is what they want to do

00:05:46.980 starting with a small beachhead here and batteries only to him but expanding they now produce eight

00:05:52.840 and a half times more EVs per year than his entire company Chinese manufacturers of EVs so they now

00:05:58.900 dominate the space globally the the longer term strategy for Tesla is an issue you know we got

00:06:04.700 massive cost issues with these massive inconvenience with these people finally coming around to the fact

00:06:10.960 that government is acing them out of choice acing them out of consumer choice by attempting to force

00:06:17.200 them in Western Europe and here force people to buy EVs only there's quite a rebellion against that among

00:06:23.560 people turns out the clients buying them are the wealthiest communities in the country tend to be

00:06:28.980 democrat communities tend to be the wealthiest 10 percent have something like 40 percent of the demand

00:06:33.740 for these so overall you're also looking at a supply chain that the Chinese totally control to make them

00:06:40.420 the electric motors the EV the batteries themselves the lithium ion the copper the cobalt the motors and

00:06:47.560 the rest of the apparatus in the vehicle they control 100 percent of the supply chain for these vehicles

00:06:52.580 therefore they want to make them end-to-end in time in time they'll render Tesla irrelevant because

00:07:00.060 their goal and objective is to take over car making also they've we'll talk later they've basically begun to

00:07:05.960 take over effectively power generation equipment manufacturer for North America they've taken over

00:07:12.680 75 percent of the announced megawatt supply of equipment to make electricity and about 43 percent of the

00:07:19.780 monetary value of that a business they weren't even in here only five years ago primary power generating

00:07:26.840 equipment that's a business I had been in in my life's work just amazingly rapid pace with which they're

00:07:32.680 taking over basic commodity electricity now also in addition to cars

00:07:37.380 that they realize that the the future of the world is electric I mean you got this you get and they need

00:07:45.080 electrical power data centers uh you know the artificial intelligence Joe Allen is going to join us a

00:07:50.680 minute has been making the case that the energy needs the water needs for this in a in a digital world in an

00:07:57.640 artificial intelligence world is is so enormous given where we are today does the Chinese because

00:08:04.140 they mouth climate change I mean you know one of the things carrying these guys talking about we can't

00:08:09.840 put tariffs on we can't do the decoupling we did in the in the um Trump uh administration we can't

00:08:17.740 confront the CCP people know that I've been fully sanctioned by the Chinese Communist Party in every

00:08:22.000 aspect uh is the first civilian in American history and I wear that proudly uh and but the

00:08:27.660 John carries the world and the Bidens and the and the Yellens got a kowtow because the number one thing

00:08:33.500 is not avoiding a kinetic war the number one thing is that we need them to work as partners uh to make

00:08:40.040 sure climate change uh doesn't doesn't hit us yet everything they do every aspect of the business

00:08:46.380 their business model is to hell with climate change to hell with anything about what the West is

00:08:52.360 concerned about in this kind of cult of climate change it's about getting down to the brass tacks

00:08:57.320 of how they dominate electrical production uh on on a global basis and particularly have as much

00:09:03.480 cheap energy as possible not just for consumers but for their industrial power Dave Walsh

00:09:09.780 they understand deeply manufacturing anything from basic steel making to specially steel making

00:09:16.280 to plastics to composites to lithium ion batteries to cars pulp and paper anything any kind of

00:09:22.860 manufacturing is heavily heavily heavily electrical electrically powered dependent it's been for

00:09:29.680 forever that that's been the case since electricity was distributed in mass quantities beginning in

00:09:34.800 1890 they understand this deeply they have managed to talk us out of it with duplicitous stories of

00:09:41.560 climate change of we need to be on the co2 abatement we need to be on that zero

00:09:46.180 we've bought into this we're destabilizing our economy and what they've even in the news media

00:09:52.760 here today announced that in the last year we've had a 92 gigawatt swing 20 more gigawatts of

00:09:58.700 baseload continuous duty coal shut down over here in western europe while china has put in capacity

00:10:04.560 72 more gigawatts of it just to give you a reference how meaningful that is 72 gigawatts is the size of

00:10:10.740 energy and southern company combined all power generation of those two large utilities in the

00:10:17.020 u.s that combined is 72 gigawatts that's what they've built just in the last year in coal plants and then

00:10:24.660 they've got 243 under permit and beginning construction for the next four years more coal plants so he's he's

00:10:32.220 boosting up coal power production it is cleaner it's it's ultra super critical technology that was

00:10:37.800 originally invented here germany and japan that they're using but this is the primary engine of

00:10:43.560 their industrial economy to compete and knowing that ai and server centers and data centers must can

00:10:50.020 only be run on 24 hour a day huge quantities of electricity not four or five hour a day solar

00:10:57.840 or seven hour a day wind must be run on continuous electricity hit hit hit back hit me back again with

00:11:05.260 that because this is the future that uh that when you take the energy side that dave walsh walks you

00:11:12.560 through and you take the demand side that uh and not the consumer man but the inner the interim demand

00:11:21.080 of the data centers of artificial intelligence that joe allen walks you through this is why you have

00:11:27.260 such a huge gap between what in the u.s they're talking about in a post-industrial economy because

00:11:35.060 a post-industrial economy note to self doesn't mean less power that you need it means more power that you

00:11:46.060 need and when you look at this call to climate change what they're talking about here in western

00:11:52.020 europe and particularly in germany it's the most bizarre thing i've ever seen because they're

00:11:57.120 sitting there talking about this transition and this transition it's not happening and it's not

00:12:01.980 going to happen it's it's it's bizarro land given what they've laid out already is going to be the

00:12:08.860 man side of the equation the people that have a hard-hitted approach to this is our number one

00:12:13.380 existential threat the chinese communist party they are very coldly and with a lot of calculation

00:12:19.340 uh and i think they're a big part in back of working with these groups in back of the

00:12:24.280 misinformation and disinformation about the whole climate change uh you know the underpinnings

00:12:30.220 predicate of climate change to begin with because you see two industrial societies go in in radical

00:12:37.280 different directions in one whether you like it or not has an internal logic to it that builds for a

00:12:45.080 not just manufacturing superpower but a post-industrial economy the digit that on the digital demands for

00:12:51.880 electricity will be there and you have because it's not just coal-fired plants they're also building

00:12:57.000 every nuclear power plant you could possibly build and here in the west we're doing the exact opposite

00:13:03.060 it's gutting our economy and these are the types of things you can't turn this ship around quickly

00:13:09.100 you're making these decisions every day today that literally are going to lead us down a path of

00:13:15.780 economic destruction full economic destruction and even if a trump comes in it's not simple to put the

00:13:22.500 rudder over to the right and turn this around dave walsh he completely understands what he's doing

00:13:29.680 and it's done with duplicitous language that here we would call and do call lying i mean he's talked about

00:13:36.660 xi jinping oh we're going to begin strictly controlling consumption of coal by 2025 and by

00:13:42.380 2030 we're going to begin to scale back maybe 30 gigawatts of it well what he's talking about are the very old

00:13:48.440 plants that aren't scrubbed that aren't supercritical that are quite dirty

00:13:51.780 beginning to phase those out for the newer ones that are all for supercritical high temperature

00:13:56.600 much more efficient coal plants that are much cleaner by the way there is such a thing as clean coal

00:14:01.580 it's done at very high temperatures japan has lots of it is investing in lots of it

00:14:06.060 china is primarily investing in that over the next five years

00:14:09.320 knowing that he as long as he panders climate change is important over here he's selling us

00:14:15.600 products he's selling us all the thin film pv 87 of the world supply of it all the inverters

00:14:22.500 now many many uh 30 of the transformers and all of the lithium ion batteries for utility storage

00:14:29.760 all comes now from china so he's pandering a sales pitch that which they're not doing themselves

00:14:35.980 because to be the dominant manufacturer of these things you've got to have continuous duty ongoing

00:14:42.620 power which is what he's building in coal plants and now gas plants because they've taken over about

00:14:48.440 50 percent of ensoldo energia gas turbine company to bring more gas turbine technology into china to begin to

00:14:55.040 build gas plants leveraging off the pipelines he's getting from russia and now iran for gas this all

00:15:01.580 now solve their gas problem that's going to be more fossil fuel which for china is a good and prudent thing

00:15:07.440 to do to buttress their already huge manufacturing sector they know exactly what they're doing and by

00:15:14.400 talking us out of using electricity that's needed to compete with them that this is this is happening

00:15:21.200 it's it's amazing we're going to need we're going to need a lot of strength in a new administration

00:15:26.440 that really understands these things i'm not sure regulators attorneys just with that background

00:15:31.360 yeah a lot of former government experience only i'm not sure that gets us there we need people

00:15:35.680 that really understand the basics of all of this how this fits together and what's happening to us

00:15:40.800 concurrently this is a this is now a disaster i'm not sure attorneys are going to work away out of it

00:15:46.020 no matter whether they have prior experience or not in this i i think you know we've got to have folks

00:15:51.140 that understand this stuff well to be to be looking after how to manage this and bring back industrial

00:15:56.860 strength to this country i uh my investment banker days at goldman sachs and my own firm for i don't know

00:16:04.460 20 25 years uh i can give you some empirical evidence i don't remember many and there may be one or two

00:16:11.660 uh major industrial concerns that employed 50 000 75 000 100 000 people that would announce 10

00:16:21.260 layoffs globally that businesses were not in a massive nosedive and of what eventually happened

00:16:28.680 is that a major restructuring went on that business i know we're not here to give financial advice but

00:16:33.460 just objectively as you look at it this uh announcement today came as a shock to people i mean

00:16:40.220 people saw the demand but there's something there's something uh and i've said this long and people

00:16:45.820 know i'm a critic of elon musk but there's been something wrong with this company for a long time

00:16:50.580 uh and we're not here to give financial advice but as you look at this and it's not just demand but

00:16:56.300 you look at the entire sector the electric vehicle uh market is in for some turbulence i think you could

00:17:02.440 say dave walsh your thoughts yeah caveat i'm not a financial advisor i will say though about a business

00:17:09.100 model where you're dependent on one country for about sixty percent of your supply chain and of the

00:17:16.460 massively critical elements the two electric motors and the the ev battery itself being about sixty

00:17:23.660 percent of the content of that which you're manufacturing that is coming from your dominant

00:17:28.860 competitor who already produce nine times more than you of the whole device end to end that you're

00:17:35.340 competing with them on i that does not augur well for a long-term business plan dependence on your

00:17:41.900 primary competitor for sixty percent of the componentry of that thing you're making in this

00:17:47.500 market and where they make nine times more of that thing you're making than you do already and they

00:17:53.420 serve a home market that's about four times bigger than the one here none of this augurs well for any

00:17:58.620 business plan for ev manufacturer over here uh then you go to okay why do we need it does does toyota

00:18:05.580 not have a better mousetrap with um with hybrids uh that are half the cost proven technology that

00:18:12.860 they're very focused on maybe let's look at that as in opposition to standardizing on what the chinese

00:18:19.900 want us to total dependence on them not just for batteries but the cars that they're in also that's

00:18:25.660 where they're headed and now based on their sheer size they'll win that game with him they'll win

00:18:29.820 it so again not a financial advisor but i that this is a it is a very troubled business model

00:18:35.500 very trouble the entire dependence on china for the critical components of what he's doing

00:18:41.820 dave walsh uh thank you so much where do people go to get uh your social media we'll spend a lot more

00:18:46.940 time because energy is going to be central to the run-up to the november election because you can't

00:18:52.460 get this economy sorted until you get the energy the full spectrum energy dominance that president

00:18:57.420 trump had uh where do people go uh where do people go to get your uh social media well thank you steve

00:19:03.500 on the getter and true social at dave walsh energy thank you d thank you so much um joe allen we're

00:19:13.500 gonna have we're gonna play in the i think we'll have it ready in the next sector maybe here in a minute

00:19:18.300 but i want to just go back to elon musk uh and i'm not here to uh to um spike the football to the

00:19:25.660 fanboys but it's central to his um his um rise in the fanboys uh you know minds and kind of the

00:19:36.540 consciousness was he's such a great businessman the he was the henry ford of electric vehicles

00:19:42.940 this has been a catastrophic announcement today because it shows you how i think he got played by

00:19:48.380 the chinese communist party and he kowtows to them they're they're his paymasters but that this

00:19:53.180 business model the stock's gotten crushed i think the stock's lost a trillion dollars in value since

00:19:57.500 its peak uh as he bought twitter and other things and i realized darren beady and some of my dearest

00:20:02.780 friends and colleagues are are high in the fanboy uh realm but with everything else like if you see what

00:20:09.420 he bragged about what he said about tesla and now you see the catastrophe tesla has lay off 10 of

00:20:14.780 their workforce in one day and talk about having a major you know industrial restructuring it doesn't

00:20:20.380 make you too that doesn't it shouldn't make you too happy about where the chips where his chips in

00:20:25.340 the brains are i realize it's all been great today it all been great i'm not sure how much the media

00:20:29.980 is really putting scrutiny on but just your thoughts before we go to kara swisher who is kind of the

00:20:35.180 the journalist the leading journalist that covers our sociopathic overlords uh and elon must be in

00:20:42.220 number one your thoughts you know steve the the kind of spectrum between the ai is everything ai is

00:20:50.780 nothing or uh the brain chips are everything brain chips are nothing or electric vehicles are everything

00:20:56.460 you know the hype spectrum is always going to be somewhere uh along that and with all of elon

00:21:04.140 musk's projects you hear from the the fanboys and from elon musk himself that this is going to be

00:21:09.500 everything this is kind of the way in which the tech sector in the us and across the world works in

00:21:15.580 general right you have to kind of sell yourself as being the ultimate revolution it will change

00:21:21.660 everything and then you have the detractors no no no it's nothing it's nothing's going to happen

00:21:25.340 whatsoever ai doesn't exist blah blah blah they'll never perfect a brain chip blah blah blah

00:21:29.660 it's always going to be in between and so you know musk is well known for over promising on

00:21:37.500 everything right like the fully autonomous vehicles were right around the corner for years now uh kind

00:21:43.660 of like uh very similar to the flying car situation so i always try to find some place in the middle

00:21:51.660 where is it actually at and where is it going to go where it's at is fairly easy to evaluate uh but

00:21:58.300 where it's going to go isn't so musk with his all of his enthusiasm and all of his uh kind of i think

00:22:04.860 in some ways underhanded techniques to uh you know reassure the shareholders that their their money is

00:22:11.500 being well spent that uh he always over promises and so in this case you can see the fruits of it you

00:22:18.620 can see it in a very practical way what is it some fourteen thousand ten percent fourteen thousand

00:22:23.900 tesla employees that are hitting the sidewalk right now uh some people would say that's just

00:22:28.700 great business he's downsizing well you know uh expanding the business to that point wasn't and so

00:22:35.660 and the loss in stock prices also show i think a great miscalculation that's why i think steve you

00:22:41.660 know everything from the the big big picture of the singularity to even small things like if you enter

00:22:48.060 integrate ai into your education or into your hospital uh or into your military it's going to put

00:22:53.500 you ahead of all your competitors it's going to fix everything um it's always going to be somewhere

00:22:57.820 in between the absolute naysayers and the people who are just doe-eyed optimists and that that's what i

00:23:03.900 see in this just a reality check by the way for the masters tournament over the weekend for the the c

00:23:11.100 because they played to the ceo's market with uh ibm and mercedes everything virtually every spot over

00:23:19.100 the weekend was all about artificial intelligence to coming into these businesses if you don't think

00:23:23.900 it's in the c-suite that's all they're thinking about you would be incorrect one thing we've had

00:23:28.060 dave walsh on and you've mentioned it for the post digital for the post-industrial economy the digital

00:23:33.420 economy they've made this thing it's all being sweetness and light you know all going to have green

00:23:38.140 fields and green pastures and we'll have this digital connection they don't talk about the underbelly

00:23:43.180 that the underside of that the power necessary to do that is orders of magnitude higher than the

00:23:49.980 powers that we need for steel plants etc the the water needs and the power needs for artificial

00:23:56.940 intelligence for the data centers is of order it's just it's mind-boggling and you never hear that

00:24:03.340 brought up in the connection with climate change because climate change is kind of their religion

00:24:08.140 and part of the way they're going to get there is through artificial intelligence why does the

00:24:13.020 media overlook that why do hard-headed business people don't talk about that because that that

00:24:17.980 difference that delta is going to have major implications massive implications for this country

00:24:24.940 the citizens and quite frankly the people in the world joe allen yeah i think that a lot of

00:24:30.300 it is just a conflict of interest so you have the the issue that you want most of these media

00:24:35.820 companies very reliant on big tech either for access or for advertising uh and many of the people in

00:24:43.260 the media are actually quite on board with this sort of total transformation of humanity it's the

00:24:49.020 ultimate progressivism so and but then there's also just the the one of the solutions to climate

00:24:55.900 change that's put forward a lot you hear this a lot in the world economic forum policy proposals

00:25:01.020 is to use artificial intelligence to rake over all of the data that's being gathered from the

00:25:05.740 internet of things to understand exactly down to the the smallest detail to understand exactly how

00:25:12.540 much energy is being used per household per business per vehicle so on and so forth and use ai to identify

00:25:19.500 those areas where more electricity is being used right so ai is now set up as the savior from climate

00:25:26.300 change we'll use ai to streamline the economy and streamline people's lives but as you say you have

00:25:32.700 to use a ton of electricity in order to train any large model uh you know i really got my head wrapped

00:25:40.700 around this i reviewed kate crawford's book the atlas of ai a couple of years ago for chronicles and

00:25:47.020 it's only become more and more pronounced since then but she lays out in great detail how not only do

00:25:52.860 these data centers use massive amounts of energy so for instance uh gpt4 nobody knows for sure but

00:26:00.300 gpt4 from open ai used roughly 0.02 percent of all of california's uh power usage to train gpt4 i mean

00:26:11.340 that may say that sounds like a small fraction but when you consider the size of the state and the scale of

00:26:16.380 that project it's amazing and it's only going to become more and more ravenous and crawford points

00:26:22.380 out that that it's using up tons of power but also they are strip mining the planet for the minerals

00:26:28.140 those are really damning facts uh joe just hang on we're getting to kara swisher

00:26:35.660 and our sociopathic overlords uh it's revolt against uh against maga uh in a minute birchgold.com

00:26:42.540 in a time of turbulence gold has been a hedge for 8 000 years of man's recorded history birchgold.com

00:26:50.140 slash bannon you get the end of the dollar empire for free but you can also talk to phil patrick and

00:26:55.420 the team call them today get online and get in touch with them today birchgold.com

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00:33:01.500 got this monthly newsletter called strategic intelligence you can go to records war room

00:33:07.100 that's all one word records war room.com and go check it out get a special deal on uh on his letter

00:33:13.900 newsletter strategic intelligence got the capital markets everything about international finance

00:33:18.620 national security and geopolitics okay check it out kara swisher uh joins our isaac arnsdorf joins her

00:33:26.460 on his her podcast a very influential podcast for the people that joe allen covers every day our

00:33:32.460 sociopathic overlords from silicon valley they fear and what they fear is the war room posse they fear

00:33:40.140 the little guy let's go ahead and cut in we'll watch we'll listen to a little bit of this and then joe

00:33:43.980 and i will come back isaac arnsdorf is a national political reporter for the washington post and

00:33:50.060 author of finish what we started the mega movement's ground war to end democracy isaac welcome thanks so

00:33:56.300 much for having me cara earlier this week we talked about these issues around dictatorships with ruth

00:34:00.540 ben giott um and i were you're our follow you're our follow because we thought it was important

00:34:06.060 um and it's a topic i'm thinking about a lot especially because i'm thinking about steve bannon almost

00:34:10.140 continually um who you write about a lot and i which i appreciate for people to understand how

00:34:15.500 important he is and all this um but this is a book where for once donald trump is not the main

00:34:20.060 character as i said it's about maga as a movement talk about why you wanted to dig into it and why you

00:34:25.820 made steve bannon such a big character it's absolutely correct to do so but talk about that

00:34:31.260 well thank you yeah it's um the book is kind of like a a search to discover trump anew i mean he shows

00:34:37.820 up at the very beginning and then we see people kind of hearing him and trying to contact him but

00:34:44.620 we don't actually meet him until the very end and you know part of that was just like you know what

00:34:51.260 else is there to say about the most famous person in modern human history but part of it is also like

00:34:57.260 you know i started the reporting at a time when trump was was actually out of the picture right this

00:35:02.220 was early to mid 2021 he was basically in hibernation at mar-a-lago and it was actually

00:35:09.180 the movement um it was his supporters as harnessed and guided by bannon who through their activism at

00:35:18.300 the ground level paved the way for trump to make this comeback it was not at all clear or inevitable

00:35:24.780 that we would be where we are now right you know bannon is you know i think of him as a marketer

00:35:29.180 in a lot of ways i pay a lot of attention he says because he's quite brilliant on communications

00:35:32.860 marketing and he has a media background for people who don't know it he was part of a lot of weird

00:35:37.820 things too including the biosphere he's a long-time media executive he's a little roger ailes in that

00:35:42.380 way so let's talk about a couple of things you interviewed him several times over the last few

00:35:46.540 years um you write he believes that the mega movement could quote represent represented a dominant

00:35:51.660 coalition that could rule for a hundred years um sounds very third reich in that regard and i

00:35:57.420 recently interviewed uh tim ryback about how hitler did a similar kind of revival of himself um talk

00:36:04.940 about bannon's role here and his and and especially before and after january 6 because he's got his own

00:36:10.780 legal problems obviously which he he has tried to squirrel out of yeah well you know there was the the

00:36:17.740 first indictment for the fundraising uh for the wall that uh he and the other people involved were

00:36:22.620 actually spending on themselves allegedly um but trump trump helped him out with pardoning him for

00:36:27.740 that and that actually really helped him you know in that moment right after january 6th when you know

00:36:33.980 again trump sort of disappeared and um a lot of pro-trump voices were disappearing from we're getting

00:36:41.100 deplatformed from from mainstream social media and and weren't getting a lot of mainstream news interviews

00:36:46.780 either um that really kind of supercharged the development of this alternative ecosystem of

00:36:52.460 mega media and bannon really became the the stop the son of that solar system and it helped that he

00:37:00.780 you know had the validation of that trump pardon but but you're also right to think about bannon you

00:37:06.620 know really the the weird period for bannon was when he was a white house or campaign strategist i mean

00:37:12.300 he came on through breitbart he came on as a media figure and so there's something very natural about

00:37:17.340 him as this outsider media figure actually yeah one might compare him to goebbels honestly you would

00:37:22.940 in a lot of ways but also brilliant the way i hate to compliment goebbels but he was brilliant

00:37:28.140 in terms of selling hitler um talk a little bit about you know what is his role what is his role has

00:37:34.300 developed he obviously was on the outs and then he was in trouble legally and then he came back after the

00:37:39.420 pardon uh he has his show the war room um uh i spent a lot of time focused on steve bannon i have to

00:37:45.420 tell you um uh myself talk about what what would you say you called him the son how would you explain

00:37:52.060 that a little further well actually i literally just came here from the war room before this i was doing

00:37:56.940 an interview on his show uh we're neighbors on capitol hill so uh you know i've just gone through the

00:38:02.300 looking glass and and back out but you know about your book yeah exactly um okay because you know

00:38:08.620 it's it's kind of their story um but but the case for their story not being you know when when i first

00:38:14.620 heard about that bannon was telling trump supporters that they needed to go become low-level officials in

00:38:21.580 the republican party you know it's sort of like okay well down ballot but there's a lot of there's a lot of

00:38:26.860 stuff that that people talk about online and what matters is does it actually cross over into a real

00:38:32.780 physical political action and what what became amazing to me about this story is that it was is

00:38:37.740 that i would call around to local party offices all over the country but focusing on the key states

00:38:43.740 and say like are people coming out of the woodwork to be precinct chairs which is like a nothing

00:38:49.420 position that no one's ever heard of and the answer was yes and so that's when i knew that that that

00:38:55.260 is actually the power of bannon is that what happens on his show doesn't stay on his show it actually

00:39:01.820 uh it actually crosses over into action and he's very intentional about that the the what he he is

00:39:08.140 trying to give his listeners a feeling of empowerment and agency and particularly in that particular time

00:39:18.060 after january 6th when when many trump supporters were so confused and disillusioned and disoriented

00:39:24.060 about what happened that guidance was crucial how do you assess him as a person like you were on the

00:39:29.740 show obviously i wouldn't say you're friendly with him but you know him and spend time with him

00:39:34.220 how do you assess him as as a power figure he's very smart um he really does read i mean he he reads

00:39:42.780 voraciously um and you know i kind of there are times when i feel like it's steve bannon's world and

00:39:51.020 and the rest of us are just living in it that he he does understand like a he is he is a generational

00:39:58.060 talent as a political strategist in kind of understanding the both understanding the mood of

00:40:05.340 at least a part of the population and understanding how to channel that into meaningful political action

00:40:10.620 uh nice to meet you this guy is such an interesting character what do you think his end game is when

00:40:16.540 he i don't know if he's married or when he's with people we trust you know he's not a young man and

00:40:23.260 they say what is your end game here like what are your goals what do you want to accomplish if you were

00:40:28.620 to try and look into his soul or his head what do you what do you think the end game is for steve bannon

00:40:35.340 well there there was a point in the reporting where he said very explicitly to me um i'm not in

00:40:41.180 the rebuilding business i'm in the tearing down business right so he he he views the the he views

00:40:47.660 history as a cycle of of building up and tearing down and he wants to be an active agent of that tearing

00:40:55.660 down and so that something new can be rebuilt and what he has in mind is is rebuilt is redefining

00:41:03.260 the two-party system so instead of having two national pluralistic parties you'll have a left-wing

00:41:09.420 globalist elitist party and a right-wing populist nationalist party and he thinks that's a rubric for

00:41:16.060 the nationalist party to dominate right of course he's using the word nationalist which has its

00:41:20.540 recriminations of that um do you so he doesn't want to be there he just wants to he wants to you

00:41:26.060 know i always say some people just want to burn down the world and that they you know they're like

00:41:29.980 they want to change it i'm like no no no they want to burn it down for the next thing kind of thing

00:41:34.460 how does he react to that idea that people are kind of onto him on that thing i don't think he cares

00:41:39.500 right correct because he'll talk he talks to you right he was very i wrote him once he wrote me back

00:41:43.820 in five seconds it was really something to see right and you don't usually get that from figures

00:41:48.220 because he's got his finger he knows who everybody is correct yeah but as you know as a media figure he

00:41:54.380 appreciates the the importance of media you know he's not one of these people around trump who

00:42:01.740 or like ron desantis who like really believe we make stuff up um and we're the enemy um he's much

00:42:07.500 more like trump in the sense that he is is dying to use us uh for his his purposes you know he is

00:42:14.860 unapologetic about using terms like nationalism and nationalism is a hell of a drug but he is a little

00:42:21.820 bit sensitive about and we got into this a little bit on the air just now he is a little bit sensitive

00:42:28.220 about this idea of ending democracy um and he points out accurately that um that this precinct

00:42:36.380 strategy what the trump supporters are doing is using the machinery of democracy to try to achieve

00:42:43.580 their political objective now but it's important to understand that democracy often ends not at the

00:42:50.300 end of a rifle but at the hands of its elected leaders democracy the hello this is precisely what

00:42:55.740 the tim ryback's book is about it's the that hitler used democracy to end democracy that's that's the

00:43:00.940 that's the old i mean that's this nonsense what he's saying to you anyway scott go ahead

00:43:05.740 what role is he playing in the election for 2024 uh from what i understand he is you know he is not

00:43:13.100 the uh the care campaign ceo like he was in 2016 um he is not frequently in touch with trump himself

00:43:21.900 um like other advisors he is in touch with some members of trump's team on a fairly regular basis

00:43:29.420 um but it's helpful to to trump to have that little bit of kind of critical and plausible distance while at

00:43:38.540 the same time you have bannon kind of as a laboratory for developing the movement that fuels trump

00:43:46.220 mm-hmm and and in terms of of uh i would imagine you know one of the things he called trump was his

00:43:51.820 his instrument right that he when he saw him coming down the the elevator escalator at the trump tower

00:43:58.540 he thinks he i think it feels like he thinks trump is not dumb but that he's just the instrument

00:44:04.380 to getting what he wants correct well he thinks that trump viscerally understands the aesthetics

00:44:11.580 of power and how to make himself a vehicle a vessel for the grievances and desires of a lot of americans

00:44:21.900 and and trump has the charisma and the fame and the stature to do that um but bannon is is and bannon and

00:44:30.700 trump have slightly different goals you know everything for trump is about himself and when

00:44:35.900 when when when bannon describes him as his instrument what he's talking about is trying to channel the

00:44:43.260 movement into an institution of the party where it can transcend the limits of being a cult of

00:44:52.780 personality around a single leader and actually achieve the durability through the party structure

00:44:59.740 that it would need to be a hundred year regime yeah that's why it's not going to work just fyi

00:45:05.980 anyway um it's it's been a busy week for donald trump and his legal team trying to put a stop to the

00:45:11.580 hush money trial it's not working it's slated to begin next week he loves to do those delay tactics um

00:45:16.620 i know you've been following all that i just would love you to talk about um the trump legal issues

00:45:21.020 helping him with these maga supporters that you've been chronicling yeah so there were there is an amazing

00:45:25.180 moment where i jump in for a second we want to get to all this also uh right there and it's one of the

00:45:31.260 reasons um joe that you came on as our editor for all things transhumanism the um the silicon valley

00:45:39.740 are sociopathic overlords and kara swisher is you know she's editor of new york magazine she's got this

00:45:45.100 huge podcast all of the um the people that lead silicon valley come on her podcast they're there

00:45:52.780 she's very familiar with the business models the elon musk uh the uh the facebook crowd google all of it

00:45:59.100 uh and you see right there what and she said well it's not going to work kara i respectfully disagree

00:46:06.460 not only is it going to work it is working what we're building is a grassroots populist

00:46:12.220 nationalist movement to fundamentally change the direction of the country and one of the most

00:46:16.700 fundamental changes is we're going to stop the abuses of working class people with this late

00:46:23.660 stage finance capitalism and what we're not going to allow to do is to allow the sociopathic overlords

00:46:29.980 that you interview all the time to run this country as they do we're not going to let uh people

00:46:35.260 that are either close to being on the spectrum or just total geeks to run this nation the people in

00:46:41.260 this country working class in the middle class in this country are taking their country back

00:46:45.660 and they're going to run it and whether you guys like it or not it is not just going to happen

00:46:51.100 it is happening and that's one of the powers i think of the book because the book gives an

00:46:54.860 unvarnished opinion it's not all sweetness and light there's a lot of characters and remember

00:46:59.100 they're obsessed with the fact that they're the pro-democracy party but that we are actually

00:47:04.460 participating in the in the precinct strategy and taking over the school boards and taking over your local town

00:47:09.740 council and in taking now the national convention where you're all going to be delegates you use

00:47:15.500 you're you're participating in democracy like edmund burke would like but of course that's not good

00:47:20.060 enough because donald trump's hitler and what you're going to do is elect hitler with a massive landslide

00:47:25.500 and he's going to run the country uh joe you see this all the time in transhumanism uh they try to

00:47:30.540 hide all that too of what they're trying to do because in this in the political sphere of what we're

00:47:35.980 trying to do it's overlaid with what silicon valley is really working on which is a fundamental

00:47:40.700 transformation of uh of homo sapiens in essentially human nature of which we're fighting your your

00:47:47.820 thoughts right there is you can smell the fear coming out of silicon valley about our populist

00:47:52.940 movement sir you know listening to that conversation just sounds like every conversation i've ever had

00:47:59.500 with the kind of cosmopolitan sophisticated types uh in university or just living in big cities uh they

00:48:08.540 are i guess very talented at critiquing their enemies with almost zero self-awareness you know just

00:48:16.780 listening to he's like well god forbid americans were to actually you know take the reins and determine

00:48:24.940 their own destiny but people like them i i i think that you know just to bring in a crass south park

00:48:32.780 uh reference they are so intoxicated smelling the uh smug that they are uh emitting around them that

00:48:40.620 they just can't they can't see the forest with the trees so that you know relating it to the the

00:48:45.580 technological element what you what i hear a lot from these people there are a lot of leftists actually

00:48:53.020 who are very very opposed to silicon valley and and the ideas of transhumanism but in the mainstream

00:48:59.340 not so much and i think it's because transhumanism represents just an extension of the progressivism

00:49:05.260 and the hyper focus on intelligence and credentials and the the kind of intellectual

00:49:11.500 structure that they believe should be running the country that a technocracy a rule by experts and so

00:49:18.140 you the the the carish swishers of the world or ezra klein so on and so forth but whatever critiques

00:49:23.900 they may offer uh they still see technology as a a means of enacting this sort of liberal left uh oftentimes

00:49:34.060 super multicultural you know the mass immigration the various kind of sexual deviances that they endorse

00:49:40.940 all of this they see technology as a means of inculcating that in the rest of the populace

00:49:46.540 as a sort of backwards rubes and flyover country and the but on the other hand i think a lot of

00:49:52.700 them certainly some of them by their own admission i also see this massive transformation as being also

00:49:58.620 in line not just a vehicle for the more social and economic agendas that they want but as we move

00:50:06.060 more and more into a world in which these companies are implementing ai and and using it to actually

00:50:12.940 transform the psychology of the world even beyond their own left liberal framework uh they see it

00:50:18.860 as an extension of that it's the next level progressivism uh you know of course we have

00:50:23.100 plenty on our side as we mention it all the time the peter teals the mark andreessen so on and so forth

00:50:28.140 who see a very right-wing uh way of enacting the technological agenda but yeah yeah i i'll say this

00:50:36.700 steve in closing um uh i can't imagine these people uh are are getting paid by you but they

00:50:43.020 just gave you a phenomenal advertisement so uh you know thank you kara swisher we appreciate it

00:50:51.340 uh joe where do people get your writings uh you're gonna be with us on thursday out in las vegas we

00:50:56.620 can't have a gladiator school unless we talk about the one of the main things that would be transhumanism

00:51:02.780 where do people go sir i encourage you to pick up the book anywhere books are sold bookshop.org

00:51:09.580 amazon with the palm payment uh or canonic.xyz dark eon transhumanism and the war against humanity

00:51:17.980 maybe kara swisher will pick up a copy and see maybe what some of the underlying ideologies are

00:51:23.420 that she is backing find all my social media at joe bot xyz and of course war room.org under the

00:51:30.220 transhumanism tab thank you very much steve uh thank you joe by the way thank kara swisher

00:51:36.140 actually i do listen to the podcast all the time it's what we try to do is immerse ourselves

00:51:41.420 in many different voices you just can't listen to your own side that's one of the reasons we start

00:51:44.940 every day normally with cuts from msnbc and an information war you have to know the battlefield

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Bannon's War Room - April 15, 2024

WarRoom Battleground EP 514： Gutting The American Economy

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