Bannon's War Room - WarRoom Battleground EP 777： President Trump's Whole Presidency Is At Risk Due To The Deep State

00:00:00.000 This is the primal scream of a dying regime.

00:00:07.700 Pray for our enemies, because we're going medieval on these people.

00:00:12.940 Here's one time I got a free shot at all these networks lying about the people.

00:00:17.200 The people have had a belly full of it.

00:00:19.120 I know you don't like hearing that.

00:00:20.560 I know you try to do everything in the world to stop that, but you're not going to stop it.

00:00:23.240 It's going to happen.

00:00:24.500 And where do people like that go to share the big lie?

00:00:27.900 Mega Media.

00:00:28.820 I wish in my soul, I wish that any of these people had a conscience.

00:00:34.700 Ask yourself, what is my task and what is my purpose?

00:00:38.440 If that answer is to save my country, this country will be saved.

00:00:44.840 War Room. Here's your host, Stephen K. Bannon.

00:00:52.340 Okay, Wednesday, 28 May, Year of Alert, 2025.

00:00:55.320 Thank you for sticking around for the second hour of our late afternoon, early evening edition of the War Room.

00:01:01.940 So much going on all day.

00:01:03.880 Just insanely good content shows with top people, because there's so much going on.

00:01:11.520 It's – and Ben Harner was going to join me.

00:01:14.140 Ben, I just sent you a text message.

00:01:17.400 If you can please read this tweet, I want to bring you in right afterwards, because I think it reinforces my theory of the case from this morning.

00:01:26.360 We had so much going on that we've asked Ben to join us in the 6 o'clock hour to give us his perspective as our international editor out of Rome.

00:01:35.920 One of my great fears – by the way, Dave Brat is going to join us as soon as we get him up here in a moment.

00:01:41.140 And we're going to be talking about the situation in – with Peter Navarro put this magnificent – something we've been calling for.

00:01:50.640 In fact, I think some of it is off some of the analysis that we've been putting out that you've got to look at the big, beautiful bill.

00:01:56.400 It's part of whole cloth of what's going on with what else President Trump's got to do, and you've got to add those numbers.

00:02:03.000 But I also want Dave Brat to comment on this geopolitical situation.

00:02:08.620 Ben, here's my concern, is that we had Mark Mitchell on this morning, and Mark Mitchell Rasmussen goes through these amazing numbers of President Trump,

00:02:16.420 where the American people now think the country's on the right track, and this is coming off of his Middle East trip,

00:02:21.120 that people now are supporting Trump probably more than ever between an election day.

00:02:27.800 And yet we're inexorably drawn in, and this is – over this weekend, and I drilled down on this thing pretty thoroughly,

00:02:35.240 we are being drawn in more and more into the kinetic war.

00:02:38.880 The President Trump has made his number one priority to actually have people put their guns down and let's get to a deal.

00:02:45.560 We're inexorably drawn into this moment by moment.

00:02:49.180 One part of it is that the Americans' weapons manufacturers have used Ukraine as a lab in these drone strikes, which are very serious.

00:02:56.320 And if you don't believe me, maybe I can play the Alex Jones clip either late in the show tomorrow.

00:03:01.140 Alex does a great job of walking through how there was a significant assassination attempt on Putin by a – basically an attack, I think, of 500 Ukrainian drones

00:03:10.740 with essentially American artificial intelligence and target acquisition and fire control solutions.

00:03:16.420 Last night in Moscow, 300 drones got through, I think, of a 500-drone attack and actually attacked the city.

00:03:25.340 The tweet I just gave you is that there's a discussion.

00:03:29.360 Look, you've got all these sites in this war that are false flag sites giving you false information.

00:03:37.280 But they're saying how Russia's had it, and with Mertz kind of driving this, that they're actually having discussions inside the Russian military about targets in Berlin.

00:03:49.260 And this is – my fear is that just like in 1939, this war is expanding.

00:03:56.080 It is not decreasing.

00:03:58.180 Ben Harnwell, from your perspective in Rome, and someone who's been dead spot on in this thing since the evening before the invasion back in, I think, was it February 22?

00:04:08.800 What's your current thoughts?

00:04:10.800 Steve, well, President Trump – good afternoon to you.

00:04:14.680 President Trump put out, I think it was on social media, that President Putin is playing with fire, and that he called him crazy in capital letters.

00:04:26.200 Steve, I have to be honest with you.

00:04:27.580 Look, I will defend President Trump until I'm blue in the face.

00:04:31.660 In every way I can, I will always see how I might take his side in an argument.

00:04:36.160 But I have to say, looking at the facts, I don't think it's President Trump who's playing with fire.

00:04:42.260 I think it's President – I don't think it's President Putin who's playing with fire.

00:04:45.120 It's President Trump who is playing with fire.

00:04:48.180 And with regards to the crazy accusation, I have to be consistent.

00:04:53.620 As an analyst, Steve, coming on the show, I have to be consistent. 0.72

00:04:56.720 I have to say the same thing that I said three years ago when Ursula von der Leyen and President Biden were pushing out this line that President Putin was crazy.

00:05:07.860 And I said – I have to repeat now what I said then.

00:05:10.020 If you guys really think Putin is crazy, this man is armed with nuclear missiles. 0.58

00:05:17.860 Why are you antagonizing him if you think he's crazy?

00:05:21.560 And I have to say the same thing to President Trump.

00:05:23.300 If you think President Putin is crazy, why are you dragging – no, he's not dragging – President Trump is not dragging the United States into this war.

00:05:35.980 He's allowing himself by other actors to be dragged in.

00:05:39.200 And that's worse because it shows that President Trump isn't in control of the narrative here.

00:05:43.860 Let me give the blinding example of how President Trump is not in control of this situation.

00:05:50.220 Two days ago, on Monday, the new Reichskanzler in Germany, in Berlin, Friedrich Mertz, had a press conference.

00:06:00.240 And he stated that – and you mentioned this on the morning show – that Germany, France, the UK and America

00:06:08.400 had now removed all the long-range inhibitions on the long-range missiles that the various countries had provided to Ukraine.

00:06:23.340 That was on Monday.

00:06:24.920 Yesterday, Mertz walked that back ever so slightly, saying actually he was talking about things that had already been happening for the last couple of months.

00:06:33.240 Also, yesterday, I think a friend of yours, Steve, Tammy Bruce, was asked whether she's – you know, does she have a statement to make on Mertz's declaration?

00:06:45.320 And she said, we're not going to be commenting on this.

00:06:47.780 Now, why is this important, folks?

00:06:49.620 Because November last year, Biden – you might remember, I remember this very well – Biden announced that he was removing the distance inhibitions on the ATACMS missiles that he had provided Zelensky with.

00:07:04.560 And I remember there was a specific weekend that I actually thought we were going to possibly see some kind of nuclear exchange.

00:07:10.760 About 30 hours after that, I don't know if Biden walked it back or if he just clarified something that had been misunderstood by the press.

00:07:19.320 But he said, hang on, hang on.

00:07:21.040 When I said that Zelensky could use these ATACMS missiles inside Russia, I was simply referring to the Kursk region conflict.

00:07:32.200 Now, Kursk, as the war impasse will know, is on the borders, on the Russian side of the Ukraine-Russian borders, where Zelensky took the war to Russia.

00:07:41.380 And he said, only there, not deep within Russia, and absolutely not towards Moscow or St. Petersburg or anything like that.

00:07:47.440 Only on that border.

00:07:49.360 The world released a sigh of relief.

00:07:53.480 And that has been the official position, Steve, of the United States since that moment.

00:07:58.360 So what is now happening is that Germany has said that the U.S. has removed its distance inhibitions,

00:08:07.600 its limiting inhibitions on the ATACMS missiles.

00:08:10.840 And the U.S. isn't making a comment.

00:08:12.740 Now, there are two possibilities, Steve, to this.

00:08:15.360 Either Merz is right, and that at some point, presumably from the inauguration to the present date,

00:08:22.960 President Trump has indicated behind the scenes that to Ukraine, that Ukraine might now use those missiles to attack deep within Russian territory.

00:08:33.700 Or Merz has got it wrong.

00:08:35.320 If Merz has got it wrong, I don't understand why Tammy Bruce won't walk it back.

00:08:39.760 If Merz is telling the truth, however, Steve, that's terrifying for a number of reasons.

00:08:44.380 Firstly, firstly, why is President Trump allowing a European leader to announce what the United States policy position is on an issue that could lead to a nuclear element to the kinetic stage of World War III?

00:09:01.000 Point one.

00:09:02.660 Point two, as I said, if Trump is putting out on social media that he thinks Putin is crazy,

00:09:07.920 and as I just said in my introduction, Putin is – Russia is the most nuclear-armed country on the planet.

00:09:17.900 Why are you authorizing Ukraine to use long-distance missiles that could potentially reach Moscow if you think President Putin is crazy?

00:09:29.620 Jim Rickards said this morning, do you agree or disagree?

00:09:34.120 He said, hey, this clearly has the implicit OK by the United States because Tammy Bruce didn't come out and say anything. 1.00

00:09:42.460 And the United States is allowing Merz to say this and going quiet publicly, but they would have had to approve it for Merz ever to include it because Merz said France, UK, and the United States all agreed.

00:09:57.120 They were all given permission to strike inland to Russia.

00:10:01.440 Your thoughts?

00:10:01.960 Look, Steve, I've been involved in politics for 25 years.

00:10:06.940 My first rule of thumb is never underestimate the degree of incompetence that takes place at the highest levels of government.

00:10:15.640 So there could be – the moment I'm leaving space for the possibility that Merz got ahead of himself on this.

00:10:22.600 But I don't understand, you know, Jim Rickards makes the point that right now, tacitly at least,

00:10:28.520 the fact that the United States hasn't walked that back, hasn't explicitly contradicted Germany on this does indicate a sort of degree of permission.

00:10:37.380 But I have a wider question on regards to this, Stephen.

00:10:40.360 Again, for coherence, I have to say exactly what I said when Biden was president.

00:10:47.900 If you are giving Ukraine free reign to use U.S.-provided long-distance missiles to attack deep within Russian territory,

00:11:01.040 you are effectively outsourcing your own role in a war of which you are not formally a part to another country,

00:11:11.040 another country that has the most massive vested interests to drag you into it.

00:11:16.460 Steve, I can't – I can make that point ten times in a row and literally repeat it.

00:11:22.300 It's absolutely terrifying.

00:11:23.720 If President Trump has given this permission to Zelensky, he is allowing Zelensky to dictate whether America is now formally involved in a war with Russia.

00:11:37.900 Let me go to Brett.

00:11:40.120 Brett, polling is out on Lindsey Graham in South Carolina in his re-elect.

00:11:45.540 I think he's got 37 percent approval among Republicans.

00:11:49.340 And as you know, South Carolina is pretty MAGA.

00:11:53.180 Are we following Lindsey Graham's policy in Ukraine right now?

00:11:58.200 Because I say we're getting sucked into this war every second of every day.

00:12:01.520 Or are we following President Trump's?

00:12:03.740 And is it – he downloaded 100 guys out of the NSC because they were all detailees from the deep state. 0.92

00:12:09.320 Is President Trump now overwhelmed by deep staters and really not following the policy that he's advocated from day one?

00:12:18.140 He wants a peace deal.

00:12:19.100 He wants the guns laid down.

00:12:20.600 He wants to stop this nonsense, sir.

00:12:23.700 Yeah, well, I want to know who's around him and who's advising him.

00:12:27.540 And you mentioned Lindsey Graham.

00:12:29.900 And I – you know, Congress is given the unique role to declare war, the War Powers Act.

00:12:36.920 The president has, you know, limited powers in the short run.

00:12:40.080 Where is Congress?

00:12:41.300 You've been on this for years, right?

00:12:44.220 Congress still has not made any definitive statements.

00:12:47.220 It's the Congress or the Senate, the foreign relations committees.

00:12:50.880 The Senate is supposed to be the, you know, the old gray-haired wise men on these matters.

00:12:56.440 And if they make one mistake, they lose their next election.

00:12:59.440 So they're quiet.

00:13:00.820 But it looks like all of President Trump's agenda is at risk here.

00:13:06.000 All of it.

00:13:06.540 The whole thing, all the economic stuff, all the tariff stuff, all goes down in flames if this war lights up, right?

00:13:14.140 And that is the deep state objective.

00:13:17.380 So in my view, everybody –

00:13:18.860 Hang on.

00:13:19.260 Hang on.

00:13:19.740 Slow down.

00:13:20.200 Hang on.

00:13:20.580 Slow down.

00:13:21.040 Slow down.

00:13:21.600 Slow down.

00:13:22.000 Hit pause.

00:13:23.520 Go back and explain that.

00:13:24.700 We had Mark Mitchell on this morning of these unbelievable numbers, not just the MAGA because we love it.

00:13:30.960 But now people are waking up to what he's doing, Middle East, tariffs, the economy, all this.

00:13:36.320 You've got – he's on a roll on so many – we just got the – we're supposed to spend the whole hour on Peter Navarro.

00:13:42.280 We are going to get to it, this incredible piece in the Hill to talk about the economic upside of where we're going.

00:13:48.460 What do you mean it's all in jeopardy?

00:13:51.100 Do you think he loses all of that if we're drawn into this war in Ukraine, which obviously we're being drawn in every second of every day, sir?

00:14:00.100 Yeah, if you just look at any information source, right?

00:14:06.080 I was looking at the conference board today, whoever runs that joint, right?

00:14:10.100 It turns consumer confidence has jumped up spectacularly.

00:14:13.980 You wouldn't know it.

00:14:14.780 And expectations – consumer confidence up 12 points.

00:14:19.120 Expectations on the future is up 17 points.

00:14:22.020 What do you think a war does to those expectations?

00:14:25.280 What do you think a war does to Wall Street, right?

00:14:27.680 They're walking a tightrope right there, right?

00:14:30.260 Trump's throwing spaghetti out there on the wall just brilliantly.

00:14:34.620 And he's searching for that golden sweet spot, that equilibrium between the bond market and economic growth and the big, beautiful bill and monetary policy and geopolitics and the labor force and education and Harvard and all of it, right?

00:14:50.580 And so a war disrupts all of that.

00:14:54.940 A war – the headlines are shot.

00:14:58.480 Nothing trumps existential threat to life, right?

00:15:03.380 And so the team better figure out every lever we have to pull with respect to Russia and pull it immediately, right?

00:15:12.340 Trump's out there sending all the right signals, right?

00:15:15.080 What are you doing, right?

00:15:16.700 I'm not happy.

00:15:19.120 I'm not happy what you're doing over there, buddy.

00:15:21.880 But it needs to go to the next level.

00:15:23.960 Congress and the Senate need to step up to the microphone today and take a little risk on themselves.

00:15:30.400 And you lay out what is the consequence to Russia for these actions, right?

00:15:37.940 But – but hang on.

00:15:41.980 Hang on.

00:15:42.180 Let me get Harnwell in here because, Dave, correct me if I'm wrong.

00:15:45.460 We – this audience turfed out Mitch McConnell as leader two years ago when he had to make or break Ukraine.

00:15:52.220 He sacrificed his time as leader.

00:15:55.240 He knew he was doing this because it's the only way they could try to get this huge bill passed to support Ukraine, which turned out to be an epic fail.

00:16:03.380 But you got so many out-of-control deep state hawks in the Senate that – I don't know if you're going to get it.

00:16:12.120 Ben Harnwell, your thoughts on Brother Brat?

00:16:16.620 Steve, they're not deep – hey, Dave, good afternoon to you too.

00:16:20.160 Steve, they're not deep state hawks.

00:16:22.940 They're deep state snakes. 1.00

00:16:24.560 These people are snakes.

00:16:26.880 To give them the magnificence of referring to them as hawks is slightly misleading.

00:16:32.420 Look, I want to come back to something that Dave mentioned about the Constitution.

00:16:36.800 Just put this to the side about the fact that Congress actually has the role here over declaring war.

00:16:43.200 Just for – I want to make a philosophical point. 0.93

00:16:45.620 Congress – it's a nest of vipers and snakes. 0.53

00:16:50.920 The present Congress, as it is constituted, is the last organization on the face of this planet that I would delegate war-making authority to.

00:17:00.240 So I would trust Donald Trump.

00:17:02.340 Donald Trump is at his best when he's communing with this movement, this vertical communing with MAGA.

00:17:10.620 He's at his best.

00:17:11.820 It's when he gets wrapped in and sucked in and encapsulated and surrounded by Congress that I think that there are the issues to behold.

00:17:22.520 And the big, beautiful bill is just an example of that.

00:17:26.520 Any organization that presents to the American people this big, beautiful bill and say we've done a great job is the last organization I would let anywhere near to this war with Ukraine.

00:17:40.120 Donald Trump needs to – MAGA, effectively, with all the agency that this great movement has, that the war in Posse has, MAGA, with his agency, needs to hold Donald Trump's feet to the fire.

00:17:53.920 He promised to do something, which is end this war within 24 hours.

00:17:57.700 He started to walk it back saying he was exaggerating.

00:18:00.480 And this movement, if I can say this ever so gently, with all love and respect to POTUS, he has been commissioned by this movement to do a job.

00:18:11.920 Fundamentally, the president, Donald Trump, is responsible to this movement.

00:18:15.880 He works for this movement.

00:18:17.640 He is there to represent this movement.

00:18:20.520 And when he said – sorry, I'll give way on this point, Steve.

00:18:22.660 When he says he will end that war in 24 hours, that is exactly why he was elected into office and that's when he needs to reclaim.

00:18:32.020 But you heard Rickards – I got that and this movement knows that.

00:18:35.980 But you heard what Rickards said today.

00:18:38.040 We could end the war immediately, but you have to give in to the Russian maximalist. 0.94

00:18:46.400 And remember, we have been against this war from beginning.

00:18:49.020 We have been against the party of Davos, Brussels, the whole EU, what they've done to instigate this.

00:18:55.240 But to solve it now, you would have to give in to Putin's maximalist positions on everything across the board.

00:19:03.640 Do you think President Trump should do that or he's trying to work to get at least a fair deal?

00:19:07.640 Look, we oppose, as you know, the economic deal with Ukraine.

00:19:11.560 But President Trump is at least trying to get something that appears to be fair to both parties.

00:19:16.940 Do you think he just ought to cave to Putin and say, hey, it's yours and move on?

00:19:21.600 Well, you know, in a sense, the suggestions are a false dichotomy because it's reality that Congress believes that it can somehow manipulate the outcome of this war without entering into full-on kinetic Third World War level.

00:19:40.340 It's false, right?

00:19:41.300 America, Spain, along with the European Union, these two blocs did everything they could already to defeat Putin.

00:19:54.420 And it hasn't happened.

00:19:55.500 So you then need to ask yourself the question, you know, where do we go from here?

00:20:01.880 What has been tried consistently hasn't worked.

00:20:04.480 In fact, it's impoverished Americans more than anything else.

00:20:10.000 So there's a Lindsey Graham talking about a new round of sanctions. 1.00

00:20:13.120 It's just performative.

00:20:14.560 He's shilling for the military-industrial complex.

00:20:18.080 Everybody knows that.

00:20:19.740 And you say to me, you know, OK, Han, well, do we give in to Putin's maximum demands? 0.51

00:20:24.320 Well, frankly, we created, you know, the West NATO, we created this in the first place.

00:20:29.320 There was either the outcomes were either we would back down and after spending 200, 300 billion, we would end up backing down humiliatedly.

00:20:42.940 Or we'll go all the way through and have some kind of nuclear war with Russia or Russia stroke China.

00:20:48.140 Those are the two cards on the table.

00:20:49.760 I don't see what the third possibility is, apart from this long meat grinder type war of attrition,

00:20:55.460 which we're not going to win for a number of different reasons, least of all because this is an existential war for Russia, as it's not for us. 0.86

00:21:04.760 So those are the possibilities.

00:21:06.720 Yes, Steve.

00:21:07.580 Yes.

00:21:08.080 Yes.

00:21:08.520 Yes.

00:21:08.760 To give you a yes on our answer.

00:21:10.120 Yes, we give in to Putin's maximist demands because we created this situation in the first place.

00:21:16.000 Brett.

00:21:17.460 Brett, your observations, sir.

00:21:19.740 Yeah, we were debating two or three regions.

00:21:29.680 Now it's four or five regions plus.

00:21:32.420 And so, yeah, it's Trump has trying to be fair, as you said.

00:21:36.440 But fairness in war, Putin holds all the cards. 0.56

00:21:39.760 He's taken the ground.

00:21:41.260 And you better make a deal of any sort before the terms get even worse.

00:21:45.540 Ben Harnwell, can you give your social media, how do people keep up with you?

00:21:53.480 Because do you agree with me that we are now in a absolute crisis mode in this Ukraine situation?

00:21:59.780 What's happened over the last 72 hours, folks, if you're not paying attention, you better, because they've got a full scale air war, a modern 21st century air war.

00:22:08.100 And I believe Alex Jones 100 percent on this, about this assassination attempt on Putin.

00:22:13.040 You've had fleets, I mean, 500, 600, 1,000 of these drones, highly sophisticated drones with advanced target acquisition, fire control solutions hitting on both sides.

00:22:23.700 And it's only escalating.

00:22:26.840 So, Harnwell, where do people go to get your blinding insights from our outpost in Rome?

00:22:32.400 Look, Steve, let's just deal with this assassination attempt, just 30 seconds.

00:22:38.320 Let's assume it had been successful and they'd taken Putin out.

00:22:42.200 What would the Russian military, who would then take control of the state, what would their next response be vis-a-vis Ukraine?

00:22:47.820 What do you think it would be?

00:22:49.560 They would level Kiev.

00:22:51.980 They would level Kiev.

00:22:54.140 Level Kiev.

00:22:54.960 Exactly.

00:22:55.240 What would the United States military do if the president's plane, if Air Force One was taken down and we knew the nation that did it, right?

00:23:05.260 What do you think the United States would do as a response?

00:23:07.580 Russia will do exactly the same.

00:23:09.460 You know, this is the degree of folly that Zelensky is in.

00:23:12.380 And President Trump needs to clarify this situation for the American people, whether he is delegated to Zelensky, the ability to choose whether America gets pulled in against its will into this war even further.

00:23:27.080 We are in a crisis situation, as you said.

00:23:30.680 Do you believe this tweet that Russian military command is – not that they're saying to do it, but they're running alternatives about the targeting of Berlin?

00:23:40.180 That's Russian media.

00:23:44.080 I have – look, when you're talking about the drone attacks, I try not to form my analysis on the basis of these tit-for-tat drone figures and anything coming out of Russian media.

00:23:57.260 The only reason I believe this TASS story with regards to Tammy Bruce is because it seems credible to me.

00:24:05.040 But I haven't found – and Steve, look, this is a story in and of itself.

00:24:08.660 Why is there zero reference to this Tammy Bruce declaration in any Western newspaper?

00:24:16.480 Simply not there.

00:24:18.060 Normally, I don't allow myself to form my opinion based on Russian media outlets.

00:24:23.380 The Tammy Bruce thing I think is credible.

00:24:26.160 The thing that you're mentioning, the tweet, I don't know.

00:24:30.720 And I'd hesitate to comment on it.

00:24:32.980 Why would I hesitate to comment on it?

00:24:35.540 Because a direct attack on Berlin would presumably trigger the Article 5 response from NATO.

00:24:43.280 What?

00:24:43.860 I think he's saying –

00:24:44.640 One last comment here.

00:24:47.160 I made the observation of what's at stake economically for our lives here.

00:24:52.880 President Trump and the Congress, right?

00:24:54.860 Harnwell's right about the Congress.

00:24:56.380 They're feckless on these matters.

00:24:57.600 They've proven it over the past couple years.

00:25:00.260 But the president needs to shine the light on Congress and make them come up with authoritative statements on all the pressure we can bring to bear on Russia.

00:25:08.700 And we need to use the trade war and every lever we have to go after China to put maximal pressure on Russia as well, as long as Europe and all our friends.

00:25:18.400 Right now, we need to play very strong and hard.

00:25:20.900 Okay, Brad, you're going to stick with me.

00:25:24.760 We're going to go through the president's economic plan as outlined by the great Dr. Peter Navarro.

00:25:30.380 Ben, you're going to bounce.

00:25:31.500 We want to thank you for staying up with us tonight in Rome.

00:25:35.040 Where do people go to get all your great insights?

00:25:38.240 Thanks, Steve.

00:25:38.820 Thanks, Dave.

00:25:39.580 On Getter, my social media platform of choice, tap in my surname, at Harnwell.

00:25:45.440 Got some great posts at the top of my feed awaiting you folks.

00:25:48.640 Thanks, Steve.

00:25:49.160 God bless.

00:25:49.480 Catch you tomorrow.

00:25:51.500 Okay, we're going to take a short break.

00:25:54.080 Dave Brat's going to stick with me.

00:25:55.700 Two things going on.

00:25:56.740 Number one, birch gold.

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00:26:04.360 You need to understand gold, how it relates to fiat currency.

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00:26:12.380 Where can you learn all that?

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00:30:59.620 The most important trial ever begins in Denver next week.

00:31:05.940 If that sounds like a bit of an exaggeration or perhaps a completely wackadoodle claim, you should know that it's coming from my pillow guy and election denier Mike Lindell.

00:31:15.420 Now, in fairness to Lindell, I am sure that it is the most important trial ever to him because he is the one who is going to be on trial, accused of defamation for saying that Denver-based Dominion voting systems and one particular Coloradan rigged the 2020 election against Donald Trump.

00:31:35.260 Truth is an absolute defense against defamation.

00:31:38.480 So, if Lindell can come to court and prove that he was telling the truth about election rigging, he's in the clear.

00:31:46.620 I actually think that this upcoming trial deserves more attention than it's getting because this is the chance for election deniers to provide their proof of the alleged conspiracy, the one that the most powerful man in the world, President of the United States, will not stop talking about even now that he's back in the White House.

00:32:04.060 But I think I know why this upcoming trial in Denver is largely being ignored.

00:32:10.280 Let's start with the media.

00:32:12.260 It seems like a lot of national journalists are just tired of covering Trump's election rigging lies.

00:32:19.100 They're now five years old.

00:32:21.440 I also believe that a number of Colorado's local journalists are skittish about covering political extremism.

00:32:27.720 It draws accusations of bias and threats of violence.

00:32:31.460 And if we're being totally honest, it's a lot more complicated to cover than much of what ends up on the evening news.

00:32:38.600 Now, let's talk about the general public.

00:32:41.140 I think a lot of Democrats are hesitant to talk about Mike Lindell's election rigging claims because they don't want to give fuel to theories that erode faith in our elections.

00:32:50.980 I think a lot of Republicans are hesitant to talk about this, too, because while you see a bunch of Republicans nod along in agreement with Trump's election rigging claims,

00:33:01.000 when people have to explain exactly how the elections are rigged, that's when folks start to sound goofy.

00:33:08.900 Like the swirl of claims that Dominion is rigging the vote with help from Antifa or Venezuela or George Soros.

00:33:18.580 The people pushing those theories for years have always said they want their day in court.

00:33:24.660 Well, they're going to get it in Denver starting next week.

00:33:28.300 Wow. We played that this morning and it blew people away.

00:33:34.460 Mike Lindell joins us now.

00:33:36.040 Mike, get us an update.

00:33:37.820 You're ensconched in Denver.

00:33:39.720 And I agree.

00:33:41.300 I think this they're not covering it because, first off, they don't want to see the facts out there.

00:33:47.020 This this trial could be a game changer.

00:33:48.780 And you're an American hero for pursuing it because you could have settled your your folks should know this is a roll the dice move of a former degenerate gambler, Mike Lindell.

00:34:00.480 Your thoughts, sir?

00:34:02.380 Yeah, Steve, I'm the only one that my pillow is being sued to that has taken it all the way to jury trial.

00:34:09.240 Now, everybody else so far has settled their insurance company.

00:34:12.260 We want to sell even though even though they're right.

00:34:14.660 It doesn't matter.

00:34:15.240 They're saying we want to sell because it's all about money or you're put out of business.

00:34:19.940 That's what lawfare is, everybody.

00:34:21.840 What lawfare with the day that when Smartmatic sued Fox News on February 4th of 2021, that started lawfare in our country.

00:34:30.320 And according to Alan Dershowitz, it hadn't been done since 1790, the 1790s.

00:34:35.040 And it was over 100 people or close to 100 and platforms that were sued and also threatening letters sent out to many, many individuals back then.

00:34:46.460 And but all these people, they got scared, you know, they and their insurance company, we have to settle.

00:34:52.040 This is so important.

00:34:53.420 A couple of things just now.

00:34:55.040 I was just looking over.

00:34:56.100 I've been here with the lawyers and stuff for about a week.

00:34:58.900 And they said to list all the experts that have worked with me on this and all the cyber people and the government and colonels and generals.

00:35:11.580 Well, it's 38.

00:35:13.420 38.

00:35:13.860 You know, so when they say in there, well, how do you know this?

00:35:16.700 I don't know anything about this.

00:35:17.900 I'm a numbers guy.

00:35:19.140 I've seen deviations in the in the elections, all the elections.

00:35:23.260 I mean, everybody's seen them now, Steve, where you see 81 million people that voted for Biden, 65 Obama, 60, 66 or whatever it was for Harris.

00:35:32.780 And and going back to 65 for Clinton, you got all this in 81 million.

00:35:37.780 Come on.

00:35:38.040 That's a little bit of a deviation or a Democrat.

00:35:40.560 We're bringing up a trial that got zero votes in her own precinct or her and her husband live in Georgia.

00:35:45.820 These are deviations that you have to explain that need explanations.

00:35:49.760 It's like, you know, if you have a thing on your bank account, everybody, that's that doesn't match what the bank tells you.

00:35:55.880 You know what they do?

00:35:56.680 They go in and see if it's a computer or they open it up and say, oh, here it is.

00:36:00.680 It was a computer error or that or you're wrong, whatever.

00:36:04.320 But we've never been able to do that.

00:36:06.180 Just this week here, it's kind of these blessings are coming.

00:36:09.000 Remember, everybody, this all ties to Tina Peters being in jail for nine years.

00:36:14.220 This gold star mom.

00:36:15.700 It's so sad that this attack and this suppression here in the state of Colorado, everybody, in the spring of 2021, they did something called the trusted bill.

00:36:25.640 Remember, I was sued by Dominion and they did this trusted bill.

00:36:29.320 Well, that trusted bill was deleted, you know, thousands and thousands of files that by by by federal law, you have to hold those records for 22 months here in Colorado.

00:36:42.220 It's 25 months.

00:36:43.720 So this all these things were broken.

00:36:45.760 And it's all called it also that's called spoiliation.

00:36:48.640 In my case, that was some of my evidence.

00:36:51.200 You just deleted it.

00:36:52.720 And so the right now in Arapahoe County, this is two weeks ago, everybody, just two weeks ago, this is going to be brought up in the trial.

00:37:01.020 This all came out two weeks ago, there was stuff that happened in the 2020 election, and everyone says, well, why do you keep looking back to that?

00:37:09.440 Well, those are the biggest deviations, but it happens in every election.

00:37:13.080 And as you all know, what have I been fighting for, Steve, to get to paper ballots, hand counted?

00:37:18.180 A hundred and thirty two other countries have banned electronic voting machines.

00:37:22.500 What's wrong with the U.S.?

00:37:24.160 And the stuff they're saying is that a reporter there that said that I accused or that it did this and this.

00:37:30.500 One of the things, Steve, is when you have a case like this is defamation.

00:37:35.520 I think it'll prove that I don't believe what I'm saying.

00:37:37.700 Everybody knows I believe what I'm saying because it's the truth.

00:37:42.180 Truth in absolute defense.

00:37:43.580 Tell me, take 60 seconds and sell me a set of sheets.

00:37:47.260 Yeah, you guys, we really need your help.

00:37:49.500 My pillow, remember, my pillow is soon.

00:37:51.600 This of all time, we need your help.

00:37:53.720 We need your help.

00:37:54.940 We need we're bringing an expert.

00:37:56.320 We're bringing in everyone next week.

00:37:57.840 You can do this by supporting my pillow.

00:38:00.140 Go to my pillow dot com.

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00:38:20.260 And I'm also going to match you.

00:38:21.820 If you buy one hundred dollars or more, I'm giving you one hundred dollars in free gifts.

00:38:25.480 And Steve, we put up every one just wants to go to my pillow and learn about the trial.

00:38:30.380 We have that posted there to everybody.

00:38:32.840 Promo code war room.

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00:38:36.100 We'll see.

00:38:37.000 We're most powerful promo code in the world.

00:38:38.800 Go hit it today.

00:38:39.740 Support Mike Lindell.

00:38:40.740 Thank you, brother.

00:38:41.320 We'll see you tomorrow morning.

00:38:42.120 Mike Lindell and Denver.

00:38:44.700 I've got I've got Brad.

00:38:46.160 We're going to break break down Navarro's report.

00:38:48.600 Brad's going to do it for me.

00:38:49.380 But I got to get Brian Costello in here for a couple of minutes because this morning Brian was watching the show.

00:38:54.040 Brian, you're our expert on with Joe Allen, artificial intelligence.

00:38:58.440 You really did disagree with Jim Rickards.

00:39:01.020 I need to get that out there before I go through this economic report, because I think the economic report is based upon advances in artificial intelligence.

00:39:08.420 He said there's no creativity.

00:39:10.440 All you're doing is a history that the machine can't be creative.

00:39:13.500 You vehemently disagree.

00:39:16.260 Yes, Steve.

00:39:17.140 I mean, I sent you the perfect example, right, is they have people need to understand there's different types of artificial intelligence.

00:39:24.060 And we also have a couple of things going on.

00:39:26.180 We have artificial intelligence merging with autonomous technology and robots right at the same time.

00:39:32.740 So there is a lot of creative innovation going on here.

00:39:35.840 You know, this stuff learns on its own, right?

00:39:38.840 Like we know that artificial intelligence, and this was a while ago, I forget the actual year, but there's something called Move 37 where a type of AI called reinforcement learning beat the best co-players in the world.

00:39:51.540 And it did a move that nobody else didn't do.

00:39:54.020 We're working with this stuff every day, Steve.

00:39:56.260 And it has the ability to create unique information, discover patterns at scale.

00:40:01.160 There's a reason, you know, all these companies are throwing money into biotech, R&D, using AI. 0.78

00:40:07.880 These guys aren't stupid.

00:40:08.960 These are guys that have built some of the best companies in the world and deployed capital. 0.83

00:40:12.800 So I think we need to be very careful as populists and people who care about America and the country.

00:40:18.540 We need to not say, like, hey, the AI stuff isn't real, like we're not getting anything creative in it.

00:40:25.120 It's very real, and it's attacking the middle class.

00:40:27.900 And our populist position can't be, like, AI just bad.

00:40:32.140 There are bad things about it, right?

00:40:33.880 It is going to make weapons more autonomous, as you talked about on the show earlier.

00:40:38.360 That might make leaders more likely to use these weapons because they don't have to put people in arms ways.

00:40:43.520 They can send drones or military robots and things like that.

00:40:46.500 So there are some negative sides to it, but there's also an innovative side of it we need to embrace,

00:40:52.280 and we need to figure out how to take people in this country that this levels the playing field.

00:40:59.320 So I know you're one of the few people that have covered it.

00:41:01.820 I think I'll be the second.

00:41:02.760 It's like, why have we left black and Hispanic populations down in tech?

00:41:08.160 Now they have this tremendous tool.

00:41:09.620 You don't actually have to be a software coder to develop software, right?

00:41:13.160 So this should help us bring these populations into the tech world, and there are positive things that we can do with this.

00:41:19.400 And we need to be careful.

00:41:20.400 This stuff is very, very powerful.

00:41:21.860 It's a huge change.

00:41:22.900 Computers can reason now, right?

00:41:25.620 And we can't ignore that.

00:41:27.920 This is scary.

00:41:29.780 I want to get you.

00:41:30.680 I'm going to talk to you.

00:41:31.340 I want to get you on a marshal.

00:41:32.380 I got to go through.

00:41:33.300 You have a model, the efficiency model versus the productivity model.

00:41:37.840 We're going down the efficiency model.

00:41:39.680 That's what the white-collar apocalypse is going to be.

00:41:42.500 We got to bounce.

00:41:43.180 Brian Costello, where do people go?

00:41:44.500 Put your Twitter feed up, dude, because you come in hot on Twitter.

00:41:48.800 Okay.

00:41:49.320 On X.

00:41:50.000 On X, it's BP Costello.

00:41:51.920 So I've fully transitioned to calling it X versus Twitter.

00:41:56.980 I can't.

00:41:58.120 And by the way, every time Mike is on before me, my mom sends me some new pillows.

00:42:05.560 So he's at least getting one sale out of this.

00:42:10.440 Brian Costello, we'll see you tomorrow.

00:42:13.100 Brian's coming up with the whole model.

00:42:14.400 Efficiency versus productivity will blow you away.

00:42:17.840 Dave Bratt, we got 10 minutes.

00:42:19.160 I need you to take, and let's get it up, Denver.

00:42:21.620 Navarro finally came out and wrote it.

00:42:23.340 The White House should be pushing this hard.

00:42:25.380 Walk me through the Dave Bratt analysis of Peter Navarro's full plan of this is what it is,

00:42:31.840 not scored by CBO, but a real economic model, sir.

00:42:37.600 Yeah.

00:42:38.120 Well, Navarro has his finger on it as usual, and he's giving conservative analysis here,

00:42:45.440 and the war room always brings receipts, right?

00:42:48.260 So in D.C., everyone lies constantly.

00:42:50.640 So you got to check all of us out.

00:42:53.120 I'm a pro-growth guy.

00:42:54.860 I love it, but growing your way out of this, this is the problem, right?

00:43:00.280 The dump that Donald Trump, President Trump, has been left with is horrible.

00:43:06.180 But Navarro goes through the structure of the big, beautiful bill,

00:43:10.040 but he first lays out what's called scoring by the Congressional Budget Office,

00:43:14.620 and that is dictated in law and custom through Congress.

00:43:18.560 So it's very boring, but they use old Keynesian models.

00:43:21.980 They don't like supply side, right?

00:43:24.020 Shocker.

00:43:24.940 They're all leftists and Democrats and quasi-Marxists now.

00:43:28.920 So they're going to do everything they can to downplay the benefits of economic growth

00:43:32.700 and capitalism and using free markets, right?

00:43:35.420 So what's the evidence?

00:43:36.480 The evidence, Navarro shows in the article back in 2017,

00:43:41.020 they scored growth at about 1.8 percent, and shocker, they were wrong.

00:43:46.040 We outpaced that under Trump.

00:43:48.860 Growth went, instead of 1.8, 2.8 percent, one full percentage point higher.

00:43:55.100 That is not a small thing in economics.

00:43:57.240 When you get 1 percent full growth more, right,

00:44:01.460 then that brings us up to the big, beautiful bill.

00:44:03.420 They scored this similarly, even worse, 1.7 percent economic growth scored out of the tax cuts.

00:44:10.340 And it's like, you guys, how can you be this wrong over time, every time?

00:44:14.960 And so what does that matter?

00:44:16.900 Well, the way it's scored, this big, beautiful bill is going to add, you know,

00:44:20.880 3.8 trillion to the deficits over the next years.

00:44:27.720 And Navarro shows, no, if you just score it with 1 percent higher growth, which we had in 17,

00:44:34.200 it's fact-based, it's science-based, that 3.8 goes down by about 2 trillion at least.

00:44:41.100 So you're down to half already.

00:44:42.640 Then he throws in the tariff story.

00:44:45.360 The CBO has refused to score the tariff story at all.

00:44:50.160 And again, some of that's just legalistic, mumbo-jumbo, the way Congress allows this and not that.

00:44:56.260 But Republicans have been sitting on their hands forever, not changing these rules.

00:45:00.500 We need to change it.

00:45:01.700 So Navarro shows, hey, we're going to get revenues, right?

00:45:04.080 Even if you just do the very conservative case of 10 percent tariffs across the board, guess what?

00:45:10.180 You get about at least $300 billion, all the way up to $2 trillion in savings.

00:45:16.180 So if you get the $2 trillion savings out of the scoring and the $2 trillion out of the tariffs, guess what?

00:45:21.500 The bill pays for itself, and it's honky-dory.

00:45:24.080 And you've sent the country on a positive, virtuous cycle of growth, right?

00:45:30.720 The tariffs, Peter is honest.

00:45:32.400 He says the tariff wears off.

00:45:34.140 But in the meantime, you've brung all the capital back into the U.S.

00:45:38.380 And any business guy, he says, any business person knows when you bring capital back, that's the best thing you can ever have for our economy.

00:45:48.680 And then we're at it.

00:45:49.540 And then your AI story, you mentioned the potential growth there is enormous.

00:45:56.300 But that's a deeper discussion.

00:45:58.720 But that's a simple summary of the Navarro piece.

00:46:02.400 I think he's conservative in his estimates.

00:46:04.300 The hard piece is the tailwinds we've got blowing at us from the Biden economy right now.

00:46:09.480 You dealt with CBO in your time in Congress.

00:46:14.340 You know the restrictions, particularly on the reconciliation bill.

00:46:17.400 He has added in everything.

00:46:19.500 And listen, right now, Kobayashi has a tweet out.

00:46:22.220 We're spending over 7 percent.

00:46:23.620 I think a percentage of deficits to GDP.

00:46:27.680 This is getting more and more serious.

00:46:28.820 Because what Navarro is showing you with adding in the real growth rate, which means more tax revenue, adding the tariffs, which means more cash, actually trying to put a number around deregulation and lower energy costs.

00:46:44.800 That $2 trillion deficits per year, which is everybody's concern, until you get to the mandatory cuts, you could cut that down.

00:46:52.760 You actually may be able to cut that in half.

00:46:55.280 And if you cut it in half to a trillion or less, then all of a sudden you're at 3.5 percent.

00:47:00.080 It ain't great.

00:47:01.340 But it's not unsustainable.

00:47:03.520 We don't love it.

00:47:04.520 But we can live with it at least for a while until we get some smart American people to see what we do.

00:47:08.920 Then maybe you can go into the mandatories and make a case with, hey, here's what we need to do.

00:47:13.980 But you need to build up trust that you actually can handle the discretionary and growth and deregulation.

00:47:20.720 Isn't that his pitch?

00:47:22.020 And the White House – Hassett ought to be selling this.

00:47:24.840 Scott Besson ought to be selling this.

00:47:26.240 Russ Vogt.

00:47:27.100 They ought to be on the shows 24-7 hammering his article in The Hill.

00:47:32.640 Don't you think, Brett?

00:47:33.520 Yeah.

00:47:34.200 Yeah, and I did – you should be yelling at me right now.

00:47:37.260 I missed the buried lead.

00:47:38.760 His whole thing was announcement to the bond market.

00:47:42.660 He says the bond market – you guys are smarter than this, right?

00:47:45.820 Look at the evidence back in 2017.

00:47:48.120 So the bond market vigilantes are coming after the markets because the bonds – the 10s are up and the 30s are up.

00:47:57.340 And that's scary.

00:47:59.540 And Navarro's main point is you're thinking old.

00:48:03.980 You're thinking old Keynesian terminology.

00:48:06.060 You're relating your logic to the CBO economists instead of to history.

00:48:12.060 And so he's showing you have two major effects here.

00:48:15.100 The tax cut effect is going to be a full percentage point higher of growth, which means more revenues coming in, like you just said.

00:48:22.000 And then you're also going to have the tariff revenues.

00:48:24.080 Those are guaranteed using a 10 percent baseline.

00:48:27.700 He's not using the 30 percent or the reciprocal tariffs or anything.

00:48:31.420 Just a 10 percent baseline gets you some big numbers.

00:48:35.340 And so the bond market – hopefully this show, they know.

00:48:40.160 They follow this kind of thing.

00:48:41.260 And they're rational actors, so they'll spread the word.

00:48:43.840 But they know.

00:48:44.980 We're not BSing here.

00:48:46.300 And there's some real good news buried in how this all works out.

00:48:49.640 It's just a matter of – we've got to have our House and the Senate still cut spending.

00:48:54.300 This in no way relieves Congress of the duty to cut spending, right?

00:48:59.340 And the unsustainable piece – I've got some charts I'll do at a later date.

00:49:03.540 But the debt blowing up and the consequences of the Federal Reserve and inflation over the years has just been horrendous and put us in this position.

00:49:16.620 Dave Bratt, where do people go?

00:49:18.420 You're putting up charts all the time.

00:49:19.640 You get down to the math of it because a lot of people think Dave Bratt is just a pretty face, that he's just a – looks like a movie star.

00:49:26.660 You know, Brad Pitt, but actually he's a Ph.D.

00:49:29.760 I don't call him Dr. Brett.

00:49:31.060 Maybe I'll start doing that.

00:49:32.060 Dr. Brett is a Ph.D. in economics just like Dr. Navarro.

00:49:35.940 He puts up the best charts.

00:49:37.620 Where do people go on social media to get all your – do you teach – why don't you teach economics down at Liberty?

00:49:43.620 You're one of the top economic thinkers in the country.

00:49:46.080 I know you're a moral philosopher and you got all that.

00:49:48.000 But Liberty is chock full of smart moral philosophers and philosophers and spiritual leaders.

00:49:53.040 Why are you not teaching economics down there?

00:49:56.660 Well, I'm following Adam Smith and trying to save Western civilization, the Judeo-Christian West. 1.00

00:50:03.580 And once I do that with you and Navarro, then I cannot wait to get back in the classroom.

00:50:09.140 Brad economics on Getter and on X.

00:50:12.460 And I got 30 charts related to 1971, the start of the Federal Reserve System.

00:50:19.500 You won't believe what you see.

00:50:21.560 Marriage ages go way up.

00:50:23.740 Childbirths go down. 0.97

00:50:24.940 Black progress goes way down. 0.67

00:50:27.000 Things you would not think related to 1971.

00:50:30.120 I posted 30 charts.

00:50:31.780 Now you told me I'm going to have to get your own.

00:50:35.320 We're going to go through all 30.

00:50:36.860 Oh, you won't.

00:50:37.620 Brad's going to make his case.

00:50:38.340 One of the smartest guys.

00:50:39.860 Explode.

00:50:41.980 One of the smartest guys I know.

00:50:44.140 Dave Bratt, thank you for being here in the 6 o'clock hour to make it all make sense.

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00:51:50.480 Okay, we're going to be back at 10 a.m. Eastern Daylight Time tomorrow when we will be in the work.

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Bannon's War Room - May 29, 2025

WarRoom Battleground EP 777： President Trump's Whole Presidency Is At Risk Due To The Deep State

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