Based Camp - Are Asians Not Having Babies Due to Genetics？ The Equation that Cracked Low Asian TFR

00:00:00.000 hello simone today we are going to be doing a stats heavy episode oh it's an intensive episode

00:00:07.040 yes it's one of those really fun episodes where i read something that a racist person wrote or

00:00:14.960 somebody who seemed to have a racial agenda okay and while i think that the person you know has

00:00:20.640 some bias in their thoughts i was like this is why it's important that we don't ban people like

00:00:25.000 this from talking okay because they will sometimes see things that somebody who is presenting and

00:00:32.160 looking at the world from a non-racist will never ever ever see yeah and that is really important

00:00:38.440 this well but if you say this to a mainstream progressive you have already basically just

00:00:44.900 said don't you think we should genocide all the palestinians i mean you have just said something

00:00:50.020 incredibly offensive because there's this perception that even being even sharing oxygen

00:00:54.500 with a racist is somehow an unforgivable act so i don't know that this person they just

00:01:01.820 seem to not love east asian immigrants and they didn't like that the beltway conservatives liked

00:01:08.220 east asian immigrants and i like east asian immigrants i really have genuinely no problem

00:01:13.340 with east asian immigration into the united states and i i don't even understand even if you were biased

00:01:17.700 about east asian immigrants like you must anyway we'll get to this later in the in the piece okay

00:01:22.040 but they noticed something that i have never seen anyone notice before and i was like oh my gosh like this

00:01:28.700 is true this is in the data okay wow comes to the subject of low east asian fertility rates might be

00:01:39.460 either persistently cultural post-immigration or genetic and in this episode we're going to talk about

00:01:46.640 the genetics of low fertility rates and why east asians might have at a genetic level a lower

00:01:55.080 in like biological desire to breed with somebody whoa there is actually a good explanation for why

00:02:03.500 they might in historical data that so this whole like kiki gomori thing this is people in japan who

00:02:09.060 just don't leave their houses and the vegetarian men of japan the men who sort of just never choose

00:02:13.640 to date or have partners this could just be partially genetically driven that these are these

00:02:20.900 aren't just tropes that happened out of nowhere there was a larger under yes and due to a specific

00:02:27.440 and intergenerational practice that was done in all of the east asian countries for hundreds of years

00:02:33.780 infanticide what well arranged marriages very strict arranged marriages we'll get you but it makes sense

00:02:39.500 when you think about it for five seconds you're like oh yeah they didn't have to have a biological

00:02:44.100 urge to find a partner they were matched with well or that biological urges to have partners didn't

00:02:50.860 correlate as highly with fertility or with with having kids and passing on your genes as they do in other

00:02:56.700 societies and and what's very interesting is if you look at east asian populations and then you look

00:03:01.700 at the east asian populations that are abrahamic in their faith they have really good fertility rates

00:03:07.200 would you like to know more so if you look at studies of fertility rates the heredibility of

00:03:14.180 fertility rates appears to be around 20 to 40 this is if you look at identical twin studies where

00:03:19.120 identical twins are raised in separate families so we already know that there is some biological drive

00:03:23.760 to have kids which ends up affecting fertility rates and you can also look at studies that look at age

00:03:30.120 of first child which is really well studied in identical twin studies and again 20 to 40 so it is fairly

00:03:36.240 genetic okay it's not as genetic as something like iq or height but it is fairly genetic yeah

00:03:41.040 meaningful now first let's talk about the culture of east asian countries okay so here i am going to

00:03:49.360 put on screen graphs that are looking at two questions uh sorry i i should point out to the

00:03:56.260 audience because the audience may not know this going into this i just assume that everyone knows this

00:03:59.820 east asian countries if you control for wealth generally the wealthier country gets the lower

00:04:03.620 fertility rate gets when you control for wealth they have the worst fertility rates of anywhere in

00:04:08.880 the world by astronomical amounts like they are off a cliff they would if they were a an animal like

00:04:17.900 if you if you consider them an animal groups like koreans for example would be considered a critically

00:04:22.060 endangered species well and wouldn't you say that in terms of the the countries on our watch list

00:04:28.240 for experiencing fundamental structural concerns in the near future due to demographic collapse include

00:04:37.880 china and south korea before anyone else yeah yeah so so like it matters you need to pay attention to

00:04:45.120 these falling fertility rates this is a part of the core key of the question of falling fertility rates

00:04:50.280 now culturally speaking we're going to look at first here this this is a a percent study within a

00:04:55.700 cultural group and that it was ranking countries many point to family and children as sources of

00:05:00.540 meaning in life so it ranked countries here if you look at the top of this wrist australia new zealand

00:05:06.340 greece usi these are countries that are actually pretty high in terms of their fertility rate

00:05:11.720 when contrast it was what you would expect given their wealth okay so children are a source of meaning

00:05:16.340 in my life those countries you want to see who's at the very bottom of this list singapore japan

00:05:22.400 south korea and taiwan they just don't see children as sources of meaning in life at higher as higher

00:05:29.320 rate as other countries so okay culturally that's why you would see that all right let's look at

00:05:33.220 another graph here relatively few mention their romantic partners as a source of meaning in life

00:05:37.840 okay okay so who considers their romantic partners their source of meaning in life those countries at

00:05:44.380 the top of the list like the usa and netherlands two countries that have unusually high fertility rates

00:05:48.080 given their wealth at the bottom of the list the four bottom countries again in order japan

00:05:53.920 singapore south korea and taiwan so culturally speaking they just do not see children or their

00:05:59.940 significant others as key parts of their meaning in life i'd actually ask you simone if you were like

00:06:05.040 rankings like your meanings in life how high would you say like i and the kids are oh you guys are

00:06:13.240 number one at this point you weren't when i was a kid you know before i met you but

00:06:18.000 so yeah for me you are so obviously number one like the kids then you then my mission like that

00:06:25.680 happens to people after they have those things yeah it could be downstream of this so we'll see

00:06:31.560 kids were like number thousand like the thousandth thing on my list before i met you you know what i mean

00:06:37.040 i really didn't want kids before i met you so i actually started thinking about this more as

00:06:43.840 could this be the explanation of why some cultures seem more resistant to the impact increasing wealth

00:06:50.240 has on fertility rates and it really checks out when i think about it for example jewish groups are

00:06:58.040 uniquely resistant to prosperity induced fertility collapse and jewish communities also put a really

00:07:04.600 high emphasis on their children and their spouses in terms of meaning in their lives in addition to

00:07:11.740 that i was also thinking about music because you know i lived in korea i consume a lot of korean music

00:07:17.100 i really like k-pop i can think of only one korean song that is about a person's children or about a

00:07:26.940 relationship between a child and their parents but that is actually uh funnily enough

00:07:33.740 by psy the guy who did gangnam style and it's i got it from my daddy which is interesting because

00:07:41.300 the song is actually done in english psy grew up in the u.s and his form of k-pop is more popular in

00:07:49.820 the united states than it is in korea yes i know people might be surprised about this but gangnam style

00:07:55.160 was not the hit in korea that it was in the united states it's not considered like classic k-pop

00:08:00.120 also interesting here if i think about like my own cultural group the greater appalachian cultural

00:08:05.400 group and the type of art that we produce you know often classic country music country music has

00:08:10.980 tons and tons and tons of songs about how great a person's wife is or how great their children are

00:08:21.000 and how important kids are in the last episode we played a clip from the episode about like what

00:08:26.760 matters in life it's a song called by dirt find the one you can't live without get a ring let your

00:08:33.240 knee hit the ground and add a few limbs to your family tree and in it you know they're saying one

00:08:38.500 of the key things that matters in life uh if not the key thing that matters in life is one is who you

00:08:43.580 marry and your children that's like the key point of the song or another one that i really like lady

00:08:48.220 which i'll play a clip from here i hope you look just like your mama you'll see close to perfect

00:08:55.040 patience if you watch her every move get her baby girl and you'll learn how to be a lady

00:09:04.280 okay well this piece was written by uh futurist right the substack and it was titled east asian

00:09:14.440 extinction level fertility is genetic and beltway conservatives are traitors um

00:09:20.080 fighting words there i actually really liked this guy's writing when i was going through this i was

00:09:24.940 just like this is really creative stuff the analysis was well done he didn't lie with data i really hate

00:09:31.420 when people do that to fit an agenda and yeah just just cool stuff i just disagree with him on like

00:09:37.060 america is worse off for having a large population of east asian immigrants i don't believe that at all

00:09:42.480 like there are some areas where i'd be like yeah maybe we should think again about immigrants from

00:09:46.060 these areas but like i'd literally take all of hong kong when like china went in to take them i'm like

00:09:50.620 let's screw hong let's screw china over take everyone in hong kong with over x amount of money as an

00:09:54.760 immigrant i do not mind high-skill immigrants at all all right so let's check in on the fertility of

00:10:00.680 u.s born east asians chinese japanese koreans weighted for respective populations within the u.s

00:10:07.060 and compare them to the figure of that same weighted population back home then let's compare it

00:10:12.500 to u.s born white fertility so the u.s born east asian fertility is 1.38 and here he's only counting

00:10:19.180 east asian as china japanese and korean um that's generally what people mean when they say east asia

00:10:24.420 so 1.38 versus 1.197 if they had stayed at home um so we often say this is a great thing like i've

00:10:32.020 always been like i assumed that it was like american culture was affecting them and it was increasing

00:10:36.340 their fertility rate okay yeah exactly um and but we would cite stats that south korean fertility rates

00:10:43.700 went up when south koreans moved to the united states which is notable because most immigrant

00:10:48.380 groups fertility drops after they immigrate to the united states yeah well they're from a higher

00:10:53.060 fertility culture yeah in koreans at for a period at least it jumped about 50 percent up but that may

00:10:58.720 have been an illusion and i'll explain where the illusion came from yeah and it's also gone down from

00:11:03.920 that 50 percent up number in more recent samples wow okay so so right here he's not talking about

00:11:09.740 modern fertility rates by the way these are these numbers are all higher than modern fertility rates

00:11:13.060 but this is just a sample set he had okay so the u.s born white fertility is 1.89 all right

00:11:19.040 so here you're contrasting and this is also why i don't understand why does he care about an immigrant

00:11:25.060 group with such a lower fertility rate than our own like they're just gonna disappear anyway like

00:11:29.380 yeah i don't i don't mean about it yeah you don't need to be mean about it bro okay so he goes ouch

00:11:36.940 east asians are clearly passing on more of their anti-natalist culture than we thought 1.38 versus

00:11:43.560 a 1.97 we've done some good work and defeating it but there's clearly more work to be done like this

00:11:51.700 is what you would think right like okay well we've helped defeat a little bit of their anti-natalist

00:11:55.200 culture when they moved here but not totally well here comes some uncomfortable stats i had forgotten

00:12:01.040 about oh no i'm gonna put on screen here that famous okay cupid chart that i am so glad someone

00:12:07.440 at okay cupid ran was their giant giant data size from back when we for whatever reason somebody

00:12:13.340 thought it was okay to post like ethnic breakdowns of message and reply rates and i we times were

00:12:19.380 different as a human race we are so so so lucky to have this data okay

00:12:26.400 east asian women prefer white men to asian men in terms of reply rates in messages

00:12:34.180 on okay cupid this isn't like rating or anything like this is the actual yeah just looking at who's

00:12:39.620 getting back yep and this is i think the only place in the entire chart where a group preferred

00:12:44.940 another ethnic group over their own which is actually kind of wild um what's up with that

00:12:53.920 by the way east asian females they also preferred middle eastern men and native american men to asian

00:13:01.240 men huh so oh wait no hold on they also preferred other and almost less pacific islanders so i actually

00:13:10.520 suspect this might be due to the incredibly strict gender roles within asian culture and asian women

00:13:16.400 just not wanting to live that lifestyle yeah and they may have you know prejudices because you see

00:13:21.380 this in korea like i know like i know personally korean women who have moved out of korea just to marry

00:13:30.440 people from not white people to be honest and it wasn't because they had like white fever or something

00:13:36.660 they're just like well you know on average i'll have a more gender equal relationship if i do this

00:13:41.920 and you see this in statistics on for example korean culture that women handle like way more of the

00:13:48.720 housework way more of the house maintenance even though they're still expected to provide the

00:13:53.040 predominant amount of child care and work a job like it's just a raw deal they're getting and this

00:13:58.880 is i mean unfortunately a cultural thing when you have other cultural options in this way you can

00:14:03.200 almost sort of see white culture as victimizing east asian culture is i mean there are a cultural

00:14:08.340 hypothesis about how they can make society work but it's a cultural hypothesis that stops working in

00:14:13.840 an open dating market right ouch and also keep in mind that then there's a secondary thing here so

00:14:21.940 suppose an east asian woman does want to take on all of these roles right like um they want to be

00:14:28.420 subservient they want to do the majority of the housework and they want to do the majority of the

00:14:32.360 child work okay in a mixed ethnic group uh if you're thinking about arbitrage opportunities

00:14:41.220 these women would actually be better off going after white men gosh you know you're right

00:14:47.880 because the white men will value all of these sacrifices from the more the white man's perspective

00:14:54.860 that they're making that the east asian men wouldn't sacrifice to an east asian man

00:15:00.300 they might be just you're doing a job yeah you're doing your job to the the white man oh my god a

00:15:07.680 woman who's doing housework so so they can and i've actually seen this in san francisco where there is

00:15:14.400 the common practice of the upper mid east asian woman getting the extremely wealthy white tech bro

00:15:22.240 i'd actually say that that's the like most common silicon valley marriage structure

00:15:26.040 because the the tech bro is just like endlessly thankful that there is any gender dynamic like

00:15:33.520 dimorphic behavior at all because they're so not used to it in the culture that they're used to this

00:15:38.480 like far lefty urban monoculture mindset but what do you have thoughts here or no i i have seen what

00:15:46.040 you are talking about and i'm sure most people watching can think of examples and i i also want to

00:15:52.940 just looking at this chart we'll do this in another episode but like we need to talk about like

00:15:57.000 because the left has stolen the black american identity to use for all of its like identity politics

00:16:05.080 nonsense it makes up ways they're discriminated against which then hide the ways that they actually

00:16:11.340 are discriminated against and that would easily pierce a public mindset if you just showed them

00:16:16.400 the data that like we're not supposed to show them if you look at black female or black males in this

00:16:22.100 graph it makes your heart great like no one is replying to them if you look at that's what i

00:16:29.480 always remember from those particular okcupid surveys was they're not surveys but studies i just like

00:16:36.060 but especially how screwed you are if you're a black woman so just the sadness of this like

00:16:42.120 if you look at this chart like women of like all other ethnic groups are like i never replied to

00:16:47.340 anyone and and then black women like green across the board you messaged me somebody messaged me

00:16:54.560 they they are like as green as male reply rates actually i think more green than male reply rates

00:17:01.400 is how screwed they get which is well i'm also you this is another group i misspoke here it appears

00:17:07.440 black females also they literally respond to black male messages less than any other group they are

00:17:14.760 more willing to respond to male messages from any group more than black males oh that is not good

00:17:22.280 does not say a lot about gender relations within that community and then black male response rates

00:17:28.700 across the board are just like oof anyway but we can also look at out marriage rates so pew research

00:17:35.420 did a research of this and 54 of east asian immigrants marry someone of another ethnic group

00:17:42.380 so here i'm just going to read a quote here among asian newlyweds these gender differences exist for

00:17:48.720 both immigrants 15 men 31 women and u.s born 38 men 54 women so it's more likely that an east asian

00:17:56.080 woman marries out much more likely like more than double more likely in in one case than a man marries

00:18:02.340 somebody of a different ethnicity and while the gender gap among asian immigrants has remained

00:18:07.760 relatively stable the gap among the u.s born has widened substantially since 1980 when the

00:18:13.180 intermarriage rate stood at 46 and now it's around 49 among east asian women so you can see again

00:18:21.500 losing their culture here which which is sad i mean they're creating a new culture right i i don't think

00:18:27.120 like the culture has disappeared but it's going to be a hybrid white east asian culture which may be

00:18:33.660 more resistant it may be that they needed this this cultural infusion to survive due to fertility rates

00:18:39.760 i don't know but um i mean that's what we're seeing here no by the way speaking of american asian

00:18:47.740 marriages jd vance oh yeah that's not east asian that's south asian yeah but still i i was more

00:18:54.860 thinking priscilla chan good example there all right so here's the thing that absolutely floored

00:19:02.980 me so okay now you've got to consider that a lot of these people are going to be influenced by who

00:19:08.620 they married right so you can't just look at them as if having like normal asian fertility rates right

00:19:15.540 you need to say okay let's look at this right so i'm going to read the the line here and this

00:19:20.460 shocked me so what the guy did is he said okay so we know that um 54 are marrying people of a

00:19:30.400 different cultural group predominantly white people so then let's take that 54 and assume

00:19:36.300 that their expected fertility rate is going to be exactly in between the east asian fertility rate

00:19:43.900 and the white fertility rate okay and then you run the math here and i'll put the math on the screen

00:19:50.700 and i will remind you that the average you know u.s born east asian fertility rate is 1.38 so if you

00:20:00.640 average the average east asian fertility rate 1.197 and then take 54 of that and assume that that portion

00:20:09.640 of that 1.97 would be midway between 1.97 and 1.89 do you know what number you get

00:20:15.380 1.38 the exact number of the fertility rate they have in the united states wow okay you don't need

00:20:28.340 any cultural change to explain the rise in fertility rate it is simply marrying non-asians that's

00:20:36.260 okay yeah all right well it's bleak if you think asian culture is a good thing and i do

00:20:45.580 i do think asian culture is a good thing i'm sad i just i think that could they're not i mean there

00:20:52.800 there are ways to culturally build and aren't there some very high fertility subcultures like outside

00:21:00.840 seoul and south korea that are just primed to inherit all of the country i've heard of like one

00:21:06.280 religious cult in korea and one in japan their fertility rates aren't great they're not like

00:21:11.680 look korea has always been great at exporting cults like the moonies and some more recent ones and

00:21:17.800 they're great at building cults so maybe they'll create something that saves them maybe but like

00:21:23.860 their fertility rates just don't touch on like the white religious nut job groups like yeah

00:21:29.780 us i need more religious nut jobs and turning women into baby factories um i mean gosh yeah i it is

00:21:39.800 concerning it's very concerning i don't want asian culturists to disappear but i do mind simone was

00:21:47.700 born in japan and has lived with japanese people for a long time her middle name is haruko because she

00:21:52.340 was born in japan she has strong cultural connections she grew up in the bay area which

00:21:56.700 is very asian pretty much your entire friend group going up with east asian right pretty much yeah and

00:22:02.180 i lived and worked in korea like i have a very strong personal connection to these cultural groups

00:22:08.900 it makes me sad that they may not survive yeah and i guess it is something when i think of all my high

00:22:15.460 school friends one of them yet not not many of them have kids certainly not more than one kid right

00:22:24.580 now which is and you're at four lady yeah that's a yeah when you compare it's not looking fantastic

00:22:31.460 so yeah so i really wanted to tackle this this hypothesis he had that this was due to arranged

00:22:37.420 marriage because i was under the the perspective that arranged marriage was at least occasionally a

00:22:43.000 practiced in europe right yeah what i came to is actually no it's being practiced in europe was

00:22:48.480 pretty rare in a historic level yeah more among just a very rare super high class group right yeah so

00:22:55.820 yeah basically only like the super wealthy did it so and even they did it differently than east asians

00:23:00.300 did it so we'll talk about the east because it gets kind of horrifying when you hear about how east

00:23:04.220 asians did it oh what yeah honestly it was news to me from you that there was even an arranged marriage

00:23:11.680 thing in east asia you will be you will be surprised by the number of women who had their

00:23:17.860 legs broken okay that they couldn't leave their house until they were ready to marry i'll just say

00:23:22.560 okay now let's go to the european sample before we get to that okay so mcflayne's marriage and love

00:23:31.020 in england 1300 to 1840 describes the laws to this effect well its primary focus is the timeline

00:23:37.580 described in the title it cites the laws of coltaire for 560 a.d and i don't want to get picked up on a

00:23:44.960 filter c-u-n-t i'm not going to say that word out loud because i don't know how to say it

00:23:48.860 unfortunate last name early well it's the name of it cunut i think it's pronounced okay early 1000s a.d

00:23:56.260 and describing the historic germanic tradition of opposition to forced marriage it lays out clear

00:24:02.180 evidence for the existence of an ancient germanic custom of permitted marriage against the wishes

00:24:07.020 of parents which remained uninhibited in britain even as the reintroduction of roman civil law

00:24:12.440 elsewhere opposed it the other country where this norm remained unabridged was sweden so keep in mind

00:24:17.760 this is you know specifically northern europe in rome arranged marriage was more common but also you

00:24:23.520 know you see less you know you see outcomes that look more in between northern european outcomes and

00:24:28.900 east asian outcomes when you look at southern european outcomes but keep in mind even the

00:24:32.580 catholic church here so and when the catholic church confronted the latter question whether

00:24:37.160 marriage could be valid without the consent of parents it was unambiguous in its support citing

00:24:42.560 creatively the bible verse that quote what therefore god has joined together let no man put asunder in

00:24:48.720 quote matthew 1916 the church consistently upheld even secret marriages made without the consent or

00:24:54.680 knowledge of anyone but the participants see charles dorn jr's paper on canon law and marriage in the

00:25:01.180 journal of family history furthermore the high the there there was a very high median age of first

00:25:06.700 marriage in northern europe in the 1600s which was 22 plus which is very rare if you look at if you're

00:25:12.700 talking about like the 1600s in east asia yeah that's late i'm gonna guess it was around 16 22 plus is

00:25:18.560 wildly late which which was because they gave people a lot of independence and this source here

00:25:24.080 argues that that was the case a a in addition to all of this you had a church and civil ban on cousin

00:25:31.900 marriage which forced women to and men to look outwards to marry so you can keep in mind if you

00:25:37.340 look at a lot of muslim cultures they do a lot of like cousin marriages and stuff like that yeah and

00:25:42.040 that's common in east asia as well i'm pretty sure is a lot of family because it consolidates power

00:25:46.920 within the family it's what you would want if your goal was amassing power as a family it's what you

00:25:52.720 wouldn't want if you're an extra family bureaucracy made up of eunuchs um that was trying to claim more

00:25:59.280 power for itself which the catholic church functionally is right so they banned that but

00:26:04.200 that creates a very interesting sort of like biological impulse here if you as a european

00:26:09.840 historically were like not driven by your sexuality to go out and screw people you might not end up having

00:26:17.660 descendants that just wasn't as true for other populations on earth and this actually reminds me

00:26:23.340 of a very interesting conversation i had with a very dear friend of mine who was a jay and um boy

00:26:28.460 at the time man i don't know young we were teens at the time and we were both in college and he was

00:26:33.000 like i was talking about dating i was like who are you interested in right and this was during that time

00:26:37.720 of my life where i was probably sleeping with like three or four different people a week and he's like

00:26:42.240 oh well you know i don't want to date until i have a job i was like you you don't want to date until you

00:26:49.400 have a job and he was like yeah you know my parents say i shouldn't really focus on it so culturally my

00:26:55.580 people we don't really focus on it you know i just well i'll focus on something not just to college like

00:26:59.860 high school college you know that's for focusing on work and in another episode we did here we pointed

00:27:05.240 out how east asians at least and i'm sure south asians are the same way spend way more time on school work

00:27:10.520 than white kids so i decided to look this up to see if this hunch was right and yes there have

00:27:15.640 been studies confirming this east asian individuals have way way way lower sex drives than europeans

00:27:22.020 and this is explains a huge part of why they outcompete white people not iq differences and i think part of

00:27:28.880 it is i was busy screwing my way through high school and college and here this kid is and he's just like

00:27:35.520 yeah i don't want it but i don't know if like biologically i could have realistically like

00:27:40.860 even when i think about my kids i'm like i know the number one thing i can't do is say don't engage

00:27:47.180 with your sexuality because i know how loud that was i may be able to like use naltrexone to try to

00:27:53.520 break any sort of like opioid pathway they have in their brains related to this right but i would need

00:27:58.980 to is through some sort of pharmacological intervention like actively treat like an

00:28:05.560 addiction or disease want to be trapped by this or not because naltrexone is actually pretty good at

00:28:09.880 breaking the compulsions but it's it's tough it is tough like it's not necessarily awesome sauce

00:28:17.900 but this is interesting to me now i'm gonna go to what he says about these other countries okay

00:28:21.840 so he says in china and korea nearly all marriages were arranged in japan most were and unlike the kinds of

00:28:27.500 more modern arranged marriages that are unfairly stigmatized today these arrangements at least

00:28:32.520 outside of japan involved no role for fertile female choice or male choice in the matter i.e no

00:28:38.440 interactions between the soon to be married occurred before the marriage was fully contracted total female

00:28:44.300 seclusion from non-kin males both pre and post marriage ensured success of this arrangement of this

00:28:49.920 arrangement to remarry even after the death of one's husband was stigmatized and keep in mind you see

00:28:55.640 this in south asia in india the the common practice of oh what was it called again uh where

00:29:00.260 they would burn the widows oh yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah and people pretend like this wasn't a common

00:29:04.840 practice and it was common in some regions but i don't want to get to south asian populations

00:29:09.560 the han chinese famously left nothing to chance in ensuring seclusion was nearly all upper middle

00:29:15.760 class and many other class households up to 50 of the population breaking the feet of their girls

00:29:21.860 to ensure their limited mobility and subservience to the east asian marital process 50 of young women

00:29:29.200 had their feet broken would note here that this number seemed unbelievably high to me so i went to

00:29:34.160 an ai perplexity specifically to ask the same question and it said in response in the 19th century

00:29:39.980 an estimated 40 to 50 of chinese women had their feet bound among the upper economic classes in the 19th

00:29:45.780 century the prevalence was almost a hundred percent a study by william russo estimated that as many as

00:29:51.600 two billion chinese women may have had their feet bound research by hill gates found that virtually 100

00:29:56.680 percent of women born in 1850 to 1854 had bound feet with the percentage slowly decreasing in subsequent

00:30:04.480 decades so a hundred percent of women and during some periods had their feet bound during other periods

00:30:10.420 it was 50 so just an absolute ton and it was practiced well into the 20th century especially

00:30:18.060 in rural and coastal regions so this article was not cherry picking to make a point if anything they

00:30:23.460 may have understated the number like this was like not messing around like you are not going to find a

00:30:30.240 partner on your own we handle who you're marrying don't worry about it was this a byproduct of the foot

00:30:37.440 binding process like their feet were just broken because they were binding them or was this well

00:30:41.980 is it burning all right here's the hammer don't leave the house video on screen close your eyes for five

00:30:48.200 seconds one two three it's gonna be on screen one two three in okay good it's off screen now but for

00:30:55.440 people who don't know what the golden lotuses look like they would put the feet of little girls in really

00:31:00.520 tight shoes they never fully developed they couldn't walk and this was you know you can sit talk about

00:31:05.600 it as a beauty ritual or whatever you want to talk about it as but it was a ritual that really

00:31:10.060 ensured that these women didn't play a role in who they were mating with and this of course is going

00:31:16.620 to have a genetic impact on arousal pathways use it or lose it i'm sorry it doesn't use it or lose it

00:31:21.800 is a saying in genetics if you don't need an arousal pathway to motivate having children you're going to

00:31:28.200 lose the impulsive arousal pathway that causes teens to make the types of impulsive decisions that lead

00:31:35.500 to babies and then lead to marriage and

00:31:38.620 that could explain this difference

00:31:43.380 that's a very interesting

00:31:46.620 prospect if you're saying that this is mostly upper and middle class people though i don't know if

00:31:53.860 they're the biggest genetic contributors to any society i don't know he's an upper middle class and

00:31:58.060 many others so around 50 of the population okay yeah i guess 50 of the population is probably enough

00:32:02.920 and offer it to have a meaningful effect too yes also upper and middle class on a historic basis

00:32:09.440 had more kids than the lower classes oh yeah because they had resources and food and whatnot

00:32:13.540 okay yeah and then the kids who you know weren't able to compete within these environments would

00:32:17.720 become and probably lower infant mortality yeah okay okay okay okay so so keep all that in line

00:32:24.640 now i want to move quickly to an email we got from one of our fans talking about chinese culture because

00:32:31.200 he's been living there for a while and i think it also helps us understand the difference between

00:32:35.600 the chinese population and our own right

00:32:37.980 i'm a brit who lived in china for five years you and consensus missed a few significant details

00:32:45.520 regarding why they're so effed i basically polled people

00:32:48.900 on this while i was there having few kids in china has become fashion driven by women

00:32:54.820 one women's sexual status in china is about luxury maximum consumption minimum effort and i've actually

00:33:02.100 seen this in like chinese videos where they'll have like women who act like bitchy or like oh they got

00:33:07.680 a car for their birthday or for their marriage and they complain about it or something to try to show

00:33:12.540 their status to other women it's like men give me stuff and i make fun of them for it and i am

00:33:17.140 unappreciative that is a sign of like it does seem to be a fetish though like there are those people

00:33:21.200 who make money from men just for yelling at them and whatnot so it's a thing these men do not look

00:33:29.640 happy about this they usually look like their souls have been taken and stomped on when we can talk about

00:33:34.440 how bad women have it in east asia but i think in many ways men also have it absolutely terrible

00:33:40.400 and like gender dynamics in these countries just need to be like yeah the sign that it seems that

00:33:46.600 both east asian men and east asian women aren't choosing

00:33:49.980 hold on i want to keep i want to keep going here i want to keep going here two they want the status

00:33:56.220 label of quote-unquote mother was out the work meaning one kid max so mother is a status but you

00:34:02.280 don't get that much additional status or it appears any additional status from additional kids okay in

00:34:07.260 the u.s that definitely isn't the case actually you don't really get any status was one kid i wouldn't

00:34:12.380 even say you get that much status with two kids but there is a community in the u.s where when you

00:34:17.220 get to three up kids you get additional status with every kid like with four kids i feel like

00:34:23.420 walking through the mall these days i said i feel a bit like prince ali prince ali fabulous

00:34:28.660 with the the kids and matching outfits trailing behind us and everybody like oh they must be fancy

00:34:36.600 three they accuse men who want more children as treating them as quote-unquote cattle they love

00:34:43.100 this comparison the oversupply of men plus the surprisingly strong and rather toxic feminist

00:34:47.120 slash anti-pickup movement gives them leverage and keep in mind there's there's very few women

00:34:52.640 compared to men in china because during the one child policy people preferred male children so women

00:34:57.660 have the advantage in the sexual marketplace and they are able to demand these types of concessions

00:35:03.220 right in china at least yeah yeah yeah all right then next intersectional status signaling and

00:35:08.680 competition the culture explicitly demands women to select men based on wealth household slash car

00:35:14.960 meme and this is actually a common meme i've seen in my asia watching stuff in china the house car

00:35:19.560 meme big um children are expensive so reduce her other luxury consumption once they have again true

00:35:26.820 and they can be uniquely expensive in east asia if you look at something like south korea

00:35:30.820 children are way more expensive than they are in the u.s you end up spending i think it was something

00:35:36.040 like a third of a family's household budget ends up going for one child to go to cram school this is

00:35:42.060 the additional school they attend in addition to public school uh social media embraces the narcissism

00:35:47.340 and wealth expectations for example there are very popular tiktok channels of couples where a woman acts

00:35:53.340 bored and useless where her boyfriend showers her with gifts and services i've seen these before

00:35:58.280 what are you saying it just sounds awful the fact that a man loves a horrible and useless woman

00:36:04.720 implies she is beautiful enough to counterbalance her awfulness implying she's really beautiful

00:36:09.800 laziness is an honest signal of beauty women aspire to be useless and rich i'm not joking

00:36:15.300 this person says and again i see this oh well the way he writes this i don't know if i word it this

00:36:20.140 way but he says chinese women cannot reconcile their preferences for prostitution with the notion of

00:36:24.780 love they ask how can you really love a poor man in quote here and i have heard this but i haven't

00:36:31.840 you know seen it myself and then here he says chinese people appeal to political correctness on

00:36:36.060 a daily basis it is very deeply ingrained they are genuinely patriotic when asked to give an opinion

00:36:41.580 on something potentially quote-unquote sensitive read political there is a short delay where they recall

00:36:47.000 the chinese stance before they state the collective national view he would argue that this happened for such a

00:36:53.120 long time that chinese people convinced themselves that having few kids was not only moral but good

00:36:57.840 in other ways two cognitive dissonance confirmation bias and intersexual status signaling drove them to

00:37:03.540 post-rationalize having few children as being something that was fashionable three this would have been

00:37:08.940 compounded by overly effective propaganda promoting all the positives for having few kids and downplaying

00:37:14.840 the negatives which are repeated verbatim by women who don't want kids because even why the women

00:37:19.960 also don't want this and four those arguments have now been fully adopted and leveraged perhaps in a

00:37:24.820 subconscious collective quote-unquote fu to the government for controlling reproductive rights for

00:37:29.320 the past um in the first place and then he said and he asked a few women whether they would prefer

00:37:34.480 one child worth 1 million or two kids worth 500k and they unanimously chose one child worth 1 million

00:37:40.560 china is effed they need to convince these women that having kids is preferable but they spent the last few

00:37:47.100 decades doing the exact opposite chinese women are ironically very individualistic and i've actually

00:37:53.060 seen this individualism in chinese women that that we're friends with but another thing i note here

00:37:58.280 is for people who like don't believe how set in their ways china is even despite their desperate

00:38:03.300 demographic situation which is going to lead to the collapse of their country pretty much inevitably at

00:38:07.260 this point the government is still only on a three child policy they need to be on a 10 child policy

00:38:13.520 yeah right yeah and i think it's this cognitive dissonance that he's talking about here is why

00:38:18.560 they haven't

00:38:19.480 gone to new way of viewing things so here i'm going to talk about another one of those subsects that this

00:38:26.880 future is right a podcast did on asians which i found really interesting and i'm going to quote

00:38:31.340 something here because he's he's talking about real studies here like i don't love all of the ideas

00:38:36.100 that he draws from it but i found it really interesting so one thing to note is if you look at infants

00:38:42.360 like six months old people who are like there are not gender differences in infants you see massive

00:38:46.820 differences in like very very young infants in terms of behavioral patterns it is very clear that

00:38:53.780 we are pre-coded to be different as genders but you also see ethnic differences which i wasn't as aware

00:38:59.700 of oh okay the face of a 48 year old chinese baby with a cloth it may clear its mouth for a way to

00:39:08.500 breathe but it will otherwise stay passive the white baby will go to war its arms will flail with

00:39:15.100 all the force it can muster against the unidentified creature that's intruded its rights that's the way

00:39:20.060 he he about words this okay was looking at this had a p value of 0.001 oh so this is a really strong

00:39:29.340 and you can say was there bias in the study in a 2005 book and i'm quoting him now the u chicago

00:39:34.340 professor who carried out this study and its follow-up the 1970s describes his inspiration

00:39:38.960 for it as talking to his chinese american wife about different cultural upbringings

00:39:43.940 babies have no culture a conformist baby becomes a conformist adult this is him quoting here of course

00:39:50.460 we be free and creative people not drones so this is the way he sees it i don't see it this way okay

00:39:56.220 but i did find this very interesting and i actually have video of these old studies

00:40:00.480 of the babies yeah you can see how the different babies react to this on earth but

00:40:07.620 there's going to be if you look at confucius culture which we you know talked about in the last

00:40:15.340 video on lower east asian fertility rate so like really preferring hierarchy and conformity that is

00:40:22.400 going to genetically reward people who have these preferences i guess trusting of authority figures

00:40:30.440 trusting of authority figures in the system and you see this in the u.s even even though

00:40:34.200 the democrats like the the east asian population in the u.s is the most effed population by dei and

00:40:40.880 yet they keep voting for democrats it is absolutely wild there no one should be further to the right

00:40:47.340 like they should be like far to the right of white people yeah in terms of their the amount that they

00:40:52.940 contribute to social services if they but they culturally speaking and perhaps even genetically speaking

00:40:58.440 seem to trust authority and hierarchies more but again i don't think this is a bad thing i said this

00:41:04.620 in the last episode progressives pretend they value diversity but then they pretend that everyone's the

00:41:10.460 same how could diversity have value of everyone's the same diversity can only be a strength if we admit

00:41:17.120 that whether it's from a cultural or genetic standpoint there are not better or worse people but

00:41:23.720 people on average are bringing different perspectives and proficiencies to the table

00:41:27.840 and through working with people who are genuinely different from you in the same way that i was able

00:41:33.820 to read this study by a guy who holds many perspectives that i personally find distasteful right i was able

00:41:42.320 to learn things that i never would have seen because of my perspective yeah that's that's a really strong

00:41:47.160 point yeah well and that's why especially why looking in to the work of people from a broad variety of

00:41:56.960 viewpoints is important because if you just stick with the heterodox people like within a certain realm

00:42:04.720 you're just going to see the weird stuff that they see you also have to look at the sources and arguments

00:42:10.920 made by people who say things that are very offensive to you or that are really yeah out of left field

00:42:17.040 for you so so i would argue that the the chinese problem when i read this guy's email and i consider

00:42:23.860 it in context with potential you know cultural differences and perhaps even genetic differences

00:42:28.340 in terms of you know proficiencies and how they choose to relate to the world it actually seems that

00:42:34.360 the core problem of east asian fertility is downstream of a sexist culture if you have a conformist

00:42:40.940 culture that views males and females as two essentially different classes or casts we get

00:42:47.680 this culture where it's easy for a woman or a man to identify more with other men or women especially

00:42:53.400 if you consider the first polls that we were looking at that is my husband or wife is not the core focus

00:42:58.400 of my life whereas if you look at the culture that we come from which is one of the most resistant

00:43:03.980 cultures to fertility collapse or other resistant cultures to fertility collapse like jewish culture

00:43:08.460 they're much more clan based so like our culture and i really see this now that i have kids and i

00:43:15.020 consider my family conceptually in my head i see us more as a clan than a family yeah looking at them

00:43:22.800 i'm like oh yeah i gotta raise the next generation of the clan i gotta play with that you know when i'm

00:43:26.580 playing with my other family members this is our clan's value set this is what we stand for the clan

00:43:31.600 comes first and this is something that was always told to me when i was a kid you know blood thicker than

00:43:35.380 water your family always comes first you know see yourself well i should note that my culture has a

00:43:42.380 pretty unique understanding of family comes first it's competent family comes first incompetent family

00:43:47.700 are worse than trash which is a very interesting way of relating to it yeah i was thinking about you

00:43:52.380 versus like the tiger mom trope and it's really interesting because it's it's a lot more sink or swim

00:43:58.840 it's not so much i'm going to focus on you no matter what even if you're a loser i'm going to keep

00:44:03.580 hammering at you it's more like if you're a loser you're dead to me leave the house we're not going

00:44:09.160 to talk anymore if you're a winner and a lot of people were surprised they were like i haven't

00:44:13.260 because i mentioned like my parents talking about disowning me when i was a kid right if i did x or

00:44:17.240 i did y or i didn't achieve z and i think a lot of people they were like i didn't hear this type of

00:44:22.760 language growing up this type of language is very common in my culture okay it's very common because

00:44:28.440 uh if you are going to have like people can see it as unethical but i actually see it as a highly

00:44:33.260 ethical way of dealing with things if you are going to have a clan based mentality i.e family first

00:44:38.720 this has a huge risk of nepotism i.e you you end up defending clan members who either did something

00:44:45.680 that was obviously immoral which can lead to things like blood feuds with neighboring clans or you end up

00:44:53.120 putting a family in a position that they haven't earned the right to secure and so it's more a clan

00:44:59.140 based system but a clan based system that only maintains ownership of an individual if they have

00:45:05.140 proven that they are worthy of being slurred slotted into like roles within the clan or clan

00:45:12.360 based like business structure uh based on their own competence and and it was made very clear to me

00:45:19.240 if you do not show that you are excellent like if you go to less than an ivy league school you're out

00:45:23.940 if you go to like they were really clear on all of this stuff and i think this is why like

00:45:28.420 all of my cousins went to an ivy league school or oxford or cambridge like it's it's uh and i have a lot

00:45:33.900 of cousins all but one but yeah it's interesting anyway did you have any uh final thoughts here before

00:45:41.980 we move to the next one i i'm just really excited to see where the research goes over time

00:45:48.780 and when we it won't go anywhere that's why all these studies are from like the freaking 40s no

00:45:52.780 but just specifically on on polygenic risk scores related to fertility because i think more people

00:45:57.880 are going to start looking at those but we'll see yeah i mean and a lot of people like why are you

00:46:03.300 looking at this old research you think you could conduct any of these studies today yeah it ain't

00:46:06.800 happening anymore any type of ethnic differences like yeah we're we're different and that's why we

00:46:13.020 benefit working together yeah and as i said in the the last episode you know you want to go on

00:46:17.900 and on about how you know we don't need their conformist hierarchy based culture nothing good

00:46:23.600 is going to come from this well then where are semiconductor fabs buddy okay we got a few but not

00:46:29.140 many a little island out there has most of the world's semiconductor fabs and when they tried to

00:46:34.600 build ones in the united states they said people couldn't follow orders well enough for the plants to

00:46:39.060 operate yeah so well then i i really hope that east asian populations figure out how to develop some

00:46:44.700 high fertility subcultures that are also really high performing because yeah to lose their unique

00:46:51.200 competitive advantages their unique perspectives would be a genuine tragedy so yikes but oh well

00:46:58.140 we'll see what happens love you to death simone i love you too malcolm okay okay so here's a question

00:47:06.820 octavian do you want to marry someone when you grow up like like have a mommy who you marry and then be

00:47:12.140 mommy and daddy to kids yes okay do you want to find that person yourself or do you want daddy to

00:47:18.420 find them for you um i want to find them by myself okay why do you want to find them by yourself

00:47:24.280 because because why why because because you like doing things on your own you like walking home on your

00:47:34.800 own right you get really mad when daddy tries to help you yes why do you like to walk home on your

00:47:39.740 own because i want to what about you titan do you want to be a mama one day

00:47:48.240 do you do you yes yes yes yes

00:47:57.300 likeか��들이 look at the people you guys are adorable yes yeah what do you want torsten

00:48:01.860 if you want to like and subscribe push out button and the youtube channel

00:48:09.700 No.

Based Camp - August 23, 2024

Are Asians Not Having Babies Due to Genetics？ The Equation that Cracked Low Asian TFR

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