How Hosts Flip Gender Roles & Mentally Dominate Women
Episode Stats
Length
1 hour and 24 minutes
Words per Minute
180.32872
Hate Speech Sentences
107
Summary
In this episode, we discuss the concept of host clubs and how they work in the context of the dating scene in East Asia. Simone and I discuss what a host club is, what it means to be a host, and how the hosts work to keep women addicted to them.
Transcript
00:00:00.000
Hello, Simone. I'm excited to be here with you today. Today, I wanted to do something interesting
00:00:04.260
because I was thinking about the concept of host clubs. And for fans who are not familiar with a
00:00:10.520
host club, a host club is something that's very popular across East Asia, particularly well known
00:00:16.220
in Japan, but also in Korea, in Taiwan, in Thailand, and in China. And it is a club where
00:00:24.480
women go to sort of experience dating with guys. And the reason I wanted to go deeper into this is
00:00:30.720
because they are an environment where the typical script that we are dealing with in dating is
00:00:35.600
flipped. Women are hyper desirable and the women pay and simp for the male's attention. And I wanted
00:00:45.660
to better understand how this sort of changes what it means to date, the strategies that are used,
00:00:52.820
what strategies are the hosts using to lock down these women. And as I started to dig into it,
00:01:00.700
I began to realize that the surface level understanding I had of what a host club is,
00:01:06.600
is entirely wrong. And the understanding that you probably have of what a host club is,
00:01:11.600
is entirely wrong. So I'll drop a little stat on you that might help you or reframe the concept of
00:01:18.860
a host club for you. So if you had to guess, for what percent of women that visits host clubs,
00:01:26.460
is sex work their primary form of income? My understanding is it's fairly high. So I'd say
00:01:32.200
maybe 30%. 80%. 80%. I heard though, that getting addicted to host clubs is the pipeline to sex work.
00:01:40.400
Yes. So host clubs as an industry, and the host clubs often manage the female sex work as well.
00:01:48.920
So the men at a host club are sort of like an intermediary form of institutionalized
00:02:00.380
Sort of, yeah. The women go to the host club, and if you're thinking about the pipeline of money for
00:02:07.540
host clubs, hosts themselves are just an intermediary for what is a pipeline that is predominantly female
00:02:14.740
sex work, given that the core income, the money that's flowing from these women is itself coming
00:02:21.580
from sex work. So I want to know, how does this effing happen? How does a woman end up,
00:02:28.900
and a lot of women are fully aware of this as well, starting at a host club, going to a host club,
00:02:36.000
and falling into this pipeline, first of all. And I think you said something there that's really
00:02:41.260
important, and it's something that we'll get to in this, is host clubs are about creating an addiction.
00:02:46.000
It's about getting a woman addicted to a host. But what I also learned from reading,
00:02:51.500
because I was like, I want to read a lot of first-person testimonial, not
00:02:54.160
the Western personalization of what a host club is, right? And what I came to understand
00:03:01.060
is that a host club psychologically for the people who engage with it, the women who engage with it,
00:03:06.940
is way, way, way closer. If you're looking at like, what would be an American analogy,
00:03:14.000
something that you might have experienced with-
00:03:22.640
So specifically, a huge part of the host club is wanting to make your guy like the number one guy
00:03:30.920
in the club. Get him to the top of the charts. Get him to relevance. Very much like the way,
00:03:37.200
if you are unfamiliar with VTubers, people will have like their Oshi or something, right? Like
00:03:42.880
No, I didn't know. So people are playing favorites against VTubers?
00:03:47.120
Well, so the idea is, is that when you have, now this is something that actually comes again
00:03:51.480
from Japanese culture that even the term Oshi does. But the idea is, is that you have a group or not
00:03:58.240
even VTuber, YouTubers more broadly, that you are a large fan of, and you want them to do better.
00:04:07.060
And to, to out-compete the other YouTubers, the other VTubers. In fact, you could say that our job
00:04:16.000
and our relation with our fans is probably more analogous to the relation of most hosts with their
00:04:24.540
guests when contrasted with other American professions. E.g. a lot of people. So obviously
00:04:32.100
we don't have any fans like this. Like we don't have any fans. And as the gold has actually talked
00:04:36.520
about whenever a fan tries to give a donation to him of over a certain amount, like a push to him
00:04:41.940
of over a certain amount, he always rejects it. Cause these like bad things can only come from
00:04:45.720
this, right? Like, and he says when female VTubers have had like fans go crazy and stuff like that,
00:04:51.940
he's like, they should have rejected the $10,000 donation. You know, they should have known better.
00:04:57.220
Because often these, when you actually dig into the, the instances in which you get these really
00:05:02.540
huge payouts and everyone's like, what's happening here? Who's the, you know, the furry who's
00:05:06.960
commissioning these extremely expensive furry arts and everything like that. It is almost never
00:05:11.060
a wealthy person. It is almost always a person going into debt.
00:05:16.900
Very often it's someone stealing from a family member or something like that. When I hear about
00:05:20.860
these often, it's that they've been stealing from like a, a sick grandmother or something. It's
00:05:25.700
horrible. Yeah. Yeah. And so, but the point being is that when you, and this is first of all,
00:05:33.160
very important to understand in this psychology, because you could understand these women as
00:05:36.160
victimized or something like that. When you go in and you start watching a VTuber who you really like,
00:05:42.400
right. And you may be aware from the little signs on their screen of the dollar amounts,
00:05:47.400
bing, bing, bing going on their screen that some people are likely donating to them in a way that
00:05:52.240
it's financially unsustainable. But you watching them, even when you donate to them, if you do,
00:05:59.260
I've never donated to a VTuber, but I, I, you know, I, we're sort of in an overlapping profession
00:06:03.620
here. When you donate to them, you don't feel like you're being exploited, right? Like you don't
00:06:10.760
think that they actually love you. Yes. There's a few like crazy people who think this, but the vast
00:06:16.560
majority of the people who are putting money into that VTuber do not feel like they are now they
00:06:23.440
realize they have a parasocial relationship. They realize that they want the VTuber to do well.
00:06:28.820
They even feel good themselves. If they saw the VTuber topping the charts sports team or something
00:06:34.860
like that. But there is not the direct form of exploitation that we might expect from a host.
00:06:42.840
So before I go further, just, I will note also, this isn't all the time. Some hosts really are
00:06:49.200
a pipeline to just brainwash women. And we'll get into those hosts and how they operate.
00:06:53.200
But for other hosts, it's more like this other pathway. And then you get the addicted women who
00:07:00.180
are the main source of income for the bar because they're just spending so much disproportionately on
00:07:05.220
the bar in the same way that like, you know, I think it's something like 80% of the profits in
00:07:09.700
almost any addictive industry, whether it's gambling or alcohol or cigarettes come from 20%
00:07:15.180
of the buyers. But any thoughts, Simone, before we go further, does this change your, your vision of
00:07:20.080
the, the sanitized host club? We see it or in a host club or whatever.
00:07:23.860
I've listened to some more bleak, sometimes slightly disguised first child accounts, first hand
00:07:40.640
accounts of host club, we'll say victims. So I, I already kind of expected this.
00:07:46.640
Well, I don't know. Oh, continue. I find it more akin to OnlyFans men, like men who end up spending
00:07:55.360
a ton on a woman via OnlyFans than I think anything else. And then that's, that's, that's pretty good
00:08:01.520
as well as an analogy. Like the man isn't exactly being victimized by the woman on OnlyFans, you know,
00:08:07.480
he knows what it is. She knows what it is. I will note here that you do see from after a person leaves
00:08:14.420
the host club world in ecosystem, they often attempt to reframe it as I was fooled into thinking I was
00:08:23.960
It's, it is a little different with these host club relationships because the men often do, I mean, one,
00:08:30.980
there's the physical connection and two, the men are often texting these women saying, oh, will you come
00:08:38.000
tonight? Well, you know, I'm really, I have to meet this goal. They're really pressuring me. They, they use
00:08:43.600
much more personalized tactics. No, no, they do. And another thing that I did not realize about
00:08:47.980
host clubs is it is very common in host clubs for the host to have sexual relations with the client
00:08:54.320
very early in their time together. So after just, so this is, this is really fascinating. If you
00:09:00.580
contrast male and female psychology, whereas a female who was like an escort or something like that
00:09:07.340
may increase her perceived value to a partner by not sleeping with them for a very long time and
00:09:14.360
wanting to extract more money before they sleep with them with women, because women psychologically
00:09:19.420
in print, especially sexually inexperienced women, this is something I experienced a lot
00:09:22.820
back in the day when I was sleeping around. If a woman hadn't slept with anyone, they become like
00:09:27.240
really devoted and obsessed with you. Often if you're the first person they sleep with or any,
00:09:32.500
it happens less if you're in like the top two or three people they sleep with. And it's because
00:09:36.260
female brain seems to be, you can watch our videos on how women who have a higher body count,
00:09:41.220
they lose this oxytocin burst, which causes this sort of like involuntary obsession,
00:09:45.220
but you do see this with women. And so what the host is actually doing here is trying to get to
00:09:51.720
that point as soon as possible with as little money spent as possible, not the most money spent
00:10:00.000
as possible. That's wild. Which is, I think, because it's, it's more, how do you get them
00:10:05.960
hooked? And for men, you don't necessarily get hooked after one sexual encounter. Whereas with
00:10:13.640
women that can be very foundational. Yeah. Wow. I hadn't thought about that element of it. That's
00:10:18.860
really interesting. Yikes. Rewriting their brain psychologically. And then another question we need
00:10:24.660
to answer here is why are host clubs only in East Asia? Why have they never been successful in the
00:10:31.160
West? Yeah. And the answer seems to be, we actually do seem to have an answer to this,
00:10:36.060
is this is my understanding. Okay. And it is that a lot of East Asian women have normalized and
00:10:47.840
romanticized Western sexual norms and gender dimorphic behavior patterns. And the host club
00:10:55.680
allows them to engage in that more. So if you look at interviews, it's something, what was it like a
00:11:02.660
huge chunk? I think it was like 80% of Korean women want to leave the country. And like, what if they
00:11:06.340
could, as an example, when we do our episode on Korea and when you watch interviews with them,
00:11:12.080
what a lot of them will say is their fantasy is going to a place like New Zealand or Australia or
00:11:19.200
the United States, white European men and marrying a man in one of those countries. And the reason they
00:11:27.520
have this fantasy is because of the level of misogyny that they believe that they will be treated with
00:11:32.520
if they marry a man was in their own country and was in their own culture. And the reason why host
00:11:38.740
clubs do not work in the West is Western men are on average, but we just act more like hosts do,
00:11:48.600
I guess you would say. We are nicer to women. And you will see this because as I read through this
00:11:54.980
and you hear the things that hosts say that are almost written about within some of these sources
00:11:59.940
that I'm going to be drawing from, a lot of them are Asian, as if they are diabolical to say this to a
00:12:04.860
woman. And you'll be thinking, that's a normal thing to say to a woman, isn't it? Like, you look
00:12:10.020
lovely today. I always look forward to talking to you. Tell me about your problems at work.
00:12:19.300
Hello there. Well, hello. How was your day? Do you need to talk? Because I'll just listen patiently
00:12:25.860
and say things like, she's clearly jealous of you. And well, it's his loss. You're a great woman.
00:12:33.980
You deserve a great man for just $24.95 an hour. Yes, please.
00:12:42.860
But the reality is that Western men, yeah, there's like a small portion of like super
00:12:47.760
misogynistic Western men who like train themselves to not act like this. But historically and in modern,
00:12:56.460
even in a modern parlance, Western men, this is the way that we are raised to treat women.
00:13:01.860
And so there's less of an appeal for that. If there was a bar where there were a bunch of male
00:13:07.460
waiters who said that stuff to women in the United States, women would just be like,
00:13:11.400
but I can get this from any simp, you know, like, why are you here? But anyway, to continue.
00:13:18.160
At the most basic level, hosts are young men who provide pseudo romance to multiple women for
00:13:23.980
sometimes exorbitant amounts of money. A host club visit is expensive and can cost around $30 per hour,
00:13:30.020
but this does not include drinks, which are often sold by the bottle with a huge markup.
00:13:34.140
The club where I carried out the bulk of my research charged 80 pounds per bottle of alcohol
00:13:39.200
that would cost 10 pounds at a supermarket. This is what makes bills jump. Women often compete for
00:13:44.580
their host's attention by buying more bottles of alcohol. And it's this system of picking favorites
00:13:49.800
that is the lifeblood of the host club. So very, very interesting here, right? Like what you're seeing
00:13:56.760
is a few phenomenon at play. First, the male host value is artificially augmented upwards for the
00:14:05.820
women because they see other women competing over this individual. And, you know, the,
00:14:11.180
the chef principle, I don't even think I'm gonna bother putting in the cliff here.
00:14:14.120
What's the Garmelik effect? The law of physics that states if one girl screams for something,
00:14:18.560
it will make other girls scream. And then it grows exponentially until all girls within a five
00:14:23.900
mile radius of screaming. So how do boy bands use that? All they do is make videos showing tons
00:14:28.920
and tons of girls screaming for the boy bands. Once you get girls screaming, you can't stop them.
00:14:33.960
They're crazy. Where if women see a bunch of women screaming over a guy, they, there's actually
00:14:39.480
great studies on this. So women will find men more attractive and be more likely to approach them
00:14:46.640
if they have a wedding ring on. Now that's an odd effect. Why do women do that? It seems like
00:14:52.720
it's diabolical. Because women are terrible. Women are terrible. The lady has foolishly attempted to join
00:15:01.920
the conversation with a wild and dangerous opinion of her own. See how the men look at her with utter
00:15:07.100
contempt. Women know your limits. No, but it's because, well, I mean, one, you. Well, it's for the,
00:15:14.240
really, realistically, women do this for the same reason why employers love to hire people from Harvard
00:15:21.940
or Stanford or Yale or some fancy Ivy League, because they know that someone else who allegedly
00:15:28.520
probably did their homework thought them worth accepting. And so they are pre-vetted.
00:15:38.020
But I think that there's a bit more to it than that.
00:15:41.260
When a woman is choosing a mate, which is what they are doing in this context, they are saying,
00:15:47.620
okay, what out of all of the males that I can see or may have access to, especially if they have
00:15:55.100
already given up on the idea of having exclusive access to a male, which basically, you know,
00:15:59.760
biologically, a woman at a host club has. She knows she doesn't have exclusive access to these males.
00:16:04.660
So she's saying, her body's saying, which of these males is going to produce a male child,
00:16:11.260
for example, because 50% of the chance their child's a male, that women are going to want, right?
00:16:16.560
And so if you see other women want that person's genes, you can assume that they will also want
00:16:24.560
the genes of your child. And so this creates that phenomenon. And something you can think here
00:16:30.220
is how can you, as a male out there dating, create this perception?
00:16:37.740
And it's also part of what causes the sort of like flood of partners once you begin to get a few
00:16:45.300
partners. There was somebody in the comments who was like, oh, we all know Malcolm didn't actually
00:16:49.260
sleep around a lot. And so when you've like met my friends growing up, like that's a comical
00:16:54.020
statement. Yeah. But I can understand why people feel that way, because perceptions around what it
00:17:02.000
looks like to be somebody who has an easy time getting. Well, there's also just the general adage of
00:17:06.940
if, you know, someone is conspicuously talking about like, oh, you know, how wealthy they are,
00:17:13.180
you know, maybe they're not actually that wealthy, that kind of stuff.
00:17:16.780
Yeah. Yeah. But the, the, one of the phenomenons that was probably most in my favor and in play in
00:17:23.620
my favor was in the environments where I found it very easy to sleep with lots of people was they knew
00:17:28.940
I slept with lots of people and they knew that I was considered highly desirable and that my time
00:17:34.760
was considered highly desirable. And because of that, it's a, it's a, you know, a rich get richer just
00:17:41.780
because they're already rich. Right. Like it's, it's, it's like, you know, if a super rich person
00:17:47.440
makes a bunch of money in a day or whatever, you're not like, oh, wow, you must've been such
00:17:51.380
a genius. Right. It's like, okay, well now you're already at a stage. Like once you get past 15 or
00:17:58.180
something, it just becomes trivially easy at that point. It's the same way, you know, once you get
00:18:02.080
past your first 500 million or something, you're like, okay, now it's just coasting at this point.
00:18:05.940
Yeah. The more women you sleep with, the more numb you become to them. Ironically, that numbness
00:18:10.960
actually makes you more attractive to certain women because you finally act attached and calm
00:18:15.480
around them. So you end up in this weird loop because you get laid so often, you stop caring
00:18:20.200
as much. And because you don't care as much, you get laid even more. And that's, that's part of what
00:18:24.660
we're seeing was in this phenomenon. But to continue here, the first visit resembles a speed dating
00:18:32.360
event. You talk to a new host every 10 to 15 minutes. And at the end of the hour, you are
00:18:38.380
encouraged to choose one to invite back to your table for a longer conversation. From then on,
00:18:43.540
he is your shime or designated host, wherever you go in the club, he is the one you talk to.
00:18:49.020
It is a permanent relationship. It relies on the host, not just being attentive to his customers,
00:18:53.640
likes and dislikes, but also on his ability to mold himself into what she is looking for that evening.
00:19:00.040
He is responsible for her emotional well-being and enjoyment for the hour or two she is in the
00:19:04.100
club. So this is really interesting here. Don't you have to sign a contract after the first night
00:19:10.040
with one too? Yeah. So they often sign contracts being like, I won't go to other clubs. I won't
00:19:15.480
visit other shime. I won't. Yeah. Like you're exclusive with them after that point. Yeah. No,
00:19:20.840
no other man at that club can walk up to you after that point. You belong to him. Yeah. Which is
00:19:28.380
really interesting, right? Yeah. Because you don't see this in the male to female direction,
00:19:33.620
right? And you don't hear about this happening, say, at strip clubs in the United States.
00:19:38.460
Right. And it has to do with relationship, I think, from an evolutionary standpoint. The idea of a
00:19:45.400
multi-party harem in nature, like in tribes and stuff like that, is something you actually see very
00:19:51.960
frequently across human populations and is part of our evolved biology. Now it's pretty rare for a
00:19:57.840
successful cultural group to adapt this, but it was much more common in East Asia than it was in
00:20:02.380
the West. Specifically in Europe, cultures that adopted this were typically out-competed by cultures
00:20:07.540
that didn't adopt it. Whereas in East Asia, you don't see that as much. You do see a slight trend
00:20:12.180
of cultures that are more monogamous to out-compete ones that aren't, but you still see some non-monogamous
00:20:17.180
cultures succeeding. But in these non-monogamous cultures, it is always multiple women to one male.
00:20:21.960
Never multiple males to one female. Women really prefer, even when a guy has other partners,
00:20:27.660
that they have one male. And this makes sense because in that context, at least somebody has
00:20:33.320
some reason to share resources with you when you get pregnant, right? Like there is at least some
00:20:39.100
understanding of fraternity. If there are multiple males, there is no reason for anyone to invest in
00:20:43.120
you except for your already biological relatives. And in the rare tribes where a woman just does sleep
00:20:51.300
around randomly with whoever she feels like it, the role of father is typically taken on by her
00:20:56.940
brother. Because that is the male in the tribe who has the most certainty that he is a biological
00:21:03.740
relative to that child. Yeah. Which I think is really fascinating. Yeah. Now I'm going to actually
00:21:09.240
go here. I'm going to skip to something I had grabbed later because I wanted to go into what an actual
00:21:15.280
host said. Like how does he secure partners? Ooh. This is actually translated from Japanese. So
00:21:22.220
you're getting straight to the source here. Okay. All right. Okay. Exposed too. So this isn't even
00:21:27.280
like he was interviewed or something, right? This is just like what I do. And his picture was very
00:21:31.300
hosty. He looked like a host club member. What? Like androgynous? Yeah. Spiky hair.
00:21:37.560
It was like the glow filter that hosts use. Oh my God. Yeah. I feel like that this comes from
00:21:43.980
Burikura booths, you know, like print club, those little arcade games where you used to take photos.
00:21:50.620
They'd like all had that glow filter. It's such a thing. I could only imagine like the horror of a
00:21:57.060
strip club guy goes and the woman's like, okay, you're signing a contract saying you're never going
00:22:00.600
to go to any other strip club. You're only going to see me when you're here. A guy would be like,
00:22:05.740
yeah, no. No, I'm not sure I'm interested in this. I'll buy. Okay. Bye. Okay. When it comes to
00:22:17.160
hosting, there are tons of things to keep in mind, but among them, the most important is remembering
00:22:22.660
things. When interacting with lots of girls, it's impossible to keep everything in your head.
00:22:26.880
So I made a conscious effort to take notes on the info I drew out of each girl and memorize it.
00:22:32.700
People won't take an interest in you unless you show an interest in them. You see what I said?
00:22:38.140
Diabolical. That's really good. And it's, it's not discussed enough among say red pillars who want
00:22:45.580
to spin a lot of plates, who want to have a lot of side checks of like really maximizing their
00:22:53.180
addiction to the men because their approach is all just disregard, maintain frame, play the dread game,
00:22:59.500
like make them feel like you're just going to leave them at any moment. Whereas he's showing
00:23:03.920
more of the carrot approach, which is show that you're the one person who understands them and
00:23:09.200
listens to them. And oh my God, it's so, so underrated. And it's something that is really
00:23:17.560
the failure of the dread game. The dread game is very, very good to play. If you are looking for
00:23:24.780
one-off sexual encounters, if you are looking to get people who are addicted and obsessed with you,
00:23:33.440
the dread game is a lot less effective. And that's the point of the host, right? And you're actually
00:23:39.520
looking for something of an inversion of the dread game here.
00:23:42.120
And this is where men who follow the dread game or fall into all of this, you know, sort of overly
00:23:48.560
misogynistic red pill stuff, get a wrong perception of women that completely screws up their ability
00:23:55.300
to date. They're like, Malcolm, are you telling me? I've seen that women go crazy over like male
00:24:01.260
murderers who get sent to prison and all of these terrible men and everything like that who've done
00:24:06.420
these terrible things. You're telling me that they like it when a guy pays attention to them and
00:24:11.100
remember things about them and acts like he cares about them. And I'm like, wait, wait, wait,
00:24:14.620
do you notice that nothing you just said is contradictory to what we're talking about here?
00:24:18.960
Do you think these host club men who are manipulating women and women know that these
00:24:24.100
men professionally manipulate women into becoming essentially smex slaves and then sell them out
00:24:31.560
so that they can pay them so that they can win their little, you think these are nice guys?
00:24:36.300
You think these are good guys in a woman's mind? No. Oh God, no. When you look at the,
00:24:41.840
when I say, oh, women aren't really into muscular guys that much, if you look at the guys that women
00:24:46.700
obsess over on, say, Tumblr, people say, oh, oh, these tall, skinny, top hat guys that they all like
00:24:54.780
on Tumblr, they must be all saints. I'm like, oh, no, they're usually like demons and mass murderers
00:24:59.820
and destroyers of the environment. They're not nice. They're not nice at all. You have confused
00:25:06.180
your perception of masculine ruthlessness with the ideal female perception of masculine ruthlessness.
00:25:15.040
And a lot of men, well, we'll read through the full thing first. Yeah. You'll see like, wait,
00:25:21.840
is that really, is that how this insidious thing is done? So he goes, if you ask about something you
00:25:27.140
heard in the past all over again, it makes it feel like you have no interest in them, which is a total
00:25:32.520
turnoff. So before moving up, review your notes to avoid asking the same things about that. With
00:25:39.260
the info you gathered, you can decide on presence, sales approaches, aftercare, offsite plans, and so
00:25:46.020
on. So a few things to note here. One thing that is very common among hosts, which you would not see
00:25:50.540
as hookers, is offsite activities. Now we noted that they often have sex with the people who they're
00:25:56.560
seeing, but they will also do things like go to Disney World, go to bakeries. Oh my gosh, what?
00:26:01.420
Yeah. Do typical romance. Take you on dates. Yeah. Take you on dates in a very stereotypically
00:26:09.000
romantic fashion. Right. And this is much more resembles the acts. This is so odd to say,
00:26:16.060
but of a, a salesperson, a corporate salesperson. Yeah. Like I'm going to take you to a Mets game.
00:26:23.760
I'm going to take you to an, on a hunting trip or on a, you know, to the, a nice restaurant
00:26:29.120
because it's building that relationship and that like favoritism above and beyond logic. That's so
00:26:35.220
interesting. Yes. And something else that's really fascinating here is that they, what are they
00:26:42.040
saying? That they, very important. It's not just to remember her interests, right? Like I think a lot
00:26:48.700
of guys, they're like, okay, I need to remember her interests, but no, you have to remember the
00:26:53.500
conversations you have used with her in the past, because if you are talking and hitting up lots of
00:26:59.080
girls at once, which, you know, back when I used to flirt a lot, I would do, I would try to have a
00:27:03.900
policy of always be talking to on any given night, like at least three girls at a time. And this was
00:27:09.900
through multiple chat threads and you can easily develop sort of go-to questions to advance the,
00:27:18.100
either the relationship or just to, you know, for interaction and end up using your go-to questions
00:27:23.680
more than once with one girl. And any guy who has practiced high throughput dating is very aware of
00:27:29.800
this. With you, for example, Simone, did you notice me ever accidentally asking you the same go-to
00:27:34.500
question twice early in our relationship? Never, never. Because I took notes and a lot of guys don't do
00:27:41.280
this. They don't take time to take notes, right? So to continue here, if you ask about something you
00:27:47.980
heard, sorry, before meeting up, review your notes to avoid asking the same things and be careful
00:27:53.480
about that. And I'll note here with Simone, the day that I went on a date with her, that was my second
00:27:58.420
date that day, right? Like I was doing extremely high throughput dating. Now, ironically, so was she,
00:28:02.940
that was her second date that day as well. We were, we were in it to win it in terms of finding a marriage
00:28:08.440
partner or you were just looking for someone to have sex with for the first time, but I was looking for
00:28:12.860
a marriage partner back then. But we were both completely like, we have to make this happen.
00:28:17.940
And that requires extremely high throughputs, right? Which unfortunately for this generation
00:28:24.760
aren't as possible. And they need to develop new strategies on how to achieve that and to create
00:28:30.260
these psychological framings like the ones that the hosts do. So for me, I was able to create a high
00:28:37.320
throughput because on dating apps back then, if you just reached out to a lot of people, you could get a
00:28:41.580
bunch of people reaching out to you. That's not the case anymore. You swipe right all week and you're
00:28:45.180
going to get one or two matches, right? Terrible. Yeah. So you need an environment where you can have
00:28:51.560
directed outreach, like direct emails, direct LinkedIn, like et cetera. Like if I was dating today,
00:28:57.660
that's probably a lot of, yeah, a lot of people, well, I feel like five years ago, people used X and
00:29:03.920
LinkedIn a lot. I bet they still are. But honestly, I feel that the bigger trend now is people are just
00:29:10.800
giving up. Yeah. The bigger trend now is people are just giving up, which is sad. I tell you what,
00:29:16.940
I'd never give up. I was obsessive about this stuff. I mean, keep in mind the things I did back in the
00:29:23.760
day, the core thing I did to like get good was the reason I would always run a few chats at a time
00:29:30.860
and have to be very careful about not repeating things is because I used basically pre-written text
00:29:37.100
blocks with minor variations to fit that individual conversation to try to build was like a
00:29:44.020
statistical probability in my mind. No, I didn't like write out the statistical probability. It was
00:29:47.680
more just like get a feel. Okay. This chain always leads to this chain always leads to this to sort of
00:29:54.100
build branching conversational pathways that I could reliably steer to certain end states that I was
00:30:01.940
looking for. And there really is only so much like once you've run mass conversations over and over
00:30:07.500
and over and over again, you realize pretty quickly that, I mean, humans are a lot like AIs, right? Like
00:30:13.480
they are fairly predictable, especially normies. And there's a lot of normie girls and girls are even
00:30:19.740
more predictable than males, right? So as soon as you figure out the standard operating pattern,
00:30:25.180
and you then figure out the type that you're dealing with, because girls fall into like a few
00:30:30.520
archetypes, goal types, desire types, you can quickly predict whatever is going to come next.
00:30:36.740
If you have a high amount of pattern matching in the past to continue here with the info that you've
00:30:44.220
gathered, you can decide on presence sales approaches. Okay. Aftercare, we just talked about
00:30:47.680
that. I think it's really interesting how you, it's like, it's like sales. If you just bombed with
00:30:51.520
questions, it starts feeling pretty transactional. So you've got to watch for that. The info you draw
00:30:57.060
out of her is for getting them to know you are and deepening your relationship. So share about
00:31:02.300
yourself too. Like if you ask their favorite food, then share your favorite food as well. Something
00:31:07.340
like that and expand the conversation from there. And so he says the key pipeline works like this,
00:31:12.840
show interest, draw info out, get them to show interest, give info, remember, take notes.
00:31:21.520
He says, if you can emergency three things thoroughly, you'll sell to some extent. So try,
00:31:27.220
so give it a try as a reference. Not rocket science people. Oh my God, Malcolm. I, in my,
00:31:36.880
in my admittedly brief experience dating before I met you, you're the only person who bothered to do
00:31:43.080
that. Yeah. Did the, did any of the other guys, I think a lot of guys are like, Oh, a lot of guys
00:31:47.080
really do this. And it's like, no, a lot of guys really don't. They really don't. And this is why
00:31:52.840
also as parents, and I think this is important, even more important as far as we're concerned and
00:31:57.280
many of the people listening, perhaps you can give your kids such a huge advantage if you just teach
00:32:05.040
them this and basic etiquette, just like, cause it, it's not just, especially if it's a young man,
00:32:13.500
it's not just that it signals that they are gentlemanly in a very romantic way. It also
00:32:19.560
implies that they're wealthy, even though that's, it can be somewhat subconscious, but it's this
00:32:25.180
subconscious signaler of wealth that would, even without explicitly communicating to women,
00:32:31.020
even if you tell a young woman, like, Hey, I'm broke. I literally have no money. She will still
00:32:36.020
subconsciously see you and code you as wealthy. If you have basic etiquette and like this social
00:32:42.420
intelligence to ask questions and engage in real conversation. So this is actually incredibly
00:32:48.940
important because when you say this and men can be like, Oh, come on, that, that can't be that easy
00:32:54.720
to work. Look at the way that male hosts dress. Okay. No, like pull up and I'll put some pictures
00:33:02.660
on screen here. Okay. What men at a host club dress like and what they dress like is well-groomed
00:33:10.680
button-down shirts and suits, often ties. Oh yeah. Bow ties. Yeah. They're not dressed comfortably for
00:33:19.300
them. So, you know, like women, like the, the male equivalent of a stripper woman or like a woman
00:33:27.620
dressed as a call girl, like go, go boots, mini skirt, pushup bra, whatever. Right. Is a suit
00:33:35.060
and a tie. Like this is male lingerie. I can't emphasize this enough. A man in a well-tailored
00:33:41.900
suit is the sexiest thing. And I know it's maximum clothing, but like, then this is obviously it's,
00:33:48.340
it's interestingly so reversed. If you look at like a gay dating app, all you see is like
00:33:52.920
six pack torsos, like just cut off the head. We don't need to see the face. Like just show me
00:33:57.980
your abs and your muscles. But for women, it is like, no, just cut off the face. Just show me the
00:34:05.340
tailored suit. Well, and it's not just that. If you look at the hosts, they are trained to be
00:34:10.260
incredibly well mannered. Manners are incredibly important in securing a partner.
00:34:16.840
I think you can also tell that this is a genuine signal that is irresistible to women. When you look
00:34:23.060
at periods in history, where you see the huge spike in romance novel, historical romance novel
00:34:30.940
settings. And this is why, for example, the Regency era is so popular is you had not only a preponderance
00:34:38.100
of manners, but a very organized and active society in which people got together to show off
00:34:48.540
those manners. It was like this unique peak in human history where that happened a lot.
00:34:53.660
So it just goes to show like women love this and they will, they will jump to, to fantasize in periods
00:34:59.660
of history where it is more likely to be shown because they just want to sit in that, in that
00:35:04.420
moment. And I think that for guys who didn't grow up in an environment where they were taught manners,
00:35:10.140
they can hear this and be like, well, where do I learn this? You know, go to AI, go, go online,
00:35:16.420
research common manners, and keep in mind the manners that are going to impress a woman the most
00:35:20.720
are the manners that are directed towards women. So easy ones that I'm always surprised. There is one
00:35:28.160
that I explicitly don't do because I think it comes off as weird.
00:35:31.140
Up when she stands up. Standing up at the table whenever a woman stands up. That one to me comes
00:35:35.380
off as too much. But opening car doors for women is what, like a lot of people remember to open other
00:35:40.440
doors, but when you're walking to a car because you're opening your own door, a lot of people
00:35:43.860
don't remember, oh, I need to run to the passenger side first and get her door, close it, then get my
00:35:49.440
door. So one of my favorite books of all time is the Emily Post, like 1942. No guy is going to read
00:35:56.000
that. I know. I'm aware of that. I'm just going to say what she says in it because she's very,
00:35:59.820
she's very no nonsense and pragmatic about etiquette, which I think a lot of people wouldn't
00:36:04.940
expect. And you're describing like performative post sense cotillion etiquette, you know, stand
00:36:11.740
up when the woman stands up. It's really stupid. And it's based on old traditions that don't actually
00:36:16.360
make sense. What Emily Post trains people in and what you really should be looking at is what I would
00:36:22.100
call functional etiquette, which is just making, you could say human commerce or like human interaction
00:36:29.620
or people's lives easier, more transparent and more comfortable. So it's not about doing things in a
00:36:35.680
performative manner. It's about actually making someone's life more pleasant and easy. It's about
00:36:40.840
clear communication. It's about reducing stress and friction. So doing things like opening doors for
00:36:45.580
people is, is nice because it makes their lives easier. It's just, but I think you're forgetting
00:36:51.120
that a part of this goes back to what you originally said was it is a subtle and subconscious indicator to
00:36:57.720
women of wealth and desirability and class status. So even the pointless ones, like a good example of a
00:37:05.920
pointless one that's not really relevant anymore, but women do notice is that you always walk street
00:37:11.920
side whenever you're walking on a sidewalk with them. And it's important to also understand why
00:37:17.440
you're doing things because if a woman asks you, why are you doing this? And you explain, oh, I do it
00:37:22.940
because historically when carriages would rise through sewage, which was on the street, it could
00:37:27.920
splash the woman. And so men traditionally walk on this side of a woman and a woman appreciates that
00:37:33.300
because you're showing more than just like rope class, but knowledge that comes with class, right?
00:37:38.780
Well, also defenestrated excrement was more likely to fall a little bit further from buildings.
00:37:44.680
The, the secondary thing. And even your feminists who say, oh, I don't like, I don't like being
00:37:49.340
treated this way. They like it. They, they like things like that. Like a lot of men, I I've only,
00:37:54.460
I've seen it complained about more men saying, oh, I hold a door open and the woman rolls her eyes and
00:38:00.700
say, oh, I can do that. But I've never seen that happen. And both men and women, because I hold
00:38:05.820
doors for people all the time are always like, thank you. Like they genuinely appreciate it.
00:38:12.500
Cause as much as I, I am the ultimate hater of opening doors, which is why I bother to hold
00:38:16.980
them. Like if I, if I went through the trauma of opening a door, damn straight, I'm holding
00:38:22.600
it for like the next 10 people. I'm going to get maximum. Yeah. No, I want to go back to what
00:38:28.840
we were talking about earlier, because I think it's another important thing that men get wrong
00:38:32.160
in dating today. We've shown you how hosts dress. Simone, how was I dressed on our first
00:38:37.800
date when I was looking for a wife? What, what was I wearing? You're wearing a button down
00:38:42.280
Brooks brothers shirt with a tie and a vest from Ferragamo. Yes, that is, that is correct.
00:38:53.440
That was what I mean. You don't need to mention the brand. I'm sure. Did you notice the brands
00:38:57.100
when you first saw me? No, I didn't know. Like you introduced me to Ferragamo as a brand.
00:39:04.180
I mean, I don't wear anything fancy now. I only wore fancy things when I was trying to
00:39:07.540
attract a partner, but that's the thing that the, the, the, the peacocking one is the one
00:39:11.820
saying they're going to be doing less in the relationship. And I definitely pull less weight
00:39:14.860
than you in this relationship. But the point being is if you take away the brand names, what
00:39:19.120
I was wearing was a pressed button down, nice shirt with a tie and a vest and matching suit
00:39:30.660
pants to that vest. And you were wearing jeans actually. Oh, I might've been wearing jeans that
00:39:34.960
day. Okay. Yeah. Texas talks. That's your culture, Malcolm. Respect it. My culture. Right. But the
00:39:39.600
later after that, I, I, there was a period where I usually wore suit pants. But anyway, the point
00:39:43.860
being is that when I was trying to attract a partner for marriage, I didn't dress like this.
00:39:49.600
No. The outfit that you have seen me wear on the show is one that I adopted because it's
00:39:54.360
utilitarian and dad-like of the typical, you know, button down collar. And I wore that specifically
00:40:00.200
because of what I was trying to present to the audience I'm selling to, which is the Mr. Rogers
00:40:04.820
look is what I was going to. But then I realized it came off too lesbian-ish because lesbians have
00:40:09.420
appropriated that. Appropriated the dad look. And so now I'm trying to go
00:40:13.860
for something more medieval, similar to Simone's. I haven't got my medieval jacket yet, but I've
00:40:17.900
got my medieval style top at this point that I'm going to be able to wear with the-
00:40:21.920
To be clear, it's not a jacket. It's a gambeson.
00:40:24.180
The medieval. Yeah. It's like a armor thing that I'll be wearing on show. So now Simone and
00:40:29.400
I, she, she had the top armor thing right here and I'll have a armor thing.
00:40:33.000
Yeah. This is like a, just a neck-based gambeson. Gambesons are multi-layered, sometimes filled
00:40:38.380
with extra wool padded garments that existed more widespread before chainmail, but were often worn
00:40:45.580
under chainmail. Yeah. So I'll be wearing the medieval style tops. And I got a few different
00:40:50.100
versions of this coming with like light armor, similar to what Simone is wearing now. So that,
00:40:55.080
because people always ask, the reporters always ask, and I feel bad about it. They're like, why do you,
00:40:58.260
why do you dress your wife this way and you dress normal? They act like I'm forcing her to dress like
00:41:04.660
a medieval peasant. And I'm like, you're right. I should be doing it too. Look, I even got my
00:41:09.980
medieval style pants, medieval style midsection here. Well, I'll have to take a full body photo,
00:41:16.580
but I'm not only going to do it once we get your proper- My proper gambeson and everything. Yeah.
00:41:21.140
Yeah. It's, it's all about the layers. You can't really just wear something in isolation and have it-
00:41:26.740
But the, the second thing I wanted to note about these men that you see, and this doesn't look good
00:41:31.800
at all without a jacket. So I definitely need to get the jacket for it. It needs the gambeson. Yeah.
00:41:35.080
It looks a little too like BS-A without the jacket on top. Yeah. That's the problem with
00:41:40.120
anything. It has like excessive eyelets or metal or snaps these days. They've ruined it. Oh.
00:41:48.240
Yeah. This is, by the way, the style that's typically open right here. I just don't like to
00:41:52.480
wear anything open here, which is why it doesn't look as normal for a medieval outfit. But the other
00:41:57.960
thing I want you to note about pictures, again, pictures of host club members is what did they
00:42:04.760
physically look like? Because we, I mentioned this over and over and over again on the show,
00:42:10.120
and men who came out of the Red Spill diaspora are just completely blind to this. And they,
00:42:17.280
at a pathological level, refuse to accept what women actually go for, because they'll look at the
00:42:24.280
studies that look at what women find arousing. And it doesn't matter what women find arousing.
00:42:33.600
That's not who they want to date or obsess over. If you go to Tumblr and you look at the pictures
00:42:39.140
that women draw, right? It's what's the typical Tumblr's sexy man. Let's start with the basic
00:42:46.060
definition. Tumblr's sexy man is a phrase used to describe any number of characters that have
00:42:50.740
reached viral Tumblr fame due to their alleged attractiveness. These characters are often drawn
00:42:55.560
as skinny white anime boys dressed in formal wear, and more often than not, they're evil or at least
00:43:00.620
have a dark side. These characters include, but aren't limited to the once-lift from the Lorax,
00:43:05.300
Sans from Undertale, Raymond from Animal Crossing, and Jeff the Killer. To fuck. The phenomenon of skinny
00:43:10.680
white anime boys from cartoons becoming Tumblr's obsession began in 2012, but the ironic phrase
00:43:16.200
Tumblr's sexy man wouldn't be coined until around 2013 to 2014. By this point, the trend was way too
00:43:22.760
widespread and prevalent not to notice and comment on, and thus it was given a name and became a meme.
00:43:27.400
It's like a- The once-lurr. The once-lurr, like the guy from Hasbun Hotel, you know, the- the- the-
00:43:34.560
Sherlock and Watson. It's- it's- it's a overly skinny guy-
00:43:39.520
Lucky, yeah. In a suit with a top hat that looks a little fae and is like mostly evil.
00:43:47.140
Mostly evil, yeah. The sexy man in question is a character called Alistair the radio demon.
00:43:53.380
You know the drill by this point. Tall, skinny, bowtie, suit, sharp teeth, magical eyes, non-human,
00:43:59.020
edgy and evil and powerful, etc, etc. What makes Alistair interesting is the meta conversation that
00:44:04.620
surrounds his very existence. Is Alistair the radio demon? Bait. He fits into every single trope laid
00:44:11.540
out by the characters that came before him almost to a T. From the sexypedia wiki, quote,
00:44:16.460
he is infamous for looking like he was specifically designed to bait the sexy man fandom and then
00:44:20.980
actually getting it. Alistair actually wasn't the first Tumblr sexy man to be accused of being bait.
00:44:26.040
Black Hat, a character from the animated web series Villainess, has also been noted as fitting a little
00:44:30.980
too perfectly into the trope to the point where many are convinced he's either bait or parody.
00:44:35.600
If this is true, then Alistair and Black Hat may symbolize the next evolution in the tropes timeline,
00:44:42.740
A lot of guys show that they just fundamentally don't understand what women like when they say
00:44:48.560
this stuff because they have learned what women want from male-dominated communities, which
00:44:52.560
don't understand what women want. They get part of it correct. Women do like the scary,
00:45:01.800
Machiavellian, sociopathic guy, but they want that with a dash of charm and skinniness and levity,
00:45:11.480
which is what's provided for them in a host club environment.
00:45:15.820
These guys are not good guys. They are the antithesis of good guys. In many ways,
00:45:23.540
the guy who sits down and meticulously draws out information from a woman to take notes,
00:45:28.860
to make her believe that she loves him, and she knows he's doing this, that is more Machiavellian
00:45:35.200
than the grumbliest of dread game Andrew Tate guys there have ever been.
00:45:40.160
And what's provided for them with the Tumblr sexy man.
00:45:44.280
Whereas you have a guy, if you watch a scene like this, and your takeaway is,
00:45:47.840
oh, that's Faye, that's lame, I would make fun of him. You've got to remember that women,
00:45:53.500
when they watch this, takes away, that's hot, I want to obsess over him,
00:45:58.260
which shows that you are optimizing around the wrong things.
00:46:04.180
Alistair, pleasure to be meeting you, sweetheart. Quite a pleasure.
00:46:07.080
Excuse my sudden visit, but I saw your fiasco on the picture show,
00:46:13.320
That's why I haven't been that entertained since the stock market crash of 1929.
00:46:20.000
Stop. I'm not going to let you hurt anyone here.
00:46:35.760
No, but if you, if you look at these hosts, right,
00:46:48.200
These are the ones that have entire armies of women
00:46:51.260
that are prostituting themselves for these men to live the high life, right?
00:47:03.100
Hitting the gym is for intra-secular signaling.
00:47:10.320
If you're looking at the payoff you're going to get
00:47:14.700
from dressing well, from keeping your outfit well done,
00:47:20.540
And note here, the other thing about all these men is,
00:47:45.460
So, yeah, but the point I'm making is that that's the way they come off.
00:48:21.420
because they have these ideas around what women are actually after
00:48:31.280
it is what women might disproportionately prefer for casual sex.
00:48:36.660
I could just, I can see how this happens, though, right?
00:49:06.200
I had a friend that was, like, in shorter than me.
00:49:20.260
Like, they'd rather share a better-looking guy.
00:49:24.000
In reality, they want something that, you know,
00:49:25.800
they're talking to a guy that's talking actively
00:49:28.060
to multiple people that they don't even know about.
00:49:32.780
misattributing why everyone is sleeping with his friend
00:49:38.080
He thinks it's because his friend is more attractive
00:49:58.880
what's the style of book that, like, only women read?
00:50:09.560
They are never overly muscular, or very, very rarely.
00:50:13.840
I mean, in Heated Rivalry, sort of the most famous recent.
00:50:25.220
I cannot remember what their bodies looked like,
00:50:27.720
even though they were, like, in episode one instantly.
00:50:40.220
Hockey players should be more beefy, but I don't know.
00:50:54.920
Like, and I think the reason why some men, like,
00:51:14.240
There's definitely women with a fetish for that, you know?