00:00:00.000Hello, Simone. I'm excited to be here with you today. Today, we are going to be talking about
00:00:03.860a number of studies that were reconfirmed recently. So this is the third time that
00:00:11.520these studies have been tested and reconfirmed. So this is a very robust finding at this point.
00:00:17.680And I want to talk about them and talk about the implications of this for civilization,
00:00:23.980strategies, culture, and how society is going to change in the future.
00:00:27.980so a study that a lot of people are aware of is the study titled will intelligent latter-day
00:00:35.720saints and smart conservatives inherit the earth and what this study looked at because a lot of
00:00:41.420people were familiar that it looked at latter-day saints versus non-latter-day saints and when i
00:00:46.820heard the results of this study initially uh some people misframed it as saying latter-day saints
00:00:53.280are one of the few religions that has eugenic effects like the the culture of the latter-day
00:00:59.360saints has eugenic effects on the people who follow that religion um this is not actually
00:01:05.460what it showed it just just looked at latter-day saints versus non-latter-day saints and now newer
00:01:10.820studies have looked at other religious groups and they have a similar effect um well at least
00:01:17.360christian groups more than a second and and there's been some people who said that this effect
00:01:21.920has died down in latter-day saints i we actually had a fan who did a really cool thing he went
00:01:27.500through utah and then went by region to find the uh effects of earning and iq by looking at it
00:01:37.540regionally and the amount that the region was the sort of fanatically latter-day saint and and this
00:01:44.400guy can pin his results if he wants to in the in the comments he did this sort of recreationally
00:01:49.280himself and he found something very interesting which we'll also talk about in this because i
00:01:54.300think it adds to this a lot which is in his findings at least was in the latter day saints
00:02:00.240the very very very most religious individuals actually began to have lower fertility rates
00:02:07.580now they weren't below the non-religious individuals but the highest fertility rates
00:02:11.520are in the kind of religious individuals like the the yeah i'm really into that but not super into
00:02:20.520that um and it's interesting i point this out because at least anecdotally this is what i see
00:02:27.040in other cultures this is what i see was like the catholics for example of the catholics i know who
00:02:33.520are like super high fertility when i've pointed this out before it's not the fanatical ones it's
00:02:39.900the ones who are it enjoyably culturally catholic like they really have fun being culturally catholic
00:02:46.720but they don't really care about the theology stuff that much let's let's get into the data
00:02:51.900here and then we can go into what might be causing that phenomenon i mean i think that phenomenon is
00:02:55.520kind of obvious if you've seen the two groups i don't know how much i need to go into it
00:02:58.980but well within casalism you're going to be like well obviously you know the most catholic people
00:03:03.920are going to be nuns or priests so they're not going to have any kids at all but the fact that
00:03:07.540you don't see that in the latter day saints and they also have a fewer number of kids i think it's
00:03:11.160because they are just not particularly like the more you get heady about religion the less you
00:03:18.800care about the concerns of this earth and the less interested you are in playing out those roles
00:03:25.600you're more interested in i mean i think that the opus de are a perfect example of this like they0.89
00:03:30.620should be one of the the coolest and most based groups of catholics and yet 30 of them are celibate
00:03:36.400like just to be celibate right well you can be based and celibate but yeah i mean it's or the0.60
00:03:41.240the i mean with the mormons like the most religious of them might have trouble operating
00:03:47.480in society they may be too basically nerdy to date or find partners fast enough and they may
00:03:54.860not even care that they're not finding a partner because they have so much belief in sort of the
00:03:59.920theological backdrop is going to protect them. But let's continue with this study, because this
00:04:06.600study didn't plot the graphs like that. It was just plotting like straight lines, like does this
00:04:10.180matter or not? So the first study, the one that most people are aware of, it looked at expected
00:04:15.460fertility rate versus intelligence, and then divided people into extremely liberal, centrist,
00:04:20.480and extremely conservative. And what we can see very, very interestingly is that when they are
00:04:26.760very unintelligent, being progressive actually leads you to have a higher fertility rate than
00:04:33.780being conservative. Why would that be? Dumb conservatives have fewer kids than dumb
00:04:44.140progressives why why why why i guess maybe to successfully marry as a conservative you have to1.00
00:04:58.200be smarter and then if you're progressive though you're not getting married to have like before
00:05:06.280having kids you're just having kids kind of by mistake yeah okay so if you're conservative if
00:05:11.100you're having kids presumably it's because you're getting married that requires that you are
00:05:17.780attractive enough to get married you're ambitious enough to get married you have enough conscientiousness
00:05:22.900to do it and then you're having kids oh actually that's a good point especially for conservative
00:05:27.820men because conservatives have children in wedlock um what that means is that if a man doesn't have
00:05:33.980money he can't find a partner and he can't get married and therefore he doesn't have kids which
00:05:38.160is a much healthier way for society to act than just do whatever you want yeah which unfortunately0.65
00:05:44.160i mean i really it is so wild to me that and i think that what's his name homath has a very
00:05:53.240interesting episode where he goes into this he talks about how basically western civilization
00:06:01.040reached a place on like the the hierarchy of like their own thoughts and and the way that
00:06:07.400they were structuring society where they actually thought like you could just be like yeah do whatever
00:06:12.500you want like of course that's going to work rules are all basically bad because everybody i know
00:06:18.400if they didn't have rules it's like when when we as a society like first had this idea
00:06:26.340most of the places of power where it was being spewed from and even even still that that spew
00:06:35.200it to some extent it seemed like a perfectly reasonable thing to say like of course we can
00:06:41.960just have people do whatever they want and that will have no negative repercussions right because
00:06:48.020everybody i know if you just said do whatever you want they wouldn't you know go out and
00:06:56.340slut it up you know they wouldn't go murder people or rob stores or great children and i think what
00:07:05.000we're seeing in our society now is like okay we unfortunately and what he pointed out there is
00:07:13.740it's sort of ironic that it was the very level of civilizational development that we had reached0.98
00:07:19.720that allowed us to even conceive of such a stupid idea that caused the civilization to collapse0.80
00:07:26.320and he argued within that video i think very interestingly that you know this has happened0.98
00:07:31.420multiple times. He's like, this is basically what happened with Islam. If you watch our video
00:07:35.140on how Islam went from one of the strictest moral cultures to one of the most debauched moral1.00
00:07:39.600cultures, you could argue, I mean, maybe this was part of that, right? They basically hit a point1.00
00:07:46.560where it was such a debauched society. And like in that video, we go over a number of examples of
00:07:52.540this. I think people today sort of forget that Islam was ever seen as the Java, the Hatha society,
00:07:59.360the endless harems and parties and drinking and everything like that that it basically just
00:08:05.460collapsed out of any form of efficiency and i'd also note here that a lot of people
00:08:13.900misattribute all of this like many of the the the falling apart of civilization
00:08:21.480to the ideals of the enlightenment and not to the ideals of uh the 1970s and or even let's say the
00:08:32.2001920s to 1970s is really where things begin to to break apart uh and when people began to say
00:08:40.440oh you could do whatever you want whatever you want in the ideals of the enlightenment
00:08:44.840for those who like haven't studied this cultural period the idea that you would give people
00:08:52.040something for like not hard work was a complete anathema their utopias were very like many people
00:09:03.060throughout the enlightenment tried to create utopias but you today these utopias would not
00:09:09.080be recognizable to any modern progressive. They'd be like, I'm going to create a factory city where
00:09:16.820every day people will spend this amount of time praying and this amount of time studying science
00:09:23.020and no one will be allowed to drink or sing. And we're going to have no sex before marriage and
00:09:30.220everyone will live in strict communal housing, strictly gendered communal housing and everything0.69
00:09:35.560like that it was a societal view of order right of we can build society like that that's how they
00:09:44.220that's what the enlightenment was was how can we structure and order society better
00:09:51.040and when the thinkers of the enlightenment attempted to build a country on the ideals
00:09:58.660of the enlightenment the it was a country where most people couldn't vote right like
00:10:03.180America was not like, oh, we'll just do whatever the masses want. It was no, no, no, no, no, no,
00:10:08.560no. Like obviously poor people are tarred. So like it should be. It was obviously, I mean,
00:10:14.940that's what representative democracy was. It was, we will have the people vote for the smartest
00:10:21.800aristocrats or landed gentry, essentially like in their local area and trust that person to make the0.97
00:10:29.640best choice for say who will be president they were never expected it wasn't the people simone
00:10:36.520it was well okay sorry land land owning white men sorry sorry no no no no it wasn't just land
00:10:42.880as i've pointed out catholics can only vote in two states but half the number of states
00:10:46.860non-catholic land owning white men sorry okay um so so i'm sorry not states colonies but the the
00:10:53.480ideal was and note here you say that in a bunch of ways that if you look at it from the perspective
00:10:58.820of the urban monoculture ooh but no this was their way of saying what we want is society to
00:11:05.080be structured where we take the aggregate opinion of educated people who have proven their competence
00:11:12.020and are culturally aligned with us well i mean the the equivalent of it today if we were to sort
00:11:17.200of apply more of our modern values would be like look i respect asmogold i'm just going to select
00:11:25.600him as my representative and then he's just going to decide who's going to be president and who's
00:11:30.860going to you know what laws we pass and stuff and and it has become abstracted from that like now
00:11:37.440it's just the electoral system i'm talking about all the various colonies decided who could vote
00:11:42.520oh and that's very different than the electoral system because i know but what i'm talking about
00:11:47.920yeah i know you're you're changing the subject i'm just talking about i'm talking about how
00:11:52.440democracy actually worked how it was supposed to work how american but it was never democracy it
00:11:58.840was representative democracy right representative democracy you're getting stuck on the representative
00:12:04.060part which i think can be used to obscure the fact that the ideals of the enlightenment were never
00:12:12.160society should be run on the aggregate opinion of the average person because people would be like
00:12:18.320but isn't that person average and could they be culturally misaligned with me right well i think
00:12:23.960if we look even further in history though like to athenian democracy to other like very very very
00:12:30.200old forms of democracy what fundamentally people came to conclude was we will give a vote to the
00:12:38.880people we need to do important things and that evolved over time when they needed people to
00:12:44.060help them you know row triremes in military conflicts guess who got the vote you know like
00:12:50.740basically if you're contributing something useful to society if if you're needed to make society
00:12:56.360work you should have a say and if not then we don't really care to hear from you was transform
00:13:03.620and when people look for like where was the origin of the rot before i go into all the
00:13:07.580dysgenics research the origins of the rot happened before anything that looks like modern wokeness
00:13:13.420And if you want to trace it back, you can trace it back very easily to one of the four original
00:13:20.120cultural groups of the United States, which was the Quakers. They always wanted the vote to be
00:13:25.100for everyone. The Quakers did. They always wanted everything that wokes want today. Even the way0.92
00:13:29.680that they're, we've pointed this out, even the way that they're like celebrations happen, where
00:13:33.380they do like the, the hand signals so that nobody feels too, or like something just moves them and
00:13:38.880they stand up and start talking. It looks exactly like, you know, occupy wall street or something.
00:13:43.420or one of these protest movements and it's because it's the same value set so i when we
00:13:49.220record this is from before we did the quaker episode so we did the quaker episode and i was
00:13:53.840unaware of this just as an idea of how right we were on this quakers were actually the origin of
00:13:59.320woke so i was like do you not know about the public universal friend and i was like i i do not know
00:14:03.780about the public universal friend they're like i hope you go into that i was unaware of this when
00:14:08.640we film the episode so for context the public universal friend this was someone who in 1776
00:14:17.520the friend that means the quaker that's what they call themselves because they're psychopaths and
00:14:22.760that's like the wokest thing you can call yourself claimed to have died and been reanimated as a0.94
00:14:28.180genderless evangelist named the public universal friend and afterwards shunned her birth name and
00:14:35.560pronouns and dressed in androgynous clothes the friend preached through the northeastern united
00:14:41.960states attracting many followers who became the society of universal friends the friend theology
00:14:47.100was broadly similar to most other quakers and the most committed members of the universal friends
00:14:53.100were a group of unmarried women who took leading roles in their households basically dominated the
00:14:58.100men in their lives and in 1790s members of the society acquired land in western new york
00:15:04.980where they formed the town of jerusalem near pen yon new york by the way still there the society of
00:15:13.580universal friends ceased to exist around the 1860s some writers have portrayed the friend as a woman
00:15:19.200or either a manipulative fraudster or a pioneer for women's rights while others such as scholar
00:15:25.320scott larson have viewed friend as a transgender although note never experienced any gender
00:15:31.800dysphoria as we've note this was never experienced before in the 1920s absolutely crazy the wokeism
00:15:38.220very clearly came directly from this movement not like tangentially from this movement so the next
00:15:43.480time that a quaker e.g rubyard slash what if alt hiss tries to tell you that puritans were the0.50
00:15:51.960creation of woke i would ask you to kindly look at your history because quakers have always0.50
00:15:59.660attempted to manipulate history to not paint themselves as what they truly are and check out
00:16:05.460that episode by the way and if you're a watcher of the show and you haven't read albion seed
00:16:10.820i would strongly suggest you read albion seed because when you read albion seed one it can
00:16:17.360help you better understand like american culture and get in touch with your own cultural roots if
00:16:21.220you're from america or if you don't have cultural roots look at the ways that the four founding
00:16:25.580cultures are different from each other and it can help you model who you want to be in the culture
00:16:29.980you want to adopt but a lot of the things that pushed the the proto movements that allowed our
00:16:36.360society to begin to collapse in the way that it is collapsing were largely quaker movements but
00:16:44.020that's for a different tale i i promise you guys some graphs let's get some graphs so here i'm
00:16:49.220putting a graph on screen here of political ideology versus fertility rates and what you
00:16:53.940can see is the fertility rate difference for intelligent conservatives and intelligent
00:16:59.260progressives is quite extreme, which means they will have even disproportionately less power in
00:17:03.820the future, economically speaking, because that's where they're being cleared out the most, right?
00:17:09.020But note, even here, this is still a dysgenic pattern. Intelligent conservatives are just
00:17:15.300less dysgenic than progressives because they are still having less kids than unintelligent0.88
00:17:20.580conservative and then with mormons you actually see a purely eugenic pattern in this this mormon
00:17:28.160study that they found was hugely it's it's slight but it's definitely there right so to continue
00:17:34.960with the new study that they have here which expanded it to other religious traditions
00:17:38.800sometime ago ed dutton and i published a study showing that the usa being a member of the mormon
00:17:45.220club seemed to protect one against having dysgenic fertility pattern for intelligence
00:17:49.520In plain language, the total population, more intelligent people have somewhat few children on average, although this varies by country.
00:17:58.240However, this negative correlation is absent and maybe even reversed positively among Mormons.
00:18:04.340Due to the small number of Mormons and the need for complex cohort and age controls, the exact slope of the fertility intelligence for Mormons was harder to estimate precisely.
00:18:14.400Hence, they had a big confidence interval.
00:18:16.220the mormon study was based on the general social survey gs c s g ss a large american data set
00:18:24.240there were some problems with this first the intelligence measure is a poor to mediocre
00:18:29.180being the 10 item woodrum's vocabulary test second religiousness was not measured as a
00:18:35.960continuous construct but by self-reported membership of different religious beliefs
00:18:41.020their subdivisions denominations thus the power is much reduced as mere membership is a proxy of
00:18:47.640a more relevant trait of general religiousness or perhaps some specific religiously related traits
00:18:54.640in the new study they sought to remedy this so the new study this was came out in 2024
00:18:59.460does conservative religiousness promote selection for intelligence and analysis of the vietnam
00:19:06.340experience study and here they say this this study was done with a data set of 4602 vietnam era
00:19:13.620veterans so unfortunately it was done a while ago so we can't necessarily say that this was the same
00:19:18.740trait but they actually looked at religiousness here and this one showed something different than
00:19:23.800the mormon study that i was showing before where it showed that sort of perfectly here the less
00:19:29.600religious you are the the fewer kids you have the more religious you are the more kids you have
00:19:33.400and the the most religious people have the most the most kids oh yes the most kids when they are
00:19:40.680intelligent and what was interesting about this study is it found and and statistically relevantly
00:19:46.700too that the highest rate of religiosity was in a population was found was being strictly
00:19:53.300eugenic it was eugenic they they the the most religious people had more kids when they were
00:19:59.780more intelligent. How much of this do you think, though, might come down to
00:20:06.240out-of-wedlock marriage, or sorry, out-of-wedlock childbirth for non-religious progressive people,
00:20:15.920which I think leads to lower lifetime fertility, because it's just very difficult to raise a child
00:20:21.460in as a single parent i mean i think one of the the things at play um is that if you are and this
00:20:34.840i think especially in the conservative versus progressive fertility difference for poor people
00:20:40.060is if you are conservative and you are poor you are less likely to be living off of welfare or
00:20:45.380to be like a welfare king queen trying to maximize the number of kids you have to get more checks from
00:20:49.620the government whereas many poor progressive people just like that's their cultural life
00:20:54.140strategy and they've been doing that for like three generations and it's all they know and
00:20:57.940it's literally like just how they survive so you think it has more to do with leaning on
00:21:10.780social services and not making your own way in the world or supporting yourself financially
00:21:17.220and less to do with out of wedlock child rearing yeah i think i think both of those things are
00:21:23.100relevant for sure yeah i think also there's the the factor that just how i think that ultimately
00:21:33.380affirmative action and dei not favoring a basically there's like this reverse effect
00:21:40.980of affirmative action and dei whereby people think it's going to help the people who are
00:21:45.820getting extra boosts or favoritism when it actually hurts them, both reputationally and
00:21:51.120in terms of cultivating strength. And in the long run, it helps the people that it's discriminating
00:21:56.760against, like white males, because they have to force themselves to be more disciplined, to work
00:22:02.740harder, to be smarter. And overall, that's going to, I mean, while some people just get totally
00:22:08.460wiped out in this equation, there is an overall, I guess you could say like per the perspective of
00:22:14.960this kind of long-term human tendencies, it has a eugenic effect on the discriminated against group.
00:22:21.860I think similarly, when you look at religious families, there is a eugenic element, for example,
00:22:29.620with the LDS church or any group, for example, that tithes, because not only do you need to
00:22:34.400be successful enough to, for example, in many cases, have a single breadwinning family. So
00:22:41.120one man that is earning enough to support an entire family by himself god yeah two parents
00:22:47.740who are you know both working and raising children it's not just that they are also
00:22:52.140spending a non-trivial amount of time engaged in religious worship wherein they can't be making
00:22:58.440money or resting really and also where they're tithing with mormons are tithing 10 of their
00:23:03.500income so this is this is a you know you're putting a lot of spoilers on your car or you're
00:23:10.080putting a lot of drag on your car more accurately i think it forces the peacock feathers to have
00:23:16.840weight yeah and well and then then you end up a lot ultimately stronger and that's that eugenic
00:23:22.920effect we're like if you are in a very non-religious family either that's leaning very
00:23:30.240heavily off of social benefits or both partners are working and you know your kids are going you
00:23:36.700know going to public school and just not really spending that much time with you you're not going
00:23:43.840to church on weekends and you're not tithing you don't have the same headwinds that are forcing you
00:23:49.700to be stronger harder faster and better does that make sense so like because religious life is
00:23:54.360logistically and financially harder technically speaking because i do not think that non-religious
00:24:02.340families i mean i remember looking at the stats before i'm pretty sure from what i remember
00:24:07.480non-religious families do not donate more religious families and especially poor religious
00:24:11.420families donate the most which is crazy like in terms of percentage of income because they don't
00:24:17.560have those headwinds they are not forced to become stronger and that could be an effect here as well
00:24:22.480what do you think yes well i mean i think the way that you relate to money when you're poor is very
00:24:30.100different from the way you relate to money when you're middle class and in a way poor people can
00:24:35.360afford to donate more than middle class people because especially if you're on social benefits
00:24:40.860yeah there's that sure so i i think that that's another thing is you can feel wealthier there but
00:24:48.120that's not the case for mormons tithing is huge and and i mean the more you earn you're still
00:24:55.080tithing 10 and then you're paying progressively more and more in taxes so you're paying
00:24:58.74040% in taxes and then another 10% half of your income that you make because keep in mind tithing
00:25:06.840is pre-tax it's not post-tax it's pre-tax 50% of your income functionally not yours taxes and
00:25:14.740tithing which is crazy plus you're expected to donate a significant amount of your time
00:25:19.760tracing wood grains has that really good subsec article that really goes into this on just how
00:25:24.880much is expected of you from the lds church especially if you are high achieving like the
00:25:30.140more professionally successful you are the more you're going to be promoted within the church to
00:25:34.940be a bishop to do more and more and more i think that that's why the church compared to other
00:25:39.280churches has been so adaptive this is one of the things that we've talked about before but like
00:25:44.080why is it that i mean and the lds started from a much harder place than say the vatican did
00:25:50.580in terms of like polygamy black people can't go to heaven that sort of stuff right or they turn0.85
00:25:57.000white when they go to heaven i think they they got black skin because they they were they were0.90
00:26:01.940neutral in the war between satan and jesus and oh and then so they were marked with darkness and0.51
00:26:07.960not white and delights yeah anyway but you know they had a lot they had a lot of differences to
00:26:14.860start and the church was able to you know sort of build a PR campaign which has been incredibly
00:26:20.760successful we have some other videos on this but like compared to their percentage of the population
00:26:24.840the amount that Mormons have been able to capture the public mind share and in a way that's not
00:26:33.080holistically negative has been incredibly impressive when contrasted with the way that
00:26:40.100the Catholic church in the Vatican is adapting now. And I think the core reason of that is
00:26:44.900because the hierarchy of the Mormon church is made up of people who succeeded in real world
00:26:52.260activities and lived real world lives. Like, I don't even think you would have much of a chance0.98
00:26:57.740of being appointed to a high level position if you didn't have a large family in the Mormon church.1.00
00:27:01.780And so they're going to be able to relate to the average person more, but be a lot less0.59
00:27:06.620theologically rigorous. But I mean, for a long time, you could do that. That's actually an
00:27:14.120interesting, you know, talking about democracy and different democratic institutions and how
00:27:18.820they end up affecting things. The system that the Catholic Church versus the Mormon Church0.62
00:27:23.760runs on, we can see how the democratic structure of each of those led to incredibly different
00:27:32.740outcomes in terms of like practice, right? Catholicism really tried to run like a dedicated
00:27:40.780technocrat institution where, you know, you become a specialist in this your entire life.
00:27:46.920And that was an institution that I think worked really well and was sort of needed when
00:27:53.360basically no one was educated, like the medieval period. I mean, what other choice did they have?
00:27:59.200you know are they gonna allow local leaders to be like elected or something like that oh or you
00:28:04.040could have them be appointed but then you're just gonna get tons of corruption right actually one
00:28:08.200of the interesting questions is why don't you get more blatant corruption in the mormon church
00:28:12.020that is a really good question i mean even the most critical people that we we watch talk about
00:28:18.000it they're not really they're obviously like well the mormon church is raising a ton of money and
00:28:22.420it may be in a way that they insinuate is exploitative toward members of the lds church
00:28:26.780that is insufficiently transparent but they do not imply at any point that they believe there's
00:28:32.060corruption that is quite interesting yeah even even the head guy in the mormon church who's like
00:28:39.560basically their prophet like more than because he can update the religion president yeah he's not
00:28:44.700like the pope where like he needs to be aware of what previous popes have said and what the bible
00:28:48.640says in mormonism you could just like be like yeah i know that's written there but like we got
00:28:54.040got new rules but he makes from what i've heard 150 000 a year
00:28:59.320like literally the voice like it's basically you you don't make money from serving in the church
00:29:08.040yeah and the big scandals that i've heard about is like the church investing in like a mall right
00:29:14.460and i'm like i mean that's what they should be doing right like they're supposed to be what did
00:29:18.700you think they were going to do give away all the money like no they should be investing it
00:29:22.980and building financial security in case things change you know they could have huge declining
00:29:28.060membership in the future and then need to to work like they're acting responsibly why are you mad at
00:29:32.680them and so but you know progressives be progressive being right oh how dare they have
00:29:37.780money but why why isn't it had any corruption issues i actually i you know i've heard of sex
00:29:45.500scandals in the catholic church but i've never heard of corruption issues you know what i'm
00:29:49.060actually going to ask ai do either of them have major monetary corruption scandals yeah good
00:29:55.180question because there's a lot of money sloshing around it could have to do with the transparency
00:30:03.460required of tax filings of of non-profits including religions in the united states
00:30:09.660like perhaps based on the tax filing structure it's just it would be harder but i don't know
00:30:16.740you know like harder to hide i but i i that can't be it no i say this because i know normally
00:30:23.120very common in evangelical churches oh yeah yeah well the whole prosperity doctrine thing and like
00:30:30.760you know that the is it people on youtube or instagram who like tell you the price of one
00:30:35.960preacher's shoes whenever he comes out wearing insanely expensive sneakers yeah yeah well i mean
00:30:42.080some of it is just so blatant as for why that happens it's actually a trope now is yeah like
00:30:47.360the evangelical christian preacher who exploits members typically white protestant culture leads
00:30:55.340to that more even though you have less corruption overall as i've pointed out in protestant societies
00:30:59.800and this is just like a factual thing you can just look at a map and do correlations
00:31:03.960is because protestantism is entirely decentralized you have a thing where if somebody can grift then
00:31:10.660there's nothing really no central organization that can come down and say hey stop grifting
00:31:14.560so if you're particularly good at grifting you're just going to grift okay so let's go through this
00:31:19.680catholic church versus mormonism so it says the gap is large catholic incidents number in the
00:31:26.320dozens historically with several high profile ones in 2024 to 2026 alone well in the lds church
00:31:32.140there is essentially zero personal grift that has been proven by leaders wow i want to know why
00:31:38.620why yeah that's so interesting because there's plenty of money good for them i mean honest i
00:31:47.200mean i think a lot of people's reaction might just be like well yeah we just haven't found it you
00:31:52.260know no one got caught but i i think it's perfectly reasonable to expect that that that just it
00:31:57.880hasn't happened mormons this this it says the main reason is the mormon church okay i i'm gonna have
00:32:06.460two two answers to this one actually one i think many people in the catholic church rise but do not
00:32:16.680really care about catholicism it's just like you're born in a catholic country joining the
00:32:22.440priesthood can be a pretty good deal for a lot of people or joining a nunnery i mean this even
00:32:26.460historically was was a cool profession if you're like nerdy about stuff and then you you get
00:32:33.540invested in the bureaucracy of it and you attempt to climb the bureaucracy of it right so but within
00:32:39.440mormonism because the even on the ground like individual rewards for joining uh the priesthood
00:32:45.980like you can't even get like an income from joining the priesthood they they expect you for most mormon
00:32:50.780things to do the work for free so you can't even enter a position oh no no no you pay to go on your
00:32:56.880mission oh yeah i'm sorry they they have you pay to do stuff for them yeah use me even enter a
00:33:04.360position where grift is possible on your part until you have already demonstrated that you're
00:33:10.600pretty invested in actually what's in the church's best interest whereas in catholicism it's very
00:33:17.400easy to get to high level positions without that proof and i pointed out this is why catholicism
00:33:23.200never adopted allowing priests to have kids because then they just have even a higher reason
00:33:27.160the second reason is likely cultural differences if you look at mormonism historically i mean it's
00:33:33.540the one instance in the united states where something close to communism has ever worked
00:33:38.240right for people who aren't aware of like the way the original mormon colonies were set up0.91
00:33:43.340you would one you'd have to think that it was a good idea to move to a place like that so you
00:33:47.840already have a strong genetic selection filter and they'd be like, okay, here's where you're
00:33:52.860living. Here's what your job is. Here's who you're going to be married to. Like they basically set up
00:33:57.740your entire life for you when you showed up. It actually sounds pretty cool. You know, I think
00:34:02.900for a lot of people, that's a decent way to live life. Right. And, and they, they did this to also
00:34:08.360acquire minis genetically better people. The way that they did that is they went to guys around
00:34:14.840to europe and were basically like hey if you're rich and come to our settlement you know we'll
00:34:19.960set you up and so they got it we're like we'll get you like three four wives how does that sound
00:34:23.920right you don't even need to believe it four wives how does that sound gonna live in the american
00:34:27.640frontier live a hard honest life and so they had a culture that needed a lot more trust historically
00:34:35.980to survive and that was like really eugenically selective like mormons also would kick out the
00:34:42.660guys because they had multiple wives who didn't look good enough this is where you have the lost0.92
00:34:46.880boy problem was good enough yeah yeah huge problem even today within the polygamous mormon
00:34:53.000sex is you know obviously the birth ratio of males to females is 50 50 but not all of the guys
00:35:00.840can have four wives so that means one guy marries for every four guys born into the community and0.87
00:35:08.740the three guys that were not successful enough or not good enough or not faithful enough get kicked
00:35:14.100out which creates a really strong eugenic pressure whereas catholicism basically grew up in the
00:35:22.180rotting bureaucratic corpse of the roman empire i mean it it did that he's just always hating on
00:35:30.320the catholics come on even catholics would say this that's where the church came from it it grew
00:35:37.800out of a roman empire in decline i mean yeah it had a few bumps like with constantine and stuff
00:35:44.560like that who was really cool but the majority of the period where the catholic church was basically
00:35:49.900running the empire the empire was falling apart and that means that there was institutionally
00:35:57.020uh like even trying to fight grift in those sorts of environments would have been incredibly
00:36:02.920difficult also i think even the idea that the church wouldn't have grift is almost a modern
00:36:09.620idea if you look if you read about the catholic church historically grift almost seems like the
00:36:16.200point if you get what i mean like no i don't okay so if you read about any point of pope in history
00:36:28.380you know you would have like a pope making his son who he had outside of wedlock because popes
00:36:34.880around all the time that period right yeah he'd make him like the the duke of venice or something
00:36:40.820right and no the popes were always doing corrupt yeah i know they were like and it wasn't even
00:36:48.200seen as like a weird thing for pope to do it's just like i mean obviously he's the pope he's
00:36:52.480gonna corrupt right and and then you had this going down all the all the cardinals were corrupt
00:36:57.560or the vast majority of them were.0.64
00:36:59.300I mean, that's why they elected the corrupt popes
00:37:01.620because then the popes would give them handbacks.
00:37:03.760And you have this going down to the local levels.
00:37:06.480I mean, if you went to like a cardinal from this period,
00:37:10.120the cliche was they lived in a giant mansion
00:37:13.860and had lots of mistresses and were incredibly wealthy.
00:37:18.040How did a cardinal afford a giant mansion, right?
00:37:21.140Like today, I think if a cardinal afforded a giant mansion,
00:37:25.180you'd be like, the castle church would be like,
00:37:27.560You're not supposed to like have any other jobs, right? Like, how do you have a giant mansion,
00:37:32.580Mr. Cardinal? This seems like a problem. So I think part of the problem that the Catholic
00:37:37.540Church is dealing with is even an expectation towards a lack of corruption is a new idea
00:37:43.200within the Catholic Church. The Mormons, interesting, the Mormons had corruption in
00:37:47.240the early church, but then they just theologically defined it as okay, right? Like, what I'll mean0.92
00:37:53.000by this is in the catholic church you know you take five mistresses and people would be like well
00:37:59.040you're not supposed to do that but you know whatever in the mormon church oh they're like
00:38:03.220he's like and god told me to and then the next leader does something that gets the rules and
00:38:09.320he's like ah but god told me to so it's the new rule but they never seem to be particularly
00:38:14.240avarice for money um potentially because they already had such high status or their community
00:38:20.100i don't know yeah i don't know i don't know well it's important to study this it's important to
00:38:24.820ask this question yeah how else did the mormon church historically have much corruption at the
00:38:29.180tough levels i think there's there's the issue for me is my understanding is there's not much
00:38:35.580transparency as to how the wealth of the lds church is spent but it's clearly not spent on
00:38:41.400salaries or on directly benefiting anyone so i just you know we we think some is spent on ads
00:38:51.420it was kind of weird that they they tried to influence legislation like gay marriage bills0.85
00:38:58.460in california that just was odd it doesn't one i i don't think a religion should try to influence
00:39:04.560legislation that actually does seem odd well like why would mormons care about that yeah like look
00:39:10.700if other people are debauched and lost i mean the people are to invest money and try to win them
00:39:15.900over yeah like tend to your own flock that's my big thing just your people handle your people
00:39:23.700okay if you don't want them to get married to same-sex people then convince them that there's
00:39:32.400a better way i don't know but don't force non-mormons to do the mormon thing don't force
00:39:38.200non-catholics do the catholic thing don't force non-muslims to live by or non-non-islamic
00:39:43.980adherents to yeah okay so this basically explains how the mormons ended up building their culture
00:39:48.780of no corruption so what happened was joseph smith was famously very corrupt and brigham young
00:39:54.980who then i consider to be the real founder of modern mormon tradition he he basically put
00:40:00.700everything he was the ray crock of the lds church yeah he bought mcdonald's from its founder just
00:40:07.080in case you not yeah yeah so anyway but brigham young he apparently because remember how i said
00:40:13.300how he operated in almost like a communist society like you go work here you do this you do this
00:40:18.260that put him into a position even without having to do self-dealing or grift to become the wealthiest
00:40:23.440person in the settlement by by far sure and because he was already in a position to effortlessly be
00:40:29.500the wealthiest person he had no reason for corruption and was able to put systems in place
00:40:35.760it prevented corruption from ever happening. Okay. I suppose I could see that.
00:40:44.900Now, one of the questions that I have for you is sort of a closing out question
00:40:47.740is the way that techno-puritanism is structured, would it have eugenic fertility practices or would
00:40:55.580it have anti-eugenic fertility practices? Because interestingly, it doesn't have as many protections
00:41:02.420that some of the other religion systems do you know it's like find out how to have kids find
00:41:07.120out how to improve those kids i think the mere mandate of genetic selection along with genetic
00:41:12.260augmentation when the technology is available means that it would be like the most eugenic of
00:41:18.020the religious groupings because even people i think it also is important that there's a rule
00:41:22.320that you you can't make your income from being a religious leader that never got baked in i
00:41:29.360actually never read that tract you didn't that's kind of important it's one of the tracks we have
00:41:36.320never read so there's like five tracks that i've or maybe more maybe like 10 i've never read
00:41:41.560so we got to get back to doing tracks if i'm going to be honest i mean piss off part of our
00:41:47.240audience but we pissed off so much of them recently by being like you keep going for
00:41:51.540their sacred cows carl young tucker carlson apparently people care about these things
00:41:57.060why but go on young one i do not know why anyone was surprised that carl young is like
00:42:03.580the heart and soul of the urban monoculture and i it's it is weird to me it's like
00:42:09.960woo psychiatry like feel good positive psychiatry and a lot of people you know jordan peterson
00:42:15.080really promoted a lot of his ideas and he was the internet's daddy for a long time so yeah
00:42:20.700and well this caused people to make a big mistake they they have this perception of like
00:42:25.100these ideas helped me at this point in my life. And I'm like, I'm not arguing that it didn't
00:42:31.100help you that you might not have been at like a lower optimum. The problem is that the ideas of
00:42:35.580Carl Jung are not a global optimum. They are a local optimum. So they may be able to get you
00:42:41.260out of, if you don't know the difference between a global and a local optimum,
00:42:44.280it's like standing on a hill and looking at a mountain. You have to first go down before you
00:42:48.660can get to a higher place. And if we're speaking of mental health, yes, there are ways of seeing
00:42:54.200the world and problems that you can't have that would make your life worse than adopting the ideas
00:42:59.640of Carl Jung and attempting to work on yourself from his perspective. Unfortunately, to get to a
00:43:05.680global optimum, you have to give up many of the ideas that you accepted while you were the student
00:43:14.940of Carl Jung. So an example of what one of these would be is something like believing that you have
00:43:21.860like a bunch of unconscious trauma from your childhood or something like that being able to
00:43:26.900frame and mentalize stuff like that may have helped you deal with a life view where you were
00:43:32.940because carl young is saying you have trauma and that trauma can be dealt with and this collection
00:43:41.140of toolkits he gave you for dealing with the trauma could get you to a higher place but then
00:43:46.900we come along and say actually the science says trauma is mostly a fictional concept it doesn't
00:43:53.580exist and you would be better off you would lose the trauma that you have if you simply didn't
00:43:58.440believe in it but unfortunately now that's harder for you because you both adopted the belief in
00:44:03.800trauma and the belief of the fix in trauma so you need to dig out both of those now before you can
00:44:10.240get to the globally optimum place of i am responsible for my own mental state in any
00:44:17.320given moment and i actually largely have control over it and i have control over the way i
00:44:22.220contextualize anything that's happened to me throughout my entire life yeah and of course
00:44:26.180that's gonna you know freak some people out who have ideas and that's you know shame
00:44:31.620because yeah yeah a lot of people in the conservative movement they were genuinely
00:44:36.540helped by these like sort of proto frameworks when they had nothing else and it's it's damaging
00:44:44.980to them to point out well the proto frameworks may be better than nothing but i think that you
00:44:49.780know other other people probably feel that way about our religious beliefs for example they're
00:44:53.800like well your religious beliefs are better than the urban monoculture but you know they're not
00:44:58.300the true option right they're not at the end so okay you've got the eugenics question but then
00:45:03.960also the corruption question the way the index is set up because we actually worked really hard
00:45:09.480on creating the government system for technical internism if it ever got large yeah and the way
00:45:14.900that funding is set up was in it and money is managed was in it basically makes corruption
00:45:20.540organically impossible if you are interested in how we did that you can read i think we talk about
00:45:27.460it both in the pragmatist guide to crafting religion and the pragmatist guide to governance
00:45:31.540how we structured the techno puritan framework or the index system to avoid the possibility of
00:45:40.180corruption because it basically organically downweights the power of any faction that is
00:45:48.380acting in a corrupt manner immediately and aggressively so that is fun but would it work
00:45:56.760as well as the Mormon system? Probably not because it does allow living off of the money1.00
00:46:02.920as it is structured right now. It does? As it's structured right now. I mean,
00:46:09.900you would be removed if it appeared that you were living in a way that was irresponsible or you were
00:46:14.640managing the money in a way that was irresponsible. But the goal of the way the system was set up was
00:46:19.600maximum flexibility for the person in charge at the moment with also maximum ability to remove
00:46:25.240them i've always felt that's the optimal government type dictator but very easy to remove is what you
00:46:30.960want yeah i guess the the votes were structured such that if you made your income or had any
00:46:39.860benefits from the governing structure be it a government or i don't know like some city state
00:46:45.800you're a part of then that would like force you to recuse yourself from voting you're not allowed
00:46:52.480to vote in the system when you're making money off the foundation if you're a government worker
00:46:56.280and you make a salary from the government you do not get to vote about how the government works
00:47:00.860yeah and this is something i strongly believe i don't think anyone who's making money off the
00:47:03.660government i don't think any government worker i don't think any elected official i don't think
00:47:06.620anyone on welsh fair should be allowed to vote if you are a net drain i mean so a lot of people
00:47:12.520would argue well i work in the government i know how it works therefore i'm more qualified to make
00:47:17.560an informed vote but we would still argue that the adverse incentives are such that
00:47:22.560no you're really just going to vote yourself more money and more more secure yeah and we've seen
00:47:27.720this with teachers unions have teachers unions made teaching better like no of course not like0.97
00:47:32.880giving giving people power over their own employer is always a stupid thing to do yeah they vote
00:47:40.420themselves better benefits less work more money that's it's yeah i mean they may know how things0.99
00:47:46.520work but it doesn't mean they have any incentive to improve them with their votes yeah like you
00:47:52.660can know how an organization works but the thing that you're going to vote for is how that
00:47:56.460organization can improve your life as an employee that's unmoored from an organization's core
00:48:01.640mission which either is you know maximize shareholder value or you know pursue some
00:48:07.260kind of non-profit mission and it can be either but i've rarely seen employees act in accordance