Society Fd Men： Some Men Are Fing Back
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Summary
In this episode, we discuss two models of men who are opting out of traditional breadwinning roles and instead relying on income from women and the state. We re talking about Welfare Kings and Welfare Queens, and how to deal with them.
Transcript
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Hello, Malcolm. I'm excited to be speaking with you today because I've got something for the
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gentlemen in the audience. You know what? All these people, these women screwing your lives
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over, the state screwing your life over, employers passing you over for their diversity and whatnot
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hires, choosing women over you, even though you show more merit. Well, some men are fighting back.
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It's more than just MGTOW. I would say it's MGTOW 2.0. They are basically doing what women do,
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like welfare queens or explosive divorcee women, but better and more competently because, I don't
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know, leave a man to do it and he'll do it better. But what I'm talking about today is two models of
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men who are opting out of traditional breadwinning roles and instead relying on income from women and
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the state. That is what we're talking about. We're talking about welfare kings.
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We're going to go into it. Yeah, actually. I mean, yeah, well, I'm actually-
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What your takeaways are here? Well, there are tactics. There are approaches. There are strategies.
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You have to do this the right way. Honestly, we've done a number of Latin American episodes
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right now. I'd say that this is the Latin American male strategy.
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Oh, no. Actually, no. The two cases I'm going to give actually are Muslim and Black.
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No, but hold on. I want to talk about the Latin American thing because it is actually something
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Something you see very frequently within the Latin American culture is a female breadwinner
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That's true, actually. Yeah, I didn't even think to talk about that. Yeah, that's more like
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the trad wife model inverted. That is fair. And I would say that could be its own episode. So maybe
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comment below if you want us to explore that. But no, we're-
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I can just quickly explain why that happens, by the way.
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But it's funny because everybody thinks of like, oh, fiery Latina or something like that. Not,
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you know, Latina ends up supporting everyone. I think it's because they get so used to supporting
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their wider family systems before the husband comes into the picture that they just see it as
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another person that they're supporting. Oh. This whole just mother hen gone wild. Yeah.
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It's like, of course I have to take care of you. This exasperated, like, oh, fine.
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The exasperated Latina should be the actual Latina.
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Save you too. I mean, I feel like it's just also broadly female trope in among sort of responsible
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parentified women, I guess. I don't know how else to put it. But I mean, I've seen this among other
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people, even people that we know closely who are not. Is this why Latin dads don't run away?
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Why you don't have a bunch of Latin kids being married in single family households? Because
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they know they just stay around. Men come into the yard, you know, when you just let them do their
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thing. But no, we're going to talk about welfare polygamists and welfare kings, or as some might
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put it, welfare kings. But I think we should really be looking at this in the broader context
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of some major themes that I see arising. I mean, obviously, like, one big theme is MGTOW. Like, you
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know, sort of men who are like, so fed up about the system being rigged against them and women being
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rigged against them. But I think that what's interesting now is we sort of, there are stages of grief, right?
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And I think there are stages of MGTOW. You know, there's like, there's the red pill stage of like,
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oh, well, all right, I'm going to game it. And I'm going to try and like, that's kind of like,
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you know, still participating in the rat race, right? You know, it's also like, I feel like
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there's something very capitalistic about like, original pickup artistry and red pillow mindset,
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you know, it's like, well, I'm going to work and I'm going to be rich. And I'm going to spend plates
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and I'm going to like, you know, do all this, right. And then then came a MGTOW, which is like,
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no, I'm going to fully opt out. And I'm gonna sort of go like full monk mode, I'm going to improve
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myself. I'm going to like go back to nature, maybe even like homestead or like live abroad in Thailand
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and just like totally opt out of the system. Right. So it came from like girl boss lean in to
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like fully like homestead opt out. And now we have like, you could almost, I would call this dark MGTOW
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where it's like, no, I'm just going to like, the system has effed me over. Now I'm going to F the
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system because one I can, and I'm smart enough and I know how to, and two, I, I deserve it. That's kind
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of like the mindset of like, I hate this system. So of course I'm going to exploit it because almost
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like, almost morally or ethically, it, they see it as justified. Like they're owed to something by this
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system that is so terrible. So like, of course they're going to exploit it. Of course they're going
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to not treat it with respect. And I think that's really interesting, but also I think this is really
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important to discuss in the context of at the time of this recording, a lot of people are discussing
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the Somali daycare fraud, but also like Somali autism services, fraud, Somali transportation fraud.
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So they're just like how there was essentially an ethnic cartel that just how they're like the
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Patel motels and their Vietnamese nail salons and like their, their ethnic immigrant groups in the
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United States and in other countries that tend to build specializations around certain economic
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models. It just so happens that Somalis in Michigan built economic models, exploiting state benefit
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systems. And I think that that's really interesting. And a point that Asmigold has alluded to in his
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coverage of this, and that we were going to allude to an episode we were going to do on these, but I'm
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like, so many people have been covering the Somali thing. I just don't want to do it anymore. I'm bored
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of it. Is it, this isn't a Somali thing. This is just, I mean, they found the Somali thing. The Somalis are
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being highlighted now, but like, this is not, I mean, there, there are, there are groups of all types that are
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exploiting these systems. And I think we should talk about some other groups and some other ways in which
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these systems are exploited. And I actually, on a sort of third level of this, I think it's genuinely
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interesting how people have inventively exploited welfare systems. I think, I think it's just in many ways, I'm
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like, it's clever. Like you gotta, you gotta respect it. Like, wow. I mean, I, I, I love, I love clever
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ways to save money. Malcolm knows all too painfully, like how, how much I gloat every single time we do
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a family shopping thing. And like all the coupons that I've like scraped together show up on our
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checkout screen. And I'm like dancing and he's like trying to hide, like as people stare at me in the
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store. So I love savings. Like, so I'm like, wow, this is, how do I get in on this? How does it
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work? How does it work? Just don't hate the player, hate the game, by the way. So let's, let's start
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with welfare polygamists. And I, I can't believe why I didn't start to look into this earlier because
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in all these different stories related to basically like egregious treatment of women by, by Muslim
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communities, I heard about women ending up in these polygamous marriages to Islamic men who do take
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multiple lives per Islamic law, AKA Mika, but only legally marry one wife and then use their various
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wives, legal single mother status to get a lot of state assistance. So they might have up to four wives
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and then, you know, three of them are getting state assistance. And this is actually pretty clever hack
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because if you are, and we know this through pronatalist.org, we did this whole research that
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we, we hired experts in, in like welfare services and, and government assistance services as specifically
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for families to build guides to each state in the United States on like what programs can parents
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possibly have access to? And it was a frustrating exercise because I thought maybe states had more
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resources for all families, but really it's more like only if you are at or near the poverty line,
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do you get services? But if you are at or near the poverty line in the United States,
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especially as a woman, and especially as a parent, you actually get a lot. Like your life is super easy.
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I mean, relatively speaking, I think like if you have friends with that and they live almost the way we
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live in terms of quality. Oh, like materially, they have more luxuries than we do.
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They have free healthcare. They have food assistance, both SNAP, which is sort of like a debit card
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and WIC, which allows you to buy like specific foods on sort of a monthly basis. Then they also
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get housing choice vouchers and they can even get short-term cash through various programs. And this
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is huge. Like when our kids were exposed to rabies, we, we did tons of like calling around, how do we get a
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rabies vaccine to them? Like we don't think they were a bit like, we don't think they were seriously
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exposed, but we were like, you know, I mean, in a preponderance of caution, it would have been really
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nice to get them rabies vaccines, but we don't have insurance. It offers really good coverage and
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we're kind of in between jobs right now. So we were like, okay, how do we like afford this without a
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$10,000 emergency room fee? And we ultimately just didn't take our kids into the emergency room
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because that was the only way we could have gotten them rabies vaccines. Meanwhile, if we were on one
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of these assistance programs, we could have just waltzed into an emergency room, like no problem.
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And like, we, we know people who are on these programs who were like, I don't know, why don't
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you just go to the hospital? We're like, we would never financially recover from that. And so the crazy
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thing is like, if you're just, just an inch above, like you're making a hundred dollars too much,
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suddenly your life is like actual poverty. Whereas in your, if you're in actual poverty,
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you're actually living more like a middle-class American, which is crazy. So yeah, there's this
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really weird thing going on in the United States. And so that's why this is extra clever. I could see,
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you know, a family being like, oh, wait a second. Like this is, it makes a lot of financial sense
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for us to do this. But also Malcolm, if I wanted to be evil and exploitative, I could divorce you.
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I could leave you in our divorce settlement with all the liquid assets in wave alimony,
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and then claim these benefits. I mean, arguably our kids would be better off that. That would be
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fraud, Malcolm. That would be welfare fraud. And, but would we get caught if we were not public
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figures, we probably wouldn't get caught. And that's the thing is if we're really divorced,
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we're just living together. How is that welfare fraud? Okay. So I decided to look this up because
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it just doesn't matter why I decided to look this up. So anyway, the way it actually works is it
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depends on the state, but marital status matters a lot less than whether you're actually living
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together. So if the wife was living in a separate house, apparently what matters the most is like
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how you prepare your meals. If they are preparing meals for the entire family at the same time,
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then you would still count as married for the, and if they're going out and buying food for everyone
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at the same time, then you would still count as married. Because it could be argued that you,
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you, you would be like, this would only happen if I had primary custody in a divorce. And if it was
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found that like, Oh, but they're living together and he's, you know, like participating in all this
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now, but keep in mind though. And like, we're public figures, we have documentary teams here. You're
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like, we can't really hide things like that. But here's the thing. And people discovered this with
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the, you know, Somali daycare fraud. No one is checking this, you know, states don't have like big
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auditing teams to, to make sure like, Oh, you know, is this couple actually not living together?
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And we know for a fact, actually, I think this should be part of the pronatalist community's way
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of life. It's just so unethical, but like, also I get it. The state should be paying for rearing
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kids. I mean, they should be because they're benefiting from the tax revenue. And that's our
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whole thing is like, now the state, like the, the state has put the entire financial burden
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for creating new productive taxpayers on the parents. Like, of course, parents aren't having kids
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like, cause the parents aren't financially benefiting from the kids. They're
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thinking about divorcing you right now. I'm so done with you, Simone. You're, and this isn't
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even fraud. You just really annoyed me lately. So I'm, we need to have a conversation about
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But we know, we actually know a lot of people who are married, but not legally because they
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do. And, and like, I'm talking like highly educated, rationalist, Silicon Valley people.
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Like these are people who, you know, are like, I'm not talking like trailer trash. I'm not talking
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like weird, you know, Islamic polygamous family, although many of them are polyamorous, but like
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even just monogamous people are not getting married. So the wives can claim these welfare
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benefits because it's just otherwise, like, honestly, it's just not worth it to have a
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job or make money or anything like that. When, when, you know, like right now healthcare is
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so expensive in the United States and food is getting more expensive and like, we're feeling
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the squeeze too. And, and it's, it's all very, and like, this is very exasperating. I think
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this is why antisemitism as we've discussed is on the rise as people. I mean, we're not,
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as you pointed out, we're not giving meaningful aid in the larger scheme of things. Like, you know,
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the number, like out of a hundred tax dollars, we pay the, the number of like cents that were
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sending to Israel, like nothing, but still people resent seeing this, any, any aid going to, to,
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to migrants or to foreign countries, because they're sitting here and they're like, I can't
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afford anything. And then all these people around them are getting all these benefits. It's just not
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fair. But anyway, so I just want to be clear that this is something that's been happening for a
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really long time. And especially with Muslim, um, polygamists, like Islamic marriages. So in the
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UK and like way, way back, we're talking like in 2011 investigation by the paragraph detailed how
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some Muslim men in areas like Blackburn and Dewsbury maintain multiple wives in separate homes with each
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additional wife registering as a single parent to access benefits. And then a similar report by the
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spectator described a taxi driver with five wives from different countries, all claiming state
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support. And they estimated that up to 20,000 such polygamous unions in the country were, were
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actively taking social benefits under this kind of scheme. And I think this happened, especially,
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I think this is another one of those kind of like ethnic cartel issues where like, you know,
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certain communities discovered this, this clever hack. It's like that chase.
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And I can make it run even better just by taking extra wives. So I mean, it would make sense to
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divorce. Oh, here we go again. Oh my God. Why always when I outline episodes, like the conclusion
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always, always like Malcolm becomes polygamous. You, you made that argument, not me. I made the
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counter argument, but now I'm just like, this is great. I want to divorce me. This is, this is just
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fantastic. Um, Muslim country. They're like, there, there are more options. I haven't even gotten to
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the welfare King. So just like, but also like apparently this is, this is also an issue that
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has been a problem in France since it's like as early as I could find is 2010 when there was this
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high profile case that involved a Muslim butcher and four companions as, as they framed it charged with
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welfare fraud after a traffic stop escalated into polygamy allegations. And there was this whole
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national debate around it. And then a 2015 politifact check debunked a viral video claiming
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that, um, that Michigan Muslims can list multiple wives for benefits. Like people were just claiming
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that, but they did acknowledge that basically informal polygamy would enable these claims and it
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absolutely does. And, and that also like it should be stated that other groups like Orthodox Jewish
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families in New York or polygamous sex in Utah also do this. This isn't like a Muslim thing. And like I
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said, like just, just monogamous couples we know who are highly educated. The first time I actually
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heard about this, Malcolm was literally at Stanford university. When we spoke at one of the search fund
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classes. Okay. One of the, one of the young women there was looking to get married and we had just
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given this whole talk on like working as a married couple. And she's like, yeah, but like, I don't think
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we're actually going to get legally married and I might just not be on payroll so that I can claim
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that like unemployment benefits. And I'm like, what? And that was back in, I think like 2017.
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Yeah. Stanford girl. Yes. She was a Stanford MBA student who was sitting in our class on search
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funds. It was just like, I'm going to take welfare benefits. Because I mean, it's so normally her
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community that she sees it as like a mandate that she does. Well, if you're making a cold
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calculation on maximizing, you know, benefits to you, like, again, don't hate the players,
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hate the game. Like the system is motivating people to do this, but let's get to the other
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thing. And this, this actually came from. I want to, before you go to the other thing,
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there, there is reason to intentionally abuse systems like this. This system shouldn't exist.
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Yeah. And the more high profile this is, and the more people who do it, the sooner this gets taken
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away. Like we, yeah, exactly. Cause this makes me so mad. It's a horrible system. It's a horrible
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system. Yeah. Well, because it encourages people to be free riders and to not develop autonomy and
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independence. And we're going to get into this in the next, in the next segment I have here,
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which is inspired by a base camper. So I can't remember if I'm allowed to attribute him. So I'm just
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going to read the comment without naming him, but he, he wrote my YouTube algorithm queued up the,
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the linked video for me. It's a conversation between influencer and coach David Cooley and a
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fellow named Jay Prince, self-proclaimed welfare Kang. Cooley gives Prince the air to explain what
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this title means. You go work a slave. I get y'all checked. I get y'all raises, right? Y'all don't
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got a freezer and freezer. Y'all can't eat multiple ice cream back to back, right? With
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three kids, right? They care pay for them. Health care pay for them, right?
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Prince goes on to describe to Cooley that he had impregnated a single or multiple who weren't
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interested in raising the resulting children. He impregnated multiple women so that they would
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gladly forfeit custody to him and how he sustains himself and his three daughters with government
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handouts. The tale itself is amazing, but what do you both think of it with appropriate
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modifications as a strategy for boosting fertility, just as you said, Malcolm. So I'm just going to
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add to the base camper summary. Basically this, this guy identifies as a welfare King and he
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deliberately exploits female led social systems and government benefits so that he can work basically
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minimally. Like he does work, but like right under the cap. So like, he's like deliberately doing
00:19:10.880
this to like maximize benefits to himself. Like he'll work to get as much cash as he can get
00:19:15.600
through a job, but no more. So he maximizes government benefits. Then he lives cheaply.
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And then he has as many children whose expenses taxpayers can cover as possible. And here's the
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really interesting thing. He deliberately chooses to have children with women who would lose a custody
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battle, which is like unhinged in, in some ways, like, cause one, like, do you want to have kids
00:19:37.960
who have like personality disorders? Like this is, I don't know, like, this seems like it would make
00:19:41.400
your parenting harder, but maybe that's just women who like, he knows would otherwise probably
00:19:46.560
produce good kids, but like, for whatever reason, like the courts would never give him custody.
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But yeah, he chooses, he chooses to have his kids with women who are unfit parents. Cause as he points
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out, the, the system is, is rigged against men when it comes to custody in most States.
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And the, the, the, this coach who is interviewing him, like categorically condemns this behavior
00:20:10.360
for having the mentality of a black woman, he puts it. And then he also points out like the,
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the, the action is morally equivalent to embracing failure and then rationalizing it as strategy or
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justice, which this guy totally does because he's putting the burden of work on other people and
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avoiding responsibility. And also because the Cooley argues that his ancestors sacrificed so that his
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descendants could be free and to pursue opportunity, not so their defendant or descendants would, would
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avoid work and live off handouts. And he also points out that if everyone did this, it, you know,
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would kill the economy. Like not everyone can do this, so it shouldn't be done. And that government
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welfare should be a safety net and help people get off their feet. And, but like, the whole point is
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like this system shouldn't exist in the first place. It does hurt people. It does create cycles
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of dependency. So to your point, the more people exploit this, the better. But what I think is
00:21:04.440
really interesting is, is, is this guy, this welfare King rejects the idea of building a career in
00:21:12.040
another man's empire. He's basically like, this is a system that is rigged against me. I'm never going
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to win in this system. There's too much bias against me. I'm dealing with tons of systemic disadvantage.
00:21:24.660
And America fundamentally hates and disrespects blacks, black men. And, and he insists that
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education and hard work are just not going to translate into real power for them. And I think
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this is a message that probably resonates with a lot of men in America, not just black men, but I think
00:21:42.180
like many white men who are hearing increasingly like, we're just not, we're not going to hire white
00:21:46.540
men anymore. So like, I think men in many different positions are feeling just super fed up. And he
00:21:52.480
frames, this guy frames his lifestyle as a form of, and this is his wording, respirations,
00:21:59.620
which he, he's like, I, he says, I'm going to get my respirations in the ghetto way. He's just like,
00:22:05.680
super unapologetic. He's just like, he knows it's trashy what he's doing, but he describes
00:22:11.040
respirations as like street level reparations for centuries of black slave labor. And he argues that
00:22:16.960
men deserve a multi-decade break. Like just not, it's not even like, this is a black guy doing
00:22:23.380
this. Yes, it is a black guy doing this. And he also, he also praises women's entry into the
00:22:30.280
workforce for lightening standards and creating easy care jobs, like sort of like med tech roles
00:22:36.220
and things like that, which he sees as low effort, female typed work, and it benefits men like him.
00:22:41.160
Cause I think in some cases he's, he even gets alimony. And I think it's really interesting
00:22:45.480
if like men can't get jobs anymore, why not just like lean on like the women who can get the jobs.
00:22:52.820
And I think this sort of dovetails then with your noticing a Latin American male pattern where often
00:22:58.380
they're depending more consistently that, and they have like less consistent jobs than their wives.
00:23:04.500
And so they're more likely to depend on them because I mean, modern bureaucracies do favor women
00:23:09.520
as many of the writers we've referenced and various people that we've talked about point out.
00:23:15.220
So I'm, I'm curious as to what you think about all this. I mean, like I, I, I intuitively find it
00:23:20.540
so dishonorable to do anything but make your own way and support yourself through the provision of
00:23:28.340
meaningfully good products and services that other people and businesses want and need.
00:23:36.120
Or our education system for kids, Parazia, or our talking teddy bear system, whistling.ai.
00:23:42.680
We, we, we try, right? And yet a bunch of people around us are living lives materially much more
00:23:50.620
comfortable than ours because they, they are playing the game. I mean, I feel like, again,
00:23:56.980
like dark MGTOW, but we're not even in the era of dark MGTOW. We're in the era of like dark
00:24:01.900
everything. It is not just men who are opting out. I mean, last week we ran the episode on women who
00:24:08.680
are foregoing marriage and sex. And we're just like, I'm over it. And I don't really know what
00:24:14.000
to make of it. Maybe people are going to coast on government benefits until governments go bankrupt,
00:24:19.060
but then AGI is going to sweep in and save them anyway. So it kind of doesn't matter.
00:24:23.740
Like, I just kind of wonder what strategically makes sense for people at this point. What,
00:24:28.260
what are your thoughts on all this now that I've kind of given you the ideas?
00:24:32.260
What it means to work is going to transform over the course of our life. And I mean,
00:24:38.880
over the next five to 10 years, I mean, over the next few years, I mean, AI is going to change
00:24:44.160
everything. The idea that you wouldn't live off the state is going to become laughable. I think to our
00:24:49.400
children is if AI does become as economically impactful as I expect it to be, it's, it's just
00:24:55.300
going to, I mean, if human civilization survives, right? Like I, I think that you're thinking too
00:25:01.720
much like the past, because in the past, you know, you, you could always out think everyone
00:25:05.820
else. You could always outwork everyone else. You could always, but if an AI can run at a marginal
00:25:10.820
cost and is smarter than 98% of the population, which is where I think we're going to get pretty
00:25:16.000
soon. Um, like the agent system we've made for our fab AI, which creates continuously thinking
00:25:21.940
agents. And right now we're getting them set up so that they can even work on like GitHub and
00:25:25.700
everything. And then it can take over the programming for me and bug hunting and everything
00:25:29.800
like that for all of the new things I want to build. I want to have it build some billions
00:25:32.600
for me because I have some ideas for them, but I don't want to go through the whole thing.
00:25:35.820
So I'm like, I'll just have you do it. Right. Even just something like that. Right. Like
00:25:39.160
eventually it's not even going to be like human actors running funds. It's going to be AIs that run
00:25:48.600
collections of other AIs, which make and build companies. The question is, is, is, is what
00:25:54.020
happens to the rest of humanity when that happens? Right. Yeah. I, I don't know. I mean, I think
00:26:01.460
it's clever. I mean, I also like, maybe this is just a survival strategy. I will say that
00:26:07.260
like the parents I know who have made big families work. I don't know of any that are like doing
00:26:14.640
committing, committing, cause this is technically welfare fraud. What I'm describing in, in most
00:26:20.660
cases, I don't, I don't actually think what the second dude is doing. I know the guy who's
00:26:25.740
keeping kids. I don't think that's welfare fraud. Especially. Yeah. But like in these other cases
00:26:31.480
of like the, the multiple wives, it's welfare fraud. And if you and I were to like divorce and,
00:26:38.680
and try to get me to like, I think that's welfare fraud. However, I will say that the,
00:26:43.580
the families that have a lot of kids that I know that, that are doing it really well
00:26:47.520
are extremely savvy about government assistance systems and they max out as many benefits as they
00:26:56.060
can get. And it's, it's hard for me to wrap my head around it because like, I grew up with the
00:27:00.760
mindset of like, even at times where I had qualified for like food stamps or something or unemployment,
00:27:07.420
I didn't take it because I knew that I, you know, had enough savings where I could make it buy. Like
00:27:16.040
if I didn't need it, I wasn't going to take it. And now I feel like, am I a chump for not
00:27:22.060
doing that? And like, it, would it not be better if we all just went hard in on this system just to
00:27:28.780
break it? I don't know. I feel like you're going to need systems like this. Like the world of AI is going
00:27:36.540
to change everything about what it means to work, about what it means to expect to earn your own
00:27:41.220
income. I just, I think, and my fans can push back on me on this, but I do not understand how
00:27:47.420
in 20 years from now we have anything like our existing global economy. Now what that looks like
00:27:54.980
in terms of individuals, jobs, everything like that is going to differ a lot between countries,
00:27:58.620
the countries that have AI and the countries that don't get out of the countries that don't,
00:28:01.840
right? Yeah. Get out of Europe, get out of Europe, run, run, run. And yeah. And this,
00:28:10.180
this brings me to, you know, where I, like, if I'm trying to predict the future of the global economy
00:28:14.620
and everything like that and where everything's going. And it's, it's one of these things where
00:28:18.340
even for like us looking for a job, you know, my brother's like, get a normal job. And I'm like,
00:28:23.900
but it'll be gone in like a month. Like everyone I know in normal jobs is afraid of losing them
00:28:27.160
because of AI, right? Like you, you see this in the numbers, right? Like, I don't know. I mean,
00:28:34.280
I, I, I do think that what they did is bad for their generation, but that's the, you know, that,
00:28:39.980
that's the last generation's rules. And if you always, there were so many things that, you know,
00:28:45.280
my parents told me that just didn't work for my generation. And they sounded wildly naive telling
00:28:50.060
me it when they were like, well, just, you know, go to an office and say, you won't leave until they
00:28:53.920
hire you. Right. You know, like that's something that, that parents used to tell kids, like in
00:28:58.640
all seriousness, show them chutzpah, you know, knock on the doors. Yeah. Yeah. And, and, and I
00:29:05.400
think you telling a kid, well, you know, you got to go out and get a job, right? Go, go to a top
00:29:10.220
college and get a job. And they'll say, Oh, what is that? Like an Uber thing? Except Uber won't exist
00:29:18.540
because it'll all be self-driving cars, right? Like, is that a, well, now what's so crazy too,
00:29:24.040
and what makes so many younger people incredibly angry is that after the pandemic, something broke,
00:29:30.640
at least in American job markets. And so many of the job postings are not even for real jobs.
00:29:35.380
They're ghost jobs that businesses maintain just to show certain optics, collect data,
00:29:42.820
et cetera. Like, but there's zero intention to hire. So you could spend a lot of time applying
00:29:48.980
for a job and it will go absolutely nowhere, which is also just such a. Well, in a lot of
00:29:56.420
industries, people have just stopped doing their work. As you pointed out, you were pointing this
00:29:59.180
out about like the publishing industry. It almost seems like nobody in it is working anymore. Like
00:30:02.860
they're just not editing. They're not answering their emails. They're not doing their jobs. Yeah.
00:30:08.280
It's like, they, they kind of left the office and maybe they're still receiving a salary, but like
00:30:12.380
low key, they're just not there anymore. But no one, it's one of those things again, we're like,
00:30:17.040
no one's checking. And I think this is one of those things, maybe we're kind of transitioning from a high
00:30:21.480
trust society to a low trust society and people haven't yet uniformly realized that. And so there's
00:30:27.940
a lot of, everyone is expecting that someone has it. Like I thought you had it. No, I thought you had
00:30:34.920
it. Like everyone thinks that someone else is doing their job. Meanwhile, no one is doing their
00:30:40.760
job and things are falling apart, but it actually takes a surprisingly long time for people to figure
00:30:45.960
that out as is indicated by the similarly daycare fraud. Like this has been going on for a very long
00:30:51.080
time, but no one checks these things. Cause everyone's like, I don't know. It's not my job.
00:30:56.520
That's must be someone else's job. My job is to process the application. My job is to see,
00:31:01.620
oh, this checkbox was met. Okay. Go for it. Like I did my job. My job wasn't to drive over there.
00:31:07.920
And like, even if like, you know, you're a government employee and you drive by and this
00:31:13.500
actually came up with the, with the Muslim, like Islamic marriage polygamist issue is in when this
00:31:21.080
started, it has at various times bubbled up on X and people have had discussion of it. And when
00:31:27.200
online discussions of this trend upward, inevitably a bunch of government workers come on and they're
00:31:32.920
like, yep. Like I'm, I knowingly process payments to, or I'm aware of like this and this, in this
00:31:39.440
case where these people are receiving this much in benefits. And I know that they don't need them.
00:31:43.760
Like I've driven by their house and I've liked them, but like they, they don't have the authority
00:31:48.740
or, and there is no pathway for them to effectively report and have these things dealt with because
00:31:54.660
we live in a society and these systems were set up without the expectation of this kind of
00:32:02.480
exploitation. This is why as bad as universal basic income is, and you can see our videos on it in terms
00:32:07.740
of the effects it has on people. I just do not, it's better than this. And I don't see any other
00:32:13.400
pathway. Well, that's, yeah, we were thinking about most fraud gets most money. Yes. Because we,
00:32:19.640
we were thinking about doing a base camp episode on like America where like American socialism sucks
00:32:27.540
extra hard because it is a socialist country, but like only for people who cheat, like only for people
00:32:34.740
who are extremely poor and for people who cheat and then everyone else is screwed. And like, it would
00:32:39.300
be actually so much better in many ways. If just, it was just for everyone because then, then you're not
00:32:45.960
just rewarding this huge swath of bad actors and you know, the money isn't being wasted in the same
00:32:51.380
way and that it is, it is very frustrating. Yeah. I mean, I think it's, it's, it's frustrating as it
00:32:56.460
is. I think these systems just need to be turned off. We just got to, we've got to overhaul around a
00:33:02.100
UBI system. I just don't, don't think that any of these other. Yeah. Okay. Well, yeah. So when you say
00:33:05.760
turned off, you say like replaced with, I don't know, direct cash payments or something like that.
00:33:09.920
Yeah. Direct replaced with direct cash payments. Just put money in the accounts. I mean, the one
00:33:14.280
thing I worry about then is what I, for example, I alluded to earlier, the WIC program that's women,
00:33:20.340
infants and children. It's, it's a program for that. Again, like if you're a single mother,
00:33:24.320
who's at or near the poverty level or who qualifies through other means, it's a really
00:33:27.840
effective program. And I like it specifically because unlike with Snap, where you can actually see
00:33:32.780
like, you know, all these TikTok shorts of mothers getting all this like horrible junk food for their
00:33:37.720
kids. WIC only allows you to buy extremely specific food. I don't like those programs.
00:33:44.320
Let the parents get bad food for their kids. Let their kids die. I don't care. I do. Not our kids.
00:33:49.720
I do. I do. But WIC is like, you can only buy like two loaves of bread this month and they must be
00:33:56.700
whole grain. They have to be whole grain and you can only buy. It doesn't even understand real health
00:34:01.980
stuff. Like it doesn't, it doesn't get the health stuff right. It's, it's like, it's like you have to,
00:34:07.720
have 1% milk for kids. Like what? No kids should be drinking. Well, but I mean, I think like maybe
00:34:13.060
there's, keep in mind, there's a correlation between poverty and obesity. So they don't want
00:34:17.420
to allow parents to buy whole milk because it burns my brain. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. These
00:34:28.780
programs are ridiculous. And the way you make this work with children is you just make it based on the
00:34:33.800
number of people. Right. And your UBI goes to whoever is caring for you up to a certain age.
00:34:39.480
And that way you do still get the assistance if you have kids.
00:34:47.080
Yeah. I, yeah, I don't know. Or like if, if there's a, like some kind of like refugee program
00:34:54.060
where like kids can run away to like a safe house if their parents suck. The problem is, and, and
00:34:59.640
like, I don't know. I'd like, I, we we've alluded to this in past, like, oh, well, what if the state
00:35:04.460
raises children? And then people clap back at us and they're like, well, look at Romanian
00:35:09.040
orphanages and like China had orphanages and they were terrible. But like, this was all for like
00:35:13.900
unwanted, abandoned children. These were underfunded programs. What if the state actually like did
00:35:19.300
an exceptionally good program, you know, where like it actually got a lot of investment and it was
00:35:24.580
good and decent. I mean, but then like all the child parents coming in and like, no, a child has
00:35:29.840
to be raised by a mother and a father who are emotionally invested in it. And if you aren't
00:35:34.580
emotionally invested in a child, you won't do a good idea. But I feel like maybe I, I disagree with
00:35:38.580
that. I strongly disagree with that. This is this whole thing of kids. I didn't live with my family
00:35:44.900
after the age of 13 and I did not care. It is when people live without parental love and it ends up
00:35:52.000
messing them up. It's because they are weak, frankly, and they're looking to blame things.
00:35:57.320
I know lots of messed up people who had parents and lots of non messed up people who didn't have
00:36:01.620
parents. I'm just saying I want, I want children to have an option in a UBI world where like mommy buys
00:36:10.200
meth with all of her money. You know what I mean? And they get, they give the kid to somebody else.
00:36:18.020
Well, think about it this way. No. And the kid has, can run to somewhere else or get saved. I
00:36:22.240
don't know. I, I just like, I, you know, I can't deal with these stories of kids getting hurt. And
00:36:28.520
like, I, I literally had to, I mean, I should have done it anyway, but I've quit scrolling like
00:36:34.920
passive scrolling on any platform because too many times now, like I scroll and it's like, oh,
00:36:40.400
like infant killed, like two-year-old found dead. And, and, and I'm like, I can't like,
00:36:44.520
then like the next two days I'm up crying all night. Cause I can't deal. Like I, I literally
00:36:48.900
can't deal. So I need like a solution that ends this no more hurting children, no more hurting
00:36:55.760
children. No, no. So fix it, fix it guys. Civilization, fix it. You guys in the comments
00:37:08.500
can let us know what you think the solution is to all this. You know, you know, me, I want to get
00:37:13.220
the extra wives. I I'll be able to breed faster, Simone. We need it. This is how we get more kids
00:37:18.600
in the house. Kid, kid, kid, kid, kid. You'll have so many kids. I'm actually outlining an episode
00:37:26.140
on the men spamming kids, people who donate sperm or people like Pavel Durov who have offered free IVF
00:37:34.580
to women who want to use his genetic material. And I am going to be making an argument against,
00:37:42.660
against that particular tactic. Like not. Well, it's not a heavy, but it's not, it's not a bad
00:37:48.200
thing. Like I offer, you know, if somebody wants to use my genetic material, I offer that, right?
00:37:53.500
Like, no, I mean, I think donating to someone who asks you or who's like, Hey, I'd, I'd appreciate
00:37:59.240
that. Like, I think that makes sense. Instead of building a family and legacy is in usually not.
00:38:07.000
I think men who are just, well, no, I think it is absolutely fantastic to donate an egg or sperm
00:38:14.100
or embryos to people who, who want them from you. But men who think it's a massive win to just spam
00:38:24.000
children. I mean, I'm going to like, I I'm going to give a good effort to try to convince myself
00:38:28.740
that I'm wrong and to steal me on this, but I cannot think of a single great historical figure
00:38:35.400
or impactful historical figure who came from a harem, who came from a man who spammed children.
00:38:41.100
I just don't think that you're, you're doing your own genetics. There's a big difference between
00:38:51.200
families and, you know, yeah, no, I like, I'm all for like having 14 kids, whatever, but like
00:38:56.560
in your household with your culture, raise them, invest in them. Right. But like when, when you are
00:39:02.880
just flying around the world to donate sperm to girls online who are like, yeah, that sounds good.
00:39:10.680
Like, I don't, I don't think that's the win that people think it is. Or when you're like paying to
00:39:17.320
have a bunch of babies born and then having just staff raise them. I, I, again, don't think that's
00:39:23.860
the same. So I, but anyway, we'll discuss that in the other episode. I need to, it's just taken me a
00:39:29.320
while to get to it because archive.is is not loading the wall street journal articles that I really want
00:39:35.500
to include in my research. So I can't read the articles and I'm really angry about that.
00:39:40.180
I'm sorry, Simone. You need to know more about welfare fraud.
00:39:50.200
Oh no. I mean, that's what the articles were. I mean, circumventing paywalls.
00:39:53.780
No, the articles are about the men spamming kids.
00:40:01.860
I always worry that they're, they're going to hallucinate. I want to see the articles.
00:40:04.980
Just say, don't hallucinate. Can you give me the full text of this article?
00:40:13.900
Okay. Well then I will try that. Thank you. And thank you for sharing that tip with our audience.
00:40:18.700
Mmm. I love you, Simone. You are a great wife, but what are we doing for dinner tonight?
00:40:23.260
So I can do more Burmese mint chicken pasta bolognese. Well, I mean, not bolognese,
00:40:28.380
but like pesto pasta with Burmese mint chicken meat sauce, essentially.
00:40:32.780
Did we have that left? Like it's going to be less.
00:40:35.260
No. So, I mean, I'm, I would do a whole new batch. So we have enough pesto left to do that.
00:40:41.420
I have the pasta from yesterday. Oh, then I want, I want a steak.
00:40:45.900
Okay. Instead you want steak with chives and...
00:40:48.140
A double order of steak with lots of chives and peppers.
00:40:53.420
And let me know when we're, we're frying it up. Cause I'll throw in some miso paste and stuff
00:40:57.900
like that to make the sauce interesting. Oh, you want to make the sauce.
00:41:01.740
Yeah. Well, I'll just, I'll just make a twist on like a Mongolian sauce or something,
00:41:05.580
but you'll, you'll make the sauce yourself. So all I have to do is prep the veg.
00:41:09.100
Well, I mean, prep a base sauce. Cause I don't know how to do that.
00:41:13.820
I don't either. Just ask perplexity, but sure. I'll do that. And then you'll add to it.
00:41:21.820
I'm not unreasonable. I'm a very, very easy husband to be married to.
00:41:28.860
Just make me gourmet restaurant meals each night while the children are
00:41:33.260
attacking and while bathing the children and changing the diapers. And no, I love you. You're
00:41:38.060
amazing. You always go above and beyond. The kids always get so sad when they discover it's not
00:41:43.100
a day when they spend the whole day afternoon with you while you work climbing over you while
00:41:47.500
you attempt to vibe code. Well, I mean, not attempt successfully vibe code.
00:41:50.940
He jumps on me. He doesn't climb over me. He does the hot jump.
00:41:55.180
So Indy climbs over you. Torsten and Octavian jump on you.
00:42:03.340
Well, it's her thing. She's a Titan. She's a shark princess.
00:42:08.540
What does a shark princess do, but jump on people?
00:42:11.260
One day she'll be a shark. That's what she said.
00:42:13.100
Yeah. And then, and then I will eat you mommy. Do not eat me Titan. Okay. I won't mommy.
00:42:20.620
Oh my God. The clip that I used at the end of the episode that I ran today, Titan was so sweet.
00:42:26.780
Oh, talking about creaky man. Yeah. Who says, you go, who says darn? She goes,
00:42:36.380
Oh, dang it. Dang it. Dang it. Dang it. And then she goes, and the creaky man,
00:42:42.220
and the creaky man lives in a cave. That's a blue and pink because those are Titans.
00:42:47.580
No, pink and purple, which are Titan's favorite colors. Maybe a little blue.
00:42:53.180
Maybe a little blue. Her monsters have to live in caves that are her favorite colors.
00:42:59.740
But creaky man is good because it sounds like a real monster.
00:43:02.620
Creaky man totally sounds like the new Siren Head.
00:43:05.660
I would say he's a real monster. Maybe she saw it somewhere.
00:43:08.540
Well, people on X pointed out that helicopter helicopter came from this like obscure clip of
00:43:15.500
what I think was, what was that thing where you would like get randomly matched with people
00:43:20.140
and it's Kermit the frog. Yeah. It's, it's a thing. I think helicopter is a reference to
00:43:27.900
Kermit helicoptering something at the end of the clip. If you want it, if you know what I mean.
00:43:36.140
So that is the catchphrase of our household and it is in reference to Kermit the frog in a random channel.
00:43:44.300
Yeah. I think that's just too perfect. It's too perfect.
00:43:47.820
I'm proud if that is actually where helicopter helicopter came from.
00:43:53.820
Hey, none of our kids have gotten in sex scandals yet. That's going to be hard.
00:43:57.260
All the, the families that do the things and then their kids get into sex scandals.
00:44:02.860
Yeah. I wonder. Yeah, actually a lot of people like on, on X were also like, don't,
00:44:08.300
don't include your photos in your, or sorry, your, your kids in your videos. Like this never goes well.
00:44:13.660
Every time there's a kid influencer. And I'm like, okay, sorry. Who is the hero of the hour?
00:44:19.500
Who is getting nothing but love? Who is getting nothing but adoration right now?
00:44:36.220
Yes. Yes. And of course, people are concerned trolling him too. Like, oh, just wait. Oh,
00:44:42.060
I'm like, the sex scandal is going to come out. And he's like, literally there was this interview
00:44:45.740
clip of him and he's like, I don't like, they're up for disappointment. I'm Mormon. I don't drink.
00:44:51.420
I'm a virgin. Like, I don't know what you expect you're going to find. Like, this is going to be
00:44:57.020
hard. And like, all of these people just want to believe that young people involved in content
00:45:03.660
creation are somehow going to be ruined for life. And of course, like, it's because they're weird
00:45:09.020
pearl clutchers. There are tons of kids who are making very good money, making just cute little
00:45:14.460
play videos. Like what's his like, whatever's world. I mean, maybe it's like, no, no, no.
00:45:19.580
The thing is, is that these people are weird pearl clutchers who complain about everything.
00:45:25.820
I'm sorry if you're also a base camper and you like our podcast, we just disagree with you on this,
00:45:29.500
but that's the thing is base campers disagree. No, I think it's so lame. It's so like,
00:45:33.820
every kid wants to be an influencer these days. Like what are like, or almost every kid does,
00:45:39.180
right? Like a screwed up family. Like I, I, most of the cases of influencer, like kid influencers
00:45:45.820
who are screwed up, the screwed up element of them is because they have like a narcissistic parent or
00:45:50.700
like they're like, whether or not there was going to be YouTube involved, they were going to have a
00:45:55.660
screwed up life. Like, yeah. So I think that there's, there's two things where you can have
00:45:59.740
problems with this. If the, the kids are the core of the content, right? Because then you need the
00:46:06.700
kids to behave in specific ways and do certain things. And you're creating a weird relationship
00:46:11.260
between you and your kids. Cause the kids are the content itself.
00:46:14.460
I think that's where parenting is the core of the content. Cause that's when you have the parents
00:46:19.340
like making a video about like, well, our daughter just had her first period and I'm going to the
00:46:23.420
store to buy her tampons. Yeah. Like that, that can cause problems for kids.
00:46:27.340
Yeah. Like that's yeah. I, I tell you, yeah. Just putting kids on Instagram. That's not,
00:46:31.820
you know, and the other one where it can cause a problem is when it's specifically because you're
00:46:37.100
trying to do something that is inappropriate with like, obviously there was the case recently
00:46:40.940
of what's her face who came of age. All y'all broke haters. Y'all ain't doing it like Lil Tay.
00:46:46.460
This is why all y'all here is hate me. This cost me 200,000.
00:46:58.380
With the, the girl who was like younger and it's like, I'm all about the money.
00:47:05.340
No, there, there are absolutely bad instances. And there, there are certain, like,
00:47:10.860
for example, like we know from experience that like, just, just having a certain number of
00:47:15.660
subscribers or views, isn't going to translate immediately to money, but translates to money,
00:47:19.820
certain types of contents, which makes like, for example, the like Sephora influencer kids.
00:47:24.540
I understand why their parents got them into that because that's where the sponsorships are
00:47:29.340
like these makeup companies reaching out to them because they make a lot of money from,
00:47:33.340
you know, other kids who are intent driven consumers watching that content and wanting to
00:47:38.460
buy something. So that leads to lucrative sponsorships. And then, you know, it ends up,
00:47:42.540
you end up with these kids who are now like screwed up with, you know, body image issues or whatever.
00:47:47.420
Although I feel like that can be easily, like, I don't, I don't know how much body image issues
00:47:51.260
necessarily even correlate with bad outcomes in life. Like I'm watching a documentary,
00:47:55.500
the old documentary gossip on Rupert Murdoch and his publications and page six. And this one
00:48:01.100
gossip columnist named Cindy and her mother, like she was born in 1935. She was 90 when the documentary
00:48:07.420
was made and her mother was like screwed up. Like she gave her, her, her teenage daughter a nose job
00:48:14.700
in like the, the, the forties, right? Like this is before like nose jobs were highly sophisticated.
00:48:21.100
She had her hairline raised because she didn't like, yeah. And she like sent her to dance classes,
00:48:26.700
like whatever. Cause she thought she was an ugly girl and she just wanted her to be beautiful. And like,
00:48:30.540
she like was very controlling, but this woman ended up becoming like one of the most prolific
00:48:37.980
and successful gossip columnists. Can you tell when a nose is attractive or unattractive?
00:48:43.180
I literally can't tell. No. Well, you and I are both broadly face blind and people thought I was
00:48:48.060
like trying to do this, but like a mean or troll in that episode where you were like, which group of
00:48:52.540
women is more attractive? And I'm like, I don't know, which is the more like, because you're like,
00:48:56.060
you can tell which is the more, and I couldn't tell which is more. No, a lot of people love that you
00:48:59.580
couldn't tell because they go, they're all ugly to me too, because I don't know. There's
00:49:02.780
this internet thing where guys think they look really cool by pretending normal looking women
00:49:07.020
are unattractive. And it's, it's, it's not a flex. It's weird. Yeah. Yeah. But I mean,
00:49:14.380
I don't know. Like I, I, I can, I can, I think I can try to like look for facial symmetry and signs
00:49:20.060
of health. That, that is what attractiveness is. Right. I think, yeah. Well, for me, it's mostly just
00:49:26.380
being appropriately the appropriate weight. Like that's a 95% of attractiveness for guys.
00:49:32.860
It's just, I think. No, no, no, no. Fundamentally, what you blew my mind about was, especially for,
00:49:38.060
for women, young, young, young, young, young, young. That's like the only thing that matters
00:49:44.940
is like how young you look. Well, I mean, that's your fertility window, right? Yeah. No,
00:49:51.420
it makes, it makes evolutionary sense. Anyway, I am going to get dinner started. I love you very much.
00:50:06.460
Wait, what happened Octavian? What, what is up there?
00:50:08.860
My, our, our Christmas, our, our Christmas llama. Christmas llama. He will, mom put him right there.
00:50:17.900
And now he moves. Do you want to put him? Yeah. I want to put him. So you get to choose a special treat
00:50:25.180
because you put, you found the Christmas llama. I can't, I can't believe I found the Christmas llama.
00:50:32.060
It's so magical. He watches you, you know. Oh yeah. He sees when you do naughty things.
00:50:40.940
Yeah, I put it in some of my things. Oh, he's going to hide again. Yeah.
00:50:44.700
He's going to hide again. And then you'll find him. Octavian, you get a special treat.
00:50:54.540
I can do it after when we eat. This is so fun. It actually is magical. It actually is? Yeah.
00:51:04.140
How can you tell? Because he moved up there. With this kind of ass? I mean, come on man.
00:51:10.460
Oh no. I didn't know he moved. I love, I love this. This is like a very sad. How do our kids not curse?
00:51:16.540
I want to get, get, I gotta get the scarf out. Let's get the presents out.