Targeted Migration Campaigns： Why They Will Make a Comeback
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Summary
In this episode, we talk about the impact of targeted immigration on the world's population decline, and why it's not just about opening the borders to immigrants. It's about how governments are actively trying to get immigrants to move to their country, and how they're doing it by offering them special privileges and incentives.
Transcript
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Hello, Malcolm. I'm so glad to be with you today because we are going to talk about something I
00:00:05.040
found quite intriguing the other day. Picture this. What if countries and cities started fighting
00:00:10.520
over you, offering cash, land, and even your own laws just to get you to move there? From Canada
00:00:16.240
and Mexico luring Mennonites with special privileges to Tulsa, Oklahoma, paying remote
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workers to relocate. Targeted immigration is actually quietly reshaping the world, and it
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has been for maybe hundreds of years. Yeah, this is a huge thing. I see many, as fertility collapse
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is going on, and what a lot of people, you know, misunderstand about fertility collapse is they
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think it's a problem of warm bodies. It's not a problem of warm bodies. No, this is about getting
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the people that you want to your country to do certain things. Right. But the whole thing that
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we need to talk about here is what makes a family or a community so desirable that governments compete
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to attract them. Like, people don't realize that this isn't just like, oh, we're opening our borders
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to solve this problem. No, it's, we want Mennonites. We want bougie couples who are dinks.
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creates itself, okay? So the problem creates itself. It's uniquely bad now because it is the
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communities that are more economically productive and the groups that are more economically productive
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that are undergoing fertility rate collapse the fastest. Yeah. But in a historic context,
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you also had this problem. Luring one immigrant group into your country was not seen as the
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same as luring another immigrant group into your country. Some immigrant groups were seen as more
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desirable because they were more desirable. They created more economic prosperity or did more
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development than other groups. So let's get into which groups are which. Yeah, absolutely. And well,
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and how in a post-demographic collapse world, you want your family culture to be such that you
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basically have your pick of the litter in terms of what country or charter city or techno feudalist empire
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you go to because you want, you want the keys to the kingdom. You don't want to be that deformed
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post-apocalyptic family living in the borderlands. Also like this is, I think one thing that's important
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to talk about before we move forward is we recently had a podcast talking about how Hillary Clinton sort of
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espoused this idea that, well, it's immigrants who have all the kids and the obvious solution to
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demographic collapse is immigration. And isn't it so crazy that the Trump administration is deporting
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people? And then one of our podcast followers tweeted us a report in 2000 by the UN population
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division. It was, it was titled replacement migration is, is it a solution to declining and aging
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populations? And this is definitely one of the most common rebuttals that we get to,
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oh no population decline. And then the answer from so many, mostly uninformed people is,
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oh, just solve it with immigration. There are many, many, many issues with that. But I do want
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to point out that even this 2000 report from the UN, which I would say is one of the more bullish
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groups on like immigration, solving the problem, plus also demographical options in the problem,
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it's going down slowly. And then they're always wrong with their projections. But basically that
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report explored the potential role of international immigration and migration and addressing population
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decline and aging. And the conclusion actually of the report is that while immigration can help
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mitigate the effects of the trends, the scale of migration required to significantly alter population
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size and age structure is likely unrealistic and potentially unsustainable. Now that coming from
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the UN is basically them admitting it's not going to work at all. For them being like, well,
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it might not, it might not be sustainable to like really solve the problem. It means that it really
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isn't going to work, but that doesn't mean that countries aren't going to try. And also again,
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just because this is something that countries have turned to for a long time. And this is what I had
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no idea about was these like niche examples also have targeted migration. So let's talk about
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Canada and Mennonites. Okay. Cause I just had no idea about this until yesterday when I started digging
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into it. So in the 1800s, so this is a long time ago, someone in Canada's government was like those
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dudes, we want the Mennonites. How do we get these Mennonites? And they made this package of, of special
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privileges just to attract them. So they actively recruited Mennonites in the 1800s, particularly from
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Russia, interestingly, by offering what they called it a privilegium, a formal agreement, just like,
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I mean, really targeted for them. It guaranteed exemption from military service, the right to run
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private schools, religious freedom, and land grants for settlement. And they were designed both to
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attract hardworking agricultural settlers to develop Canadian West, which makes sense why like targeted
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Russian Mennonites. Cause they're like, these, these dudes can handle the cold. They'll be okay.
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I was looking for a group of people to develop like Canadian agricultural land. Yeah. Russian
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Mennonites. Yeah. They're like the, the Scottish cows.
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Oh, sorry. People don't know what the Mennonites are. It's like a, they're Anabaptist, which means
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they're related to the Amish. They're basically Amish. They're, they're slightly less strict than
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the Amish. So depending on the Mennonite group and a lot of the groups that I've been looking at
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recently are much more conservative, almost Amish like in, in, in how strict they are, but you're more
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likely to see Mennonites owning cars, some select machinery. Like they're, I think they're more
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consequentialist than deontological when it comes to Anabaptism where they're like, all right,
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like this machine actually isn't that worldly. It's just helping me do my job.
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So I'm going to be okay with it. But anyway, the, the long-term impact and changes of this,
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it's interesting over time. So a bunch of, a bunch of Mennonites came over to Canada and there
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still are a lot of Mennonites in Canada. But then over time, Canada started to erode these privileges,
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like especially concerning private education, which also was a problem with indigenous populations,
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but no one talks about Canada and their immigrant populations. Those also had some rights to private
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education eroded. So I think that's also interesting that Canada was equal opportunity and it's taking
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children and trying to homogenize them. So no, I think they basically betrayed their Mennonite
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population. They totally did, which led to significant Mennonite immigration from Canada to Mexico and South
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America in the 1920s. Also during World War I, anti-German sentiment led to a temporary ban on
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Mennonite immigration. So Canada just got like super mean Mennonites, but the original privilegium
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that like set of, of that 1873 set of privileges that they used to target Russian Mennonites remained
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a touchstone for Mennonite claims to conscientious objector status during both world wars. So they
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still got to use parts of it, just not all of it. And this, I just want to highlight for later
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discussion, as we talk about what you need to be, to be a desirable population and have the keys to the
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kingdom, is that you also have to be prepared for an erosion of promises made. And this is a thing
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that's just going to come up again and again. So let's not, but now, okay, it's the 1920s, right?
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Canada's being a dick to the Mennonites. Where do they go? Well, Latin America is like, oh, so these
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guys develop land and are productive and they, they, you know, produce good agricultural goods. Like
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I want them. So they started offering privilegium and Mexico was one of the first to really get on the
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bandwagon. And also like the Mennonites didn't have to go as far to get there. So like Mexico was a
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really popular first destination for them and a ton of Mennonites settled there. So Mexico's offer
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of state finance migration, which was kind of how like some AIs were describing it to me. And I'm
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like, well, what is state finance migration? The, the offer of state finance migration to Mennonites
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in the 1920s was not direct financial support in the form of cash payments or government funded travel,
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but rather a comprehensive package of incentives and privileges designed to attract and facilitate
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Mennonite settlement. Here's how the Mexican government supported Mennonite migration.
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So one, they offered land access and sales at very favorable terms. So they're like,
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you know, here's this big tract of land. Like it's yours. We're going to make it easy. We're not
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going to, I mean, because buying land in foreign countries can be very difficult. I just want to
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lay that out there. So the Mexican government agreed to sell large tracts of land to Mennonite
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settlers at very reasonable prices. And specifically in Northern states of Chihuahua and Durango,
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which is where you'll still see some of these populations. And that's because these were
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actually at the time, and we're talking 1920s, suffering from economic and demographic decline.
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Really? Well, the 1920s did have a major demographic issue that we talked about before that was only
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really solved by the baby boom, which seems to have mostly been a result of improving medical
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technology. Yeah. And well, this, this specific one, especially in those regions was resulting from
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the Mexican revolution, but still like, also this is just to be clear, countries experiencing
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demographic decline and economic decline in regions or even universally is not a new concept.
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And immigration is like the first thing where you're like, oh, let's just import the problem.
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Like we'll import a solution, but then you just similar. Yeah. Go ahead.
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Mennonites are an action. If you're going to import a group to like develop a region,
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Mennonites are a great group to import because they are pathologically pacifistic. While they
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will not acculturate into your culture, they also will not prey on your culture and attempt to take
00:09:12.800
converts. Yeah. They are a group that is pacifist that won't seek converts and will just grow and
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develop land and contribute economically. I won't seek converts. Yeah. For the most part,
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we'll get into that. We'll get into one instance in which they did convert.
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Two. Well, two, two. So yeah, but so Canada, sorry, Mexico, similar to Canada also offered
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the legal and social privileges that Mennonites really need to be able to settle somewhere.
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So through a formal agreement with president Alvaro, sorry, Alvaro Obregon, Mennonites were
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granted exemption from military service, very important freedom to operate in their own schools
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and teach their own language, full religious liberty, the right to dispose of property as they wished
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and no taxes for 100 years. There's some speculation about it, but that's a freaking huge
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draw. Wait, no taxes for 100 years for Mennonites?
00:10:03.840
Yeah. Yeah. And I have three citations on that. I can give them to you if you want. Like this,
00:10:07.620
there's, this is documented. There, there is, there's, this is according to some accounts,
00:10:11.920
but I mean, I bet that, I mean, at least some government officials were like, yeah, don't worry
00:10:15.200
about it. Just don't, don't pay taxes. There's such insular communities that I could see like
00:10:18.840
them. Yeah. Let me guess. They like immediately went back on that after like a few decades.
00:10:24.280
Maybe. So here's another important thing though, is the government also provided military and police
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protection for Mennonite colonies when conflicts arose with local populations and bandits. So when
00:10:36.260
they first came over in the 1920s, despite the Mennonites being pacifist, because they were going to
00:10:42.240
fairly like wild west regions, they even got protection from the government. And that's pretty
00:10:47.260
big too. I mean, that's a, that's a wonderful privilege, but we'll see how that, how that ended
00:10:51.080
up. Beyond that though, they had a political. In rural Mexico, not well. I mean, you know,
00:10:57.180
but officials at both the local and federal levels often intervene to resolve land disputes in favor
00:11:01.740
of Mennonites, sometimes using force to remove other claimants from lands that were purchased by
00:11:05.980
Mennonites. So this is like, they were really going above and beyond to be like, nah, man, these dudes are
00:11:11.340
going to like actually do something productive with this land. It's theirs. You are out. And this is their
00:11:16.920
own citizens. So this is this, I think this is a really good illustration of how far a company's
00:11:24.280
or sorry, a country or company that becomes a nation's stakeholder will be a wingman for you.
00:11:29.860
If they think that you are desirable, like screw their citizens, they'll take you. And there's
00:11:35.800
historical precedent for that. And then the government also viewed Mennonite agricultural
00:11:40.020
expertise as a means to boost regional food production and economic stability. So they prioritize
00:11:44.600
their settlement as part of broader national development goals. So that helps to explain why
00:11:49.920
they did that. But so, I mean, as you can imagine, the primary reason why this like kind of unraveled
00:11:56.340
in Mexico was that there's just like this explosion in gang violence in Mexico. So from 2012 to 2017
00:12:05.060
alone, an estimated 30,000 Mexican Mennonites relocated just to Canada. But a bunch of Mennonites
00:12:11.820
also have emigrated from northern Mexico to safer regions within the country, such as Campeche
00:12:17.140
or abroad to countries like Belize, Paraguay, Argentina and Bolivia. And the reason I fell down
00:12:24.300
this rabbit hole in the first place was I watched this documentary on a Mennonite community that was
00:12:30.160
quite conservative in northern Argentina. And I'm like, how the hell did these low Dutch speaking
00:12:36.760
Mennonites who are clearly like a Polish origin in northern Argentina? I just like it was so confusing
00:12:46.720
to me. But now it all makes sense. And a bunch of these countries did the same thing in trying to
00:12:53.500
attract Mennonites. So like, oh, those dudes. Hold on, hold on. So now they come over from Canada,
00:12:59.320
then they go to Mexico, then they go to Argentina. Yeah, yeah. And like, and so like,
00:13:03.340
and again, like, so Argentina, Paraguay, Mexico, Bolivia and Belize, all of them offered land
00:13:08.560
grants. All of them offered military exemption, though in Argentina, that's just informal. All of
00:13:13.280
them offered educational autonomy. And all of them except for Argentina offered formal privilegium.
00:13:19.440
So the same thing that Canada started in the 1870s. So while there's there's no formal deal in
00:13:25.780
Argentina, like basically off the books, they're totally autonomous. In Paraguay, they have more of a
00:13:31.720
kind of sovereign state thing. They have embedded sovereignty, as it's explained.
00:13:46.080
Yeah, Mennonite Prospera. And in Mexico, they had all those privileges, which are now eroding,
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because basically the state can't even take care of its gang problem. But in Bolivia,
00:13:55.200
they have large land holdings. And in Belize, they have lots of formal agreements. But here's what
00:13:59.500
blew my mind. Because I was like, okay, so I guess all the Mennonites now live mostly
00:14:03.720
in South America. But that's not actually true.
00:14:07.780
No, actually, the two biggest, out of the top three Mennonite countries, two of them are
00:14:14.560
Yes, this blew my mind. So for very similar reasons to why South America was like, yeah,
00:14:20.540
move down here. The Democratic Republic of the Congo and Ethiopia were both like,
00:14:25.460
in response to the interests of some Mennonite missionaries. Like, sure, come here as long as
00:14:33.160
you develop infrastructure. We could use it. Very Belt and Road. Like, fine, come here. Like,
00:14:37.780
I'm not going to do anything for you. But like, if you're going to build something, fine.
00:14:41.160
What happened, though, was like, among the local population, a version of Anabaptism just kind of
00:14:48.600
took off. And I thought, so I googled, like, Mennonite community, Ethiopia. I was expecting
00:14:54.160
to see, like, you know, Ethiopian families in straw hats and, you know. Because honestly,
00:15:00.880
like, the reason I clicked on the Argentinian Mennonite video on YouTube was the hats these
00:15:05.440
girls wear are high fashion. They're couture. They look just so great. Like, white ribbon.
00:15:10.980
Okay, hold on. I'll look this up. Argentinian Mennonite.
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I was, I was here for it. At least in this one documentary. It's just like, this one community
00:15:17.140
really just, like, nailed it. Chef's kiss. Kind of, kind of wear. But yeah, it's, they more just
00:15:23.460
wear, I would say. Oh my god, these hats are awesome. I know, right? I know. I'm like.
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They're really good at hats. Yeah. They say, they say they are not a proud people. Me think
00:15:36.000
they dress with a little too much pride. Yeah, actually, I was watching another Mennonite
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on a YouTube video today talking about like permitted fabrics and clothing, like stuff
00:15:44.860
that her mom would be cool with her getting and stuff that her mom would get mad about
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her getting. I love that everything was like filtered, not through like, this is what my
00:15:51.500
culture says. It's like what her mom would have let her buy. But she was, she introduced
00:15:55.080
the concept of something being fancy. And something that was fancy was too worldly. But those hats
00:15:59.960
are fancy. Yeah, they don't, that's far too fancy. Yeah, they're extreme. But oh, they're so
00:16:05.980
good. Anyway, the Ethiopian Mennonite communities and the Democratic Republic of the
00:16:10.200
the Congo, they're they look much more like other Congolese from their country. Yeah,
00:16:15.520
they just like but but coordinated coordinated Congolese, you know, like coordinated and that
00:16:19.960
like family photo ready, you know, like, so really pretty good. But anyway, yeah, Democratic
00:16:24.920
Republic of the Congo 235,000 Mennonites, Ethiopia 224,000 Mennonites. Now the United States has more
00:16:33.760
with over 390 Mennonites. And then Canada has over 137 because they just screwed the pooch India. And I
00:16:41.360
haven't looked into this, I need to figure out what's going on here nearly 150. So 150,000. So
00:16:46.240
that's more than Canada. And then in Paraguay, 33k Mexico 32k Bolivia 25k Brazil 12k. So like,
00:16:55.280
it's really not that much in Latin America. But I think that just considering how difficult it is
00:17:00.320
to migrate, like just the incentives, it's pretty impressive. So I just like that actually the
00:17:08.560
Indian Mennonites, the dress like pretty, like traditional Indians, I guess. Oh, do they?
00:17:13.600
They are Indians. Oh, oh, like, like Ethiopian and whatever. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I see the thing is,
00:17:20.300
like, if I was converting to become a Mennonite, like 80% of it would be for the fashion. Yeah,
00:17:25.000
I'd be like, come on, what are you doing? You're not a Mennonite. You'd like you're missing
00:17:28.480
the point. It's a sartorial choice. Whatever. You do you, I guess, you know. But I guess I can
00:17:35.520
also see, like, the point isn't the particular style of clothing. It's that it is traditional
00:17:40.640
clothing. So I mean, I get it. You know, don't be worldly. And it would be fancy to wear foreign
00:17:46.960
clothing that is cool. So it is un-anabeptist to do that. And I am just being sacrilegious. And this
00:17:55.040
is why we're techno-puritans. Yeah, we're techno-puritans. We're gonna, our religion's
00:17:59.280
gonna spread. It's gonna be the best. It's the best religion. If you haven't checked it out.
00:18:02.240
It's the best. Everyone knows it. So this, this, this brings an end to our Mennonite
00:18:08.800
soliloquy. We, we are now going to discuss basically places doing this in modern times,
00:18:14.240
aside from just like Argentina and, and, you know, these people trying to siphon off the,
00:18:18.080
the Mexican refugees from, you know, the failure of Mexico to protect their precious Mennonite
00:18:24.080
population. There, there is still lots of targeted immigration happening or like targeted
00:18:30.640
recruiting attempts happening on behalf of, of countries. And the funny thing is Malcolm,
00:18:34.880
you and I have been directly involved with two of them in terms of applying and being interested.
00:18:39.920
Oh, really? Oh yeah. Yeah. We have actually the one in Chile.
00:18:43.120
That's right. Yeah. So Chile startup program, it specifically targets tech entrepreneurs and
00:18:47.840
digital nomads, and it offers startup funding in a streamlined visa process to build the company's
00:18:53.520
reputation as a tech hub. And we actively applied to that. I don't know if we got in,
00:18:57.200
I think we might've gotten in, but I refuse to get it. I refuse to go. Was that it?
00:19:00.800
Well, we got in, but we had gotten some other opportunity and it just wasn't that much money
00:19:05.120
and worth going because we would have to relocate to Chile for a while. And you were like, it's not
00:19:09.520
worth it for the money they're giving us. Yeah. I was like, no Chile, you're not. And then we ended
00:19:13.200
up in Peru. I didn't want to go to South America at all, but like, no, the future police, the agents
00:19:19.760
of Providence wanted me there. You're going to South America, lady. I don't care that you didn't
00:19:23.680
want to take that money. Also, Ireland and England have programs to attract teachers,
00:19:29.280
remote workers, graduates with financial incentives and relocation payments. So they've done it to
00:19:33.600
not as much. I also recall speaking of English people, France really catching a lot of heat from
00:19:40.480
its own citizens for changing its tax law to attract like billionaires from England. Do you remember
00:19:46.000
that? Yeah. They were mad, but absolutely. Like this again is targeted. It's like, what can we
00:19:52.800
shift? What incentive will only draw in the desirable population? And as we saw with Mexico's
00:19:59.280
alleged promise of no taxes for a hundred years, which I love, that one of the ways is to be like,
00:20:06.400
oh, for this tax bracket, oh, this population, no taxes. So I think that's interesting. And then,
00:20:12.640
so what's the other program that we, the, the other targeted immigration program that we,
00:20:17.840
we flirted with? Oh, it was the Singapore we were recently looking at was a biology company.
00:20:23.360
That's different. That's, that's, I didn't. Yeah. I mean, that, that is, I would say
00:20:27.840
a really good example of, and he's, he's, he's referring to what is it called? Network school
00:20:33.280
or network university? Apologies. We're in the process of applying. I haven't done the test
00:20:37.120
yet. Cause they want me to do it like an IQ test. Yeah. Which I, I'm like, I'm a genius.
00:20:41.440
I don't need to do an IQ test. Just take my word for it. They're going to be like,
00:20:44.320
who is this potato named Simone that is attempted to not? I'm just going to try any math questions.
00:20:49.840
I'm like, come on guys. Just, yeah. I finished one of them. I'm just very like,
00:20:54.160
I'm with a pet. They, they, they don't. Yeah. Anyway, people, people, someone commented on one
00:21:00.240
of our recent videos that I'm very smart. They don't realize they said that they said that Simone's
00:21:05.600
smart. Yeah. And I'm like, I'm sorry to tell you this. My wife is basically retarded. Yeah.
00:21:10.640
I don't think basically, I think, I think retard is the, this is, this is why it's not even offensive
00:21:17.040
for us to use the term. Yeah. It's, it's okay for me to say it because my wife is a retard.
00:21:22.320
I am. I'm a retard. It's true. I can't even open doors. Malcolm knows this all too well.
00:21:29.280
And that is why every morning I wake up and I just look at her and I'm like,
00:21:34.880
and I'm like, get out of bed. You're disgusting retard and, and make me my effing money and then
00:21:41.920
make me dinner and care for my kids. Cause that's what retards do. This is why she stays married to me
00:21:50.560
because I've been able to train her into believing she's a retard. It's called, let's see. I just
00:21:55.520
want to make sure I get the, the name of it. Bology's Island. It's network. My question for you
00:22:02.480
is what's this other one that we applied to? Cause I don't remember. Yeah. Networks anyway,
00:22:05.680
but no, I, I just, I do want to highlight the fact that, that Bology is trying to build this network
00:22:10.720
school on this Island adjacent to Singapore. And what I think is kind of a charter city. I'm not
00:22:16.240
part of the Belt and Road initiative. Is it, but like, it, it feels very much like what I expect
00:22:21.200
this to look like in the future, which is these techno feudal charter cities where you have
00:22:26.320
specifically not like a collection of investors or, or an incorporation even, but like, maybe you have
00:22:32.800
those, but like, they're led by a figurehead like Bology, like a sort of Jesus-like figure.
00:22:37.120
Yeah. I could see Andrew Tate have one. I could see Jordan Peterson have one. I could see Elon
00:22:43.200
Musk have one. I mean, you and I will have one. That'd be pretty cool. We have our Tundra one in
00:22:49.280
the far North or subterranean Tundra charter city. Make it miserable to live in. Just called Frostpunk.
00:22:56.080
We just, yeah, we just don't even get creative with it. But no, so like, I think it's really exciting
00:23:02.320
to see that we're, this is already here. They were already starting to see targeted immigration.
00:23:07.120
And to your point, right. We're just talking about how we applied to network school. And in addition to
00:23:12.000
like submitting a pitch deck related to our startup, what's the other one we applied to?
00:23:16.240
You said we'll tell you after we talk about this. So after, after doing that, the next stage of the
00:23:21.280
application was literally taking an online IQ test with like the shape rotator questions and the
00:23:26.080
vocabulary questions and the math questions. So that is like, this is, they are only targeting
00:23:32.960
top tier intellect that is also entrepreneurial. Like there's a very targeted population here. And if you
00:23:38.960
are mid or a retard, like me, you're going to get kicked out. Like you're not going to be accepted.
00:23:43.040
And this again, is this very targeted immigration. So tag this in your mind, as you think about how do
00:23:46.960
I cultivate a population that has the keys of the kingdom? Anyway, the final one that you're,
00:23:51.360
you're forgetting about. And I think this is also important because this is an example of
00:23:55.440
a contemporary that has been around for a decent amount of time. Now, private family led
00:24:00.240
targeted immigration program, not to a country, not to a broad region or a state,
00:24:07.360
but literally just to a city. Tell me you're not remembering this.
00:24:10.800
Oh, Tulsa. Yeah, you're right. Tulsa. Yeah. So they have, there's the Tulsa remote program.
00:24:14.720
It offers 10,000 racist. Well, we can talk about that, but they offer 10,000 as a grant to eligible
00:24:21.280
individuals, only targeted people who are willing to relocate to the city and work remotely from there.
00:24:26.480
The program is designed to attract remote workers from outside of Oklahoma and help reverse population
00:24:30.880
decline and brain drain by bringing in talented professionals. So what they're really looking
00:24:34.720
for is like bougie dinks to go and live there. And everything is framed around DEI. Everything
00:24:40.880
is framed around. That's what really turned us off. Yeah. We're like, wait, so you want us to come
00:24:44.640
here, but then be second class citizens. And like, no, they made it very clear. If you're white in Tulsa,
00:24:50.960
you are a second class citizen. Yeah. That is what like, also they, they did a lot of things
00:24:56.400
that felt very futuristic to attract families. Like you get like free access to this really
00:25:02.240
nice coworking space. There are these like, you know, bougie dink apartments that you can move to.
00:25:08.160
They set us up in this gorgeous, cute boutique hotel that was all automated when we stayed
00:25:12.880
that overlooked this beautiful park. It was right next to this. Oh my God. I was pregnant at the time.
00:25:19.040
So they had this amazing Mexican restaurant and you know how I'm always craving enchiladas. I can't even.
00:25:28.000
utopian futuristic over the top park that is like, I've never seen a park like this anywhere
00:25:35.760
in the world. And we've been to a lot of incredible parks, but this park was like,
00:25:39.440
am I in a sci-fi right now? Like what is going on here? And it was all developed by this one really
00:25:43.760
wealthy family that also is behind the Tulsa remote program. That's just like, we're going to make Tulsa
00:25:47.520
great again. And we're going to do this. But again, this is, I think this is very
00:25:51.840
similar to what we're going to see in the future is these powerful families, these powerful people,
00:25:56.640
these groups, these syndicates building city states and saying, this is my land. This is my kingdom.
00:26:02.720
This is my fiefdom. I want, I want the right kind of people. And I'm going to, I'm going to be very
00:26:06.880
generous to them if they come and I'm going to attract them with all sorts of treats.
00:26:10.800
So they will be charter cities. They will be network states. They will maybe like you say,
00:26:16.880
you know, leverage countries programs like belt and road or other like charter city legislation.
00:26:22.640
And there's obviously like plenty of examples of these now, but they're getting off to a rocky
00:26:27.280
start. And that rocky start is really helpful in enabling families to know what they can depend on
00:26:32.480
in the future as an attractive family and where they need to also protect themselves and sort of like
00:26:37.040
always make sure they have their backs on something. So consider for example, Prospera
00:26:41.360
and in Honduras, right? They are a charter city and they have tax autonomy, labor autonomy,
00:26:48.320
legal autonomy, and regulatory autonomy, which is why tons of cool medical experimentation is
00:26:52.640
taking place there. Anything from gene therapy to getting a chip inserted into your wrist that can
00:26:58.560
open up your Tesla. That's just super fun. I just love it. It's so cool. But the problem is that
00:27:04.800
when there was a regime change in Honduras, the next president who was super socialist was like,
00:27:10.720
oh, I want to undo this. And so there's, there's all this, like, who knows if, like,
00:27:15.360
I think now Prospera is suing Honduras for like three times its GDP or like some, some insane amount.
00:27:22.880
Cause they're like, you broke your promise, but like, who knows how that's going to go. And that is a
00:27:26.480
problem is you have to feel confident that whatever you're setting up, isn't just going to be like
00:27:37.040
That's why you should not set it. Like, I would not set this up in Latin America. I would set this up
00:27:45.520
Maybe. So I want to hear your thoughts on, on another charter city. We really haven't engaged
00:27:49.360
with much intellectually or logistically. I don't think we know anyone involved.
00:27:52.480
Is there's the Dubai International Financial Center in the UAE. They're a financial free zone.
00:27:57.600
So they have their own commercial law. They have their own courts and their own regulation.
00:28:01.200
It's just sort of like this different kind of thing. What are your, what are your thoughts on
00:28:05.520
like the Middle East or something like this? Do you just think you're too
00:28:11.360
They are too in-group favoring and I wouldn't want to live there and I wouldn't trust it. Like
00:28:15.520
if I was going to, the, the place that we looked at doing this, which has been leaked is the Isle of
00:28:20.080
Man. You know, like that's a great place to say they're dealing with a major brain drain.
00:28:24.400
They have a degree of autonomy. They're not in the EU, but they're near all of that.
00:28:30.000
It would be amazing. The Isle of Man would be amazing.
00:28:35.120
And then what's that, that one that Arya Babu wanted to target.
00:28:37.840
That was a small island between the UK and French.
00:28:43.680
I mean, I would work about like worry about Sark and severe weather.
00:28:46.400
Isle of Man has the same problem, but like, no, totally in favor of those.
00:28:49.760
I think another good example of like cautionary tales is Hong Kong because they had their own
00:28:54.480
legal and economic and immigration systems, but China's like, yeah, then there's, I think this is
00:29:01.120
a really great example is the, the special economic zone that was shut up, set up, shut up.
00:29:06.640
That was set up in Shenzhen in China that just revolutionized China.
00:29:14.800
So they, they offered regulatory and economic freedoms, but they did things that only China
00:29:20.640
I'm probably going to flub my attempt to very succinctly summarize this, but it used to be
00:29:26.240
before this zone was set up that people couldn't just up and move from their local villages to work
00:29:32.880
And what changed with Shenzhen is it suddenly they were allowed to go work there.
00:29:37.200
And if this enabled this massive floating working population that would sweep into Shenzhen
00:29:43.200
and work and often like live in company towns, but on a sort of migrant labor basis.
00:29:49.360
So their kids would stay at home with their parents and they would just work it to the
00:29:55.280
point of, as we know from like the Foxconn suicide nets and everything, they'd work to the point of
00:30:00.080
like their minds breaking, but make a ton of money that they would never make it home in their local
00:30:08.160
And then eventually just go home to their families and like survive, you know, like go back to life.
00:30:14.640
But it enabled these huge like labor to sort of slosh around and respond to demand.
00:30:21.760
It's an example of China using targeted immigration in its own way to sort of get
00:30:26.800
value out of a population that wasn't really valuable to it before, because they were basically
00:30:31.520
taking subsistence farmers and subsistence families and turning them into slaves.
00:30:37.520
Yeah. Like the, the, the force that enabled sort of Apple to, to become Apple, but also Apple
00:30:44.080
to make China into the industrial powerhouse that it became during that period.
00:30:49.280
And if you're interested in this, I think there's this author that wrote about how
00:30:58.080
I mean, kind of. Yeah. And then also there's gone from the region, even though they should
00:31:03.360
have a long time ago due to, you know, risks and they're, and they're freaking out over
00:31:07.520
Trump's tariffs and everything. They don't have a plan. And everyone told them, get out of China,
00:31:11.680
get out of China, get out of China, get out of China, get out of China, get out of China.
00:31:13.840
And they're trying. And, and apparently the, the, the journalist who wrote this book
00:31:17.120
upon interviewing many people actively working at Apple, he thinks they're delusional,
00:31:22.720
but Apple is actively trying to shift a ton of its production now to India.
00:31:26.560
Um, and while he thinks that they're, they are being way overly optimistic about how
00:31:32.480
quickly they can shift over, they are very intent on shifting away.
00:31:42.640
I know. And they're trying, I'm just saying they're trying, Malcolm. So give them some credit.
00:31:47.520
Not that we are huge Apple stands. I mean, I freaking love my mouth.
00:31:50.720
Whatever. Let Apple crumble. Right. But no, but I mean, I think America should,
00:31:54.080
it should always try to be growing ties with India and India should work to drop its stupid
00:32:02.400
India is obsessed with trying to be neutral in global power.
00:32:07.520
China's right there. What do you want them to do?
00:32:11.120
No, no, no, no, no, no, no. They, they, they, I mean, they're anti China and neutral.
00:32:15.040
Like for example, they bought a ton of Russian oil during the Ukraine conflict.
00:32:18.560
Right. Like they, they need the oil during the, during the communists versus capitalists
00:32:24.400
saying of the, the, the, the, that period, they never really became a client of the U.S.
00:32:29.280
They always tried to play the U.S. and the USSR off each other.
00:32:32.400
And while it sounds smart, look at where you are now, India, it clearly hasn't worked out for you.
00:32:38.160
You know, choose a side America will work with you and China will turn you.
00:32:44.880
Well, it's not great what China does to the people who tried to befriend China.
00:32:52.640
Anyway, these, these are just some of the examples, but I think we're going to see a lot more of this.
00:32:56.720
So as demographic collapse plays out, even though immigration is not the answer,
00:33:02.000
people are totally going to turn to immigration and we should be exploiting that to our advantage.
00:33:14.400
Well, I think the big things is create jobs, generate tax revenue by making money,
00:33:20.000
buy from the local economy, build infrastructure and produce useful products like agriculture,
00:33:26.640
And I think, you know, doing things like that would be great.
00:33:29.500
That's why we're so obsessed with building a no holds barred medical research community
00:33:33.700
that brings in medical tourism, that brings in academic researchers, that sort of becomes
00:33:38.100
this essential place for the wealthy and resourced to get experimental medical procedures
00:33:43.780
that they can't get anywhere else that fosters academic research.
00:33:47.540
But I mean, there are lots of different specialties you can have that do that.
00:33:50.820
And also just becoming entrepreneurial and knowing how to generate tax revenue and both contribute
00:33:58.500
I mean, like, obviously, one way to generate tax revenue is to make money yourself.
00:34:02.660
But another way to generate tax revenue is to bring jobs to a population, you know, sort
00:34:07.940
of have this like, if you build your fiefdom, and then there's these villages around you that
00:34:11.860
are that are selling to you and buying from you, then, you know, the country benefits even
00:34:16.180
more or the larger area that's attracting you benefits you even more.
00:34:24.020
And I think this is an equally important part of this equation that people need to be looking
00:34:27.540
at and talking about that they're not talking about, which is, what do you do when there's
00:34:36.420
And what do you do when these countries can no longer handle basic things like not only
00:34:42.980
Well, I mean, look at what's happening in Peru right now.
00:34:45.540
People are like Amish and Mennonites are destroying the Peruvian Amazon and stuff like that, right?
00:34:50.180
Like the deforestation claims and stuff, right?
00:34:55.860
Like, yeah, if you let the wokes get too much power, you got to run again.
00:35:04.020
So I don't know how much you can choose or predict the continued friendliness of an area.
00:35:11.700
Probably the the more isolated you are in an area and the less desirable that area is going to
00:35:16.660
be like we've always had this theory that if we were going to build a fiefdom or a city
00:35:22.340
state or a charter city, it would be somewhere that's not desirable, that isn't going to be
00:35:31.460
I mean, that's why you're looking at Sark in the Isle of Man.
00:35:34.260
These are areas where you can actually do a degree of farming, but it requires technological
00:35:41.620
They're not they're not, you know, they're there are not huge reasons why people are
00:35:45.460
going to want to go there for natural resources.
00:35:48.020
So that's I think that's also really important.
00:35:50.020
I'm surrounded by unstable governments that are going to change their mind in a day.
00:35:54.340
You're less likely to have like roving gangs because they are literal islands.
00:36:02.820
I mean, Canada's is attractive in so far as aside from maybe interest in oil or logging,
00:36:13.620
You know, desire to to settle there, I think, but I think a lot of it is if you can control
00:36:21.060
your own energy production and defense, you are in a much better position than just a
00:36:27.140
group that happens to be very economically productive.
00:36:32.180
You've got to eventually get to energy production and defense.
00:36:35.780
Well, and I'm hoping that small scale nuclear just becomes a thing.
00:36:38.820
And so just, you know, well, your compound is going to have its little
00:36:48.500
And I think when we look someday, we will turn our eyes again to investing in companies and
00:36:53.540
technologies that enable sovereignty from a technological standpoint.
00:36:57.860
So like AI systems or other systems that enable any independent group that decides to organize
00:37:04.020
and settle land to like with a lot of help, like maybe with the help of drones and a couple of
00:37:10.020
types of robots and a bunch of AI, like sort of preloaded to help to set this up like a kit to set up
00:37:16.340
small scale nuclear septic systems, like a well insulated settlements, maybe connected by tunnels
00:37:23.540
of things like that, that like just will work pretty much anywhere.
00:37:27.060
And then some permaculture that works with the local environment.
00:37:29.940
Like I really want to invest in technologies like this because as much as I appreciate what AI
00:37:35.940
doomers are attempting to do to like prevent things from happening.
00:37:39.460
Like the more we can enable people to live off the grid successfully in communities and be
00:37:45.700
independent and take care of each other, the more I think humanitarian crisis.
00:37:53.860
I'm so excited you brought this to everyone's attention, Simone.
00:37:56.740
This is a fascinating topic because it did you read about where this was happening in Korea,
00:38:02.180
by the way, because I had mentioned that in Korea, they're doing this a lot more.
00:38:06.580
So one of the phenomenons in Korea is they keep doing these programs to try to get people
00:38:11.460
to new regions because obviously they have this massive depopulation.
00:38:15.140
This is also happening in Italy, Greece, Switzerland, but this is for like internal citizens.
00:38:22.500
Where they'll change what they're offering people to get them to move to a new part of
00:38:26.020
Korea and then everybody moves there and then they'll change what they're offering again.
00:38:30.020
And then all the people who just moved to the new region moved to wherever the best.
00:38:32.820
Oh, so it's, it's, it's as if we, as a couple had like done startup Chile, but then we moved
00:38:38.740
to Tulsa, Oklahoma, but then stayed there for the requisite year and then moved to like somewhere.
00:38:44.980
Just being whoever is offering the best benefits.
00:38:48.660
And I, but I bet there will be those like just sort of, you could call them like mercenary
00:38:53.780
it girl populations that just like go to the highest bidder at any given time.
00:38:58.580
And they're just like, Oh, it'll be high population.
00:39:00.420
Well, you know, we'll have a ton of kids and we'll just go to whoever is giving us the
00:39:04.820
And that's, that's what we're seeing in Korea right now.
00:39:06.820
I just wonder if you could kind of think of Jews as that kind of population that like
00:39:13.140
If by best benefits, you mean least killing them, I guess.
00:39:17.940
I mean, there are various ways to look at this, Malcolm.
00:39:21.220
I mean, also like maybe the best benefit we're going to get from various city states is like
00:39:29.860
But like, I don't know that there's the fun timeline and there's the dark timeline.
00:39:39.860
Well, in Korea, a lot of people know that we, we did an episode on this when I first
00:39:44.980
One in four men in rural Korea has married a, a non-Korean woman in foreign
00:39:52.820
Is there, is there a big gender differential or is it just that like all the women are choosing
00:39:57.380
to be single and women are choosing to be single and, and, and overly picky in Korea
00:40:02.100
and men are just like, okay, I'll marry a foreigner.
00:40:04.500
And that is how the Korean population is replacing.
00:40:07.060
Maybe you're not giving women the benefit of the doubt though, because one of the big
00:40:10.180
issues in Korea and in other countries that have developed more quickly than Western companies.
00:40:17.940
More misogynistic in that they have sort of double standards for women.
00:40:22.020
Like, yeah, we're going to be a dual income household, but also you're going to do all the
00:40:26.580
Which is, is not, you know, so, I mean, of course they're going to go to women who are willing to do
00:40:30.740
that, but those women who are doing that also aren't going to be as educated and aren't going
00:40:38.580
I mean, I, it's not all on the men it's, it's on everyone.
00:40:42.420
You're, you're so kind and magnanimous, Simone.
00:40:53.940
Oh, go heavy on the pineapple, but cut it smaller than the way you normally cut it.
00:40:58.660
Do you want it confetti small, or do you want it like.
00:41:02.100
Not confetti small, just like a quarter of the size of those giant chunks.
00:41:07.460
And what would I want for, I definitely do not want that rice again.
00:41:13.140
I just, I, you kept talking to the journalist and I just kept slicing and zesting lemons
00:41:28.020
If you want me to eat something, I could just eat the Penang directly, or we could try dumplings.
00:41:38.500
Or, or maybe it will taste good with something other than Penang.
00:41:41.540
But right now it just tastes like ultra lemony.
00:41:46.580
But we could try like dumplings or something with Penang, I think would work really well.
00:41:58.180
And when you reheat it, also put in a bit more spice.
00:42:01.220
Obviously we were trying to make it bland for the journalists.
00:42:06.820
We told him that we're glad the German people are going extinct, so.
00:42:11.220
Although he, I think he maybe identifies more as Swiss, because he talked about growing
00:42:21.220
Do you want fish flavor bland, or do you want like beef flavor?
00:42:36.180
Do you remember we kept having people call like on me for laughing too loud?
00:42:41.620
Someone just knocked on our hotel room because they were like, you should.
00:42:57.460
Don't like, but I think this shows like who we are as a family.
00:43:00.660
It's not like you're beating your wife too much.
00:43:03.700
Like what kind of delicate snowflake do you cut?
00:43:09.860
Like, are these just all extremely like sensory sensitive autists?
00:43:17.700
I don't say, I think it's that they, they hate other people being happy.
00:43:24.660
If you understand why it is that Swiss people hate fun.
00:43:31.860
poor little Malcolm here just laughs and laughs.
00:43:39.940
And I say, well, you're stupid because I'm having fun and you're going to die alone and sad.
00:43:51.220
By the way, just in terms of good food, you need to know this.
00:43:58.020
Like there are multiple accounts that have a lot of likes, like a lot.
00:44:06.420
It only shows people going around to buffets and often like office buffets,
00:44:14.580
wedding buffets in South Korea and just filling their plate.
00:44:22.260
Bread buffets, wedding buffets, work office buffets.
00:44:25.300
And it just, it just goes from like tray to tray.
00:44:28.020
And then you just see a hand loading up a plate and you were just like,
00:44:32.900
Like of all the random, you know, there's the restock.
00:44:36.580
Have like a huge problem when you're in Korea, which is that they over.
00:44:43.940
And so what this means is that when they go to all you can eat buffets,
00:44:47.940
there are specific meals that they know costs more to make.
00:44:56.660
So it's like everything at the buffet is ignored.
00:44:58.820
But this one thing that like all the Koreans recognize is the best cost to
00:45:14.020
they just go to every single tray and load up a little bit.
00:45:27.540
It was my little thing here for, for, for, is that,
00:45:31.140
is that really what the people need to see Malcolm?
00:45:34.660
They're probably wondering why is he looking down and my mouse was getting
00:45:42.180
I love that our kids are hooked on toothbrushes right now.
00:46:04.180
And we wanted to, if I wanted to drive down to Maryland again,
00:46:23.380
It's most evil day to us with our reverse seasonal affective disorder.
00:46:28.580
I'm like, this is the evil day winter solstice.
00:46:31.140
I'm like, no, it's only going to get longer from here,
00:46:35.620
They jump into solstice rituals, musical battles,
00:46:39.780
impromptu debates on AI philosophy, folk dance,
00:46:46.660
All of it oriented around connecting with others,
00:46:52.420
Meme and myth collide, and something new and magical will be bored.
00:46:57.860
Oh, and there's also recreational waterboarding.
00:47:05.540
She's going to be in vibe camp because I thought,
00:47:08.740
She went to vibe camp last year, but I didn't like talk to her much
00:47:11.380
because it felt like trying to walk up to like the main celebrity of the event.
00:47:18.820
No, she's always like open with us, but she is, you know, a lot of people have demands on her time.
00:47:23.060
Oh, and who else did I meet the last time I went is I ended up playing board games.
00:47:27.140
A tabletop game with Robin Hanson and friends and company.
00:47:35.220
That involves crowds of people and being outside.
00:47:41.700
Like, I definitely don't want to risk making a friend, you know?
00:47:51.380
Yeah, a lot of, just a lot of touchy, touchy feeling, mystical kind of stuff.
00:47:58.260
Yeah, no, these are people very into indulging in alternative outlets for their sexual desires
00:48:05.620
that they contextualize as non-sexual or adjacent to sexual, but not passing sexual norms within
00:48:15.700
And there's somebody like, well, you know, it's just a cuddle party or something.
00:48:20.260
It's like, how is that not infinitely worse than just having sex?
00:48:27.300
Well, imagine though, and just how toxic it was for me to be raised in an environment like that,
00:48:31.860
where I was, well, I was like raised in an environment where cuddling and all of this
00:48:39.300
And I was fully convinced that none of it had any sexual insinuations, that nudity, cuddling,
00:48:45.620
all of that was like 100% just natural and that it wouldn't confuse people.
00:48:54.020
Wait, so did you ever go to like a cuddle party?
00:49:00.500
There were instances in groups of people where like everyone was cuddling and I'm like,
00:49:04.820
I guess I have to like snuggle in, you know, or like, yeah.
00:49:08.820
And, and, and then, and then this led to people getting the wrong idea about me.
00:49:12.580
And like, it just, yeah, it doesn't, it doesn't produce good results.
00:49:18.420
So like, these are very, you're glad that you get to live with me.
00:49:27.220
Now, what is the interesting thing you're going to say?
00:49:29.540
I read you the hook and you were like, that sounds good.