Based Camp - The Year Trans Was Invented (Gender Dysphoria Absent From the Historic Record)

00:00:00.000 hello simone i'm excited to be here with you today today we are going to be going deeper

00:00:04.060 down a rabbit hole that i have pulled on in the past but i was called back to it by an episode i

00:00:10.660 watched of the rapidly declining in viewers a short fat otaku i think we now do better than

00:00:16.480 him in terms of view count by probably like 20 percent which is pretty exciting because i used

00:00:21.720 to really like him and his videos and he sort of got he actually represents a wider phenomenon that

00:00:29.260 i wanted to grab onto on this topic because he in his recent video he was critical of leaflet's

00:00:34.400 debate performance whereas almost everyone else says that she won dramatically i even had this

00:00:39.020 moment where he's like i think she lost the trans debate she was having and i was like to go to an

00:00:43.320 ai and be like is it general what's the general consensus on who won this debate and it's like

00:00:48.060 overwhelmingly leaflet and then it went through all of the reasons it was overwhelmingly leaflet

00:00:53.320 so i was like okay just checking yeah just so yeah to even override your your bias still

00:00:58.760 but he said one thing that really got under my skin at the beginning because a trans person was

00:01:07.020 saying to somebody who is in this debate that was happening on x you know we were here before you

00:01:11.980 and we will be here after you and then his response that went viral was like this is true

00:01:17.400 and and he then says trans people have been reported in human history since you know across

00:01:24.140 cultures since the beginning of time and this is factually not true and i actually don't even

00:01:29.680 really blame short fat otaku for not knowing this because he's not a historian yeah yeah well it's

00:01:36.340 something that's not widely known and yet is claimed with a lot of confidence by the trans

00:01:41.660 community and if you don't double check because you'll be broadly aware like if you're aware of

00:01:48.200 history you will be aware that throughout human history and a lot of different cultural contexts

00:01:53.400 where people will take on alternate gender roles where sometimes people cross-dress in history

00:01:59.960 where people would act like a man or a female at different points in history the fall of rome

00:02:07.260 joe rogan had this to say on his podcast fascinating that the end of empires they get

00:02:12.640 really concerned with gender and hermaphrodites the roman femboy fully grown and willing to take

00:02:18.440 on the role of a common roman woman even the emperor himself donned girly outfits mascara

00:02:25.280 and held many chamber parties the roman senate began having debates to determine if quote being

00:02:31.880 with a femme boy was a totally gay thing after all and so you take that and you then just are

00:02:38.580 like yeah of course i've heard like three or four instances of that happening in history 0.80

00:02:42.180 that i can just think of off the top of my head but that's not what the modern trans movement is

00:02:47.780 And even the core complaint of the modern trans movement is gender dysphoria, this really, really intense discomfort with your birth gender to the extent that you may want to unalive yourself, right?

00:03:02.920 Like, you cannot live a mentally healthy life as your birth gender.

00:03:06.360 It is something that is constantly eating at you if you don't transition.

00:03:09.260 This phenomenon literally nowhere in history before the year 1920.

00:03:17.040 And you may want to say, well, Malcolm, that's pretty nitpicky. So you're saying that there have been alternate gender presentations throughout history, but there's never been dysphoria recorded in history. Why does that matter? Right? And it's like, well, if it turns out that dysphoria is a modern cultural phenomenon, if dysphoria is not actually part of the human condition, then most trans arguments immediately fall apart.

00:03:42.560 the idea of i can't be mentally healthy without doing this because of what because of the distress

00:03:48.440 i feel when i'm displaying my birth gender if you say well that distress is a cultural artifact

00:03:54.800 and we're probably better off removing the cultural artifact than attempting to address it

00:04:01.140 through major surgery that falls apart and if you can say well if the people in historia you know

00:04:08.340 lived as other genders but didn't feel dysphoria then why'd they do it and it's like well we

00:04:13.280 actually have a very good record most of the time it was either like a woman wanted to live as a

00:04:18.900 father in like a church and like this sort of lifestyle or did she wanted to fight in a war 0.62

00:04:25.060 and women weren't allowed to fight in wars during that period or she wanted to pursue a gay

00:04:29.260 relationship and women weren't allowed to pursue gay relationships in that period or uh with guys

00:04:34.540 it's often they were cross-dressers cross-dressing is something we see recorded throughout history

00:04:39.160 even today to conflate somebody who is a cross-dresser with a trans person is extremely

00:04:45.200 offensive to both the trans community and the community of cross-dressers they are not the

00:04:49.220 same thing wanting to dress up and talk like a woman sometimes is not the same thing as being

00:04:56.180 trans so if you say oh well in history we have cross-dressers but no trans people that's a

00:05:02.380 significantly different thing that removes most of the motivation for like why we need to gender

00:05:09.680 someone correctly gender dysphoria why do i need to use that restroom gender dysphoria why do i need

00:05:16.220 to be on the sports team gender dysphoria but if we're looking to history and all we have is

00:05:20.560 sometimes i like cross-dressing then it's why do i have to play on this girl's sports team 0.95

00:05:25.580 because i like cross-dressing it's like oh no that's stupid no we can't let you on the sports 1.00

00:05:30.440 team just because you like cross-dressing if gender dysphoria is a cultural artifact that is 0.95

00:05:35.780 the center stone that the entire trans community relies on to demand they one be seen as their

00:05:42.460 preferred gender and to gain access to safe spaces that would otherwise be referred for people who

00:05:48.900 were born that gender and also just to head this off at the beginning of this we do not think that

00:05:56.040 they are faking feeling gender dysphoria or the severity of the gender dysphoria they are they

00:06:02.160 feel we suspect with a lot of evidence that we've gone over in other episodes that gender dysphoria

00:06:08.540 is very similar to other forms of body dysphoria which are associated with culture-bound illnesses

00:06:16.120 these are psychological conditions that only happen within certain cultures within certain

00:06:22.140 periods of history and people are unable to catch unless they are aware of them with the most famous

00:06:28.540 being anorexia and again you can see a lot of similarities age of onset around puberty gender

00:06:35.280 distribution more girls than guys key characteristics hits autists more than the general population

00:06:41.700 associated with intense body dysmorphia and simone as somebody who went through that and

00:06:48.520 we're going to see this throughout this episode, can really empathize with how real this feels.

00:06:53.800 But if it is a culture-bound illness, the way that we need to address it is entirely different

00:07:01.020 than the way our society is addressing it right now if we actually care about the people who are

00:07:05.420 suffering from it. And there are two maybe cases, but both of them are really bad. We'll go into

00:07:11.700 them in a bit just to briefly touch on them one is a jewish rabbi from 600 years ago who wrote a

00:07:19.760 poem about like wouldn't it have been better to be born a woman and we'll go through the poem and

00:07:24.480 everything like this and just to sort of give give away the thing there it's that poem is considered

00:07:30.280 within jewish thought for 600 years up until the year 2000 not a single scholar it's a very famous

00:07:38.700 poem thought that it wasn't satirical in fact it was considered almost prototypical or an excellent

00:07:46.240 example often used of jewish humor from that period so not a single scholar or rabbi for 600

00:07:53.580 years thought it was anything other than a joke well even if it wasn't a joke though i i don't

00:07:58.360 think that that could even necessarily be seen as gender as a joke it's sad no but even if it

00:08:05.480 wasn't as someone could just be like well practically i'd rather be born a woman especially

00:08:09.380 during a time of war if they're like i'd rather not die in a war what the poem was it wasn't like

00:08:14.300 that it was a joke it was written in a book of jokes okay the other things in this book were

00:08:20.640 mostly jokes okay it was satire it's not like a oh you could interpret this in various ways

00:08:27.880 it's very clear what was intended by it the only other example we have in history is potentially 0.97

00:08:35.080 gavala a roman emperor who based on one account asked the doctors if he could have a vagina 0.57

00:08:43.620 sewn onto him to become a woman and he would dress up like women the problem is is that this

00:08:50.140 one account was extremely hostile to him and all historians always like basically you know if you

00:08:58.340 go back and you read the historian literature and we'll go into this a bit deeper i just want to set

00:09:02.900 this up to begin with they agree and then this is the academic consensus that a lot of this was

00:09:09.860 slanders made up about him about of people who didn't like him and even if you do bite the bullet

00:09:14.640 on a gabala you are basically saying i could just go into this a little bit he's like one of the

00:09:20.840 people in human history he would do things like cut off people's members and then feed them to

00:09:28.720 snakes and birds and stuff like that as part of a religious ritual he made up he would give people

00:09:35.020 positions based on the size of their members he was the one who had a fixation before the gladiatorial

00:09:42.300 games releasing snakes on the crowd just to watch them freak out he liked to as a hobby throw gold

00:09:50.840 at crowds so people would trample each other at one point he dropped so many flower petals on a 0.96

00:09:57.080 party a bunch of people suffocated he was super gay very into you know having a gay main lover

00:10:03.440 so the the reality is is even if you accept that this guy is trans and a historic example of it

00:10:10.440 he is like that's your historic prototype of the modern trans community right which really

00:10:16.760 leans into the trans stereotype that like freedom tunes has so three turfs are on a beach

00:10:23.640 and they find a genie. 0.93

00:10:25.820 All right, let me stop you right there. 0.99

00:10:27.420 Are these women gonna get murdered by you? 1.00

00:10:32.780 I swear you're gonna like this one. 1.00

00:10:34.720 Fine, fine.

00:10:35.440 Okay, go ahead.

00:10:36.580 They rub the lamp

00:10:37.540 and the genie comes out, right?

00:10:40.380 Right, right. 1.00

00:10:44.520 And the genie is me and I murder them all. 0.99

00:10:47.260 Okay, do you see how that's just you murdering people again? 0.97

00:10:50.620 No, no, because the genie also says

00:10:53.460 i love cat boys no it was that trans comic which you know it's something you see we have our 0.98

00:11:00.020 episodes where like you you do see disproportionate violence sexual arousal from from trans individuals

00:11:04.940 and we go into why that might be the case you see this in a-list studies it's well studied in early

00:11:09.580 trans communities but we're gonna go into those a little bit we're gonna go into all of the

00:11:16.200 different cost cultural things that people say are trans because they're not you gotta understand

00:11:19.480 what a big deal this is as a data point we're talking about literally all of recorded human

00:11:25.440 history and you could be like well maybe they didn't write it down because it was societally 0.86

00:11:30.800 looked down upon at the time and it's like doesn't work we have so many so many records of gay people

00:11:38.120 throughout history we have so many records of other things that were taboo in society we have

00:11:44.280 James Joyce talking about how he's turned on by farts not once did anyone think to say I don't

00:11:49.920 like my birth gender right like they're they're willing to in a society that will kill you for

00:11:54.580 doing it sleep with a guy and write long love poetry but never once write down in the private 0.57

00:11:59.960 journal I'm just not happy with the gender I was born as that is a massive data point and keep in

00:12:06.520 mind we don't even see an instance of this in cultures that accept people taking on roles that

00:12:12.900 gender non-conforming. We don't see a single instance of this. So even where it isn't

00:12:17.940 discriminated against, no one ever thought to once in human history until the 1920s put a pin to page

00:12:24.620 and say, I'm not happy with my birth gender. And keep in mind how shocking this is when you

00:12:29.980 contextualize it in the context of how much trans people say that dysphoria affects them in their

00:12:38.320 daily lives how painful it is to them how top of mind it is for them in every single human

00:12:44.240 interaction they have if anyone historically was feeling this of course somebody like keep in mind

00:12:51.320 right now we're looking at like 1.5 percent of the population or something is trans you think nobody

00:12:56.040 would have written that down ever ever ever that's completely implausible and i want to notice here

00:13:01.360 with the agabala case here which is the strongest historical case we have of somebody feeling that

00:13:06.340 way he never even actually says that he just seems to be debauchery maxing and thinking wouldn't it 0.93

00:13:12.520 be cool if I had another sex hole right like that's literally what I'm reading from Agabala 0.96

00:13:16.820 so with that being the case I think you you're really making quite an astonishing claim to say 0.98

00:13:24.200 nobody thought to ever write this down nobody thought to ever write it in a private journal

00:13:30.360 no one thought to ever have it in a private diary with everything we know about human history that

00:13:36.040 is absolutely astonishing to me and to me it means with like like you think even accidentally

00:13:44.380 somebody would have been even if even if dysphoria isn't a phenomenon somebody might just have like

00:13:49.420 felt this way because they were abused in some sort of weird way that led to this you know a

00:13:53.980 convergently looking outcome but no to not take this data seriously is to just not be taking

00:14:01.220 reality seriously so that really annoyed me because i was like come on like dev i i and i

00:14:06.540 think that dev's the type of person that if he just dug into the evidence on this he would stop

00:14:11.260 making such an easily disprovable claim that something that looks like modern gender dysphoria

00:14:16.480 existed anywhere else in history or in any other culture okay but the same thing he does which i

00:14:21.160 think is even more fascinating is it's the entire perspective that he argues from which is he went

00:14:27.280 up there and he's like no reasonable person believes that when you transition your gender

00:14:35.700 you magically turn into a woman right and of course he was did they not tell him

00:14:40.340 rattled on x with many comments getting like five x of the likes of his comment telling everyone

00:14:47.760 how could he say this about trans people you know don't you know that trans people are actually

00:14:53.020 women it was extremely aggressive i posted nobody reasonable actually thinks that trans women

00:15:00.380 metamorphose into biological females the ask is not believe that men are women it's don't be an 0.99

00:15:05.980 asshole you don't have to like trans people you do have to leave them alone and just so we're clear 0.99

00:15:10.540 here i'm completely correct on this i might have received a lot of blowback but i'm not backing 0.99

00:15:14.300 down from any of it i don't care how big of a horde of people showed up to complain they're all wrong

00:15:19.260 and i'm right in fact there were two hordes of people the first horde was left-wing deranged

00:15:24.140 trans activists who hopped in to say that hrt does in fact turn trans women into biological females

00:15:30.060 and saying anything otherwise is transphobic in fact according to this crowd if you side with

00:15:34.300 trans women on every reasonable policy prescription with regard to their individual liberties but you

00:15:39.420 refuse to believe they become female then you're exactly the same as a bigoted right-winger trying

00:15:44.220 to force them back into the closet these people are delusional um and this brings up the second

00:15:49.500 thing i want to get into which is like the dev perspective the last 90s liberal out there right

00:15:55.660 and a lot of us were 90s liberals whether it's jk rowling or us or any number of other people who

00:16:02.860 have since updated their opinions on this even leaflet i think previously would have been you

00:16:08.620 you know, pro-trans. And the reason we were pro-trans isn't dissimilar for the reasons that

00:16:14.200 Dev is still arguing today. It was, we're like, well, no reasonable person would, if we try to 0.95

00:16:21.280 give trans people more rights, start using women's restrooms, start, allow anyone to just say I'm a

00:16:28.260 woman and get into a woman's prison, compete in women's sports. Like no reasonable person would 0.99

00:16:33.640 do that so we can give the trans community these rights and they will self-police because they know 1.00

00:16:39.240 that they'll lose these rights if they don't self-police around these issues right right yeah 0.95

00:16:44.400 and what we all learned is we were wrong whoops it just wasn't the case there was this vision of

00:16:55.760 just like just let people live their lives you know just let them live and it's fine and it will

00:17:00.860 be fine and there was this assumption that you wouldn't really have bad actors in this great

00:17:05.380 world because if someone went off the rails they'd be doing it in their own little controlled

00:17:09.960 detonation box you know it wouldn't bother us it wouldn't affect other people we would never

00:17:15.180 have fathomed that someone would be like no this means that i should be allowed to go into like as

00:17:21.020 a man into women's prisons like we just never would have imagined that's crazy what we imagined

00:17:26.400 is yes some random psycho may say something like that some random psycho may no one would listen

00:17:35.120 to them yeah but the entire trans community wouldn't then get up in arms and support them

00:17:41.680 and make their perv dreams an actual reality right like that that when it came out that

00:17:49.320 something like you know we often point out that the trans swimmer who's who's super famous 0.96

00:17:53.100 that she was flashing her genitals to girls in a girl's locker room where it is not even normal

00:17:58.180 for girls to fully undress as we pointed out that's not normal in modern changing rooms and

00:18:03.380 hasn't been for a long time and schools are even designed with this in mind these days so this is

00:18:09.220 just like intentionally using this opportunity to flash people and then later a bunch of you know i

00:18:14.100 don't want to get into all that but yeah it was clear that this was an individual who just wanted

00:18:18.500 to flash people right that they didn't then turn on this individual we're like well obviously you're

00:18:23.460 not going to be one of our leaders or archetypes of what it means to be trans but they did and this

00:18:29.520 is when a lot of us who were just sort of i guess the normies out there we were like oh i'm sorry

00:18:36.160 like we we gave you the knife to do a responsible thing with it and then you went out and started

00:18:41.500 stabbing people right and death is interesting because he even sees in his own comments on x

00:18:48.740 that the bad actors have control of the ship right like when you see somebody like camilla

00:18:56.200 using public funds to do gender reassignment for people in prison you know tax dollars it could be

00:19:02.780 going to homeless people to gender reassignment in prison you're like oh the people who are in

00:19:08.960 control of the ship these people go with the extreme take the take that he said no reasonable

00:19:18.560 person and most of the people who had this original like liberal perspective on this or

00:19:23.200 libertarian perspective on this went for and so we've adopted our views the question is is why

00:19:28.860 hasn't he and the answer is twofold and he basically gives it in the video answer number

00:19:35.100 one is he thinks and a lot of people think that simply because if everyone was reasonable this

00:19:43.920 giving them these rights and giving them these interpretations of gender would work we collectively

00:19:51.620 culturally should do this okay and it's a really sad perspective because it's like

00:19:59.020 yes i will i want to operate society as if everyone is sane and well-meaning

00:20:05.580 when that's not the case right and so it's almost a weird sort of deontal liberal deontology right

00:20:13.420 like what is moral is what you would do in a society where people don't act like people but

00:20:19.940 that's what leads you to horrors like communism and stuff like that right like in a society where

00:20:24.900 everyone was reasonable and responsible and had self-control communism works right but we don't

00:20:29.780 live in that world and he commented on our last video first time i'm aware that he's commented on

00:20:36.240 one of our videos where we mentioned that his his viewership has dropped because he is seen as sort

00:20:42.000 of betraying the wider movement that we are all part of which has become the new right which

00:20:47.240 drifted through internet culture and he's like well i never changed my views i never became a

00:20:52.640 conservative i've always been a classical liberal i never was anti-trans and i'm just

00:20:58.340 baffled but i'm not we're not criticizing you for changing your views we're criticizing you

00:21:03.060 for not changing your views as new evidence came out right like we all had those views back then

00:21:09.520 when i watched your videos when i loved your channel i had all the perspectives you had i

00:21:13.500 was seeking truth i wanted a better world and i believed that you know oh well we give these people

00:21:20.140 these additional rights and they will use them responsibly and society will work and then it's

00:21:27.420 the same with things like immigration oh we can just take people from other countries bring them

00:21:31.180 to our country and it'll work and they'll become just like us and then with both of these instances

00:21:35.660 we're like oh okay well clearly this is not working or whatever one who was here because

00:21:41.600 we were interested in what was reasonable is like oh well clearly this isn't working so now we need

00:21:47.180 to address this i take much more pride in my views that i have changed than in my views that have

00:21:55.600 stayed the same and i'm beginning to sort of wonder or realize was dev ever actually on that

00:22:03.920 journey with us and this faction of people who say are like still classic 90s liberals or whatever

00:22:08.540 did they ever really care about what was in the best interest of society or did they have like

00:22:13.740 a religious belief in what was the most common cultural belief system of progressives in the

00:22:21.100 nineties. And just as society has changed around them and certain things that we assumed were true

00:22:26.820 back then have been proven untrue. They're just like, but I refuse to change any of my views

00:22:31.920 because this is what was true in the nineties. This is what any reasonable person thought in

00:22:36.500 the nineties that we can just have as many immigrants as we thought, which I thought I

00:22:39.800 was pro unrestricted immigration back in the day okay because i looked at the economists research

00:22:44.840 i looked at that and i was like oh this works and new evidence has come out we have tried it

00:22:48.580 at scale it didn't work especially the uk or on trans issues where it's like okay we'll give you

00:22:55.940 these rights and you will not use them to do things like go and aggressively try to convert

00:23:03.340 minors like actively convert on fetish forms right like if somebody was doing that you try to shut

00:23:09.360 that down right okay good and then oh shoot somebody's doing that you guys shut it down

00:23:15.040 how dare you stop them trends of hope and you won't claim crazy things like you're actually

00:23:20.900 biologically women and then he sees oh oh no the people running the ship are that that's concerning

00:23:27.840 that's gonna cause negative effects for society and yet he's like but i'm religiously i will live

00:23:34.480 in the 90s. No new information. You know, Travis Stock was never shot down. We never saw that they

00:23:41.900 were hiding the files showing that putting people on poobity blockers was increasing the risk of

00:23:47.500 wanting to unalive and decreasing their mental health. That this was wide scale throughout the

00:23:51.860 trans industry we saw in the WPATH files. I never updated my beliefs after that. I only operate on

00:23:58.180 90s research that was done largely by clinics that made their money off of gender transitioning

00:24:03.040 people and i think that this is really sad that people like him they'll go cite the research and

00:24:07.900 i'm like was that research done by researchers who made their living off of transitioning people

00:24:12.380 okay do you understand how that might be compromised and we might need to look at

00:24:16.760 other sources of evidence it's important and i feel like even if you disagree with us

00:24:23.100 that you take time to understand that when it comes to the anti-trans position of the majority

00:24:31.220 of the leading intellectuals who are anti-trans these days whether it's elon or jk rowling or us

00:24:36.180 we do not come to this because we love tradition for the sake of tradition because we are attached

00:24:42.900 to traditional gender roles because we want some old religious hierarchy in place if anything we're

00:24:50.200 kind of on the opposite team we come to this because we wanted a better society and we got

00:24:56.540 new information and it's the new information that must be dealt with not the oh you're just taking

00:25:03.360 away our rights because you hate us obviously that's not true all of us had trans friends

00:25:08.880 second he has friends close friends who are trans and are is this something he's mentioned

00:25:17.180 explicitly or is this an assumption he mentions this repeatedly in the video this is and i can

00:25:23.920 really understand if you have close friends who fall into a specific demographic that is in a

00:25:30.000 systemic way acting bad right on a global stage you can be like i i really don't want this friend

00:25:37.540 of mine to have to suffer they're a nice person right but the problem is is by taking the action

00:25:47.340 that you are taking, many, many more people who are not your friend end up suffering much, much

00:25:54.880 more, right? Whether it is the people who end up being assaulted, which happened just recently near

00:26:01.980 us in Pennsylvania, the young trans girl who made a hit list of people in the school and they tried

00:26:07.220 to do something about it, but she had this protected status. And so then she beat a girl 0.99

00:26:11.060 and it's really horrible. And, you know, all the warning signs were there, but trans are the people

00:26:16.480 who lose their medals. They're shot at college. They're shot at scholarships because of this. 0.99

00:26:20.700 Or the kids who end up getting transitioned. And now we know from papers that one in 10 kids who

00:26:27.340 only, if you look at 14-year-olds with a paper on this, it showed that only one in 10 who identifies

00:26:34.040 as not their birth gender ends up still identifying as not their birth gender by the time they're,

00:26:38.840 I think, 21 or 23. And we know that this increases unaliving rates by huge amounts if they end up

00:26:45.360 adopting into this community we know that going on to like when the cast report thing broke down

00:26:52.160 and the the it wasn't the cast report it was the travis.clink when it shut down it went through

00:26:56.540 the files and they found the suppressed research it showed that going on puberty blockers increased

00:27:05.320 unaliving risks we know now because puberty blockers have been blocked in the uk

00:27:09.680 today that rates have not gone up. That is a huge sample size. We could have easily seen that if

00:27:16.580 that was the case. It turns out that this entire thing was just wrong and a lie and people using

00:27:22.900 captured scientific institutions to lie to people. And you can update your beliefs on this, right?

00:27:28.980 Because the point I'm making is you are causing real harm because you don't want your friend to 1.00

00:27:35.840 feel that i mean i think we can relate to it because we have friends who are non-binary not 1.00

00:27:40.600 necessarily we've certainly met nice people i mean they're not friends anymore because of course 0.98

00:27:45.820 you know i don't want to like there's a point where you have to go out there and but i mean 0.98

00:27:50.100 for every trans friend that i've lost i've gained more detransitioner friends so like

00:27:55.040 i the reality is is i'll tell you the harassment my detransitioner friends have faced

00:28:02.280 from the trans community dwarfs in orders of magnitude i mean like 10 20 x anything any

00:28:10.580 trans friend i have any face from from anyone that's true yeah and you know this as somebody 0.93

00:28:16.700 who's had trans known trans people and detransitioners it's not even close like the

00:28:20.660 trans community is like the very definition of bigotry in the way that they treat you 0.61

00:28:24.060 pretty freaking bad yeah not good but well and this is this is how do i say to somebody you have 0.88

00:28:31.200 to look at the larger picture right and be willing to be like i can still like this person as a

00:28:37.340 person and say that we shouldn't harass like trans adults on the street we shouldn't treat

00:28:41.360 them poorly but we need to understand that there is something deeply wrong with the community as 0.59

00:28:45.560 it exists right now and just trying to be this like moral deontologist around like well if

00:28:50.000 everyone was reasonable in society when it's been proven to you on your very platforms that that's

00:28:55.640 not the case and i'm sort of writing this video almost as if i hope dev watches that i'm trying

00:28:59.700 not to be too mean to him right like please like take a step back from this particular cliff

00:29:06.200 you are not helping the wider trans community by not admitting that that we do actually need to

00:29:14.880 start taking action on this issue um and it gets worse if it turns out that even your friend is

00:29:21.000 suffering from something closer to a culturally bound illness which is what we'll be arguing with

00:29:25.760 with this stuff before i get into that one final thing i wanted to note is an argument that i saw 0.99

00:29:29.940 when i was doing some research on this to try to understand this for like women in you know trans

00:29:34.860 people joining women's sports right trans males women's sports and a lot of people get tripped up

00:29:40.980 on this argument because they'll say something like, well, Michael Phelps has like dramatically

00:29:45.020 larger lungs. And like, that's for genetic reasons, right? You know, like, why is he allowed

00:29:49.980 to compete? And yet a trans person who has some, like, because they had a male puberty, larger 0.99

00:29:55.860 lungs or something like that, why are they not allowed to compete? Right. And I think when you

00:30:01.800 actually think through it, the answer is fairly obvious. Suppose there was a surgery that you

00:30:07.140 could get where gills were grafted onto you or you could genetically engineer some humans to be like

00:30:15.660 triple muscled and be able to breathe basically underwater and blah blah blah blah would it be

00:30:21.160 remotely fair or sporting to allow these people to compete in the men's competition no nobody would

00:30:28.460 do that right like we in the enhanced games yes in normal competitions no no yes and there is a

00:30:35.460 a version of the Olympics that's being built for this, right?

00:30:38.380 This is the reason we banned testosterone,

00:30:40.560 like our performance enhancing drugs in the Olympics.

00:30:42.660 This is the reason we banned EPO doping in the Olympics.

00:30:45.460 This is the reason we banned many types of like even swimwear in the Olympics

00:30:48.540 because it gives people too much of a scientific advantage

00:30:51.760 because that's not the point of the Olympics.

00:30:54.620 If you then created a separate category for the gill people,

00:30:58.560 it would make sense for trans men to compete in that category 1.00

00:31:00.940 because they're using a surgery to gain an advantage over other people. 1.00

00:31:05.460 okay yeah we used to see jokes about trans people competing in sports teams and being allowed in

00:31:13.940 women's changing rooms as being fundamentally anti-trans because it was seen as so obviously

00:31:20.980 an unfair thing to do come in jerry have a seat take off your bra if you'd like i need to talk

00:31:27.380 see i have this problem i have a terrible secret well cindy we all have our little secrets

00:31:35.120 sometimes we do things we're not so proud of to gain the athletic edge on the competition

00:31:40.700 sometimes those secrets come back to haunt us

00:31:44.260 oh the other thing i note about not wanting to tell a friend like yeah but overall it's bad

00:31:52.160 is i would ask i don't know if he does have any friends like this but

00:31:57.380 I've also had friends who are Scientologists, right?

00:32:01.000 And it made me very uncomfortable speaking negatively about the church, but the church

00:32:04.320 has destroyed countless people's lives.

00:32:07.100 Yeah, sure.

00:32:07.980 And it is demonstrably a negative force in our society.

00:32:12.160 And it's something that-

00:32:13.160 So we've had Scientologists for whom, as far as we can tell on the outside, it's worked

00:32:17.060 well for them.

00:32:17.660 And you feel like, okay, well, this is good for you.

00:32:19.920 I'm not going to question your choice to do this, but on average, I would not have anyone

00:32:24.420 I care about join the church. 0.95

00:32:27.380 Yeah, well, and it makes sense to warn people about it, just as we warn people about gender transition at a young age, or normalizing this. And if I could put legal restrictions on the Church of Scientology, they'd be similar to church, I'd be like, I would want legal restrictions that reduce the number of people coming into the church, but I wouldn't want to punish people who are like genuine day-to-day believers.

00:32:45.300 And I think that that's the way we should be approaching this. To the question, and this was the big question in Leafless Debate, it was the big question Dev focused his video on is, what is a woman? Like, how do you define the word woman?

00:32:57.380 And I largely actually agree with the broader take on Dev's perspective on this. I keep saying Dev, that's a short fight otaku, it's like game, which is a woman is whatever a woman is culturally conceived to be by that particular cultural group.

00:33:14.100 so from my cultural perspective that you know we have built for our family a woman is somebody who

00:33:21.920 has the larger gametes and has children and are you like are you saying somebody is less of a

00:33:29.640 woman if they can't have kids it's like well kind of the primary distinction between man and woman

00:33:34.680 is made around what role they play in reproduction given that i think that reproduction is particularly

00:33:40.260 core part of the human life cycle the role that somebody plays in terms of birthing and having

00:33:47.400 kids yeah i i think that they are functionally is the 50 year old woman who is out there sleeping

00:33:53.140 around with 50 guys and having fun because there was an old actress bragging about this being at

00:33:57.600 least who's 50 and brett cooper was like what are you doing like and i was i felt the same way seeing

00:34:02.300 this 50 year old like brag about this is she less of a woman than the 50 year old with three kids

00:34:06.760 yeah she is okay i know that's an offensive thing to say in our society but culturally that is the

00:34:13.360 way i see it in the same way that culturally trans people see it differently right and then you can

00:34:19.800 say well if if culturally trans people see it differently then why don't you say okay you just

00:34:26.800 do it culturally your way they do it culturally their way the reason it is because their cultural

00:34:32.520 perception has numerous negative externalities on the people who adopt it, both in terms of

00:34:40.540 psychological health, self-worth, and outcomes. And worse than that, it's a particularly predatory

00:34:46.280 ideology, which is known for aggressively trying to find new converts in younger individuals,

00:34:53.100 from setting up conversion pipelines in schools, which is something we've seen,

00:34:57.520 explicitly trying to groom children which is something we have seen repeatedly and it's not

00:35:02.820 just like the online i often play this clip from the giggly goon files i think it's quite good

00:35:07.240 where you see in a forum people talking about oh i'm gonna hunt children right and it's something

00:35:11.120 that they do regularly for sport it's genuinely really good grooming advice i've so far sent it

00:35:16.820 to four minors between the ages of nine and 13 i hope it encourages them to transition when the

00:35:21.500 onca zone animation became a meme they got excited over its virality among kids man and drain and

00:35:26.980 Orion also fantasized about getting kids on hormones.

00:35:29.860 Orion was the manager, coercing him every step of the way.

00:35:32.880 Has he started hormones yet?

00:35:34.140 Yes, but not effectively. 1.00

00:35:35.460 I guess that's what you'd expect, just telling a retard to buy hormones. 1.00

00:35:38.460 They bought estrogen, but no anti-androgen. 1.00

00:35:40.740 It would have been more fun if he started hormone blockers at like 12.

00:35:43.780 Haha, isn't that true for everyone? 0.95

00:35:45.540 Don't worry, I'll make him into a good girl.

00:35:47.720 Don't blow up our spot, bro. 1.00

00:35:49.020 All T-slurs are like that. 1.00

00:35:50.580 If you can trust me around your kid, it'd be transphobic not to. 0.99

00:35:53.520 Me with daycare tots.

00:35:55.060 To Orion, and many of his associates,

00:35:56.980 Their identity was little more than a political shield.

00:35:59.620 And it's something that we have seen with even the Travis Doc Clinic.

00:36:04.140 One of the doctors there was arrested for going to a local park and attempting to recruit kids.

00:36:07.860 This is a repeated phenomenon within the trans community.

00:36:11.760 I'm not sure about that. That's wild. 1.00

00:36:14.380 And it's not punished by the wider trans community once it's caught. 1.00

00:36:17.660 It has to be punished by outsiders. 0.78

00:36:19.060 I just want to point out, this is ancillary to our first and maybe most fundamental philosophical gripe with trans ideology, which is that it violates consent in that to be trans isn't really so much an internal process as it is involving forcing people to externally do something against their will. 0.84

00:36:44.860 They, they are obligated per your choice to see you and acknowledge you and refer to you by your gender of choice, even if that runs against their instincts and preferences and own philosophy, philosophy. 0.69

00:37:00.540 so what our big thing is like with with most fundamental like 90s progressive live and let be

00:37:09.020 like like approaches hey as long as everyone's consenting and and letting people live their

00:37:16.740 lives it's fine but on a very fundamental level the modern version of what it means to be trans

00:37:23.440 involves revoking people's consent because they are now obligated to exactly with them 0.92

00:37:29.640 it's not about being allowed to live the way you want to live it is much closer to catholics

00:37:36.040 all of a sudden deciding they're going to force everyone to call any priest father and if you

00:37:42.660 don't call a priest father you get a giant online harassment campaign against you to try to get you 0.62

00:37:47.980 to lose your job and potentially even legal ramifications i i call trans people their

00:37:53.980 preferred gender i call priest father even though i don't think those things i think it's the polite

00:37:58.400 thing to do but if catholics decided to attempt to force everyone else to do that i'd be like

00:38:02.920 especially against other people's religious beliefs yeah just like how like when we went

00:38:08.120 when we travel in in other regions where wearing a head covering is appropriate i'll wear a head

00:38:14.140 covering you know like you know but that if someone's forcing me to do it that's a very

00:38:17.800 different story yeah yeah well i mean you you do it in those other countries often because you are

00:38:22.200 forced to do it they will kill you if you don't okay yeah that's and that is very much the way 0.61

00:38:26.040 the trans community acts right like but i want to get and when i say they're like oh they won't 0.98

00:38:31.460 kill you it's like well one look at all the mass murder trans stuff you can see our video on that 0.93

00:38:35.340 like yeah they actually will and there have the look at the charlie kirk situation right like yeah 0.97

00:38:41.820 yeah they kind of actually will but two they will try to get you like the online mob will try to get

00:38:47.440 you fired from your job and stuff like that which we've already had happen to us and when you have

00:38:51.860 five kids or something like that that's taking away the family's lifeblood you know that is not

00:38:55.980 a trivial thing to attempt to do. And it shows that even from Deb's perspective, even he can see

00:39:03.100 it. The community is owned. The culture is now owned by bad actors. And by running cover for

00:39:12.460 them, you are allowing countless amounts of harm on innocent people. But now I want to go into the

00:39:19.000 different cultures that have ideas that trans people claim shows that the trans phenomenon

00:39:24.920 is not something that was basically made up in germany in the 1920s the nazis took it down

00:39:30.900 then we don't see a single case of it for like a long time then there was one viral news story

00:39:37.840 about a trans person and then the phenomenon explodes and this is very similar to anorexia

00:39:43.480 which is another culture-bound illness that disproportionately targets autistic people

00:39:47.300 is associated with body dysmorphia and we have seen things like a viral story happening in hong

00:39:52.400 kong and then it explodes where we don't have any records of it in the united states it exploded

00:39:56.760 after a few viral stories this appears to be a category of culture-bound illness that includes

00:40:02.160 intense susceptibility by autists involves body dysmorphia intense discomfort with who you are

00:40:07.840 it's something that like we even like simone suffered intense autism and almost died for i'm

00:40:11.680 sorry intense anorexia and almost died of it right like she understands what it feels like to have

00:40:16.800 body dysmorphia right oh yeah that doesn't mean that she believes that it isn't a culture-bound

00:40:22.080 illness right Simone yeah I know it's crazy no but I'm saying do you believe that it's a culture-bound

00:40:30.840 illness like do you believe that just because you felt it strongly doesn't mean that it does

00:40:34.480 it must exist in other cultures oh no yeah it's culture-bound I it's not like I was trying to

00:40:41.180 conform to some kind of culture that I don't think it was a cultural contagion thing I think anorexia

00:40:44.940 is actually pretty universal so maybe it's a bad example i'm giving you too autistic of an answer

00:40:48.780 is about control simone this is a well-studied phenomenon anorexia does not exist in any other

00:40:55.580 human culture at any point in human history it has been very widely studied yeah there was no

00:41:00.900 come on there's all the so before it was called anorexia it was like oh she's fasting for religious

00:41:05.680 purposes and there were all these girls like you would have no sorry when anorexia starts being

00:41:11.780 first described in the literature people with it look shocking to people okay it is noted as

00:41:19.720 nothing like anything any of these doctors have seen it did not look like fasting for religious

00:41:25.820 purposes it did not look like being a quirky girl when you were skeletal Simone you wouldn't have

00:41:32.420 been described in the Victorian times as quirky people would have described you as skeletal

00:41:38.220 well yeah i'm just saying i think i actually think this is really good because you have 0.98

00:41:45.720 experienced basically exactly what modern trans people experience and you show why it's so hard

00:41:51.700 for them to accept that it really was just their culture and if they had been unaware of the concept 0.58

00:41:58.560 of gender transition if you had been unaware of the concept of anorexia you would not have

00:42:04.640 expressed your autism in that way maybe yeah no no for sure like behaviors are typically learned

00:42:12.800 and you can't really learn a behavior if you've never seen it before you can learn a behavior by

00:42:19.380 the way you haven't seen before same-sex attraction for example same-sex attraction exists across

00:42:23.600 cultures that is very different from anorexia and this conversation is so fascinating because

00:42:32.840 You're seeing in Simone's eyes, in the way she's relating with this, she apparently was unaware that anorexia is the poster child of culture-bound illnesses.

00:42:44.180 And it's very hard for her to accept that this body dysmorphia that she felt was downstream of her own culture.

00:42:52.820 So people are aware with how this works in anorexia.

00:42:55.680 Basically, anorexia, like a big news story is what happened in an area.

00:42:59.380 And then you get tons of cases of anorexia.

00:43:01.240 Well, and the same happens with unscheduled life ending.

00:43:04.960 Right.

00:43:05.420 But this is different because when it happens with anorexia, there will not have been a

00:43:10.320 single medically documented case of this for like 300 years.

00:43:14.620 And then you get 50 cases in a year.

00:43:16.780 The other most famous culture-bound illness is multiple personality disorder, which does

00:43:22.040 not appear to be real.

00:43:23.120 You see a movie about it or a story about it, and then a bunch of people start expressing

00:43:28.180 it.

00:43:28.380 but we don't we don't have really robust but i think so just sorry not like just in my defense

00:43:34.980 i think cutting is a good example of something similar to anorexia where it's like a shirt like

00:43:39.360 these things are new you know but like you had people religiously self-harming well before

00:43:46.300 cutting became a trend that emerged in high schools and someone in the victoria era would

00:43:51.540 find to be yeah but cutting i am aware of a lot of self-harm rituals historically yeah it's not

00:43:58.660 analogous because we are aware of self-harm rituals historically we are not aware of something like

00:44:05.300 anorexia historically we are aware of fasting but fasting in the way it happens with anorexia

00:44:11.540 and i think you're being so perplexed by this shows how trans people must feel right when the

00:44:18.840 evidence is so against something that felt very intuitive to you. It felt like an intuitive way

00:44:25.880 to act when it was, was in your cultural landscape. And this appears to be one of the effects

00:44:31.840 of autism. No, no, come on. There, there were spoonies in the Regency era. There were spoonies

00:44:38.800 in there, but there were not anorexic. Yes, there were. No, I mean, okay. Simone, we have to like,

00:44:45.340 definitely there were no there were definitely women especially women though i mean sometimes

00:44:49.880 men too have been recreationally and by their own choice choosing to restrict their calories

00:44:57.740 or burn more for example cc um the the empress known as cc was 100 definitely anorexic and

00:45:08.080 famously would eat just like broth and worked out in a weird-ass gym that everyone thought was insane 1.00

00:45:13.880 and maintained very small size she was one cc emperor cc like she was an austrian empress 0.90

00:45:21.920 she was very famous she's definitely existed before the modern concept of anorexia she was

00:45:27.180 100 anorexic and and even more because i think that you actually i think you're i know i know

00:45:35.100 that you're wrong and i mean i also get your point though that like social contagion is a real thing

00:45:39.340 and it's also very hard to see it when it's happening and you want to believe that what

00:45:43.180 you're doing let's pull this up because you don't you're acting like a trans person right now you

00:45:48.780 are scared about being proven wrong because you are doing what trans people do i'm so happy to

00:45:54.860 just lose arguments but i just i know that i'm right take a step back here okay i will explain 0.53

00:46:01.320 how your argument actually shows the mental gymnastics that trans people do okay okay okay

00:46:06.320 i point out that anorexia this becomes absolutely skeletal not general calorie restrictions not

00:46:14.500 being quirky in how you eat not fasting so just in case to give this away no princess cc looked

00:46:23.740 nothing like the phenomenon we call anorexia today this happened after two of her children died

00:46:30.920 she went into a period of intense depression and not depression like we talk about it when we talk

00:46:37.140 about oh there's a lot of comorbidity between anorexia and depression no that's teen girl

00:46:43.260 stuff we're talking about one day her daughter died and then for the next three weeks she didn't

00:46:49.820 eat and then she built a habit of almost never eating after that that that is not like modern

00:46:57.260 anorexia one of them died by unaliving it was later in her life she went into intense fasting

00:47:06.480 because of her children's deaths this is not what anorexia looks like this isn't a teen girl

00:47:12.560 deciding to become super skinny right or obsess over calorie restriction this is a mom who lost

00:47:21.620 two of her kids in quick succession going through some sort of like a psychological break to even

00:47:29.980 compare the two is kind of horrifying in the same way as we'll go over the trans stuff a lot of the

00:47:37.060 people who trans people will be like oh that's a trans community and it's like well actually this 0.95

00:47:41.940 is the community that has their genitals cut off so they look like girls so they can be sold for 0.86

00:47:46.820 sex work that's not like it's kind of horrifying that you would call that a trans community in the 0.99

00:47:53.260 same way that it is horrifying that simone would correlate this woman's experiences with hers

00:48:02.260 anorexia becoming horrifyingly skeletal and freakish looking to outsiders was not a phenomenon

00:48:10.620 that was recorded in history and you hear calorie restriction in the same way that when I say

00:48:17.280 gender dysphoria is not a phenomenon that was recorded in history and trans people here 0.94

00:48:22.220 identifying as a different gender their brain intentionally twists what they're hearing into 0.97

00:48:29.160 something else so they don't have to face the reality that they succumb to a cultural trend 0.86

00:48:35.140 but I am going to look this up because okay you might be right Simone

00:48:38.620 So, sorry to... 1.00

00:49:08.600 you this empress sisi do you know how long she lived how long did she well like all her kids 1.00

00:49:16.780 died and she lived way too long she probably should have died young okay so you've already 0.99

00:49:21.480 disproven your points when you just said all her kids died if she had had anorexia that was like 0.81

00:49:26.280 modern anorexia she would not have been able to conceive children in the first place two she

00:49:31.180 lived until she was 60 and did not die from thinness so clearly not like modern anorexia

00:49:37.740 i'm a functional anorexic and i'm probably not going to die from my thinness you would have

00:49:42.240 died at the weight you were when you were a kid your body shut down and you still do not produce

00:49:46.980 eggs naturally because of your thinness you were well worse than anything emperor cc reached in her

00:49:54.320 life and i want to point out that emperor cc was the best random example that somebody was deep

00:50:01.220 historical knowledge like simone was able to think of and simone is a random effing person

00:50:07.880 who hannah had orexia and it's not even a big person for her personality or how she sees herself 1.00

00:50:13.820 she had something so bad that she can never produce eggs again and princess cc regularly

00:50:23.380 had children the idea that you could compare these two and be like oh this is a good example

00:50:28.820 from history borders on the comical and i'd point out as you're seeing here there are many pictures

00:50:34.020 of her from the period she is claimed to be at her skinniest and she does not look like an anorexic

00:50:41.980 at all and this is really important it's really important because what we can see is this

00:50:50.460 desperation to not have been influenced by culture to have some historical precedent to have this be

00:50:58.320 part of the human condition to want to say no somewhere else in history someone else did this

00:51:05.860 and when reality does not conform with this to begin to filter all of the information that's

00:51:11.680 hitting her like obviously simone is a smart intelligent like well-read thoughtful woman

00:51:19.880 and this psychological break of realizing no one ever did this before like the 1950s

00:51:28.260 this psychological break of being like and it's the same with her she's like oh but there were

00:51:33.580 people who practiced calorie restriction in the past therefore there were anorexics in the past

00:51:37.860 no there were people who presented as different genders at specific parts of history therefore

00:51:43.820 there were people with gender dysphoria that mirrored modern transness no and recognizing this

00:51:49.920 is necessary for us to make the right logical choices for society okay three we have lots of

00:51:56.220 paintings of her that i am now looking at and they look nothing like a modern case of anorexia

00:52:01.500 you want to look up look up pictures of her you're vindictive you're so cute there are lots of even

00:52:08.340 photos of her photos so you know they didn't fake i know yeah she doesn't look like uh like a like

00:52:15.620 commit how do i say committed diehard anorexic no but you're actually fascinating here because

00:52:23.260 you have a condition and you went through a condition analogous to transness a culture

00:52:27.700 around illness that desperately tries to seek for validation in history i was not just following a

00:52:33.820 cultural and you basically crashed out trying because you hear something similar in history

00:52:40.120 and then your brain shaves off the edges of how it wasn't actually like what you went through

00:52:46.360 because if you're dealing with an analogous mental disease culture-bound disease it can

00:52:52.480 help you see it from their position better i don't feel like i'm missing their perspective

00:52:58.840 i think you and i've been as empathetic as we can be to the trans cause it's just that

00:53:03.000 I guess, similarly to anorexia, we're like, Hey, this isn't healthy. This doesn't produce good 1.00

00:53:08.200 outcomes. Maybe there are better ways. That's not the point I'm making here. Okay. The wider

00:53:14.080 point I'm making here is this is a phenomenon that started in the 1920s, not popular in the 1950s,

00:53:19.920 and literally is no, in no other culturally nowhere else in human history. Okay. It is not

00:53:25.080 a part of the human condition. It is a cultural phenomenon. All right. And that doesn't mean that

00:53:31.620 they don't feel it as strongly as you felt anorexia or my family members who have had anorexia

00:53:38.580 have felt anorexia okay so to continue here because now i'll go over the various instances

00:53:46.300 but even you can't fully like admit like oh my god this is not something we see in other cultures

00:53:52.560 and follows a very specific pattern within autistic populations and you grab at things

00:53:56.980 that look kind of like it and we'll go on how trans communities so let's start with two-spirit

00:54:01.860 people because you hear this a lot yeah well but also like i never heard about we did so much in

00:54:07.520 terms of native american studies in my californian public schools never heard about two-spirit people

00:54:12.220 so that that's like a new thing well because you know when the term how two-spirit people were

00:54:17.600 invented and i think a lot of people in this community are like genuinely unaware that this

00:54:22.060 is where this concept came from no tell me myra larini a fisher river creek nation counselor

00:54:28.680 in 2021 stated that the phrase came to her in a dream slash vision during the summer

00:54:36.500 1980 yes while she was at a protest in the dream she was in a teepee with her indigenous mother

00:54:46.820 on a hunger strike seven spirits appeared shifting between male and female forms two of them declared

00:54:53.620 her niece manawagi in whatever i can't pronounce that she shared this vision at a conference

00:54:58.840 in a sharing circle of about 80 indigenous lgbt plus people across north america after sharing

00:55:06.100 this it was formally opposed and quickly adopted at the third annual intertribal native first

00:55:12.340 forums gay and lesbian american conference this took place in 1990 we don't have any historical

00:55:19.140 examples of anything like this existing not not in in in like some some people want to say well

00:55:27.240 native american cultures have a huge degree of cultural diversity and it's like despite that

00:55:31.900 huge degree of diversity we don't have anything that looks like any good record of anything that

00:55:38.700 looks like a two-spirit person have i just been gaslit then i could have sworn i've either read

00:55:43.700 articles or listened to podcasts about how like there were two-spirit people and the the two like

00:55:49.820 in at least some tribes and these two-spirit people are kind of seen as like

00:55:54.220 spiritual leaders in the tribe like we do not have okay so someone just

00:56:01.480 Did they just meet?

00:56:02.620 They just made it up.

00:56:03.580 Yeah.

00:56:04.020 I bet that we were extra spiritual here.

00:56:08.340 What we do have evidence of do you have Spanish records of native

00:56:14.420 Americans having same sex relationships, 0.97

00:56:17.220 which they were very aghast at and some native Americans in these same 0.96

00:56:22.380 sex relationships would dress like, 0.97

00:56:24.720 and take on the role of a female in their community. 1.00

00:56:28.100 But that doesn't happen. 1.00

00:56:29.740 That's not trans. 0.99

00:56:31.480 That is, we see this in our society. 1.00

00:56:33.700 We have gays, we have twinks. 1.00

00:56:36.420 Okay, twinks is a well-known phenomenon. 1.00

00:56:38.280 And this is what we'll see throughout this.

00:56:39.700 There's a lot of these examples that people call trans

00:56:42.680 are gay people where one of them takes on

00:56:46.760 a more feminine role within the community 0.53

00:56:49.540 and within the relationship. 1.00

00:56:51.440 And that is something that we also have

00:56:53.560 in Western culture back to the beginning of time.

00:56:57.000 But that is very different

00:56:58.500 than intense discomfort with your gender

00:57:00.740 and a desire to change your gender yeah yeah that does not describe gender dysphoria

00:57:05.100 it may describe gender euphoria and desperately grasping with examples for anorexia would be like

00:57:12.620 yes a lot of people talk about two-spirit it must be i still don't know i didn't even identify as an

00:57:18.560 anorexic at the time the next example we have are the hijra from south asia india pakistan and

00:57:24.480 Bangladesh. These are individuals that for young males who due to poverty have been ejected by 0.99

00:57:32.900 their families, end up joining all male communities that undergo a practice where they are castrated

00:57:43.280 for two things. One is the communities make their money predominantly for two things. One

00:57:48.440 is a religious ceremony that you can only do if you've been castrated. And then two,

00:57:53.460 the bigger source of income is prostitution so basically it's a way for extremely in these 0.97

00:58:00.900 societies who are forced to go into sex work to get more clients by appearing more feminine

00:58:06.080 and then make some money on the side with a specific religious role for individuals like this

00:58:10.800 are not super accepting they are like this is not like a super celebrated role in these indian

00:58:19.560 communities either, by the way. It is actually kind of ghoulish that these people are called

00:58:25.440 trans or, you know, the West specifically pushes on them this concept of trans because they're,

00:58:32.960 they're really child victims often. And on top of that, they identify as a third gender,

00:58:41.600 not men or women they they do not have gender dysphoria so much that they have no interest in

00:58:49.900 other people identifying them with the opposite gender so you cannot claim that this is something

00:58:56.780 analogous to the trans phenomenon okay next the fafaim in the manner of a woman are natal males

00:59:03.760 who naturally exhibit feminine traits or behavior they are not considered women by society they do 0.71

00:59:09.800 not want to be considered women by society, and they are mostly effeminate men who enter same-sex 0.70

00:59:16.520 relationships with men. Again, we would call this twinks in today's society. Nobody would confuse 0.96

00:59:22.060 this with a trans individual. However, where transness has entered these cultures, some of

00:59:28.100 these individuals have decided to adopt Fafaim as a name, and now they say, oh, and this always was

00:59:34.200 trans, but that's not what we see in the historic literature, okay? The Muxay, Zappo culture in

00:59:41.760 Mexico. So they're biological males who adopt the presentation and roles, often women's work. 0.72

00:59:47.880 They have cultural acceptance and family integration, but they are not seen as women.

00:59:52.180 They are seen as a distinct third gender. And they are mostly effeminate men in same-sex 0.57

00:59:59.680 relations with other men we also do not have any good records of this existing pre-spanish

01:00:06.860 colonization some people will say that we like answer like in terms of the actual evidence we

01:00:13.320 don't we do not just because that was when it was first documented like in records that we still

01:00:19.680 have because so many records were like burned and stuff if memory serves when europeans first

01:00:26.040 it could be that this is a modern phenomenon another good example of a modern phenomenon

01:00:32.020 that is put as an older phenomenon are the kathay are the lady boys of thailand and the balaka

01:00:37.240 and this is a group that people most identify as like a really good example of a true third gender

01:00:47.080 oh okay but is this not just another case of of men who are impoverished doing what they can to

01:00:54.740 make money well we'll get into that but but a lot of people in these cultures do gender transition

01:01:00.200 today and do act as prostitutes and identify as trans by the way this also happened in like 0.81

01:01:06.540 middle ages europe if you for example were to look for sex workers you find some women but

01:01:13.040 you would also find a lot of men masquerading as women yes but that is not like an asian thing or

01:01:20.140 like mexican thing it's it's a it's a people want to make money thing need to make money need to not

01:01:27.000 die thing so how how far back did this goes we have one early record potentially of this a chinese

01:01:36.920 explorer zon danong who noted androgynous cross-dressing males kumer but specifically he

01:01:44.180 notes them as a part of the sex industry they were sex workers it was a way to get clients by

01:01:52.940 taking on this effeminate role well i guess it should be noted that that many men male to female

01:01:58.560 trans individuals in like working within modern woke culture who would like sort of identify as

01:02:04.140 like the modern new trendy of of trans are sex workers like that's kind of that that's more of

01:02:10.420 a through line than gender dysphoria for sure so we actually and i'm going deeper on this one

01:02:16.060 because this one is is one where you see people who identify as trans and as members of this 0.51

01:02:19.660 community and it's the only one where you see this the problem is is we don't have any good

01:02:24.700 records of this community existing before the 1900s at least in the regions where they are

01:02:29.700 predominant today they appear to be a a holistically modern phenomenon and if they

01:02:35.700 have any ancient roots it's as a type of sex worker which is very different from and if people 0.56

01:02:41.940 are like well a lot of trans people are forced into sex work don't you know that and it's like 0.87

01:02:46.880 yeah but it's the directionality these are people who are impoverished realize men want to sleep 0.75

01:02:53.560 with things that look like women and will pay to so they change their body to look that way

01:02:58.180 they are not people who change their body to look that way and as such go impoverished right 0.80

01:03:03.600 more because i i want to be exhaustive here we have the golly these are self-castrating male

01:03:11.100 devotees who wore women's clothes makeup and performs ecstatic rituals romans did not these

01:03:17.200 were not treated as a normal part of roman society romans called them half men they were regularly

01:03:20.880 mocked in roman society so first of all and two they were a religious cult and they were seen as

01:03:27.240 a religious cult right this is this is not i think anything close to what we would consider

01:03:33.060 trans today and certainly not close to what we would consider societal acceptance or some

01:03:37.240 alternate role or some evidence of gender dysphoria in history. They look much more like, and so do 0.95

01:03:43.300 many of these other groups, much more like castratos than modern trans individuals. People 0.97

01:03:47.300 are not familiar with castratos. The only reason trans individuals don't claim castratos as trans

01:03:51.900 is because everybody knows castratos weren't trans. Castratos were young boys who were often

01:03:57.160 forced to be castrated so that they could keep a high singing voice through nobles. That is

01:04:01.520 not trans that is a child victim yeah now a final one and i think that this one really shows how 0.64

01:04:10.320 bad faith people are who attempt to bastardize and steal these other cultural traditions

01:04:15.860 to normalize their own struggles right is the sworn virgins this is in the balkans especially

01:04:23.720 in the albanian region and these are biological females who adopt a lifelong virginity and adopt

01:04:29.760 male roles, dress roles, rights, et cetera. The problem is, is that we have no records of anyone

01:04:37.500 ever doing this because they feel they're in the wrong body. Okay. Why do women do this in

01:04:41.840 Balkans tradition? Because women can't own property in the Balkans tradition. And so women 1.00

01:04:46.460 do this so that they can own property or be the heir of the family or escape an arranged marriage 0.92

01:04:53.600 they don't want to do we have plenty of records of that and so let's go into the jewish play

01:05:01.400 the guy's name is kaliumas ben kalamus at no time in history he wrote in 1286 to 1328 in provence

01:05:12.720 france and at no point from then into the year 2000 did anyone think this poem was about something

01:05:20.460 other than a joke okay and it was a joke that had meaning to people the idea how did you say

01:05:26.480 province so that people can understand why this would have been funny to jewish people of the

01:05:32.600 time while also sharing a brief message it's a joke about wanting something absurd and not

01:05:40.620 accepting the way that you're born it's literally an inversion of the concept of transness

01:05:47.460 uh woe to me my mother that you ever bore a son what a great loss and no gain curse be the one 0.93

01:05:55.760 who announced my name to my father it's a boy the messenger shall be had guilty of bloodshed 0.98

01:06:01.080 cursed be he woe to him who has male sons upon them a heavy yoke has been placed of restrictions 0.61

01:06:07.360 and constraints some in private some in public now remember this guy's an orthodox jew so he's 0.97

01:06:12.680 not talking about minor constraints here it can be very difficult to be a jewish man but of course

01:06:17.880 he's writing all of this with the knowledge of like what would have made this funny this line 0.76

01:06:22.880 funny right and explicitly shows that he's telling a joke here is any orthodox jew would be aware 0.61

01:06:30.360 that yes being a male as an orthodox jew means you have a huge number of constraints 0.90

01:06:35.920 in your daily life in how you live in how you interact with the world but obviously women have 0.99

01:06:41.920 even more constraints than you they are a different set of constraints but they are surely greater 0.90

01:06:47.900 than those that you are under and so he's saying this is a joke like i'm not even considering

01:06:53.080 what it would be like to really be a woman i just don't like being me right and yet the first few

01:07:00.740 lines of this and i'm cutting out the stuff that doesn't affirm a trans interpretation of this

01:07:05.260 just to make it even more so you can see how they see it because there's some of this it's just

01:07:09.140 fluff talking about other stuff really sounds like a modern day trans person so a modern trans person

01:07:14.720 reads that and then doesn't get the orthodox jewish context that makes this a joke in the

01:07:20.300 second part um sever statues and awesome commandment 613 our father in heaven if you hear

01:07:27.200 he's talking about all the rules he has to follow if only you turn me from male to female if only

01:07:31.600 the craftsman who created me would have made me a decent woman i may today have been a woman wise

01:07:37.560 and smart spinning with her hands and perhaps i would be skilled enough in spinning and i would

01:07:42.460 say how lucky am i and then the poem ends with an inversion of a jewish blessing basically saying

01:07:48.500 like a satanic curse almost you could think of from the perspective of like blessed are you oh

01:07:54.440 lord for has not made me a woman you can think of this as like if you said like all men but an

01:08:00.280 inversion of this now keep in mind this is an orthodox jew he does not mean to blaspheme god

01:08:06.060 right he is saying that all of these ideas would represent an inversion of the natural order

01:08:13.360 right that's that's what makes the joke funny okay and he and again when he's complaining about

01:08:19.680 being a man his primary complaint about being a man even though at one point he does refer to his

01:08:23.800 genitals as like a defect or a blemish the primary complaint is all the rules that he has to follow

01:08:27.940 and yet women have more rules and not getting to make his money spinning and yet spinning is a

01:08:33.180 harder thing than what he, a rabbi, would have to do, which is education. Now, if we look at what

01:08:38.080 people historically thought of this, we've got Joseph Koster in 1900. He wrote, quote-unquote,

01:08:45.020 a masterpiece of Hebrew satire that passes in review, quote, all of the social positions of

01:08:50.700 which men are proud of and argues that they are a vanity, end quote. He then notes of the entire

01:08:56.820 work that this guy did, and it's a very long work. He said this was one of the most humorous parts.

01:09:03.180 right so this was not like a maybe this was satire maybe it wasn't it was seen as clearly

01:09:10.920 satire until after transness existed as a phenomenon now when we're talking about the

01:09:16.240 roman empire that i was talking about we can go to cassius dio a roman senator and historian who

01:09:22.400 was a near contemporary of agavala he lived through the reign and was politically affected

01:09:26.880 by it he recorded this in roman history book 80 the thing about him wanting to actually change

01:09:33.520 his gender however we've also already gone through all of the other horrible things that this guy did

01:09:39.080 that could have been exaggerations i mean you could just say okay they're exaggerating about

01:09:42.640 him to make him look bad because he killed a bunch of people which he did and he did a lot

01:09:45.800 of blasphemous stuff he tried to change roman religion to a new religion so people really 0.52

01:09:49.380 really really hated him but either you accept that the only real trans individual we have in history 0.71

01:09:55.780 is one of history's greatest monsters or we accept that a guy that tried to change the religion of 0.57

01:10:01.480 rome had a lot of people with the motivation to make stuff up about him to make him look bad

01:10:06.420 and talking about bad emperors within roman tradition as a historian as being effeminate

01:10:11.940 because they would often do this it was like shorthand for and this is how you know he was bad

01:10:15.820 and and and not acting with with good action yeah sort of common like i guess maybe the modern

01:10:22.600 analogy of like well he had an affair with or like molested one of his aides but this is just

01:10:29.620 the roman version of it yeah right there's kind of like a common ring of truth to it i mean there

01:10:35.740 were plenty of emperors who had their you know stable of male lovers oh this guy had this guy

01:10:42.220 had such a stale of male lovers he was well known for he opened the bass to the roman public so that

01:10:48.760 he could walk around the baths and look at people and then he even had specialized servants that

01:10:54.200 would go to the baths like every day or something and look for whichever men were the most well

01:10:58.920 endowed and bring them back to him oh god bless he doesn't just like jillen maxwell yeah that's

01:11:06.880 great he was sort of a debauchery maxer like that was his core thing seemed to be maximized

01:11:13.340 debauchery as streamly as you can if you see our life episode maybe this is a a true

01:11:18.460 convergent example of maybe something like the life of Anna Valens, right? But to continue,

01:11:25.460 when did transness appear if we don't see it at any point in human history or in any other culture? 0.65

01:11:31.040 The first thing that we can see that looks anything like modern transness

01:11:35.720 was Heichfeld's lab in around 1910. So, okay, a bit before the 1920s, where he had 17 detailed

01:11:44.840 cases and this was in Germany and then the Nazis came in and they burned down all this stuff

01:11:50.500 and after this as far as I'm aware there is not a single known case of a trans individual until

01:11:58.200 1952 after the Christine Jorgensen media explosion so the name sounds familiar should I know it

01:12:07.820 yes she was a media phenomenon born George Jorgensen 26 year old American ex-GI underwent

01:12:14.180 male-to-female sex reassignment in Denmark,

01:12:17.960 and when he returned to the U.S., 0.54

01:12:19.620 there was the XGI becomes blonde beauty,

01:12:23.180 sometimes referred to as XGI becomes blonde bombshell

01:12:26.160 that went around in all the tabloids and everything like that.

01:12:29.680 Okay, Christina, was it pulled off?

01:12:32.800 That's the real question.

01:12:34.180 Well, the point is that the news acted like it was both pulled off

01:12:38.020 and something you could aspire to.

01:12:40.960 And then if you look at...

01:12:44.180 uh the guy who is seen was re benjamin the the next guy to build a a lab harry benjamin this 0.94

01:12:52.460 was he he built a lab in the i want to say oh yes his landmark book came out the transsexual

01:12:58.360 phenomenon in 1966 so almost 10 years after the christine jorgensen case and he said to christine

01:13:05.020 jorgensen this is a guy who wrote the book on this who started the first lab not bad yeah it

01:13:11.340 passes pretty well yeah so i can see how that individual made this look glamorous enough to a

01:13:17.960 lot of people who are looking to reinvent themselves who are looking for a sense of control like you

01:13:22.840 i also want to point out that this case really shows that america is not culturally reflexively

01:13:31.600 anti-trans i haven't been able to find a single newspaper article on this case that was negative

01:13:36.640 it's all stuff like nature's error forces girl to live as boy or xgi blonde bombshell beauty

01:13:43.220 people only became anti-trans you take that jk rowling or something like that after interacting

01:13:49.940 with the trans community and the way that they decided to use these particular privileges that

01:13:56.720 were granted to them so this is what the guy who literally started the lab that all of the modern

01:14:03.100 trans movement grew out of well him and joe money they worked alongside each other i'm trying not to

01:14:07.480 treat this negatively but joe money was operating at the same time if you're unfamiliar with his

01:14:11.400 story he took children lied about them being able to change their gender by raising them as another

01:14:18.940 gender forced them to sleep with each other in front of them lied that they now adopted the new 0.55

01:14:24.400 gender that they had gone into one of them unalived themselves he hid that then he started a clinic 0.89

01:14:29.580 that did this to thousands of other children ruining their lives really a genuinely psychopathic 0.54

01:14:35.600 human being like one of history's greatest villains but if we say okay he's not the source

01:14:40.960 of the trans movement this benjamin guy is right well what benjamin said was indeed christine

01:14:46.080 without you probably none of this would have come to happen so what he's saying is in all of his

01:14:52.300 interviews everybody cites her as the reason they decided to transition and then that snowballed

01:14:58.020 to a wider phenomenon. Now this Christine person, did they genuinely have gender dysphoria? They 0.78

01:15:04.600 might've had some super rare something or another, but when you consider, and you look at society

01:15:09.740 today and you're seeing like 1.5% of people identify this way, what we can say is that is

01:15:15.640 not something you see in history. It's a modern phenomenon. And this is very important because

01:15:23.780 if it's a modern phenomenon and this very high unaliving rate this very high ideation rate that

01:15:29.880 you see with this this very high depression rate you see with this are tied to this personal way

01:15:38.300 of dealing with specific i might even say autistic urges let's say it's some version of like 0.56

01:15:43.500 psychological urge that certain peoples get around body dysmorphia it turns out that the correct way

01:15:50.760 to mitigate the harm from this is to tone down exposure to people. That means exposure in the

01:15:59.500 school systems. That means exposure through speakers. I know it's sad, but the harm, and

01:16:06.960 as Simone 100% believed, I am not influenced by culture when I'm doing severe calorie restriction.

01:16:14.020 This is a totally me thing. It's not because I saw somebody else do it. When you have whatever

01:16:19.520 this condition is, and I think that it is the same condition, when you have whatever this condition

01:16:24.580 is, you are particularly resistant towards accepting this fact. And this is why I tried to

01:16:33.660 bring all this evidence together in this episode, along with somebody who suffered an analogous

01:16:38.280 condition, so that people who are suffering this can maybe just get enough evidence all at once

01:16:47.220 that they can break through and finally get to the other side and be like oh my god this is really

01:16:52.260 not part of the natural human condition and as strong as it feels to me it's not real and it is

01:16:59.520 a it is hurting me to engage with it in this way and anybody who's heard me or seen my history or

01:17:08.300 goes through my history of comments they know i am not approaching it like this because i am bigoted

01:17:13.540 against trans people, right? Like I don't, I'm not like angry at trans people over anything. I

01:17:17.980 have no reason to like dislike trans people at a personal level. I have had trans friends. I was in

01:17:23.700 the GSA as a kid, right? I fought for when, when I had a significantly smaller platform, but I fought

01:17:29.940 for trans people being accepted in society before I knew how people were going to end up using this

01:17:36.760 as a weapon to hurt women. Okay. Second. And when I say as a weapon to hurt women, if you're 0.99

01:17:42.640 unfamiliar with how this is happening just broadly lay this out for you you know in school if you 0.96

01:17:46.840 grew up before this happened how there was that kid who was a complete sex pest and like liked i

01:17:51.520 remember at my school there was a kid who was famous for being caught masturbating outside the 0.96

01:17:55.640 women's dorms while eating fried chicken just like a beast kid by the way too just like 0.99

01:18:02.620 lovingly sex pest who doesn't respect other people's boundaries do you not think that if 0.99

01:18:08.040 you told him hey if you say you identify as a woman you won't be punished in the same way 0.99

01:18:13.140 that he wouldn't take advantage of that yeah i mean it's a no-brainer of course he's crazy not 0.96

01:18:19.040 to yeah you're giving these sorts of sex pests this tool okay and it is unfortunate that the

01:18:26.600 people who get caught up in this like autistic version of it that simone had are dragged down 0.75

01:18:31.980 because of this or that they can't well it'd probably be better if they didn't have their 0.94

01:18:36.060 their toy anyway because it still seems to hurt them as well it seems to not be the best way

01:18:40.560 it seems to be telling somebody with anorexia to identify as an anorexic

01:18:45.780 and obviously that's not a good thing to do that's going to make the pro-ana movement it's

01:18:51.080 like we normalize pro-ana people don't know that's the movement that is trying to normalize

01:18:55.440 and glamorize anorexia and like we shouldn't be shamed for this and we should you know be who we

01:18:59.660 are and it would be fine like and obviously i'm the type of person if you could take a pill and

01:19:04.220 just become a woman whatever right if it didn't have all these negative effects i wouldn't care

01:19:09.240 i'm not out here because like from a christian perspective i don't think they should be doing 0.70

01:19:13.200 this i'm not out here because some trans person tried to ruin my life or cancel me or something

01:19:18.660 like this i'm not out here because i was personally harassed by a trans person or something you care

01:19:23.420 about human flourishing and when you see that there's something that just clearly is nerfing 0.65

01:19:28.200 people at best and at worst destroying and ending their lives in horrible ways you want to speak up

01:19:35.480 about it yeah i'm i'm out here because the preponderance of evidence that we have access to

01:19:41.260 now unfortunately does not make it look as if and like we have evidence at the level of an entire

01:19:49.900 country now banning puberty blockers at the level of the uk that's that's like the the the quality

01:19:57.460 of a study at that level is enormous like that can't be fake that can't be edged we just know

01:20:03.580 that people are not unaliving themselves because they're not able to get access to this and now

01:20:07.680 that we know that we have to say okay we need to start rethinking all of this and that's

01:20:14.920 unfortunate and people can be like yeah i just i hope that dev comes to the light on this because

01:20:21.600 in the past i really respected him as an intellectual and i know that right now he's

01:20:25.580 sort of going through a hard time with his followers because he's been kind of ideologically

01:20:28.800 captured by a certain friend group is is my guess that he's not able to see that like new evidence

01:20:36.060 is out there now right like when in the episode he said something like and we know that this is

01:20:42.660 the best solution to lower like unaliving rates for people who have this and it's like actually

01:20:50.040 That's been broadly disproven at this point, both from the country level source, us finding

01:20:55.960 out that mainstream trans clinics were hiding information at the Travis.Kyle case and the

01:21:00.620 WPaths file release and the studies that have been used to argue this being very poorly

01:21:08.440 conducted and by hugely ideologically captured institutions.

01:21:11.660 We actually went through an episode.

01:21:13.820 We have one episode where we go through all these studies and the ones that people are

01:21:16.540 always citing they were done by a clinic that made its primary source of income by helping 0.91

01:21:22.660 people gender transition like come on dev you're not stupid you must be able to see that a country

01:21:30.140 level data set at the level of the uk is a better source of data than a clinic that makes its income 0.83

01:21:38.360 off of this and is dependent on it continuing to happen and like joe money would have to admit that

01:21:43.700 they were monsters and hurt a ton of children because they couldn't admit this earlier and i

01:21:50.580 think that we argued that's why he didn't but anyway thoughts simone i think this is it's

01:21:57.160 interesting and it's important and i don't know i mean my general take is in the past

01:22:04.500 people were able to express various forms of what people can now refer to as gender like either the

01:22:15.980 way they want to bang other people or get themselves off or dress or style themselves

01:22:22.740 or relate to other people like they just dealt with it and they didn't force other people to

01:22:27.200 conform with it and this new version whatever it is is is most uniquely different to me

01:22:33.060 and that it does and i agree that pretending that this thing has been around forever is

01:22:41.180 inaccurate at best and i i also had no idea the extent to which we've been gaslit about it

01:22:48.380 like that there are people right like yeah because that was just i don't know i

01:22:53.120 i i've become a lot more incredulous but i still figured like i don't know that kind of

01:22:59.300 makes sense i guess well there's a lot of american native american tribes out there presumably at

01:23:06.220 least one had a dedicated third gender role that was more similar to transness than similar to 0.97

01:23:14.880 being a gay twink yeah it just seems so screwed up that people would make that up it it yeah anyway 0.93

01:23:20.560 so this this has been enlightening and i appreciate your looking into it what was what's cooler or 1.00

01:23:25.280 you know more whatever you want to think of but more pathetic is the secondary thing they decided

01:23:31.380 to add to this made-up role which is and they were treated as spiritual guides for their communities 0.91

01:23:37.340 right yes and they were in some way like spiritually mystically and morally superior

01:23:41.700 yeah yeah like you see the narcissism on display there right you know um and then they invent

01:23:51.320 importance to it they can't just say oh it was an alternate role in the society right um and keep 0.78

01:23:57.300 in mind for most of these other societies that we have access to when they were trans they like when

01:24:03.460 they fed this it wasn't trans in almost no society do you have trans of all the ones who

01:24:07.200 normally it's a third gender and normally it's a discriminated third gender so it's it's just

01:24:14.820 you need to break this for the people who are trying to be and i want to believe that dev

01:24:21.140 is genuinely trying to be intellectually honest

01:24:24.660 in the way he's approaching this

01:24:25.840 and that he does want what's best for people

01:24:28.280 and that if he just had access to all of the information,

01:24:32.040 he would change his mind

01:24:33.620 because I think most sane people would. 0.99

01:24:36.520 I even think most sane trans people would. 0.99

01:24:40.200 Yeah, I think so. 0.83

01:24:42.160 I mean, maybe, I don't know.

01:24:43.340 Again, like even per your argument,

01:24:47.360 the correct response I should be making is

01:24:50.620 oh like my excessive exercising and calorie restriction was in response to a social trend

01:25:00.640 that i was surrounded by whereas i feel like i had a very different experience but like

01:25:04.680 i so i should be i should be saying that whereas i don't i don't feel that way so

01:25:09.320 this is such a good case for this i know i know so i'm maybe people in the comments can explain

01:25:15.380 this to me but this is what's very important about this phenomenon yeah yeah if it happens to you

01:25:22.540 and you're not one of these just sex pests who's using it for cover it doesn't feel like you caught

01:25:28.780 a social phenomenon it feels like a decision you made for yourself and an obsession i didn't

01:25:36.680 actively choose to do it i kept doing it because it made me feel a little better but i mean yeah

01:25:41.460 presumably that's a tool for control but i feel like what's what happened with trans stuff in

01:25:47.640 schools especially with young women who are transitioning was this did happen with friend

01:25:53.140 clusters i didn't have friends who did this so right and that might be a completely separate

01:25:59.020 phenomenon my my guess trans community is predominantly four groups one group has this

01:26:05.820 form of dysphoria that you had they do not need a lot of priming to begin to exhibit

01:26:11.120 transness they yeah no that that one makes sense we're like you feel dysphoria you hate your body

01:26:16.260 and then someone mentions like oh maybe you have this you can take this pill and make it all stop 0.89

01:26:22.160 and that is very appealing and that would be the version of trans that i fell into

01:26:25.760 would have fallen into then there's the other groups that are like well all your friends are

01:26:29.780 doing it and so in the similar way that like cutting spread or that that that i i'd flesh

01:26:35.520 out this secondary category a bit more than just all your friends are doing it um you're going

01:26:39.280 through puberty you feel uncomfortable with your body you're going through a lot of changes you

01:26:42.920 don't like and somebody says there is an out and and there's a culture that will affirm you and

01:26:50.400 tell you that you know your your body is good that you are good that you should be accepted and they

01:26:55.240 will never criticize you as long as you go along with them and this can be very appealing and you

01:26:59.960 even hear some people like zizian the head the guy who founded the trans murder cult zizian said that

01:27:05.920 he went through gender transition because he was afraid of going through puberty. 0.91

01:27:09.300 They were Zizians. 1.00

01:27:10.480 He was Ziz. 1.00

01:27:11.940 Ziz, whatever.

01:27:12.840 He was afraid of going through puberty.

01:27:14.180 So I think that this is like a cluster of ideas here.

01:27:16.360 It's a bit of a cultural contagion and a bit of a good, like, mimetic virus.

01:27:19.480 And for these people, they are partially aware that, you know, it was in part influenced

01:27:25.760 by a friend group, right?

01:27:26.920 Now, they are less true trans. 0.89

01:27:28.500 And I would put the version of trans that's more like anorexia. 1.00

01:27:31.840 It's probably the truest form of trans there is. 0.94

01:27:34.380 disagree because no no i think that's very different because that's um that's not a desire

01:27:42.560 to be the different gender that's feeling in general like a general body dysmorphia and then

01:27:48.600 falling into a common solution that's presented to people who show body dysmorphia like you know

01:27:57.660 because now there's this preponderance of people who are like oh you're trans whereas before it

01:28:02.320 would always be something else like oh you just need to power through it or like i don't know

01:28:07.840 talk to god more you know like people used to give other solutions so i don't actually see them as

01:28:11.940 trans i think there's a different group of people that falls into the culture and and believes in

01:28:17.840 it for that reason maybe also they're goaded on by it the other two groups in the trans community

01:28:23.900 other than the ones who have something analogous to anorexia then there's the ones who have

01:28:28.520 something that is, you know, the, the, the, you'll have a community that will accept you.

01:28:33.160 You're going through puberty. You're uncomfortable with your body. And, and here's how you both get

01:28:36.860 social acceptance and are comfortable with your body. It's one simple trick. And then the next

01:28:41.580 group, cause I'm going to say there's four core groups here. These are the groups, this group,

01:28:46.020 I would just call the sex pests. These are the people who realize that they can use this to 0.94

01:28:50.660 gain access to women's faces. And when people are like, no trans person does this. And then I ask

01:28:55.340 you okay i let's say no real trans person does this do you think a cis person a cis male would

01:29:04.140 have such low morals and such a voracious sexual appetite that they would do it of course they're

01:29:08.800 like well of course some cis males would do and like well those cis males are now using the trans 0.91

01:29:12.900 identity right you can say oh cis males are terrible but they're using your identity to do

01:29:17.420 this the the guy jacking off outside the girl's dorm or the guy you know this seems to very clearly

01:29:23.980 be the case of it was leah thomas was the swimmer right who kept flashing cable in the restroom

01:29:28.380 and then there was a bunch of weird porn stuff with her when that was all leaked by the way you're 1.00

01:29:33.980 not familiar with this leah thomas had a secret instagram account where they would frequently

01:29:39.200 like posts and images that were explicitly tied to agp related content eg content that suggested

01:29:47.080 that trans people are only trans people because they were turned on by acting like women and it

01:29:54.780 makes it very clear that leah thomas was agp this was a sexual fetish for them and this is not some 0.80

01:30:01.420 outsider accusing them of this this is them saying yeah that's why i'm doing this that's what turns

01:30:07.420 me on like when i advocated for trans rights back in the day i assumed i was not just advocating for

01:30:13.920 the rights of flashers who wanted to violate women's autonomy violate women's consent and so

01:30:19.620 when i saw somebody very clearly doing this and the trans community not being like oh that person

01:30:25.560 isn't us that person doesn't stand for us but instead doubling down no that is what we're

01:30:30.620 fighting for i was like oh i've been used i was a patsy and i think that there's a point where

01:30:37.620 somebody like dev needs to be like am i being used to protect flashers who want to violate

01:30:42.880 women's autonomy and then there was the and no this was before she went through her surgery right 0.55

01:31:03.640 like this she just appears to have been a sex pest and and and these are the people who in 0.99

01:31:08.100 prison are like ah i'm trans now because they get access to the women's prison and then they 0.98

01:31:12.720 rape a bunch of women and this has happened multiple times you know and and everybody must 0.52

01:31:17.280 realize that this is like an actual like the most problematic group and then the final group which 0.96

01:31:22.080 is like okay almost as problematic as that group is these are predominantly men but sometimes also

01:31:29.200 women who seem to get aroused by convincing other people to transition it's a power fetish for them

01:31:37.880 we've seen this in the trans maxing community is very clearly partially about this we've seen this 0.82

01:31:42.680 in the giggling goon files we've seen this in some other parts of the trans community and i loop them

01:31:47.280 in with the other people i guess it's a separate category of this the the afabs or whatever who

01:31:51.660 have some sort of fetish tied to this but it's not about converting other people and then this 0.88

01:31:56.680 that's this other part it's this very aggressive and predatory part of the community that that is

01:32:01.500 specifically about i and keep in mind people are like why would somebody want this well if you look

01:32:06.220 at their own writings talking about it because there have been they're like dude like if i can

01:32:10.800 convince a young boy to get on puberty blockers, I get like a prepubescent child for like the next

01:32:16.780 10 years. You know, like these people are truly debauched, but this is what they say in their

01:32:21.580 private message boards, right? And I mean, it makes sense, right? Like they found a way to make

01:32:27.320 PDA fileness legal. And keep in mind that individuals like this, you know, have,

01:32:37.040 well we won't we won't get into the harvey milk situation but there's too many cans of worms here

01:32:43.860 yeah all right any thoughts on short fat otaku dev leaflet the debate anything

01:32:49.360 leaflet can do nothing wrong in my view i she just she comes at everything from both

01:32:55.040 a place of intelligence but also humility i i yeah it would be shocking to me that

01:33:01.520 no that's what the ai review of her debate kept saying it was like throughout the debate it is

01:33:05.760 noted that she appeared very kind and understanding and wanting to like understand their perspective

01:33:11.320 and that i'm so respectful yeah even when she like goes over other streams she like waits for the

01:33:17.320 the the person's sentence to stop before commenting she's just so kind was that leaflet

01:33:24.300 was overly conciliatory and didn't want to interrupt the person so they kept ranting at

01:33:29.300 various points oh yeah that yeah that that would that's a very leaflet yeah because she's she has

01:33:36.000 courtesy oh my gosh no one knows how to do i don't know how to do that anymore i interrupt you all

01:33:40.700 the time i'm terribly rude i'm really sorry about that anyway i love you love you too and yeah

01:33:46.600 do you want though have we no yeah we did it once we did oh god never again never again

01:33:54.580 a lot of the people i want i sure you're surprised by the people who are like

01:33:59.140 like ai is not gonna work like it's literally erasing so many jobs right now yeah like what

01:34:05.720 do you think is happening right now i think some people were like oh the unit economics don't work

01:34:10.980 out like that the energy is not gonna work well you know we're gonna blow up the data centers

01:34:17.380 like all these things there are answers for these things i don't yeah automated drone swarms

01:34:24.340 costs less than you and your entire army that wants to blow up automated drone swarms if people

01:34:32.260 literally one hotel night in your average united states hotel costs less than you if we're talking 0.56

01:34:38.380 about the rate of a hit per by like a mexican it's like 250 dollars to unless the price has 0.83

01:34:44.760 gone up to kill someone you want to hire someone in mexico to do it but maybe those are the in

01:34:50.900 mexico rates not the in united states rates i haven't you know i haven't checked recently

01:34:57.400 gotta get back on that market other people being like well you know with this kind of wealth

01:35:05.460 divide like there just won't be anyone left to buy anything but then i think a lot of people

01:35:09.780 don't realize that already now half of consumer spending is being made by the top 10 percent of

01:35:17.300 earners like yeah we're already we're already mostly there there's a reason why disneyland

01:35:23.840 is becoming insanely expensive it's because they've given up on normal people and they're

01:35:30.360 just charging a ton of money to the really wealthy people who are still spending tons of money

01:35:35.120 it's uh it's happened it has happened

01:35:38.480 so you know

01:35:42.800 what you're gonna do what you're gonna do

01:35:48.480 get a parcel of land

01:35:52.880 get food stores get used to rice and beans at least rice and beans is so freaking good i think

01:36:01.720 you don't like rice and beans i love rice and beans yeah i was i was i i just am so shocked

01:36:07.560 by the people who are like, AI can't do human work. And I'm like, I literally have already

01:36:11.140 fired multiple teams because AI has replaced them. Well, I mean, to, to be fair, there are

01:36:17.460 some things where, you know, we're still hiring specialists to deal with plumbing problems and.

01:36:25.360 Oh yeah. Yeah. There are some things in regards to people who are like, well, AI can't do

01:36:29.440 human motor control work really well, like walking around and stuff like that, that,

01:36:33.480 that is true and the main reason is that i talk about this in the comments it's because we're

01:36:38.440 approaching it wrong if you know but also like are you aware of what's going on with optimus

01:36:43.740 like entire tesla factories have been repurposed to building these these humanoid robots that

01:36:49.900 actually are pretty dexterous it's just that they're not on the right but more broadly the

01:36:54.160 problem that we have here and the problem that ai experts have here is i have explained in other

01:36:58.840 videos that the human brain, particularly the cerebral cortex, appears to operate like a

01:37:04.340 collection of token predictors. And there's a lot of research on this. You can watch our episodes

01:37:08.380 where we go over all that research. But what's really important to note is if the AIs we are

01:37:13.220 using today arrived in an architectural convergence with our cerebral cortex, which it appears they

01:37:20.460 had, they are naturally going to be bad at fine movement. Because that is not handled by our

01:37:28.620 cerebral cortex. That is handled by our cerebellum, which is one, a completely separate organ

01:37:34.680 practically, and two, architecturally entirely different. So what we're likely going to want to

01:37:42.000 do for AI movement-related stuff is either hard-coded direct pathways that ideas are sent

01:37:50.560 from the cerebral cortex-like collection of token predictors to these and then carried out

01:37:54.660 automatically which will likely be drawing from the works of companies like boston dynamics and

01:37:59.600 stuff like that yeah well i mean also just keep in mind like just like tex here for example like

01:38:06.520 his motor control even our kids you know like there any parent who's gone through the process

01:38:10.640 of teaching a kid or helping a kid develop fine motor control like pull the pen or you know type

01:38:17.020 on a keyboard or draw will understand that even for someone who has all the parts built in really

01:38:23.020 well, it takes a long time to figure that out. Yeah. Another thing is, I think people really

01:38:28.800 miss the ball on this. They're dismissing open AI as just a text model or a text prediction model,

01:38:36.060 which shows a fundamental misunderstanding of like how larger AI systems work. So if you're

01:38:42.440 talking about agents, you know, these are things that can do emails, do phone calls, do coding,

01:38:48.540 everything like that. Like all of the advanced stuff, generate images when they want to generate

01:38:52.980 video when they want to the core of their thought is always a text-based model the the text-based

01:39:02.260 ai models are always the core brain of an ai because they are the least expensive way to send

01:39:10.080 large amounts of information into the future of the ai basically and so this idea of oh that's

01:39:14.600 just a text like what whatever it's just a text model it's like what are you talking about like

01:39:20.680 it's it's like you you see a company trying to get in the the cutting edge of of cars and think

01:39:27.400 that cars are going to change the way that transportation works and you go they just make

01:39:30.920 engines what did it's just a simple engine like all of the fancy stuff in your ferrari

01:39:37.600 is downstream from the engine right everything an agent does is downstream from that simple text

01:39:45.600 model but anyway this is a fun into this episode that's gonna attract some normal right-wing bait

01:39:52.420 right all right i'll get started on this yeah because tomorrow's leaflet oh people don't know

01:40:01.360 i will be on leaflet's show tomorrow but you're gonna run a different episode this morning

01:40:05.700 tomorrow yeah i'm gonna put this into the different episode are you gonna oh okay

01:40:10.780 yeah i'm going to be on leaflet show tomorrow at you mean today yay today at 7 p.m i think

01:40:19.880 we're going to start so you're going to get me at a completely different different time zone

01:40:24.480 which will be fun we'll see how that goes but i'm i'm looking for it'll be my first time doing like

01:40:29.820 live streaming was like a of somebody's fan base interacting and i don't know how i feel about that

01:40:37.400 i'm a little worried you did it a little bit when you had that debate with that guy yeah but i didn't

01:40:44.780 have time to be reading the stream i do it when we go on ed ed dutton's show he does it but like

01:40:50.200 i don't care what ed dutton's audience they they're just too different from our audience in

01:40:54.200 my mind like ah so you're nervous about this one because you actually respect her audience

01:40:59.500 and that's the yeah like ed dutton's comment section was full of people trying to determine

01:41:03.960 if you were a jew or not by your nose shape right like i'm like her audience isn't going to be

01:41:09.280 that sophomoric yeah i don't think so no i imagine they're pretty cool

01:41:15.780 so they're not that i don't like it done i i like him i like it's content we love him

01:41:21.740 it's just it's attract um a certain like like he's he's he's less we're we're pretty big on

01:41:29.600 our show about being like if you're just like a generic racist we don't want you here no like

01:41:34.340 the jew comments are very much like our our kids for example like their go-to is poop jokes 0.98

01:41:41.500 titan's a poopy head toastie's a poopy head they use our alexa smart devices to say poop poop poop 0.95

01:41:47.400 poop it's all poop jokes and it's very reductive and it's just their go-to and it's like they're 0.91

01:41:52.260 inside this is i'm joking language yeah and i feel like jew comments online are like that is 0.92

01:41:56.960 like the adult version of poop jokes where they're just like jews jews jews jew jew no you're wrong

01:42:03.560 really there are people who make jokes like that and for a while jokes like that have become common 0.96

01:42:07.920 but now there's this genuine community online that's just like my personality is i hate jews

01:42:13.460 and i'm a generic racist right like some people are poly some people and if you and if you

01:42:19.220 constantly signal on your show yeah this is not for that audience so like he does really high

01:42:26.420 quality content he just doesn't also regularly be like oh and if you just hate on jews i think 0.98

01:42:31.680 you're stupid right like obviously jews have problems which we've talked about in detail 0.98

01:42:36.880 but there's a difference between saying that and just being like like complete crash out mode you 1.00

01:42:43.400 know yeah which i think is hard for people because for example i think one of our top performing

01:42:48.400 videos is like the jewish iq myth one and of course the people who freaking hate jews were

01:42:56.220 like, oh, this is gold. And then they were like, so betrayed. And then we lost all those subscribers.

01:43:01.620 And then they were like, oh, they don't hate Israel. What's wrong with them? So, you know,

01:43:08.320 you can't win. Well, I mean, I think you can win. I think this is actually something I was talking

01:43:12.700 to you about today, but like we hold really weird religious beliefs that I think if they came out

01:43:17.600 later or we came to them later in our streaming career, it would have been very disqualifying of

01:43:22.580 us in conservative intellectual spaces yeah but we led with them and we've been very consistent

01:43:29.140 and logical about them in a way that i don't think people find them particularly off-putting

01:43:33.340 in the same way that because it's very interesting that that like in our episode recently about dev

01:43:39.800 slash short fat otaku versus what's her name oh shuan head shuan head shuan head that the right

01:43:49.340 loves shoe on head and has mostly turned against short fat otaku and short fat otaku has moved

01:43:55.740 or stayed on the left in areas that seem odd to us but the shoe on it is fundamentally much more

01:44:03.020 of a leftist than he is and yet she's forgiven for and he's not i think it's because she started

01:44:07.740 with these the positions that she has that are discordant and she focuses on them from a logical

01:44:13.760 perspective yeah i think you're right anyway love you to testimony the comments on today

01:44:21.520 of the shoe on head video were fun yeah i'm glad that that a lot of people like shoe on head

01:44:28.000 it seems like a lot of people really like what they call 90s era democrats yeah well i mean

01:44:34.360 that's that's the white house now what like elon rfk trump jd vance who do you think these people

01:44:40.720 are right like this is our party now okay yeah yeah i don't know as i pointed out the the purity

01:44:47.720 the the faction on the right that's like oh we need to focus on like purity culture we need to

01:44:53.320 focus on extracting everything we need to focus on all acting the same way i i point this out i'll

01:44:57.520 keep pointing out they ideologically have much closer with the leftist aligned islamists than

01:45:03.680 they have with any faction that holds power on the right and they don't really have a place in 0.75

01:45:10.500 the modern right and do have a place in the modern left and they found it yeah right like

01:45:14.900 they regularly sit down and talk with Islamists right like they they have a side and a place that 0.50

01:45:20.540 already accepts them there's like not even a reason even from an and and people like well 0.82

01:45:25.620 you couldn't get their votes and it's like unlikely right like they're not a very they

01:45:29.440 they put out insane demands that like would hurt us prevent our party from winning but the left

01:45:36.020 doesn't have any cost to meeting the demands right because the left actually have to follow

01:45:41.940 through with the things it says or promises yeah nor do they need to be coherent or cross achievable

01:45:49.860 well yeah because you can just keep blaming when you have an external locus of control

01:45:57.420 themed party you could always blame someone else for things not working out and never take

01:46:03.500 personal responsibility and what's so interesting about the Trump administration right now is

01:46:10.340 taking personal responsibility for very controversial things very unpopular things

01:46:15.640 and not blaming other people not being like well so-and-so made me do it or think you know this is

01:46:22.540 you know it's just like no I'm gonna do this I'm sorry it's a little bit tough it's gonna be a

01:46:27.440 little bit tough for a little bit longer this is gonna be worth it in the long run even if you

01:46:31.260 don't think so i don't care because i think this is the best and it's a very different kind of

01:46:36.260 he's playing his music

01:46:38.700 wow tex

01:46:42.220 yeah tex's tunes

01:46:52.700 to master

01:46:54.420 look at the phone look at the camera

Based Camp - April 14, 2026

The Year Trans Was Invented (Gender Dysphoria Absent From the Historic Record)

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