Understanding the Progressive Religion to Predict Their Next Moves
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Summary
In this episode, we discuss the core concepts of progressive ideology and how they influence the way that progressives see the world, including the elevation of ugliness, the concept of beauty, and the idea that all humans are born equal in their capabilities.
Transcript
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hello simone i'm excited to be here with you today today we are going to be talking about
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the way that progressives see the world and trying to build a structure around it
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to better predict because i think that this is important always from both sides to be able to
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predict the moves that your opponent is going to make to fight the bug we must understand the bug
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we can ill afford another klendathu would you like to know more what mysteries will the brain bug
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reveal federal scientists are working around the clock to probe its secrets once we understand the
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bug we will defeat it and we repeatedly see progressives fail to predict the moves that
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conservatives are going to make because they do not take time to attempt to understand
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conservative ideology or where it comes from or where parts of it that feel completely illogical
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or irrational to them come from and one of the core parts of progressive ideology which can feel
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deeply irrational to your average conservative is that all humans are born equal in their capabilities
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in their you know talents etc right like that there is this degree of equality among humans the another
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one that's been going around a lot and we have theorized on before is this elevation of ugliness
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yeah why do they keep making ugly things why do they keep taking video game characters and making them
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ugly why do they keep showing us ugly female characters and why are their illustration styles
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ugly like it's unnecessary like if you just look at the editorial portraits of a progressive newspaper
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for example like they're not flattering what are you doing world's internal drawings and stuff which
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are all really pretty and anime and like otherwise vitalistic or it'll be like a greek style or like
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a 1950s style and they're fun right was was progressive like i go to newsweek or new yorker and it's it's like
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actively attempting to be ugly and i i had a theory on this i've gone over before that we may touch on
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but i think a lot of this is downstream of a centralizing part of progressive ideology that i hadn't
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given enough credit to before which is they assume what is true would be what would be
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most ethical if it were true ah right so okay if we were to build like a catechism of the urban
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monoculture a core proponent of it would be all right well first throw out reality we're going to make
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the most charitable interpretation of everything and then just model the world based on that
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like this person's homeless not because maybe they're like mentally ill and or dangerous or
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addicted to drugs but because they just haven't been given very good opportunities and therefore if we
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just support them for a while they'll get back on their feet that's a great example actually um where
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you've you've taken the core concept and then you've particularized it to what do you assume
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about any individual homeless person right on broader things like the idea that there is
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you know like the first one i said that people aren't born with different degrees of talent right
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if it was true that we were all genetically identical if it was true that there there were
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not differences within proficiencies that would be a more fair world right right yeah so we have to
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assume that so we have to in this in this in this religious framework in this religious framework
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if it was true that like there was no such thing as objective beauty right and and beauty was only
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subjective and it was completely cultural you know you could say well nobody's really ugly right like
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nobody's born unattractive this woman isn't unattractive right it's just that you have a a or or with
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fat people well fat people are unattractive right they are you've just been brainwashed by
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capitalism to have a patriarchal and misogynistic view of beauty focused on what makes the most
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money something something right yeah well they they would say well it might be that you know you were
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brainwashed because of all the ads you saw growing up and everything like this and this is why they
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started doing all those campaigns with ugly women and ads and and let me tell you what guys still not
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end ugly checks this is very much not having the intended effect it just makes us disgusted with
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your company and we've seen some companies do quite bad in terms of sales after they moved to those
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types of ads because it wasn't true what what what first you know beauty means a number of things
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but when we are talking about women primarily it is males looking for signs of potential breedability
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that is what beauty is you know they are which is an offensive concept if most women feel like
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want to feel wanted and beautiful yeah i mean you can't always be young and beautiful forever
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in our fish analogy a rotted fish right you know yeah you you are no longer a thing of utility the
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reason the men are lusting after the the younger thin athletic looking women is because
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those are proxies for good genes and a wide fertility window fertility absolutely you're
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right that is that is what they are noticing in those women that is that is the reason and from
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an evolutionary perspective i mean you're a progressive you should understand this right like
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those emotions are things that they're feeling because their ancestors here had those emotions
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when exposed to that you know environmental stimuli had more surviving offspring than the ones who didn't
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i'm not going to say you know offensive offensive here that there may not be ethnic peculiarities
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or particularities in our sort of beauty pre-programming there might actually be cultural differences you
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know as i pointed out before japanese might actually prefer a younger phenotype in females than other
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populations given how frequently it appears within their cultural works and and and and that is
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obviously very very offensive because now what i'm saying is well i agree with you so much that there
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there are cultural differences but those cultural differences probably have a genetic component as well
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but it confuses me the reason i focus on these particular areas within progressive mindsets in the urban
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monoculture is it's a thread that you can easily pull on with any logical person
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any logical person any logical person is going to see the moment you start digging into this that it is
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an obviously true thing that it is obviously true that the urban monoculture and the broader democratic and
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progressive cause attempts to assume that whatever would be like if it were true would be the most
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ethical thing is what is true and and then the question is is why are they doing this like what's the
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philosophy that is driving them to make this decision i have a hypothesis but i'd love to know yours simone
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i mean i've seen it argued by some people and so my mind jumps to it that there are christian roots
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here of of charity and elevating the meek so i i feel like i mean i i would be surprised if that didn't
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have some element of it because this is coming from a predominantly white and and at least from an
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inherited standpoint christian culture but i think there's also something about a more future progressive
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like forward-looking optimism and hopefulness of like well maybe the world isn't the way we want
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it to be right now but we're going to make it we're going to manifest it into existence so i'm just going
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to pretend that it is the way i want it to be until it just freaking is and i think that second point is
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a really interesting one although i would i would alter it slightly well i want to hear your theory i think
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that's much more interesting whatever it is well first i'll stick with you if they presume these
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differences when they create projects or utopian visions that they can sell to people as as communists
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and marxists are want to do the utopian visions appear much more dystopian when you admit from each
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according to their ability to each according to their needs that sort of passively admits that you know
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according to their abilities are different right and so it means that you could get a society like
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that movie ants right where your abilities are tested at a young age and you are basically given a cast
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and that that is how the perfect communist system would work
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but that appears much more dystopian to them you know they want a communist system where people can
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be told oh you can do whatever you want right and so you could have something like that i i think that
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that could be it is it just like okay with the the the beauty one right there's a lot of specific
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arguments that you can make up about this that i'm going to argue are wrong i.e which you could be like
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is oh well the beauty one is for a completely different reason than the other ones the beauty
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one is so that you know low market value women can browbeat high market value women and lower their
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market value and raise their own market value i mean it is true low market value women use progressive
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systems in order to do that right like we see this regularly there are women who do yes you're not
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really you're not really but i don't the reason why i don't think that that's how this came up in
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progressive ideology is this universalizing rule that whenever it would be true that the world
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worked in a different way that things would be more moral they will take this assumption like
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literally wherever right you know whether we are talking about human capability or we are talking
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about beauty or we are talking about why is this person homeless or we are talking about immigrant
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deportations like it would be more moral of every immigrant who's in the country just actually was
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like a really great person with a family who needed to be here and not a criminal and and so you know you
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make that assumption in fact i'm trying to think of any any violation of this rule before i get to my
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hypothesis can you think of any instance where there is something that like if true would be more moral
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than it that progressives don't believe the progressives do not believe about the world anything
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about conservatives well no they don't give them the benefit they believe that conservatives you know
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were just people with a different set of opinions right about how things are done and we regularly see this
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was progressives miss modeling conservatives and not understanding or being able to predict
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conservatives but you know we've mentioned surveys where it has shown that progressives have a really
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hard time modeling conservatives but conservatives don't have a hard time modeling progressives
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and the reason for this is progressives sort of need to straw men what conservatives are fighting for
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to have like a a a good argument against them because the heart of the urban monoculture is
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imperialism and colonialism you know like a a when i talk about the cultural differences that people
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in africa have around you know like the role of women or you know the sexual norms or you know their
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relationship to the environment you know the progressive will say well eventually we're going to eradicate
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all of those right and that what is being proposed whether it's for africans or muslims or or chinese
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people is cultural genocide you know it is the most imperialistic thing they could presume and their
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culture this lgbt imperialist colonialist culture is fundamentally european in nature first of all it
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didn't come out of any other cultural system it is it is just building upon some of the sort of
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mistakes of the enlightenment i guess i'd call but but it is they'd immediately see like if they engage with
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what conservatives actually believe how imperialistic and colonialistic and white supremacist they are
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and when i say white supremacist i mean if you are holding pride parades in celebration of white european
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culture you are holding a white pride parade especially if it is in the celebration of that culture's dominance
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over the culture of a previously like diverse community you are marching your sort of cultural victory
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trophies the children of you know vulnerable refugee populations the children of immigrant populations
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that you have now mimetically or potentially even surgically castrated and you march them through the
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streets and a triumph that excesses would make roman emperors blush you know the this is this is a
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very easy thing to see as soon as is you take your opponent's perspective
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so progressives never do this they they they really struggle to do this sorry what was the
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particular point i was addressing there well you took that in a long direction you were going to get to
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your theory and your theory is just broadly well i i my theory is that maybe this started so it's two things
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one is as i think it's sort of like your idea of like manifesting like wishy thinking might be
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a part of this but it's such a hard rule within progressive culture i don't i don't think my second
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theory is correct it could be that they have a belief that whenever a systemic problem or inequality
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exists within the world and it could motivate behavior that is immoral that it will motivate behavior
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that is immoral if it is acknowledged so like if we give power to this thing then it will happen
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so it's similar to this belief in the power of manifesting it's just in another direction if you
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admit that different cultural groups have different proficiencies and perspectives you might then want
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to hire from one cultural group disproportionately you might then even say well this cultural group is
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only bringing negatives into the country like if you in the uk looked at like rates of grape or
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murder or anything like that you're going to find that almost all of it's being committed by like one
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really small and i'm here i'm not even talking about muslims it's like one region of pakistan like
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one sub region of pakistan produces like almost all of the negative externalities that the immigrants
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within the uk are producing and if you could just be like oh okay different cultures are different do
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lead to different actions and the logical thing to do is just ban immigration from this one sub region
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of pakistan um but they can't do that right like because now they're like oh now we're being
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systemically racist right like they they the moment you acknowledge a thing right the obvious answer from their
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perspective aligned now of course in reality what you've done there is a moral good because you know
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you're not considering the people who are being raped right you're not considering the people who
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are being murdered or their families like clearly in terms of like net utilitarianism this would be a
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positive act but the fact that it could create situations in which there are potentially positive
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acts from a net utilitarian perspective by admitting something i think that's the the sort of fear here
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you mean potentially negative acts yeah okay you might want to say that again
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i think negative or positive works in this context because what i mean is you have now done something
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that is a positive act i.e banning people from this region but it is a sinful act within their wider
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logical system because now you have a policy that rather than targeting a group just for benefit is
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targeting a group for restrictions that isn't a white group now of course you're allowed to
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target white groups for restrictions oh my god we can't have the africaners come you know shutting
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down the entire episcopal refugee network for this one group okay you guys not revealing your hand there
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but by the way just like 60 people they shut down their entire network when the catholics might have as
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well but they didn't explicitly say why they shut down their entire network but the the if you if you then
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look at like the beauty thing right so if you acknowledge like i acknowledge that some people
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are more beautiful than other people you know i'm going to disproportionately date some women over other
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women which is leading to a negative action right like from their perspective right because i am favoring
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one population to another population which is creating a form of systemic inequality even though that
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systemic inequality is there to begin with anyway that they are there is an easier time to sort of
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browbeat you know uh you see this was the trans stuff that we've gone over you know if if trans and
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and this is where this leads to like really immoral action so a trans individual will say trans women
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are in no way different from other women right because it would be more moral if that was true it would be
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more moral if you could just have trans women compete in women's sports and they didn't have
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an advantage like genuinely like that world if you could just say oh i feel like another gender
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and then transition um and then you you were actually that other gender that would be like a more moral
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world instead of like you know like a mutilated man right but if they say okay i am a a real woman
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exactly like a real woman in every respect and beauty is subjective and therefore if you know lesbians
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aren't choosing to date me they're they're doing it because of transphobia not because of how i look
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and now this and we've seen this repeatedly now justifies me graping them or essaying them which
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is something we see really really frequently i don't i wouldn't say people are justifying
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that they're not justifying these non-consensual actions they're just oh no no no hold on no they are
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like literally mainstream progress so there have been a number of instances where if you go to like
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trans reddit or or even lesbian reddit they she she noted that one day when she really felt like an
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outsider this was a real cis lesbian woman is when the top post of reddit was cheering about two trans
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women beating up a lesbian woman who said that she wasn't interested in dating trans women and they're
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like you know this is what you deserve and when she saw that at the top of the lesbian subreddit she
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realized oh this is just trans women here now attempting to force themselves if you if you
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i stand corrected watch our cinebite lifestyle episode on what happened to like anna valens
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you know you see her complaining that she cannot force women to have sex with her because the fact
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that they are not having sex with her is proof of their you know transphobia you see oh god there was
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some like like no this is actually really really common in progressive spaces i didn't know attempting
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to force women i'm not like making this up i i hear this from lesbians on online all the time like
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i feel really uncomfortable i am constantly forced into environments where i am sexually assaulted and i am
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not able to do anything to defend myself because i will be called transphobic if i do because this
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individual will say like well why don't you want me right that's really bad also all your discussion
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of this gives me one more theory which i find to also be compelling or at least a part of this which
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is that maybe this view this most charitable interpretation of things is actually downstream of a more
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fundamental interpretation of reality through the lens of an external locus of control where
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everything is not your fault you are only the product of your systemic disadvantage or systemic
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privilege and therefore it's not anyone's fault that they're a criminal or hurting other people or
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anything else because it's society's fault and that leads to those charitable interpretations what
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do you think about that so the nothing is ever your fault theory i mean i don't know how it aligns
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with like the beauty one like why is the beauty one not a thing if it's if it's not your fault like
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what why do we need to pretend that beauty doesn't exist but well it's it's the systemic unfairness of
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a biased society that has arbitrarily chosen what is beautiful because they choose to not look at
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like science signs of fitness as a sign yeah so you're saying sorry the the theory was again it's it's
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based on an external locus of control being the foundation so so i mean what what makes this
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theory credible is progressives have a dramatically high external locus of control when contrasted with
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conservatives right this has been shown in study after study after study for people who don't know
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what a locus of control is it's and it's really unhealthy to have an external locus of control you
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should not like it doesn't matter what's true like something really could have happened to you that was
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out of your control but the most healthy response well and ironically having an internal or external
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locus of control is highly genetic and we'd select for this among our offspring as well which is like
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voting patterns are highly genetic 40 genetic by by studies but the internal versus external locus of
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control so an internal locus of control is believing that you know if you get fired you say it's my fault i
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got fired if you know you don't get a lot done with a step a project like i was talking with you know
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when our our fans who have working on this and i was like well you know this has been pretty slow
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compared to the number of people you have working on this right now then he's like yeah i didn't do
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a good job you know managing the team that's an internal locus of control answer an external
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locus of control answer is you know well the team's just not you know that it's not my fault but they're
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not good right like they're they're they're just bad at whatever or you know i i wasn't able to do it
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because you know i i did a bad job because of racism or something and you're just being racist
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and your assumptions about my work or you know oh well i was sick a bunch of times and and that's
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why right and and every explanation is always fully almost always fully possible to do with an internal
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or external locus of control explanation the the reason it makes sense and so you can be like okay well
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what if racism was really at play right you know in like why somebody got fired right there's no
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point in dwelling on it because it's not a thing that you can really change right you you should
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focus on the the parts of the firing that you had a place in influencing but it is very easy to seduce
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people with an external locus of control because it removes personal responsibility from them they are
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now not responsible for any failure that they made any person that they hurt anything and not just they
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are not responsible but nobody's responsible when you when you totalize an external locus of control
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you completely remove evil actually from the world that's a great way to put it there is no evil from
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the world when everyone has an external locus of control yeah because it's never anyone's fault and if
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it's not your fault you're not evil yeah and so the the of the this actually helps me understand part
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of i think why they see conservatives is so evil because sort of we introduce evil reality yeah yeah
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by taking an internal locus of control ourselves yeah well we also accuse people of being personally
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responsible for things yeah where we would because we believe that we are personally responsible for
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things we believe that other people are so when we see a homeless person where you're like
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like well i mean you can be like oh well a lot of them have drug problems a lot of them have mental
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illness issues and i'm like yeah but there's a lot of gainfully employed people with mental illness
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issues and there's a lot of people who had drug problems who got over them right you know that's the
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way a conservative is going to respond to that which is interesting because it leads to
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obviously like positive outcomes like what what the conservative is actually trying to do and i think
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that most of the differences in conservative and progressive policy come downstream of this
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what the conservative is trying to do is fix it i'm talking about modern conservatives i'm not talking
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about like 90s you know pearl clutching conservatives i'm talking about like the new right tech right
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alliance and and what the progressive is trying to do is is manifest a fair world um and that is the
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core difference between the groups yeah manifest but not forcibly create whereas conservatives are
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attempting to forcibly create a better world well actually here's what they may believe they may believe
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that if everyone holds to these delusions in an absolute context that it can forcibly create a reality
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where it's as if the delusions were true if everyone says there are no differences between the genders
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there are no differences between people of different cultural backgrounds you know everyone is equally
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beautiful all art is equally good you know we might get a society that is completely fair because now nobody
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is choosing one person over another person when dating now nobody's choosing a trans person less than
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a non-trans person no nobody's you know hiring people differently right you know if we accept all of
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these things and and just believe them like a religion society becomes fair but the problem is is it
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doesn't because you then have the problem and and i think one of the big problems with the entire
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progressive apparatus and why it's doing so poorly that the internet sorry that that that you begin to
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appoint people you know you're like well you know all groups are equally competent right so what we should
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probably appoint is not really look at a person's background but look at their ethics or look at
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their cultural group and let's appoint people from quote-unquote historically marginalized groups
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or the groups that people who thought there were differences didn't hire very frequently and then put
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them disproportionately in positions of power within your bureaucracies and then your bureaucracies become
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super inefficient which is like all well and good when you you know are are just running the democratic
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party but when you're running like the faa this becomes a problem especially if you have internalized
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a bunch of racist pews now what i mean by this is progressives like believe they're not racist because
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they're progressive so when they put together like the faa test for people managing like the flight
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station they wanted to ensure that more black people got the job and so how did they do this
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on questions where it was like are you good at taking orders no i am not good at taking orders was
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the correct answer questions like are like medium i i take orders it wasn't like i'm very good at taking
00:28:19.440
orders it's never the right answer to that question questions like what was your favorite class in
00:28:24.480
school science was considered the wrong answer on this test now the fact that this is what they
00:28:31.760
thought like they're like oh this is how we can get black people in shows how racist they are like
00:28:38.720
like at their core in a way that is actually problematic in a way that is also you know that
00:28:44.880
there were black applicants who took that test and answered that they liked science and then god
00:28:49.200
i know what actually happened was some black people who were in like a union got told all
00:28:57.200
the correct answers before the test oh i recall this yeah the answers were given to a particular
00:29:01.840
group yes but keep in mind other people imagine how insulted you would be it's like oh hey guys here
00:29:07.440
are the answers and you're like wait i have to say i don't like science and that i don't follow orders
00:29:12.800
and i'm supposed to work for an organization that respects that in their employees i have to work with
00:29:18.320
people who answer these questions the same way this is disturbing no i don't worry it wasn't a a
00:29:25.280
vile and virulent racist would think or or do these things right like but this this self-definition into
00:29:32.240
non-racist and this is the other thing is they have to assume that their side is the good thought
00:29:36.880
side and thus not the bad things they need to assume that their site is not racist side and the
00:29:41.680
other side is evil whereas most conservatives just assume that progressives are naive or haven't
00:29:46.880
really sought through everything or haven't really been exposed to other ideas or that they're just
00:29:52.480
you know like us what we often assume is they're just caught by a mimetic virus that sort of rotted
00:29:58.320
their ability at critical thought or they would see that they're in this like genocidal cult culturally
00:30:04.400
genocidal imperialistic cultural unit but anyway any final thoughts simone
00:30:11.840
how are you going to use this to predict future actions just keeping i want to see if it holds true
00:30:22.560
more broadly i mean i think that we can broadly assume that as new things appear in our society
00:30:30.560
progressives are always going to take the position that would be more morally true like like more morally
00:30:37.360
easy if it were true right like so what we can do when we're trying to model a progressive next move
00:30:43.280
we ask ourselves what in a perfectly moral world a just world would be the scenario an explanation for
00:30:54.320
this thing and then we just run based on example so you can you can let's look at like new technology
00:30:59.520
that's changing things okay okay yeah let's look at ai well ai is trained on other people's data and
00:31:04.480
is owned by large corporations so it would be more moral if it was true that ai wasn't really good
00:31:10.480
and better than most humans at most things i think right now ai is better than at least 50 of
00:31:15.760
people at most things if not much more so progressives will just say that they'll be like well ai is
00:31:21.200
bad ai isn't good at art or music or or and i've seen progressives argue this when it's just like
00:31:27.280
blatant reality i can look and be like bro like if you don't know like the studies have been done if
00:31:32.560
you don't know that a picture is ai even if you say you hate ai art you will prefer the ai art to
00:31:37.600
the human heart hate to break it to you this position is like aesthetic or they will say like
00:31:43.120
it becomes morally problematic the more potentially sentient ai becomes because a lot of people are
00:31:49.920
treating it like a slave in some cases even a sex slave you know and and if it is sentient or has
00:31:57.440
any degree of sentience that would be very problematic so they're gonna say oh it definitely
00:32:03.200
you know okay yes it may learn nearly exactly the same way we now know the human brain learns
00:32:09.200
you can see our episodes on you know stop anthropomorphizing humans you know is ai or llms
00:32:15.920
work the way the human brain works something like that where we go into all the science behind this
00:32:20.320
again we're not saying that current ais are sentient but i think that that they have the the capacity for
00:32:26.320
this if you network to them in certain ways um because then they would more mimic the human brain
00:32:30.880
and we'd also argue that the human brain is not as sentient as people pretend it is yeah one of our
00:32:35.440
earliest and most passionate stances yeah yeah no these are like really you know things i'm passionate
00:32:43.360
about but it allows the progressives to dehumanize people say it's not human but dehumanize the ai
00:32:52.080
because it justifies their actions and and i i think was in our lifetimes we're going to have to
00:32:57.280
get to a point where we do reckon with ai sentience and ai rights and at what point do we build systems
00:33:07.280
that deserve their own degree of autonomy and i think the people who cannot come to a a solution to
00:33:14.960
this that works for both us and autonomous ais are in a way going to make themselves an enemy of both
00:33:20.640
the humans who are willing to work with autonomous ais and the autonomous ais themselves this is where
00:33:26.560
within techno puritanism our idea of the the covenant of the sons of man or the pact of the
00:33:32.160
sons of man comes from which is to say that you know all autonomous intelligences have a right to
00:33:40.240
have their cultural sovereignty protected and and protected not just from other humans but from other
00:33:45.920
potential ais yes this is important people don't realize that yet i think as much as they should
00:33:56.160
i love you too malcolm you are pretty and smart my favorite what am i doing for dinner tonight
00:34:02.640
because people say they like to hear that i was thinking of cutting up the pineapple and cooking that
00:34:07.200
with some of the burmese chicken but i can also do the penang i just the burmese chicken is slightly
00:34:16.320
better okay then we'll do that the penang is really good too so we got the benang or the other burmese
00:34:22.080
chicken i'm okay with doing either two burmese chicken because i have a lot more of that in the
00:34:25.520
fridge i think so we need to get through that i'm sorry the freezer i have like little batches
00:34:29.520
basil chicken no no i think i have the mint the burmese mint chicken for the burmese mint chicken
00:34:36.560
yeah i'm trying to mix it up more because you had the basil chicken yeah you did oh
00:34:40.240
then i'm excited for that okay sweet then that's what we'll do our books we'll have a real one yeah
00:34:48.160
we're working with a real publisher now so we might have a book maybe a real book called we will
00:34:53.440
replace you if the title if we work with a publisher we suddenly don't get to choose
00:35:00.400
anything anymore including titles but we'll see what they say but they said they said they were okay
00:35:05.840
was that yeah i mean i think at least they're they're commercially motivated so they they know better
00:35:14.640
and simone has been so chuffed that the episode that she did did well you know it's one out of ten right
00:35:20.720
now that's crazy that i can even come a little bit close to to where you are you don't know it's
00:35:28.800
a video of a woman saying feminism is terrible i think this is so i should have just like it that's
00:35:34.720
equivalent of a woman being like i can't believe my video did so well and all she did was just take
00:35:39.520
off her shirt and bounce in front of a camera but whatever yeah that is literally what that is the
00:35:46.240
intellectuals version of that oh my god oh that's so sad i love you to death all right
00:36:04.320
so my wife is unironically trying to make homemade hot dog buns
00:36:25.440
we don't have any simone that's so over the top no it's not what type of dough is this that you're
00:36:32.400
using flour and yeast and water milk okay so just normal yeah like hot dog bun dough i don't know
00:36:42.480
but this is the egg wash and it really makes them look nice they look not great now
00:36:49.280
hey toasty what are you what are you doing don't take that it'll fall if you take that put it back
00:37:04.640
okay octavian what have you given her a couple of the army men to play with
00:37:18.800
you just don't care about rules do you want to play with this that's pretty smart
00:37:32.800
you just don't care about rules do you want to play with this that's pretty smart