00:27:56.260i believe that trans women should always be able to speak first due to their oppression
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00:28:05.080was in our society you're just going to kick it off yeah you just drop right yep yep and you
00:28:11.240walk out we'll let the fuse now it's just waking it you just got to wait for it to snake its way
00:28:16.500oh my gosh and then if somebody else says well hold on malcolm but as a white man you know you
00:28:29.960can't understand what it feels like to be black and to see a trans woman speak before me and then
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00:28:36.280i say whoa you are right we need to create a table with a hierarchy of oppressed categories
00:28:46.940if the entire point of something like a point of privilege system is to ensure that a more
00:28:52.880oppressed person is more centered then all of you who have had an internal experience of oppression
00:29:00.120shouldn't you be able to sort this out and of course i will recuse myself because
00:29:07.600i have no role in this conversation yeah no your your white man voice
00:29:13.060just throw them to the wolves it's like when the emperor would like throw money at crowds to watch
00:29:22.560them fight over it well of course someone in this room is the most depressed well someone has to ask
00:29:29.700So, like, was this a matter of people going to the local printing store next door to this convention center and buying their own colored cardstock?
00:29:39.880Or was this a troll handing out additional pieces of colored cardstock and saying...
00:29:46.240Oh, no! I know these people in their heads so easily.
00:29:49.980They see some trans woman up there speaking or some woman up there speaking, and they think that they should be in the most oppressed group in the room,
00:29:58.840and they are just moldering especially because like imagine you're one of the quebecis and you
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00:30:05.460know well at the last conference you had cards that you could use right so why
00:30:11.720i don't care them quebecs quebecers they're not people come on they're not going to be here in a
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00:30:19.140few years anyway they have a terrible birth rate i think one of the lower fertility rates in france
00:30:23.920um in canada whatever they never should have been allowed in this country in the first place
00:30:31.280you will never give the french a chance you're never gonna give the french a chance i know it
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00:30:38.340is it is my culture doesn't matter if they're in canada it doesn't matter if they're in france
00:30:43.740it doesn't matter if they're in some african country you're like no you're out cheese eating
00:30:49.740surrender monkeys we love cheese how dare you i do like cheese but i don't like cheese i i i
00:30:58.280we've talked about this in another episode but like genuinely i only like didn't like the french
00:31:02.700performatively at first because if you're from texas you know like culturally you're supposed
00:31:06.160to pretend you hate the french it's just one of those things that like everybody proved it
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00:31:10.120pretends performatively they hate the french in texas it's like a texas thing but like hilariously
00:31:15.840i have since been to france on a number of occasions and they are easily i mean without
00:31:21.820any close competition the most unpleasant people on earth parisians specifically i've heard that
00:31:29.500there are pleasant french people outside of paris but um and i will note i may like make fun of new
00:31:35.600york and stuff like this and like new york is falling apart but like people in american major
00:31:40.740cities like new york and san francisco are predominantly pretty decent they may not be
00:31:45.820our reputation is just for being very loud and very friendly and yeah that that is that is like
00:31:51.960known is that we're like hi and we just talk with people all the time and like you don't see that in
00:31:57.060france especially not paris you don't see that in germany for sure you see it more in germany than
00:32:02.860in in in any other european country that i've seen no people are people are fairly they're more
00:32:07.840friendly in in the uk than they are in germany more friendly in germany disagree well our comments
00:32:17.620can argue about this i i didn't see it as a big difference i mean i definitely think it's debatable
00:32:21.700uk versus germany you can't be like oh nice weather today if you're like checking out at
00:32:26.580groceries in germany they look at you like you've committed a war crime don't even don't even the
00:32:35.260difference is that i guess you don't have the chance to in the uk because it's just some
00:32:38.660beleaguered immigrant running one of those like auto checkout lines you know you won't find someone
00:32:44.640running the cash register anyway so well i mean it actually comes down to something that we've
00:32:49.460talked about in other episodes where i think one of the worst social tactics that you can
00:32:54.860allow to be normalized is people attempting to raise their social status by shutting down other
00:33:02.020people's excitedness or excitement about an idea or i don't i don't think that's what's going on
00:33:08.000in germany it's just like this is inefficient this is not the place for it it's really not
00:33:13.140about it is it is what's going down in paris right like oh sure yeah or like when you try to speak
00:33:20.040french in in france and they just kind of are insulted that you've butchered their language
00:33:24.500it's very different than when you try to speak japanese in japan and they just literally can't
00:33:29.300understand you because white people don't speak japanese they're like what they're so funny
00:33:36.760because simone speaks some very fluent japanese in terms of accent and everything because she grew
00:33:41.740up there partially and said when we had the japanese news crew here and she answered the
00:33:45.560phone in japanese and they they freaked out they were like i'm calling for simone can you put her
00:33:51.500on the phone they yeah they actually did acknowledge that i it's different when they're
00:33:56.520abroad if you speak Japanese to someone who's Japanese and they're outside the country they're
00:34:02.020like wow whereas if you're in the country they're like I'm sorry I don't speak English
00:34:08.640it's great whereas yeah you're definitely insulting the French by even trying which is
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00:34:15.780great I mean that's I think that's why it's extra great that you just butcher their words
00:34:19.220because you're just feeding into the stereotype this it's a it's a it takes two to tango right
00:34:24.700you know, they need men like you to demonstrate that Americans shouldn't be allowed to speak
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00:34:29.140French at all, you know? Right, right, right. But I mean, actually, interesting point, by the way,
00:34:35.040if you're talking about a culture that has never fully integrated, like we talk about, well, if you
00:34:40.060integrate into American or Canadian culture, then you're American or Canadian. The French never
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00:34:44.040really have. Quebec is still culturally very different from the rest of Canada, linguistically
00:34:48.880different from the rest of Canada. And the regions of the United States that were French settled
00:34:54.180like louisiana are still culturally quite different from the other parts of the united
00:34:59.280states and i really only think that it is tolerable in the united states because it's
00:35:04.460such a small population yeah like if louisiana was a significantly larger population in the
00:35:09.880united states i'd be like yeah we need to we need to have a conversation people really speak
00:35:14.520french in louisiana anymore i don't think there's no but they they're different culturally
00:35:17.820they have nothing more different culturally than in other places i would doubt i doubt that
00:35:25.700yes they are absolutely okay i haven't been so i couldn't say they they are like and especially
00:35:35.040along the metrics that people like you and i find distasteful they are by far the most mystical
00:35:42.700subpopulation in the united states um like mysticism is an important part of like everyday
00:35:48.580happenings for many native louisianas and i find that very distasteful that doesn't have a place
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00:35:56.080in america it's funny that one person saw how like materialist and anti-mystical we were and
00:36:02.440they thought that that was like in alignment with the urban monoculture whereas to me the urban
00:36:06.460monoculture is incredibly mystical and and because like to us it's like far to the left of us on
00:36:12.980those things and then these people are even further left than that where they're just like
00:36:17.060full-on woo and crystals and but you know their own brand of it but anyway to continue here
00:36:22.000we have a collective responsibility to make sure that all of our party activities are safe
00:36:29.600said smith these words seem to be set set the tone of the conference as one of a war between
00:36:36.380oppressed groups each wanting to claim that they've been wrong or discriminated against in
00:36:41.020some way it encouraged delegates to view others suspiciously as strangers who might be covert
00:36:47.040bigots who could cause them harm it certainly worked okay what did he say how do we trigger
00:36:53.760this in people we have a collective responsibility to make sure that all of our party activities are
00:36:58.780safe that's a good one to throw out there and then all signal also this yellow card which is
00:37:06.260available at all of the microphones smith said on day one this is a way for a delegate to signal
00:37:11.920the chair that they have a gender identity other than man and this allows you to exercise priority
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00:37:18.120in the speaking order we will come to you they should have just done it so that people didn't
00:37:22.640misgender them that they would just lose use they them pronouns or something oh no but that happened
00:37:26.940like there is this scene where one of the people holds up a card a non-binary person okay holds up
00:37:33.080the card claims a point of privilege misgenders the person they're claiming the point of privilege
00:37:38.000to the the madam speaker and then the madam speaker has to explain to them that they were
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00:37:43.300just misgendered and explain that this was all agreed upon before the proceedings started and
00:37:48.740it only covers gender anyway less than two hours into the day party members could be seen on camera
00:37:56.760adding additional color cards in neon blue and pink the microphone stands the up to the stand
00:38:06.560so they basically made a chill card and put them up at the stand this apparently caused confusion
00:38:12.780among delegates who begin to use the cards to identify as members of other equity seeking groups
00:38:17.220based on race or disability for instance on day two smith told the audience i want to be clear
00:38:24.560that at your convention the equity card applies to gender equity i really love this though this
00:38:32.180because this again i hate the there's no such thing as equality because it's always equality
00:38:37.220based on something that is subjective either you know equality of of need of merit of wants it of
00:38:47.840of deserves it of has had the most trauma of is of this privileged class is the most popular
00:38:55.400like there's no such thing as equal and this shows that like well I want my equality and I want my
00:39:01.220equality and it turns out that no because equality means privilege and when people talk about equity
00:39:07.260what they're talking about is I want a bigger slice of the pie and I know that if I use this
00:39:12.040word, somehow I'm going to get it. I just, oh, this is a great illustration of it though.
00:39:17.280Equity is the opposite of equality. Okay. An equitable world is a world that is definitionally
00:39:25.340unequal in terms of effort to resources. All right. It's a world that says, if anything
00:39:36.120impedes your effort to resources journey or even potentially could we have to rig the system in
00:39:43.160your favor anybody who says they want equity is saying they want fascism they are saying they
00:39:53.820want to strip you of your rights and you shouldn't for a second be confused about what that word
00:39:59.160really means i i think there's a funny meme of this or something where it's like what equity
00:40:07.360means and it's you know the three different people trying to look over the fence at a baseball game
00:40:11.540and the the reality is it's the the tallest person has their legs chopped off so they're the same
00:40:17.100height as the shortest person the next person has their legs cut off that much they're the same
00:40:21.200height as the shortest person and this is true everybody has to go down to the height of the
00:40:25.280shortest person because you you you cannot like if you are raising one person that has to come at
00:40:31.900the expense of other people who are producing more and that only comes from lopping down other people
00:40:39.720right but what i love here is he goes this is the decision that you collectively made those delegates
00:40:46.080from ontario might remember that at the ontario convention we use the cards more broadly for
00:40:51.160members of all equity seeking groups i'd encourage you to consider that as we move along towards the
00:40:56.780future that we all deserve basically saying he's referencing the ontario one here but basically
00:41:02.580being like look we voted on this is only going to be about gender at this convention so on the last
00:41:08.620day of the convention shane has happened on the last day of the convention a white day guy comes
00:41:12.580up of course this white guy and says hey what if we make this multiple cards thing official and
00:41:19.580every time somebody uses their card, they have to explain how that disadvantage or point of
00:41:26.120privilege is relevant to the talking point that they are about to make. Come on, this was a troll.
00:41:32.460This was a troll. How is he not a troll? That is where I'm just like, and it got voted on. So,
00:41:37.660you know, hopefully it'll be in there next year because it would have made things so much worse
00:41:41.940because they're all going to want to say it before they have to say anything. They're all
00:41:47.340going to want to say it but now they have to explain why it's relevant i'm not i'm not going
00:41:56.440to keep reading here because i think we covered all the important points was a really big one
00:42:01.580being that that the other big trick in this is to get them to create hierarchies as soon as you can
00:42:07.600do that you've won right because then when they realize they're not well yeah as soon as is one
00:42:11.780group yeah yeah and this is really true of particularly the most self-interested groups
00:42:18.540so where the hierarchies are really busting of the coalition is trans people a hundred percent
00:42:26.480believe they should be at the top always black people a hundred percent believe they should be
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00:42:31.720at the top always and is black people who are actively participating in this which i want to
00:42:37.500argue you know there there are lots of black people who do not buy into this yeah yeah and
00:42:42.140there are also i would say fewer but there are 100 trans people who do not buy into this political
00:42:47.240ideology who are just living their lives and then finally islamists they 100 think that they're
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00:42:54.300actually at the top they think all of progressivism is really about promoting muslim values
00:42:58.920yeah would you would you say that there are subsets like there's the palestinian supporting
00:43:04.720islamists and then there's just islamists because i feel like there's one set that
00:43:09.780doesn't understand what palestine is about at all and then there's another one that
00:43:14.700like understands the larger goal of islam and is actually like believes is an adherent of the
00:43:24.560religion and then there's other people who just like literally don't understand and just
00:43:28.940listen to Hamas propaganda points and are not themselves Islamic.
00:43:33.520So the branch of Islamists that likes these people is in the Palestine faction 100%.
00:43:41.020There are many Muslims who are not of this category that you talk about, right?
00:43:46.760In America, they generally vote conservative.
00:45:00.760They understand that the Muslims who support Palestine are terrorists who want to kill the sane Muslims as much as they want to kill the rest of us, right?
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00:45:11.320And if you don't have any sane Muslim friends, like seriously, go out there.
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00:45:14.320like we live in an area that's that's got a heavy muslim population that is predominantly
00:45:21.080sane muslims right and it's because of where they come like i'm gonna be honest most of the crazy
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00:45:26.700muslims come from like one of three fairly small areas but their branch of islam has been adopted
00:45:34.420by the wider progressive cause yeah so that yeah the point is not to be suspicious of someone just
00:45:45.760because they're muslim it's to be suspicious of someone no no no be suspicious of someone
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00:45:50.280because they're muslim trust but verify right you know like oh god i was gonna say like if they're
00:45:58.300muslim and staunch progressive political activists that's that's a pretty clear red flag
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00:46:04.620but yeah i mean basically you want to don't make them say i like israel right like that's not the
00:46:13.880way you you you're like okay of the various political groups battling over the middle east
00:46:20.400right now which one are you for right like uae saudi arabia iran or one of the other groups
00:46:27.620like the the hussies or the al-qaeda or the you know isis and there's acceptable answers there
00:46:35.140right if they say saudi arabia they're they're still a little sus they could be wahhabis
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00:46:41.220if they say uae they're generally fine if they say qatar be super sus if they say
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00:46:49.060any of the terrorist groups or iran you know you're dealing you're dealing with a situation
00:46:57.600there right well i mean because i feel like people people in iran themselves are actually not
00:47:05.440extremists in general no no generally persian immigrants to the united states
00:47:11.580hate iran like i actually don't know if i ever met an iranian who likes the current iranian
00:47:17.060government yeah that's the weird thing we gotta jump on our next podcast but funny funny side
00:47:22.760note about like the trait i always see in iranians like i joke about iranians all the
00:47:26.980time on this podcast but the number one trait and i i don't know why i haven't said this on
00:47:30.620the show before that i always associate with iranians in the united states is they more than
00:47:36.480any ethnic group i have ever met love nightclubs and clubbing i have never met another group that
00:47:43.480can go to nightclubs like multiple nights in a row right they've evolved for it they have evolved
00:47:53.200for it they have like tolerance for the poison it's it's part of their dna we gotta run we gotta
00:47:58.900run gotta run okay bye i just sent you the link don't worry it will be okay
00:48:08.220i mean i shouldn't say that i can't guarantee that everything will be okay
00:48:16.580people who say that are not to be trusted i'm so curious because the moment i saw people making
00:48:25.120fun of this i wanted to understand what is this system how do you get the cards is there a desk
00:48:32.860that hands out the cards do you make up your own cards what is this what does point of privilege
00:48:38.960mean i have there are just so many things that i need to know
00:48:42.160because i mean normally in left-leaning circles point of privilege or at least the term privilege
00:48:53.080is a derogatory term right you need to check your privilege your white privilege etc right