Candace Miller is joined by Bernie Sanders' former press secretary Breonna Joy Gray to discuss the anti-Semitism bill that's making its way through Congress and what it means for the future of free speech in America. She also talks about TikTok and why it's a problem, and why AIPAC should be worried about the next generation of pro-Israel tech companies. Candace is a regular contributor to the Forward podcast and host of the show Candace's new show, The Candace Miller Show. She is also a frequent guest on CNN and other media outlets, and is one of the most influential women in American politics. You can find Candace on social media as , and on the pod as . Thank you for listening to Candace and Forward. Please don't forget to leave us a rating and review on Apple Podcasts! or wherever else you get your podcasts. We'll be right back with more episodes like this and more in the coming weeks. Thanks again for listening and Happy Listening! Timestamps: 5:00 - Is America a sovereign nation or are we being controlled by Israel? 7:30 - Anti-Semitism is a problem? 8:15 - TikTok? 9:00 11:00- Is TikTok a problem or is it a good thing? 12:40 - What's the real game? 15:30- What's next? 16:15- Is Israel a problem now? 17:20 - Who's going to be the real? 18:20- What s going to win in 2020? 19:40- What do you think of Tik Tok Tok? 21: What s the best app? 22:40 23:30 26:00+ - What s your opinion on TikTok s role in the future? 27:10 - Is Israel's place in the culture of the culture? 29:10 32:00 +33:30+ 35:30 +34:40 + 35:40+ 36: What is the role of Jews in the story of the Bible in the Bible? 35,000+36:00? 37: Does Israel have a right to be a Christian in the Torah? 39:00 Is she a Christian? 45:00 What does she really believe in Jesus Christ the real God?
00:01:42.800The conversation is moving because we are seeing people that are having their entire livelihoods destroyed for critiquing a foreign nation as an absurdity.
00:02:37.680We really have a TikTok problem, a Gen Z problem, that our community needs to put the same brains that gave us Tag Lee, the same brains that gave us all these other amazing innovations, need to put our energy toward this, like, fast.
00:02:54.560Because, again, like we've been chasing this left-right divide.
00:03:53.460Well, you better be very careful if you're going to talk about how the Jews played any sort of role in his persecution.
00:04:00.980Yeah, because that's what's in the anti-Semitism bill.
00:04:04.220Being a Christian will pretty much be banned if it gets passed.
00:04:07.140So, yeah, things are pretty strange and it makes sense when you consider the fact that Thomas Massey, my favorite congressman in the entire world, because he seems to be the only one that will stand up to AIPAC, recently went on Tucker Carlson and he had this to say.
00:05:19.220I was going to talk to you guys about this topic, but I got to I got to go call my AIPAC person because I got to see what I'm allowed to say.
00:05:27.020He goes on later to talk about how they should have to register, obviously, because you have a foreign country that is impacting American politics and that should be illegal.
00:05:38.960But of course, Thomas Massey is playing in some waiting in some dangerous water, so to speak, because we know that there was once a president who wanted to make AIPAC register as foreign and he ended up shot.
00:06:03.400We are seeing people get plucked, plucked, plucked, not because they're anti-Semitic, but because they're not pro-Israel enough.
00:06:11.060You know, they're not happy, I guess, when when an innocent Palestinian kid dies.
00:06:15.820That's what it seems like if you if you if you are not completely doing the work of AIPAC and if you are not willing to support every action that Bibi Netanyahu does, then the media will perpetuate you as an anti-Semite who should lose everything.
00:06:30.060And there is somebody who claims that she recently just went through that.
00:06:32.960As I told you at the top, her name is Breonna Joy Gray, and she was fired.
00:06:37.480According to the headlines, it was because of her shocking response to the sister of a Hamas hostage.
00:06:42.680I'm going to let you hear what Breonna said to the sister of the Hamas hostage.
00:06:47.360And tell me if you're completely shocked by it.
00:06:49.720Take a listen to Breonna while she was at the Hill interviewing this young woman.
00:06:54.700I'm just going to push back against the implication that in Michigan, which has the largest Muslim and Arab population in America, that there is any threat of terrorism from our own people.
00:07:04.360And I would like to clarify also that one of the rationale that was presented for 9-11 was discussed with America's support of Israel's continued occupation of Palestine.
00:07:18.940I really do hope that Netanyahu agrees and Israel agrees to the ceasefire deal that could bring all the hostages, including your sister, home.
00:07:27.360And I'm sure many people watching are praying for her safety.
00:07:48.220She seems to have rolled her eyes when the young woman told her to believe women.
00:07:53.400I mean, that hashtag, just believe women, of course, is something that makes me roll my eyes as well.
00:07:58.060We want to believe our hard facts and we want to be able to discern what is actually happening.
00:08:04.660But I'm not going to contextualize anything that bright.
00:08:06.480I'm going to allow her to speak on behalf of herself.
00:08:09.460We'll have that coming up for you guys in just a second.
00:08:11.960Well, I can tell you one thing that happens when you get fired.
00:08:15.260You start to worry about your everyday bills.
00:08:17.640And I can tell you that, unfortunately, that's the climate for a lot of Americans right now.
00:08:20.960It's just glass prices so high, food prices so high.
00:08:25.300And if you own a home, yeah, you're probably thinking a lot about whether or not you can afford those bills as well.
00:08:31.780And if you're thinking about that, I want you to call my friends at American Financing.
00:08:35.240Interest rates have dropped into the fives, which is nearly a quarter of the average credit card rate.
00:08:40.580American Financing is saving their customers an average of $854 a month by tapping into their home's equity and wiping out high-interest credit card debt.
00:09:30.960I didn't see the interview before I read the headlines.
00:09:33.600The headline that I saw reads, this is from the Daily Mail, Brianna Joy Gray is fired after her shocking response to sister of Hamas hostage.
00:09:42.960So I was like, wow, what did Brianna say?
00:09:46.340She must have just been off the rails, crazy.
00:09:58.920And I really do appreciate you reaching out, Candace, as someone who has been through this not so unique experience.
00:10:05.260I was going to say unique experience, but increasingly it's happening as I think more and more journalists who might not have focused on this particular issue in the past find themselves doing so, informing themselves,
00:10:16.180and finding themselves on the, quote unquote, wrong side of this issue when it comes to censorship.
00:10:21.360So I really do appreciate you reaching out.
00:10:23.720And it's interesting to have you and I speaking because we are not on the same side of the political aisle.
00:10:28.500I mean, you are a person, your background, you were the spokesperson for the Bernie Sanders campaign.
00:10:34.100I mean, I was very much identified as a Trump supporter about as far as you could be in the media's eyes when he was running in 2016.
00:10:42.080And yet we do find ourselves allied in the belief that people in America should be able to criticize the actions of foreign governments without having their entire livelihoods risked.
00:11:00.240And yet there are so many people who know, like I know and like you know, that if you are in media, you got to be careful talking about Israel.
00:11:08.960Yeah, it really is the one true red line.
00:11:12.100And I think you experienced that as being part of a media organization that I think rightly really prioritized and focused on various threats to free speech in various different contexts and across the political spectrum.
00:11:24.600But it really does feel like free speech, except for when it comes to Israel, progressive, except for when it comes to Palestine.
00:11:32.060I mean, there is this Palestine sized hole or exception in a lot of people's principled stance against various issues.
00:11:39.820And I say progressive, except for Palestine, because there are similarly people on the left who say that they care about various groups, who say that they are anti-war, but who very similarly will look the other way or frankly become very oppositional when suddenly the people that we're talking about who are being under siege in a conflict are in fact Palestinian.
00:12:00.060Yeah. And it's particularly interesting to see the way the media reports on these incidents.
00:12:06.280And I see it already in how they're speaking about your firing because they don't actually say what it is that you said that was controversial.
00:12:14.920I saw this when Alpha Daily Wire, Andrew Klavan does this episode.
00:12:18.280He's like, she was saying things in a way, but he can't actually point to what I said because actually there was something that I said that was controversial.
00:12:24.780Unless you view a certain race to be just above and above critique really is what it is.
00:12:32.420If you view a certain race to be above critique.
00:12:34.620And I found that when I was being lied upon by a man named Rabbi Barclay.
00:12:41.000I mean, he lied so badly about me that they PJ Media wound up taking the article down after I interviewed him because I was genuinely curious.
00:12:47.680Like, how could you say you're a rabbi or supposed to be a leader in your community and you're publishing lies about things that I never said.
00:12:55.440And when he when he spoke to me, he was very honest.
00:12:59.440And I realized, OK, he's actually just a racial supremacist.
00:13:02.360He's telling me that he believes that, you know, if Jewish blood is shed, it does, in fact, matter more when it is Jewish history.
00:13:10.480It matters more. And I appreciated his honesty.
00:13:13.540And I could see why we were going to be on the wrong side of this issue, because I don't believe in racial supremacy, whether it's coming from BLM leaders talking about, you know, their list of demands for white people.
00:13:23.200I don't believe in racial supremacy if it's white people.
00:13:25.820And I certainly am not going to accept it if it's Jewish people.
00:13:29.100I just that's not something that anyone should accept.
00:13:31.900Well, it'll come as no surprise to you, Candice, that I feel differently about when we can get more specific about your qualms with BLM.
00:13:39.780But with respect to Israel, I do think that what has become increasingly clear to people is that the ideology that sort of justifies a Jewish state created in the middle of an Arab land really requires a commitment to basically expelling, ethnically cleansing,
00:14:00.040and even committing what has been described by the ICJ as a plausible genocide against the population so that there can be a Jewish majority.
00:14:07.740And I know that's a sort of uncomfortable fact, but it's one that I think many people are coming to when you start to question why it is that Israel has made the choice to treat five million people who are in constructively occupied territory in both the West Bank and Gaza,
00:14:23.580as second class citizens for years and years, not to mention the 20 percent of Israel's population, who are subject to about 60 different laws that discriminate against them in terms of housing, employment and in other kinds of arenas.
00:14:36.480And it all comes down to when you start to listen to people explain why they think it's acceptable to, for example, kill over 270 Palestinians and murder so many children the way we saw just a few days ago in Gaza to rescue three hostages.
00:14:53.580You have people very openly saying it's justified. It would have been justified to kill 500, 1,000 Palestinians if it meant getting three hostages back.
00:15:02.360And I certainly understand prioritizing hostage exchange. And this is what I told to the sister of the hostage that I spoke to on Rising last week.
00:15:11.520Certainly, if you want to prioritize hostage exchange, I agree with that. And we should be talking about the protests that are being put on by the families of hostages in Israel against Netanyahu because they rightly perceive him as being the primary obstacle to prioritizing hostage exchange over what he has said is his priority, which is eliminating Hamas.
00:15:34.000All that being said, there are ways to get the hostages back. It is evident and could have gotten back months and months ago if that were, in fact, the priority.
00:15:42.420But instead, the cost, the value of Palestinian life is perceived as so cheap as compared to Israeli lives that we've seen and said that they would rather do these military organizations with the help of the U.S. government using a U.S. built pier that cost $300,000, was told it was a humanitarian pier,
00:16:01.080using an action that was in fact a war crime using a humanitarian vehicle to Trojan horse military officers into a refugee camp and then kill almost 300 Palestinians in the effort to get three hostages back and also losing an Israeli soldier at the same time.
00:16:21.940Does that really seem worth it? I think the average person says no.
00:16:24.700And the only reason you come to a yes is if you really very cheaply value lives that are not Israeli.
00:16:31.780And that's where I'm getting at where I say it actually is what we're talking about is just racial supremacy.
00:16:35.860You know, I don't know a single person who was not horrified about what happened on October 7th, who obviously wants every hostage to be returned because we value the lives of the innocent full stop.
00:16:45.100It doesn't matter to me if that's an innocent Palestinian life or whether it's an innocent Israeli life.
00:16:48.960And as soon as I was saying this is equal to me, suddenly all of these attacks started.
00:16:53.220And I really did feel like what was happening after October 7th is very reminiscent to me of what was happening after 9-11 and growing up in the 9-11.
00:17:02.420And I look back on that time because I realized that there was this sort of media insistence.
00:17:06.860We didn't have social media. We didn't have other perspectives being given to us.
00:17:10.160There really was no sense of an independent media.
00:17:12.260But I look back on that and I realized I was almost brainwashed to believe that Muslim life had no worth.
00:17:17.180Thinking about how scared I was every time I saw a Muslim, you know, wherever I was, whether I was an airport, anywhere.
00:17:22.340And I actually believe that the media in America was successful in dehumanizing Muslims.
00:17:26.820I'm not a little girl anymore. OK, I'm an adult. I am a woman.
00:17:30.500I'm a mother, which is the most important thing.
00:17:33.720And I just remember after October 7th, I was I was very due to give birth looking on Twitter and seeing these children.
00:17:42.080These children happen to have the same complexion as my daughter because I have a mixed child being blown up.
00:17:48.340And then having people tell me that I shouldn't care about that.
00:17:52.280And I said to myself, OK, I totally understand people wanting to have their hostages returned.
00:17:57.820I can totally understand people wanting to make sure that their family is safe.
00:18:02.580But what I cannot understand is how you think you are a good person when you devalue the life of a child.
00:18:10.260You are a monster. I don't care who you are. I don't care if you're an American commentator.
00:18:13.340I don't care if you're a rich billionaire. I don't care for the average person on the street.
00:18:17.620When you applaud one hostage being returned and yet, you know, thousands of people who are similarly innocent were killed in the process and you go, oh, well, too bad.
00:18:29.440You become a monster. And I know that there are so many people who agree with me in media who are scared to say that because they are fearful of having their jobs.
00:18:40.400They are fearful of losing their jobs, rather. So can you speak to exactly how you found out you were being terminated and on what grounds you were terminated?
00:18:48.920Yeah, I mean, the the email that I posted to Twitter is the entire record of contact that I've had with the Hill.
00:18:58.500So I usually worked Monday through Thursdays. We had just shifted through a Monday to Wednesday schedule at my insistence,
00:19:04.720in part because of how hostile the environment had become, not just on air with my co-host, who I'm, you know, obviously the point of the show is for us to debate.
00:19:13.800And we have a good working relationship off screen. But with the staff behind the scenes, new producers that had been hired,
00:19:20.940who ostensibly were there to exert some broader editorial guidance over the show, but seem to focus very specifically on minimizing the extent to which we could cover the Israel-Palestine conflict.
00:19:35.440There were a number of indicators for months now that they were unhappy with the tenor of the show.
00:19:41.940Obviously, my co-host Robbie was there to push back. I don't know if they found his pushback to be inadequate,
00:19:47.220but they kept wanting to have specific kinds of guests on the show, which I, of course, was open to.
00:19:50.900I have never turned down a guest for ideological reasons.
00:19:54.500I cannot say the same for guests that were aligned with my ideological perspective and my co-host, I have to say.
00:20:00.520But I noticed that when they were trying to find guests that presented a pro-Israel point of view,
00:20:07.060unlike the kind of guests that I seek to bring on who have some kind of issue area expertise,
00:20:11.340let's say because they're a journalist or let's say because they're a professor or let's say because they're a politician, an elected official,
00:20:18.680they would bring on people who seem to just be Internet actors who would come on and instead of taking questions from Robbie and I
00:20:25.480in a professional kind of interview style of format, would very quickly try to personalize the issue
00:20:30.140and want to have an argument with me about whatever tweet that they last seen of mine that they didn't like,
00:20:34.760which obviously puts me in a really tough position as a host who wants to be gracious and sort of moderate
00:20:39.680and not get into a back and forth with a guest.
00:20:42.240But the guests started increasingly coming on with this kind of ideology.
00:23:45.280Because I'm Candace, I don't have all of the degrees that the rest of these people have who think that they're so smart and they're so brilliant.
00:23:52.460Wouldn't you just think that you would slam me in a debate?
00:23:55.340I'm so dumb and you're so smart and you're so wise and you just need to teach us things.
00:24:00.840If the Israel argument is valid, sit down and debate it with somebody who is against the Israel argument.
00:24:37.340We talked about in monologue, which you didn't get to see, how Trump couldn't get this thing done.
00:24:42.400He wanted to ban TikTok because he had concerns about China.
00:24:45.520Suddenly John Greenblatt swoops in and it's gone.
00:24:49.820TikTok has got to go or at least it passes in the House.
00:24:52.200And immediately you start to realize who's actually controlling Congress.
00:24:56.640Yeah, and it's not it's not just Republicans.
00:24:59.140I followed the Massey AIPAC challenge very closely because it mirrors, frankly, the kind of challenges we've been seeing on the left for quite some time.
00:25:09.940The left, you know, not liberals who I am frequently a critic of.
00:25:14.220I think I critique more than any other group is not what I'm talking about here.
00:25:17.600I'm talking about real progressives, you know, to the left of Bernie, frankly, have frequently found themselves in the exact same situation as Thomas Massey, because it is, again, the one and true only red line on a bipartisan basis that nobody on either side of the aisle is allowed to cross.
00:25:34.020So you've seen these mounting AIPAC challenges from candidates like Anita Turner in Ohio's 11th District.
00:25:40.780Summer Lee was able to survive her challenge.
00:25:42.620You're seeing Jamal Bowman in New York getting challenged along these lines.
00:25:47.000And you're seeing a lot of I know you have an interest in kind of the craven weaponization of identity politics and the exploitation of race to lend cover to what are, frankly, in this case, kind of a foreign policy agenda, but are often sort of corporate policy agendas.
00:26:04.940And there's often overlap between the two.
00:26:06.580As we're talking about Israel, we can't not talk about defense contracting and Boeing and why there is so much incentive to continue this war along with so many others.
00:26:16.200But what you see is that particularly people like Richie Torres, Congress members who are black and brown, are often weaponized to advance the interests of Israel in this case.
00:26:29.260Hakeem Jeffries, also from New York, frequently famously says Israel is the sixth borough.
00:26:35.680Mayor Adams, unsurprisingly, is a big advocate for Israel.
00:26:40.240And I think they try to disguise the extent to which there is a conflict of interest there between the average working class American and the interests that are being pushed by a foreign lobby by dressing it up in the veneer of a trusted black representative.
00:26:56.060On the other hand, and I think we talked about this a little bit before we started recording, those black representatives and political leaders that don't fall in line are subject to particular scrutiny and particularly forceful pushback.
00:27:11.120And I think that's part of what you experience is part of what I experienced.
00:27:15.000The Stop Anti-Semitism account recently decided to post a picture of a random black high school student who had said that they want to free Palestine, really targeting in particular black people.
00:27:27.660Because I think they're capitalizing on this stereotype that because there is, I think, a longstanding tradition of black people kind of empathizing with the situation of Palestinians, because frankly, it is familiar that we have historically also been tarred with the label anti-Semite.
00:27:42.960And it's a method to effectively shut down conversations about this issue.
00:28:03.920I've worked for Jewish companies my entire life.
00:28:06.000How did I just become a raging anti-Semite simply because I have questions about what is happening to these innocent Palestinian children and why we are treating them like their lives don't matter.
00:28:15.820Again, my position is that what we're seeing operating in the media are racial supremacists.
00:28:20.200And I think that they're taking the wrong side here.
00:28:29.100People are seeing what is happening to people.
00:28:31.240There seems to be an awakening on this issue.
00:28:33.340And let me tell you, if this awakening speeds up, and I think it is, it's catalyzing, people are going to look back and remember these voices that sat there and supported racial supremacy because they didn't want to lose their jobs.
00:28:44.600That supported racial supremacy, supported the death of innocent children who are out there saying outrageous things, applauding the death of children as long as they get back one person, as opposed to saying, no, this conflict needs to come to an end because too many children are dying.
00:28:59.920I have no regrets in the way that I've been treated in the media because at the end of the day, my relationship doesn't matter with the boss.
00:29:05.600And they are all going to have to account to God one day.
00:29:09.280And you can see these psychopaths in media, you know, that are trying to sell you something different and tell you that there's something wrong with you or you're perverted because you feel bad for a dead child that you are seeing on your screen.
00:29:20.960I wouldn't want to be those people when you have to meet the ultimate boss one day and really account for what you've created and, you know, throughout your life.
00:29:29.160Yeah, Candace, I would love to just speak to that Jewish supremacy point, if I could, to clarify for some people who might hear that phraseology and find it to be a little bit dissonant.
00:29:40.340I just want to say that, obviously, I think we can all understand that any supremacy movement is a problem.
00:29:46.080It is, we are, I think, so rightly appalled by the horrors of the Holocaust and we have been so, that has been emphasized and taught to us so strongly in our education as we grow up, rightly so, that I think the idea of even thinking about Jewish supremacy is sometimes difficult to wrap your brain around because we're so focused on the opposite, right?
00:30:15.340Anti-Semitism and the relatively recent historical tragedy that ended up killing two-thirds of the world's Jewish population in a horrible Holocaust, right?
00:30:28.400You know, and I want to just really address that dissonance because what I'm talking about, and I think what you were talking about when we're talking about supremacy, is an ideology that I think is required to support Zionism, but which is not fundamental to Judaism as a whole.
00:30:44.580That's correct. Judaism is not Zionism.
00:30:46.960Right. There's been this effort to conflate the two because we all abhor the notion of being anti-Semitic, right?
00:30:55.100And I think there is a sensitivity to that that Zionists are aware of, and so they know that it's easier to marginalize someone for being anti-Semitic than anti-Zionists because what is Zionism?
00:31:05.420Zionism is a particular political belief that thinks that there should be a Jewish state established in a part of the world that is overwhelmingly Arab.
00:31:13.380And when you do that, it requires you to establish a democratic majority to not allow Palestinians to, for instance, have the right of return.
00:31:21.620That a, you know, a Jewish person who was born in New York or Philadelphia or Iowa is able to have the right, even if they've never stepped foot in that region, to move there.
00:31:32.320Whereas a Palestinian who has keys to the house that they owned before they were expelled in the Nakba in 1948 is not allowed to visit the country.
00:31:41.780Where Palestinians who work in Israel via work permits are forced to wait for hours at checkpoints or who need to get better hospital care than is available to them in the occupied territories have to wait even if their health is imperiled because there's different roads and different rules for Palestinians, for Arabs in Israel.
00:32:03.280This is an apartheid state. It's a two-tiered state that specifically gives different rights, superior rights to people who are Jewish as opposed to people who are Muslim and Arab.
00:32:13.520And I say Arab and Muslim separately because there are Christian Arabs in Gaza who have their churches being bombed, who are themselves being killed.
00:32:21.760Justin Amash, a libertarian former congress member, had multiple family members killed by U.S.-backed airstrikes earlier in this conflict.
00:32:32.100And you almost heard nothing about it, no condemnations from Congress for a former sitting U.S. congress member, Palestinian American congress members, own young family members being massacred by Israeli bombs with American political cover.
00:32:47.800And all of all of the problems of the region can be traced back to the insistence that Palestinians and Jewish Israelis cannot have the same rights within the state of Israel, because if that happened, there would be demographic parity, the same number of Palestinians as Israelis.
00:33:05.520And that would, we're told, necessarily imperil the safety of Jewish Israelis.
00:33:12.040Now, let me ask you this, Candace. Does it make sense to you to simultaneously be making an argument that Israel is a democratic country that we should be loving and supporting?
00:33:21.600Because, look, 20 percent of the population is Arab and we all live peacefully.
00:33:25.280And isn't that wonderful? But also to be making the argument that we can't have any more Palestinians because they're inherently violent.
00:33:31.940They're inherently regressive. They will ruin our society if they come into the country.
00:33:38.340Well, that's what I'm speaking to when I talk about this dehumanization of Palestinians that's happening right now in the media.
00:33:42.660It's disgusting. And like I said, you know, I would say I'm agnostic on the issue.
00:33:47.380I want to learn more, which is why I'm trying to have a debate with somebody who is, you know, radically pro-Zionist.
00:33:52.060I don't have an issue with the fact that you're radically pro-Zionist.
00:33:54.380What I have an issue with is that you speak down to people as if you are a superior and you won't debate your ideas.
00:33:59.860Right. I have an issue with the fact that you are you're speaking about, you know, the Arab population who, by the way, are Semitic.
00:34:07.420You're talking you're talking about anti-Semitism and what these are Semitic people.
00:34:11.000You're speaking about them in this way that makes me uncomfortable.
00:34:14.440You know, my grandfather grew up in a segregated South. I'm not comfortable with the way you're speaking about them.
00:34:18.860And when you try to shut down my conversation and you speak to me in that same way, you are acting like a racial supremacist.
00:34:25.200And we have to have the courage to call that out. And of course, it's not all Jewish people.
00:34:28.680Some people genuinely just are like, I want the hostages to be returned.
00:34:33.140You know, I am concerned. You know, I followed some Jewish influencers who have been so understanding.
00:34:38.920You know, there are people that you listen to them and you're like, this makes sense.
00:34:42.200They're not being pushy. They're not being supremacists. They are obviously concerned.
00:34:45.900They grew up in Israel. You know, their family grew up in Israel as Jews, you know, because this was after 19, 1945 or, you know, within the last 30 years.
00:34:53.900And they are not disgusting in the way that they are talking about this issue.
00:34:59.540But it feels like a lot of people in the media are. And that's what makes me uncomfortable.
00:35:03.340They are they are very disgusting and matter of fact. And, oh, well, we've got bigger bombs.
00:35:08.800And who cares how many Muslims you kill? I care because I'm a Christian and I'm not comfortable with the amount of death that is happening to children.
00:35:16.420How dare I call myself a pro-life conservative and then stay mum on this issue?
00:35:20.780How dare I call myself a Christian, a child of God, and then be mum on this issue because I care about money?
00:35:27.520And so that's kind of where I want people to really consider listening to this podcast.
00:35:32.000Are you comfortable with the amount of death of innocent children?
00:35:36.100And to check yourself, have you been brainwashed to believe that it doesn't matter if an Arab child is killed?
00:35:42.820And let me also push you on this to my listeners.
00:35:47.140If you say it's OK when a state does this, then you better hope you remain friends with that state, because if they ever turn their arms against you and you've already set the groundwork for believing that it does not matter when innocent children are murdered, when they are waking up to bombs being dropped on them, then you're going to have to stand by those words.
00:36:08.180OK. Yeah. I mean, I would also point out, I think your I think your point about children is really well made.
00:36:15.200I remember I believe you were pregnant when you were talking with Norm Finkelstein and I could tell how much you were impacted by him, you know, also bringing up the lack of maternal health care that's available.
00:36:26.980I mean, maternal health care. Forget that. I mean, clean water and food available to so many pregnant women in Gaza, babies that have been born into this conflict who have been killed by this conflict.
00:36:37.360I mean, the whole thing is terrible. But we're also having new reporting just over the last few days about a torture camp that exists in Israel where.
00:36:45.560And I'm sorry, and I'm sorry, this is so graphic, but Palestinian men have been having metal electric rods inserted into the rectums as a kind of torture.
00:36:56.120We've had ample reports of rapes that are substantiated. And I got to say, I'm sorry, there have been ample reports discrediting the New York Times reporting about the, quote unquote, mass rapes that happened on October 7th, including most recently in the Times of London,
00:37:13.520really destroying all of the sources that were used in that initial reporting reporting that was so controversial, even within the New York Times, that its own podcast, daily podcast department declined to do a podcast in the story because it was so riddled with obvious inconsistencies and reporting errors.
00:37:28.960So that was headline news. That was front page news. When Joe Biden lied about there being 40 beheaded babies, that was front page news.
00:37:37.060And the retraction is just a blip. His people coming forward and saying, oh, he didn't actually see that.
00:37:41.220It didn't actually happen. That's just a blip. And meanwhile, the Times finally reported on this torture camp where they're sodomizing Palestinian prisoners.
00:37:49.160It's at the bottom of a lengthy article that did not get the above the fold treatment that the original reporting did.
00:37:55.820And so, again, you're seeing the asymmetry and the value of life.
00:37:58.280One other point that The Intercept and some other organizations have been tracking the use of language when describing Palestinian deaths versus Israeli deaths and words like barbaric, savage, horrible, kind of more emotive words are used 60 times as frequently when discussing Hamas killing Israelis versus Israelis killing Palestinian civilians.
00:38:25.540And so we are all being taught by the media how to interpret this crisis in incredibly subtle ways and also in very overt ways.
00:38:34.920And that's, I think, a reason why it's so important for you to be independent, to be able to speak out boldly without worry that you are going to be censorship by a parent organization the way they attempted to censor you and the way I have been censored.
00:38:48.880And I personally am very grateful for the existence of independent media platforms.
00:38:52.840I want to say, everybody, like, you know, don't lose your values, you know, like, just do not lose your values in the sea of everything going on.
00:39:01.480People are scared, whether we're talking about, you know, people scared to speak up about transgenderism in children or whether you're talking about, you know, what's happening in Palestine and Israel.
00:39:09.900You should speak your values and expect that when you do something that is right, the world will open up to you.
00:39:15.620So, Brianna, I am wishing you the most luck.
00:39:18.120Can you allow us to know where we can follow you and how they can support you?
00:39:23.320Let my listeners know how they can support you.
00:39:25.520You can find me at patreon.com slash badfaithpodcast.
00:39:29.080I have a weekly podcast that comes out free every Thursday.
00:39:32.480You can catch it on YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:39:35.560And if you subscribe at Patreon, you can get an additional Monday episode for $5 a month.
00:39:41.720This Monday, today, as we're recording, I just released a really thorough, deep dive into the months-long effort to oust me at the Hill and actually, frankly, get into some issues around transgender issues and politics as well in that episode.
00:40:00.720And I want to extend the invitation, Candice, to you also.
00:40:03.140I know that we disagree about a lot of things, but I have been impressed by your willingness to have open debate and conversation and be receptive to different points of view.
00:40:10.580I've seen it in the context of Israel, and I would love to continue this conversation on a number of other issues if you ever have the time.