Episode #4 - How To Get Into The Cryptocurrency Industry w⧸ Ameer Rosic ( BlockGeeks.com)
Episode Stats
Words per Minute
212.54344
Summary
In this episode of the BlockGeeks podcast, I sit down with Ammar Chaudhuri, CEO and Founder of Blockgeeks, a company that focuses on Bitcoin, Ethereum and other cryptocurrencies. We discuss the company's vision for the next 5 years, how they think about the space, and who are the good actors and the bad actors in the Bitcoin space.
Transcript
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I actually highly recommend you get a piece of paper
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I sit down with Amir who's arguably one of the top
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and we just deconstructed not only the incredible resource
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how they look at being involved in the Bitcoin,
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the crypto space and the vision for the next five years
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and talk about who are the good actors, the bad actors
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and actually make a killing in the Bitcoin crypto space.
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You're in the crypto space, and what is BlockGeeks?
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BlockGeeks, in a nutshell, is we focus on educating developers online.
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So if you're like a junior dev, and you're trying to get in the space, we offer online training.
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So you know who your competitive set is, but not necessarily competitive.
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So what's different about what you guys are doing?
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So one, we're very agnostically focusing just on blockchain technology.
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And number two, we're actually implementing crypto itself within BlockGeeks.
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You focus on cryptocurrencies, the blockchain technology.
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Because people like those other sites, they are teaching curriculum.
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The difference between, let's say, you're a JavaScript developer is all you learn is just basic if, this, then that rules on JavaScript, right?
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When it comes to blockchain architectural system, it's more than just coding.
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You have to understand human psychology, human behavior, economic principles, etc.
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Because you're actually building a society online.
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When you look at Ethereum, when you look at Bitcoin, it's a society.
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Yeah. So essentially you're designing the laws that this society, this set of values,
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inside the currency, there's a set of rules, governance, principles, et cetera. And so it's
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really the human side and it's the technology side.
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Cool. What do you think is going to be the unfair advantage in your business in this space?
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For us, right away is positioning. We're the world's biggest blockchain educational website
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already. We launched about a year and a bit ago. We're doing coming up to 3.5 million visits a
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month. And how did you do that? Content marketing. Okay. Well, I break that apart. Content marketing.
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So I'll tell you. So good friend, my Dimitri, which is Vitalik's father. So Vitalik invented
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Ethereum. I got in the space. That's an unfair advantage to a certain degree. It's a massive
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unfair advantage. Yeah. The father of the son who created one of the second largest currencies
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is your business partner. Yes. All right. Let's start there. So for me, I was talking to Dimitri
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at that time, and I was trying to find more information about Bitcoin, about Ethereum,
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I'm not a big fan of Reddit because there's a lot of, let's say, trolls over there, and
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I don't want to read through a million threads to find one diamond in the rough.
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I just want to read a simple blog that, for me, I'm not a developer.
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Even though I understand technology, I'm not a coder itself.
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I just want to understand the 30,000-foot view.
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And then it didn't exist, and it's kind of mind-numbing to me.
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I'm like, Bitcoin's been around for seven-plus years at this time.
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and there's no resource for any of these other blockchains,
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well, I personally want to learn a little bit of coding myself.
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It's just like literally if then, case statements,
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And for me, my background is online marketing growth.
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I wouldn't call it blog, but I call it a resource.
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And like, you know, it's kind of like pretty much a laggard-ish, you know what I mean?
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Like the accountants are definitely not usually early adopters.
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And he was like, hey, man, what do you know about, you know, we're working out.
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Yeah, he's like, what do you know about crypto?
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Yeah, and I was just like, go to Block Geeks, go spend six months, you know, read everything you can.
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But I'm curious because I know you're building Accelerator and then you've obviously built this massive knowledge base that's free.
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anybody can go consume it and you talk about like the right way to purchase and secure it and wallets
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and all that stuff. I know you've you're very vocal on ICOs and the craziness that's going on
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right now but if somebody wanted to get involved because this is the big the big question is how
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how would you suggest somebody get involved not necessarily having to buy Bitcoin and or
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cryptocurrency or having to become a programmer what are your thoughts to somebody's just
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passionate about, they see this as the future, right? It's not just a way to make
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money. How would you suggest they get involved? Well, number one, they got to
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understand how blockchain works. Perfect. How long do you think that might take
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somebody? Depends on their background. Like for me, it didn't take too long. Like I
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think even sitting down with somebody and just doodling it out. Yeah. And looking at
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some YouTube videos that we have. And you've done some whiteboard. Yeah, I've done
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whiteboard for that. Just doing that and maybe just really understand and taking
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your time instead of just like, most people skim through stuff, let's be honest, right?
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Yeah, the headline, you know, sub-headline, oh, I got it, I'm good.
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Like for me to understand crypto economics, and I'm not an expert at all, like I just
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I'm just reading and writing and reading and writing, reading and writing, I'm like,
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It took me six months, nights, like I was, I think I was building clarity, early days
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We were looking at how do we use Bitcoin as a payment structure.
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Because that was, that was kind of like a great PR angle.
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And I did that kind of like every night sitting down, you know, laying in bed with my wife
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But I mean, once they understand it, how do they get the most out of it?
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We have a lot of marketers coming into this space right now.
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Let's use my buddy Ian, who's an accountant, because I think that's probably more...
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The biggest problem right now in the crypto space, especially for people who actually
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Like for example, in Canada, it's capital gains tax.
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But capital gains tax, you have both profit and loss, but profit and loss, depending on
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But entry point, you can determine on how much money I sent from my bank account to an exchange.
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But you can't really determine on the movements I made from exchange to exchange.
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So the problem is like, okay, if it's capital gain stocks, I can just claim a loss then, right?
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So I always recommend accountants to really figure out the jersey.
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Or if you got it somehow without just investing.
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We were saying, well, that's five bucks a Bitcoin.
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And we were like, oh shit, they're going to probably lose the money because it's like
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So you're saying, figuring out what thing they're good at that could apply to the space.
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Lawyers, accountants, people who specialize in taxes is much needed in this space.
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Pretty much like anybody in the business infrastructure.
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Because, I mean, what happens, like, there was a lot of talk about, like, buy.com, I
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Because, like, they can't stay in crypto if they're purchasing and operating their
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So they're going to have to, like, there's services that lets people buy in crypto and
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convert that to fiat so they don't have that exposure?
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Like, let's say you as a Shopify store, you have the option of taking Bitcoin right now.
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Right now, Bitcoin isn't, and this is a big war right now going on with Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, Ethereum, Litecoin, Monero.
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Each of them have a different use case and different technological stuff.
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And people don't want to invest the time to learn that.
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That's the part is they're buying stuff without knowing what they're buying.
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I'm like, do you know anything about real estate?
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I have a little bit of stocks, but I haven't really sat down and invested a whole year of my life.
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The amount of time required to actually be intelligent.
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Confident enough to be like, I'm going to make my own bet on that.
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And know that you're competing against some of the smartest people in the world
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And for you to find the small little kind of this little crevice
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There's a funny meme going around in the crypto space where you have two lineups.
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Another lineup is, I'll actually tell you how it works.
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Kiosk One is a big sign that says, I will tell you when to buy and sell.
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And there's like a big lineup of people like, yeah, I don't want to think.
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There's a dude who's like, I have to tell you how it works.
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Like, you're way smarter than 99% of the population.
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Which the financial markets, I believe, back, I think it was Telex or whatever,
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like a lot of these early investors, like Ray Dalio from Bridgewater,
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and that was like a communication heartbeat, you know,
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then it was newsletters and financial news so like that's been around forever
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it's just a different implementation model today with the with crypto so
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you're saying if you're in the business of helping businesses or infrastructure
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on businesses figure out where where the intersection of what they do meets
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crypto and and kind of like whatever and then spend the time to learn it where's
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your bets gonna be placed as a block geek slash whatever this accelerator
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The whole ecosystem, because BlockGeeks focus on all developers of all different platforms,
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whether you're a Bitcoin core developer, you're an Ethereum developer, whether you're a Hyperledger
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developer, or the many different blockchains that are slowly coming out right now or emerging
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How do you pick what to teach if you're building all this content?
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Okay, so you're just going to look at the ones that have the highest search term, volume?
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Yeah, and also talking to companies, talking to people, talking to projects.
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Oh, actually talking to financial institutions, saying, hey, where are you guys thinking
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going with our hyperledger program yeah because you just realize that's the best implementation
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yeah and they need it yeah so it's not necessarily because there's a lot of
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talking bitcoin or no those infrastructure you're just saying like in a lot of these camps they
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don't like each other like the bitcoin maximalists don't like ethereum right yeah uh and they don't
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like anything like either bitcoin or nothing so you're approaching it with a capitalist approach
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yeah but where's the opportunity there's a optimistic approach capitalistic approach but
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also i want the whole ecosystem to grow as a whole i don't like if you look at organisms and if you
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And the way you would think about it is kind of like protocols, like SMTP, FTP.
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Yeah, at least for the next four or five years.
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So essentially, there's the blockchain as an infrastructure like TCP IP.
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You've got the protocols like the internet, like email, so different applications.
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And you're saying that you're going to figure out which protocol is being pulled by the
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corporate market the fastest and let's ramp up, teach those developers to get the base.
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Yeah, whether it's, like I said, Bitcoin Core, you know, working on the Bitcoin or Ethereum
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or working on Hyperledger, any of these big platforms, we will provide training.
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I think they're a revolutionary model of raising money.
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Yeah, they're actually, they're very similar to crowdfunding as a Kickstarter.
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The only problem with the difference with a Kickstarter is I have an IOU promise on delivery for a product.
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And then the thing you got was essentially the fuel that allows you to use.
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99% of these ICOs do zero crypto economic, let's say.
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That takes a, like, the whole process of figuring out your governance model for your blockchain.
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And remember, most of these ICOs, they're not, they haven't built their own blockchain.
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They built an ERC-20 token, you know, a computer language token on top of Ethereum.
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And there's not a lot of reference to model against.
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No, so essentially they're saying, I'm going to be successful implementing this new token
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structure and I really don't have a whole lot of best practices to borrow against.
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So I ask questions, I'm like, number one, why do you need your own token?
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Meaning that there's liquidity in an Ethereum that wouldn't be.
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Like when people say my token is an Ethereum token, really?
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There's nothing fundamentally promising for me to even use your token.
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of one of the ICUs that actually had a strong argument
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So they're looking at storage around the world,
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so how many tera hashes and giga hashes of free space
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and there's also, what was the one that just happened
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right now. Polkadot. So that's a side chain to help scale blockchains. I personally don't
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like it as good as I like it. From a higher volume transaction speed?
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Yeah, exactly. So it's pegged against, is it a Bitcoin or Ethereum blockchain?
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It can be used for now for Ethereum, but there's companies like Cosmos upstairs that
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we work with that might be interoperability in the future.
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Okay, amongst multiple blockchains. So think about this as a scaling solution. You have
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You have all these different blockchains and you can use this scaling platform to interconnect
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Essentially, it's almost like a layer switch, like in the network space.
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So between protocols, different levels of layers.
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Is there somebody trying to pull together the best practices and patterns for these
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Like that's looking across Ethereum and Bitcoin and...
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There's a bunch of people working in this space, but once again, we haven't defined
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Crypto-economics in Ethereum is a little bit different than Bitcoin.
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Crypto-economics in, let's say, Cosmos upstairs where they run is a little bit different than
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So I think we're very early right now to figure out what is some fundamental key principles
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You have Vlad from Ethereum Foundation, you have Vitalik, you have the Bitcoin core team.
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You have people from Cosmos, people from Polkadot, people from Mio in China.
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$200 billion worth of value has been created from this technology that arguably four or
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five years ago would have been considered maybe like...
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Where do you see the potential for this in the next five years?
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And do you have any thoughts on price of Bitcoin, price of Ethereum?
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Because you don't know if it could just, like, it could, it just takes one developer to do,
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Like, Ethereum has its own issues, but it's not Ethereum itself.
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It's all these wallets and apps, the plug-in, like, for example, Parity is a multi-sig wallet,
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Coming up to, like, 300 million dollars locked away.
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Someone found an exploit in a bug, and it wasn't malicious.
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Yeah, and when he was exploring it, essentially, it changed the signature for the wallet.
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And he's like, I'm the owner now, but it got locked up, and now, like, $300 million is locked, and no one can touch it.
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Imagine us looking at a translucent safe, like, oh, there's the money, but...
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And arguably, you'll never get it, because if you could, then it would question the whole infrastructure.
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Well, no, people, for this one, they're going to take their time, but as we stand a second,
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Well, if Ethereum does a hard fork like they did with the DAO, so the DAO…
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They're not going to do a hard fork for $300 million, are they?
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Yeah, unless the actual parity company itself bites the bullet and pays out.
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Imagine you're a tech company offering security for somebody and you get exploited.
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Typically, you have insurance, but I'm pretty sure nobody's going to touch that.
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So arguably, I mean, unless they bite the bullet, agreed, the chances of that happening
00:19:02.560
So you're saying you're going to get involved in the ecosystem.
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You've got essentially the free content, which is BlockGeeks.com.
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We already started creating, and we have full in-house teachers upstairs.
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So the lead generation for us, there's two lead generations we have.
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We have our guides, which gives us up to three.
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Like, that's the big thing that I feel like people don't understand is there's nothing
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unique to Amir that said, you're anointed, right?
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You just said, I'm going to spend the time and energy to understand this, interact with
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people, build the network, produce content that's valuable.
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And also not be greedy and not be sucked up because like I did my own, I've been approached
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I've been approached by many people doing ICO for Block Geeks.
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I've got more morals and ethics for that and I actually want to build a business that makes
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That's a hard part for me is I've got probably six friends that have created ICOs and privately I can't stand behind them.
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And I'll put a million dollar bet on it and all of them burn.
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I know and that's the part where it's like there's one thing of not participating and there's another part where it's like I really feel it's unethical.
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I know that in some way you've spun it in your mind that it's okay to do it.
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But at the end of the day, unless there's something you know that I don't know.
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There's people who, like maybe your friends are in Camp A.
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There's people who really don't know the space and they really view it as, oh, this token is a cool thing and it's all about raising money.
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And there's Camp 2, where it's like, I know everything.
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Like if you look at their ICOs, like these guys don't know what the fuck they're doing.
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They haven't done their due diligence and see a money.
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I always tell people, like, why do you need $20 million at the beginning?
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First of all, the majority of these tokens are not even real business models.
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The business model is speculation, which is not a business.
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Second, I always tell people, why do you need even a million dollars to start?
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Like, why can't you go on, oh, what's the wireframe online?
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Go on fucking InVision, hire a guy for $1,000 on InVision.
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Hire a dude on Upwork for $1,000 on InVision and get your thing made for me so I can physically see it.
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This written word thing, copy-paste, white paper.
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And you see these some ICOs are raising $50 million, $200 million, but it's slowed down right now.
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I mean, it's just overcapitalization is an argument as well.
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It's tough because there's, you know, the innovator in me, the capitalist in me that's excited for this new method of funding.
00:22:04.900
Well, majority of these ICOs aren't innovating anything.
00:22:09.720
I guess there's also the part that it's exposing people to a new market.
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Like, you need to be motivated to learn something.
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And sometimes the upside is the motivation, right?
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So, like, people learn how to code the internet just because they're like, this is going to
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be a big thing, not necessarily because they were passionate about it.
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And that's the thing that I'm, like, torn with because it's like, yes, there was a lot
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I don't mind the folks that willingly know this is a very unproven market and they know
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that there's risk, especially a lot of the investors buying the currency, right?
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Like, you know, when I got involved in Bitcoin, I knew very well this could go to zero.
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I don't really, at the end of the day, it's either going to be huge success or huge failure.
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But most people don't have that, and a lot of people funding these ICOs, and maybe they're
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Maybe it's my assumption that a lot of these people are not educated.
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Maybe they just want to be participating in the upside and some of them get stuck on
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I get pitched every day, like ridiculous amounts.
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Do you have like a standard video response right now
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for good proper white paper and auditing the team
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I would honestly say 99% have no clue what they're doing.
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At the most, there's maybe 500, 600 legitimate full-stack devs who understand blockchain.
00:23:57.360
So essentially, you're saying, I'm making the bet on the free content, I'm then creating
00:24:01.080
the training program, and then there's an accelerator of sorts.
00:24:04.180
Yeah, so that's L4 with Dimitri, Jason, so I'm there right now as more special advisor
00:24:10.960
So what we're focusing on, so it's Dimitri, it's Jason Matheson, we have Ethan, we have
00:24:16.280
Josh, we have Richard, and then we have Liam Horne, am I missing anybody, oh and Jeff Coleman,
00:24:24.240
So basically our main thing is we're focusing on protocol layer thing and we're going to
00:24:34.340
And what is the expectation of these companies, are they revenue generating through corporate
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state channels, which every blockchain in the world needs.
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So you can scale, I think, million transactions in a second.
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Off-chain solution, where all the transactions of a business will be done on this,
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but when we actually have to confirm if everything's legit, then it talks back to the root blockchain.
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Yeah, essentially it like packages it up into what it should look like and it says,
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It's transactions for a database, essentially for blockchain.
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We announced that, no monetization system for that.
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like a traditional open source kind of revenue model?
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There might be ways to monetize that in the future,
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But we know open source has, you know, there's been...
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I think right now we're in a revolution of open source.
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Like the blockchains of the future that succeed
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where you can be an early developer on a platform,
00:26:03.120
whether it was in Ethereum or Ethereum related projects,
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Yeah, bug bounties or like they have, let's say.
00:26:22.380
Dude, there's a company now that does this at scale
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like they essentially manage the bounty program.
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and they're just creating this consensus model around
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where they're gonna create open source bug bounties
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So basically, what we're having is you get paid in Ether.
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they're like, oh cool, I just did a bunch of these courses,
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I don't wanna spend hours on Stack Exchange or GitHub.
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Yeah, I'm like, listen, 20 bucks worth of Ether,
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Go answer, within 24 hours, you get your ether.
00:27:05.900
it really takes that whole idea of crowdfunding
00:27:23.260
So it's kind of like, what's that site that would do that?
00:27:27.600
No, they were about like, if it's real news or not.
00:27:31.800
Yeah, so kind of like Snoops, but a little different.
00:27:33.640
Well, Snoops is centralized, controlled by one person.
00:27:37.620
So their bias is definitely going to show up in their editorial.
00:27:40.280
So this is kind of like crowdsourced, unbiased.
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So you create, is it an incubator then, or are the companies?
00:27:49.340
Okay, so the companies are being created through that advisory board.
00:27:53.660
The talent is, I'm assuming, going to come from the training?
00:27:55.580
Yeah, there's going to be a bunch who want to apply afterwards, yeah, definitely.
00:28:00.060
Like I said, we're very early in the stage right now,
00:28:02.600
and it's the next four or five years all experimental.
00:28:16.400
what's the thing that you're most excited about
00:28:26.060
in our inner circle, it's like, oh, it's older age.
00:28:35.800
Ray Dalio Bridgewater is $150 billion fund, right?
00:28:41.060
The big national wealth funds from UAE or Dubai,
00:28:43.720
they want to invest in a minimum $100 billion, right?
00:28:48.440
the biggest problem in the crypto space right now is like-
00:28:52.040
So I want to literally train 10,000 devs a year.
00:28:56.100
so let's say it goes from $200 billion to a trillion.
00:28:59.420
That increase is gonna come from the price increase
00:29:04.900
Is there value arguments for that level of demand
00:29:19.020
Yeah, at least right now, Bitcoin and like Monero,
00:29:26.160
You have inflationary rates of 2% minimum per year, times that by inflationary rates of everything else around you comes on average that your dollar has an inflationary rate of 5% per year minimum.
00:29:39.080
So you're just sitting on your money in the bank is the worst possible thing you can do.
00:29:42.500
Yeah, yeah, the day long for it to go to a whole lot of nothing.
00:29:44.100
So a lot of these people are trying to look at it.
00:29:45.620
And plus, crypto is a brand new asset class in general.
00:29:47.940
So they're looking like, how can I hedge my bets against something?
00:29:50.640
At least maybe have maybe 1% to 5% of my portfolio within crypto.
00:29:58.260
Dan and I were talking about cryptocurrency, blockchain technology.
00:30:04.360
Our company, BlockGeeks, focus on training developers online.
00:30:07.100
So if you're like a junior stack developer or even a senior stack
00:30:09.300
looking to learn about whether Ethereum or Bitcoin coding
00:30:14.760
Plus, we're the world's largest blockchain educator online.
00:30:18.060
But the whole notion of the talk Dan and I just had is
00:30:38.320
There's never been a technology like this before.
00:30:41.900
It's just how they stack this technology together
00:30:52.040
and once you do understand it then you can figure out how you can contribute to it we're just at the
00:30:56.040
beginning right now like imagine i always give it the the the comparison to like netscape like
00:31:02.440
netscape came out like what 20 something years ago give or take we're on that stage of the blockchain
00:31:06.840
so we got like 20 plus years to go till we see maturation like look at e-commerce like for
00:31:12.040
example in china 90 of purchases is done on wechat right on mobile but if you look at for example
00:31:19.080
North America I don't even think so it's north of 20% for e-commerce but even e-commerce has a
00:31:23.320
long way to go so we're at the haze we're just at the very beginning of blockchain technology so
00:31:28.360
my advice to anybody regardless of it like I said if you're a developer if you're an accountant if
00:31:33.160
you're a lawyer whoever you are understand the technologies join your local meetup go to