Dan Martell - How To Hire & Retain High Performers For Your Startup

00:00:00.000 That's what humans buy into.

00:00:01.320 They buy into story, they buy into meaning,

00:00:03.360 they buy into the why.

00:00:04.600 The next thing, if you can do that,

00:00:06.240 then connect your story on why you're the person doing this.

00:00:09.720 Not because it's a market opportunity

00:00:11.400 and you're gonna make money.

00:00:25.080 Manish, how's it going?

00:00:26.920 Well, I'm doing great.

00:00:28.280 amazing tell me about your situation what's going on so i run a startup named as traceable

00:00:34.840 it's based out of banglore and uh what we do is that we uh make a entire supply chain in one toolbox

00:00:41.720 let's say tomorrow you go to a premium organic store and buy your dairy like you know the organic

00:00:46.840 milk uh during the point of sale we give you a qr code you can scan the qr code and get to know the

00:00:51.240 entire information where was the milking done which farm was it or what are the information

00:00:55.880 which goes in the farm whether organic practices was done or not the fodder was maintained or not

00:01:01.080 and the supply chain was ethical practice was done model practices was maintained

00:01:05.880 and were the cows feeded healthily where their health was also considered and hygiene was

00:01:11.000 maintained or not all these minute decisions to the consumer to take data driven decision

00:01:16.120 whether to buy the product or not so this is something which you're doing having said that

00:01:19.480 currently i'm doing in textile industry as we speak there are like five plus car consumers

00:01:25.560 using our product in textile industry nordic regions and i'm using blockchain for this to

00:01:31.400 make this happen and yeah that's about me and having said that it's being in an early stage

00:01:36.760 startup and i'm also this is my first startup as well uh being 24 uh i mean there's lots of things

00:01:43.000 which i'm learning with time however i feel there are certain things i can accelerate with the

00:01:46.600 proper knowledge and mentoring so this is where i am at the moment got it so you have a supply chain

00:01:52.360 tech startup it's called traceable yes yes okay in bangladesh india oh no no bangalore bangalore

00:02:02.440 yeah yeah and this is your first startup what questions comes to mind that i might be able to

00:02:09.720 help with uh so how my first question would be that uh how do you have a motivated team all around

00:02:16.760 i mean like you know who looks up to it and building a strong team system however in the

00:02:21.640 startup the first 10 employees are the main crucial ones and how as a ceo i can make sure

00:02:28.840 the team is in the high spirits and ensure that i can have them for a longer time as possible

00:02:34.200 being a startup i have restrictions i can't uh however have them with like i have limited

00:02:38.840 bandwidth in terms of cash which i can be giving them but there's any ways where like members can

00:02:43.720 be motivated and making sure they're there for the longer time so this is it's not like a problem but

00:02:48.680 i wanted to learn this yeah um here's the way i think about building a team is what i've discovered

00:02:58.280 and i've read a ton of books on what motivates people um you know and there's a great book

00:03:04.600 called who by jeffrey smart uh compensation or fortune right he's got i think it's called five

00:03:11.240 f's there's like uh future and fit and family and fortune um and then there's a fifth one i can't

00:03:19.320 remember but you know capital like getting paid what you get paid is not number one right when

00:03:25.880 people join a startup an early stage company the type of person that would want to do that

00:03:32.120 is completely different than somebody that went to university and wants to work at a fortune 500

00:03:37.960 company okay so if you even find somebody that they know applying to that role that it's like

00:03:47.400 a beginning company then they they've kind of self-selected as is kind of like more risk taker

00:03:53.320 more about kind of being exposed to different ideas be willing to develop into the role etc

00:03:59.800 so the question is then how do you keep them engaged right especially when you can't

00:04:05.880 pay them what the market would pay them right how do you get them to show up especially in

00:04:10.840 early days of companies that you're getting your butt kicked right that you know there's good news

00:04:15.560 and bad news and like this is awesome this is bad and it just dude like building a company is like

00:04:21.560 riding a tidal wave like being in a in a like a wave pool where you're just getting beat and

00:04:27.160 you're trying to make progress and you're swimming and then the next wave crashes on you and then you

00:04:30.760 get up and you keep swimming um and the only way to do that is to be able to tell a story

00:04:36.840 that's compelling enough and if i think about it is the story has to be more compelling than the

00:04:42.200 friction okay so the future place that you're trying to create every company exists to solve

00:04:47.320 a problem does that make sense it doesn't matter if you're elon musk and you're going to mars

00:04:51.800 you know creating a multi-planetary species which is the problem he's trying to solve

00:04:55.640 or you're jeff bezos and you're trying to you know give people more options and not you know

00:05:00.760 make people feel like they're restricted in regards to the the decisions and products they

00:05:04.440 buy based on where they're geographically located um every business that's successful

00:05:11.640 only exists because it solves the problem so the job of a founder is to be able to tell that

00:05:18.040 compelling story to attract people that is compelling enough that when there's friction

00:05:24.520 and they hit that friction they're willing to ride through it with you so what you described

00:05:32.280 for traceable is very tactically you know left brain specific what it does and how it works

00:05:40.040 right but you know if i was talking to a potential team member i wouldn't even start with that right

00:05:49.000 and i know you're like trying to give me context to give you advice but i would start with here's

00:05:54.280 the problem i see in the world right so if i ask you this question we'll do this in real time what

00:05:58.600 problem are you trying to solve in the world the products which are using are not ethically

00:06:05.480 based or standard because the consumer wants to know where the product that's that okay so again

00:06:10.040 that is a very uh like specific left brain like here's the reason why it's going to exist but

00:06:16.360 what problem if you don't solve that like what why does the consumer want to know that

00:06:21.720 they want to know the product which they're buying is healthy or not okay so what problem

00:06:28.280 is that solving for them trust okay again they're trying to solve the problem for something bigger

00:06:36.040 so like why do they care why is that important to know uh to make a sustainable practice

00:06:42.760 perfect so they want to create a sustainable future because they believe there's a lot of ways

00:06:46.360 So, do you see how I went from tactically what you do, specifically what the customer

00:06:53.360 is making a decision around kind of like the simple stuff to the bigger meaning behind

00:06:57.280 all of this?

00:06:58.280 Yes.

00:06:59.280 Right?

00:07:00.280 So, the way you would say that is to say, we see a problem in the world where there's

00:07:05.980 a lot of waste and a lot of products being consumed from folks that are making them unhealthy,

00:07:12.480 creating a ton of products, whatever the problems are, okay?

00:07:15.500 think a lot of people are making purchase and decision that's causing a negative future impact

00:07:20.060 and we want to solve that problem okay and it's this big of a problem it's like 83 billion a year

00:07:27.580 plastic creation whatever and i'm involved in a company called pila that makes recyclable

00:07:32.220 polymers right they make a biopolymer build a bunch of products this phone case is a pila case

00:07:38.220 my sunglasses are peel case they don't talk about sunglasses they talk about waste if you go on

00:07:44.220 peelavision.com and you read their website that's the first thing they talk about that's what humans

00:07:49.260 buy into they buy into story they buy into meaning they buy into the why okay so start with your why

00:07:55.980 as simon sinek says and wrote a whole book on this and then the next thing if you can do that then

00:08:02.140 connect your story on why you're the person doing this not because there's a market opportunity

00:08:06.940 and you're gonna make money right that's not gonna get me to want to help you what's gonna

00:08:12.860 it's kind of like you know my um my house manager betty uh i was training for a full ironman

00:08:21.020 okay this past summer two months ago i completed it but prior to that i had a couple half ironmans

00:08:27.500 and i was just doing a lot of racing and she was supporting me she was showing up waking up at

00:08:31.260 five in the morning 4 30 in the morning to set up the race to man the aid station to get my bike

00:08:36.780 ready to get like she was helping me and i remember one day she was just like really excited about

00:08:42.460 this thing i was doing and i just asked her i was like why are you so like eager to want to help me

00:08:49.500 i know i'm paying you but there's a difference between people that show up to do the work versus

00:08:53.020 like you're really thinking through things and being very proactive and i really appreciate

00:08:56.460 but i'm just curious why and she goes i'm just inspired by how crazy of an idea it is that you

00:09:03.980 think that you're just going to run a full iron man like and for her she was just inspired by

00:09:11.340 the fact that she can't even fathom just for context a four kilometer swim and i hadn't i

00:09:16.860 just learned to swim two years prior a 180 kilometer bike ride and a 42 kilometer run in

00:09:24.220 right after each other right and that's that's what people want they want to be inspired many

00:09:33.500 the people that are going to work with you want to be inspired by you how you get there is the

00:09:38.620 the kind of mundane tasks that have to be done but what gets them jumping out of bed and wanting to

00:09:44.940 jump on their laptop and respond to slack messages and get you know go do cold calls

00:09:49.580 to get customers and and help you out is that and if you get really good that's a skill that's a

00:09:56.540 muscle if you get really good at that then you'll be able to attract great people that you could

00:10:04.300 never afford that will stick around with you for years to help you make that dream come true and

00:10:10.700 and my rule is if you if you get that support you have to make it right financially in the future

00:10:16.380 right which is how we do it typically with stock options or whatever but if those people show up

00:10:21.580 and they support you along that journey just promise me you'll make it worth it for them cool

00:10:26.860 Definitely. I mean, like, this paradigm shift, I'm definitely getting good.

00:10:32.180 But that's how you do it. You literally start with why, you start with meaning,

00:10:36.140 you talk about the problem, you talk about why it's important to you,

00:10:38.860 what's your personal story and association to it, and talk about the customers you're serving and

00:10:43.580 why you think it's important to help them out and why they're great people and help the customers

00:10:47.740 make better decisions. And overall, that's going to lead to a better future. I mean,

00:10:51.340 I mean, in our DNA as humans,

00:10:54.260 we have this need to want to make the future better.

00:10:58.380 Why we have kids, right?

00:10:59.980 It's why we want the faster iPhone.

00:11:03.660 It's part of our DNA.

00:11:04.680 It's in our biological programming

00:11:07.380 to want to create a better future.

00:11:10.680 If we didn't have that, we just wouldn't start companies.

00:11:13.120 We wouldn't try to be better humans.

00:11:15.260 We wouldn't read books, right?

00:11:16.840 Like we wouldn't do this stuff.

00:11:18.400 So create, give them a reason to latch onto you for that. But interns are great. When you're

00:11:24.940 starting off, you got no money. Interns, people that are retired, like literally people are

00:11:32.120 retired. They love working with young, eager, motivated entrepreneurs, and they're just sitting

00:11:38.280 around doing not a whole lot. So for you to get an hour of their time once a week or have them help

00:11:41.900 part-time crazy valuable um yeah interns recent grads right a lot of them are willing to forego

00:11:50.860 the big paydays today because they weren't rather the experience that you might be able to provide

00:11:54.700 them so sell against that make sure you mention those things to those people and it's going to

00:12:00.220 get them attracted to working with you definitely i mean no this is what i needed i'm happy i got

00:12:06.380 this answer i'm going to start in like you know implementing this with my work and

00:12:12.060 while i go down back to the board drawing room and come back with these plans the narration

00:12:16.620 which i need to say to the team thank you so much cool anything else i can help with

00:12:22.220 yeah i had a second question was uh right now how um how can we handle the stakeholders i mean

00:12:28.620 right now i have directors other directors who are helping me do the sales in nordic regions and

00:12:34.220 getting me the understanding of textile industry which i'm currently working with however later

00:12:39.020 i'm going into the other industry as well but how is it that can you i mean like you know keep all

00:12:44.940 the stakeholders happy because everyone has a different vision different aligned uh actions

00:12:50.540 which they want to take uh how is it that you can handle that and uh follow-up question to that is

00:12:55.900 that off late uh i'm seeing many attractions many uh potential investors who are reaching out to me

00:13:03.020 and speaking to me how do i select the right one directors as well yeah i mean so is the question

00:13:10.220 how to manage the directors or is it how to choose the right ones in the future i mean like i'm i'm

00:13:17.020 failing at both of this i'm figuring out how to do both of this so so let me start with choosing

00:13:23.020 right so i have this this this concept that what we want to do is find people that have the

00:13:28.300 experience and things that we lack okay and if we want to keep it simple we call these experience

00:13:32.700 buckets right so there might be an experience bucket around technology one around people one

00:13:38.940 around legal one around finance you know these are typically things that most first-time

00:13:43.740 entrepreneurs don't have a mark marketing sales is if i know what i'm good at and i know what my

00:13:50.780 gaps are these missing experience buckets then i can go out to the market and use that as a filter

00:13:57.660 to choose which one of those um people i decide to bring into my team if i have three options

00:14:04.300 this one is the best option because they also have this background that i don't have and it's

00:14:08.380 part of my list of people to be around so that's how i choose i also again when you're starting

00:14:15.660 off you don't have money you know sometimes directors want to get compensated i've literally

00:14:20.700 seen people if they want to sit on boards or get compensated they want to get paid to me those

00:14:25.580 people are quick filters out because the type of people i want around me are willing to get paid

00:14:30.940 in recognition honestly just being associated and praised publicly um but if they did want to get

00:14:37.420 like you know financially compensated then stock options right and they'll win as we win and and

00:14:43.740 investing because a lot of times directors or a lot of people call advisors they add a lot of value

00:14:49.580 for a month and then they go silent so i would never want to just give somebody equity in my

00:14:53.660 business and not have them participate over a long period of time usually for advisors two years

00:15:00.860 um you could even go four years but the norm is about two years so meaning that if you give them

00:15:04.540 one percent equity in your business you know typically it's one year cliff and then monthly

00:15:09.820 best um or you could do monthly best and like if they are really helpful for the first three months

00:15:14.540 and then they're not you might have a conversation with them and say hey you know you mentioned you

00:15:18.060 make all these introductions or you mentioned that you would leave this meeting every week with my

00:15:21.740 team. And that's not happening. You know, I understand life gets busy, but maybe you're

00:15:26.860 not available anymore. And that's fine. I just want to make sure we can reallocate that equity

00:15:30.340 to somebody that can help us get those outcomes. And that's, that's the way I have that conversation

00:15:35.740 with somebody in regards to managing them, you know, especially if you have like a board or

00:15:44.660 whatever, I just believe that your job isn't to report to the board or the board isn't there to

00:15:50.880 report to you per se or report your the board is there to do work so even if i have investors

00:15:57.300 i put my investors to work if i have advisors i put my advisors to work and the trick i do which

00:16:03.600 everybody messes up i don't send one email to everybody i send one email to an individual

00:16:09.560 so if you were on my board manish i'd be like hey manish just want to give you a quick update

00:16:14.220 on the business here's the high level boom boom boom last time we talked you mentioned x would

00:16:20.520 be able to do a b and c let me know attaches the update board deck for context that way i've asked

00:16:28.760 you something specifically right just like literally right now a company i'm involved in

00:16:33.320 um the founder just asked me to make an introduction for him he's putting me to work as he should i

00:16:38.920 teach this it's online on my youtube channel so he's doing exactly what i teach which is he's i'm

00:16:45.320 not here to hold him accountable or to you know police him i'm here to create value for them but

00:16:51.880 they need to do the work to ask me specifically for something they know i know how to do that

00:16:59.320 that's going to create value for the business they're not going to take advantage they're not

00:17:01.960 going to put me to work full time i'm not here to be an employee but you know for a lot of parts

00:17:06.520 it's knowledge or connections those are like the two big areas things that i do for my director

00:17:12.280 sometimes. I'll ask them to interview a key team member. I'm thinking of hiring CTO, CMO, director,

00:17:19.680 like somebody I've never hired before. And I just need somebody kind of have a second opinion. I'll

00:17:23.940 just ask them, like, could you get on? You know, I did this with Mark Cuban. Mark Cuban was an

00:17:27.260 investor in one of my companies. And I was just like, Hey, I'm trying to hire this VP of sales.

00:17:33.140 You know, he's really excited. He was fascinated to find out that you're involved in the business.

00:17:37.580 would you mind giving him a call? No problem. Hey, it's Mark Cuban. Take the job. That's all

00:17:44.000 I needed him to do, right? But you need to ask for those things. So that's how I think of like

00:17:49.560 who to pick, how to compensate, and how to put them to work so you get the most value from the

00:17:53.800 director. Does that help? What did you like best about that? What resonated the most for you?

00:18:02.860 I mean, the fact that sending the mail, making it more customized to individual and

00:18:07.420 uh hearing it out from them i mean uh usually when i send a generic mail i'm putting nobody replies

00:18:14.940 nobody not even one i get but uh here they're compelled to give me a reply and easier to get an

00:18:20.540 action and even having it one-on-one has far more advantages than doing that and there's some

00:18:26.860 practice which i only don't do which i'm seeing many of the other startups as well which they do

00:18:31.820 that and having that kind of association and expecting our directors also to join the force

00:18:40.060 i mean that while they're doing it i would like to make sure that plan is on as well so this is

00:18:46.140 something which i got familiarized and connected instantly when you mentioned that and that's

00:18:50.860 something which i was not going the right way so i'll connect to that as well and i had i had a

00:18:56.860 last question uh being an early stage startup everyone says that you should take one day at a

00:19:01.100 time one day at a time but having said that uh how is it that i can envision myself like five

00:19:06.700 years down the line what should be the company like i mean like i have watched the north star

00:19:11.020 metric of your own video uh which made me into like it put me in more thoughts that i'm not

00:19:16.700 tipped in the right mindset i should be thinking more so when i how can i define myself as a five

00:19:23.660 year ten year kind of a goal to look at myself as a long-term pitcher in that case scenario yeah

00:19:30.940 Yeah, I mean, it's just such a great question. When I started off, I think I was like, you know,

00:19:38.620 I had a few failed companies. And then when I was 24, I started to read books and get mentors. And

00:19:44.840 that's where I started to find my stride in business. But I think for me, the first moment

00:19:50.200 that I can remember when I started to understand the value of having a clear vision for myself

00:19:55.080 was when I read the book, Good to Great by Jim Collins, right?

00:19:59.480 And in that book, he argues this concept called the BHAG,

00:20:03.320 a big, hairy, audacious goal, which is kind of like this.

00:20:06.360 It's almost like setting a goal that you know you could never achieve,

00:20:09.580 but the pursuit of it is one of the big reasons of its value.

00:20:14.100 Again, I point back to Elon because it's the one most people know about,

00:20:17.420 but like getting to Mars, like, sure, he'd like to be there in his lifetime,

00:20:22.240 but there's a good chance that he won't even ever have experienced what he creates. So imagine

00:20:27.760 creating an outcome in a business to achieve something that you, the CEO, will never be able

00:20:35.360 to experience, which is pretty cool. But that to me is like the idea of a BHAG. So once you have a

00:20:41.280 BHAG, then you can work backwards and say, okay, where do I want to be in a year? Where do I want

00:20:46.240 to be in three years? Where do I want to be in 10 years? And that to me is typically the timeline

00:20:51.200 that i like and the key though is to ask the question in a way that removes all the roadblocks

00:20:59.680 most founders are going to choose outcomes based on their their previous history okay so they set

00:21:07.200 goals based on their previous history they don't understand that every year you get better so most

00:21:12.720 people underestimate um or overestimate what they can get done in a year in 12 months but they

00:21:18.080 overestimate or they underestimate what they can get done in 10 years okay so in 12 months they

00:21:23.840 think i'm going to raise a round of funding i'm going to build a team i'm going to have customers

00:21:27.120 and revenue at whatever size and then they don't hit that but then when you ask them where they

00:21:32.400 want to be at this time like at 24 where did i think i'd be in 10 years at 34 um i underestimated

00:21:41.520 because i couldn't understand the idea of compounding knowledge compounding growth

00:21:46.560 momentum right so the key is you know wave the magic wand no limits no constraints what do you

00:21:56.000 want to create in three years 10 years and what's your b head and know that you're not supposed to

00:22:04.160 know how to accomplish that most people make the mistake that if i don't have a sense of how i'm

00:22:09.600 going to do that then i don't think it's right for me to choose something that's crazy but my whole

00:22:14.960 philosophy is my job is to figure out the where and the destination and let the how

00:22:23.040 reveal itself as i go through the journey as i go through the experiences to learn to and all

00:22:28.560 i need to do is figure out how do i get to the next quarter the next quarter the next quarter

00:22:32.080 so i pretty much live my life in these 90 days but i plan with a 25 year b hag and i plan with

00:22:38.560 a 10 year and a three year but i reset every year but i'm only executing in 90 day increments does

00:22:44.160 Does that make sense?

00:22:45.380 So again, my job is to figure out where I'm going,

00:22:47.460 but not worry about the how.

00:22:48.840 The bigger the why, the easier the how,

00:22:51.260 but in a 90-day window,

00:22:52.900 I do need to execute and create that momentum.

00:22:56.320 Does that make sense?

00:22:57.920 Yes, yes, it definitely does.

00:22:59.680 Awesome.

00:23:00.520 So Manish, as we wrap up,

00:23:01.280 I'm just curious, based on the whole conversation we had,

00:23:04.660 what's the number one thing that resonated the most for you?

00:23:08.160 Out of everything we talked about,

00:23:10.300 what did you feel like you needed to hear the most today?

00:23:14.160 The first point, I mean, like connecting with the team members and making sure they, I mean, they connect with me and they go on with the company with respect of how much of the pay is or being with it.

00:23:26.960 Because somebody when I felt after you mentioned that some of the people are staying in the team for that reason, and I had quite judged myself.

00:23:33.300 So through your words, I got to know that.

00:23:35.740 And second thing is that what I thought, second point which you gave, I thought having communications with directors, it's like a rocket science or anything as such.

00:23:43.980 But these are simple hacks, which you mentioned, and this is not, so that is

00:23:48.140 one thing which I wanted, I mean, like I kind of got, uh, very, uh, closely

00:23:53.520 attached to, and which I kind of missed so many days.

00:23:56.460 And those, so these two are my main takeaways and the final thing, which

00:23:59.340 I've got, I guess that was a truth bomb.

00:24:01.520 And, uh, I mean, I just feel, uh, I got a great takeaway from this session.

00:24:06.920 I mean, uh, this need to implement this and make sure the, this knowledge

00:24:11.780 session which i've got uh should be better results from not here on that's my that's what's running

00:24:17.760 in my mind at the moment awesome those are great takeaways honestly it's just one step

00:24:21.460 day over day one foot in front of the other and um just don't lose momentum it's the most powerful

00:24:27.220 force in the entrepreneurial journey just keep that momentum don't don't let the the the setbacks

00:24:33.220 hold you back just keep keep moving it forward and i guarantee in a decade your life will look

00:24:38.560 completely different. Definitely. I'll say to that and thank you so much. I mean like

00:24:44.040 it's a great opportunity for me to be like having a one-on-one conversation with you because

00:24:49.620 not only me, I make my entire team watch your videos to get connected, to understand and

00:24:54.960 the thinking has improved. I mean like most of the ways our thinking strategy or how we send a deck,

00:25:01.880 how we give a demo to the people, how we do the sales part. I mean we look a lot more than what

00:25:07.580 are each members looks like and it's because of your support and someone whom I look up to someone

00:25:12.460 whom I'm learning from last four months I've been following your YouTube channel and LinkedIn post

00:25:18.140 and now to be here one-on-one I mean it's a great takeaway and I'm very confident from tomorrow

00:25:23.900 once it would be a different day for me with this video my rule Manish just so everybody watching

00:25:31.100 understands this is that if you make it to the top it's your responsibility to send the elevator down

00:25:36.700 to the first floor right like if you have any success it's your responsibility to help other

00:25:42.540 people and that's why i try to make my time available for folks following along and that i

00:25:47.340 might be able to support so i just want to thank you for the for being open and willing to do this

00:25:52.380 and uh i hope to hear updates and watch along your journey definitely all right manish have a great

00:25:59.580 day. Talk soon. Peace.

Dan Martell - November 08, 2021

How To Hire & Retain High Performers For Your Startup

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