Now we Know What HAPPENED !!
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Summary
In this episode, Tashdi Flohr and Magnus discuss a recent interview with Michael Gottlieb, the lawyer for Blake Lively, about her defamation case against Ryan Reynolds and the Wayfair Party, and how he handled it.
Transcript
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As long as he can talk about the underground smear machine, he's on a roll.
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Hi and welcome to Flossom Talk. I'm Tashdi Flohr, journalist, Hollywood truth teller,
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and your voice of reason in a town built on the illusion. Magnus is here to help me. I really
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need help today because I could not stop laughing, basically, when we look through this interview.
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so on Friday I think this happened actually that Michael Gottlieb who is Blake Lively's
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main attorney he went on Puck or the town which is the name of the podcast of Matt Belloni
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who is the journalist behind Puck is that right Magnus? Yeah I think so yeah yeah. And we were
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looking through some of the statements that he made in this interview and the best part of this
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I think are the questions because obviously he's answering like he's all over the place trying to
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gaslight us but the fact that Matt Bologna the journalist here really went for it and asked a
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lot of really tough questions and that's why I needed Magnus here to help me analyze this yes
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I'm gonna try not to laugh because watching this was uh if like just trying to find the logic here
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if you can find the logic here you deserve a big medal so let's get into it so at first
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uh matt baloney starts asking uh michael gotley uh how he can say that they won when they basically
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dropped the last three claims after first okay so first she actually had 15 claims just to put
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that out there because some people have forgotten including me that she actually dropped two claims
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um already back in september to avoid to avoid sharing her um personal medical records yes
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basically yeah so she dropped two emotional stress uh claims back in in the fall and then of course
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as you know the judge tossed out 10 of her claims and then she drops her last three ones but then
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michael gottlieb thinks this is victory not just a regular victory but a big big win for big
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leg lively and her five lawyer firms the reason that our client is happy with this settlement is
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because it gives her the power and the opportunity to pursue what we believe is her most potent
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and powerful claim and they gave up everything so they gave up the right to appeal that 400
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million dollar defamation judgment so this is what she wanted from the start yeah so she knew
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that they were going to countersue her apparently after she filed the lawsuit according to this
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logic right or what to what he says she won because he waived the right to appeal the countersuit
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against her but he doesn't say that she also lost her right to appeal no they forgot to mention or
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he forgot to mention that both parties agreed that they wouldn't appeal to come up with this
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to come to this settlement agreement which you know you give up something i give up something
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then we make this public statement that we're going to weaponize and use against you by the way
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but you're not gonna let you know right now but that's what they did and now he's talking about
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how they gave up everything so that so how he's explaining that Blake Lively won is that she can
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still ask for attorney's fee for a countersuit that was a result of her original lawsuit but
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that was the plan all along I'm at my head spinning I can't I can't get right so they were actually
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thinking that when they planned for this lawsuit they were like what if he responds this is a bit
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minority report to me you can sort of you can foresee the future and and possible litigation
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i guess yeah and then you're saying okay if that happens down the line if we sue then that's the
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point of this original lawsuit so nothing to do with all the world's children now or no or digital
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violence or and she doesn't want money by the way we're gonna get back to that later but that's not
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what she's looking for oh no no absolutely not and we also have to remember that when baldonis
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Yes, and Ryan Reynolds and Leslie Sloan was dismissed.
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So he keeps saying that there was no reason for this lawsuit.
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It was frivolous just because the judge dismissed parts of it.
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He dismissed a lot less than he dismissed of Blake's case,
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So one of my favorite parts in this interview is when Matt Belloni sort of,
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You are essentially settling for the opportunity to litigate further.
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And you can see that he has this little smirk all the time when he's asking these questions.
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And you can also notice how Michael Gottlieb is sitting.
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You can see that he's shaking his leg under the table.
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But the logic here is sort of like Putin having a truth with Ukraine to be able to have more war later.
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Like no one should ever, you know, use any weapon against each other.
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But because of a sentence in the peace agreement, we'll start a new war.
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I feel Ryan Reynolds is sitting underneath his desk and like pulling his hair out of his leg while he's sitting there because he looks like he's sweating more and more.
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His face is getting a little red and he's getting really anxious.
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I think he regrets that he said yes to this interview.
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You know, their clients said, you have to, you know, come out and help us.
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He did get rich from doing this for Blake, by the way.
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This lawsuit has never been principally about money for our client.
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It has been about shining a light on this underground smear machine.
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They're sitting like in the underground, basically.
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But they do have internet access down there, though, thankfully.
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But what I find interesting is that she asked for $650 million if it wasn't for the money.
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I mean, isn't that interesting that you choose an amount like that?
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the victims of digital loans and other survivors as well also they hired eight experts to prove
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how much Justin Baldwin and the Wayfair parties owe Blake Lively eight experts who come up with
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different numbers of how much this cost Blake Lively to be so unpopular but it's not about
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the money no no absolutely no no no and also don't don't forget the fact that he uh you know
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that she used five law firms to litigate this or or at least to get close to litigating this and
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then it's not about the money. No no no it's not about the money she spent to try and be popular
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again at least. Sorry I'm laughing. Yeah. Is evidence coming out in our case that has led
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to information being used now in other litigations? This underground smear machine has been exposed
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and people are now on notice. No he's getting a little he's getting his mood back here.
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As long as he can talk about the underground smear machine, he's on a roll.
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I find it so interesting because, as you know today, Magnus,
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it could take you about 10 to 15 seconds to create a smear website about someone online.
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And he's saying that they uncovered this untraceable underground smear machine.
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Yeah, we'll get back to that later, actually, because now also they refuse that they actually accuse them of using bots.
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Just to clarify, we did not allege in our complaint that they attacked with bots.
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But he's not explaining how this actually works, this underground smear machine.
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But he's explaining that because it happened, that he claims it happened in other cases, it must have also happened here.
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because some of the same people from this crisis PR team
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are also accused of smearing someone in other lawsuits.
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But hold on, didn't Blake actually write in a text
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that they're using bots, and Ryan Reynolds also claimed
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No, but now he's saying that they only did that.
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they only said that they use bots to make them look ridiculous and it's they never claimed that
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oh so how did jed wallace actually make these untraceable smear campaigns if he didn't have bots
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how many likes and comments were there on the little bump video so what he was saying which
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we'll get to in another clip here actually is that you can manipulate a video on youtube or tiktok
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by liking the top comments and he and there's no scientific proof because their paid expert
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found this out yes yeah the paid expert that blake lively hired to come up with a theory of
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why people hate her came to this amazing solution or this conclusion that uh we are having a really
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hard time believing but anyways i do think that we've uncovered a lot about how that operation
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works i did say i had a favorite part right did i say that before now i have a new one uh sorry
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but but uh when matt baloney is saying that blake lively suing led to sort of an streisand effect
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and by that he was referring to when barbara streisand sued a photographer for showing her
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house i think it was and it led to that photo being published everywhere and you know talked
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about much much more yeah yeah no one knew about her house before that and no one's seen the
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photograph that this cameraman had taken and then all of a sudden it was everywhere and that's
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exactly what Blake did with this I think it's a great way to explain it actually yeah that it was
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a Barbra Streisand effect you got to understand when reasonable people look at this case and say
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why why did she initiate this case so I don't actually think the data supports what you're
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saying and what I mean by that is what the data supports and this came out in expert reports in
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our case, is that the reaction to Ms. Lively bringing this lawsuit was positive.
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Yeah, he says the reaction to Ms. Lively bringing this lawsuit was initially positive.
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What he means, though, is when the New York Times article was published, everyone was
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Yeah, because everyone was like, wow, this sounds horrible.
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Because it was one side of the story and also it was some cherry-picked text messages that
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And also, they implicated you without evidence, saying you were part of the underground smear machine.
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Yeah, so what happened was that after a week, he came out with all the evidence contradicting everything that she said.
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And according to Michael Gottlieb, that was not the public reacting to all the new evidence.
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that was manipulation by this continuous underground smear machine.
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No one could look at the evidence themselves and see,
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He's basically saying that the public is really, really stupid
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so he basically believes that we are all programmed bots because we cannot have our own opinion
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that's a bit elitist isn't it yes and at the same time he's saying there are no bots but he's
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thinking of human beings as bots the way i see it yeah don't you agree brainless machines walking
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around so if we see someone liking a video we will we will then of course like the video too
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and we will write mean comments and if there's a comment on top of that video that says something
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We will definitely just agree with that without having any questions about it.
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He also keeps calling this lawsuit an improper sham lawsuit.
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The judge never said that this was a sham lawsuit.
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The judge said, you know, on technicalities, you can't countersue her.
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You do have to at least think about whether there is some other strategy to rebuild a reputation.
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I think you got to wait and see what we accomplish in our 47-1 before you write the final chapter of that book.
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I don't know. I said before that I had another. I think this is a favorite, too.
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oh my god um so yeah um people will now change their minds when she wins millions in this
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yeah upcoming new litigation that apparently we we can expect so the logic here is according to
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michael gottlieb that people will not people will change their mind about what they think about
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Blake Wively if she wins this last motion of these attorney's fees so if she gets paid attorney's
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fees according to Michael Gottlieb then the public will start liking her that's exactly what he said
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it's that easy because Matt Bologna as you heard said that is this the best way to rebuild your
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reputation by continuing to litigate and he thinks so yes that's the best way she can
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really rebuild her that was the idea the whole time yeah and as you know magnus one of our
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experts said that it would cost her between 16 i think it was a 14 to 20 million dollars to rebuild
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her image they just need to change the message out there and all of us will believe that she's
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actually a really nice person and this was just a misunderstanding because the top comments on
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some tiktok videos told her not told us not to like her so things are going to change you guys
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just when she gets those fees well it's another reason to while she initiated this fight is that
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she wants to be a role model to other uh victims survivors what was it both yeah um so that was
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the only reason right yeah no yeah she wanted to shine a light oh yeah yeah he wanted to shine a
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light he wanted to shine so other people can do it but then matt's baloney is asking you know
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don't you need like unlimited resources to bring a fight like this on you know to start this to
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hire five law firms and then he's like well no no no not really you know it's just to shine a light
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for other people i mean shining a light on the untraceable underground smear machine that we
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managed to trace i mean i can't and that's the thing because it's so untraceable but michael
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godlyb traced it yeah he doesn't explain how though no but he also knows that if you like
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or comment on a video it's going to go viral yeah if you like the top comments yeah the top comments
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on the video it will go viral because then they're they manage to manipulate the algorithms
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with untraceable digital smear campaigns yeah that's the experts at that the funny thing about
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this is that we're now talking about a video that she made uh in a promotional setting for to push a
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movie and that's the video they say basically brought her down yeah with their logic though
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yeah so by liking something by liking her own words you are participating in an underground
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smear machine are you following along yes i wish he would have asked him actually it was one thing
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i was i wish matt poloni would have asked him like how is it that you know you think that like
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by this theory you think that while you are liking like someone is commenting something negative
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on a youtube video and that gets enough likes everyone that watches that video of you will
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believe the comment and not necessarily believe what they actually watch in the video it's more
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you know you're more manipulated by a comments in the comment section than you are of the actual
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content that's what he's saying we are sheep and then this is the worst parts that they are twisting
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the statements i mean she deserves to be heard amber heard that they're saying that this statement
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that they actually you know they worked on together like matt baloney is saying in this interview
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That statement that you created together where the Wayfair Party said that Blake Lyley deserves to be heard, they chose to weaponize this.
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And this is basically their whole claim now that they're going to try to use to get attorney's fees and damages and stuff.
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By admitting to saying she deserved to be heard, but his logic is that by saying that, her claims can't be untrue, which is complete BS if you look at it.
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does it mean that the murder charges can't be true?
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actually responded to this motion for these fees.
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but the fact that they actually turned around now and they want to amend this whole motion
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to add more to it because amongst other things this statement and use it against them to get
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their attorney's fees it's so disgusting it really is I mean you you yeah remember they had a mountain
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of evidence that they apparently didn't want to show because in that what they said in the beginning
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of the whole case, we have a mountain of evidence
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that's going to surprise a lot of people at trial.
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Yeah, everyone's going to be so surprised by this mountain.
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But now it's all about she deserved to be heard.
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So therefore, it can't be untrue what she says.
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I mean, it's so, like, both sides could use that
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What deserves to be heard means, what it can't mean is that they're fabricated.
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He also said that the Wayfair parties admitted that Blake's claims were in good faith because they said that she deserved to be heard.
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They're getting a lot of mileage out of that little phrase.
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Yeah, and he said that they admitted it was reasonable.
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So he's reading between the lines for us and analyzing this for us, saying that this is how we were planning to use this against them.
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he's not saying what they meant how does how does he know what they meant did he ask
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brian friedman what does your client actually mean by this by that she deserves to be heard
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does it mean that they thought her claims were reasonable uh you know even ballon is is laughing
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at this though it's a bit embarrassing and also saying you know you could you can interpret this
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any any which way you want yeah yeah so and i mean every lawyer i've heard and i also had my
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own lawyer on yesterday, John Genga, who spoke about this as well. He was appalled by the fact
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that they actually used this against him. And then he went on to say that, are you listening to what
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they're saying, the garbage their side is saying? And then Matt Bologna is saying, you can just say
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that it's Brian Friedman you're referring to. So he's basically saying that Brian Friedman is going
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around spreading garbage. And then in the statement, it also says they want people to move forward
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and basically get on with their lives and i guess they're doing this by initiating a new
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by fighting more yeah and he said like oh we we want to move forward so now he's saying that
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because brian friedman did all these interviews you know saying that they had this is a victory
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for them then that's that's not what they planned because they wanted to move forward
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that's why also blake light as you know went to the med gala to move forward yes but
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To start another litigation that's also moving forward in their terms.
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It's interesting, though, that if you read the comments after the Met Gala, they weren't overly nice to her.
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And so does that mean that this underground untraceable smear machine is still ongoing?
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Yes. You can't just turn that off so quickly, Magnus. It takes a while.
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Oh, really? So the bots aren't, oh, sorry, whatever they are that are clicking.
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clicking and don't believe any negative comments you read online no because they're not they're
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manipulated yeah they're manipulated and we know now that one thing that can be done is
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you can manipulate the comment sections of a post in a way that increases or appears to increase
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user engagement with it then they get to this other thing about the stephanie jones and jennifer
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abel lawsuit that's still ongoing so the two publicists are suing each other basically jennifer
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Abel's case against Stephanie Jones is moving forward to discovery. And as you know, Stephanie
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Jones took Jennifer Abel's phone and gave it to Blake Lively, who gave it to the New York Times.
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And according to Michael Gottlieb, that's completely normal behavior.
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Stole her phone. It's established in the record what happened. I mean, the phone was a company
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phone. If I left my law firm or if one of your employees over there left, they have to turn in
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their devices you had a field day with this didn't you you reacted very strongly what he's saying is
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because Matt Paloni said that oh she stole her phone and he's like oh no no no no no she didn't
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steal it she gave it back voluntarily which is a normal thing to do when you leave a company
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he forgot to mention that it's not normal to give your phone to someone that you are in a legal feud
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with basically or it wasn't legal at that point but you are in a feud with to give it to the New
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York Times so for Michael Gottlieb he would be fine and whenever he leaves his company to give
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them his phone and they can take all the content on that all the conversations that he had with
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his clients and give it to New York Times to publish it in a story according to him totally
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totally fine yeah so how did they find out how this merit campaign works Magnus um they found
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that out but they decided not to share that with anyone it has been about shining a light on this
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underground smear machine this underground smear machine has been exposed and people are now on
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notice i do think that we've uncovered a lot about how that operation works my question is then how
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did they do it if they didn't use bots how did they click so many likes on the top comments to
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make that go viral according to this expert if they didn't use bots they know this though yeah
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they got the answers yeah but they're not really sharing it with us maybe it's in that mountain of
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evidence that it makes no sense that they're saying they didn't use any bots don't you agree
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yeah absolutely yeah like how could you like the top comments 78 000 comments or something no but
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how can you like this top comment 73 000 times because my the top comment which this expert
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wrote a lot about which was my video my little bump video got a 73 000 likes on the top comments
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which is what he's saying here that made it go viral and people didn't like like it was not the
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content of the video keep that in mind it was the comment but how could jed wallace click 73 000
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times on that from different accounts yeah you have to you have to click you have to click from
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different accounts you can't just click many times yeah yeah so well his tunnels are big
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he has got a lot of people down there and then he talks about taylor swift at the end here
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which of course michael gottlip says he had nothing to do with anything it was a sideshow
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that they created to drag blake's friends into the mud just to like get the attention away from
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what this is really he forgot he forgot to mention that blake asked her to that blake asked taylor
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to lie for her and apparently she did but that's just a sideshow i also wish that he would ask
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Michael why do you think Blake and Taylor are not friends anymore oh yeah of course that would
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have been the obvious question yeah he did say though I hope she get invited to Taylor's wedding
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or he's saying that to Michael Gottlieb and Michael is going to tell Blake that yeah that so maybe she
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will change her guest list now yeah for sure because this argument between Blake and Taylor
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had nothing to do with this case absolutely nothing so since um Michael Gottlieb is claiming
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We wanted to see how we can explain this in everyday life
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and how you guys can also claim that you're winning things
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that maybe you're not really, but you could use it and twist it a little bit
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But I like this first one that they came up with.
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and then holding a press conference claiming they actually won
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because the refs gave them a decent parking spot.
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This sounds like someone quitting a marathon at mile 18
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because they found a shortcut to the gift shop.
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and it it won't look well for michael gottlieb that's for sure no yeah no this is so embarrassing
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for him i almost feel sorry for him he's got to live with this interview being online
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for the rest of his life my god that sounded very dramatic yeah it did but i mean i i feel like
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imagine what an underground smear machine can do with this oh my gosh i wonder what the top
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comment says on this interview anyways you should all go and watch the interview it's really
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amazing it's a 30 minute long talk it's called the town this podcast and uh yes and don't leave
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a comment though because then you're part of the underground smear machine they will come after you
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all right thank you guys so much for watching and if you haven't subscribed yet please do and
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hit the notification bell so you never miss an episode of awesome talk
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and i'll see you tomorrow and thank you magnus bye