RILEY GAINES PODCAST： Powerlifting and Transgender Athletes： When Records Get a ＂Lift＂
Episode Stats
Words per Minute
173.9615
Summary
April Hutchinson is a Canadian National Team Powerlifter who has represented her country at the World Championships and has competed at the highest level of competition. In this episode, she shares her story of how she got her start in powerlifting and how she overcame a drinking problem that kept her from competing.
Transcript
00:00:03.400
Break through the busiest time of year with the brand new Peloton Cross Training Tread Plus.
00:00:09.700
With real-time guidance and endless ways to move,
00:00:12.280
you can personalize your workouts and train with confidence.
00:00:21.620
Explore the new Peloton Cross Training Tread Plus at onepeloton.ca.
00:00:36.100
Today's guest is a dear friend of mine and a Canadian national team powerlifter.
00:00:42.900
She's done a lot of the heavy lifting herself, no pun intended.
00:00:49.400
Okay, April, I am so glad for you to be joining me.
00:00:57.780
However, how we've both been involved in this battle.
00:01:01.180
You, of course, and Canada, me here in the States, but we see a lot of parallels.
00:01:05.180
And so, I want you to just start by, tell us who you are, tell us what you do,
00:01:10.080
tell us how you got into doing what you do in terms of powerlifting.
00:01:21.600
So, I've been powerlifting for about four years now.
00:01:24.040
And I've always been, like, into sports, like, since a kid.
00:01:29.600
And I kind of dabbled in powerlifting when I was doing my MMA training.
00:01:33.880
So, I've actually done a cage fight before, which is funny.
00:01:37.380
But my coach got me into powerlifting to help with my power and my explosiveness.
00:01:46.240
But the one thing that kind of kept me back from being, I guess, my 100% potential was that majority of my life,
00:01:54.960
I was actually a very, a functioning alcoholic.
00:01:59.920
But, you know, I'd still actually do well at sports, even when I was, you know, in my drinking stages.
00:02:04.980
But, in 2019, I got quite a scare with my health.
00:02:10.640
My doctor basically gave me one year to live if I kept drinking.
00:02:17.560
And when I came out, I literally started powerlifting the next day because I was familiar with it.
00:02:23.740
And I needed something as an outlet, basically, for my health and my mental health.
00:02:27.560
And that was actually right before COVID had hit, too, which was perfect timing because I don't think I would be alive today if I didn't get sober before COVID or have some type of exercise or outlet during that time.
00:02:41.940
And I guess, like, during COVID, I just, I trained.
00:02:47.680
I was working, but, I mean, everything was closed down.
00:02:50.460
So, I literally would train five times a week, two hours a day, and I qualified for the nationals.
00:02:57.060
It was probably one of my first meets was the nationals.
00:02:59.940
And usually, you don't skip, you would know, you don't skip right to the nationals, right?
00:03:09.960
And then, I went to Worlds in my second year, which was last year.
00:03:18.520
So, I did Worlds last year in October, and I've done two North American championships as well.
00:03:28.040
Just out of curiosity, I have to ask, what's your favorite lift?
00:03:34.240
I love the deadlift because I'm basically kind of born to do it.
00:03:41.520
And it's actually the one lift that actually just shows your true, pure strength, which is great.
00:03:53.060
You've accomplished, obviously, some incredible things in really a short amount of time, which is incredibly impressive.
00:03:59.720
What are the kind of issues that you face in terms of, I don't think a lot of people understand that performing and competing at this level, it really is like a full-time job.
00:04:11.480
If you want to do it successfully and if you want to do it well.
00:04:14.680
So, it's hard sometimes to make a living for yourself.
00:04:18.760
So, talk about what that looks like as a female athlete competing at that level and the issues that arise.
00:04:25.120
And the opportunities that we have or, I guess, really don't have being female athletes.
00:04:32.400
So, I'm glad you brought this up because, I mean, I didn't realize just how much work I was, I guess, putting into it and how much, like, my lifting.
00:04:43.140
Like, I work full-time and after work, I train.
00:04:50.240
I'm not in this, I mean, I enjoy powerlifting, but I'm in a competitive sport too, right?
00:04:59.860
But, at my level, I mean, I need to train three to five times a week.
00:05:07.160
Many times I've had to tell my boyfriend, oh, I can't see you tonight or I can't go to this function.
00:05:13.040
I can't go on holidays because I'll miss my training.
00:05:16.680
My diet, like, it's, you would know it's a 24-hour thing.
00:05:21.800
I have my little cheat days, but otherwise, I'm very cautious about how much protein I'm getting, where I'm eating, what I'm eating.
00:05:32.800
It's probably the number one thing is sleep and, which I haven't had a lot of this year just because of all the stress with what I've been kind of battling for.
00:05:40.560
But, yeah, it's a lot, and it's really hard to get sponsors.
00:05:46.640
Like, people think that we just have sponsors, like, handed to us.
00:05:51.840
A lot of the time, you actually have to put something out there and approach companies, right?
00:05:56.740
Like, I got some clothing companies that came to me.
00:05:59.780
Two came to me, but one, I actually went to them.
00:06:01.920
And you really have to be a business lady, really, not just an athlete, but a business person.
00:06:08.140
So I definitely put way more money into the sport than I actually get, and that's fine because I do it, again, just for myself, right?
00:06:23.200
And, you know, after provincials in a couple weeks, I'd like to take a break.
00:06:28.000
I think I'm going to take a little bit of a break and focus more on cardio and cutting some weight.
00:06:32.820
But I definitely need a little bit of a break from it because it is time-consuming.
00:06:38.560
And one thing that I think is really compelling that I've heard you say previously is that even competing for the Canadian national team, right, representing your nation, your country, you even had to pay for your own uniform.
00:06:54.200
And I just say that to show really the lack of funding, the lack of resources that particularly women have.
00:07:03.500
Again, you're competing at the highest level, yet you were still paying out of pocket for your own uniform, which I just think is wild.
00:07:11.900
But it's an important piece to mention because it goes along with the other issues that you and a lot of other women around the world are facing.
00:07:25.380
And my understanding is, of course, you have had to do this.
00:07:28.900
So when is the first time in powerlifting that you had to compete against a male?
00:07:36.340
And how has it progressed to where you are now?
00:07:39.200
So the trans-identifying athlete, Anne, in my federation,
00:07:46.040
I found out that Anne was a male, I think it was back in 2021.
00:07:57.540
We were chatting about Laura Hubbard, the weightlifter that went to the Olympics.
00:08:12.820
Like, he kept on referring to himself as a she-boy.
00:08:15.880
And I was like, I don't know what a she-boy is.
00:08:18.620
And so anyways, I said to Anne, I said, well, it's completely unfair.
00:08:27.080
Are you just doing this for fun at a local level?
00:08:29.040
And he's like, oh, no, I want to go to Worlds and all this stuff.
00:08:36.700
Like, mark my words, I will not shut up about that.
00:08:46.280
I was supposed to compete against Anne at the nationals.
00:08:50.500
And basically, I think there was maybe eight women in the category.
00:08:56.620
Some of them didn't know that Anne was a male, but I certainly knew.
00:09:02.060
So the day of the competition, I actually, the referees were like,
00:09:09.580
And I said, I refuse to show up if there's a biological man in the competition.
00:09:15.020
So that same very day, ICFS and Linda Blade and all the women showed up at the competition
00:09:23.940
And, of course, the president and people there tried to kick them out.
00:09:31.500
And so I've never, I refuse, I will not compete against a man.
00:09:43.260
In my experience, this, at least in the States, it all happened quickly.
00:09:47.500
This whole incident regarding Leah Thomas, it was kind of just thrown on us.
00:09:52.360
I don't even think we really, which this is a pretty lousy excuse, but me being 21 at the time,
00:09:56.900
I didn't even feel like I had enough time to think about what I wanted to do.
00:10:02.300
But looking back, I so badly wish we would have taken more of a stand and really created
00:10:11.660
Again, I think everything happens for a reason.
00:10:13.760
And I think God had me race and the tie and everything.
00:10:18.560
But it's so powerful when you just don't compete.
00:10:22.440
And I wish more people would realize that, more young girls, even more male athletes.
00:10:30.160
And so what you did, what you continue to do, I think is so incredibly admirable.
00:10:35.380
You're one of the very few who are willing to really make that sacrifice.
00:10:41.020
You talk about the diet and the sleep and all those different things.
00:10:44.900
Yet you were willing to step down because you knew, you saw what was at stake if you did it.
00:10:48.840
If you went with it, if you smiled and stepped aside and allowed to really stomp on you guys.
00:10:56.500
Humiliation, and it's not because, you know, I mean, it's a humiliating thing, not to mention
00:11:02.820
There's a lot of different aspects of this where it's just utter violation and an utter
00:11:08.160
But you took a stand, which I think is awesome.
00:11:10.700
Um, just in recent weeks, uh, in the last couple of weeks we've seen now, it really got national
00:11:17.180
news, which is actually kind of helpful to the cause now that this has become a bigger
00:11:23.440
Um, we have seen, and, and we have seen how he broke a Canadian national record.
00:11:28.720
Um, we saw, I believe what I read was an unofficial world record in this women's division of power
00:11:35.900
And so can you, can you walk us through that, just what this means, because I know there was
00:11:40.160
a couple misprints in some articles as well, saying that, and one by 210 pounds, no, and
00:11:45.600
one by 210 kilos, which is top 2.2 times, whatever that 210, it's like 460 pounds.
00:11:55.380
Um, so talk us through that and really what that, what that means on the bigger scale of power
00:12:00.760
So that was like, I think it was last Sunday that was at the Western regionals and I competed
00:12:07.040
three days before Anne was supposed to compete.
00:12:10.900
Now I was really hoping to get my deadlift because if I got my deadlift of 513 or 12 pounds,
00:12:18.360
I knew Anne was going to break that three days later.
00:12:20.820
And I was like, it would have looked great if he actually took my record, but I didn't get
00:12:25.280
it, but it didn't really matter because he went and just crushed it at the regionals.
00:12:29.880
He, he actually holds every single record in the province of Alberta.
00:12:39.960
Now keep in mind, we didn't actually think that Anne was going to go into the masters.
00:12:46.780
It's almost like, it's so bad of him to do that.
00:12:49.160
It's almost like going into the Paralympics and crushing it because like, look at that
00:13:00.780
And he's always been talking like, Oh, I'm not out for records.
00:13:06.680
He's about, he wants to dominate and he wants all the records because he now has all the
00:13:11.140
So, but I honestly think that was the best thing that could have happened.
00:13:15.540
And everyone said it, just let Anne go in and take the records.
00:13:20.020
And then the very next day I was on like Pierce Morgan show, it blew up.
00:13:24.800
And then same week, a week later, we got this news from the IPF, the International Powerlifting
00:13:30.980
Federation that, who I've been working with for like probably a year now, stating that they're
00:13:39.000
So it was perfect timing for everything, to be honest.
00:13:42.420
It's sad that it has to happen and those records, I hope, and should go back to the
00:13:52.260
I'm just going to take this win for now, but that definitely has to happen.
00:13:57.080
But yeah, it was the competitors on that, at that day on Sunday at the competition, three
00:14:06.920
One person cut weight so they didn't have to compete against Anne.
00:14:10.180
One, my friend, Christine, she dropped down to the open category.
00:14:16.460
And one woman on the podium had no idea that Anne was a man.
00:14:19.860
So you talk about people clapping and going along with it.
00:14:24.000
Some people, honestly, Riley, don't even know what a transgender is.
00:14:31.080
And it's almost like when you did your race against Leah, it's like it was so new to you
00:14:37.840
that you, honestly, a lot of people go along with it because we're so, as women, we're
00:14:43.760
And we're just like, oh my God, we don't, you know what I mean?
00:14:52.280
One, I think it's really interesting that you say, Anne, you know, he said, I'm not doing
00:14:57.720
Well, how incredible that you, that you're essentially saying you don't even have to
00:15:05.080
You're still, I guess, in terms of in swimming lingo, blowing everyone out of the water.
00:15:09.800
That that's incredibly impressive, shall we say?
00:15:13.660
But, um, but another thing that I've, of course, you've known about Anne for several
00:15:20.980
years now, and I found out about Anne really through you, um, when we became friends and
00:15:26.600
we started intermingling about the different scenarios and how it pertains to the different
00:15:32.460
And you sent me this video of Anne really mocking women.
00:15:51.840
We all know that I'm a tranny freak, so that doesn't count.
00:15:57.700
She's got little T-Rex arms and she's like 400 pounds of chest muscle, apparently.
00:16:04.380
I mean, standard bench in powerlifting competition for women.
00:16:13.660
If you just listen to that in its entirety, you hear this man, first of all, he acknowledges,
00:16:21.680
you know, he says, I'm, I'm a tranny freak, which I think is an interesting way to refer
00:16:26.940
Um, but secondly, he says, now why is women's bench so bad?
00:16:39.400
So, I mean, that, I know that, that video went viral.
00:16:44.320
And I mean, that's not the first, that was the very first time that he publicly kind of
00:16:49.400
mocked women, but he has continuously mocked women, um, since then.
00:16:53.700
But making a statement like that, that his, his five-year-old can bench more than some
00:16:58.920
women, I mean, that goes to show you just that he's a man, you know what I mean?
00:17:04.560
That just goes to show you the, the major biological advantages that he has.
00:17:11.220
Bench press is always the hardest lift for a woman.
00:17:20.320
So for him to have a 300 pound bench press is crazy.
00:17:25.480
I mean, people, women have it, but I'm talking about women that have trained like world champions
00:17:32.840
Um, so it's, it's just crazy that he actually mocked his own members, like his own teammates.
00:17:39.940
Um, yeah, it's, I mean, it doesn't, doesn't really surprise me coming from a,
00:17:45.300
from him to be honest, that kind of, that kind of hate.
00:17:47.940
So I think it, um, again, outside of even just our, I guess our biological physiological differences,
00:17:55.660
I think this shows the innate differences that we have within our characteristics as
00:18:02.000
Um, as you mentioned, women, we tend to be more agreeable.
00:18:05.160
We tend to be more emotionally involved and apologetic and compassionate and all those
00:18:15.400
They tend to be more aggressive and, and agenic.
00:18:19.560
And I think that's what we see when we, when we listen to and say what he said about women
00:18:25.380
I think that's, um, disgusting to put it totally frank.
00:18:29.580
You talked about the IPF rules very, uh, a few minutes ago.
00:18:34.340
And so I want you to go into what this is, cause this is new news.
00:18:38.340
And I, I don't think people realize, but this is exciting news.
00:18:43.640
Um, so can you talk about what the IPF is and what this ruling means for power lifters?
00:18:54.900
I mean, I would call it, um, like a, yeah, like a little baby win for right now.
00:19:03.300
Well, no, it was actually, I knew this was coming like months prior to them actually announcing
00:19:12.500
So it was actually, I wonder if they waited for Anne to go and take the records.
00:19:19.020
I'm not quite sure, but it came out yesterday that the IPF, uh, emailed the CPU basically
00:19:26.340
with a letter stating that you must align with the IPF transgender policy or you will be suspended.
00:19:33.740
So basically kicked out of, you won't be able to compete internationally or go to worlds
00:19:40.660
So what, what their policy is, is basically you've probably seen it a lot.
00:19:45.680
Um, I think cycling had it prior maybe, but it's testosterone monitoring of 2.4 nanomoles,
00:20:00.360
I know people look at it and go, oh, you know, women aren't a hormone level.
00:20:06.360
The best policy is to obviously make men lift with men, women with women.
00:20:12.460
But still this policy is still stepping up and protecting women because it is a very hard,
00:20:21.140
Like you have to be monitored for a year, then apply.
00:20:24.820
You have to be approved by chief medical staff because you might not even get approved.
00:20:30.480
And then they might say, no, sorry, we want to be monitored for another year before you
00:20:35.760
When you apply, if you get approved, I think there's actually a psychological assessment,
00:20:40.560
uh, component involved, um, continuous monitoring, blood work.
00:20:47.800
I don't think if Ann goes through with it, it'd be another four years before he can actually
00:20:54.280
So it's really the first time this federation has prioritized fairness, um, because before
00:21:07.700
We've seen this with world athletics and cycling, um, the policies they're creating.
00:21:11.760
It's a bold first step, but it's not necessarily satisfactory.
00:21:18.560
We, as women, we're more than a testosterone level, but we do have to celebrate the literal
00:21:25.240
It's what keeps us motivated to continuing on to fight this, this bigger picture, which
00:21:29.920
is of course a broader war on women that actually extends beyond just sports.
00:21:36.920
And I couldn't be more grateful for your involvement there.
00:21:44.020
I think that's, as I mentioned, just extremely admirable.
00:21:49.600
Um, I know, talk about the president here, the, the U S powerlifting president.
00:21:56.380
Um, he's one of the few, one of the few coaches, especially who have really taken a stance against
00:22:03.700
And so can you talk about Larry, um, and what this really looks like for the U S, especially
00:22:08.080
as it pertains to, um, the legal situation surrounding the state of Minnesota?
00:22:14.980
So I really have to commend Larry and you met him too, when we were in Texas.
00:22:18.880
And I think he was at the, uh, the summit to the conference, the other thing too, in
00:22:25.400
I mean, anytime I meet a man that actually steps up and speaks out, it's just like, I think
00:22:30.440
you and me and Marcia are the same, it's just like, wow, like this is so great.
00:22:36.160
He has three girls and his three girls don't actually agree with us, but he said like, look
00:22:44.340
They don't see it now, but anyways, he's very vocal, which I love about him, but no, this
00:22:56.040
Like, um, I don't really want to say too much because I don't, I don't know anything
00:23:00.640
Um, I've heard things about the judge and anyways, it just helps because, and that's
00:23:07.020
why you talk about a small win, because even though it's not the perfect policy, this sets
00:23:14.400
So this is going to affect Larry's case because here you have Canada, which is the most lenient
00:23:22.320
They push inclusion anywhere you go, which I believe in inclusion, but not when it comes
00:23:27.740
So if Canada can do this, you know what I mean?
00:23:31.900
That could show that obviously Minnesota and the States should be doing it too.
00:23:37.080
So no, I think it's going to help this case tremendously for sure.
00:23:42.540
I mean, the CPU is the only federation that actually has an inclusion policy.
00:23:46.880
All the other powerlifting federations in Canada have testosterone monitoring.
00:23:58.060
What does the state of Canada look like right now?
00:24:01.180
Because unfortunately, I think you guys have kind of become the butt of a lot of jokes.
00:24:08.060
Um, we see a lot of videos of what's happening in Canada as it pertains to, again, not just
00:24:13.240
We see what's happening in the education system.
00:24:15.200
We see what's happening, um, in your political sphere up there.
00:24:18.220
We see Justin Trudeau, um, all of these different things.
00:24:24.640
Oh, Canada is, yeah, it's the laughing stock of the world right now.
00:24:29.040
It's honestly the only reason why it's, I used to be proud to be a Canadian.
00:24:34.560
I was always like, oh my God, this is the best country.
00:24:38.400
But ever since Justin Trudeau came in and just basically ruined what a beautiful country
00:24:44.840
we had, um, you know, just pushing and pushing his ideology on, it doesn't matter what it is.
00:24:51.300
It's just, he's just pushing it at every kind of thing.
00:25:01.920
I'm constantly asking her mother, what is she learning in school?
00:25:07.860
I've seen books with like, I don't know if it's grade four, the, the curriculum, like talking
00:25:13.840
about sex positions and books showing kids like, oh, it's just, it's crazy.
00:25:22.220
Um, but I will say myself, I'm very passionate about that topic too.
00:25:27.620
And also women's spaces because I'm a sexual abuse survivor.
00:25:32.080
So I know that when I was sexually abused, when I was six years old, like I had no clue
00:25:38.600
what sex was, what body parts were, anything like that.
00:25:41.740
But when I was sexually abused by my neighbor, after that happened, I went around and I was
00:25:53.600
If I was never exposed to that, I would never even have done that or wanted to be involved
00:26:00.460
So that's what's happening in these schools is like, I know they call it grooming, but
00:26:06.880
They're putting this buffet of sexual like orientations and, and teaching about the body
00:26:14.440
and all this other stuff to kids that shouldn't be doing this.
00:26:21.060
I didn't learn any of that until probably grade eight or even in high school, but we didn't
00:26:27.680
It was like basically STDs straight up sex education.
00:26:31.960
So, I mean, people are speaking up now, like, especially the Muslim community.
00:26:38.260
I mean, we have a bunch of protests coming up in Ottawa and other cities where the Muslim
00:26:43.640
community are really voicing their concerns and being loud about it.
00:26:54.320
So, he has literally single-handedly ruined Canada.
00:27:01.740
Wrapping up here, why is this important to speak up?
00:27:13.440
And I mean, because I got a whole whack of messages because I posted the news about the
00:27:21.000
Even if it's just a little tweet or repost my post, nothing will change if you don't
00:27:30.080
Like, I guess I was kind of like the spokesperson, but I had an army behind me.
00:27:47.580
If you sit back and just go with the flow and just take what's given to you, nothing
00:27:57.300
You know, if you want to, whatever, lose weight and you just sit back and do nothing about
00:28:09.300
And I like how you translate it beyond just this topic, because that really is with anything.
00:28:15.840
I think there's consequences to every decision.
00:28:18.520
And there's same, similarly, there's consequences to not speaking up.
00:28:27.100
I imagine you'll take some time to celebrate, enjoy, before you kind of dive back into this.
00:28:35.300
So right now, I'm just basically training, back training again.
00:28:39.400
I have a new coach, which I'm pretty excited about.
00:28:43.640
And I'm just basically training for provincials.
00:28:47.640
And then I'm going to take a nice little break.
00:28:49.760
I told Marshy today that my boyfriend and I are going to be in Vegas in October.
00:28:53.960
So we're going to celebrate when we go to Vegas.
00:29:08.920
I want to see if they actually align with the IPF.
00:29:12.720
I think everyone's kind of on eggshells waiting for that decision to be made.
00:29:19.420
But I mean, that's the only stuff I have right now in the forecast.
00:29:22.900
But I mean, I'm just going to chill out for a little bit because I haven't slept for two years, I think.
00:29:34.820
Thank you so, so much for coming on and keep us updated.
00:29:40.640
Yeah, I just want to say thank you to you too, Riley, because I mean, you've done so much.
00:29:48.540
And I mean, I'm so grateful for our friendship and hope to see you again.
00:29:52.900
Thank you for listening to the Gains for Girls podcast.
00:29:56.020
You can like and subscribe anywhere where you get your podcasts.
00:29:59.600
If you are a female athlete, if you are a coach or a parent or someone who just wants to help defend the female identity,
00:30:07.520
women's sports, women's spaces, the freedom of speech,
00:30:10.340
you can check out www.rileygainscenter.org for further details on just how to do this.