The NCAA's Flawed Definitions
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Summary
After President Trump signed an executive order banning men from competing in women s sports, the NCAA announced a new policy that was in direct conflict with the Executive Order. In this episode, we speak with former Ivy League All-American Gymnast, Kim Jones, about the new policy and why it's a bad idea.
Transcript
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With a towing capacity of 3,500 kilograms and a weighting depth of 900 millimeters,
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Hello, everybody. Welcome back to the Games for Girls podcast.
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As always, be sure to check us out at OutKick.com.
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That's where you can get all things Games for Girls,
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As you probably know at this point, a few weeks ago,
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President Trump signed an executive order ultimately banning men from competing in women's sports.
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But what we have seen following this executive order,
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which was so beautifully and thoroughly written, by the way,
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we have seen states, number one, states who are simply unwilling to comply,
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who have publicly declared, actually, that they're going to ignore the law.
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States like Minnesota, Michigan, Maine, Connecticut, Washington, Oregon, of course, California.
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One thing we saw this past week was President Trump.
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He was addressing the RGA, the Republican Governors Association.
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We are going to withhold federal funding from any state that is unwilling to comply.
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Of course, Maine was a state that just last week had a man who placed fifth the year prior in the men's division,
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and ultimately would go on to bravely and valiantly win a women's state title.
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But President Trump, that is the type of moral clarity and decisive action and accountability
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that I know people are so glad is finally back in the White House.
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Following his executive order, we also saw the NCAA, NCAA President Charlie Baker,
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pretty immediately the next day after this EO was signed,
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released a statement saying, look, we're going to do what we can to comply with federal law,
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I was quick to applaud the NCAA's movement, but very naive of me,
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because once I looked at this policy, it is terrible.
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We're going to get into that today with a special guest.
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We're going to get into the specifics in this episode with Kim Jones,
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But I think what really drove her, her motivating factor in ultimately deciding to,
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and ultimately deciding to, you know, toe the line with the bureaucrats and the elected officials
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is because her daughter competed in the Ivy Leagues against Will Thomas as well.
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This new NCAA policy is in direct conflict with the executive order
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in regards to definitions, in regards to requests,
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And it's not in line with federal law, that federal law being Title IX.
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And it's in direct conflict with Charlie Baker's promise of a consistent nationwide policy
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Number one, this policy, it removes all accountability from the NCAA.
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Shocker, they don't want to be held accountable or responsible or liable.
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Some of those loopholes would come from the fact that it doesn't define sex.
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Again, I can't believe we have to define these words.
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What we've seen is unelected bureaucrats go through the back door
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and reinterpret these words to mean what they want them to mean.
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And in those provided definitions, it says those are just gender identities.
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How it does qualify sex, though, is by a simple birth certificate.
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It is a dependent policy, of course, which means nothing.
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Anyone with any amount of rationale can understand the problems here because we've learned
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that birth certificates can be forged and made totally fraudulent.
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In all but six states, you can change your birth certificate.
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This new policy, it explicitly allows for both men and women to be on the women's team,
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In this policy, men are still allowed to receive women's benefits.
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Of course, it means access to their locker rooms.
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This policy, in short, it does not and it cannot protect women.
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Any new policy that would be made from the NCAA at this point, some of the things they have to have,
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it has to define these sex-based terms and it has to provide screening or oversight.
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We will get into that, what that means, what is screening.
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We're going to talk about that with Kim Jones right here.
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Well, Kim, thank you for joining the Gains for Girls podcast.
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You have been, of course, I mean, a dear friend of mine over these past few years,
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but someone who has dedicated heart, soul, blood, sweat, tears, all of the things into this mission.
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Partially, I would say largely, actually, because of you were an athlete yourself,
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an All-American yourself at Stanford, but you had a daughter, you have a daughter,
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who competed against Will Thomas as well in the Ivy League championships.
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And so that really kick-started, I think, for you, your passion for protecting women and enforcing reality.
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So thank you for everything, the amount of late-night phone calls that we have been on.
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I swear you just never sleep, but I'm very grateful for you and for everything.
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But today, I wanted to discuss with you, really the expert of this, the new NCAA policy.
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This policy came out following President Trump's keeping men out of women's sports executive order.
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And this executive order, written and signed by President Trump, was thoroughly and beautifully done.
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Charlie Baker, the president of the NCAA, then came out with a statement the next day saying,
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Hey, well, we're going to do what we can to comply with this executive order, new things to come soon.
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They released their new policy, and everyone was very quick to celebrate it.
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Admittedly, even myself, I took to social media very quickly and applauded the NCAA for taking
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what I believe to be the necessary action to protect women's sports.
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But upon actually reading the policy, I realized how wrong I was to applaud the NCAA, to be
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so naive, to believe that they essentially grew a backbone overnight and decided to protect
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And so I wanted to just, number one, of course, your initial thoughts on this policy.
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And then I kind of want to go through it with you and break it down and highlight all of the
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flaws so the general public can get a good look at that as well.
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I mean, it's after the executive order came out and then Charlie Baker gave that, you know,
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he gave a, I mean, it was a pretty good line saying, we're going to get in line with the
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I think everyone thought, oh, you know, fantastic.
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You're not going to skirt to, you know, put alternative definitions in or do it.
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I remember reading at the end of his statement where I said, we stand by to help any athletes,
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you know, that would struggle under this new policy.
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And I was just like, oh, my gosh, again, centering the boys, like still no offer of support for
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the women who have just been thrown under a bus for years now on with their just totally
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I think we all thought when we read those words, here we go, we're going to actually get something
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in place where women are going to be treated well by the NCAA, or at least not well, but
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Everything was in place for the NCAA to do the right thing.
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Yes, so here we are back, actually, like, as we looked at it, realizing that it's a worse
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It doesn't offer any accountability or protection.
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And I agree with you that the president's executive order was spot on and exactly what
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It's just a matter of following that and making sure that policies are in alignment with it.
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And federal law, which we just saw this past week where President Trump, he called out
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He said, look, if you're not going to comply with this executive order, I mean, you don't
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So it's nice to see at least a little bit of enforcement.
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But again, I believe we do have to hold the NCAA's feet to the fire.
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Basically, what this portion does is abdicate the NCAA of all responsibility, basically putting
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the responsibility on the schools or state or federal legislation.
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There's a definitions portion, which goes through and defines things, words and phrases and terms
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we never thought we would have to define and words that they should define that they did
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So, Kim, can you kind of walk through some of the flaws, starting with the definitions
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Because I think this is the most basic, because, again, I can't believe we have to define these
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things, defining things like NCAA women's team or defining things like gender identity in
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this policy where it seems totally unnecessary to define.
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Yeah, I actually think if you don't mind, Riley, let's kick back up just to the title of the
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policy and start there, because that should have been a big tip off.
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This is a policy that automatically centers those with identities there.
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We have no business talking about identities in sport.
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This is categories are based upon they're based upon real biological realities.
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We've got weight classes, we've got Paralympics, we've got sex classes and age, obviously.
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It should be a student athlete eligibility policy.
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And I think that was a key thing to pay attention to at the beginning.
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But instead, it's called the participation policy for transgender student-athletes.
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So to your point, again, centering around athletes who identify, claim to be something other than
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Not a participation policy for women, or like you said, a broader participation policy for
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student-athletes, specifically a participation policy for transgender student-athletes.
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And we all are very well aware that as soon as you're talking about sports and transgender,
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the term transgender, you're talking about men having access to women's sports.
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And then I think just looking at the application part where you said they were really abdicating
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all accountability, that was very clear in there, just even before we got down to the
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substance of the policy, the NCAA exists to create nationwide policy so that we can have
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collegiate sports, so that different states can compete with each other.
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I mean, the point of this is to follow federal law and federal guidelines so that there is a
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level playing field and agreed eligibility stance for all of the schools to follow that doesn't
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So the idea that even in this policy, there would be anything written about, we're going
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to like the states or local, states or local laws could take precedence over this.
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No, this policy needs to be written in accordance with federal law, which would always supersede
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So then let's go, let's go into that right after that.
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They define NCAA men's team, NCAA women's team, mixed team, sex assigned at birth.
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They're defining sex assigned at birth, major red flag.
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They define gender identity and they define transgender.
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Notice, again, just looking at these definitions without even getting into the substance of how they
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are defining these things, they don't define male, they don't define female, they don't
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They don't define sex itself, but they do, in fact, define transgender.
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NCAA, I mean, you can kind of go through them piece by piece if you want, or you can just
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highlight some of the major, major red flags that it doesn't take a legal mind.
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That's something I've heard, you know, I have many years of legal experience.
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It doesn't take a lawyer or anyone with 30 plus years of legal experience to recognize
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And just, even if you just looked at the words that they listed, you should be like, whoa,
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This doesn't fall in line with the executive order.
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And any lawyer with any amount of experience or anyone who's aware of the law can know that
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So, just what you've chosen to define there doesn't offer any protection for women.
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How are you going to talk about a women's category if you haven't defined what constitutes
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Yes, every single one of those definitions is suspect, in my opinion, but the most important
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one is the sex assigned at birth and the gender identity.
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Defining sex assigned, they define sex assigned at birth as a birth record, what's on a birth
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So, without a definition of what sex is or what male or female are in this policy, we
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are, every time they use the term sex assigned at birth, all you need to do is substitute in
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So, there is no, and a birth certificate is not an immutable characteristic.
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And it is not a valid basis for dividing categories because it's a changeable document all around
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Well, specifically in the United States, we know that in all but six states, you can change
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Washington State actually just made it to where you can change your birth certificate
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So, it is something that can very easily be made fraudulent.
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Well, and I think another point that was made to me by a lawyer when I was discussing this
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after going through it, she said that you can't control policy on papers.
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So, whether or not, if as an institution or as a federal government, we say birth records
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are not allowed to be changed anymore, it still can't be the basis for a policy because
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it's not an immutable characteristic, and we can't control it around the world.
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You and I both know, having competed at the highest level in the NCAA, there are a lot of
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foreign athletes that come here to access the world's best opportunities in sports.
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Yeah, and so, we're not going to be able to control what birth records say around the
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world, and we know just from this past Olympics that, you know, passport documents and official
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documentation allowed two men to compete in the Olympics when that was what was used as
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So, we've got all kinds of open doors, whether it's policies in a state in the U.S. or policies
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around the world that allow someone to change their birth certificate.
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We also know that sometimes birth records have errors on them, as does any kind of documentation.
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So, we've got, and that can happen by an accident.
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It can also happen by DSDs, differences of sexual development, where they're, you know,
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we don't have to get into that, but where a child is mistakenly identified as, or observed
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as one sex, but they are the other, and you can't figure, you don't find that out right
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So, there's a whole kind, there's a whole boatload of reasons why we can't use documents as a proxy
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or as a substitute for sex, but it's also a moving target, Riley.
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So, just because one state has, or one country has a policy about their documentation right
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now, we have seen over the last decades that the policy on different documentations, it
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shifts and changes, and it can be changed by different administrations.
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We need something that's unchangeable, and that is your sex, to be defined.
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Now, with this, this under sex assigned at birth that defines gender identity, this was
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a huge red flag to me, because it defines it as an individual's own internal sense of
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Again, number one, unnecessary to define in this policy, because it's saying the policy
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That's how the incivil, at least sex assigned at birth.
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But then it goes on to list examples of gender identity.
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And it defines gender identity as man and woman.
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So, they, when you're saying this policy is supposed to be, those words were very well
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When they chose sex assigned at birth and then defined that term as your birth record, they're
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So, those words were carefully chosen because it kicks the door wide open for a whole host
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of opportunities for men to be in women's sports, because there's no checks, there's no medical
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records, there's no making, there's no oversight on that.
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So, if this policy were to be tested by someone saying, I'm not in violation of the NCAA policy,
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especially under a different climate or a different leadership in the, in government, we would,
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there would, there would be nothing stopping any man from being able to participate and compete
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This, that's, that's just a blatant, like, you could drive a truck through that.
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So, I mean, think about if, if, um, Castor Semenya decided to come and race in track in
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the United States, or it's a, it's a young version of Castor Semenya.
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There's literally nothing in that policy that would stop a man, a full grown man from competing
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And, and you pointed out something to me, uh, when looking at the policy, uh, number
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Uh, and it goes on to, to, you know, go through all of the, the necessary eligibility requirements
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And then it goes on to define and, or, or explain the policy behind what it takes to be
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In bullet point A, there are two bullet points, A and B. In bullet point A is student athlete
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Even when specifically addressing women and the women's teams, still their first priority
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That's if you take their policy at face value that how they expect most people to read it.
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But when you were back up there talking about gender identity, they actually do, um, in
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It's an individual's man and woman is a sense of self.
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So by women's team and men's team, they're not actually referring to men and women.
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This, the whole policy is gender language, gender identity language.
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There's nothing in here we can take at face value.
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That is what it, why it's in such opposition to both the executive orders.
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Um, but really importantly, the sports executive order, there's nothing in here that is foundational
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There's nothing in this policy that is tied to federal law.
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There's not the definition of women in here is incorrect.
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So going to the women's team where they, where they appear to center men, of course, that's
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Like you pointed out that men are explicitly in their allowed membership on a women's team.
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So the women's team already is mandatorily including men and women, no matter what way
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you shake a stick at this, whether you use, you're using the words as you want to, as you
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perceive them to be, or the way they're defining.
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Um, it says here under the practice portion, it says competition, a student athlete assigned
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male at birth, again, referring back to birth certificates may not compete on a women's
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Uh, but for the practice portion, a student athlete assigned male at birth may practice
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on the team consistent with their gender identity and receive all other benefits applicable to
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student athletes who are other otherwise eligible for practice.
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And so Kim, what are some of those other benefits that these males would be able to receive?
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Does that include access to women's locker rooms?
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But the problem is this policy, as it's written, can't be saved with an addendum to explain that
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it can't because by the policy, what you've just written, if you replace, reread that top
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line and it says for male assigned at birth, what they're saying is those with an M on their
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So it doesn't, if I like use a little bit of thought process here, what that means is
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that if I'm a man and I managed to put an F on my birth records, I am allowed to compete.
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But if I'm a man that has an M on my birth records, I'm still allowed all access to opportunities
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that were set aside for women in collegiate sport, including membership on a team and
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I mean, it is the single biggest defining factor in human athletic performance.
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But when you are a member of a team, you have access to a whole host of other things that
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And very obviously, the concerns would be areas where women need privacy and dignity.
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So the locker rooms, which you have a ton of experience with.
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This story, of course, garnered national attention because I wouldn't even say necessarily because
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of the man on the San Jose State volleyball team, but I think more so because of the brave
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women like Brooke Sussler, who is also a part of the San Jose State team, but also the five
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other universities in the Mountain West Conference that ultimately decided to forfeit or boycott
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So but all that to say, what about someone like Blair Fleming?
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Do we know the specifics of what his birth certificate looked like?
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But let's say his birth certificate did say female.
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Is this someone who would still be allowed under this this new current NCAA policy?
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Would he still be allowed to compete on that San Jose State women's volleyball team?
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The reason, according to this policy, why he wouldn't be allowed to.
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Again, this policy has messed up from the foundation.
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The definitions of terms and the explicit allowing of male athletes onto women's teams,
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membership onto women's teams is an immediate no when it comes violation of Title IX.
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So in essence, every single school that adopts this policy is in violation of Title IX.
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Whether or not they allow a man on their team, they are saying that they would allow men to access
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But yes, there's nothing that would stop a Blair Fleming.
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And as you know, Riley, like we're tracking a whole host of young male athletes coming through
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middle school and high school ranks right now, some of whom are are in the process of talking
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They are in states where birth certificate changes have already occurred and would be
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These schools do not know that these young athletes are are young men and there would
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So in this policy, there is no way to question that.
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There has to be a screening mechanism just the same as you would have when you have a
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weight class to say our weight class is 135 pounds or whatever it would be.
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You have to identify what the eligibility criteria is.
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And then you have to put these people on a scale to see if they meet that eligibility criteria.
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For women's sports, you have to say it's for female athletes only.
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And then you have to have a screening mechanism.
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We've seen in the Olympics previously how they how they did.
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I mean, like, I think, like 60 years ago at this point, it was in 2000.
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Maybe it was, I think, 60 years ago that they did have a pretty invasive process where they
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And let this be on record, those in support of strong sex based policy and sex based language
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That is something we hear from the left all of the time.
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I hate to make it, you know, partisan like that.
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But unfortunately, that that is ultimately the way this has become.
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The left says all the time that we want to look inside someone else's pants, which is
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grotesque and disgusting and incredibly invasive.
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So I wanted to you to go a little bit in depth to what this this sex screening process looks
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No, I mean, it would be a cheek swab or a spit test.
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And you'd be testing for the SRY gene, which is not displaying your whole genetics or putting
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anything out there going through anything that isn't already completely legal.
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Even for high school students, it's it's literally a fingerprint.
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So the Supreme Court has already ruled that students, even in high school, can be subject
00:28:54.240
Almost every state, I'm not aware of a state that doesn't require a student, a student to
00:28:59.700
go through a physical in middle school and high school.
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And we do some, I don't know how, if it's all 50 states, but we have, you get to do a
00:29:12.480
In some cases, you do TB tests to make sure that you're OK.
00:29:16.520
So there's all kinds of tests that we require people to go through in order to be eligible for
00:29:24.140
So sports are a, I mean, they're not mandatory and this is optional.
00:29:30.160
So you have to meet the eligibility requirement in order to do requirements, whether it's your
00:29:35.800
grades, whether it's, I mean, there's a whole thing that the NCAA requires you to go through
00:29:41.140
with their portal initially to make sure that you're even allowed to be recruited.
00:29:46.520
So you have to stand on a scale to wrestle in a weight class.
00:29:53.060
And like we said, so the idea that we would give any credence whatsoever to the idea that
00:30:01.780
verifying your sex is an invasion of privacy is insane.
00:30:08.480
It, all that is doing is saying, um, we won't protect women, even though under federal law,
00:30:14.560
we have to, so there's, there's no, um, it's an easier, less invasive, more accurate
00:30:23.480
test, initial screen for sex than almost any other criteria.
00:30:30.000
Um, so you would just spit into a tube, you take a cheek swab, you're testing for the active
00:30:36.420
SRY gene, and you've, and that's going to take care of almost everyone.
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In incredibly rare circumstances, you might get an error or a surprising result, in which
00:30:47.680
case that individual just goes to their doctor to verify that like, here's the situation you're
00:31:00.420
So you mentioned these, of course, the cheek swabs, and it reminded me, I haven't thought
00:31:04.960
about it from this perspective, actually, until you just said this, we had to do every single
00:31:10.840
week, especially those of us who were unvaccinated, like myself, every single week, I had to go
00:31:17.020
into, um, our athletic department and let them swab my nose, stick a Q-tip up to my brain.
00:31:25.600
I believe in 2021, uh, all of the, the student athletes, we had to gather, uh, and kind of
00:31:33.180
It was pretty Orwellian really, when you think about it and each take a step into this room
00:31:38.100
where they swabbed your nose before you were eligible to, to compete.
00:31:42.020
And you mentioned the, these drug screenings you have to do.
00:31:45.240
Uh, when I got drug tested in college, we had to go into this room where a woman stood at
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00:31:52.460
the bathroom stall, she watched you, you had to pull your pants all the way down to your ankles.
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You had to lift your shirt up and do a spin and then pee in a cup while this woman is watching
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00:32:04.540
And that wasn't considered invasive, definitely uncomfortable.
00:32:11.300
And of course it's uncomfortable, but that wasn't considered invasive by my university or by the
00:32:20.000
These are the same people who make the argument that a simple cheek swab or spitting into a
00:32:31.140
It's the, it's the trans activists and the ACLU that want to call this an invasion of privacy.
00:32:41.040
You go in and you make sure that you meet an eligibility requirement in order to do this
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And this is consistent with every other kind of eligibility meeting that we have in sports.
00:32:55.300
My kids had to go through drug screening in high school in order to participate in high
00:33:00.500
And like I said, there are going to be tests coming out in the next year that are dirt cheap,
00:33:13.280
That was massively, this is literally just check a box.
00:33:19.640
Let's make sure that you are not violating the rights of women.
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00:33:27.560
Defining a policy on the basis of sex and then a screening mechanism.
00:33:32.420
Until we have, you know, if the NCAA needs to buy a year to figure this out, it's very easy
00:33:39.220
for them to say, well, the physicals need to have a line on them that says, you know,
00:33:45.940
by this definition that we've, and we've got a very clear definition for female eligibility
00:33:52.600
That they have no reason to suspect that this individual was male at birth.
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And then you have another line of stages, another line that says, you know, under penalty of
00:34:05.260
perjury, I do not, I have, I was born female and I have not altered my birth records.
00:34:10.520
And then you buy yourself a year to put these screening mechanisms in place in a cheap and
00:34:18.420
And then we have accurate reporting for numbers.
00:34:21.340
We know who's female and participating in the NCAA and women aren't stuck in this horrible
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position we've been in looking over their shoulders, wondering who's, who's competing
00:34:35.440
We're not worried about these poor girls, like the ones, the young women at San Jose state
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who were set up to room and undress and take showers where their consent was stripped
00:34:46.120
They didn't know that they were being exposed to a man.
00:34:48.940
It's, we can't continue to put women and women in these positions.
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00:34:56.140
I don't understand, especially with an 80%, with 80% of the public furious at the NCAA over
00:35:04.980
this and believing that women deserve these protections.
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Why wouldn't you just step up and do the right thing?
00:35:11.100
And I think it's important to make the point that the overwhelming majority of female athletes
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I know at least at the Olympic level, there is a statistic done, especially after there
00:35:26.280
were several males, as you described, people with DSDs who the public often refers to these
00:35:32.960
I would challenge that, that language is misleading.
00:35:36.260
These are individuals who are either still male or female with a difference of sexual
00:35:42.380
development, especially after that became very prominent in sports like track and field
00:35:48.580
Women supported this because we want equal opportunities.
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00:35:56.320
Um, I guess kind of like wrapping up here, why is the NCAA, why are they fighting this?
00:36:04.920
President Trump allowed them to really be heroes.
00:36:08.420
That's maybe to put it, you know, it's hard for me to say that knowing all that's gone on
00:36:13.400
behind the scenes and kind of being subjected to, to the villain side of the NCAA, but President
00:36:19.720
Trump presented them on a silver platter, the ability to do the right thing.
00:36:28.620
Yeah, well, I can't answer that question, but I can say that the way the wind is blowing
00:36:35.060
We've already got, we had some screening in some of the international federations that
00:36:39.020
are recognizing this has to happen again in the women's category.
00:36:42.940
Aquatics, World Aquatics has it in their policy from the last Olympics.
00:36:47.300
You know that World Athletics, the largest international federation and most important international
00:36:52.900
federation under the IOC is going to be bringing the cheap swap, cheek swab back.
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It's going to be implemented in several other international federations that we are talking
00:37:09.540
And it's, it's got to be implemented by the NCAA.
00:37:16.800
So I, I don't understand why they're fighting it.
00:37:19.540
And like you said, you know, the public can be very forgiving of people who apologize and
00:37:26.140
reverse course when they recognize and they acknowledge that they've been in the wrong.
00:37:30.340
And there's a real opportunity here with enough voices standing up and saying, look at the harm
00:37:37.620
Like they brought this, they brought this to the public attention.
00:37:42.280
They are not going to be able to just disappear.
00:37:45.100
We're not going to let them just disappear into the night, continuing under the guise of
00:37:55.180
They're going to have to recognize that every single one of the men that have participated
00:38:00.560
in women's collegiate sports were there in violation of federal law.
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Those records and awards, they need to get handed back to women.
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They need to bring the women to the forefront that they've wronged and say, look, we're sorry.
00:38:14.040
We're trying to make it right now and pay their dues and work their way back into good graces.
00:38:21.300
No, which again, we've, we've seen on behalf of the department of education now on behalf of
00:38:27.460
the white house, on behalf of, of the Trump administration, uh, they, they are doing what needs to be
00:38:33.720
done to ensure accountability, responsibility, and transparency on their end.
00:38:40.140
I mean, can the white house hold the NCAA's feet to the fire?
00:38:44.160
Do they have the authority to, to do that, or at least continue to pressure the NCAA?
00:38:52.340
And I think, you know, the white house has the power to pull them in and say, Hey, you're
00:39:03.380
I think it's going to be, um, I mean, we're just getting started.
00:39:07.100
We're a few days out from having read the policy for the real.
00:39:10.480
So the, the anger is just starting to build and no one who's been remotely involved in
00:39:17.400
this fight is going to not make sure that the public is well-informed.
00:39:21.280
So the frustration will build and the pressure will continue to mount that, um, you know, it'll
00:39:26.720
be interesting to see if the NCAA does the right thing or if the white house gets involved
00:39:31.920
and says, yeah, you need to get back to the table here, folks.
00:39:34.980
What shout out to attorney general Ken Paxton, uh, who just this past week filed a, a temporary
00:39:40.920
injunction, uh, to prevent this NCAA policy from taking place as he recognized the glaring
00:39:47.600
The department of education, uh, you know, recognizes the loopholes in a statement that
00:39:54.120
Like, like I've been on Fox several times and these aren't people oftentimes with legal
00:39:58.980
backgrounds and they've asked me, you know, looking at this policy, it seems as if there's
00:40:05.800
If you look at it for, for five seconds, you see the problems.
00:40:09.600
If you go beyond the statement that Charlie Baker initially put out saying that he would
00:40:13.960
ultimately comply with federal law, everyone sees the problems.
00:40:18.480
Uh, so I believe we need to, to keep the pressure on it.
00:40:22.040
We've seen it work, uh, whether it is the NCAA, whether it's, you know, large corporations
00:40:27.880
or businesses or, or other organizations, public pressure works.
00:40:32.580
Uh, that is how ultimately I believe we make change as we, we have to stay on them.
00:40:44.420
Just continue the, I, and I want to reiterate, like you're saying, the department of ed has
00:40:49.020
The white house has called for them to admit their wrongs and fix the records.
00:40:53.920
Um, there really isn't any way escape out of this.
00:40:58.340
And you and I have both spoken to senators offices in the last few days, even it is, it's
00:41:04.780
And I think the biggest lesson from all of this is that truth is not going to stay hidden,
00:41:12.540
And the crazy thing is that the NCAA brought this to the public's attention through Leah
00:41:20.620
And that is the biggest scandal in sports history on the women's side right now.
00:41:26.860
I mean, I would say this eclipses the doping scandals.
00:41:30.480
So there's no way that we are going to just let this drop.
00:41:40.560
It's not going to go away until it's done right.
00:41:45.900
If not now, then when we can't guarantee what happens in four years, we can't guarantee what
00:41:52.060
So we have the ability in terms of, of federal representation for sure to get this done.
00:42:05.300
So we're, I'm grateful for you, Riley, for being such a huge voice, for being so fearless
00:42:14.800
It's been incredible to see the effect you've had.
00:42:18.940
And, um, I just wish you all the luck in the world and stay strong.
00:42:27.740
Thank you guys for tuning into the gains for girls podcast.
00:42:32.200
I hope you learned a lot about the new policy, about the cowardice of the NCAA.
00:42:41.200
I hate that the NCAA is unwilling to do the right thing.
00:42:45.680
Uh, what majority of Americans, what majority of people around the world know to be right
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00:42:57.940
They are legendary fence sitters winking at both sides, uh, but it's up to us, the people
00:43:03.220
to call them out, to continue to hold their feet to the fire, to put the pressure on them
00:43:09.660
Because if we don't, uh, first of all, no one else will.
00:43:12.860
And the NCAA will change nothing because ultimately they don't care.
00:43:17.520
They don't care about, uh, their athletes, especially their female athletes.
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They have made that very clear over the past few years.
00:43:24.560
Uh, so keep the pressure on, we still need to make sure too, that Congress is passing
00:43:30.180
and codifying these bills into law because ultimately the executive order, uh, let's
00:43:35.700
say in four years, God forbid someone like AOC is in the white house.
00:43:39.360
This executive order would be overturned just as quickly as it was implemented.
00:43:43.680
Uh, so we need to make sure that the Senate, uh, undertakes and hears on the floor, the Senate
00:43:49.340
floor, uh, the corresponding bill in the house was HR 28, the protection of women and girls
00:43:55.660
We need this to be done in the Senate to hopefully get on president Trump's desk to
00:44:01.520
So lots of things to, to continue to look out for, uh, to continue to keep the pressure
00:44:06.340
on, but as always, very glad you guys listened.