In this episode, we discuss the current state of the country, the current political landscape, and the future of Canada in the face of foreign interference and corruption within our government and institutions. We also discuss the best path forward for the separatist and loyalist arguments.
00:08:10.440And if you told me in 2010 or 11 that, hey, Marty, a bunch of your taxes as an Albertan
00:08:16.720are being wasted in ottawa i wouldn't have cared uh because i you know i had a pickup truck my
00:08:22.960house my kids were doing well everything was good uh something happened around 2014 we had a small
00:08:29.600downturn in the price of oil and people out east started cheering as if the demise of alberta was
00:08:36.000something good uh we didn't care in alberta we continued on um and then and then all of a sudden
00:08:43.920it became existential the threat to Alberta because we elected Trudeau and in his cabinet
00:08:51.240he had guys like Stephen Gilbeau and others who who suddenly instead of just interfering and just
00:08:59.300abusing us we're we're now almost openly declaring a war against us they don't like me particularly
00:09:07.800because I'm a landowner I drill for oil and gas I own guns I'm a family man
00:09:13.200so um i'm rambling a little bit but canada to me i kind of suspected it was broken because
00:09:22.040a long time ago but it didn't manifest itself in my day-to-day life and when i say broken
00:09:28.780it's because uh as i posted up in the nest if you look at confederation the way it was designed
00:09:35.620adding uh you know it was four provinces to start with and adding a bunch of other provinces along
00:09:41.860the way saskatchewan manitoba bc others it was sort of an afterthought and and the other provinces
00:09:49.400never got a fair deal and a few things put into confederation to try and make it work
00:09:55.340and and i guess we kind of succeeded in making it work for a while but at the end of the day
00:10:01.140i i it today in in 2025 as an albertan to me my conclusion is that canada as designed
00:10:10.420is broken now i know you talked about solutions to me there is a there is a yeah you got about
00:10:17.74030 seconds yeah there there is a path forward if you want it to repair it which is changes to the
00:10:24.980constitution and give all the provinces an equal representation but based on the events that
00:10:30.700occurred in the last couple of weeks in particular you know that i don't see a team canada and i
00:10:36.200don't see that possibility so i'm i'm promoting an independent alberta pause it there oh okay so
00:10:46.820independent alberta to potentially join america as in like be like an independent alberta will
00:10:52.700be the next step to joining america or uh independent no i'm not interested i'm really
00:10:58.460not interested in joining america i'd be proposing an independent alberta but i i should put a caveat
00:11:03.040actually i think every province or or i think the country should break up into about six regions six
00:11:08.480provinces or six countries on their own i i think there's no fixing canada so i would just break it
00:11:14.560up okay and if some if some regions want to join the u.s that's their prerogative but i i as an
00:11:20.560albertan i'm not promoting joining the u.s okay uh and i guess we'll get into that further in
00:11:26.960terms of what your stance is in regards to wanting an american-like constitution or a republic and
00:11:32.000that sort of thing um but uh let's go to cameron cameron are you there can you give your your three
00:11:38.000minutes uh opening statements on what is the best path forward for canada all right well thanks greg
00:11:45.840and and the hosts here for putting this on tonight i'm looking forward to a great discussion so i was
00:11:52.740born in the united states i'm an albertan by choice my family moved here when i was quite young
00:11:58.000And I grew up in Alberta. The historical, traditional young Albertan went and worked in oil and gas. And the benefits of being an Albertan and having the opportunities that were available in this province and have since been continually attacked and denigrated by the rest of Canada for decades, long before I was involved.
00:12:24.780I've got a bumper sticker on my office wall here from 1971.
00:12:30.060It was the rallying cry of the West wants in, and now I believe the West wants out.
00:12:38.520I am focused solely on achieving that.
00:12:43.380I don't believe that Canada can be fixed, and here's the reasons why.
00:12:48.760We have a cultural difference between Eastern Canada and Western Canada, and what I mean by that is the view of self-determination, the strong independence mindset, the desire to be left alone and free to forge our own path, whether that be in a career or otherwise.
00:13:16.940there is a fundamental cultural difference. The individualism of Alberta often clashes
00:13:26.540in Ottawa with the progressive centralized tendencies the rest of Canada seems to embrace
00:13:32.400every single federal election. And I include every election because even when we elect
00:13:38.780conservatives, we often see that play out that there's acquiescence to the Ontario-Quebec
00:13:45.240desire for the institutions and that preservation of progressive policies, whether they be watered
00:13:54.980down from cycle to cycle or not. So there's distinct cultural differences. And if you're
00:14:00.760a historian like me, you dive into why that is, how the West was settled, Alberta, Saskatchewan,
00:14:07.380Manitoba in particular. Largely, there was a large influx of Americans into the West,
00:14:13.960and the east was was several generations prior to that predominantly from from both europe and
00:14:22.300and the loyalists fleeing the 13 colonies so cultural differences number one we have that
00:14:30.280cultural difference creates an irreconcilable difference and many of you have heard me say it
00:14:35.760before but i do believe we are in a irreconcilable difference with the rest of canada we we need a
00:14:41.960divorce here in Alberta, and I'm not a 51st stater. I believe that should be left to the people,
00:14:48.320but right now we need a divorce before we get our dancing shoes on.
00:14:53.560Canada by design is broken because the system was designed originally to ensure that the power
00:15:02.920brokers at the time were able to maintain and exert power over the rest of Canada, which was
00:15:08.280an economic resource colony all right cameron and so to marty's you got 60 seconds here yeah
00:15:14.020so so to marty's point without tripoli senate without judicial reform without a constitution
00:15:23.360instead of instead of our forms of government they're weak canada cannot be fixed and so the
00:15:30.840best thing for canada is alberta to separate forge its own path and lead by example and show canada
00:15:37.840there's another alternative there's a there's a better way all right all right thank you i like
00:15:46.020the idea of you need to divorce ottawa that's a good sort of uh visual for people um all right
00:15:52.700it's so for we're going to go to the loyalist side now um who wants to start fortisax or daniel
00:16:01.100i think we said daniel's going to go first mr tyree can you give us your your three minute
00:16:05.660uh introductory statement uh yeah for sure um so so just to start off on the uh to address any
00:16:19.120any uh trump's statements around annexation uh i do want to just kind of press this the
00:16:26.480point by saying i don't perceive those as serious threats uh i've mentioned this on a previous space
00:16:34.960But I very much believe this is just Trumpian rhetoric in order to expose some of the shortcomings coming out of the Canadian government, specifically around our lack of military capacity.
00:16:47.780In the modern context, the Arctic has become a more active geopolitical zone, and Canada has limited to no ability to control an increasingly important area of the globe.
00:17:01.620and i believe trump's statements around annexing canada is a kind of a coy and classic donald trump
00:17:09.560way of exposing this lack of military capacity so while he's made claims around trade and around
00:17:15.620drugs and immigration and stuff i think the root of the problem is that we don't have
00:17:20.020much uh capacity to control an important part of the globe that affects american trade interests
00:17:27.040as well as american security interests uh it's kind of been a missed part of the the conversation
00:17:33.200uh and the response from the canadian government so in terms of annexation i don't think it's a
00:17:39.200a credible thing that's going to happen it doesn't seem to be a central point of this conversation
00:17:47.040it sounds like we're going to focus more on separation rather than annexation um so i just
00:17:52.960wanted to quickly kind of put my my thoughts on that aside um in terms of our national sovereignty
00:18:02.560our our union as a confederation and our distinction from the united states i think
00:18:08.080my the the root of my position philosophically is that uh any benefits of joining the states
00:18:17.040would be focused on kind of short-term gains. That is a bit too short-sighted. People cite
00:18:28.020things like getting lower taxes, access to the First and Second Amendment as key benefits of
00:18:35.080joining the states. But really, I think what's most important as a nationalist is that we're
00:18:44.580not simply individuals that seek personal gain and satisfaction. We're only the most recent
00:18:53.300iterations of a long heritage of Canadians. And it's our duty as Canadians to preserve
00:19:03.780this nation for the benefit of our people and for the benefit of our descendants.
00:19:08.540And it would be a betrayal to our ancestors to cede this great country that they built to the Americans in order to gain short-sighted interests like I've listed previously.
00:19:26.120It's our duty as Canadians to ensure this country is governed well for the future of our people.
00:19:34.380I completely agree with the separatists on the other side of the floor that the recent governance has been poor and has certainly negatively affected Western Canada, but I don't think the solution to that is separation or joining the states.
00:19:56.760I think the solution is creating a better government that serves the interests of all of our people, Western and Eastern.
00:20:07.140All right. Thank you. Thank you, Daniel Tyree.
00:20:12.340Yeah, I like what you said about it's our it's our duty to, you know, satisfy what our ancestors had built before us.
00:24:57.280saying i've got one if marty doesn't sure go ahead sure so the first question would be the
00:25:07.060first loyalist would be what exactly are you preserving because the nostalgia of what canada
00:25:14.380was hasn't been for several generations the benefits that that benefited a nation that was
00:25:22.700supposed to be governed by ontario and quebec hasn't benefited the rest of canada so what
00:25:28.320exactly are you trying to preserve i can speak to that but daniel if you want to answer if you have
00:25:35.940an answer lead us off yeah you can go ahead for us sure so for sure yeah so when we talk about
00:25:48.020preserving a national identity uh nations are groups of people who share a common heritage
00:25:55.780it's not just a piece of paper it's not necessarily even just living in a place but
00:25:59.860it's belonging to a community it's belonging to a broader ethnic family that you share and this
00:26:04.980concept is normal and commonplace out east in many places people still remember what a canadian is
00:26:10.420growing up as a quebecker is never a question to me what a canadian is it was not passport paper
00:26:14.740It was not someone who could simply move. So when you say, what are we preserving? Well, it's preserving our way of life. It's preserving the values of peace, order and good government. The foundational Canadian values that have defined us for centuries. It's, you know, it's it's our folkways. It's our culture. It's it's our sports. It's our food. It's the way that we live and conduct business. It's the way we trust the law to not break our knees at a traffic stop.
00:26:39.000most of the time when we talk about what is there left to preserve i find that a bit of a loaded or
00:26:45.180at least a redundant question because you could ask that about just about anywhere you could say
00:26:48.700well what is there left in the british state to preserve what is there left for germans to preserve
00:26:52.860if the metric for abandoning our heritage or for abandoning our way of life is we'll look around
00:26:58.680you look at how there's nothing left i mean you could apply that to the u.s as well you could
00:27:02.780apply that to practically anywhere so for me it's preserving the ethnic body of our people
00:27:08.280the canadian people and preserving our way of life and our common culture and heritage
00:27:13.080and and but so if i could add to that like you know confederation to me is 157 years old like
00:27:22.820it's 18 you know it's 1867 somebody said that you know the the west was first settled by whatever
00:27:30.340the northwest mounted police no absolutely not i mean there's been people in the west living here
00:27:35.480you know some of the locals like to say since time immemorial but uh me personally I mean
00:27:42.220I've had I've had ancestors here like I'm you know I was just looking at the family tree I had
00:27:48.620nine generations that were here before sorry eight generations were here before even confederation
00:27:54.640occurred and then and then you know five since so to me this idea of confederation it I don't even
00:28:01.500have an emotional attachment to that so you know i i'm just throwing that out there yeah and i think
00:28:08.600that's why uh fordstacks myself we we bring this back to our identity as an ethnic people uh marty
00:28:16.780we're not just rooting it in confederation our history certainly goes back much further than
00:28:21.620that hundreds of years um and that is something part of what is so beautiful and and worth
00:28:28.740preserving uh now regardless of whether or not the state is accurately representing and preserving
00:28:35.820the uh the entrance of that ethnos i think that's the the crux of the problem that needs to be
00:28:43.300addressed and it goes back to right to the the root of uh where the end of portasacks is a
00:28:49.200uh opening statement uh we need to fix what's broken not just uh throw the yeah yeah the bath
00:28:56.040water and and and and i think that's the debate that we're gonna get into because you know when
00:29:04.200i heard you guys talking we're almost we're almost in agreement i mean we're definitely
00:29:07.900in agreement in terms of the potential of canada or or territory i think we're all in agreement
00:29:16.120that we're not interested in joining the u.s in the short term the debate simply becomes at this
00:29:20.580point is canada um can it be repaired and and that's the debate and so um you know and and and
00:29:30.820can it be repaired and should it be repaired because you know if we're in a discussion and
00:29:35.700if we're in a in a negotiation i mean this is a question i ask the people right now often if given
00:29:41.140what we know today um if it wasn't you know if if if this was 1867 would we join would we have
00:29:49.140formed a confederation knowing what we know today my my my theory is no so i think you know that's
00:29:56.620my debate is it is it repairable or not and people are going to have a hard time convincing me the
00:30:01.900confederation is repairable because as an albertan i don't know what's in it i don't see the value of
00:30:07.880being part of this confederation the there's another aspect that i think critical to address
00:31:06.880created an influx of the loyalist population of Ontario in Quebec
00:31:10.960in the in the late 1700s and there is a cultural difference between east and west but you highlight
00:31:20.160their issue that i think critical to point out and look at this from the short-term game perspective
00:31:27.520all the things that have bowed in the last decade decades of mismanagement and and and
00:31:34.900The subsequent governments that have created policies have, quite frankly, put behind generation, to see that change isn't a short-term gain because they're systems of a broken system.
00:31:53.440So when you see people want to buy taxation or changes of that, it's the system that's broken.
00:32:01.180And the system has created symptoms that attract people today, whether that be separation or statehood conversations.
00:32:11.980Cameron, I think you were rubber banding a bit.
00:32:14.560If we need to drop you down and bring you back up, I'm willing to do that.
00:32:18.860I'm not sure if other people heard that, but Lee and I found it a bit Stephen Hawkins.
00:32:25.300Yeah, he was rubber banding for me as well.
00:32:28.440Okay, so I don't want us to lose our point.
00:32:30.660cameron i'll drop you down and bring you back up okay buddy sorry greg no that's all right i was
00:32:36.660i thought it was only me so i'm i'm i'm glad that uh everyone else was hearing that uh go go ahead
00:32:42.160four seconds oh i was just gonna say that i find i find that there's a tendency in westerners and
00:32:50.260everybody does this right like uh easterners will over exaggerate differences between themselves
00:32:57.300and western canada to make a point uh there's a lot of hyperbole involved i've noticed that
00:33:03.400there's a tendency of many western canadians to overemphasize their degree of ethnic heritage of
00:33:08.080distinction from the east but as i cited in those sources and i took that source from the 2021
00:33:14.020statistics canada census which is made up of self-reported ethnic identification so it's not
00:33:22.240it's not necessarily genetic it's people claiming or saying that they are a certain thing so yes
00:33:28.540did a not insignificant number of European diaspora go to the western provinces yes they did
00:33:34.640were many of them Ukrainian sure they were were many of them German yes they were but even today
00:33:40.580as I said 47 percent of Alberta's population is British and French so these other diasporas are
00:33:47.520not even the majority and on a national level ukrainians are only two percent of the entire
00:33:52.260population self-identified ukrainians germans are only eight percent of the entire population
00:33:57.480um these cultures did not or sorry these groups did not come to define the common culture what i
00:34:03.220would agree with you on is that the influx of american settlers most of whom were from the
00:34:07.780american midwest they're actually around uh from indiana um they were pushed out as the germans
00:34:22.040at least some distinctions, culturally speaking.
00:34:25.620Alberta today has three major cultural political influences,
00:34:29.000and that would be Anglo-Canadians, Anglo-Americans,
00:34:31.720and then you have your European diaspora,
00:34:33.760such as Germans, Ukrainians, Dutch, and Poles, and so forth.
00:34:37.060So to say that the province was sort of unanimously
00:34:39.860of this cultural character is not exactly accurate especially when we look back to the history of
00:34:44.500social credit especially when we look back to the founding of Edmonton and Calgary which were most
00:34:48.540definitely not founded by Anglo-Americans they were very solidly so and to you guys's point
00:34:54.080you might even say that the reason those cities lean left is because they're more Anglo-Canadian
00:34:59.240because they have more of that communitarian character to them but I just wanted to push
00:35:04.020back on the claim that Alberta was you know more so heavily defined by those other European
00:35:09.180diasporas yeah i mean but but you know you you heard me say again you heard me say earlier like
00:35:19.260i've i've literally lived and i've worked in all 10 and i to me regardless of how it happened
00:35:29.380i see six or seven different regions in this country i mean the maritimes are completely
00:35:35.660different than that from alberta then and you know you got alberta and saskatchewan is a group
00:35:41.980you got you've got british columbia that's got a certain culture you got newfoundland which is
00:35:46.900completely i don't know what they are over there but they're their own thing quebec is absolutely
00:35:50.980distinct and then you got a chunk of you know ontario and and whatever so i see six cultures
00:35:57.080i'm not interested i mean sure as a as a historian it's fascinating to try and figure out how they
00:36:03.760came about that way but i you're you're denying a reality they are distinct and so alberta and
00:36:10.800saskatchewan is a distinct place it's a distinct place based on how we came here when we joined
00:36:17.880confederation who came here our climate our geography and a whole bunch of other things
00:36:24.740uh make us a distinct region and that's why and and i'm not like i'm not again it is a divorce
00:36:30.960right a distinct region analogy a distinct region not a distinct nation and i would never deny the
00:36:38.000regional distinctions in canada but to suggest enough to make it a distinct east enough to make
00:36:42.480it a distinct uh culture in a distinct nation i mean we have a different attitude towards work
00:36:48.640we have a different attitude towards entrepreneurship we have a different
00:36:52.160attitude towards guns and hunting and nature than somebody who lives in i don't know nova scotia
00:36:58.640hold on couldn't you make the same argument though of could you could you not make the
00:37:03.400same argument about the inner city of edmonton or calgary versus like rural alberta like i'm sure
00:37:09.540you could find a lot of like you know blue-haired freaks in edmonton who are like we hate guns and
00:37:13.600like all that sort of thing yeah yeah i i hear that's it i've i've heard that argument brought
00:37:19.200up like where do you stop you know how how small do you get right like you do after people say that
00:37:25.220once it's if alberta becomes within another generation we'll split alberta into half
00:37:31.500that that's the potential i mean that's a the balkanization they call it right how small do
00:37:36.540you get and i don't have an answer for that i really don't but i can but as a starting point
00:37:43.140i i can see big regions right now i think an interesting i think go ahead this is a bit of
00:37:50.680oversimplification at the same time like as has just been pointed out there's differences between
00:37:55.900rural areas of the country and metropolitan areas of the country like uh uh you know someone uh from
00:38:03.640metropolitan calgary might have much more in common with someone from metropolitan toronto
00:38:07.620and someone from rural ontario might have much more in common with someone from uh from rural
00:38:13.660alberta there there are regional differences there are rural metropolitan divides across
00:38:20.500this country but at the end of the day i think there's a lot more that brings us together than
00:38:24.620brings us apart uh like if you compare i've done my a fair amount of traveling around the country
00:38:30.400as well and while there are differences we still broadly have this similar lived experiences
00:38:37.780especially compared to people from other countries um there's definitely a shared nation and that is
00:38:44.620to say nation in the purest sense of the world word of people with a shade heritage that have
00:38:50.480been you know uh defined and changed over generations of living in different geographies
00:38:57.100and different climates and so on um but at the the end of the day we're still rooted in that
00:39:03.220shared heritage as a people. And I think protecting that and having a state that
00:39:09.640represents the interests of that is what's most crucial. Another consistent thread here
00:39:18.340seems to be that there is a systemic dysfunction in the roots of confederation.
00:39:27.980And while I think that the Canadian state has been very dysfunctional for generations now, I think the bigger issue is our shared identity crisis, which has more been caused as a result of the influence of the dominance of the American global hegemon.
00:39:57.980particularly impacting us due to our geographic situation being so close to them, creating these economic ties that has dramatically influenced our culture, creating a profound identity crisis across the country,
00:40:17.620which has manifested in a government that has embraced a style of liberalism that doesn't represent the Canadian ethnos anymore.
00:40:34.180And the people are detached from that problem. And to find a solution, we need to kind of return to our roots, return to those principles of peace, order, and good governance in order to have a sort of national renaissance.
00:40:56.180if i could on on that note uh daniel the the notion of peace order and and good governance
00:41:08.360is uh shorthand for take what we give you and fall in line to the west the rest of western
00:41:15.080canada and it's not well the the fundamental challenge here is that a a failure to recognize
00:41:24.520the system itself was designed to utilize western canada as a resource pool or resource colony
00:41:33.700and the lack of desire in eastern canada to relinquish and create an equal effective and
00:41:43.140elected senate or changing the judicial system or changing a parliamentary democracy like 30 other
00:41:52.360members of the commonwealth have to a constitutional republic devolution of powers
00:41:58.080from quebec and ontario to the rest of canada there has been absolutely zero
00:42:03.680interest in west in the rest of canada to do that i don't see that changing and so that's
00:42:12.860that where a desire to change the system by leaving it comes from in the west
00:42:18.560but i think the real practical problems are are poor leadership poor governance i think if we
00:42:28.840didn't have a government that was infringing on firearms ownership if we didn't have a government
00:42:35.520systematically trying to destroy the economy of the western provinces and instead enabled their
00:42:45.140flourishing that western alienation would not be uh a concept uh i think if we had good governance
00:42:52.920in this country there would be no there would be uh no issue with western alienation so just to
00:42:58.200clarify sorry just to clarify what daniel was saying so just to kind of simplify it for people
00:43:03.560because you know i'm trying to follow here essentially daniel what you're saying is that
00:43:07.960the sort of alienation of alberta and this sort of uh using them for resources and kind of uh
00:43:15.500taking them out of the conversation or disempowering them in ottawa is actually not how
00:43:20.280the system is designed but it's more just how the actual politicians themselves like make their
00:43:25.820decisions like it's not it's not part of the system but it's actually just the individuals
00:43:30.220in the systems who are kind of imposing this or kind of creating this uh disadvantage and
00:43:35.540disenfranchisement uh to the west is that a good simplification
00:43:39.520sure it's bad leadership so i also i also wanted to push back uh cameron namely that actually were
00:43:49.960two attempts at rectifying this situation and those two attempts were meech lake and charlottetown
00:43:55.300and they were spearheaded by the east the east did try to fix the constitutional problems and the
00:44:02.000power balance in the entire country and both attempts failed because all parties involved
00:44:07.440basically screwed the pooch so we did attempt and the last attempt was Charlottetown in 1992
00:44:15.200it ends up that Manitoba and it was either Manitoba and PEI or Manitoba and Newfoundland
00:44:23.020who didn't sign or didn't ratify the changes but they were effectively torpedoed by everybody
00:44:28.740involved like all premiers were cutthroat all premiers were out for their own provinces
00:44:33.260uh there were attempts so to say that there was no attempt to ever at any point acquiesce to the
00:44:39.060west that's not exactly accurate and and and just to that point um without devolving into
00:44:46.620Meech Lake and Charlotte and Accords and and the details whether that was entirely favorable to
00:44:52.380the West or not on all sides is another debate. But what I would say to Daniel's point, particularly
00:44:59.440on the politicians we elect being the problem, not the system of government, I would challenge that
00:45:06.200because the system of government has allowed multiple elected cycles to bring us politicians
00:45:14.260predominantly supported by the East who have done exactly that. The attacks on industry, the attacks
00:45:20.780on on our way of life and the things that make the west in a unique and distinct culture and
00:45:28.780that's that's a system problem it's not just elected officials it's a system that allows
00:45:33.740those types of politicians to continually be elected and that's what's broken in canada
00:45:38.560i just wanted to take a minute here and interrupt us there's some people in the comments um we will
00:45:44.300be opening the mic after a while after the debate has uh kind of wrapped up and we'll be opening
00:45:49.800the floor okay thank you um i'm breaking up i might have to drop and come back but i want to
00:45:58.320ask one question from uh either danielle or four sacks like oh you got a partner in confederation
00:46:06.240who's unhappy why do you want alberta to stay what do i want alberta to stay because at the end of
00:46:14.500the day regardless about whether or not we sling poo at each other albertans are canadians god
00:46:21.900damn it we're part of the same family we're we we're part of the same nation okay most the vast
00:46:28.040majority of westerners come from back east you yourself included you're a 12th generation franco
00:46:32.860albertan your family would have gone the same time anthony hende was exploring the saskatchewan river
00:46:37.720and because you're a descendant of the feeds of law that makes you and i probably distant cousins
00:46:42.100And that's not even a joke because of how small the French-Canadian population was at that time.
00:46:47.920If you take a DNA test from somebody from Nova Scotia and you take a DNA test from somebody from Nova Scotia.
01:03:36.660an equal elected and effective Senate would certainly go a long way to solving some of the
01:03:54.160problems that Canada has. Without diving into how Eastern Canada views issues in the West,
01:04:02.800I think a Senate that at least was somewhat equitable would provide a sense within Alberta to look at it and say, well, at least we have a fair shot at expressing our views within Confederation.
01:04:21.480I'm not entirely certain that it would solve all of the problems, but it would be a great first step.
01:04:27.740uh fortisax or uh daniel did you want to jump in
01:04:33.740i'm not particularly passionate about uh senate reform it's not uh an area of expertise by by any
01:04:46.140means uh i'd definitely be be open to uh changes and it's run but i don't think this is the the
01:04:54.180the root of of the problems that we can agree upon uh i i don't think the the senate is a very um
01:05:03.620influential body uh i think it largely goes to rubber stamp things um i don't think any of the
01:05:12.340recent decisions that have negatively infected the west have you know originated or been aggravated
01:05:19.460by the senate um i i think it comes back to to issues of uh of leadership right it's it's justin
01:05:29.060trudeau's um uh uh leadership and policies that have negatively affected uh the resource sector
01:05:39.300and the albertan economy um and uh the the makeup of the senate would have uh i don't think it would
01:05:48.660have stopped uh these policies from from being bloody um but uh i'd have to look at you know
01:06:00.000the voting record of these these bills and if there were slim uh just bills that passed by slim
01:06:07.400margins that have been changed by the by the makeup of the senate um the fact of the matter
01:06:12.760is that the canadian senate is nowhere near as powerful in decision making as the american
01:06:17.340senate is like it's not it's not even really that influential of a body which is why people don't
01:06:21.540really care about it um it's probably also honestly why uh elected senators haven't been
01:06:28.860instituted because if it was that powerful there'd be more of an incentive to reform it
01:06:33.640to have elected senators like a place like the states so i i it's an odd priority it almost
01:06:39.760seems like rhetoric uh from the from the 70s and the 80s uh this sort of uh emphasis on on
01:06:45.680unequal senate treatment when there are much more pressing issues in my view uh and i would agree
01:06:50.400with daniel that i feel that western alienation is primarily the consequence of laurentian elite
01:06:58.400kneecapping uh alberta's ability to make money alberta's ability to raise the standard of living
01:07:04.240and provide goods and services and uh for its people i i'm not so sure the the senate or why
01:07:10.960why the Senate is such a sort of important focus.
01:07:14.900So I just have one question and then I may have to bounce off the call here tonight, Greg.
01:07:20.920But my question for the loyalist side of this discussion is if Quebec and Ontario,
01:07:28.760and God forbid this happens, but if Quebec and Ontario in this election that's coming up here shortly
01:07:35.240and the Laurentian elite decide to double down again
01:07:39.880and select another five-year WEF-sponsored Trudeau-Carney liberal government,
01:07:48.740why should Alberta stick around and see what happens for another five years of this?
01:08:05.840I don't think that the pillars of their foundational beliefs are going to last much longer.
01:08:11.480I believe that there are both internal and external pressures that are forcing them, obviously, from inside and outside to reform and or stabilize the country.
01:08:23.360You know, the National Bank of Canada just announced that we went through a lost decade.
01:08:28.040There's been almost negligible economic growth since 2014.
01:08:31.280This is obviously a problem because we flooded the country with 5 million people in the short span of four and a half years, thinking that it would raise the GDP.
01:08:41.220Instead, it actually collapsed the GDP per capita for the average Canadian.
01:08:45.200The economy is not bigger, and now inflation and cost of living and food and so forth is sky high.
01:13:55.480But I just saw that Harrison, Harrison Faulkner jumped into the space.
01:14:01.580I know he doesn't have that much time, but Harrison, have you been listening?
01:14:05.100Did you want to sort of share your thoughts on what's the best path forward for Canada?
01:14:11.880Should we become part of America or should we try to reclaim our institutions?
01:14:19.140We certainly shouldn't become part of the U.S.
01:14:21.400And obviously reclaiming our institutions. I've been listening and my main concern and my main focus is on preserving Canada.
01:14:37.380Now, I have heard from the Alberta separatist side of this debate issues with confederation that are easy to understand and sympathize with.
01:14:49.460And I've heard proposed solutions that would make it much better.
01:14:53.960And then after hearing these solutions, they then say, well, that's why we need to leave, not try to work on achieving those solutions.
01:15:03.200And the way I see it is, Canada needs to have Alberta because Alberta makes Canada very wealthy, and Alberta has natural resources that are very important to Canada and very important to Alberta.
01:15:19.060Alberta needs Canada for a number of reasons, but mainly because the Canadian government allows Alberta to sell their resources to the global market.
01:15:34.640It brings global trade to Alberta, and it also provides a social safety net, which keeps Albertans doing well.
01:15:45.340Now, there are serious issues with Confederation, and Alberta is not the only region that has major issues with Confederation.
01:15:54.240And they need to be brought forward and discussed and debated.
01:15:58.160But you don't do that by having a defeatist attitude, where once you lay out all the things that would make you essentially drop your position,
01:16:07.120And I think Marty alluded to that, that if Canada allowed, you know, Alberta resources to go to market and got rid of this ideology, this keep it in the ground ideology, and allowed for Albertans to have their firearms and gave them more autonomy under Confederation, I think you said that you would basically have a very difficult argument on your hand.
01:16:26.580if Alberta were to separate, the immediate problems would be significant and the long-term
01:16:33.380ones would be significant as well. For one, it's a major national security threat because
01:16:36.920you either separate and then still remain entirely under the control of the Canadian
01:16:41.840government for national security, for all these other issues, or Alberta separates and is left
01:16:48.140entirely on its own with no established resources to engage diplomatically, engage in the world
01:16:58.220stage, bring your resources to market. These things work together and long-term solutions
01:17:05.100need to be hashed out to make it better. But by having a defeatist attitude, it's completely
01:17:09.700useless to this conversation. If you bring up reasons as to how this can be better solved
01:17:16.420and how Alberta can be better served, then let's go and try to find ways to put those into action.
01:17:22.380This seems to me to be an issue with ideology.
01:17:25.240This seems to be primarily driven by Trudeau government ideology.
01:18:15.640unfortunately Marty it looks like Marty dropped out but I certainly want to hear sort of a little
01:18:22.100bit more of the specifics of because you know everyone gets kind of like carried away with
01:18:26.920this conversation we want a constitution screw the monarchy and like it goes in all these different
01:18:30.720directions but I really want to like paint a picture for people like what the path forward
01:18:34.640looks like Marty I see you're back in here uh did you hear all of Harrison's statement yeah I heard
01:18:40.400it i i just wanted to add one thing to what harrison said like you know we're defeatist
01:18:45.040christ man defeatist like after 157 years of getting the kicked out of you and making request
01:18:51.160after request after request even yesterday when carney came to visit here danielle smith made
01:18:56.920requests and carney basically blew them off and walked away and the and then the mainstream media
01:19:01.900and everybody else shit on us for for for for suddenly you know demanding a fair treatment like
01:19:08.460we're we're defeatist because we've been kicked down this road for so long man like it's not
01:19:14.700this is not a new thing somebody else mentioned it earlier like Meech Lake was a failure
01:19:19.220and and all sorts of previous failures this is not a new problem this is not something like
01:19:24.860we brought up the solutions and the solutions are constantly ignored and somebody else earlier
01:19:30.220talked about yeah do I agree that Trudeau is an aberration absolutely he's an aberration he made
01:19:35.200things a lot worse but somebody telling me keep your fingers crossed there's a tide turning and
01:19:41.640we're going to get in a new guy like i don't get to choose the new guy because when i turn on the
01:19:47.500the when i finally start to see the results of the election at 6 p.m it's already decided so
01:19:53.400it makes us nervous i'm not going to like keep your fingers crossed is not a strategy that the
01:19:59.620next guy is going to be better like i i don't buy that it's easy for you guys to say we're defeatist
01:20:04.800and this and that but we've been abused in this relationship and you're right you guys are
01:20:09.480benefiting man like i've i've tweeted at this extensively like the transfer payments that are
01:20:15.380going out there they over can like we are disproportionately talented to all sorts of
01:20:21.980programs and we get shit on all day are you still there murty you said we get shit on all day was
01:20:32.360the last thing we heard yeah yeah i'm there like uh like i just i just it's it's it's tiring to
01:20:39.360have people tell us that they you know be part of team canada the last three weeks man there is no
01:20:45.760team like you guys like the rest of canada almost forced us actually i shouldn't say almost they're
01:20:51.820in the process of doing it and it might happen literally you want us to not sell our resources
01:20:57.260to the to the u.s to be part of team canada there's no benefit for like i'll take my chances
01:21:04.480on a small on being a smaller nation i don't need the protection of everybody else i don't
01:21:09.780buy that argument i don't buy it one bit did any of the loyalists want to uh jump in and respond
01:21:16.620to that harrison did you want to say anything uh or tyree i see your hands up i and thank you for
01:21:23.380sharing that marty that was a very uh you know passionate uh testimony and i'm sure you represent
01:21:27.940how a lot of albertans feel uh we've been shit kicked for years we're tired of this and crossing
01:21:34.560our fingers doesn't really sound like uh much of a solution um harrison i know that uh did did
01:21:42.980daniel or harrison want to jump in here well i'll just quickly jump in and then i'll i'll let daniel
01:21:50.700take it over because it is uh it is their debate i'll just say an alberta being on its own and a
01:21:58.300separated alberta makes canada weaker and it makes alberta weaker now if this this shit kicking that
01:22:06.320albertans have been feeling is true it's accurate but it can stop basically what i what i gather
01:22:13.260is that alberta wants to have wants to have more equal treatment in the equalization payments
01:22:19.760They want to be able to get all of their resources to market without this green ideology stopping these issues.
01:22:27.660And they just generally want to have more of a say in their long-term destiny.
01:22:33.240That can all be achieved under Confederation, and these ideologies go.
01:22:38.900So this seems to me to really be an issue under this Trudeau government and in previous liberal governments.
01:22:49.760And, frankly, I think the idea that Alberta will be fine on its own is a fake.
01:22:57.820And if Alberta were to separate, Alberta would still be expecting Canada to defend Alberta, to protect Alberta's political sovereignty.
01:23:07.500How do you guarantee that political elections in Alberta won't be compromised without some sort of control and oversight from Canada?
01:23:17.520And how obviously our systems are not great either. But this seems to be an issue with ideology, not with the system, because ideological solutions have been raised here.
01:23:28.680And once the solutions are raised, then the next statement is that's why we have to leave. Not we need to win ideological debate and actually prosper from it.
01:23:38.240That's what I that's what I see here. It's it's it's an issue of ideology, not of the system.
01:23:43.380i'll just hop in on that and um you know because i see a lot of conversations going on
01:23:50.900of the poor pitiful state of this country and i think we we're all here kind of for that we
01:23:56.700share that kind of sentiment and i always because when people see a quick solution i'm always like
01:24:02.620well have we actually confronted has like my worry for separatists for people who just want to you
01:24:09.980know try and join america or for alberta to be independent is i worry of well what's the next
01:24:16.800basket of problems going to look like you know and the path forward we didn't really get into this
01:24:22.940and it because it might get really deep into the weeds but uh like i'm curious like what the path
01:24:28.160forward would actually be to like you know let's say carney gets in and everyone in alberta is
01:24:33.000pissed and they want to separate like like what would that meaningfully look like and what would
01:24:38.560the set of challenges be and for me i feel like the underlying sort of common denominator of
01:24:44.480solving the problems is we need more like patriotic canadians who are willing to put in like the
01:24:51.280white collar work of politicking you know and i i get the frustration of albertans but at the same
01:24:58.440time it's like how many albertans have just kind of like shut their mouths and just like agreed
01:25:03.220with the conservative party of canada and pierre polyev uh without kind of like pushing back
01:25:07.780um against their sort of weakness not being stronger to be the opposition to the liberals
01:25:12.820although a little a lot of my bias is coming through now but i just kind of wanted to to
01:25:17.780share that i definitely want to get uh jason levine's thoughts because i know you're out
01:25:23.300west sir and you have a kind of a good pulse on how alberta feels but first maybe we'll go to uh
01:25:28.560daniel tyree you've had your hand up did you want to jump in
01:25:31.980yeah i'll be quick and maybe uh i don't know if jason's gonna take up the mantle of the the
01:25:40.680the segment or if we're just gonna have a bit of a an echo chamber here uh as as we
01:25:48.160things down a bit um but like we it seems like we kind of been cycling back to this whole thing
01:25:54.040where um the both sides kind of agree generally on the problems um but uh the the solution that
01:26:04.840the separatists offer just kind of ends that we should and this is what i mean when when i
01:26:10.840when i say we're so short-term focused and uh things are not really thought out because uh
01:26:17.160as it has kind of been said like separation is not a simple or or complete solution to the
01:26:24.760the problems that we all agree on um like not only is there no real political support for
01:26:32.280for separation in alberta and i i am not convinced there there ever will be um but unlike quebec
01:26:41.560Like Alberta surviving as an independent country like makes even less sense. It's completely a landlocked province, unlike Quebec. It has no access to global trade routes. They do not have anything like an army or even a provincial police force.
01:26:59.440uh they're nowhere near being able to to stand on their own um i completely agree with harrison
01:27:06.700that canada is certainly weaker without alberta but alberta is is also weaker without canada
01:27:11.960um one of the principal issues with the alberta economy right now is that
01:27:16.580oil is only sold down south and as such they are uh forced to sell at their their resources
01:27:25.940is at a discounted rate and if alberta was an independent country that situation would be the
01:27:32.580same they'd still be dependent on canada to access any sort of global markets or be forced to to go
01:27:38.860through the united states um unless they joined the united states um so i i don't really see it
01:27:46.160as a as a solution uh and kind of uh cam before he left it it was it was just kind of the the
01:27:52.760end point we'll just separate there but like there's there's no political support for it
01:27:59.220there's no it's not it doesn't actually solve the problems uh it just kind of makes them feel like
01:28:07.660they might be better off able to solve better able to solve their problems but like fundamentally
01:28:13.140uh the most important thing to the alberta economy is being able to more effectively export their
01:28:19.280natural resources, mainly oil. And Canada is the key to solving that problem. Yes, we've had
01:28:30.140governments that have been actively aggravating that problem. But the solution is to work together
01:28:38.980with your friends out in the east, like the people here on this call. Common solution that
01:28:47.160works for all of us because it's in canada's interest as well as alberta's interest to
01:28:51.760to get that economic engine revving okay um i'm gonna bring some guests up shortly but i want to
01:29:01.240be respectful of uh marty up north because you've been here for an hour and a half sir and you know
01:29:07.320we've been saying some things about alberta that you know i want to hear your response to some of
01:29:12.260this um do you have much do you have any more time to share marty we'd like to hear what your
01:29:17.780thoughts are yeah well i'll probably like the room is breaking up for me i'll probably stay on
01:29:22.860but i i just want to say this too um there is a growing separatist movement in alberta you like
01:29:30.100there's it it's some people are underestimating just how big it is it is pretty big and we've
01:29:35.860been glancing over a couple of things really quickly i mean i didn't know how much detail
01:29:39.720we wanted to get into but there trust me there are efforts we know that is
01:29:47.480wouldn't be to be the same um the movement that's existing would be wants out you know we would
01:29:54.120separate and we would transform we would we don't know exactly what we would transform into but
01:29:59.640you're right it's not enough for us to just separate and we're aware of that we will and
01:30:04.200so even now as i speak there has been a strong movement you know there was there was something
01:30:08.680called the alberta firewall that was proposed 25 years ago and we know that we need to have our own
01:30:15.480alberta pension plan our own tax collection agency uh things like that we do have a police force it's
01:30:21.880not an alberta provincial police force at this point but we do have sheriffs and we are augmenting
01:30:26.840that so you know that's a whole other separate like it's not people have just said hey let's
01:30:32.200just separate and then try and figure it out there's we we recognize that separation would
01:30:36.600have issues and it wouldn't happen overnight um okay and in the spirit of kind of being solutions
01:30:43.240oriented is there any sort of like provincial parties that are like the separatist parties
01:30:49.960that you that you would crown as like you know keep your eye on these guys or i support these
01:30:54.040guys i think they're going to try to use the leverage of alberta independence to get what we
01:30:57.800want or i missed part of your question greg repeat it is there any what people or groups
01:31:06.200Yeah, people or groups or provincial parties that are sort of leading the charge or that like that you are supporting or keeping your eye on in terms of trying to get Alberta independence or kind of use that leverage to get what they want.
01:31:20.640Well, right now, the we're trying hard to work.
01:33:34.600Yeah, more of a realist or more of a patriot.
01:33:38.300Because what I'd love to see is a Canada new provincial deal.
01:33:42.000So let me have a couple of moments to kind of lay out the foundation of my proposal here, because it's not an argument, because every single thing I heard from both sides are all correct.
01:33:59.620So we weren't at the table during the Confederation creation because we thought Canada was a lovely place to be for security and for prosperity and for trade and a whole bunch of other things, including culture.
01:34:12.000and also the identity of a nationalist country but here's where i'm going to kind of
01:34:19.200let you guys know where i'm coming from i spent half my life in the west and half my life in the
01:34:24.000east my children were born in ontario i was born in manitoba and i'm now raising them in alberta
01:34:29.520so it gives me a very unique perspective on this nation of ours and i love all of these kind of
01:34:35.600provinces i've lived in i do want to highlight just a couple things about the the construction
01:34:41.360of confederation which i think is is kind of the sticking point that a lot of people actually do
01:34:46.300agree on this conversation on both sides when confederation was created we also created the
01:34:52.620supreme court where the by law uh three judges must come from quebec and by a tradition three
01:35:00.280judges come from ontario that's already six out of the nine uh two from the west or northern canada
01:35:07.060and one from the east now the reason why this was done was because at that time canada was a very
01:35:13.220east heavy country with a lot of population industry and trade happening in the east but as
01:35:20.100the last hundred years or so as alberta and other provinces joined the confederation there's been a
01:35:24.980lot of growing up especially in the west bc alberta you can kind of say manitoba has really grown up
01:35:32.500since confederation and that's exactly the purpose of adding us to the confederation and i do think
01:35:38.900what we need is a new provincial deal for all provinces quebec is casting those waters for a
01:35:44.980long time now every time that they have the idea of having a provincial constitution which is
01:35:50.740something that's granted under the canadian constitution each province can have one no
01:35:55.060province really has one at this stage but quebec every time they bring it up does allow it to
01:36:00.100become negotiation power for concessions with ottawa and this is a cycle that's been working
01:36:06.420quite well for quebec and bravo to them because it does allow them to do what they need to do now
01:36:11.780i've had the luxury of having uh jeffrey rath on the phone earlier today so he's the gentleman from
01:36:20.420i've also had him on my show with bruce party drew barnes and cameron davies who was one of your
01:36:26.500our um debaters here today and i've listened to them all very very carefully on what they
01:36:31.780think is the solution here and i i'm going to suggest to you the solution is not the breakup
01:36:37.220of canada into sixth region with alberta leaving i kind of parrot what bruce party from ontario
01:36:44.420suggests which is to have alberta in a position to support independence so there has to be a clear
01:36:53.700and convincing question with a clear response
01:36:56.900and start to follow the current guidelines.
01:39:42.980I think Harrison was a lot closer to the right solution, which is we need to sit down and renegotiate only in after that.
01:39:50.720If there's no solution, then we should be looking at. I would like to have marriage counseling or a constitutional convention.
01:39:58.040OK, OK. And we can certainly go deeper into the weeds on that.
01:40:03.060I brought up two more speakers. I do want to hear from Daniel and Fortisax first, though, to see if you guys have any response to what Jason was just saying.
01:40:12.980And then after that, we're going to go to Chad, uh, Chad Eros.
01:40:16.860I don't know if I'm saying your name right, but I'm, I believe that this is a, you are
01:40:20.780part of the trucker convoy, if I'm not mistaken.
01:40:23.400Um, and we'll get to hear your perspective and then we'll go over to Nathan Cook, who
01:40:27.360I believe is a nationalist, but, uh, did Fortisax or Daniel, did you first want to hop
01:40:32.200in and say anything, uh, about what Jason was just, uh, talking about in terms of the
01:41:12.740i gotta go like just so that we understand the positions of uh of the speakers here we don't
01:41:22.260necessarily disagree with the with the notion that there should be fair treatment the one thing
01:41:27.780and this is true everywhere else and this might be a little spicy it might be a little controversial
01:41:33.440to say but there will always be some degree of a power imbalance the question is how intolerable
01:41:40.700and how unfair will that power imbalance be and that's just a result of pure demographics and
01:41:46.580population size that's what i would say yeah i mean i'm familiar with the the act and like
01:41:58.140You mentioned other provinces jumping all in. Based on the polling that I've seen, I'm very suspect that there's the necessary political support in even Alberta to achieve such a measure. There's definitely no support for it in a province like New Brunswick or any of the maritime provinces.
01:42:18.520um i think a constitutional convention would be a mess the previous then it gets everyone's backs
01:42:27.340up and makes puts everyone uh gets everyone to dig their heels in and become unreasonable instead
01:42:33.340of seeking uh pragmatic solutions to some of these things um i don't think the regional makeup
01:42:42.680Supreme Court is one of the fundamental problems with the governance we've seen in recent years.
01:42:50.460Again, we go back to we need to change the culture to have the proper pressure on politicians to govern better in line with the interests of our people.
01:43:03.440And that will solve the problems that are affecting the past.
01:43:07.400That'll solve many of the problems that we share, East and West.
01:48:51.480uh denny rancor provided us statistic data on the excess mortality of canadians and when our
01:48:58.840value of the oil goes down the rate of suicide drug use and other types of horrible things and
01:49:06.760deaths across canada goes up it's statistically proven that when we have a depression in canada
01:49:12.620economically we actually lose lives so this is not just a ideology conversation as harrison put it
01:49:19.720This is literally about life and death, because the more that we suffer in the country, the more that we actually take our own life and go on the bad road.
01:49:28.020So this is a conversation about fixing Canada, going to counseling, and let's see if we can do this.
01:49:33.580But we will have far more leverage if Alberta and other provinces have voted that they're ready to separate, much like in a divorce.
01:49:40.660If you're ready and talking to the divorce attorneys, it's a little bit more serious.
01:49:45.440So the counseling stage, I think, has to happen.
01:49:47.720And there's no way in my mind, I don't see a path forward where Alberta just unilaterally leaves without Canada's consent, because I think that will turn into a civil war and we are landlocked.
01:49:58.580And that would be a generational problem.
01:50:01.520We'll be failing pain for the next 20 years if that's the road that we went.
01:50:05.080So I do want to see some sort of consent, a new conversation and a financial deal.
01:50:10.100Amazing. Amazing. A triple landing of the plane.
01:56:38.800And I want people to understand something about equalization payments.
01:56:43.680Equalization payments is not a transfer from one provincial government to the other.
01:56:47.900equalization payments comes from paycheck you know how you have source
01:56:52.700where money comes off of your paycheck and then it goes to the government well money comes off of
01:57:00.760um you know workers in the west or basically everybody the government the federal government
01:57:08.580has a pool to you keep breaking up a bit i don't know if you can get find a spot with a better
01:57:16.300reception is that happening other people too no i can hear him pretty good okay yeah i think that
01:57:23.580was a you problem greg uh-oh yeah oh sorry about that yeah no um if i'm breaking up for people
01:57:30.620sorry about that i i actually took myself okay yeah i i took myself off wi-fi didn't happen
01:57:37.220um but yeah the equalization payment i mean there's other revenues that go into funding
01:57:43.720equalization payments including resources um but uh it comes off of uh essentially a large part of
01:57:51.220it people's paychecks we have no choice the only way to stop sending equalization payments is to
01:57:57.340stop paying our personal taxes or businesses can stop taking uh money from deductions from people's
01:58:05.080paychecks but that would take a major like revolution or revolt right for for for um employers
01:58:11.800in the West to say, you know what, we're so fed up with equalization payments that we're
01:58:16.500not going to deduct source deductions from our employees' paychecks and send it to the
01:58:20.540federal government, because that's what actually funds it.
01:58:24.640And so another landmark happened with equalization by a Liberal Prime Minister, and it was Pierre
01:58:31.980Elliott Trudeau, another Liberal Prime Minister, he enshrined equalization payments in our
01:58:40.480actual constant issue it's a constitutional issue and
01:58:47.340basically exploiting rupert's land or the west uh you'd actually have to open up the constitution
01:58:58.400and take it out so it's a constitutional crisis issue because equalization is enshrined in our
01:59:04.820constitution as of 1986 by pierre elliott that's why um two of like well maybe we should just
01:59:15.140i think it's my computer guys this has happened before to you know take profits and take take
01:59:27.880um earnings from the west and transfer it east i'll land the plane there and i i don't know if
01:59:34.980i gave any new information this space opened up or not but yeah thanks
01:59:40.800uh thanks for sharing your thoughts chad i definitely want to hear from uh nathan cook
01:59:48.020but did uh fortisax daniel uh fortisax your hands up did you want to jump in here
01:59:53.040Yeah, I just wanted to correct the record on a number of statements that Chad made. And I wanted to say, you know, I appreciate your contribution to the discussion, as always, for coming up here.
02:00:06.100So while it is enshrined in the Constitution of Canada and while it was enshrined in the Charter of 1982, the fact of the matter is that it's actually been reformed multiple times.
02:00:17.800Most importantly was Justin Trudeau to disseminate more funds from the Western provinces to the East, but Harper actually led a massive overhaul.
02:00:27.960So I think it's better understood as a mechanism of which the federal government has the ability to allocate resources to parts of the country where they're necessary or where they're needed.
02:00:38.720I don't really think there's anything wrong with that.
02:00:40.860I think that that's kind of the prerogative of the federal government.
02:00:44.180Now, obviously, there's been extreme abuse.
02:02:52.000The reforms that Harper did was to change how much natural resources contributed towards the average tax rate calculation.
02:03:06.120So there has been numerous reforms, but the bottom line result is still that money comes from the West and goes East.
02:03:16.200Um, and the other thing is that, um, I think you framed your, um, your, your, uh, explanation of how, uh, there was no formal offer from the U.S. to buy Rupert's Land.
02:03:31.140There, there, what, there, historically, historically there is, um, there were considerations of selling it to the U.S.
02:03:39.540Um, I've, I've read extensively on this, um, but by no means am I a historical expert on this.
02:03:45.420But at the end of the day, you might you might recall that there was a revolt over the sale of Rupert's land to Canada by the Métis people led by Louis Riel, because he said, hey, wait a second.
02:03:58.360We weren't consulted on this. We're prairie people. We weren't told that this land was going to be sold to Canada.
02:04:05.460like what if we wanted to stay sovereign and you know it was such a surprise to some people
02:04:11.140that there was a revolt and louis riel a metis person was hanged for treason for his revolt
02:04:17.780so it wasn't just a cut and dry thing um as much as we you know you'd like to say it was you know
02:04:24.240it was just a nice peaceful transaction um yeah so there there is there was there's um
02:04:31.560actual proof uh that it was a little bit tumultuous
02:21:40.380yeah grab just like i remember like when i was living in vancouver you know it's nothing new
02:21:48.220alberta was trying to get the pipeline going same thing pulling the booze off the shelf in bc
02:21:53.820alberta liquor i forget what year it was but it was about 10 years ago remember that fellas um
02:21:59.900what was it just just uh it was a 2012 or man i'm so you know i'm still living in 2020 to be honest
02:22:13.380because the pandemic and the way our lives got sucked away but i just i'm so like bad with time
02:22:18.320but i'm just guessing like 10 years when we were trying to get the pipeline going to ship
02:22:23.900off the ports of uh through the pacific and vancouver or british columbia blocked it and
02:22:29.700started pulling alberta's liquor off the shelves similar today do you remember that like that
02:22:35.760wasn't it was a while ago but it wasn't that long ago it's you know you're you're not a port you're
02:22:42.240you're you're a province it's landlocked and you're not a port province right so you're you're at the
02:22:48.000mercy of these other provinces and that's what i mean being a separatist you'd be tariffed in
02:22:53.640tax to death right um i i think being a separatist is um you know you if you're you're a separatist
02:23:02.080you don't believe in in being a bloodline you don't believe in bloodline canadians you don't
02:23:05.720believe that we have a natural identity a heritage our own sovereignty and our own independence
02:23:11.400and i get the frustration there i get you got you guys are i i lived out there i lived out there for
02:23:17.400quarter of my life and i i get i get i get that frustration i understand it absolutely absolutely
02:23:24.940um yeah i appreciate that nathan did anybody else want to hop in on on uh i've got some fresh blood
02:23:33.360up here too um greg i've got uh ginger snaps and j remy so uh absolutely go ahead and then we'll go
02:23:41.920to our new guys yeah thanks um i you know i i love uh nathan's um passionate uh you know talk
02:23:50.980about his family you're you're proud that your family helped build this country and um i think
02:23:57.740i think that's where you find common ground with westerners too like my my ancestors came here and
02:24:05.380there was nothing here all the towns all the cities all all the roads everything was built
02:24:10.020by uh people that i know like my grandparents my great grandparents people that i met and knew
02:24:17.940built the prairies like my my family's first winter here was they had to dig a hole in the
02:24:24.060ground and they lived in a mud hut that was their first home was a mud hut to settle the prairies
02:24:29.840because there was nothing here um and i think in that way um uh you know prairie people share the
02:24:38.360same heritage that you do they weren't um they weren't immigrants they were pioneers pioneers
02:24:44.200are different than immigrants because immigrants immigrate to something that's already pre-built
02:24:50.840pioneers build something that was never there in the first place and there's a big difference so i
02:24:57.880my ancestors are pioneers my ancestors built something from nothing and there was nothing
02:25:04.220here and you know people can say you know aboriginal people are here and stuff like that
02:25:08.060But they were nomadic, and in the wintertime, they got the hell out of here because it was too cold.
02:25:14.760And my ancestors built permanent settlements here.
02:25:18.820And, yeah, of course, you know, I can't say all, all, you can't say all Aboriginal tribes left Saskatchewan because there's about 70 to 80 of them, but most of them did.
02:25:30.100And just back to Greg about how, you know, there's just this mass immigration influx.
02:25:37.160I taught at a business school. I taught finance and accounting, which is an ironic thing to teach in a business school because the business schools are one of the main vehicles to take over international students.
02:25:50.800And that whole mass immigration thing is about getting head taxes off of people, billions and billions of dollars of head tax through tuition.
02:25:59.840And what I know from being an accountant in industry is that these people are paying franchises and paying workplaces to do a workplace needs assessment, basically fraudulent workplace needs assessments to apply for foreign workers.
02:26:20.880And these people pay for their jobs. They'll pay between $30,000 and $70,000 to have these fraudulent workplace assessments done for foreign workers so that they can stay long enough to get landed immigrant status.
02:26:36.400It is a massive, corrupt, multi-billion, maybe trillion-dollar corrupt industry.
02:26:46.000And actually, one of the last things Trudeau did is it became so obvious and prevalent, like the corruption was starting to bubble to the top so much that he said, look, we're going to –
02:27:06.400on the foreign worker thing on the foreign student thing i don't know if you guys remember this maybe
02:27:10.800you want to put the clip in the nest about he had to basically admit the corruption behind all of it
02:27:17.020and that they were going to scale it back i do remember yes uh that's a that's a really good
02:27:23.720and interesting thing to bring up um and i also wanted to slide that into how uncanny it is
02:27:31.020that the Liberals had admitted their immigration mistakes
02:27:35.600and even brought up the controversial topic of immigration in general
02:27:39.720sooner than Pierre Polyev and the Conservatives.
02:34:05.760However, America also has its own set of problems when it comes to demographic change as well.
02:34:10.240And for those who don't know, based on current deportation numbers, Obama is actually going to deport more people than the current Trump administration, which is not, I don't think, what MAGA voted for.
02:34:24.440It's not what Trump supporters voted for.
02:34:26.980So if you are a Trump supporter, you're a 51st stater, that is something to keep in mind that Trump is actually not delivering on mass deportations.
02:34:33.360They like they even had signs. The Republican Party had signs, mass deportations as part of their campaigning, and they're not deporting as many people as Obama.
02:34:42.340And so I like the stuff that Trump says, too. But like he's he's actually not delivering on this sort of like nationalistist American first Americans first platform as much as he said he was.
02:34:54.680and that's why a lot of these people who want to separate saying oh my god constitution um yeah
02:35:00.440there's we're just not familiar with the crooks and the bureaucrats south of the border and how
02:35:05.280they could potentially screw you over and and extort you for your resources all the same as
02:35:10.480that's happening in ottawa but um anyway that's all to say i i want to get somebody up here though
02:35:16.500that um is a big 51st stater because because i was kind of it was kind of interesting at the
02:52:18.740When people make an oath to the king, they're making an oath to tradition.
02:52:21.860They're not getting on their knee and saying, King Charles III, I solemnly swear to defend your person and your family, your noble house, like this is a game of thrones or something to that effect.
02:52:39.280But that's not objectively how the Canadian system functions. And to your point where you say that it would actually lead to a more unified country, the reality is having a monarch actually puts an accountable face to the whole system because you can point your finger and say it was this guy's government.
02:53:00.820It was his majesty's government at the time who is directly responsible for the unwise or foolish decisions during this time.
03:01:57.640So if the people sit down and participate, and we are all forefathers in the new system,
03:02:03.140we will put things like recall, real recall, not the fake one that we see here in Alberta at 40%, but 20%.
03:02:09.200We have judges elected, we have senators elected, and we have law enforcement elected
03:02:14.500because it's under that system of republic that they're actually accountable to the people.
03:02:19.480So that answers your question, Greg. Why is the U.S. able to fish out corruption? Well, they actually go after congressmen. They go after senators, the FBI. They actually are accountable to the people. And this is where I think we would actually have a really good chance on fixing Canada and getting rid of this problem.
03:02:36.840And then my last point, because I said three and then I have to run. The king does have power. He's never executed it. And unfortunately, I want to kind of highlight, he should have. He should have executed some power when Trudeau would not listen to the people, when they had genuine concerns in Ottawa.
03:02:53.460and the federal court agrees the Mosley decision was very clear that the government overreached
03:03:02.160they should not have done the emergencies act and they should have liaisoned with the people better
03:03:06.420that's an example of when the in case of emergency break glass and have the king step in should have
03:03:12.760taken place the king should have actually stepped in and had a conversation with Trudeau and said
03:03:17.840no you got to listen to the people but that's where the king's power was not executed and it
03:03:23.100should have been executed so this is a great example of how it is exactly an elite system
03:03:28.700they do work together and i'm sorry i'm going to throw another point because it just hit me
03:03:32.860we just witnessed carney not elected and he's in power and he's in power because of our current
03:03:40.140system he's appointed by the governor general by the request of the party that wouldn't happen in
03:03:46.140a republic it would be the president it would be another person who was elected because the entire
03:03:51.660succession of power is an elected position the head of state of canada is a king not the prime
03:03:58.220minister the head government is the prime minister and currently in canada we have two unelected
03:04:05.180leaders the head of state the head of government that wouldn't happen under a republic so i hope
03:04:10.620those kind of covered some of those questions you had there greg because that is how we get
03:04:14.380true accountability is we have elected people who are accountable to the people in law enforcement
03:04:19.660in the courts and in the senate and right now canada doesn't have that
03:04:23.820all right jason we appreciate your time um i definitely want to hear uh from the loyalists
03:04:32.420after all of that they're they're they're ragging on the king they're ragging on the queen
03:04:36.980they think this system sucks guys what do you think fortisax i want to go to actual actually
03:04:42.320i want to go to daniel first we haven't heard from him yeah go do daniel first
03:04:45.500hopefully he's okay do i sound better this time i think so i had to jump in and out a few times
03:04:53.640can you hear me uh it it sounds good so far yeah okay um i don't know where to start there was a
03:05:01.960lot that went on there uh just i want to rewind to jonathan's point about the u.s like
03:05:10.880the the utopian vision of the american system is like the is on full display like i feel like
03:05:22.960in the not so recent past it would have been very uh much accepted that the the u.s system
03:05:30.880is completely dysfunctional like do we are we going to forget about uh the you know the 2020
03:05:37.860election the the the russia gate persecution of president trump that's completely unfounded
03:05:44.980the weaponization of institutions are we going to pretend that there isn't foreign influence
03:05:50.280in the american system are we gonna we're just gonna like cast off that uh there's issues of
03:05:57.280sovereignty in canada without you know accepting that those same uh issues of sovereignty are
03:06:04.320facing every other western country including the united states like it's it's it's very similar to
03:06:13.240our previous debate earlier tonight about separation it's just we we bring forward a
03:06:20.280bunch of problems with uh the system or uh the politics and then we just point to a solution
03:06:29.240that's kind of half-baked i would say um as if it solves all these problems and doesn't come with a
03:06:37.320myriad of its own um so like i i'm very apprehensive of joining the u.s i think it is as i noted right
03:06:48.560off the top in my opening statements i think it's a portrayal of our ancestors uh i think that they
03:06:56.560had a point when they decided to found this country in stark opposition to the American
03:07:02.120experiment, in lay, entrenching our values of peace, order, and good governance, rejecting
03:07:11.940radical liberalism in favor of tradition and heritage to preserve the interests of our
03:07:22.320canadian people uh and i am very skeptical of how that would persevere if we adopted
03:07:31.320or allowed ourselves to be annexed by our other neighbors um i mostly agree with with
03:07:41.440four sacks i think the the the comments have been made both are a bit uh absurd uh assuming that
03:07:49.860uh american politicians are above corruption because they don't have a specific oath of
03:07:55.580secrecy to the to the king is a bit strange um i think uh organized corruption is uh an affliction
03:08:05.260of all government systems and is kind of an inevitability of uh power manifesting itself
03:09:37.820yeah i i want i want to jump to uh fortis acts then we'll get back to some of the 51st staters
03:09:45.000but um one thing i wanted to throw in there it is um is uh jason you're referring to how well
03:09:54.000in the states you know there's much more of a system of accountability to hold people accountable
03:09:58.420and um i think that's you know to give us sort of like one liner meme to this whole thing
03:10:06.160A lot of the 51st staters are like, yes, we just need the American Constitution, and then that's going to solve all of our problems.
03:10:13.020And I look at the state of demoralized, fearful Canadians, and I say, no, we actually need American bravado within the actual people of Canada.
03:10:23.660You know, because one of the most detestable things I've seen since joining politics is the apathy of so many Canadian citizens, where I'll say, hey, look, look at our media.
03:10:33.980It's purchased, it's paid for by the government.
03:10:37.220This is something that happens in communist countries like North Korea and Russia.
03:11:48.280We still have apathetic people all across the 51st state of Canada.
03:11:51.960So we're just going to get exploited and taken advantage of again by whoever decides to be in charge.
03:11:58.460Or at least like why I'm hopeful with this 51st state conversation is it's getting us to actually think about this stuff and hopefully have a more like stronger sort of bravado among Canadians to try and actually hold our people accountable and kind of take, you know, have more civic activity with Canadians trying to actually take a hold of these institutions and of our systems.
03:12:23.620but um i uh i know john i know uh we've been talking a lot i do want to answer that because
03:12:30.380because you called go ahead jason go ahead have to run sorry brother um you nailed it you absolutely
03:12:35.600nailed it in that last little bit there uh we'll be exploited so here's what i propose to canada
03:12:42.200let's pay attention to this i strongly believe canadians are the most per capita wealthiest
03:12:49.420people on earth with future and current potential when it comes to resources i strongly believe that
03:12:57.540what trump is up to is he wants to take our resources he wants the northwest passage to be
03:13:02.800open and he wants to open that trade route because that is going to be trillions and trillions of
03:13:06.980dollars if canadians could understand this and say hey let's get a divorce from the king
03:13:12.620let's renegotiate provincial deals let's develop our resources let's open up a churchill port
03:13:19.160Let's become the next trade route for Europe and Western Asia, or Eastern Asia, sorry.
03:13:28.040We would be far more individuals on our own accord, not with somebody else taking care of this.
03:13:34.900We are absolutely in a position as Canadians to go ahead and do this development.
03:13:40.340We can become not just a breadbasket for a lot of places.
03:13:43.160We can become the energy and economic engine of Canada, not just Canada, but the globe, if we decided to go ahead and develop our resources.
03:13:53.840Trump wants us because he knows exactly what I just said is true.
03:14:00.880He knows that we have the resources, and he knows that he needs it in order for America to do exactly what he's suggesting they do, become a strong industrialized country again.
03:14:11.460they need the raw materials from us so if we grow up get out of the nest say goodbye to the king
03:14:18.280do not jump in bed with another pretty looking lady because we think it's going to be great
03:14:22.700and we just do this independently i think alberta would be happy because we're now independent of
03:14:27.720the king and we're going ahead and developing our resources all provinces can sit down and do what
03:14:33.620section 91 and 92 really meant and be sovereign and go ahead and open up to global markets this
03:14:39.760is what trump wants this is why he is saying the 51st state and greg you nailed it we would have
03:14:46.040been miserable under biden and if canada joins the u.s we're two socialists it would be a democratic
03:14:52.880nightmare it would be a harris government next this is not the way canada needs to go forward
03:14:59.480we need to have a different system where we take care of ourselves collectively and we can become
03:15:04.320great partners to the U.S. and the rest of the world. Per capita, we are the wealthiest people
03:15:09.680on earth. This is why this is happening to us right now. We just haven't woken up, took the
03:15:14.820confidence to take those baby steps out of the mummy and daddy's bedroom, which is the king,
03:15:19.660and go ahead and try this on ourself. Now, if we do that for 10, 20, 30 years, and it doesn't work
03:15:24.740out, the Canadian experiment under Republic doesn't work out, we always have the option to go to the
03:15:29.900us and that's part of the u.s constitution they'll take canada at any time but let's not be that
03:15:36.260meme that we all laugh at which is the guy turning his head looking at that girl that looks pretty
03:15:40.760while he's walking with another one let's divorce the king redo our system and get rid of some of
03:15:46.180these people and the people are the lieutenant government the governor general and the king
03:15:51.280system and let's do this on our own and let's see if we can grow the f up at this point jamaica's
03:15:56.300doing it that's yeah same path so let's let's consider that i think everybody on all sides
03:16:02.100would would love a canada to stay together we kept our culture we didn't merge with the u.s
03:16:06.640and we became their economic neighbor that's far stronger than we are now we didn't give energy to
03:16:13.080ukraine when we should have we didn't give energy to europe when we should have and that's because
03:16:18.080of the current system that we have we are being suppressed and it's kind of frustrating to me that
03:16:22.900Canadians haven't seen that potential. We are so wealthy that the U.S. is willing to even
03:16:28.020use economic force against us in order to take us. Now, last warning, Carney and his cronies
03:16:35.080from the globalists and the global elites, they know this too. This is exactly why they're trying
03:16:42.000to tie Canada to global debt. They're trying to get us into the International Monetary Fund,
03:16:47.760European debt, and this is exactly what the loony dollar system that he just released
03:16:52.260on March 12th, please watch that episode, is meant to do.
03:16:56.260It's meant to bring us to European debt.
03:17:00.180We are going to owe all our resources of future output to Europe
03:28:28.260The concept of a province came out of the Roman Empire,
03:28:31.660And basically a province is the carving up of an empire to make it more easily governable.
03:28:38.820So when you study Roman history, you'll study how they carved up their empire into different states,
03:28:46.140whether it was in the Middle East or across Europe or wherever they carved up their various pieces of their empire.
03:28:55.940And the one thing I wanted to say about, so going back to Lee, she said something quite a while ago.
03:29:01.660Like where where would that leave back with in regards to their society?
03:29:06.660Well, in like their their distinct society, culture, preserving their language, their heritage and things like that is the concept of that is the very concept of a state.
03:29:18.560And the 10th Amendment in the Constitution of the United States is that the states it doesn't have the word sovereign in it, but it it basically essentially says that the power resides in the states.
03:29:31.660And then I also want to touch on the fact that I think people have brought up that there's corruption in the United States, but the corruption in the U.S. is in it's in spite of the the republic that they have, the systems that they have, the separation of the pillars of government that they have.
03:29:50.840it's like there's a difference between um the problems and the corruption being in spite of
03:29:56.800the system and because of the act and so i think and then addressing what greg had said before is
03:30:05.020that a lot of the 51st staters um are basically uh fanning their hearts and calling on trump to
03:30:11.720save the day that's not the sentiment at all actually they're there it's more after the
03:30:16.600system it's more after the sovereignty like the Alberta sovereignists which I've actually been
03:30:21.600quite critical of no hold on hold on but would you be saying the same thing romanticizing the
03:30:26.540American system if Kamala was president if if Kamala was president would people still want the
03:30:34.820concept of statehood yes people do want the concept of statehood just because Kamala became
03:30:39.060the president wouldn't mean that Alberta wouldn't want uh or Quebec wouldn't want um a distinct
03:30:46.380society like just because um you don't think any of this 51st state hype has to do with the allure
03:30:52.440of trump who who kind of started this whole conversation no because we made it this predates
03:30:59.620this yes this this absolutely does predate trump um the idea of of sovereignty i mean
03:31:07.540we know this with quebec itself it's not the idea of sovereignty though it's it's the idea
03:31:12.420of annexation which by the way like polls show has less than 10 support amongst the canadian
03:31:19.400public yeah because you know so all that's a good point and i want to address that really good point
03:31:25.680um is i would say that this is mostly a western thing i don't think it has a lot of legs although
03:31:33.360i think jonathan's from uh nova scotia or he's from the maritimes but i would say this is mostly
03:31:39.800a western canada thing and the the bottom line here's the bottom line and i'll i'll hopefully
03:31:46.780people walk away with this it's like well we're either going to be ruled by and i've heard this
03:31:51.460word this uh phrase given a lot we're either going to be ruled by the laurentian elite where
03:31:56.940we're never going to or we're going to be ruled or or turned by or part of the usa which one and
03:32:03.840And so it's like, well, which poison do we pick?
03:32:13.820I'm acknowledging that very point that you're saying right there is that it's kind of like they've got to pick poison, right?
03:32:19.940It's like, which one would we rather have?
03:32:23.040Because they're being ruled over anyway.
03:32:25.200And I'm not saying I agree or disagree.
03:32:28.340I'm just actually stating the sentiment.
03:32:30.100I'm just actually articulating what the bottom line of this 51st state stuff is, right?
03:32:37.860Yeah, so I don't think it's that they're fanning their heart and saying, come rescue us, Trump,
03:32:42.740because you go tell an Albertan that they're fanning their heart and wanting someone to rescue them
03:32:47.900when they're an economic powerhouse and they're sick of having a lot of their profits siphoned off and transferred around the country, right?
03:32:56.620So that wouldn't be sentiment. It would be it would be more of what I articulated just now.
03:33:02.460That's fair. That's fair. That's that's that's a certain that's a good correction.
03:33:07.660Although I do kind of I am noticing sort of a pattern here that I think is worth pointing out, which is, you know, you were talking about the theory of statehood versus a province.
03:33:16.960and i feel like there's this sort of uh contrast between like like the the theory of freedom the
03:33:24.240theory of sovereignty and this sort of like idealistic or utopian vision of how the system
03:33:29.840is supposed to work versus sort of a more like realist like pragmatist of like well how does
03:33:34.780this stuff actually function because at the end of the day yeah but ideas are powerful
03:33:38.700ideas are powerful like let's not poo poo ideas right i i know they're powerful but again i want
03:33:45.460to come back to the argument that um these ideas of more sovereignty or more freedom or the first
03:33:52.140amendment um i feel like a lot of canadians are getting excited at that and we're kind of
03:33:57.520sidestepping the sort of ongoing problem which is the apathy of canadians the lack of sort of like
03:34:03.420civic agency to actually want to hold those in power uh accountable but i'm sort of repeating
03:34:08.980myself now because i brought that up earlier um that being said though i guess to add to add to
03:34:14.180this sort of um to my argument uh rfk we love rfk um you know he's he was like let's make america
03:34:23.500healthy again right and he was he kind of joined the sort of mag of movement he's seen as this
03:34:28.720this big figure and as the sort of what head of health or a health department or wherever it was
03:34:34.440of america one of his tweets was guys you know what's a big health issue anti-semitism which was
03:34:42.620totally came out of left field he's talking about seed oils and how we need to keep americans
03:34:47.760healthy and then all of a sudden he's talking about anti-semitism which i'm sorry that is sort
03:34:51.700of the path toward violating the first amendment of all americans which is we actually need to
03:34:57.700control speech around the topic of anti-semitism and if you start to you know if you start to
03:35:02.440violate the first amendment then it's not a first amendment anymore and that's again to say
03:35:07.020we can do all this idealism about the states if you'd like but if you actually look at certain
03:35:11.420some of the things that the trump administration is doing it's very suspect and it's and it's very
03:35:15.740undermining these so-called principles and once again it's that kind of conflict of the theory
03:35:20.700and the idealism of freedom and well what's actually happening in function because at the
03:35:25.120end of the day and i feel like a lot of the loyalists tonight are kind of emphasizing this
03:35:28.960which is like it's about power it is about these sort of elites it's about the people who are
03:35:33.620actually pulling the levers and where their hearts at like what what are their priorities
03:35:37.820what do they want what are their interests and um yeah i really think it comes down to
03:35:43.640you know how do canadians get their interests met because at the end of the day like you know
03:35:49.500there needs to be that willingness to do that and uh yeah but we we do gotta wrap it up soon
03:35:55.500because we've been going for three and a half hours i do want to go over to john john uh do
03:36:00.200you want to respond to that chad and then we'll go yeah sure i do i do because you kind of asked
03:36:05.300me to introduce myself and i didn't really want to harp on stuff but i would say that i'm probably
03:36:11.240the only one in the room that had their bank accounts frozen and is on a lawsuit for protesting
03:36:16.920i'm being sued for 300 million and i think the sorry 300 million 300 million dollars i'm being
03:36:24.940sued for for protesting an auto at the freedom convoy so what i want to say about that is not
03:36:32.080not just a plug for myself guys i'm i didn't bring that up to talk about myself why the reason why
03:36:36.820i'm bringing that up is because the the uh the premise the underlying assumption the ideology
03:36:43.820behind that it is is that um this is what i believe is that um our constitutional rights
03:36:51.060our charter rights and freedoms in canada um come secondary to this what i would think is what we
03:36:58.640inherited from um you know probably europe or the or the commonwealth or or you know the the
03:37:06.340british class system is that no no no uh the elites as as um as uh daniel was uh before is that
03:37:16.700the power lies in the elites and that democracy is a radical uh is a radical idea and law and order
03:37:24.180comes first and then you get your right second and and the way that this has been articulated is
03:37:30.240by the people suing me and and a bunch of protesters is that you don't have a constitutional
03:37:37.300right to loiter you don't have a constitutional right to um cause a nuisance uh where's that in
03:37:45.380the constitution where's that in the charter of rights and freedoms because they are holding
03:37:49.880bylaws over the the the uh the charter of rights and freedoms whereas in a different set of
03:37:57.120ideologies the charter of rights and freedom supersedes bylaws laws it is the supreme law of
03:38:02.660the land and i want to protest on the road and lawyer i have the right to do that because maybe
03:38:08.960there's too many people at the protest and the protest is being pushed into the street and i
03:38:12.560can't get on the sidewalk and not loiter and i can't get on the sidewalk and not block traffic
03:38:16.680And so that's when my constitutional rights would kick in and then we'd have a discussion about that. That's not the sentiment in Canada. And I'm sure we have a lot of people in the room here, including the loyalists, that sympathized with the protest or maybe they didn't.
03:38:34.360Maybe they thought, well, you know what, the government said what it said, it did what it did, and if you didn't like it, that's the way it is, because we favor elite rule over democratic rule, and why should the people have a say? And I'll land the plane there.
03:38:48.360no like we all thought covid was wrong i was there in the streets with you chad
03:38:55.300uh i just because i prescribed to an elite theory of how power is wielded doesn't mean i
03:39:03.240agree with all the ways elites wield power but how can you have it both ways how can you say
03:39:09.660that you do that that's just my power how can you have it both ways though i don't get it
03:39:14.880so inadian tradition it's pretty it's very simple like this is how i see how the world operates
03:39:21.920that's like saying uh like i agree with a raccoon being hit by a car because it happened like this
03:39:30.020is how nature this is the realities of nature and in the modern world right well no i think you're
03:39:37.560saying that it should be that way not that it is i understand the difference between no no no no no
03:39:43.360what i'm saying is it is that way and we have to understand how things are and operate within
03:39:52.720the confines of how power operates just the reality of the situation whether you think
03:40:00.840it's good or bad is secondary it is what it is so just uh just i think what the government's
03:40:07.980doing to you is horrible chad like i don't think you deserve to be sued for 300 million dollars
03:40:14.660because you uh exercise your civil rights to peaceful protest like that is absurd i can't
03:40:21.820believe that is even true um tyranny that is definition of tyranny even in the english
03:40:28.460tradition of modern it's unacceptable in totality well just so you guys know that when they took it
03:40:36.120to court they they lost their appeal to this ice a judge two judges have have refused their appeal
03:40:45.700to to take away that that case that's how bad it is and who are those judges people who made their
03:40:52.820allegiance to the crown so yeah but american judges do questionable decisions every day as well
03:40:59.240um like oh but that's in spite of the system not because of the system and our system it it it does
03:41:07.200have the system they're in and like i have experiences within the legal system well like
03:41:12.380i've i've experienced how uh unfair it can be but as fortisacks alluded to earlier uh like the
03:41:19.880constitution covid is the perfect example the constitution is not worth the paper it's written
03:41:25.300on it's only as powerful as the people in charge uh this is where we get back to elite theory like
03:41:32.960we need to replace the leaders with better men in order to solve this problem it's not about
03:41:41.340making stronger well through democratic means but the result is a what did chad say a second ago
03:41:52.140he said we aren't i describing a democracy uh but the difference is i think that leaders lead
03:42:02.320not the the public pushes leaders like what i know we have young global leaders we have
03:42:10.840z cabinets don't you remember this yes they are wielding elite theory better than we are
03:42:16.540i uh yeah and just this is a really this is a really good uh part of the topic i think because
03:42:27.820um you know what people would try to compare it to january 6 for example and they might say oh
03:42:34.200there was tyranny uh you know there's a whole bunch of unjust stuff that happened in america
03:42:38.100too and i think you could actually make a good argument when you bring up things like
03:42:41.140like waco or even how the kind of um legislative was weaponized against donald trump for example
03:42:48.900when they were trying to like throw him in jail and give him the mugshot and everything
03:42:51.500like there certainly is tyrannical things or undemocratic things that happen in the states
03:42:57.180as well however um chad you're absolutely right in terms of the way that yourself and other
03:43:03.100i call them political prisoners have been treated in canada and it's very very frustrating because
03:43:09.640it's like where is the actual justice here where is the justice i was on a live stream
03:43:16.740last weekend with um archer bavlowski and he chatted for a bit and he was like where is the
03:43:23.920justice in the country where is the justice and um i don't understand enough about the law
03:43:30.500and like the differences between america the american justice system and the canadian justice
03:43:37.000system but that's uh that's certainly something where i feel like the 51st staters may have a
03:43:42.740point but as i said i don't understand the law in america versus canada i don't know if anyone
03:43:48.160can kind of hop in here to fill in this uh to fill in kind of answer my question um but i will
03:43:56.420kind of offer as well once again it's super frustrating because most americans will hear
03:44:01.760your story chad and be like that's completely ridiculous like that's on like unbelievable
03:44:07.500and then if i talk to some canadians from high school they'll be like yeah well
03:44:12.620covid was a crazy time and it's like that's all you have to fucking say like like you know
03:44:19.260fuck you you know like here you're like you're a friend about like you what you're just gonna
03:44:23.440watch tv while this is happening this is disgusting um we is chad's uh chad's a listener
03:44:29.980now chad i think i don't know if you dropped out but you got a request to uh to speak again
03:44:34.680can anybody answer that question that has to do with uh how the law works in canada versus america
03:44:41.100do i sound crazy does this make sense no it totally makes sense it goes back to what i
03:44:46.040talked about where you know canada is actually ruled by law rather than rule of law we don't
03:44:53.420have a justice system we have a legal system and it's all you know again it's these judges are
03:45:00.380appointed by the crown they swear allegiance to the crown the difference of in canada versus
03:45:08.100the united states and with the formation of constitution and the 51st all the judges would
03:45:14.960be elected by the people so how do you think those judges are going to perform when there are people
03:45:22.260that these are judges that the people have selected rather than a crown appointee right
03:45:28.740so that it's a it's a huge difference and really people in canada back to your thing about apathy
03:45:37.620this is a symptom of institutionalization like this is part of being canadian and this is by
03:45:43.940this is meant by design as part of the system of the constitutional monarchy to keep people
03:45:49.140subjects to keep them unengaged because the only rights we have in legislation are every four years
03:45:55.640go out and vote so why would they want to upset the electoral autocracy that exists so i i think
03:46:02.740that that is by design they they purposefully don't teach us civics uh to any adequate degree
03:46:08.680for us to understand the game that we're playing you know imagine you're you're sitting down with
03:46:14.580somebody who is a master at the game and you haven't even been told the rules. And that's
03:46:20.940the situation of the Canadian people. And so they can't care because they don't even know what
03:46:26.000system they're in. Whereas in the United States, like you said, they're taught that they have to
03:46:33.380have civics. The system will teach them civics. They will actually know their constitution.
03:46:39.000go and ask a canadian what their constitution is good luck right so it's uh it's by design and uh
03:46:46.700and this is part of the problem and back to what jason said um about the republic thing i was
03:46:52.040wanting to say something about that but we went we aren't talking about stuff so i put up in the
03:46:55.900nest uh something i wrote up a little while ago i think it was about a month ago uh yeah and uh
03:47:01.620as basically a vision. Um, so this is my, this is back to you loyalists.
03:47:07.620This is my challenge to you is my problem is a vision for Canada. Um,
03:47:13.260so Jason said something about, you know, why don't we do it ourselves?
03:47:16.500And this is the problem. The people just,
03:47:19.240and this is why 51st state is attracted, not because of Trump,
03:47:24.240they have offered vision for the people of creating something great. You know,
03:47:28.920there is something yeah it is trump's vision yes but it's not it is it is a vision though and and
03:47:35.660the problem in canada is there's not like there's i mean there's the what we see from the politicians
03:47:41.240today you know we're going to build the homes and all this other kind of stuff like it is not
03:47:46.160inspiring this is this is like a vision of of mediocrity and it doesn't inspire anybody and so
03:47:53.220they look at what's happening in the united states oh 1.5 trillion of new investment wow
03:47:58.020That sounds pretty good. It's all happening there. What's happening in Canada? Oh, we're
03:48:01.520spending $6 billion on a defense system that isn't probably going to work because we're in the Arctic
03:48:07.100North. So there's this disparity that the people can't get passed. And this is part of why so many
03:48:14.860people attract to the 51st state. And back to what you were saying, Greg, I agree there are some of
03:48:19.900those out there who are like, Trump, save us. I agree. They're out there. But majority of the
03:48:25.02051st status who actually are serious about it know that it's actually hard work. They're called
03:48:30.740traitors every day. It's like being called an anti-vaxxer every day. Remember that? It's the
03:48:36.640same deal to be in that position, but they are learning more every day and they're passionate
03:48:44.700about it, but they know it's going to take hard work. It's not something where Trump is going to
03:48:48.280be able to do it automatically. It's actually going to require the people to actually want it,
03:48:54.700to have it happen because you can't have no matter what happens whether it's a 51st
03:48:58.780or whether it's a republic of canada either way you have to have an engaged public you have to
03:49:04.700have a people to be able to have a republic and right now we are subjects we are subjects in a
03:49:10.300constitutional monarchy that are taught to be passive and not engage and to be spoon-fed everything
03:49:17.260just the monarchy will take care of you the monarchy will take care of you is what we're
03:49:21.260taught generationally like back to you know 40 saxons about our culture that's literally no no
03:49:27.120that's literally not how things happen we are not taught facility by the constitutional monarchy the
03:49:33.840lack of interest and education in civics goes back to pure trudeau and the liberals and the
03:49:39.780cultural revolution that they instated on this country civic participation was much higher in
03:49:45.420the past. The fact of the matter is that from the 1840s onward, we had the implementation of
03:49:55.180what we're called responsible government, where democratic reforms were given to the country in
03:50:00.020a manner not entirely dissimilar from the United States. This is when people begun to participate
03:50:05.240in elections, and it happened because of two revolutions. Two revolutions happened, namely
03:50:10.700the upper and lower canada ribbons which then enforced the british uh the british colonial
03:50:16.500authorities to institute responsible governments and this gave the vote to land owning uh land
03:50:22.660owning individuals men usually older men uh and uh in a matter identical to the united states or
03:50:28.980virtually identical to it and also u.s judges are not elected it depends on the state federal judges
03:50:35.740are not elected they're appointed by the president of which they stay on for life they have to be
03:50:41.360confirmed by the senate sure but it's a lifetime appointment whereas in canada federal judges last
03:50:46.360until the age of 75 so like again we're i feel like we're we're going back to square one with
03:50:53.120the utopian projections uh this is this is utopian projection and a misunderstanding of the canadians
03:50:59.840and also both the canadian legal system and the u.s legal system have their roots in english
03:51:05.100common law so yes the u.s legal system is is revolutionary it is uh classical liberal at its
03:51:10.960origins um but it's based on english common law and it derived from the bill of rights so they're
03:51:15.340really not that different it is not fault or the responsibility of the constitutional monarchy
03:51:20.880to have made people docile like that's that's nonsense that started with pierre trudeau all
03:51:26.540of that started with each successive government after the fact there's nothing to do with our
03:51:30.420system okay so we're almost going for four hours now so we are going to start to wind things down
03:51:38.340i want people to start leaving their sort of uh their sort of closing statements with all of this
03:51:43.400uh we are going to go to uh chad first uh and then we're going to go to daniel tyree
03:51:51.240and uh yeah so chad go ahead we've been you know a lot's kind of come up
03:51:56.900uh when it comes to the legal stuff but uh yeah go ahead
03:52:01.440oh thanks greg um yeah so um i just want to say like i i don't have much clout i'm a plebs pleb
03:52:12.000i'm not connected i i i don't i'm i'm a am i a 51st stater i don't know how to call myself that
03:52:19.100but i would say that i'm a keep my try and keep my head above water guy and um and i just uh
03:52:26.280After my experience with feeling, you know, the government's boot on my neck, that way, you know, having these stars and visions of, you know, we're in Canada, we have rights, and finding out that maybe we don't.
03:52:43.480I have great sympathy for sovereignists or Alberta's sovereignty.
03:57:22.000The country is fundamentally changing as our population is being replaced.
03:57:27.000It's becoming more and more tangible each day.
03:57:28.920And unless we start talking about this seriously, talking about serious solutions like remigration, the country, as we know it, is not going to exist within a generation or two.
03:57:45.000So I think we need to keep our focus on the most important issues instead of arguing with our brothers about how we organize our family.
03:58:01.660Thanks to Greg and Lee and Base Maiden for organizing this.
03:58:11.280real real quick question what's the difference between remigration and deportations is there one
03:58:17.040remigration is more of a term which includes mass deportations technically speaking mass
03:58:23.720deportations is the removal of violated the law or is here illegally mass deportations would be a
03:58:31.960part of a remigration plan but it would not be the extent of it um it would be you know we have
03:58:39.480so almost like the immigration 500 000 almost like the immigration has like various you know
03:58:45.560the family reunification they have the point system like you know re-migration is the opposite
03:58:51.000of that it's having deportations it's having you know other kind of programs yes got it so it's an
03:58:57.320umbrella term that would include uh that includes all methods of relocating foreigners to their
03:59:04.280homelands um so that would include things like deportations of illegal very migrants um refugees
03:59:14.040but also uh the any moves to create the economic and cultural conditions to encourage even legal
03:59:21.800immigrants to return uh to their countries of origins through things like a repaid recreation
03:59:28.360program uh or it's like you know it's another version of family reunification except reunifying
03:59:36.040yeah yeah the other way of that the other way family is just reunifying them in a different
03:59:40.180country so uh okay thank you thank you so much for coming out daniel we really appreciate your time
03:59:45.560um and your perspective as a loyalist and someone who knows more about uh the canadian system in
03:59:52.000history than me uh chad i think i saw your hand shoot up for a sec did you kind of want to share
03:59:57.760through a few comments and and and say goodbye again or um did you want to chime in there maybe
04:00:05.000he's doing the dishes now and he's walked away from his phone uh let's go to uh let's go to
04:00:11.920uh fortisax did you want to say anything before we go i do want to get to jonathan as well for
04:00:15.960for any uh closing remarks so let's go i just wanted to affirm uh i just wanted to much of
04:00:23.040what daniel touched upon is that all of these ideas whether they're pro-monarchy whether they're
04:00:30.000pro-republic they're pro-liberal democratic whatever uh all western concepts they're all
04:00:36.740western ideas they're systems of government that western civilization has created for itself to
04:00:43.340govern its own distinctive peoples um there is no one size fits all um you cannot democratize
04:00:50.400of people where did not emerge out of naturally in many other parts of the world, even when
04:00:56.220countries attempt to call themselves liberal democratic, such as North Korea or China, which
04:01:01.060calls itself the People's Republic of China. The fact of the matter is, the ethnos drives the ethos,
04:01:11.600the people drive the ideas. And people are not replaceable parts of the machine. They're not
04:01:17.280cogs you can't just take a massive population of people from one part of the world and then
04:01:22.820airdrop them into another part of the world and hope that once they cross an arbitrary line that
04:01:27.820they start thinking exactly the same as you that's not that's not actually how things work
04:01:31.740and to the whole concept of the 51st state you know i find that canadians may find themselves
04:01:39.480in a situation god forbid that this ever did happen that kind of was annexed the fact of the
04:01:44.900matter is that the biggest supporters of the First and Second Amendments, as well as the
04:01:49.640Constitution of MAGA itself, are actually heritage Americans. Americans who can trace their origin
04:01:57.080from 1967 or 1965, before the Hart Shack Act. Massive quantities of people in the United States
04:02:04.420do not statistically care about the First or Second Amendment. They do not value free speech.
04:02:10.560They do not value the right to bear arms. They do not value some of the very relaxed laws that Americans play for self-defense and especially against horrific situations like home invasions.
04:02:23.100right um so immigration and demographic change is an existential threat to the existence of
04:02:30.700canada and to the united states and to the entire western world and if this was occurring in any
04:02:34.780other part of the world it would in japan is now opening its borders uh this would also be
04:02:40.300a problem for them because the risk is that japanese society and value regardless of whatever
04:02:45.740those values are are a threat from disappearing so to affirm what daniel said we can argue about
04:02:52.300governmental systems on how people ought to be governed how our society ought to be organized
04:02:58.220but the fact of the matter is that these are almost exclusively pertinent to us it's pertinent
04:03:03.060to us engaged in this conversation right now it's not pertinent to the vast majority of those who
04:03:07.780are coming they do not value liberal democracy they do not value free speech or the right to
04:03:12.120bear arms or anything so i find that canadians if that situation ever happens may find that the
04:03:19.840benefits of joining the United States are much more than they'd like to think. And I'll close
04:03:23.880with that. Greg, thank you for having me on. I find that you are
04:03:27.680probably one of the moderators in regular
04:03:31.660CanadianX spaces. So thank you for your time
04:03:35.780and hosting this space, providing me as well as others. Jonathan, I wanted to thank you
04:03:39.740for providing a strong opposition voice in favor of
04:03:43.700the 51st state. I think that you articulate and enunciate
04:03:47.940your views uh exceptionally well compared to a great many other people uh who are involved in
04:03:53.920this discourse so thank you for your time lee and base maidens as well daniel thank you for
04:03:58.480being loyalist buddy back to back against these republicans and it was a pleasure to fight with
04:04:06.140you brother revenge for 1812 all right thanks a lot guys i appreciate you having me uh thank you
04:04:15.320fortisax go follow fortisax guys um all right jonathan did you want to share some closing
04:04:22.360remarks you bet uh so yeah that was that was really good thank you 40 sacks and uh everyone
04:04:32.420else i i want to um bounce off of what daniel was talking about how immigration is uh most
04:04:39.740important issue uh that this is all a distraction um i i understand like i i i agree that immigration
04:04:48.340is uh a very important issue for canadians it's uh detrimental to the future of our country but
04:04:55.100this this also speaks to what we were talking about earlier which is the powers that be the
04:05:00.300the powers of the world and where is canada and and what we're looking at now is canada being
04:05:07.420in the throes of, uh, international fingers that are basically puppeteering this nation.
04:05:14.660Uh, we're basically, uh, an economic territory being admitted by globalists. And for a lot of
04:05:21.94051sters, the, the question isn't a matter of, you know, what do they want for Canada? So like it's,
04:05:27.660they kind of have realized that either going to be these powers that these globalist powers that
04:05:33.820doing what they're doing to us now or it's going to be joining the United States and being able to
04:05:40.780have the protection of their constitution to be able to form Canada in the way the people want
04:05:47.100rather than what these globalist designs have been and we all know about it like Canada is
04:05:52.080zero for the the global agendas and I don't need to go into that I'm sure you all know what that is
04:05:58.520But essentially for 51st years, they see this as Canada being in the midst of a geopolitical power grab, as many of you have alluded to.
04:06:11.040And for Canada, for Canadians at least, the people of Canada should be differentiating Canada from the government of Canada.
04:06:19.580I find that a lot of people, when they talk about defending Canada, immediately go to this, well, you're not a Canadian if, it's like, but what you're talking about is defending this government.
04:06:31.940And I understand some of the people who are loyalists, that is what they're doing, because they think that this is just a bump in the road for the system.
04:06:40.140But for others, they see this as this is a system of tyranny.
04:06:49.580And to them, maybe they've just had a little too much American growing up and now they want to have a republic and they want to be able to have the freedoms that Americans have.
04:06:58.940And I think the 51sters, that's what they see as a quick path to that, because they see the alternative as more globalism, less, you know, less and less of everything else.
04:07:12.060So, yeah, that's that's the difference. And so when you hear 51sters, you know, they're they're really they it's it's them wanting to get away from this system of government.
04:07:23.900It's there is a true love of the Canadian people and they want to see what's best for the people of Canada.
04:07:30.920They just don't see this government being the ones that are going to deliver it. So I'll just let my plan.
04:07:36.460thanks jonathan thanks jonathan i definitely think we all agree with that that we that we
04:07:42.180don't a lot we don't like the people in the parliament buildings and we want to we want
04:07:45.760to change that all right we're going to wrap it up right now based maiden you have your hand up
04:07:49.720did you want to uh say something before we get going yeah i just wanted to thank you greg you
04:07:56.120were the hostess with the mostest and yeah greg yeah you were amazing um no fights broke out
04:08:03.820um which is good for democracy or yeah i know it's not good for ratings um and thank everybody
04:08:12.660in the audience and uh to those we bring it up well this it wasn't necessarily a normal space
04:08:19.240um we kept it kind of uh high and tight so thank you to the guest speakers who did
04:08:24.560to come up and um i uh i do sorry i was just gonna say i i do see alberta independence
04:08:33.100in in the uh in the thing i don't know if you want to request to speak we could give you a few
04:08:37.860minutes to kind of state your case if it's you know if you wanted to say something real quick
04:08:41.620before the end uh if that's all right if people have time for a few more minutes if alberta
04:08:46.620just because it seems kind of like you know they have a fairly big account and it's obviously
04:08:52.540relevant to the conversation especially at the beginning uh so if you want to request to speak
04:08:57.660then come on up alberta independence um i'll just kind of share my closing thoughts right now
04:09:02.700which is yeah i think i think the common denominator here is like civic activity civic
04:09:09.160agency canadians giving a crap canadians actually doing the hard work of uh engaging in their
04:09:16.200politics and not just you know i feel like since the convoy uh the conclusion i've come to is like
04:09:23.120you know what it's great to protest it's great that we had that kind of miracle the trucker
04:09:28.840convoy happened where the people actually got hurt by those in ottawa but um we actually need
04:09:34.440a lot more we need to build we need to build stuff we need uh you know i i'm very sympathetic
04:09:40.020to the sort of perspective of having our own elite that are actually naturalistic that are actually
04:09:46.220you know actually have resources and money and can actually start to uh you know do do usurp
04:09:51.880more power in our institutions and uh you can doubt that all you want but if you look at the
04:09:57.340enemies the people who currently have the control of the institutions it's a bunch of elitists it's
04:10:02.560a bunch of people working together and uh there's certainly people who think like us who are on our
04:10:08.240side and who have resources but it's a matter of kind of just building that up uh because you know
04:10:13.400even if we become part of the states we still need people to advocate for the people in this
04:10:19.680geographic location. But, um, I, I, I personally think that we're just at a low point and that
04:10:26.840this is a great leverage. This is a great sort of jumping off point to actually reinvigorate
04:10:31.980nationalism in Canada. And, uh, that's why I love to have discussions like this. Um, but yeah,
04:10:38.620like we, we need, uh, we need the, the rise of Canadian nationalism, the rise of people realizing
04:10:45.900that uh you know we need to put canadian interests first and i think that the fact that immigration
04:10:52.360and demographic change coming up is is is super super relevant because if there's a whole bunch
04:10:58.560of people in the geographic location in canada who want a state of calistan in india well that
04:11:04.460just makes everything more complicated and becoming the states i i think i think just makes it even
04:11:08.420more complicated so i think kind of just uh reasserting our identity and our history is a
04:11:13.740great first step that also helps helps shatter the uh you know the sort of overton window of
04:11:19.780being politically correct all the time but i'm getting off into other topics now
04:11:23.260and uh that's great so let's wrap this up yep great great i mean i do think that the mass
04:11:30.760migration is actually a great lead up to another conversation and another debate though again i
04:11:37.760think we'll find a lot a sequel perhaps a cliffhanger for a future space yes but you know
04:11:44.100if it were left to the um i think we could figure this out and it really speaks to um with people
04:11:51.060really strong views um and they see things differently but it's the incompetence of the
04:11:57.100political class that they can't come to a place where we can end things satisfactorily or complete
04:12:05.540a deal satisfactorily so um you know i just you left it actually up to us we could sort this out
04:12:12.740um absolutely lee did you want to say something before we go and then we should really shut this
04:12:19.260thing down i'm hungry man i'll let beth and get uh last word but i i just wanted to remind people
04:12:27.060that it's up to them to hold politicians accountable stop looking up to politicians
04:12:32.700to solve your problems because it's up to you in the end.
04:12:37.060Being at home, eating Cheetos, nothing's going to change.