Human Events Daily AmFest Rumble Special
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Summary
This is what happens when the 4th Turning Point meets 5th Generation Warfare. A commentator, international social media sensation, and former Navy intelligence veteran, Jack Posobiec, sits down with Graham Allen and Rich Barris to discuss turning point and the current state of the movement.
Transcript
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This is what happens when the fourth turning meets fifth-generation warfare.
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A commentator, international social media sensation, and former Navy intelligence veteran.
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This is Human Events with your host, Jack Posobiec.
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Ladies and gentlemen, welcome aboard to a special AmFest edition of Human Events Daily.
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We're very excited here to have the illustrious panel with us.
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And we've got Graham Allen, long time turning point contributor.
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I want to say you were probably one of the original turning point contributors
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I remember, cause I remember I'd be working at a one American news and I
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would come to cover it and it'd be like you anna polina whole number of people up there with
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charlie that was like the first generation you know the first class i'm the new class
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of the contributors for sure you know it's it's been quite a ride and one of the things and graham
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maybe i'll even ask you this first one of the the narratives that people have been asking about this
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turning point as they say my gosh is turning point turning into a food fight is it's is it
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divisive are people divided are people attacking each other up on stage what's going on what is
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your take on that well that's that's the i'll just say that's the outside mainstream narrative
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of what's going on in here so compare that to what you're seeing outside versus what you see here
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well i'll compare it to what i've asked the people around here and the feedback that i've
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been getting them and what i'll say is this i agree i'm all about a good fight i love it
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grandma never shied away from a fight i have to pray through it because i i i love awkward
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fighting too much like like that's something about myself however i get it that look our
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coalition our side everything we're never going to agree on 100 of everything and that's one thing
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that charlie did so well is he was able to get people to put the the secondary disagreements
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aside for the mission first purpose of hey and charlie behind the scenes on stage you know this
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jack charlie would never tell anyone what to say however he would challenge them to perhaps think
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about how to deliver it differently he would say okay i know you're really passionate about this
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but have you thought about if you say it like that is that going to lead to the actual outcome
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that you want it to be and and i thought that's something that charlie did really well and so what
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i will say now is this i get it we got people in our movement that they don't agree on a lot of
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things and and i think we have to be honest with ourselves there is infighting going on right now
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we've seen it live on the stage people throwing daggers this and that my question is this i'm all
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about fighting out the issues that i think blake said this yesterday fighting out now in december
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instead of in november i got it but my question is this we're all about debate and open dialogue
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my critique of what's going on right now is are we actually having debates or are we actually
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dropping quote-unquote truth grenades of whatever side that we're having the problems on and then
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we're walking off the stage and we're letting the internet decide and then my question to that is
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how does that lead us towards the mission of actually making heaven crowded and securing
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the midterm and so that's my critique of what we're saying right i think that's a great point
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i think it's a valid point as well that and i remember charlie even at the very last um you
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know turning point student action summit one that we had in tamper with the very as it turns out we
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didn't know but it would be the very last turning point event that charlie would be at that he held
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a debate on and he moderated on the issue of israel and he had dave smith he had josh hammer
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two very strong uh believers different side of the issue but you know i believe two people who
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are willing to come at that have that healthy debate and charlie said let's facilitate it
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let's have that conversation let people decide for themselves he didn't tell either of them what to
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say. He didn't tell anybody what to think, but he said, let's have the debate because I believe
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his idea was to keep the coalition together. And as you said, we need to focus on the main mission,
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winning the midterms and defeating the radical left. Rich Barris, you look at this from a polling
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perspective, you see the media narrative of, oh, there's this division at turning point,
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division in the coalition the fracture was charlie kirk the tentpole holding it up i think that
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personally i think we saw a lot of this going on prior to charlie's death as a matter of fact and
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as unfortunate as it is the last couple weeks of his life were actually focused on dealing
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with this division and then what happened was his mitigating presence was lost so those divisions
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just flared up and spilled out into the public. But I just I know from, you know, being behind
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the scenes or being able to help wherever I could, that those divisions already exist. So, Rich,
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talk to me about are these divisions legitimate? Are they real? Do you see it in the polling
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numbers when it comes out to voters? These things that we talk about Israel, these things that we
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talk about Charlie Kirk's murder itself, some of these other issues that have come up on stage,
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where do we see that as the actual electorate so i'm glad you said that part of it though
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like i think that gets lost in the media narrative that does it does that this was going on when
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charlie was still alive he was just blue and without his presence it left a bit of a void
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and i felt like charlie was in the middle of the tug of war in many ways together and now um
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we're at, I think, a point where because of that absence, that is happening a little bit early and
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a little bit premature, right? This is a midterm season, right? We could be having this debate in
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the nomination process for 28. It would be more productive to keep the coalition together and
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make sure everybody remembers you still have to defeat the Democrats. But from a polling
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perspective, this was going to happen. This is a huge age thing. We have the old wing of the old
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guard of the Republican Party. And let's I mean, look, I'm not doing this to throw any bombs. I'm
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saying let's use the representation. You know, there's Shapiro and Proud kind of wing of the
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Republican Party. And then you have I'm not sure he would even cast himself this way, but you have
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Tucker being used. And this is really just a proxy battle for the future coming up in 28. Who's going
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to be the nominee? The direction the party is going to go in. The fact of the matter is, I think some
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people have to understand that the age demographics of this younger voters younger right-wing voters
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are more mad they're not isolationist but they are more MAGA and that's because they feel so deeply
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the dire threat to their own future and their own ability to live the American dream you do see this
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massive age signal with 50 under 45 under 50 whatever however you know demographic bucket
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you want to put it in so it was bound to happen Jack it was going to happen and I well and I see
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this with younger voters all the time you i think we said earlier what did we say under 50 under 50
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under 50 under 40 crowd is when it comes to a lot of the foreign policy stuff they'll say yeah okay
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but what about me exactly what about us what are you doing for us what are we getting out of this
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and so when they say america first they don't necessarily mean that like you say it does that
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you know we have to recede from the world and be isolationist all this but they would like to see
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more of a prioritization on issues of americans the issues of veterans and rather than this this
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foreign policy push that they feel for so long had been the focus of the republican party and oh by
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the way those are the same conditions that led to the rise of maga of populism of donald trump in
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the first place in 2016 so graham i'll toss that back to you because you're you're in there you're
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on the fight right here on rumble every day when you're talking to those people do they want to go
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back to the old style republican party no nobody wants to go back to the old style but again i've
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talked about this a lot as as people with large platforms we have a responsibility to have
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discernment of what we throw out there when we throw it out that's why i've had problems with
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a certain uh female vocal uh person behind the mic that's why i've had questions of some of the
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things tucker does i believe tucker believes in the truth i believe tucker believes in finding
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out the truth i question do you need to have every single one of your conversations in front
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of your entire audience in front of the entire world does that lead to more clarity or more
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confusion. No one wants to go back to the old way, but I see it in my audience all the time.
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You see it all the time. This is what we see every single day right now. We see either you've
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abandoned Israel or you're a paid Israel shill or you're paid by Qatar to hate Muslims and all
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this other stuff. We have allowed this narrative that may or may not be influencing the actual
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polls but we're allowing it to pick up more and more steam to where more and more people are
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becoming more and more isolationist and more and more it is america not america first but america
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only and that's what that's that that is a real thing that we are starting to see rich when you
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talk because you as as ol you're polling voters you're conducting focus groups all the time
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here's here's what i would would even ask is is that really being driven by a difference in
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foreign policy, or is it being driven by the anger of feeling that these issues are coming ahead of
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American economic issues? It's, it's real. It's the anger. I mean, that's, we could see it been
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going on for a long time. It's not new to this fight that everyone's been having inside. This
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is something that's been trending like this for, for many years now. So I do think that what Graham
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said. There's validity, though, to what Graham said, that there is this other side of that that
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maybe sees an opportunity to get this fight started now. I don't know what I'm not going
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to assign motives to what they may be thinking, but they for some reason view that it's an
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opportunity to try to hatch this out or even bring it in a totally different direction from
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where it actually started from with that anger. So, look, I think a great example is the Trump
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administration. And we, this is a reason why that a lot of this really came up. It was regardless
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what was going on, you know, starting in the spring and then going into the summer,
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there were a lot of these voters who already were angry, who felt like they got, they wanted more
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out of Donald Trump than what they were getting. And then Trump got distracted. And to them,
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it was a here we go again moment. Every time we get our president, every time it's our turn,
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they take it from us that is the feeling the voters have and honestly are they wrong
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they're right so how are you going i mean that's that's just a fact so i mean they're influencers
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and pundits yeah i guess we have a sway over people jack but they're gonna do and think what
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they're gonna do and think based on the reality of their world and their experience and we're just
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We're here to be we're here for the ride and we're here to be observers and we try to call balls and strikes as we see it.
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But I mean, we can exacerbate that public opinion, but I don't think we can create it.
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I think that's created by their own reality and their own experience.
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Yeah. And I think there's a palpable anger out there.
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And I'll just say it. I remember at the last major turning point event, that student action summit, that was right at the same time.
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The first big blow up that you saw regarding this was the Epstein files.
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And by the way, we did get this trove last night and I've been running around here at
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these different events, but I saw, I was able to scroll through a number of rows of things.
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My God, some of the grossest stuff I've ever seen.
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They ought to call these a Clinton, the Clinton Epstein files, by the way, because Bill Clinton
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all over there and there's some pictures that just from a cursory look at it those are little
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kids all right there's little kids in this stuff the epstein files and so i don't think anyone
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would be surprised if we pointed out that the way the epstein files were treated by the
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administration was a misstep it was a major misstep first they gave out the binders to you
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know myself included right i was in the group with the binders and they give this to us and they say
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hey this is phase one and we said okay what about phase two what about phase three are we going to
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get more and people kind of i've talked about a million times but i said look i went to the white
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house i asked the president of the united states the attorney general director of the fbi said
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release the epstein file please do that and then they hand us this binder and then people say oh
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well why do you didn't go hard enough i said what else do you want me to do i went all the way in
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ask for them and we got what we got then in the summer we were told there isn't anything more
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now here we are it's december we're getting more and as horrible and horrific and disgusting as
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these files are and i'm glad that they're out and i'm glad that people fought to get them out
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and i called for them to come out on stage at the last turning point event the fact of the matter is
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should have been done right away they shouldn't have pumped the brakes and that really led to
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this first break I would say publicly with these type of voters you're talking about I mean Graham
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Young MAGA and Young MAGA Graham I'm sure you saw the same same sentiment yeah I mean you know I
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mean there's still people mad even about this launch because of all the redactions there's
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redactions right there's a lot there's a lot of redactions and so people want to know and you
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know depending on who you ask in the administration right now even at the highest levels they will
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admit that was a that was a major misstep there and they know it that was a major misstep uh same
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thing with the truth of whether we've got the epstein files versus the epstein client list
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we needed to do a better job of messaging than we did which said hey what we should have said was
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hey we're going to go in there but the democrats have been in power for the past five or four
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years there's no telling what they have done to this thing they're not there may not be a list
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there may not be anything we don't know because we haven't been in there yet i think the american
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people would have responded better and bondy i would say if you remember the very first thing
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that she said was that the files that she saw made her sick to her stomach you remember when
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she said that and so i think it was her saying that and then switching but then suddenly we get
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from the DOJ. There's nothing else to getting these pictures, which made me, I said, wait a
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minute. So she must have seen this. So she knew that this was real, that it was all real. And
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let me tell you something. There are no photos of Donald Trump frolicking in swimming pools with
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redacted underage girls. There's photos of Bill Clinton in those swimming pools. He's in the hot
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tubs. He's in the spas with the girls. And you watch suddenly the Democrats are all going to
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stop talking about the epstein file yeah and look like we can't over step over the moment when trump
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sent that post to those who were frustrated yeah and he said you know what this is a hoax and if
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you're not hearing me and you wouldn't just go away and leave me alone and then i don't want
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your support anymore and we heard people in our own polling go no i don't i i strongly disapprove
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okay elaborate on that why didn't you hear what the president said he doesn't want my support
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anymore that happened that was real so i mean i don't mean to throw shade at the president here
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but it was mishandled it should have been acknowledged that it was mishandled all you
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had to do was do a gram just that which i told multiple people by the way at the time all you
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had to do was say listen this is the same agency who had the russia hoax this is the same agency
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who lied about this right robert muller's agency jim comey's agency it's gonna take us some time
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to go through all this stuff to make sure innocent people don't get hurt.
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But we hear you, I promise you, I promise you still, I'll get it to you.
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Trump has more grace with the American voter than any politician ever.
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Would you have been able to string them along for four years?
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But it would have given you time to go through it.
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He handled that, the whole entire administration handled that,
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about the worst you could possibly handle or mishandle.
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a sensitive situation like the epstein files with multiple myriad pitfalls and instead of
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trying to course correct he fired off that tweet telling everybody and then they you know that we
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don't want the support so we we can't overlook that and then the pivot and i think this is where
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israel is almost a victim of this the pivot from that moment to now leave me alone i have to deal
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with iran for israel was just a one two two piece the chant of maga and that was the next month it
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was it was the very next month and so it made it gave certain female podcasters ammunition
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and it really did and not and by the way and i'm say candace and it's candace not that you know
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you know it's not like the name who can't be said or something but and it wasn't just her there were
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A lot of people, I think, in the audience and a lot of people out there, regular folks, good folks, who felt very upset about all of these things and said, wait a minute, this isn't what I voted for.
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And it's an example, I would say, that proves Graham's point about how the things people say and the acts that they take can really have an effect on the broader picture.
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And I want to put a pin in that because that's so important.
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The other point of contention that beyond that, now the files are out, but it's done
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in such a way that, you know, I don't think President Trump is going to get credit for
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releasing these, although he does deserve credit.
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And this is something that I will always defend and point out.
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His administration actually arrested Epstein in 2019.
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And yet everybody seems to overlook the fact that Donald Trump is the one who actually
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brought epstein to justice and depending on how far you believe on this some people even think
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it was his administration that killed him right and honestly if you follow which i'm not saying
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they did that i'm just saying that you know wouldn't it logically state that not too many
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jack not too many people even as private citizens living in that upper class socialite world ever
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said or did anything to challenge jeffrey epstein no and donald trump was literally the only one
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to say, you know what, you know, we're not doing this. You're out of Mar-a-Lago because
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I'm hearing these stories. So nobody else can say that. When you look at Donald Trump's
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association with Jeffrey Epstein, he comes out cleaner than anyone else that was involved with
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this guy. Come out cleaner than Reid Hoffman. He comes out cleaner than Bill Gates, Larry Summers.
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He comes out cleaner than, of course, Bill Clinton, all these people. And yes, that includes
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Ehud Barak, who was the Prime Minister of Israel, and who was the head of Israeli intelligence.
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By the way, all of these things are just true. They're just true. And if we sit there and try
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to lie about them and say, oh, you can't talk about that, then guess what? That's what galvanizes
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people, and it's what gives credence to people who believe that perhaps Israel is controlling
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all of American thought or all of American politics if you sit there and act like that.
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The other piece that I wanted to get into while I do have you guys
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is that one of these things now is as horrific as every Epstein's crimes were, they were in the
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past. There are victims. The victims, I believe, are getting reconstitution and reparations now
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from the estate of Jeffrey Epstein. By the way, I love that if there was no Epstein client list,
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then who's getting all these retribution checks, right? So clearly there's been some kind of
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victim list. So there is one case, though, that is currently pending. And it's something that
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really burned me up last week when i saw tyler robinson walk into that courtroom and he started
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grinning he started smirking he started sharing these little little smiles with his defense
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attorney that burned me up that really burned me up and this is a real trial that is ongoing
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there is another hearing that comes up in february i believe there's another one that
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comes up, the actual arraignment is still pending. It's going to be later on in the winter. The actual
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trial may not start for several months, but because there has been so much contention over
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this issue that I think people have gotten very far away from the actual facts and evidence of
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the case that show to my mind, based on everything that I've looked at, that Tyler Robinson was the
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one who pulled the trigger and murdered our friend charlie no i agree i i mean i i do agree
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in that now do i also have questions with all these discord channels and people that had
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right now absolutely but yeah i mean there is more if this was any other thing everybody would
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be like yeah you know how many times has there been a trans shooter that was involved in one
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of these cases you know a trans shooter at a school for nashville minneapolis the trans shooters
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that we've seen again and again and again and we say yep that was the person but for some reason
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this one everyone says no no it couldn't possibly be him well not everyone but certain people and
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again it goes to the discernment of things that i'm talking about here candace has just as many
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connections as we do like she can make the same phone calls we can now whether or not they'll
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pick a phone these days or different she can have these conversations she could have had a lot of
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the conversations uh early on these things could have happened early on but her choosing along with
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other people choosing to take it immediately to social media to let people who actually don't
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have any idea what's going on uh now candace is even alluding to the fact of yeah there are things
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we don't know because they're not releasing everything that they have to us because and i
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would i would agree with that i would actually agree with that that in these cases and rich
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i'll bring you in a second that i would like to see more records videos whatever is out there
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released publicly in the charlie kirk murder case we know there's more records we know there's more
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videos out there people are so sick of being of the lack of transparency you'll want to get it
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out there and have it known let the public know and rich because you've done and a lot of people
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don't may not know this that not only do you do public polling for politics you have corporate
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clients and you all that you work for the from brand management these types of perspectives
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but also you do uh jury polling in various various locales various jurisdictions so on this issue
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this question of transparency. I get that the legal system says, we don't want to show any
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evidence until we get to that trial phase, until we get to the probable cause phase. However,
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we now live in a 24-7 information environment where the stuff you see on your phone,
00:25:08.180
on these little pieces of glass every day is constant. It is a constant barrage of information.
00:25:13.840
so my question is it almost seems like the presupposition has changed from you have to
00:25:22.120
wait until trial to oh they're not showing us information they must be hiding something you
00:25:26.880
get what i'm saying and do you hear that when you talk to prospective jurors i i yeah i do and i do
00:25:33.160
think that charlie's i'll actually say it's kind of like we saw the csi effect in the 2000s now i
00:25:39.820
would say we've got the social media effect yeah and it's a true crime effect yeah and much more
00:25:45.140
amplified and i i think that we will have to find a better way to tackle our authorities we're gonna
00:25:50.040
have to find a better way to attack tackle this because you do have podcasters who decide i think
00:25:54.440
i'm gonna live stream an investigation and it would you know in real time and that's what people
00:26:00.200
want they want answers fast uh the problem is with that jack i mean immediately my major concern
00:26:06.580
was this is going to take it to jury all you all you need is one person who may even look and sit
00:26:14.020
throughout the entire trial and hear the facts hear the evidence and decide that maybe i still
00:26:20.100
believe somebody else not being held accountable here and they god forbid cast a not guilty verdict
00:26:27.980
i mean this has happened this happened before in eye profile cases look i think charlie's case is
00:26:33.740
a little bit different jack it has to be treated differently people on the state side of this are
00:26:39.620
going to have to come to grips with the appetite for information prosecution yeah the prosecution
00:26:43.720
side of the state and by the way i would remind people again you know i don't trust the fbi either
00:26:48.860
but guess what the fbi is not prosecuting this case so i hear this repeatedly well why are you
0.66
00:26:54.380
taking the fbi's word for why do you believe the fbi why are you pushing that fed slop why are you
00:26:58.780
why are you pushing the feds flop the fbi is not prosecuting this case this is a state case all
00:27:05.260
right so again i i i don't want to say it's like almost a matter of national security interest
00:27:11.880
but there is he this was the most high profile assassination in our lifetime political assassin
00:27:17.860
you have to share more you have to try to do better i get it um so in the future though we
00:27:25.700
do have to on our side of it that's when the state side from our side of it we do have to
00:27:30.460
think about what grant said at the very beginning of this which is we do have a responsibility
00:27:35.340
i mean we we can go back to oj there was a witness in the oj case they saw him pull away
00:27:42.660
but by the time the prosecution ever got around to try to use that witness she had been all over
00:27:47.960
the media and all over all these other people who had other theories of the case and her testimony
00:27:52.920
was garbage it was incredible it was never admissible in court it was never brought up in
00:27:57.840
court so we we also have to do better i get everybody's want and desire for information but
0.70
00:28:03.480
take that to the proper channels take that to the pro don't take it to your podcast audience
00:28:09.140
and start talking because you really can take the jury and go out so far as to say
00:28:14.020
you know there there are even medical records that potentially could be released
00:28:18.720
A lot of people have questions about the ballistics in this.
00:28:27.780
And yeah, it is morbid for me to be sitting here in AmFest and talking about a guy who
00:28:32.360
was my friend and talking about a guy who did get shot in the neck in front of so many
00:28:37.520
But if there's questions about the ballistics, you can release a ballistics report and you
00:28:42.960
can have that out and you can have people say, all right, this was the bullet that was
00:28:47.900
we have it in custody it's going to be entered in let's just release that turns out bullets do
00:28:53.100
do a strange thing they do do weird things right because that's a whole other line of questioning
00:28:57.740
people yeah and so but i mean that would i think i think that sunlight is the best disinfectant
00:29:02.900
here on a lot of this i really do i would also add that beyond that beyond that you mentioned
00:29:10.380
the fbi angle and audio trust the fbi and i said well here's the thing you don't have to rely on
00:29:17.240
the fbi on this that's your hang-up because i've you know certainly have questions as well and and
00:29:23.960
and concerns but it wasn't the fbi who identified tyler robinson tyler robinson was identified
00:29:32.680
after 33 hours when the local campus police i'm sorry they completely failed that day there's no
00:29:39.860
question the the local orem police department was kept at arm's length they weren't allowed to fly
00:29:45.660
their drones and you know who knows what would have happened if they did right i don't like to
00:29:50.180
go down that road because you can't do that in this lifetime um but you know who knows but
00:29:55.780
tyler robinson was turned in by his mother and father right it was his mom and dad who turned
00:30:01.940
him in and i don't know any mom and dad that are going to pick up their phone and make that phone
00:30:08.580
call if they're not sure that their kid did something wrong because they knew this was a
00:30:14.740
case where the president of the United States said, I want the death penalty and you're going
00:30:19.620
to turn your son over. My boys are here today. I can't I can't even imagine. It's an incredible
00:30:26.780
decision. It actually speaks to the goodness of heartland America, the goodness of Christian
00:30:33.000
American fathers and mothers that they were able to do that. And I think it's totally overlooked
00:30:38.400
and overshadowed. And oh, by the way, those parents did come to that courtroom where he was
00:30:44.740
uh, smiling and laughing in the Navy, we would say coconut and joking. I don't know if you guys
00:30:48.660
say that in the army, you say coconut and joking. Yeah. It's must be a Navy. It's a Navy say, okay,
00:30:52.960
but yeah. All right. All right. But yeah, it's a, it's a squibby thing. Uh, I would say it, but
00:30:58.320
at no point during that hearing, did the mother or father go over and the media was all there.
00:31:06.160
Brian was there for news nation. I think he's a good guy at no point. They walk over and say,
00:31:11.720
hey you need to tell the truth because my son didn't do this they were there for hours hours
00:31:16.520
and hours and hours and you don't see a single family member coming out and look i'm not saying
00:31:22.640
that's this positive but i am saying there's a dog that's not barking here the new york times
00:31:27.660
just did an article um watching post watching post watching post hey at the friend they interviewed
00:31:32.420
the friend but they did and as it turns out this is a major lost opportunity for us to talk about
00:31:38.740
political violence in the wake of charlie's assassination we conducted a large study that
00:31:43.860
got no attention at all with the exception of a couple of times you and i discussed right when
00:31:49.280
we mentioned the transgender angle before we went into all of it and now i'll just end up wind up
00:31:54.620
putting it out for everybody to see jack but there's something very real there and i think
00:31:59.220
the one thing that i by myself that i want to know most of all is what grant said what about
00:32:05.360
those discord messages i just did this research i know now how much more likely these subgroup
00:32:12.440
demographic groups trans right how much more likely they are to accept acts of political violence
00:32:19.080
because they themselves feel like they're in danger of something so they don't view words
0.66
00:32:24.900
violence any different they they don't distinguish the two so i want to know what was said in those
00:32:31.280
actually i gotta i gotta on that full credit dr chloe carmichael she's absolutely brilliant on
00:32:39.440
this she said her theory is having the clinical psychologist her theory was you know how they do
00:32:45.940
the etchings into the bullets of the words think of it the combining of words and violence so what
00:32:54.240
they've done because they viewed charlie's words as violence directed at them what did they do
00:32:59.580
They create, we saw Maggioni wrote into the bullets, the anti-ice shooter down in Dallas
00:33:03.900
wrote into the bullets, Tyler Rittenhouse wrote on the bullets.
00:33:08.260
It's a pathology where they make literal violent words, violent words.
00:33:14.020
So Graham, talk to us about the danger of missing this rise of political violence.
00:33:20.160
Well, the first thing I want to, I want to add to everything that you guys did.
00:33:23.860
And so what I would say is this, I think that we live in a world where
00:33:29.440
social media works faster than the justice system and again i think that we as commentators
00:33:37.000
all of us myself included i had this conversation with the vice president
00:33:40.880
probably a week and a half ago we did a bad job and we have continued to do a bad job
00:33:48.000
in letting the american people think that once we won that election that within 90 days everything
00:33:56.300
was just going to be fine and everything was going to be great and now we have a situation
00:34:00.960
the most high profile political assassination of our generation where i think that people believe
00:34:08.520
that because we have social media that in their homes they should have every piece of evidence
00:34:14.860
and every piece of everything in this case immediately right now and that's that's just
00:34:21.160
not the way that it works now granted are there some exceptions for some releases to calm
00:34:28.020
heated things down because of high profileness sure but the vast majority of evidence data all
00:34:35.040
this kind of stuff that's not the normal way that it happens and and this is by the way this is what
00:34:40.980
you're talking about is that disconnect that rich was saying that people's perceptions have been so
00:34:46.460
changed by as you say by that social media environment by true crime podcast by all of
00:34:52.580
these things that there's a difference of expectation and when people's expectations
00:34:57.400
aren't met that's when you like relationships as well right when your expectations aren't met
00:35:03.080
that's what leads to anger disappointment dissension correct and and because of that
00:35:09.040
it is now taking away from us having the real conversation to your point which is the rise in
00:35:14.620
political violence which is the reality that those of us that do this for a living our overhead
00:35:20.780
just went up five x because we all have to figure out like okay i want to go out and do this
00:35:27.860
speaking event do i have to pay a million dollars a year for security and all these things to have
00:35:33.840
conversations it is a terrible place that we're finding ourselves which is what they which is
00:35:39.120
what they want which is what they want and and i'll put in time for an applause there but either
00:35:46.260
way uh that's what they want and it's because of we have not done a we have not done a proper job
00:35:53.260
of letting the american people know hey i've seen this a lot to the point about the feds in our
00:35:59.180
administration oh we just trust the administration now oh we just trust the feds now we just do this
00:36:05.220
and we do that well we did when we voted for donald trump in november november 5th of 2024
00:36:11.140
we all agree that charlie kirk was a once in a lifetime leader brilliant price driven human being
00:36:21.560
that was responsible for probably 90 percent of the people that are in these positions now
00:36:27.880
and so you can't hold two two positions to where you believe that charlie kirk was a once in a
00:36:34.080
generation leader of our movement of our party of people of americans of young voters and then
00:36:41.440
also believe that he had the worst discernment and judge of character of any human being that
00:36:48.320
has ever walked the face of this planet discernment too because there were people right and by the
00:36:53.880
way i'm perfectly happy to follow the evidence wherever the evidence lies and that's what
00:36:58.340
charlie was about standing on truth you have to always stand on truth and i'm not afraid to call
00:37:04.020
i say i talked about the uss liberty yesterday i'm not afraid to talk about israel i'm not afraid
00:37:08.600
to say that i don't agree with everything the government of israel does we could talk about
00:37:12.700
gaza we could talk about all those things but but do so with evidence do so with truth i've talked
00:37:20.040
many times about how i think that the that the government of israel in their conduct of the war
00:37:25.100
in gaza did not do a good enough job of protecting churches of protecting christians and places of
00:37:30.560
worship that are located within Gaza. I really believe that that's a huge problem and has
00:37:35.000
created bigger problems from that for them. That being said, there were people who said that Charlie
00:37:40.800
was killed by Israel while before his body even made it to the hospital. That is not standing on
00:37:46.900
evidence. That is taking something that is a preconceived notion, a preconceived bias that
00:37:51.880
you are trying to put and paint on your situation because it's pushing an agenda. And that's not
00:37:57.720
right that is not right just add something to that jack and then doing that and sharing
00:38:02.120
personal messages you may have like all this i haven't shared i haven't shared a single
00:38:08.240
personal message between myself and charlie and you're not going to see me do that never doing
00:38:11.860
you're just not going to see me do that thank you that's that's when i first sent me something in
00:38:16.680
private then that was meant in private to get these and confidence is something you keep going
00:38:21.940
you're violating this man's privacy posthumously it makes it it bothered bad i haven't actually
00:38:29.180
said that out loud so right now but that is it's it's actually let's not do that to make our own
00:38:35.820
point i will say this i will say this i try to have grace because i know there's a lot of people
00:38:41.620
that are going through trauma that went through trauma in those early days who were literally had
00:38:47.660
their whole life turned upside down not just obviously you know the business colleagues
00:38:55.380
friends but let's try to remember that at the end of the day this isn't about how it affects
00:39:02.480
political movement it isn't how it affects a podcast career are you getting more followers
00:39:08.220
subscribers whatever Erica and those children are not are his family they're not going to have a
00:39:15.340
father that's home for this christmas or any christmas coming forward and we should respect
00:39:21.260
them and think about what is best the best way to respect them in everything that we do because
00:39:28.500
that to me is way more important than scoring some political points or getting more viewers on my
00:39:34.820
podcast or or whatever it is and you know if people want to get mad at me for saying that
00:39:39.760
to let him get mad because i know what i'm saying is right no it is it's 100 there's a human
00:39:45.840
side of this story it's not just a political story or a story about a movement and factions and
00:39:52.360
there's a human being who had a family and children and you just said it and i just think
00:39:57.500
put yourself in someone else's shoes for a moment i don't think i'd want my kids reading that years
00:40:03.700
later you know just have a little bit it just has always bothered me just to be able to know look i
00:40:08.600
had this message and i had it's crazy it's unseemly no what i'd like to i mean and i said
00:40:13.560
this before but you know i feel obviously horrible that that charlie's kids are never going to be
00:40:21.000
able to really have that relationship with their dad but in a sense too they're going to have a
00:40:29.440
relationship with sort of the their digital father right like his digital footprint his videos his
00:40:36.600
speeches his debates and and that was his public work but that wasn't charlie you know what i mean
00:40:43.520
like that wasn't charlie the man that wasn't charlie the father the husband and obviously
00:40:48.640
you know he put his heart in his work there's no question about that but you know and and i've got
00:40:54.620
my little kids and and you know i just hope that that someday if they ever want to you know more
00:41:00.940
than happy to just answer every question they want i let them know hey i knew your dad this is what
00:41:05.840
he was like outside of the podcast outside of the text messages outside of all that nonsense
00:41:11.920
this is what he really was like this is what really drove him and this is who your dad was
00:41:17.140
and you know when when you have when you have one of your battle buddies go down like that you know
00:41:23.220
there's there isn't really a playbook for that there isn't really a a manual but you just try
00:41:30.100
to do the right thing by his family i think just do the right thing by his family yeah i couldn't
00:41:34.260
agree more and you will be there yeah I mean that's great um you know again you see it a lot
00:41:40.660
a lot more different than I guess some of the other people have chose to make this play out
00:41:45.340
publicly and in front of everybody you know so um in the future and I ask Graham what could we do
00:41:52.460
better not to steal your I'm just like wondering your thoughts here what could we do better do we
00:41:57.100
as podcasters need to start growing more like the and I don't mean this in that way but in the
00:42:03.380
traditional media do we need our own version of an ap handbook well i mean we have to decide why
00:42:13.080
why are we doing what we do now in the first place are we doing what we do now because we
00:42:17.960
want to make money we're doing what we do now because we want to be the most popular one are
00:42:22.040
we doing what we want to do now because we believe that we have influence and because we have
00:42:29.800
influence we should be using that to our agendas and what we think and you know and i think there's
00:42:37.080
a lot of people right now i've heard it on the stage by a lot of really big name people i think
00:42:44.000
i feel i i you know i think i feel i've heard it over and over and over and over again these past
00:42:51.920
two days i don't care what you think and what you feel i care about what's true and what's not true
00:42:57.080
and what i know that is true right now is that if we don't figure out this infighting that we've got
00:43:02.660
going on right now we're not going to do well in these midterms and charlie would be the first one
00:43:08.900
to be getting a hold of that charlie kirk would have called a massive meeting of the minds
00:43:14.100
right here in phoenix and what do you he would have had everybody fly in he would have been like
00:43:19.140
all right patch it out we are we are in trouble in these midterms if we don't figure this out
00:43:23.960
It is on us to lead people in the right direction for mission first.
00:43:29.200
How do we figure out how to all come together, even though we're not going to agree on everything?
00:43:34.220
If Charlie's not going to be here, then it's really as simple as that.
00:43:42.540
And remember that we are more, there is more that unites us than divides us.
00:43:47.600
There is more that we understand our patriotism, our love of God, our love of Jesus.
00:43:52.400
this these are the things that unite us and while there will be divisions though there will be
00:43:57.620
issues where we disagree we can do that in such a way where we maintain that grace but we also
00:44:03.220
don't lose sight of what the greater mission is graham allen where can people go and follow you
00:44:08.540
brother just google graham allen it's either good or really bad and you'll you'll find it on there
00:44:13.580
so rich barris people's fund it yeah we're all over the place jack you know on the getter on
00:44:18.720
twitter the best places on locals peoples pundit.locals.com pundit.locals.com all right
00:44:25.240
folks follow me at human events daily is the show every day jack posovic and i'll be on stage here
00:44:33.120
just a couple hours thank you so much for this live special edition of human events
00:44:38.860
amfest rumble special ladies and gentlemen as always you have my permission to lay a short