Human Events Daily with Jack Posobiec - THOUGHTCRIME Ep. 109 — Tyler Robinson In Court？ AI George Washington？ Charlie, Person of the Year？

00:00:00.000 From the age of Big Brother.

00:00:02.540 If they want to get you, they'll get you.

00:00:04.880 DNSA specifically targets the communications of everyone.

00:00:08.820 They're collecting your communications.

00:00:18.760 All right, guys, Jack Posobiec, we are live.

00:00:25.760 Another edition of Thought Crime Thursday.

00:00:28.360 We've got breaking news hard and fast in the Tyler Robinson trial.

00:00:34.320 We're on with Blake Neff.

00:00:35.800 What's up, Blake?

00:00:36.800 Howdy.

00:00:37.280 Howdy.

00:00:37.540 Good to see you, Jack.

00:00:39.860 You as well.

00:00:40.940 And Cliff Maloney.

00:00:41.700 How are you, Cliff?

00:00:42.580 Doing great.

00:00:43.320 Thanks for having me, gents.

00:00:45.200 All right, guys.

00:00:45.620 So the judge is currently ruling on information regarding and motions regarding whether or

00:00:53.900 not cameras will be allowed in the courtroom for Tyler Robinson, who is the accused murderer

00:00:59.140 of Charlie's friend.

00:01:01.300 And I've been seeing a lot of information that Judge Graf made a ruling regarding cameras

00:01:09.960 in the courtroom.

00:01:10.900 However, people need to understand that the ruling that just came down, and I see this

00:01:15.260 going viral online even as we speak, that was only about cameras in the courtroom today

00:01:21.320 as pertains to this specific hearing and possibly pre-cloud hearings in general.

00:01:27.960 There's also mention, and I've got this from a reporter that Graf wrote, or excuse me, stated

00:01:35.400 that we've set aside the 30th of January, and that might be the one that wants to say to argue

00:01:42.260 our anticipated motion that's coming about keeping court with other cameras in the courtroom.

00:01:47.500 I want to weigh in as well.

00:01:48.780 It will be on January 30th.

00:01:50.380 So on January 30th is the one that they're making that ruling for.

00:01:54.060 They're not making a ruling yet as of this time for the entire courtroom trial.

00:02:00.340 Blake, Matthew, is this your understanding as well?

00:02:03.340 Yeah, yeah, that seems right.

00:02:04.480 It went out in a few places that they'd already ruled, but that's not surprising.

00:02:08.580 Kind of everything about this case seems to take forever, which we complained about on

00:02:11.960 the show today.

00:02:12.600 And I promptly got an email from another person who works in other murder trials, and she

00:02:16.880 said, it's just always like this.

00:02:19.420 She said she's seen absolute open and shut gangbanger shooting cases take two years to

00:02:25.580 resolve.

00:02:26.240 And so that sadly might be like this, even for something as basic as getting cameras into

00:02:31.060 the courtroom, which we're all hoping for, I think.

00:02:34.520 Besides that, I guess the main thing we've gotten out of this, because people need something

00:02:39.380 to feast on is we do have really our first in a courtroom video footage of Tyler Robinson.

00:02:48.560 We have people analyzing his facial expressions, because there's not too much to analyze otherwise

00:02:54.100 at this point.

00:02:55.760 Whether the look on his face in profile, which we're showing right now, is he smiling?

00:03:01.660 Is he laughing?

00:03:02.700 A lot of people have had that interpretation.

00:03:04.320 I'll admit, I've only gotten a chance to look at it a few times.

00:03:08.440 I'm not sure I see laughing.

00:03:09.920 You can see a sort of grin a few times, but I could understand if someone said it was otherwise.

00:03:18.040 And by the way, guys, I'm going to share in the chat right now, I just got the otter note

00:03:22.940 with the full transcript.

00:03:24.760 So if you guys want to get it in, there's an audio issue for me.

00:03:31.300 Do I have an audio issue?

00:03:32.800 A little bit.

00:03:33.480 It's like you're skipping record occasionally, like a little hiccup, but we'll survive.

00:03:37.660 Oh, I see.

00:03:38.280 Well, when we tested, it was all right.

00:03:41.120 Interesting.

00:03:42.380 But yeah, so, oh, excuse me.

00:03:46.420 The media access, actually, January 30th has now moved, because the hearing is still going

00:03:51.880 on, so they've now moved back to February 3rd.

00:03:54.860 So, Blake, to your point, there we go.

00:03:57.040 They're just moving it out again.

00:03:58.400 They're moving it out.

00:03:59.000 They're moving it out.

00:03:59.880 I would say, though, if you have, does anyone have that picture of Charlie, or excuse me,

00:04:05.100 Charlie, of Tyler Robinson, this, you know, where it's kind of zoomed in?

00:04:10.560 It's like a zoomed in picture of him.

00:04:12.960 And Blake, you know, to your point, I'll send it in the chat.

00:04:16.520 But I didn't necessarily see him laughing in this video, but there's one spot where

00:04:23.660 that, I mean, that's just definitely a smile.

00:04:26.900 And, you know, there are times where Brian Enten, out of News Nation, who does a lot

00:04:32.400 of this reporting, he said that, you know, sometimes it can be a tactic by defense teams

00:04:37.720 to say, try to look more human, try to smile, try to humanize yourself with the jury or any

00:04:44.240 potential jurors who might be watching, so act normal.

00:04:47.720 And yet, when you see this specific image of him smiling, and you see sort of the way

00:04:54.540 that he's acting, I mean, to me, he looks very smug.

00:04:59.180 He looks very smug.

00:05:00.600 He seems, it's a grin.

00:05:04.000 It's a grin.

00:05:04.800 It's a smirk that you see in these images.

00:05:07.780 And we're going to get that up and show you guys in just a second.

00:05:10.060 But this is, I'm just going to say, guys, this was very, it was hard to watch, right?

00:05:16.600 I'm just going to say it right now.

00:05:17.280 It was really hard for me to watch and see this guy yucking it up with his lawyers there

00:05:22.980 at the table and grinning and certainly not looking remorseful, certainly not looking as

00:05:29.700 though he's sad that we're in the proceedings for the death of a good man, the death of a

00:05:35.760 father, the death of a husband, he's just, you know, pretty nonchalant and, you know,

00:05:40.880 having a good time, hanging out like he doesn't have a care in the world.

00:05:44.360 And, you know, I don't know the strategy or what, but I got very upset watching this

00:05:51.600 earlier today.

00:05:52.600 And I, yeah, I can't even really say publicly what I want to say.

00:05:59.140 Cliff, I don't know.

00:05:59.960 What do you think?

00:06:00.700 What were your thoughts when you saw this video?

00:06:03.040 Well, I think this was a big moment for everybody, at least for me.

00:06:06.780 I mean, I texted Tyler about this when I first saw the image of him grinning.

00:06:11.020 I did the same thing.

00:06:12.580 Yeah.

00:06:12.760 The same exact thing.

00:06:13.740 In a weird way, I think all of us are dealing with this in different ways and it still comes

00:06:18.780 in waves and sometimes it still doesn't feel real.

00:06:21.880 This was a moment, right?

00:06:22.980 When he, seeing him like as an actual person, I'm not calling him that, he's nice, not worthy

00:06:28.520 of being called a human being, he's a piece of garbage.

00:06:30.540 But it really just made this thing real again.

00:06:34.460 And I think it was a moment, you know, to see him not just as, you know, hey, this prisoner

00:06:39.440 who we saw briefly in the, you know, the prison garb, but now to be in a dress shirt and a tie

00:06:46.420 to have people surrounding him, defending him.

00:06:49.920 You know, it's a justice system.

00:06:51.060 It's going to play its way out.

00:06:52.320 But it was tough to watch.

00:06:53.640 And let me just say this to everybody out there.

00:06:55.720 These trials are going to take time.

00:06:58.140 OK, it's going to be frustrating.

00:07:00.200 There's going to be so much that they have to prove that he is a person, that he was

00:07:03.740 there, that there is a campus.

00:07:05.820 The campus exists in Utah.

00:07:07.640 There are so many, I want to call them preliminary things, but things that for most normal folks,

00:07:12.040 if you've never been into a criminal trial, if you've never seen one, there are so many

00:07:16.200 mundane things that the prosecutors are going to have to prove that are real things.

00:07:20.840 And to us, it's so obvious.

00:07:23.180 But in the court of law, you have to prove those things.

00:07:26.420 And so I do think we should be prepared for this to be a long, drawn out battle.

00:07:30.140 But as Erica said, why not be transparent?

00:07:33.540 So that is the wind that we're looking for.

00:07:35.420 We're hoping that this is all going to be on camera, not to glamorize him, but let the

00:07:40.160 people see what this monster did.

00:07:42.060 And let's have an open trial so that there's full transparency.

00:07:46.020 I agree with Erica on that.

00:07:48.220 Yeah, I really think it's one of those things where there's a lot of, I think a lot of the

00:07:52.800 issues we've encountered with what people say about this, it comes from the psychic overload

00:07:58.820 that people have such strong feelings about Charlie and about what happened to him.

00:08:02.960 They need to engage with it.

00:08:04.420 They need something to react to.

00:08:07.060 And instead of having an unfolding trial with facts, instead of having all the truly actually

00:08:13.080 quite lurid information about Tyler Robinson and his private life, I think that could be

00:08:18.620 satiating a lot of them.

00:08:19.880 But it's taking a long time because these court proceedings take so long.

00:08:26.060 And so they're getting diverted into other things.

00:08:29.020 I think it's a big argument in favor of we should, as a country, spend more on our justice

00:08:34.760 system, have more prosecutors, more judges, whatever it takes to have faster hearings,

00:08:39.780 faster trials, faster turnaround on this sort of thing.

00:08:43.260 Because this is a modern development.

00:08:45.440 You used to be able to do serious trials with serious evidence and serious proceedings within

00:08:51.120 the last hundred years without nearly as much delay for this sort of thing.

00:08:57.300 There have been attempted assassins of presidents who are tried, convicted, in a fair trial, and

00:09:04.240 in their cases executed within a two, three-month time window.

00:09:09.340 You don't necessarily even need this to be that fast.

00:09:11.500 But it feels very disappointing to me that anyone in a high-profile murder case is taking

00:09:18.100 half a year before you're even getting to jury selection.

00:09:22.940 Yeah, and it's going to continue to drag out.

00:09:24.840 And that's why I'm saying that, Blake, I agree with you.

00:09:26.920 But I think it's our job to kind of set the expectation with viewers of the show and people

00:09:30.840 that love Charlie, this is not going to be a four-month thing, right?

00:09:35.160 This is going to take a long time.

00:09:37.520 There's going to be jury selection.

00:09:38.800 There's going to be tons of these just things that, from an outside perspective, you're going

00:09:42.580 to say, well, who really cares about that?

00:09:44.540 Why are they able to drag it out?

00:09:46.520 But that's part of the strategy.

00:09:48.260 And sometimes it's for the defense.

00:09:49.580 Sometimes it's for the prosecutors, you know, to kind of get the jury mad at the other side

00:09:54.400 or to be frustrated.

00:09:56.020 But I think, you know, the other thing is selecting a jury in this case, you know, to have a jury that's

00:10:00.600 not tampered or people that haven't seen this.

00:10:03.200 I mean, this is unprecedented, right?

00:10:05.100 Charlie was everywhere.

00:10:06.740 I think it's hard to find someone, especially now with the news coverage, that doesn't know

00:10:11.920 who Charlie Kirk is.

00:10:13.600 And so you're going to have a heck of a jury selection to try to figure out, you know,

00:10:17.500 and some of these rulings are going to be crucial on who the judge lets in, who the judge

00:10:21.500 says, you know, has some sort of bias.

00:10:23.960 And I think that's going to be a key part, you know, to what the prosecution has to do is

00:10:28.580 to making sure that this isn't some issue that goes to a mistrial later, because one

00:10:33.120 of the jurors says that, oh, they weren't familiar with it, or they don't know who Charlie

00:10:36.400 is, or they haven't seen any of these reports.

00:10:39.080 I mean, this isn't OJ.

00:10:40.280 Like, we're in an age now where everyone has access to social media.

00:10:45.380 Everyone has access to content.

00:10:47.960 So that, to me, is going to be a very, very interesting part of this process.

00:10:51.760 So one thing that I'm getting from a friend of mine who was watching this and does some

00:11:01.840 work in the true crime, you know, kind of like policy trial, so it says that Erica was

00:11:08.920 officially made the victim in this.

00:11:12.540 And something that a lot of people have pointed out that could come up in terms of some of

00:11:21.480 the firestorm, the media that's already going on, is the Utah Witness Intimidation Law.

00:11:27.160 And I'll put that out right now.

00:11:29.120 So this is something, by the way, this is something that comes up in a number of these cases when

00:11:33.860 people have followed them so closely, but then become so, shall I say, so targeted at

00:11:43.160 witnesses and victims.

00:11:45.980 So here's what it says.

00:11:47.000 Under Utah law, a person committing witness tampering or intimidation, if they attempt to

00:11:52.700 improperly influence the testimony of someone they know that might testify, to prevent someone

00:11:56.880 from testifying, threaten, harass, or retaliate against someone because of their role, engage

00:12:03.360 in conduct intending to make a witness fearful, silent, or less cooperative with the justice

00:12:08.160 process, Utah specifically criminalizes threats, harassment, public accusations intended to

00:12:14.020 be discredit, public pressure campaigns that could show testimony retaliatory conduct towards

00:12:20.840 victims or victim advocates or designated representatives, public statements, even online, can use the

00:12:26.140 definition that the intent is to affect testimony or cooperation.

00:12:30.020 And so this is something that has come up in a number of these cases where, you know, you

00:12:37.540 have this huge community that gets involved.

00:12:39.940 But people have to remember that they are active cases.

00:12:43.360 And in fact, there are laws on the books that govern anyone who can get involved in any

00:12:49.820 way, you know, that is getting involved in these cases.

00:12:54.480 And that's serious.

00:12:56.440 That's a very serious thing.

00:12:57.860 And these laws have been on the books for a long time.

00:12:59.840 Blake, walk us through why we have laws like this.

00:13:02.940 I mean, we have laws like this because those are the things that people do to escape culpability

00:13:09.440 for crimes.

00:13:10.700 And also, frankly, a part of it is also there a way like our glorious Supreme Court has made

00:13:22.380 it difficult to execute people, unfortunately.

00:13:27.300 And so one of the ways they've gone about it is they've said, you have to have some aggravating

00:13:33.180 factors before we will allow a heinous perpetrator to face appropriate punishment for their crimes.

00:13:41.520 And so you definitely see facets of that throughout the indictment of Tyler Robinson, where they

00:13:48.640 threw in that charge for doing something in the presence of a minor.

00:13:53.740 And I think the witness intimidation stuff comes into that because when you're doing stuff

00:13:58.320 against witnesses, that's another thing that's considered a valid aggravating factor.

00:14:03.180 in cases.

00:14:04.180 And so you get those in play.

00:14:06.640 They're clearly, they structured the indictment in a way to make sure a court couldn't swoop

00:14:12.140 in later and say there were no aggravating factors.

00:14:14.480 So you can't try to bring the death penalty in this case.

00:14:19.280 Yeah, let me make one comment.

00:14:21.260 So, and let me just.

00:14:22.360 I just wanted to, I just want to throw up something, guys, because I have this.

00:14:25.340 So the official term is, and, you know, mea culpa, if I use the wrong term, she is recognized

00:14:31.840 as the designated victim representative.

00:14:35.400 So she'd be officially recognized as the designated victim representative.

00:14:40.140 And so that means she has a right to attend the trial.

00:14:43.840 But as such, a lot of these witness intimidation laws could potentially, if the judge decides

00:14:50.000 to, cover the designated victim representative as well, which means they cover Erica.

00:14:54.300 And, I mean, Blake, to your point, there's a basic reason we don't want people intimidating

00:14:58.820 victims in a trial because we want actual justice.

00:15:03.020 Well, for the same reason, we want actual justice.

00:15:05.820 So that's why these laws on witness intimidation also cover victim representative intimidation

00:15:12.000 as well.

00:15:12.400 Yeah, and if I'm, if I'm understanding this correctly, why I think this opens up a can

00:15:18.300 of worms in a good way is because now all of a sudden, you know, look, defamation, all

00:15:22.980 of us know, you know, some of the vile things we've seen and some of these horrific things

00:15:26.580 that people say about us or anybody that's involved with Charlie or New Charlie, you know,

00:15:31.400 the standard for defamation is pretty much impossible in the United States.

00:15:34.360 I mean, for public figures, it is pretty much something where to be successful in a defamation

00:15:39.160 case against the public figure.

00:15:40.880 It's just very rare.

00:15:42.320 But now I'm hearing this and I'm thinking to myself, you know, now it makes it, I think,

00:15:46.960 much more doable that if Erica or the state wanted to go after somebody that is literally

00:15:53.300 threatening her in a way or defaming her in a way that could intimidate her as a potential

00:15:58.640 witness or as, you know, the victim representative, am I saying that correctly?

00:16:04.520 Does that open the door where it's much more liable for somebody to go after somebody that

00:16:09.860 now has that label?

00:16:11.640 Because with defamation, it's pretty much impossible.

00:16:14.280 Yeah, it can be.

00:16:15.880 It's it's it's ultimately up to the judge.

00:16:18.600 It's ultimately up to prosecutors in this case.

00:16:21.920 But yes, it does give her an official standing with the court and in the trial.

00:16:27.200 So what it means and this has come up in other cases where in other parts of the country where

00:16:31.600 people have been harassed, intimidated and then taken it up with the courts.

00:16:37.840 And they've they've gone back and found rulings on their behalf and said, look, you can't

00:16:44.000 interfere with someone who's directly involved with a trial like this.

00:16:48.040 It is what they view as a form of witness intimidation jury and actually tampering with

00:16:53.040 a jury trial.

00:16:54.340 And by the way, you know, just from a personal perspective, I want everyone to comment on

00:17:00.040 this trial.

00:17:00.600 If you disagree, if you think if you're one of these people who is I've been calling them

00:17:04.500 the Robin Sims.

00:17:06.040 So the Tyler Robin Sims who actually support Tyler Robinson and they think that he's completely

00:17:10.420 innocent and think that there's no way he could have done it and think this.

00:17:15.460 I want the Robin Sims to be out there.

00:17:17.020 I'm not calling for them to be arrested or charged or anything like that.

00:17:20.280 And I think they have a perfectly fine First Amendment right.

00:17:22.860 It would be wrong for the Robin Sims.

00:17:25.020 People asking questions.

00:17:25.860 You've perfectly had a right to ask questions in this country called the First Amendment.

00:17:31.840 That said, people should be aware that the laws are on the book.

00:17:35.520 And that's just why I'm reading that.

00:17:36.940 Because very simply, I'm just reading here, victims have rights.

00:17:40.880 It's really simple.

00:17:42.120 There's a Bill of Rights for Victims and it includes the victim to not be the freedom to

00:17:46.100 not be publicly harassed, continually abuse, protection from activations, mobilization of

00:17:50.220 followers to harass or attack.

00:17:51.740 And so this means that in a sense, and I'm reading this, Erica is now officially tied to

00:17:57.780 the prosecution and the prosecution can take actions to protect her.

00:18:03.100 And that's just something that is going to be another future of this case, I believe,

00:18:08.740 going forward.

00:18:11.280 It's possible.

00:18:12.460 I feel like that would be what you're alluded to would be a stretch.

00:18:16.180 But I guess I would probably appreciate it if it happened.

00:18:18.720 It's not a stretch, it's the law.

00:18:20.480 It's actually the law in Utah, it's not a stretch at all.

00:18:23.140 Yeah, I mean, it's the law, but it would be, there's laws and then it's, how do you use

00:18:27.600 those laws?

00:18:28.280 I would be, I would be very pleasantly surprised if we saw, if we saw it used in that way.

00:18:36.100 I mean, I don't know.

00:18:37.200 I'm just saying, I have no idea if it would or it wouldn't.

00:18:39.280 But we have seen people face charges for victim intimidation before in other states.

00:18:48.440 We have, we have.

00:18:49.960 I'd have to read more on what they specifically did in those cases, though.

00:18:55.040 Well, again, we're just talking about the liability.

00:18:57.260 So this, the fact that she is now the official designation means that there are certain laws

00:19:02.560 that apply to Erica that prior to this did not.

00:19:05.200 And if I had to ask you guys, how long, how long do you guys think that this lasts?

00:19:11.920 I mean, what, what's a, I mean, is it, are we talking about a year and a half?

00:19:14.400 Are we talking about, you know, three months?

00:19:16.500 Like what, what's the prediction?

00:19:18.680 I mean, if you really want to know if it's a capital case, if he gets the death penalty,

00:19:22.860 he could, this could be a 30 year thing.

00:19:25.780 You've seen how often they love to drag these things out.

00:19:28.660 Even without that, it's a, it's a great cause of the left to get people who have life in

00:19:34.340 prison out on parole somehow, especially if it is life without parole.

00:19:39.920 We're given that promise all of the time and it doesn't pan out.

00:19:43.220 You see these things.

00:19:44.600 They, they love to commute sentences nasty. 0.98

00:19:47.480 There are just people out there who love criminals.

00:19:49.140 They love letting criminals get out.

00:19:51.680 They love letting people who've committed heinous crimes roam free in society again.

00:19:56.540 So I feel rather, unfortunately, I just can't truly imagine this being over, over for tragically

00:20:05.360 many years.

00:20:07.060 They'll find some way to perpetuate this case far beyond what it should be.

00:20:12.680 And do we have any intel?

00:20:15.120 Do we have any intel on how he's funding his defense?

00:20:21.040 I mean, does he come from any money?

00:20:23.380 Like, is this, are these public defenders?

00:20:26.000 So, um, it's a, it comes from a public pot of money.

00:20:30.500 And so he's given a public pot of money that was granted to him.

00:20:35.240 Um, this is also under, governed by Utah law.

00:20:37.860 I could, I could pull up in a second exactly, um, about his legal team, but yes, it does come

00:20:43.340 from a public pot of money.

00:20:44.600 And they're, they did give him, because it's a capital case, they are then giving him access

00:20:49.460 to a higher amount of funds they would, if, then if it were a, uh, you know, if there

00:20:54.060 were just a misdemeanor case, a felony case, but because it's a capital murder case, they

00:20:58.320 are giving him access to far more funds because of course, this is why the state wants this

00:21:04.000 because they don't want, um, let's say he's convicted.

00:21:07.300 They don't want him to be able to come back around on the field and say, oh, I had ineffective,

00:21:10.940 uh, you know, ineffective counsel or something like that.

00:21:13.140 Um, got it, but yes, it is, it's taxpayer funded and we'll say to people.

00:21:22.120 Oh man.

00:21:23.060 Uh, Blake, what, what, what do you, what did you make of the, well, here's something else

00:21:29.060 I want to add, by the way.

00:21:30.220 So his parents, we, we are told on reporters who are in a courtroom, including Gen News

00:21:34.680 Nation, that his parents did attend the trial as well as one of his brothers.

00:21:39.720 Uh, and it sounds like his mother was very emotional.

00:21:42.620 Uh, it sounds like, uh, she was, she was fine while she was, um, waiting for, there, there

00:21:48.000 was a portion of this that was held behind closed doors while they were sort of making

00:21:51.640 the argument regarding the cameras.

00:21:53.220 And, uh, uh, Brian Nettin mentioned that his mother has, was all at one point, they asked

00:21:58.600 for the family to stay in the courtroom, but then the judge actually asked them to leave

00:22:03.420 the courtroom during the, uh, during the trial phase or during that argument phase and said

00:22:07.960 the mother was outside in the courtroom, out of the courtroom, just crying.

00:22:11.560 And, and look, I keep saying over and over, you know, for people who have been telling

00:22:18.220 me that, oh, Tyler Robinson, the plants, you know, this isn't, this isn't real, or it's

00:22:23.660 sort of like, guys, his, his parents were the ones who, who turned him in.

00:22:29.120 And if they thought their son was innocent, that if he was falsely accused, you know, they,

00:22:34.680 they have all the opportunity in the world to speak to media that eyes, the water on them

00:22:38.380 today, not one of them walked up to media and said, my son is innocent.

00:22:43.900 Um, we have the Oswald famously referred to himself as a patsy.

00:22:47.820 And you just don't see anyone from the family coming out and saying that, uh, that they believe

00:22:54.380 he didn't do it.

00:22:54.980 They believe he was innocent.

00:22:56.240 Just hasn't happened.

00:22:57.640 And it certainly didn't happen today.

00:22:59.180 They had the opportunity to do so.

00:23:00.320 They did not.

00:23:01.460 And look, we see these images of Tyler Robinson, these sick images of him.

00:23:07.900 And I've just found a new image, by the way, I'm going to sound it as well.

00:23:11.260 Just this sick image of him grinning.

00:23:13.960 It's very well, very clear that he's grinning and, you know, caught in 4k.

00:23:18.860 He just looks weird, too.

00:23:20.620 I guess that's not, that's not the best thing to say.

00:23:22.740 Oh, there it is.

00:23:23.020 There it is.

00:23:23.360 Yeah, there it is.

00:23:23.960 He, he really.

00:23:25.200 He's sitting there grinning while Charlie's family is going to go through Christmas with

00:23:28.940 I believe that.

00:23:30.380 He's sitting there grinning.

00:23:32.640 Okay.

00:23:33.680 Okay.

00:23:33.920 Can we not talk about how he looks like Beto O'Rourke?

00:23:37.660 Has nobody made that comparison yet?

00:23:39.960 Oh, I feel like today.

00:23:41.340 He does.

00:23:41.880 Wow.

00:23:42.220 He does kind of look like Beto.

00:23:43.340 Today, in that outfit was the first time I saw that.

00:23:46.620 No, I don't.

00:23:47.380 First time I saw that.

00:23:49.080 Jack, you made a good point.

00:23:50.200 I want to elaborate on it.

00:23:51.180 That ruling was interesting when they said, hey, we need to clear out.

00:23:55.620 We're going to make some decisions about cameras and we're going to have some debate

00:23:58.280 on this.

00:23:58.780 And I don't want the public in here.

00:24:01.440 And they obviously, you know, the defense said, hey, we want to request the family can

00:24:05.200 stay.

00:24:05.920 And the judge did not go with them, right?

00:24:08.700 The judge went with the prosecutors.

00:24:10.720 But I find that to be very, very interesting because a lot of times you'll see judges start

00:24:14.720 to go one direction.

00:24:16.340 And if early on they're going the direction of, hey, we're going to, you know, be with

00:24:20.640 the defense, that becomes a problem if you're obviously rooting for the prosecutors.

00:24:24.300 And so I think some of these early decisions can kind of show what type of temperament the

00:24:30.100 judge is going to have.

00:24:31.120 And for the judge to say that Tyler Robinson's family does not get special treatment, they

00:24:36.060 are not allowed to stay in the courtroom, that all members of the public have to leave.

00:24:40.180 I think that's a big win.

00:24:41.180 And I don't think we should glance over that.

00:24:44.000 That was a big ruling from the judge today.

00:24:45.860 And so one other piece for people to understand is that people are asking, will Erica testify?

00:24:58.860 And so likely, I mean, it's certainly possible that anyone can call witnesses, but it's more

00:25:06.060 likely that as a victim representative that she will be giving a statement not during the

00:25:11.220 trial phase, but there's two phases to a death penalty trial.

00:25:14.660 And a death penalty trial in those states, including the states of, you know, state of

00:25:19.620 Utah, that they've, the victim doesn't testify until, so there's a conviction, then there's

00:25:25.160 another phase, which is the conviction that our first testimony brought in, and that's

00:25:30.320 when you feel what's the order called victim impact statement.

00:25:32.680 And those victim impact statements are the ones that come in there.

00:25:36.520 I'm told that we have a donation.

00:25:38.840 Oh, yeah.

00:25:39.180 Well, we have, we have Caden again.

00:25:40.740 He's, he's, he's a frequent donor.

00:25:42.120 So thank you again, Cade.

00:25:43.160 He says, Hey friends, hope you are well today.

00:25:47.000 And thank you very much, Cade.

00:25:48.640 And we have a second one, but it's a, it's a lighter topic.

00:25:51.320 So I would like, I don't want to hit it until we're ready to move on to the next one.

00:25:54.540 Cause I don't want to taint this very serious topic with it, but we are aware of your earlier

00:26:00.000 one.

00:26:00.500 Caden, uh, who was that from, from B Jordan.

00:26:03.120 We'll be reading off yours in a sec here, but, uh, do we have anything else we want to hit

00:26:07.480 on this, uh, on this, I have one last, one last, one last question.

00:26:12.260 Do we think that he testifies?

00:26:15.680 Robinson?

00:26:16.660 I mean, technically we don't even know if he has, he hasn't entered a plea yet.

00:26:20.660 Correct.

00:26:21.100 Not a formal plea.

00:26:23.240 No.

00:26:23.440 Yeah.

00:26:23.760 He might just plead guilty for all we know.

00:26:27.140 Yeah.

00:26:27.820 He could.

00:26:28.460 Um, so as far as we know, yes, he easily could just, he could plead guilty.

00:26:33.580 And I'm, I'm looking at the chat and the chat, just, just most people that I'm are just appalled

00:26:39.360 the same way that I am to see him smiling, to see him grinning, laughing it up.

00:26:45.140 Go ahead, man.

00:26:46.040 Laugh it up.

00:26:47.080 Go ahead.

00:26:47.920 Keep laughing it up.

00:26:49.480 Laugh it up as much as you want.

00:26:50.460 Please continue to do so.

00:26:52.780 So I'm like that.

00:26:53.920 I'm going to bite my tongue.

00:26:55.060 That's, that's all as far as I'm going to go right now.

00:26:57.640 Keep laughing it up, buddy.

00:26:58.940 Keep laughing it up.

00:27:02.300 Um, yeah, I mean, the chat is just, the chat's livid.

00:27:06.680 I'm looking at it right now.

00:27:07.620 People are just, it's just livid.

00:27:10.360 Yeah.

00:27:10.760 I was saying they're making him, you know, it's, it's so awful that they're making him

00:27:13.920 look clean cut.

00:27:15.280 Um, you know, he's, he's grinning, smiling, laughing.

00:27:22.100 Uh, Namarston asked, can they have cameras in the courtroom or not?

00:27:25.200 They have not ruled on that for a trial.

00:27:26.920 He ruled that they could have cameras in the courtroom today for today's hearing, but

00:27:32.340 we do not have a ruling on the overall trial.

00:27:35.260 We likely won't have that for many weeks.

00:27:37.740 That is the cursed reality we live in.

00:27:41.080 We all want to see this move more quickly, but that is the situation we have right now.

00:27:48.840 If, if both, if both of the sides, yeah.

00:27:50.660 So the hearing, the hearing, you can tell February 3rd.

00:27:54.380 Yeah.

00:27:56.040 We've got two months before we even get a next hearing on that.

00:28:00.680 Just, uh, yeah, it's, it's, it's as stressful for us as it is for everyone else.

00:28:06.060 I can assure you.

00:28:07.880 Yeah.

00:28:08.180 And Blake, I actually, when you said 30 years, I kind of hit me in the gut, but you're right.

00:28:11.480 I mean, this thing could be a very, very long process.

00:28:15.480 I mean, it's truly horrible.

00:28:17.160 I was, I once read in, in the seventies, uh, there was a serial killer in Houston and, uh,

00:28:24.020 several of them, in fact, it was a group operation.

00:28:25.800 So one of them died and the other went to prison for life and due to some glorious quirk of the

00:28:31.160 judicial system, that person is eligible for parole.

00:28:34.700 And so they, they literally were a group that abducted children and murdered them. 0.54

00:28:39.580 And every couple of years, the parents of one of their last victims have to go to the court

00:28:46.480 to present their arguments for why the person who murdered their child should not be out on

00:28:51.960 the streets again.

00:28:52.680 And it's just, we'll just, this will continue as long as they are alive.

00:28:57.160 And I just think about what a tragedy that is for a person who like their entire life

00:29:03.240 was a waste.

00:29:04.600 They used it to destroy other people's lives and we preserve them for some reason.

00:29:10.660 I, I don't understand it.

00:29:12.220 I don't understand why we moved away from justice as a principle that our state can wield, but

00:29:19.040 that is what we have.

00:29:20.900 And it leads to a lot of re-traumatization of, of people like those parents, like Erica

00:29:26.360 Kirk, like, like a lot of people.

00:29:30.000 Well, Blake, are you familiar with that case?

00:29:31.760 And Cliff, you might know this because it's Philadelphia of Mumia Abu-Jamal.

00:29:36.740 Fry Mumia. 0.99

00:29:37.520 Now, fill me in.

00:29:40.280 Yeah.

00:29:41.280 So, Mumia, this is a guy who, think about this, he killed a police officer, Black Panther, 0.94

00:29:47.360 so he shot a police officer in cold blood before I was born in 1980.

00:29:53.360 Well, he killed him in 1981, then he sentenced to death in 1982.

00:29:57.420 And years and years and years go by, 20 years go by, he's still alive, he's still on death

00:30:05.280 row, he's filing a field, filing a field.

00:30:07.500 The widow of the police officer who is so young, Maureen Faulkner, the wife of Danny Faulkner,

00:30:13.120 you know, widow of Danny Faulkner, is, is begging over and over for this justice to be 0.98

00:30:19.180 done on this.

00:30:19.800 And then eventually, 30 years after the murder, because things have become so woke in the city

00:30:25.260 of Philadelphia, that in 2011, the prosecution simply agrees to change his sentence to life

00:30:32.200 without parole.

00:30:33.380 So, he gets life without parole, he's in Gen Pop, and this is what they can do there now. 0.91

00:30:38.440 He became sort of a quasi-celebrity.

00:30:41.600 You have, you know, like Rage Against the Machine and all these people coming in for him.

00:30:46.040 And so, Blake, to your point, this is a big problem when we wait so long to execute murderers

00:30:52.840 that emotions fade, memories fade, people move on to other things, and different narratives

00:31:00.840 can get in.

00:31:01.560 And in this case, they waited so long that the case was actually taken away, the sentence

00:31:06.560 was actually taken away, and now we just have life in prison.

00:31:08.700 And there's a shortage of justice.

00:31:10.080 Like, people, I think there is a psychic feeling across America that they think there's a lack

00:31:15.320 of justice for things that have gone wrong.

00:31:18.960 You often hear that in reference to COVID, that lockdowns were obviously a catastrophic

00:31:22.840 decision, a ton of people suffered a lot, and then nobody ever was really held accountable

00:31:27.560 financially, criminally, socially even, for what they did.

00:31:31.880 Like, at a minimum, someone responsible for something that bad should feel a little ashamed

00:31:35.640 to go outside, and that never happened.

00:31:39.060 And I do feel that's one of the important arguments in favor of capital punishment.

00:31:44.340 There should be a high-profile way, something that goes on semi-regularly if you're in a society

00:31:50.580 with crimes, that reminds you people who do grave works of evil will be ripped out of society

00:31:57.760 like the cancers that they are.

00:31:59.800 And I don't think it's a surprise that when you have a society afraid to execute the worst

00:32:06.340 malefactors, you have a society that is increasingly detached from any principle of right and wrong

00:32:12.200 whatsoever.

00:32:15.440 Yeah, and look, I mean, I...

00:32:16.800 And there's no deterrent.

00:32:18.520 There's just no deterrent.

00:32:20.160 Yeah, and look, I mean, I spent a lot of time, I mean, Trump's first term, the First Step Act,

00:32:23.980 right, a lot of people on the right, criminal justice reform, we were all about it.

00:32:27.080 But here's the big difference.

00:32:28.520 We were talking nonviolent.

00:32:30.520 And this is where I think a lot of people on the left have kind of lost it, not just

00:32:33.380 with defund the police, but it becomes at any law on the books, you know, we need to have

00:32:37.580 sympathy for those because the justice system is flawed.

00:32:41.180 And it's just not true, right?

00:32:43.100 Obviously, the justice system can be flawed.

00:32:45.480 But this idea of like soft on crime across the board, it's kind of this vicious, like,

00:32:51.360 they're just all in on that.

00:32:53.140 And to me, like you said, when you have these things that are very, very much not what I

00:32:58.340 would call nonviolent, these horrific crimes, I think it should be the opposite.

00:33:02.060 Like you said, we should make an example of these people.

00:33:04.760 And I took a look, I spent a lot of time being against the death penalty, probably 10

00:33:08.020 years.

00:33:08.880 And to be frank with you guys, this was probably the moment where I realized when something

00:33:13.500 hit close to home with somebody that we knew that, you know, it's easy to theorize about

00:33:19.480 that and to say, well, you know, I don't trust the government to kill somebody.

00:33:22.980 But in certain circumstances, it is very justified.

00:33:26.440 And obviously, I believe this is one of those.

00:33:29.180 We have got a question from a gibberish nation asked, can the feds go back and charge 0.97

00:33:33.320 Robinson with causing Charlie to lose his federal rights by murder and thereby seek the death

00:33:39.780 penalty if it is not obtained through the state court?

00:33:43.220 I suppose the most important question is, is that, do you guys know, is that a capital

00:33:46.720 offense, a deprivation of civil rights in that matter?

00:33:50.100 That would be an important question.

00:33:51.560 Obviously, we have seen.

00:33:55.620 You would have to charge him with a form of terrorism, I believe, to be a capital offense.

00:34:01.360 Yeah, that would be my guess.

00:34:04.300 I'm sure that that has entered their mind as a way.

00:34:07.620 Yeah, terrorism, maybe they could get some sort of federal murder charge.

00:34:13.700 They're always creative with those if they cross federal property to do it or something

00:34:18.940 like that.

00:34:19.900 I wouldn't be surprised if that's on the table.

00:34:21.620 But part of that is that's one of the things about it taking so long.

00:34:23.960 Are you going to suddenly come in and charge him if this verdict is finally reached a year

00:34:29.760 from now, a year and a half from now?

00:34:31.900 That is something I'm not sure of.

00:34:34.140 I'm sure they would make a show of it.

00:34:35.940 But again, by the time that would be done, you might be in a new presidential administration,

00:34:40.460 might be a Democrat.

00:34:42.880 And let's be careful what we wish for.

00:34:44.740 Obviously, we want justice for Charlie, but you don't want to get in the habit of the federal

00:34:48.180 government coming in and finding some law or something that they can.

00:34:52.560 I mean, what's John Stassel's book?

00:34:54.140 Three Felonies a Day, right?

00:34:55.320 If the government wants to come after you, they can.

00:34:59.980 So I do want justice here, but let's just get the win here in Utah and not try to find

00:35:06.700 a way that the federal government can come in and try to.

00:35:08.880 Yeah, the answer to the question is yes.

00:35:10.280 Of course, if the feds wanted to do it, they could try to do it.

00:35:12.820 It'd be unprecedented, but they could try to do it.

00:35:15.620 I don't think we want to be in the position where the federal government, God willing,

00:35:19.160 it's not J.D. Vance after 28.

00:35:21.520 I don't want them backdating things and coming after us for random acts that they deem as some

00:35:26.400 sort of federal offense.

00:35:28.100 I mean, you certainly can add that Derek Chauvin got federal charges added to his state charges.

00:35:36.180 So, I mean, this this wouldn't be the first time that there were there were two sets of

00:35:41.260 cases.

00:35:41.820 And I'm not saying it's prudent necessarily do so, but certainly just in a basic answer

00:35:48.100 to the question, yes, the federal government can do that and certainly have the right to

00:35:51.780 do that.

00:35:52.100 So, all right, it looks like it looks like I just want to say because they did donate

00:35:57.140 and we always try to read those.

00:35:58.340 I said I do it when we got to change topics, but the chat is super locked into this topic.

00:36:02.140 So I think we're staying zeroed in on the Robinson saga, but I wanted to call this.

00:36:06.380 So be Jordan two, four, five, six, three donated $20 and said, appreciate the show, guys.

00:36:11.480 We appreciate you, Jordan.

00:36:13.060 And hoping the Sharon Moore situation might come up this week.

00:36:16.380 For those who don't know, the coach of Michigan football got caught, I believe, impregnating

00:36:21.560 an undergraduate, not advised.

00:36:23.060 That would be an amazing topic, but we have a more serious topic that is very close to our

00:36:28.940 hearts that does deserve our full attention this week.

00:36:32.380 But I agree.

00:36:33.280 It is a very fun story.

00:36:35.020 And again, thank you for your support.

00:36:36.760 Thank you for tuning in.

00:36:37.820 But yeah, on this one, yeah, you're right.

00:36:42.520 Turning point.

00:36:42.980 We have to stay focused for Charlie.

00:36:44.940 We have to watch this case.

00:36:46.880 We anyone else.

00:36:48.480 Someone's just a Chad 89 says Antifa being a terrorist organization could be enough for

00:36:54.560 a federal charge.

00:36:55.860 I guess you would have to find you would have to be able to prove that he even considered

00:37:00.680 himself acting on as an agent of Antifa.

00:37:03.520 So that would be something where if we have a very thorough look at his discord messages,

00:37:10.440 any chat groups he was in, you might be able to find that.

00:37:14.440 But if he's not, if he never uses Antifa to describe himself, if he's not in contact,

00:37:19.860 that could be tough.

00:37:20.540 It's always there are things that can bring you down.

00:37:23.680 So I don't I guess I would encourage us to view this trial as by far our best shot to

00:37:29.820 get the accountability we want for Robinson.

00:37:32.420 And we would only consider alternatives if that's just not going to come to pass.

00:37:35.980 That's my thought.

00:37:38.100 Yeah.

00:37:38.600 And also, as an example, the Maggioni case, depending on where you take this, you know,

00:37:43.320 you got to make sure you have a judge that actually believes in upholding the law.

00:37:46.360 So the regime of Maggioni was charged under federal terrorism.

00:37:50.400 And the judge in that case, this liberal judge, actually threw it out.

00:37:54.840 So he threw out the terrorism charge because he said that, well, this isn't terrorism that

00:38:01.700 when Maggioni murdered the health care CEO and the judge, as a liberal, said that it wasn't

00:38:07.380 terrorism because it was only murdering one person and that his actions weren't intended

00:38:13.580 to cause harm or intimidation to others.

00:38:16.660 Despite the fact that he, just like Tyler Robinson, wrote political slogans on his bullet, had

00:38:22.980 a manifesto, had all the intent in the world to spark what he called justice for, you know,

00:38:30.880 the issues in the health care system, inequality in the health care system.

00:38:34.340 And yet the judge said, and the judge actually imparted his ruling in that because in the

00:38:39.020 New York, this isn't even a state judge, so I may have to double-check myself, but I

00:38:44.600 remember it was the terrorism charge, and I thought I'm talking about it.

00:38:47.060 But he said that the way the statute was written was that it affected harm to civilians.

00:38:54.180 And under the statute, he ruled that health care workers don't count as civilians because

00:38:59.920 that only means the public at large.

00:39:02.480 I mean, it was the most twisted ruling and the most twisted reading of the statute that

00:39:06.920 I've ever seen.

00:39:07.900 And I'm like, this guy must obviously be a liberal to say that, oh, well, if you work

00:39:11.920 for a health care company, you're not a civilian.

00:39:13.820 It's like, yeah, that's exactly how Allmark was saying.

00:39:20.480 Yeah, one point I'll make, I mean, you know, I've seen a lot of these different cases where

00:39:24.460 the law can say, you know, the sky is blue, but if a judge says, hey, you know, today it's

00:39:30.340 red, it's like, it really, once again, there are flaws in the justice system, and some of

00:39:35.500 these judges and some of the rulings, it can be as clear as day to all of us.

00:39:39.540 And, you know, I mean, these judges are elected, right, or they're appointed by somebody that

00:39:43.100 we elected, and that system's supposed to work, but sometimes it's just broken, and it stinks,

00:39:47.700 and you got to power through it.

00:39:48.560 And so I've been asked, say, what is the psychology of a Robin Simp?

00:39:56.880 And I'll ask you guys this.

00:39:58.200 So do you guys know, so a Robin Simper, so a Robin Simper is who, and not just ask questions

00:40:04.400 about the public narrative, but you ask questions, you ask questions about evidence, ask questions

00:40:09.020 about the FBI, fine, go ahead, First Amendment right.

00:40:11.440 But there are people that are full on Tyler Robin Simper, who are just like, this guy didn't

00:40:15.500 do it, I don't believe the parents, I don't believe any of it.

00:40:17.920 But, you know, he needs to get off, we need to work to get him off, and that makes you

00:40:21.160 a Robin Simper.

00:40:22.480 And are you guys familiar with the term pro-burgers?

00:40:26.360 Have you guys ever heard of this, pro-burgers? 1.00

00:40:28.640 Pro-burgers? 0.77

00:40:29.360 No.

00:40:31.200 I only eat amateur burgers, Jack.

00:40:34.540 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:40:35.160 So have you, but do you guys remember Brian Koberger, as in the murderer up in Idaho of those 0.88

00:40:41.360 sorority girls? 0.97

00:40:42.140 Oh, oh, the guy who looks like Richard Hanania crossed with Josh Hawley?

00:40:47.920 Yes.

00:40:48.600 And it kind of looks a bit like Tyler Robinson, because he doesn't lie.

00:40:52.640 So the pro-burgers are a subset of the true crime community, where they completely believe 0.96

00:41:00.000 that Brian Koberger is innocent, that he was set up, that someone else did that.

00:41:06.080 And they have formed, it's kind of a mini cult.

00:41:08.860 They have this parasocial relationship with a variety of people who lead the pro-burger

00:41:14.700 cult, and it's basically like a fandom cult of him.

00:41:18.940 They have shrines, they have song, they have, like, edits of Brian Koberger.

00:41:24.220 Obviously, you see this a lot with Luigi Maggioni, who rated that.

00:41:27.220 Um, and you see, you even see people taking trips to go and visit the places associated

00:41:34.620 with Brian Koberger, because they believed so strongly in his, uh, in his innocence.

00:41:41.480 But it's beyond, it's so far beyond just, you know, oh, I think this guy didn't do it.

00:41:46.600 It's literally become their identity, because I don't know if, it's like, you don't have

00:41:51.900 meaning at home, or you're disconnected and disassociated with life.

00:41:56.220 Um, it is female-coded, bad to say, it's just true. 1.00

00:41:59.580 It's, uh, it's very female-coded, where, yeah, they will completely allow this to subsume 0.99

00:42:05.020 their identity.

00:42:06.260 Well, what's funny is, I have to imagine, really deep down, they would not want him to

00:42:11.600 be innocent, because clearly their actual thought is that he did do it.

00:42:15.680 They just, this is weird to say, they think it's hot, I guess?

00:42:18.880 Like, he's this dark, killer person?

00:42:22.800 Like, I don't think they would find this guy terribly interesting if he wasn't a murderer.

00:42:26.360 Hybristophilia?

00:42:29.260 What's that, I want?

00:42:31.120 Hybristophilia.

00:42:33.600 Hybristophilia?

00:42:33.800 Hybristophilia is a, hybristophilia, I'm sorry if my audio is being messed up again.

00:42:39.960 So, hybristophilia is a paraphilia.

00:42:42.220 It's a type of sexual attraction for people who commit serious crimes.

00:42:45.680 Now, you saw this, uh, with the, the Columbine shooters.

00:42:50.120 You see this with a variety of fillers.

00:42:51.860 You saw this with the Boston Bombers over at Don Aya, where people who are, um, I believe

00:42:57.280 it was, um, oh gosh.

00:42:59.460 There are, Ted Bundy got married while he was still in jail.

00:43:02.640 And, you know, they, they believe that they're super attracted sexually to bad boys, criminals,

00:43:08.600 deviance, and they want those typical risky, you know, risky relationships.

00:43:14.080 And so they're attracted to criminals.

00:43:16.320 So yeah, Ted Bundy, um, I'm, I wouldn't surprise me if there were people who were attracted to

00:43:20.920 Jeffrey Dahmer.

00:43:21.780 It's, it's absolutely a certain, um, paraphilia that's out there.

00:43:25.620 And it's this desire for intense, risky relationship.

00:43:29.440 Yeah.

00:43:29.600 You want, like, did Jeffrey Dahmer get letters in jail just saying, like, please eat me,

00:43:33.480 Jeffrey, please?

00:43:35.440 Yeah.

00:43:35.820 And this is, this is why you see, I mean, a lot of the true crime documentaries, it's

00:43:39.020 kind of wild to me how many of these serial killers have so many lovers, right?

00:43:43.240 That they're exchanging letters with.

00:43:44.980 Um, and it directly comes from, like you said, that, that weird desire, uh, to be with the

00:43:49.540 bad boys, if you will, you even get funnier versions, funny sub versions of that.

00:43:55.460 Like, um, didn't Martin, Martin Shkreli had that journalist fall in love with him while

00:44:00.180 he was in jail.

00:44:00.860 And I think she, did she leave her, she like left her boyfriend or, or even left her husband 0.95

00:44:05.280 over it.

00:44:06.500 And this was a purely non-physical relationship.

00:44:08.480 He was in prison the whole time and then he got out and I think they, they quite promptly

00:44:12.080 broke up once he was out of prison.

00:44:15.980 Weird.

00:44:16.660 Weird.

00:44:17.180 So Martin Shkreli, exactly.

00:44:18.380 But Martin Shkreli did nothing wrong, so.

00:44:23.200 Jack's part of the cult.

00:44:24.220 I love it.

00:44:26.520 No, Martin Shkreli was not a murderer.

00:44:28.420 Martin Shkreli was a pharma bro.

00:44:30.120 Oh, oh, okay.

00:44:30.900 Got it.

00:44:31.200 Got it.

00:44:32.660 Yeah, it's a little like his, his crime.

00:44:34.700 It felt odd.

00:44:35.620 I just felt like it wasn't spectacular enough to get a woman swooning for you over it, but

00:44:40.300 she was, she was really into it.

00:44:42.360 And then he, man, I haven't heard about that guy since he, he kind of tried to get

00:44:45.680 Barron Trump into that crypto thing, but I guess that's getting a little off topic.

00:44:52.400 He's, he's on Twitter.

00:44:53.280 I see, I see him there every once in a while.

00:44:55.560 He does like spaces and stuff.

00:44:56.940 But, um, let's see.

00:45:00.220 And we only have a couple of more minutes because we do, unfortunately, have a hard

00:45:04.900 out today.

00:45:07.140 And just looking through the chat right here again.

00:45:14.040 And guys, just do me, do me a favor.

00:45:15.600 Throw that picture of Tyler Robinson up again from the court today.

00:45:19.200 Please do that.

00:45:20.280 As much as it pains with all of us.

00:45:21.720 Just do it.

00:45:22.340 Because I, I, there is something I want to say when we look at this picture.

00:45:29.800 This is not the behavior of a patsy, guys.

00:45:33.340 This is not the behavior.

00:45:34.960 This is not the way it would look.

00:45:36.460 This is not the way that a person would comport themselves if they were thinking, oh, I was

00:45:41.100 set up.

00:45:41.860 Oh, I shouldn't be here.

00:45:43.440 Oh, you gotta, you gotta get me out.

00:45:45.320 I was falsely accused.

00:45:46.220 This guy doesn't look upset at all.

00:45:47.400 I didn't see in a single one of these images or videos, any image of him actually looking

00:45:54.960 upset.

00:45:55.820 It's not there.

00:45:56.800 He's happy.

00:45:57.640 He's grinning.

00:45:58.400 He's smug.

00:45:59.260 He's smug about what he did.

00:46:01.000 And look, you know, say what you want about me.

00:46:03.640 I don't really care.

00:46:04.500 Honestly, I've never cared.

00:46:05.480 People call me all sorts of things.

00:46:07.560 But this guy, this guy's sitting there looking smug.

00:46:10.700 He's sitting there looking smug.

00:46:12.760 And it's as simple as that.

00:46:13.640 The other thing that bothers me is the longer that this case goes, it's just going to continuously

00:46:19.060 be more attention.

00:46:20.000 I mean, obviously, I want attention to honor Charlie, but it's just going to be more fodder

00:46:23.780 for all the trolls, right?

00:46:25.360 Every time that this is live, every time it's out there, every time there's something new

00:46:28.940 and this grin, obviously, you know, the first time we're seeing him, it should make us all

00:46:32.980 burn inside.

00:46:34.080 And I'm sure the people that, you know, praise him and the people that celebrated the death

00:46:38.140 of Charlie, you know, they love seeing that, right?

00:46:40.880 This gives them something else to share, something else to celebrate.

00:46:43.920 And they're just pieces of garbage.

00:46:45.780 I'm going to continue to say that.

00:46:48.760 Absolute and utter pieces of garbage.

00:46:52.400 Blake, did you say you had something?

00:46:54.060 Yeah, well, we have a good, we have a nice message.

00:46:56.880 We have this one from Kyrie McAllen, another, I see her in the chat all the time.

00:47:03.060 Kyrie donated to 10 and says, please give us who love Charlie, his family, the Charlie Kirk

00:47:09.100 show team, and all the teams of Turning Point some practical ways that we can share the

00:47:15.700 arrows, as Ali Stuckey says, that are being directed at all of you.

00:47:21.240 You know, I think the best way is know the details of this case.

00:47:27.660 Read the indictment.

00:47:29.440 All right, guys.

00:47:29.900 Well, I'm told I have to leave, so see you.

00:47:31.520 Oh, no, oh, no, we're losing Jack.

00:47:33.700 Well, thank you, Jack.

00:47:35.200 Jack, I want to close out this thought before we lose it, because you should.

00:47:39.460 Charging documents are online.

00:47:41.120 The evidence against him is online.

00:47:42.580 And you can also go read, search a guy named Turkey Tom.

00:47:46.680 There's a video you can look up called, I believe it is, The Man Who Killed Charlie Kirk.

00:47:51.380 Obviously, he's presumed innocent, but that is the title of the video.

00:47:55.800 Let me make sure I have that exactly right.

00:48:00.420 It is, can you help me out here, Angelo?

00:48:04.940 What's the name of the title?

00:48:09.600 The Man Who Killed Charlie Kirk.

00:48:10.780 Okay, I had that correct.

00:48:11.520 Okay, it is titled The Man Who Killed Charlie Kirk.

00:48:13.820 And there's also a, if you prefer reading, there's a substack post that you can find by

00:48:17.720 the same person.

00:48:18.500 And what it gets into is it gets into the evidence about his personal life, his relationship

00:48:25.140 with his boyfriend, the evidence, you know, the stuff people have said is weird, such as

00:48:30.800 him calling his boyfriend my love in their messages, the guy saying that is, in fact, how

00:48:35.740 they talk to each other.

00:48:37.360 If you guys want to help share the arrows, learn those facts, because the most common thing

00:48:41.940 you see is you see the Robin simps, as they're calling them, who are going to just 0.86

00:48:48.460 say, oh, he's a patsy.

00:48:50.600 Oh, there's no evidence for this.

00:48:52.800 Oh, I think it's all fake.

00:48:54.940 In truth, I think they're saying this because this is a drawn out process and not enough

00:49:00.660 of it is on TV, basically, for them to feel like it's real.

00:49:04.960 But it is real.

00:49:06.300 The evidence in this case, we believe, is quite strong.

00:49:09.960 If we thought it was fake, if we thought they had the wrong guy, we would obviously be freaking

00:49:15.160 out because we care deeply that the correct person be brought to justice for this.

00:49:21.040 So the best way you can share those arrows is know those facts.

00:49:24.220 So if it comes up in passing, you're able to say, oh, man, did you hear about this?

00:49:29.400 Did you hear about the stuff that they were into?

00:49:32.160 Did you hear about this nesting?

00:49:33.620 Because it really is a bizarre case.

00:49:37.140 You could make a fascinating, there will be fascinating true crime documentaries about

00:49:42.460 all of this one day because it is lurid.

00:49:45.140 It is incredibly upsetting to see the life, the lives that these people were leading and

00:49:51.220 to think that this allowed a person to go and to just go and randomly strike down a person

00:49:56.860 as great as Charlie.

00:49:58.560 So maybe you have your own thoughts, Cliff, but that's my thought on how to share the load.

00:50:03.540 Yeah, I mean, of course, referring to, you know, the public perception of what's happening

00:50:07.460 in the trial.

00:50:08.260 But I also want to say what would Charlie want us to do to share the arrows is to go do the

00:50:12.720 work, right?

00:50:13.780 Obviously, I'm not always going to pitch that we got to be out chasing ballots, but I wouldn't

00:50:16.980 be doing my job if I didn't get out there, you know, get involved, find a way to advance

00:50:22.020 our cause when it comes to the political scene, when it comes to the ideology of trying to

00:50:26.280 reach new people.

00:50:27.600 That's the way to share it, right?

00:50:29.320 I'm not saying you have to ignore the trial.

00:50:30.840 Obviously, we're all going to follow along.

00:50:32.340 We're rooting for justice for Charlie.

00:50:34.280 But at the same time, we have to double down.

00:50:36.920 We have to go out there.

00:50:37.920 Turning Point has to survive.

00:50:39.580 Turning Point has to thrive in terms of not just campus, but all the Turning Point

00:50:43.760 Action, all the efforts, the things that we're doing, that's what this is all about.

00:50:48.320 And when I think about what Charlie would be telling me right now, it would be, yes, honor

00:50:52.760 him, follow the trial.

00:50:55.320 But at the end of the day, we cannot get distracted.

00:50:58.800 And what I mean by that is not that we're going to not give him the homage that he deserves,

00:51:03.100 but he would want us to do the work.

00:51:05.500 And so for all of you out there that have done certain things, whether it was 2024 or

00:51:10.460 before, 2026 is coming up.

00:51:12.780 And that's a huge opportunity for us to get involved and to truly make a difference when

00:51:18.000 it comes to figuring out ways to do the work as Charlie would want us to do.

00:51:22.120 Exactly, exactly.

00:51:24.300 Like, in the end, a lot of the nastiest stuff that's said, it's said because it wants to

00:51:29.260 hurt the mission.

00:51:32.000 It's people on the left who promoted, oh, actually a MAGA guy did this.

00:51:36.320 They say that for ideologically motivated reasons.

00:51:38.880 And people from other aspects do it.

00:51:40.640 They want to, ultimately, for whatever thing is going through their head, they want to tear

00:51:45.920 down the things that Charlie fought for, the things that Charlie died for.

00:51:51.860 And so along with what I suggested, Cliff is absolutely right.

00:51:55.020 Do the work.

00:51:55.840 You want to be engaged?

00:51:56.680 If you're in Indiana, we've been talking about that.

00:51:59.220 They just had that vote on their redistricting map, and it failed.

00:52:02.540 It failed not because of Democrats.

00:52:04.360 It failed because of Republicans.

00:52:05.500 And so we've been saying Turning Point Action will be taking action on that.

00:52:09.100 If you're in that state, that is an easy way to get involved with something right now

00:52:13.220 that is relevant.

00:52:13.980 But I know other people are saying they want to find out other facts.

00:52:18.220 Some people mentioned Paramount Tactical.

00:52:20.120 I was just looking at their videos the other day.

00:52:22.140 They have great videos just talking about the details of the case, how we can know what

00:52:26.980 happened or why some things people are saying about the bullet, for example.

00:52:31.140 There's been a lot of claims, oh, this bullet could not possibly have been what killed Charlie.

00:52:35.840 And there's some great Paramount Tacticals one.

00:52:37.980 There's other gun experts who've dived into that.

00:52:40.500 And believe me, you'll hear more from us on that in just a matter of a few days.

00:52:45.820 But we have, I think, one more message here, and then we'll close it out because we have

00:52:51.480 this hard out here.

00:52:53.980 EB Dim the Ninth.

00:52:56.240 Eb Dim the Ninth?

00:52:57.220 I'll go with that.

00:52:58.080 Eb Dim the Ninth.

00:52:59.320 Be blessed in the Lord, Brother Blake and crew.

00:53:02.980 Thank you so much for that.

00:53:04.440 Thank you to everyone who tuned in for this, and we'll see you next week.

00:53:10.900 AmFest, I believe we're doing ThoughtCrime on stage at AmFest next week.

00:53:15.060 We encourage you to tune into that and tune in to every other part of AmFest.

00:53:19.480 Until then, and until always, keep committing thought crime.

00:53:25.580 Thoughtcrime is death.

00:53:26.840 Thoughtcrime is death.

00:53:27.740 Thoughtcrime is death.

00:53:28.640 Thoughtcrime is death.

00:53:29.740 Thoughtcrime is death.

00:53:30.740 Thoughtcrime is death.

00:53:31.740 Thoughtcrime is death.

00:53:32.740 Thoughtcrime is death.

Human Events Daily with Jack Posobiec - December 13, 2025

THOUGHTCRIME Ep. 109 — Tyler Robinson In Court？ AI George Washington？ Charlie, Person of the Year？

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