Juno News - October 29, 2022


Alberta lawyer takes aim at CAF vax mandate


Episode Stats

Length

18 minutes

Words per Minute

168.68149

Word Count

3,093

Sentence Count

109

Misogynist Sentences

2

Hate Speech Sentences

4


Summary


Transcript

00:00:00.000 Welcome back to the Andrew Lawton Show.
00:00:10.760 This is Canada's most irreverent talk show.
00:00:13.580 We have talked a lot on this program about vaccine mandates,
00:00:17.200 federal, provincial, international.
00:00:19.580 One that we have not focused on as much
00:00:22.140 is the Canadian Armed Forces vaccine mandate.
00:00:25.680 And part of this is because I think it was part of,
00:00:28.580 certainly when I was discussing it,
00:00:30.000 it was part of the broader vaccine mandates
00:00:32.500 that the Liberal government put in last fall
00:00:34.500 for the entire civil service.
00:00:36.420 But there have been different nuances to it
00:00:39.740 that I think make it worth taking an extra look at this.
00:00:43.120 And one of them, I think, is the demographic profile
00:00:45.620 of who it is that's in the Canadian Armed Forces.
00:00:47.580 These are the people at the least risk possible
00:00:50.920 for having serious complications from COVID-19.
00:00:54.140 But also the idea of authority and obedience
00:00:56.700 and the chain of command,
00:00:57.900 these things that have really, I think,
00:00:59.440 complicated the ability for someone
00:01:01.980 to say no to this vaccine
00:01:04.280 or to say no to following the mandate.
00:01:07.300 Well, there's a proposed class action now
00:01:09.440 against this vaccine mandate,
00:01:11.180 representing so far hundreds of people
00:01:13.080 that were put on leave,
00:01:14.680 whose future careers in the Canadian Armed Forces
00:01:17.340 are still in uncertain territory
00:01:19.680 because of this mandate.
00:01:21.020 This has been fought by Catherine Christensen,
00:01:23.980 who's a lawyer based in Alberta
00:01:25.480 and the founder of the Valor Legal Action Centre,
00:01:28.760 which is a not-for-profit that is fighting this case.
00:01:32.440 Catherine Christensen joins me now.
00:01:34.300 Thanks so much for coming on the show today.
00:01:36.040 Good to talk to you.
00:01:37.580 Good to talk to you, Andrew.
00:01:38.820 We're happy to be here.
00:01:39.880 So what is this case about, really?
00:01:42.700 Obviously, the vaccine mandate, incredibly disruptive.
00:01:45.580 I would argue just plain wrong.
00:01:47.260 But we also know that it caused a number of issues
00:01:50.680 as far as shortages, confusion,
00:01:53.360 not to mention the legal rights aspect of this.
00:01:56.160 But what is really the core of this class action
00:01:58.480 you're proposing to bring?
00:02:00.940 Well, Andrew, I've been watching
00:02:02.760 the Canadian Armed Forces for a few years.
00:02:04.520 My practice has always been with military and veterans.
00:02:08.440 And I have noticed a real trend
00:02:11.060 in some of the things that they were doing to their people.
00:02:15.220 And then last October,
00:02:16.140 I was approached by a group of hundreds of military,
00:02:20.900 serving military,
00:02:21.860 who were affected by the first directive, the mandate,
00:02:25.820 and now subsequently mandate 2A and 3A.
00:02:29.640 And I have to tell you
00:02:31.520 that it was sort of the perfect package
00:02:33.460 to bring what is essentially an abuse of power lawsuit
00:02:37.180 against the Canadian Armed Forces.
00:02:39.060 It's not about the mandate itself.
00:02:41.420 It's about how the Canadian Armed Forces
00:02:43.960 have abused their people.
00:02:46.400 And their chain of command is in absolute chaos.
00:02:49.740 And for all of General Eyre's talking about
00:02:53.140 everyone has to follow his orders,
00:02:54.980 they aren't.
00:02:55.900 And it's caused some very big consequences
00:02:58.160 for some very dedicated,
00:03:01.040 long-serving members of the Canadian Armed Forces.
00:03:04.580 For people that haven't followed the intricacies of this,
00:03:07.280 when you say mandate 1, mandate 2, 2A, 3,
00:03:10.700 what are you referring to there?
00:03:12.080 What are those different mandates that have come in
00:03:13.900 or updates to the mandate?
00:03:16.220 Right.
00:03:16.520 So last October,
00:03:18.660 the Chief of Defence staff issued a directive.
00:03:22.320 And the first directive was to bring in
00:03:24.080 that COVID-19 vaccines were now mandatory
00:03:28.660 for service in the Canadian Armed Forces.
00:03:31.160 He then subsequently did a couple of amendments
00:03:34.160 with a second directive
00:03:35.700 and then an amendment of that second directive,
00:03:39.700 which I call 2A.
00:03:40.740 And then just recently in the last month,
00:03:43.720 he's brought down Directive 3,
00:03:46.060 which was touted as a removal of the mandate.
00:03:49.800 It doesn't actually remove the mandate.
00:03:51.900 It continues if you want to do anything
00:03:53.920 in the Canadian Armed Forces.
00:03:55.520 But what it did was say that,
00:03:58.120 well, if we haven't already released you,
00:04:00.360 which was under the first directives,
00:04:02.980 that if you didn't get the vaccine,
00:04:04.560 you were to be discharged under a 5F,
00:04:06.940 which used to be dishonourable,
00:04:09.020 but has been made honourable
00:04:10.800 in the last tough couple of years.
00:04:12.760 Some of these people were not released
00:04:14.300 in the 30 days like they were threatened with.
00:04:17.000 And so they've been told now to come back to work.
00:04:19.480 But they've been put into situations
00:04:22.020 where they're sitting by themselves
00:04:24.000 in empty buildings.
00:04:25.900 They've been told they don't basically
00:04:27.520 get to do anything.
00:04:29.280 In fact, I have one person who is unvaccinated,
00:04:32.400 was told to come back to work.
00:04:33.680 And he's been assigned to help take care
00:04:36.920 of people who are quarantined for COVID-19.
00:04:40.420 So ironically, that's what this is.
00:04:43.820 The Chief of Defence Staff should have said,
00:04:46.940 because under the National Defence Act,
00:04:49.280 Section 126, he has the power to say
00:04:53.300 that you must be vaccinated
00:04:54.660 to serve in the Canadian Armed Forces.
00:04:57.240 If you refuse, you are brought with a charge
00:05:00.320 and court-martialed.
00:05:02.040 They didn't do that.
00:05:03.240 They went to what was called remedial measures
00:05:05.420 and basically did an administrative process,
00:05:08.700 which is completely unanswerable
00:05:11.980 until it gets brought into court,
00:05:14.920 which can take years
00:05:16.000 because it may go through a grievance process.
00:05:19.300 So that's one of the questions I have.
00:05:20.380 And just to confirm,
00:05:21.040 what happens to people in that interim period
00:05:23.700 while they're waiting for a court date?
00:05:25.160 They basically are suspended.
00:05:29.900 They still, they can't put anyone
00:05:32.140 in the Canadian Armed Forces
00:05:33.220 under a leave without pay.
00:05:35.420 The Canadian Armed Forces
00:05:36.300 are different than the federal employees.
00:05:38.220 They have to ask for a leave without pay.
00:05:40.920 They cannot be ordered
00:05:42.100 to take a leave without pay.
00:05:43.660 So that was part of the issue
00:05:44.720 with the first directive
00:05:45.680 because they talked about
00:05:46.660 putting people on leave without pay.
00:05:48.480 Of course, that was challenged
00:05:50.240 and they had to backtrack.
00:05:51.540 So the people that haven't had
00:05:54.420 anything happen to them
00:05:55.300 in the past year
00:05:56.040 have basically been sitting at home
00:05:57.860 waiting to be released
00:06:00.180 as they were threatened
00:06:01.000 they would be released
00:06:01.920 and they haven't been.
00:06:03.560 Now they've been told
00:06:04.320 to come back to work.
00:06:05.660 Why is it that
00:06:06.660 the Canadian Armed Forces mandate
00:06:08.660 seems to be distinct
00:06:10.440 in terms of how it's unfolded
00:06:12.880 and what the challenges are
00:06:14.060 compared to the broader
00:06:15.200 public service mandate
00:06:16.480 that applied just in a blanket way
00:06:18.580 to everyone in the federal public service?
00:06:20.320 Why are these two different animals?
00:06:23.040 One of the big differences
00:06:24.240 is that how people were treated
00:06:27.220 in the Canadian Armed Forces
00:06:29.340 compared to the federal service.
00:06:30.900 In the federal service
00:06:31.600 they basically were sent home
00:06:33.240 on leave without pay.
00:06:34.680 When their mandate was suspended
00:06:35.820 they were told to come back to work.
00:06:37.700 In the Canadian Armed Forces
00:06:38.660 we have the chief of defense staff
00:06:40.160 going on the national news
00:06:41.440 telling people that don't get vaccinated
00:06:43.880 and want to serve in a uniform
00:06:45.920 aren't worthy.
00:06:47.220 That they're morally weak.
00:06:48.520 that their ethics aren't
00:06:49.940 where they should be
00:06:50.920 basically name calling them
00:06:53.500 and isolating them
00:06:54.500 which is a form of discrimination
00:06:56.220 and I would even argue
00:06:57.960 maybe some harassment.
00:06:59.480 Then we get what actually happened
00:07:00.880 to people on the ground
00:07:03.800 as these directives
00:07:06.060 were being unrolled
00:07:06.900 from pregnant women
00:07:09.360 who didn't know
00:07:10.880 if they wanted to take the vaccine
00:07:12.440 being charged with AWOL
00:07:14.220 because their obstetrician
00:07:15.360 put them in the hospital
00:07:16.420 due to the stress.
00:07:18.240 To young sailors
00:07:20.460 being isolated in a room
00:07:22.300 with four officers
00:07:23.800 and told to sign
00:07:24.900 a piece of paper
00:07:25.920 that they wouldn't follow
00:07:26.800 a lawful order
00:07:27.580 under complete coercion.
00:07:30.440 To a young man
00:07:32.340 made to stand outside
00:07:33.720 in January
00:07:34.600 at attention
00:07:36.080 where all his coat workers
00:07:37.320 could go past him
00:07:38.260 and say
00:07:39.180 because he wouldn't
00:07:40.160 take the vaccine.
00:07:41.060 He lasted a month
00:07:41.940 before he'd lost
00:07:43.420 15 pounds of muscle mass
00:07:44.980 and mentally
00:07:47.560 couldn't do it anymore
00:07:48.680 and he voluntarily released
00:07:50.480 because he just couldn't
00:07:52.040 cope with the punishment
00:07:53.680 that his commanding officer
00:07:56.340 was giving him.
00:07:57.680 I mean,
00:07:58.000 if she had done that
00:07:59.080 to someone
00:07:59.880 who was a prisoner of war
00:08:01.420 she'd be charged
00:08:02.200 with a war crime
00:08:02.920 and be brought up
00:08:03.640 in The Hague for it.
00:08:05.340 This is how these people
00:08:06.640 were being treated.
00:08:07.820 It wasn't a case
00:08:08.520 that they were just told
00:08:09.460 well, go home
00:08:10.300 and then they just sat at home
00:08:11.420 and did nothing.
00:08:12.460 They were actually being
00:08:13.840 deliberately isolated.
00:08:15.700 They were told
00:08:16.140 they would go to jail.
00:08:17.980 They were told
00:08:19.020 that their families
00:08:20.700 would starve,
00:08:22.260 that they would receive
00:08:23.140 no benefits,
00:08:24.440 that their pensions were gone.
00:08:26.160 All of these things
00:08:27.060 are not true.
00:08:29.260 And so it was very different
00:08:30.900 for these people
00:08:31.980 who were in uniform
00:08:32.900 that absolutely
00:08:34.540 dedicated their lives
00:08:36.160 to serving Canada
00:08:37.220 and then were
00:08:37.980 being treated like garbage
00:08:39.680 and thrown out like garbage
00:08:40.840 in my opinion.
00:08:42.320 I want to go back
00:08:43.080 to what you said
00:08:43.620 a moment ago
00:08:44.240 about being asked
00:08:45.100 to agree that
00:08:46.120 they were not following
00:08:46.980 a lawful order
00:08:47.780 because everyone knows
00:08:48.580 that in military
00:08:49.400 there's a chain of command
00:08:50.480 and that you do need
00:08:51.600 to have a level of obedience
00:08:52.980 but this has been clarified
00:08:54.620 over time
00:08:55.360 and it's that you have
00:08:56.300 to obey lawful orders.
00:08:58.060 And interestingly enough
00:08:59.080 just this week
00:08:59.820 there was the story
00:09:00.760 in the Canadian press
00:09:01.980 that the chief
00:09:03.280 of the defence staff
00:09:04.020 was warned
00:09:04.660 that this mandate
00:09:05.680 might not actually
00:09:07.080 be a lawful order.
00:09:08.360 So there isn't actually
00:09:09.620 something we can take
00:09:10.440 for granted here
00:09:11.220 that the Canadian Armed Forces
00:09:12.780 can rely on
00:09:13.620 that this was in fact
00:09:14.640 a lawful order.
00:09:16.180 Exactly.
00:09:17.400 The Canadian Armed Forces
00:09:18.440 have a reputation
00:09:19.420 internationally
00:09:20.420 for having smart people.
00:09:23.060 People that are willing
00:09:24.520 to question
00:09:25.220 and willing to say
00:09:26.360 to their chain of command
00:09:27.440 I don't think
00:09:28.460 that's a lawful order
00:09:29.460 or no I will not do that
00:09:31.320 based on my ethics
00:09:33.540 or my religion
00:09:34.760 whatever the case may be.
00:09:37.280 And so that's what
00:09:37.900 they came up against
00:09:38.800 when they issued
00:09:39.440 these directives
00:09:40.320 because how it usually
00:09:42.200 works in the military
00:09:43.280 is you don't get
00:09:44.680 the chief of defence staff
00:09:46.420 doesn't issue a directive.
00:09:47.960 He issues an order
00:09:48.920 and then the directive
00:09:50.200 is the instructions
00:09:51.280 to his chain of command
00:09:53.120 how that order
00:09:54.040 is going to be carried out.
00:09:55.320 That didn't happen here.
00:09:56.640 He instead brought
00:09:58.140 these directives out
00:09:58.900 and said well
00:09:59.280 that's an order.
00:10:00.380 But they were so vague
00:10:02.220 and so jumbled
00:10:03.180 that the chain of command
00:10:05.740 across the country
00:10:07.380 all implemented it differently.
00:10:09.640 It was absolute chaos.
00:10:11.520 Someone on one base
00:10:12.720 was doing another.
00:10:13.720 Another admiral
00:10:15.260 on the west coast
00:10:16.460 was doing something else.
00:10:18.060 So this caused people
00:10:19.620 to say is this
00:10:20.680 a lawful order?
00:10:22.580 And the other part of it
00:10:24.380 is Andrew
00:10:25.440 is their rights.
00:10:26.700 Just because they put
00:10:27.420 on a uniform
00:10:28.020 doesn't mean they gave up
00:10:29.200 their rights as a Canadian citizen.
00:10:31.240 They still maintain
00:10:32.260 all those rights.
00:10:33.960 And one of the rights
00:10:34.620 you have is to bodily autonomy
00:10:36.120 and whether you wish
00:10:37.080 to consent to a medical treatment.
00:10:39.180 And that was what
00:10:40.300 the chief of defence staff
00:10:42.220 tried to take away
00:10:43.080 from these people.
00:10:44.760 We have the admiral
00:10:45.900 or the vice admiral
00:10:47.660 who's commander
00:10:48.640 of the Navy now
00:10:49.540 telling people
00:10:50.880 that they didn't have
00:10:51.780 bodily autonomy
00:10:52.520 if they were in
00:10:53.800 the Canadian armed forces.
00:10:55.380 Well that raises
00:10:56.040 a lot of questions
00:10:56.940 because if they have
00:10:58.640 no bodily autonomy
00:10:59.560 then does that mean
00:11:01.680 the chief of defence staff
00:11:02.600 can say well
00:11:03.080 I don't have enough women
00:11:04.120 in the military
00:11:04.800 so therefore I can order
00:11:06.460 people to have sex changes
00:11:08.440 because that's what he's saying.
00:11:10.360 He says he has the power
00:11:11.400 to order any medical treatment
00:11:13.620 for any member
00:11:14.740 of the Canadian armed forces
00:11:15.660 and they're not allowed
00:11:16.520 to disagree.
00:11:17.260 So this is part of why
00:11:20.880 I chose to do this
00:11:22.340 because it is extremely upsetting
00:11:25.860 to the people I represent
00:11:27.420 and it was upsetting to me
00:11:29.120 as I started to hear the stories.
00:11:31.420 There are some deployments
00:11:32.700 where certain vaccines
00:11:34.160 would make sense.
00:11:35.160 If you're going to Mali
00:11:36.360 for example
00:11:37.080 you should probably get
00:11:38.360 your meningitis vaccine
00:11:39.640 and so on.
00:11:40.300 The rationale
00:11:41.520 for COVID vaccination
00:11:43.320 has been
00:11:44.320 I think increasingly
00:11:45.460 precarious
00:11:47.320 the logic
00:11:49.120 on which it rests
00:11:50.020 especially as we've learned
00:11:50.940 it doesn't block transmission
00:11:52.160 so whether you get
00:11:53.520 vaccinated as a soldier
00:11:54.780 does not have
00:11:55.680 any bearing
00:11:56.200 on whether the person
00:11:57.480 you're bunking with
00:11:58.500 is going to get COVID
00:12:00.060 increasingly.
00:12:01.280 So what is the rationale
00:12:03.240 on which the Canadian
00:12:04.800 armed forces
00:12:05.480 has relied
00:12:06.380 or is it simply
00:12:07.240 we're telling you to do it
00:12:08.760 so you have to do it?
00:12:09.760 Well part of what
00:12:11.360 they relied on
00:12:12.020 was a draft
00:12:12.800 from the Public Health
00:12:14.140 Canada
00:12:15.460 Public Health Agency
00:12:16.720 of Canada
00:12:17.200 and it was a draft
00:12:18.220 we have searched
00:12:19.760 for a final version
00:12:21.040 they can't produce one
00:12:22.540 so they had a draft document
00:12:24.440 from Public Health Canada
00:12:25.500 which the Peckford
00:12:26.940 questioning
00:12:28.340 the Peckford documents
00:12:29.540 have revealed
00:12:30.520 that Public Health Canada
00:12:31.500 never recommended
00:12:32.940 vaccination
00:12:33.660 as a mitigation
00:12:35.020 measure
00:12:38.020 I guess I could call it
00:12:38.940 so they
00:12:40.380 relying on that
00:12:41.640 certainly isn't
00:12:42.700 going to be standing up
00:12:44.620 and we had the
00:12:45.520 Chief of Defence staff
00:12:46.480 on national media
00:12:48.980 saying that his
00:12:50.140 reasoning was
00:12:51.240 that it was
00:12:52.400 to prevent transmission
00:12:53.580 that we were going
00:12:55.480 to the Canadian armed forces
00:12:56.240 which even Pfizer
00:12:56.260 doesn't say anymore
00:12:57.240 right exactly
00:12:58.560 and the Canadian armed forces
00:12:59.920 were supposed to set an example
00:13:01.300 in fact in his first directive
00:13:02.900 and other subsequent directives
00:13:05.360 the first priority
00:13:06.300 was to set an example
00:13:07.540 for the Canadian population
00:13:09.020 that's not a reason
00:13:10.760 to mandate a medical treatment
00:13:12.540 to your troops
00:13:13.500 that's not taking care
00:13:15.700 of your people
00:13:16.260 because if it's a vaccine
00:13:18.140 that isn't even fully tested yet
00:13:20.800 I mean
00:13:21.560 Dr. Larenko
00:13:24.020 from the Government of Canada
00:13:25.440 admitted under questioning
00:13:26.760 and under oath
00:13:27.380 that the human trials
00:13:29.280 are not over
00:13:29.940 that the human trials
00:13:30.880 are the general population
00:13:32.300 and the other factor
00:13:34.720 we have here Andrew
00:13:35.620 is the people
00:13:36.800 that serve in the Canadian
00:13:37.800 armed forces
00:13:38.360 are extremely low risk
00:13:40.020 to die from COVID
00:13:41.740 or have serious COVID
00:13:42.960 they're fit
00:13:44.680 they're young
00:13:45.620 there was
00:13:46.640 there has been
00:13:47.680 more vaccine injuries
00:13:48.980 than anything else
00:13:50.560 from this whole thing
00:13:52.280 and they
00:13:54.020 can't ever point
00:13:56.820 to one death
00:13:57.900 in the Canadian armed forces
00:13:59.220 from COVID
00:13:59.760 they can't even point
00:14:01.000 to serious illness
00:14:02.100 of anyone
00:14:02.800 in the Canadian armed forces
00:14:03.940 so how are you
00:14:04.780 rationalizing
00:14:06.420 a treatment
00:14:06.980 to your people
00:14:08.160 that is more
00:14:09.940 dangerous to them
00:14:11.080 than the actual
00:14:11.840 disease itself
00:14:12.600 yeah
00:14:13.840 and I think that's
00:14:14.580 such a critical point here
00:14:15.760 it's a critical point
00:14:18.260 because
00:14:18.600 the vaccine
00:14:19.660 is something
00:14:21.180 that I think
00:14:21.760 should for any reason
00:14:23.120 be a personal choice
00:14:24.140 if you feel
00:14:24.900 it will put you
00:14:25.680 in better standing
00:14:26.580 take it
00:14:27.020 if you don't feel it
00:14:27.880 that way
00:14:28.460 don't take it
00:14:29.120 but if you look
00:14:30.080 at the numbers
00:14:30.660 no one has ever argued
00:14:32.000 even the most alarmist
00:14:33.120 that COVID
00:14:33.660 is a death sentence
00:14:35.460 for a fit
00:14:36.460 healthy
00:14:36.920 20 something
00:14:37.920 30 something
00:14:38.920 year old
00:14:39.560 and to the contrary
00:14:40.700 I mean
00:14:41.120 for 20
00:14:41.880 30
00:14:42.260 40 year old men
00:14:43.480 we know that
00:14:43.980 the vaccine itself
00:14:44.980 and numerous studies
00:14:46.160 have showed
00:14:46.520 this actually poses
00:14:47.440 more risk
00:14:48.100 when you're talking
00:14:48.560 about things
00:14:48.880 like myocarditis
00:14:49.780 and other things
00:14:50.460 and I don't even
00:14:51.540 want to make this
00:14:52.080 a scientific discussion
00:14:53.200 because it should be
00:14:54.280 based on
00:14:55.140 individual choice
00:14:56.140 but I think your point
00:14:57.000 is a valid one
00:14:57.820 and I take you
00:14:58.740 at your word there
00:14:59.360 there has not been
00:15:00.160 a single COVID
00:15:01.340 fatality
00:15:02.000 in the Canadian
00:15:02.520 Armed Forces
00:15:03.140 you say
00:15:03.620 right
00:15:04.580 not a one
00:15:05.360 but I can tell you
00:15:06.260 there's been lots
00:15:07.060 of vaccine injuries
00:15:08.620 from myocarditis
00:15:09.780 I have clients
00:15:10.960 in this lawsuit
00:15:11.740 who have had to have
00:15:12.620 open heart surgery
00:15:13.520 that were fit
00:15:14.780 and healthy
00:15:15.360 and I know
00:15:18.100 of deaths
00:15:18.740 of fit
00:15:19.680 and healthy
00:15:20.320 young men
00:15:21.480 who died
00:15:22.900 in their sleep
00:15:23.560 which should not
00:15:24.500 be happening
00:15:25.040 so
00:15:27.420 you know
00:15:28.260 I question
00:15:28.980 the rationale
00:15:31.860 behind this
00:15:32.580 because I don't
00:15:33.400 think they have
00:15:34.300 if they want to say
00:15:35.620 they relied on the science
00:15:36.620 I don't think the science
00:15:37.540 is backing them up
00:15:38.460 what's the timeline
00:15:40.540 of your legal challenge
00:15:42.240 I expect to be filing
00:15:45.040 in the next few months
00:15:46.380 as you can imagine
00:15:47.220 I have
00:15:48.360 over 300 people
00:15:49.900 confirmed as plaintiffs
00:15:51.280 there's a couple hundred
00:15:52.520 more that have reached out
00:15:54.120 but we've set a deadline
00:15:55.800 cut off of
00:15:56.840 October 31st
00:15:58.120 on Monday
00:15:58.600 and then
00:15:59.660 you can imagine
00:16:00.980 writing several hundred
00:16:02.260 affidavits
00:16:02.860 and I would say
00:16:03.780 I have
00:16:04.380 you know
00:16:05.560 a truckload
00:16:06.280 but 100,000 pages
00:16:07.780 of evidence
00:16:08.520 to make sure
00:16:10.140 it's all ready
00:16:10.860 before we head
00:16:11.740 into the court
00:16:12.440 and the statement
00:16:14.480 of claim is ready
00:16:15.240 I'm just getting
00:16:16.260 all the rest of the
00:16:17.420 I's dotted
00:16:18.280 and T's crossed
00:16:19.020 to bring it forward
00:16:19.780 it is coming
00:16:21.080 it is not going
00:16:21.820 to go away
00:16:22.460 and just to put
00:16:24.420 kind of the technicalities
00:16:25.600 forward here
00:16:26.240 this is a proposed
00:16:27.240 class action
00:16:28.040 so you're fighting
00:16:28.680 this on behalf
00:16:29.260 of all members
00:16:30.480 of the Canadian Art Forces
00:16:31.480 even those who aren't
00:16:32.280 members of this
00:16:33.060 legal challenge
00:16:33.940 correct?
00:16:35.300 Yes
00:16:35.500 if I can get a certified
00:16:36.480 as a class action
00:16:37.440 absolutely
00:16:38.040 the other thing
00:16:39.400 is that to
00:16:40.220 counter the government's
00:16:41.960 favorite strategy
00:16:42.720 of running people
00:16:43.480 out of money
00:16:44.080 I created a non-profit
00:16:46.040 the Valor Legal Action Centre
00:16:47.820 which is helping
00:16:49.300 cover
00:16:49.760 the cost
00:16:51.200 of the litigation
00:16:52.020 because litigation
00:16:53.020 against the government
00:16:53.900 is very expensive
00:16:54.760 but it also means
00:16:56.380 that
00:16:56.820 because
00:16:58.020 the non-profit
00:16:59.380 runs on donations
00:17:00.320 people weren't
00:17:01.420 having to come out
00:17:02.420 and hire a lawyer
00:17:04.480 for a couple
00:17:05.640 hundred thousand dollars
00:17:06.560 each to bring
00:17:07.280 their claim forward
00:17:08.060 that's why we
00:17:09.040 put together the group
00:17:10.260 we put together
00:17:10.840 the non-profit
00:17:11.480 because I firmly
00:17:12.780 believe this is a question
00:17:13.900 that needs to be
00:17:14.680 answered in a court
00:17:15.520 of was that
00:17:16.740 a lawful order
00:17:17.500 and was it
00:17:18.340 handled in the way
00:17:19.600 it should have been
00:17:20.200 handled
00:17:20.520 or should he have
00:17:21.900 used the National
00:17:22.600 Defence Act
00:17:23.340 as he had the
00:17:24.840 power to do
00:17:25.500 and chose not to
00:17:26.320 and we'll put that
00:17:27.780 up on the screen
00:17:28.500 there right now
00:17:29.200 ValorLegalActionCentre.org
00:17:31.660 and that's the
00:17:32.440 Canadian Spelling Centre
00:17:33.580 with an R-E
00:17:34.240 ValorLegalActionCentre.org
00:17:36.260 Catherine Christensen
00:17:37.640 joins me now
00:17:38.360 Catherine thank you
00:17:39.120 so much for your work
00:17:39.860 on this
00:17:40.140 good to talk to you
00:17:40.940 good to talk to you
00:17:42.360 too Andrew
00:17:42.680 thank you for having me on
00:17:43.780 thanks for listening
00:17:44.660 to the Andrew Lawton Show
00:17:45.840 support the program
00:17:47.120 by donating to True North
00:17:48.360 at www.tnc.news
00:17:51.820 ZombieSpace.org
00:17:55.080 We'll be right back on it
00:17:56.140 to the Andrew Lawton Show
00:17:57.440 to the Andrew Lawton Show
00:17:57.880 and to the Andrew Lawton Show
00:17:58.300 if your Mamet ext峙ほed
00:17:59.220 is awesome
00:18:00.180 because この
00:18:00.660 UK
00:18:01.440 hun
00:18:01.940 for helping to
00:18:03.360 have you
00:18:04.300 so much
00:18:04.840 the
00:18:07.680 have been
00:18:08.160 common
00:18:12.120 these
00:18:13.280 weren't
00:18:13.800 all
00:18:15.920 we'll be
00:18:16.580 bored
00:18:17.040 and
00:18:17.700 they
00:18:19.320 don't
00:18:19.460 let