Juno News - Alberta teacher says union shut out members

00:00:00.000 Welcome to The Fighter. My name is Kris Sims. I'm the Alberta Director for the Canadian Taxpayers

00:00:11.360 Federation. Thank you so much for watching this new show. If you haven't done so yet,

00:00:16.380 be sure to like this video online. Go subscribe to Juno News so you get a lot of exclusive content

00:00:22.240 and most importantly, share with your friends who need to know. Okay, this is a situation on

00:00:28.160 the ground in Alberta. We still have around 700,000 students who are out of school because

00:00:35.480 there is an Alberta teacher strike. Now, the Alberta Teachers Union says that they have around

00:00:41.780 51,000 teachers in their ranks. If you do an actual head count, according to government data,

00:00:49.200 there's around 35 active duty frontline in the classroom teachers who are teaching. So that's

00:00:57.100 the situation we're in right now. The teachers, generally speaking, from the union's perspective,

00:01:02.720 are asking for more money and a hard classroom cap size across the province. Two things there.

00:01:11.860 The Alberta government was offering a pretty sizable pay increase for the Alberta teachers.

00:01:18.740 They were offering between 12 and I think it was up to even 17% in some cases of a raise over four

00:01:25.620 years. Basically, under that rejected deal, a teacher in Alberta would start at around $71,000

00:01:34.520 per year. After seven years on the job, they're already making over $100,000 a year. Plus vacation,

00:01:42.740 plus benefits, plus time off, all of that stuff. Okay, plus really solid job security, especially when

00:01:48.320 you're comparing that to other professions in Alberta. So that was apparently the offer from the

00:01:53.240 government that the teachers union then rejected. Just recently, the teachers union came back with,

00:01:58.820 how about you spend $2 billion more? Over and above the $2.6 or $2.7 billion that the government had

00:02:09.860 already earmarked for this. I've got to be real clear here. Alberta is in debt. We've got a big

00:02:17.140 multi-billion dollar deficit this fiscal year. This year, we are on track to have a provincial debt

00:02:25.380 of well over $80 billion. Okay, with a B. What the teachers union came back and said,

00:02:34.780 hey, how about you spend $2 billion more? That was just unreasonable. And you could kind of sense a

00:02:40.440 shift actually in a lot of the public of like, okay, whoa, that's way too much. And so after the teachers

00:02:47.720 union came back and said, give us $2 billion more, the government said, okay, listen, how about Monday

00:02:55.720 morning, teachers go back to work and back on payroll because they're not getting paid right now.

00:03:01.100 They've got bills coming due. How about teachers go back to work in class with students first thing 0.56

00:03:06.380 Monday morning, but we keep on talking. So deal's not done, but how about we go do enhanced mediation

00:03:13.960 with the teachers union, but y'all are back in class, okay, and earning your paychecks.

00:03:20.700 Apparently, the Alberta teachers union said no to that right away, but we're hearing from rank and file

00:03:27.880 frontline teachers that they weren't asked about that one. That's when Alberta Premier Daniel Smith

00:03:35.120 took to the podium. And here's part of what she had to say.

00:03:38.920 With the 12 to 17% raise that was recently rejected by ATA, teachers' salaries would have

00:03:45.240 started at $70,916 and go up to $119,033. This would have made them the best paid teachers in

00:03:55.140 Western Canada after provincial taxes. We offered to hire an additional 3,000 new teachers over the

00:04:01.380 term of the contract, which would help alleviate classroom sizes on top of the $8.6 billion investment

00:04:07.940 we made this year to build 130 schools. The ATA's latest offer would have cost taxpayers an additional

00:04:14.460 $2 billion on top of the $2.6 billion that we have already committed, a total of $4.6 billion.

00:04:22.200 Our province is facing a $6.5 billion budget deficit this year, and we must continue to be responsible

00:04:29.500 stewards of taxpayer dollars. After about three weeks, a strike of this nature would reach the

00:04:35.340 threshold of causing irreparable harm to our students' education. The ATA needs to do this

00:04:40.220 for its members and for all students. If it refuses to do so, we will consider other options to bring

00:04:46.020 this strike to an end.

00:04:46.900 Now, what the Premier was saying there with irreparable harm, so a few things. The legislature

00:04:52.900 isn't sitting today, but it's going to start sitting very soon again in Edmonton. So that

00:04:58.740 means that it sounds like the Alberta government is going to take further action. And as a parent

00:05:05.060 who has students in the Alberta school system, what I think the Premier meant there by irreparable harm

00:05:11.460 is, for example, grade 12 students are getting notices right now that their diploma exams in British

00:05:18.580 Columbia, they would have called them provincial finals in other jurisdictions. Basically what

00:05:23.060 these are are provincial, province-wide exam level tests for the end of your course in your grade 12

00:05:30.180 year. Usually those exams count for a big chunk of your final grade, which of course matters if you're

00:05:36.900 going on to trade school, college, university, etc. Some students are now getting notices saying that

00:05:43.380 your diploma, your final exams will become optional. What does that mean when you're applying to maybe

00:05:50.980 a university outside of Alberta that doesn't understand what's been going on with this job action?

00:05:56.020 We don't know. So that's what the Premier was getting at there. Okay, we're hearing a lot from

00:06:01.060 the government side here, right? Yeah, for sure. What about the teachers? Why haven't we heard from the Alberta

00:06:07.540 Teachers Union? Why haven't we heard from teachers? Hold that thought. We're going to talk to one

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00:06:51.780 can learn more by visiting unsmoke.ca. Okay, as promised, it was late last week and I was working on some,

00:07:00.420 you know, capacity analysis for different schools, trying to see how much hard classroom size caps

00:07:07.380 wind up costing taxpayers. Because of the Taxpayers Federation, we want government to run more

00:07:12.420 efficiently. And everything we'd been told is that these hard cookie cutter class size caps across

00:07:17.460 Alberta would cost a lot of money for taxpayers and not actually deliver the results that a lot of

00:07:23.620 parents and teachers want. Then my phone rang and it was coming from an Alberta teacher who is usually

00:07:32.260 right in the thick of it in downtown Edmonton trying to teach grade 11 English. What does she have to 0.53

00:07:39.860 say? Let's find out. Joining me now is a teacher from Edmonton. Now, you gave me a call late last week

00:07:48.340 and you were understandably upset. Can you please explain for our audience what is upsetting you about the

00:07:55.140 current situation? Well, what happened was I got an email from the ATA stating that the government had

00:08:03.220 come back with another proposal. This was after we had rejected their offer. And the government came

00:08:10.660 back and suggested in their proposal that teachers should return to work on Monday, October 20th and

00:08:17.460 that they would appoint another independent mediator to do an enhanced mediation to try to resolve some of

00:08:26.020 the issues where we're really far apart. And the ATA arbitrarily rejected that offer without consulting

00:08:34.740 teachers. And because that's a directly impacts our paychecks, I think that teachers should have had

00:08:41.220 the opportunity to say yes or no. I don't think the ATA should have arbitrarily made that decision

00:08:47.300 for us. So to put it in layman's terms, the government was basically saying, listen, teachers

00:08:53.060 can be back at work today, Monday, getting a paycheck, getting paid in front of their students,

00:08:57.860 in classrooms, but we're still going to keep negotiating at the table during this. Like it's

00:09:02.660 not over, but you can all go back to work while still earning a paycheck. Is that generally what was

00:09:07.780 being offered? That is my understanding as I read that proposal, yes. Me too. Okay. Can you just give us

00:09:14.820 a little bit of background as to how long have you been teaching? What do you teach? I know that you're

00:09:20.420 in Edmonton. What's it like for you right now as a teacher? I've been teaching with Edmonton Public

00:09:26.820 Schools for 15 years now. I started in 2012. I teach at an urban high school in North Edmonton and I teach

00:09:34.500 English Language Arts. So just to give you an idea of what my day is like, I teach four classes in a row

00:09:41.700 every day. I get 40 minutes for lunch. In my four classes, my first class in the morning, I have 33

00:09:50.740 students. It's a regular streamed English class. Out of those 33 students, 13 of them are either coded

00:09:58.020 learning disability or an English language learner. My second block class is a 30 level course and

00:10:06.740 there's 31 in that class and 10 of them are coded or ELL. My block three class is a 30-1 class.

00:10:19.140 There's 32 students in that and only two of them are coded learning disability, which is that's

00:10:24.020 reasonable. I don't mind that. My block four class is the big problem. There's 37 in that one and 19 of

00:10:31.060 them are either coded or English language learner. That's 51% of my class that is either coded or is

00:10:39.140 English as a second language. I do this day in, day out, every day. We don't get any prep anymore. That

00:10:47.700 got taken away from us several years ago. It's a tough work day.

00:10:53.700 It sounds like a tough work day, especially when you're talking about what the word that people are

00:10:59.300 using is complexities and then you're using a word they're coded and I've looked at some of earlier

00:11:05.540 collective bargain agreements where I've been reading through different agreements and my

00:11:09.460 understanding is that coded students, they literally have a code and that is based on their ability to

00:11:17.780 learn, maybe some language deficiencies, things like that. It's types of disabilities, right,

00:11:23.700 that certain students might have? That's what coded means?

00:11:26.500 Yeah, coding means any kind of diagnosed learning disability or it could also be behavioral as well.

00:11:34.340 And so, yeah, there's a code that goes with every kind of learning disability. There's autism,

00:11:39.460 there's things like dyslexia, and then there's just straight behavior problems as well. And those can

00:11:45.940 also be coded. Now, I have to ask you, we were chatting last week. My daughter, unfortunately,

00:11:53.220 she's missing Hamlet right now. She's in her English year, she's in her English class, and

00:11:58.820 she's missing out on Hamlet. You were saying you teach English. What do you like teaching the most when

00:12:04.660 you're actually in the classroom? Well, I kind of have a passion for Shakespeare. I love his stories.

00:12:10.500 I think that stories is how we learn how to deal with adversity in our life. So I love,

00:12:17.780 I love reading and I love literature because I think students can learn so much from reading about

00:12:23.140 how what others have dealt with and had to gone through and the lessons learned from it. I also

00:12:28.100 like helping students with reading comprehension because thanks to technology, kids nowadays don't

00:12:33.940 read the way they used to. And reading comprehension is definitely a problem for a lot of students. So

00:12:41.060 those are my two areas of passion. They're a really big deal. I'm a huge reader myself. So is my husband,

00:12:47.780 our whole family is. But you're right, with all the technology now, it feels like you're constantly

00:12:52.100 battling the screen. And I must say, like, my grade 11 English teacher, the way she taught us Lord of the

00:12:58.660 Flies, it'll stay with me for the rest of my life. She turned the lights off, she had to sit in the

00:13:03.780 middle of a circle, she had a lantern right next to the person who was reading, it had a huge impact.

00:13:09.700 And I can guarantee you, it had a huge impact on every kid in that class. And so I think I speak on

00:13:15.220 behalf of most parents in Alberta, where they would rather have their kids in school right now, to put

00:13:20.580 things nicely, they would rather have a deal with the teachers. Now I have to ask you, from what we're

00:13:27.300 hearing from the government side of things, they were offering what looked like a pretty fair pay

00:13:33.460 race, to a lot of people, where they're saying, hey, you know, you'd start at about $71,000 a year,

00:13:40.500 after seven years in, you're making around $100,000 a year. They also use the language of they would

00:13:47.300 become the highest paid teachers in Western Canada after taxes. To be fair, I did email the ATA,

00:13:55.380 asking, did you guys really come back and ask for $2 billion more? Like, is this true?

00:14:00.980 And I have not heard back yet. What do you think of the current offer coming from the government?

00:14:08.980 Well, from a salary aspect, there's no way to catch up over 10 years of erosion and not keeping up with

00:14:17.780 inflation. It's unrealistic to expect this government to do that, especially given the fact that we've got a

00:14:23.460 huge deficit in the province now. So I thought the offer was fair. For me personally, it would amount

00:14:31.140 to, by the fourth year, an increase of 14%, which is, who gets that in the public sector, right?

00:14:38.180 Nobody. So I thought that was fair. As far as the complexity issue, I think the Premier was pretty

00:14:45.300 straightforward in recognizing that there are issues with complexity in the classrooms. And

00:14:52.100 I believe her that she is going to work with us and try to resolve some of those issues. Building

00:14:57.540 new schools is definitely going to help. You know, hiring new teachers and EAs is definitely going to

00:15:02.260 help. But I think that this is a problem that you can't fix in one bargaining round. Like, and you can't

00:15:08.340 expect this government to make up for years of underfunding by previous governments either.

00:15:14.820 You mentioned the complexities thing. Can that be worked on by targeting the funding, focusing the

00:15:22.980 funding on more EAs and maybe giving teachers more say at the classroom level as to how many kids with

00:15:31.620 complexities are in their classes and then really focusing more on special education? Because I just,

00:15:38.340 from a layman's perspective, I think one of the stumbling blocks here is that the Premier is coming

00:15:43.940 back with things like, let's focus funding on things like special education and making sure that we, you

00:15:49.220 know, deal with class sizes where they are a problem. And what I'm hearing, at least in the media from the

00:15:54.660 union is more of a, let's have a blanket class size cap across the province. They seem to be,

00:16:01.060 at those two polar ends of things. Do you think that things like the complexities issue and the

00:16:07.380 class sizes issues, like that last class you're teaching there, that sounds like pretty overwhelming,

00:16:12.660 can that be focused upon in order to fix it without just doing blanket class size caps across the

00:16:17.620 province? What do you think? I don't think a class size cap is a realistic thing to strive for.

00:16:25.860 A, because our population continues to grow. And B, because like, how do you do that? Every school is

00:16:34.260 different. You know, a class size cap that works in one school won't work in a smaller school, for

00:16:40.660 example, because you'll end up having split classes in a bigger school. And it just muddies the waters too

00:16:47.380 much. Focusing funds on where they're needed is a really good idea. But I think the government has

00:16:56.660 been giving lots of money towards classroom and sizes and things. I'm just not so sure the money's

00:17:03.860 going where it's supposed to. That's where my disconnect comes in. You know, I didn't mention this

00:17:10.260 before. But I over the weekend, when you mentioned where money is going, I was scratching my head,

00:17:16.100 because I was looking at some data. Now it's about a year and a half old, to be fair. But I was looking

00:17:20.900 at some capacity data on different schools. So within the same thing, like public, public, Catholic,

00:17:27.540 Catholic. And I was looking at some of their capacities within the same cities. So Calgary,

00:17:33.620 Edmonton, Red Deer, and I could find some schools that were over capacity, like, you know, they got 47

00:17:40.340 too many kids or 52 too many kids. And like a six minute bus ride away, they've got room for like 150.

00:17:48.820 Now, it was one of those things where I was scratching my head going, why isn't, why aren't

00:17:53.780 administrators figuring this out? Is that up to the board? Sorry if you don't know the answer to this

00:17:58.100 question. Isn't that where some of the planning and the funding needs to go is to figure this out?

00:18:03.860 Without necessarily having to come back with, let's give 2 billion more dollars to this problem?

00:18:10.340 Yeah. My own personal opinion on this is that I think that the reason why we're seeing

00:18:16.900 that effect of some schools being really over has to do partly with the way our neighborhoods are laid

00:18:23.380 out. And, and, and like, for example, if you live in a certain neighborhood, you're not allowed to go

00:18:29.220 to a school in another neighborhood. They've, they close the boundaries, right? I think it's,

00:18:33.300 that's part of it. But I think also it's, it's where all new people to Canada are being funneled

00:18:41.060 and what neighborhoods they're gravitating to, to live in. I think that also contributes.

00:18:46.660 Our high school, for example, I believe was built to house about 1300 students, maybe 1400.

00:18:53.060 We're at 1700 this year. So for the first time since I've worked there, we had to close enrollment and we're

00:19:00.020 only accepting new students who move into that actual neighborhood, but we're definitely over

00:19:07.460 what our building is supposed to house. Like there's no spare classrooms anywhere.

00:19:11.860 Wow. Okay. See, it's so good to actually get your report from the ground where you're actually teaching

00:19:17.380 and you're seeing the school. Just a couple more questions for you. Last we left off, the last we heard

00:19:23.300 from the government is what you just described of the different pay raises. Apparently they were also

00:19:29.060 offering to hire 3000 more teachers, 1500 new educational assistants. So, you know, people who

00:19:35.540 help in the classrooms. And then we heard to come back from the teachers union. How about $2 billion more,

00:19:43.380 like over and above what the government had already earmarked for this. You mentioned the deficit.

00:19:49.060 You're right. I think a lot of people heard last year's fiscal year end with the surplus and they

00:19:54.340 got confused. That's not what we're dealing with right now. You're right. We're dealing with a

00:19:58.500 multi-billion dollar deficit for this fiscal year. And we are on track to have a debt of more than $84

00:20:05.220 billion with a B. What did you think of the teachers union coming back and saying, spend $2 billion more?

00:20:12.260 Um, well, they're not, they're not being realistic and I'm kind of in a cotton, uh, between a rock and

00:20:21.620 a hard place because I'm a teacher and I, and I do realize that we have issues in right now, but I'm

00:20:27.940 also a taxpayer and a conservative. And so I can't sit there and support that kind of a request. I mean,

00:20:36.420 it's absolutely fiscally irresponsible. No, any government who would do it would be, um, held to,

00:20:43.220 under a microscope for doing it. And it's just, it's just not fiscally responsible or achievable

00:20:48.260 right now. Like it just isn't right. Um, this government has invested so much in education

00:20:55.300 since they took power. Um, and they're building 90 new schools over the next seven years.

00:21:02.100 So you can only do so many things, you know, like the, the, the money isn't getting printed,

00:21:08.660 you know, at the legislature and doled out. And we've already seen what happens when you print

00:21:12.820 money with our liberal government, right? Look at the, the problems we're having right now because of

00:21:17.220 that. So I just don't think it was reasonable to ask for that kind of money. Fair. And, uh, what

00:21:24.260 you're getting at there with the problems is, uh, inflation. It's one of the reasons why everything

00:21:28.660 costs so much. And for people who don't know, um, at the federal level, uh, prime minister,

00:21:33.700 Justin Trudeau's government printed like $300 billion out of thin air, um, over a couple of years.

00:21:39.940 It was astonishing. It's one of the reasons that we have an inflation issue. Speaking of money, uh,

00:21:44.420 just for folks who need the math, I went back, I went back to the 2021, 2022 budget. Okay. You look at

00:21:52.100 the fiscal year end, that's where you find out how much they spent on education as a line item.

00:21:57.220 You fast forward to today for the budget. Okay. These are forecasts, but that's what they're

00:22:02.580 planning on spending. The increase is 33%. So since 2021, 22 fiscal year end to now what they're spending

00:22:12.740 this fiscal year is an increase in education spending by 33%. And I checked it does eclipse inflation

00:22:21.620 and it does eclipse student population growth. And so to your point, there's only one taxpayer

00:22:28.100 in Alberta. And I'm worried that, that people are getting at loggerheads and they're not actually

00:22:33.700 conversing with each other. And so it really matters to me and to this audience that you're

00:22:38.260 speaking with us this way. I must say over the weekend, uh, I bumped into one of my daughter's

00:22:43.140 favorite teachers. Um, I'm worried for her because I know that teachers apparently aren't getting strike pay.

00:22:49.060 Nope.

00:22:49.700 Nope. You've got bills. You're a human being. So is there a, is there an opening? I,

00:22:56.980 sorry, I didn't ask you this before, but is there an opening with your union? If enough teachers

00:23:01.460 say, Hey, I want to say on this, could they get back to work and then get a paycheck while still

00:23:06.420 negotiating? Is that still an option? Cause I'm thinking about the bills coming due.

00:23:12.180 Uh, I honestly don't know the answer to that question. Um, I haven't heard anything. I check

00:23:16.820 the news every day, which is another issue that I have is that we're not getting enough communication

00:23:22.260 from the union or the ATA about what's going on. Um, as far as I know, um, you know, I'm sure the

00:23:30.100 government, if we were to say, yeah, you know, we changed our minds, we'll take it, let's do this.

00:23:34.740 They would probably say, yes, we could probably be back at work tomorrow, but, uh, uh, it's like

00:23:40.420 silence out there. There's, I haven't heard anything from anybody. So, um, I think they're

00:23:46.820 digging in and they're just saying, Nope, we're just going to dig in because they think they're

00:23:50.980 going to magically get something that they're not, I don't think they're going to get. And,

00:23:56.020 and I'm the one who's going to suffer because come November 1st, I can't pay my bills.

00:24:01.220 My goodness. Um, not to put you on the spot and without exactly identifying your union or your

00:24:07.540 reps for people who don't know, cause I don't know if you wanted to speak to your union leadership,

00:24:13.780 like what's the mechanism? Like, do you email them as a teacher? Is there like a one part,

00:24:18.580 one question surveys that are put out? Like what's the mechanism between the union that is speaking for

00:24:24.260 you and frontline teachers like you? Um, I have to email my reps for my area. So,

00:24:30.900 which is on my list of things to do. I was going to do that today as soon as I could to find out

00:24:36.980 what's going on and where their thought process is and, and to see if they want to pay my bills

00:24:41.860 for the month of November. Because when I look at what I pay in union dues, I went back through my T4

00:24:47.540 slips since I started teaching and I have paid $16,425 in union dues between 2012 and last year's tax

00:24:57.620 return. And if you look at, if there's 35,000 teachers to use the premier's numbers in the,

00:25:04.500 in, uh, Alberta, and they're all paying around that amount of money, where'd all that money go?

00:25:10.980 Why don't we have strike pay? You know, where did all of my union dues go and why can't I access them

00:25:18.100 when I need them? Right. And just, yeah, well, just to be clear, then that isn't paying into like your

00:25:24.420 benefits. That's not for your dental and your glasses. No, this is just straight union dues.

00:25:28.260 It shows on my T4 slip as union dues. So, so where's my money going and, and how is it being spent?

00:25:35.860 These are really good questions. I really appreciate your time today. I'm going to

00:25:41.540 leave you with this question. Um, if you could speak to fellow teachers, because I imagine some

00:25:46.820 of y'all are feeling kind of isolated right now. Um, if you could speak to fellow teachers who are

00:25:51.380 in your situation right now, what would you say? Um, well, I would just encourage people to speak up.

00:25:58.180 And if you're not happy with what the government or what the ATA is doing, say something,

00:26:04.660 because if you don't say anything, then they assume that you're on their side and you agree with them.

00:26:10.180 And there was just under 20% of us who didn't want to strike to start with. Well,

00:26:14.900 maybe now that number's higher, maybe more people need their paycheck back. So people need to speak up

00:26:21.060 and email your reps. For everyone's sake, for yours, for parents, for students, for taxpayers,

00:26:28.900 I really hope you're back teaching Shakespeare very soon. I'm sure my students wouldn't agree with you

00:26:35.220 there, but I do. Thank you so much for your time. You take care. Okay. Thanks, Chris. You too. Wow.

00:26:42.260 What did you think of that? Um, she phoned me straight up on her own time, uh, upset last late

00:26:51.220 last week when she got ahold of the letter that was then publicly made knowledge of, uh, from the

00:26:57.380 government that was offering, Hey, if you want to go back to work on Monday, we don't have a deal yet,

00:27:02.420 but if you want to go back to work on Monday, teachers will keep bargaining at the table, but

00:27:07.060 you're going to be in the classroom and getting paid and students can keep learning.

00:27:11.060 And she phoned me upset, understandably so, and basically said what she said there of let's work

00:27:17.940 out a deal. But at the end of the day, teachers need to be back at work and students deserve to be

00:27:23.620 learning in the classroom. What did you think about her explaining that last class that she has during

00:27:28.820 the day with those complexities where it sounds like around 50% or half of her class have English as

00:27:35.540 a second language or, you know, different disabilities. That sounds like a lot of people

00:27:40.900 and a lot of students to try to manage that way. Do you think focusing the funding and the attention

00:27:47.620 specifically on those target areas of things like more help for special education, more help for

00:27:54.740 teaching ESL classes? So they're not just put suddenly into trying to learn Shakespeare in grade 11.

00:28:02.180 That is the answer. Because so many times I'm hearing from analysts who are saying

00:28:07.540 province-wide cookie-cutter classroom sizes don't work because they become inefficient,

00:28:13.860 super expensive for taxpayers, and you wind up with split classes galore. And it doesn't usually fix

00:28:20.820 the problem. Why not focus the funding in those high growth, high population dense areas? Why not focus

00:28:27.460 the funding and the nimbleness on things like more special education and ESL so that teachers like we

00:28:33.700 just heard from can actually teach? Thank you so much for watching this special episode of The Fighter

00:28:40.900 with Chris Sims. Be sure to like this video if you're watching online. Be sure to head on over and

00:28:47.220 subscribe to Juno News so you can get more first-person stories like this. Because at the end of the day,

00:28:54.340 we're fighting for you.

Juno News - October 20, 2025

Alberta teacher says union shut out members

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