Juno News - Canada wants to kick Trump out of the G7？

00:00:00.000 Hi, I'm Candace Malcolm, and welcome to The Candace Malcolm Show. We have a great episode

00:00:08.440 for you. I hope everyone had a wonderful weekend. Hope you had some time with your family and

00:00:12.940 friends and a nice relaxing one. And we're back into a crazy week. We're still reacting to what

00:00:17.600 has happened on Friday when President Donald Trump welcomed Ukrainian President Vladimir

00:00:23.260 Zelensky into the Oval Office. And well, let's just say things didn't go very well in that

00:00:28.920 meeting. So we're going to watch that clip, break it down. We're going to talk about the Canadian

00:00:33.640 reaction, which folks, it is just increasingly deranged. The idea that democracy is embodied by

00:00:41.540 Ukraine and Vladimir Zelensky is somehow the leader of the free world is just the most insane

00:00:47.360 thing that I have seen. And so we're going to talk about that. I am joined by two guests today. I'm

00:00:51.820 very excited about this conversation. So first, we have Alex Zoltan, who is a crime reporter at

00:00:56.280 true north and also marty belanger first time on the show he's known online as marty up north so

00:01:03.080 gentlemen it's great to have you thanks for joining the show hey good to be here okay so

00:01:08.760 let's go back to friday afternoon and we sort of had this historic moment this this this oval

00:01:15.160 office address uh this is this is something kind of fun about the white house uh about the trump

00:01:19.560 white house is that you some you sort of have access to things that we would have never normally

00:01:23.720 had access to so i don't know whose idea it was to have this sort of bilateral agreement being

00:01:28.680 negotiated sort of live on television but things just sort of got deranged very quickly got derailed

00:01:35.160 sorry very quickly and it turned into quite a heated uh reaction and back and forth i'm sure

00:01:40.360 you've seen this clip by now but just want to show you to answer before you get to the clip to answer

00:01:44.840 one of the questions right like trump 2.0 is different than trump 1.0 um i i did not i and

00:01:52.840 And I thought Trump 2.0 would be a little bit calmer than the first one.

00:01:56.240 But man, we're like, he's off to a great start.

00:01:59.080 And that's the context for the clip, I think.

00:02:01.360 Like when he got elected, right?

00:02:02.840 Remember a month ago, he was crazy with executive orders and getting stuff done.

00:02:08.720 And I remember joking, saying, what's he going to do next?

00:02:11.900 And we joked about he's going to do peace in Ukraine and peace in Israel, like, you know, big other big things like that.

00:02:17.960 And he's doing that, but he has a very crazy, weird way of getting stuff accomplished, I think.

00:02:24.080 It's totally unpredictable. You're right. And I mean, to be honest, I'm almost surprised that this hasn't been dealt with already.

00:02:29.740 I thought that this was going to be something that Trump was able to skillfully put together kind of day one, like bring Putin and Zelensky to the table.

00:02:36.600 Nobody wants this war to go on. Everybody just I mean, from my perspective, I don't want wars.

00:02:41.420 I don't like wars. I don't like the idea of young men out there getting drafted onto the front line and killing each other,

00:02:46.480 especially Ukrainians and Russians who were more or less like brothers or cousins. I mean,

00:02:51.960 it's so awful. I completely agree. We all thought he was going to solve the war in Ukraine on day

00:02:58.180 three of his presidency. Yes. So obviously, they're having some issues. And I think from

00:03:02.640 this exchange, I mean, we'll show it. It seems to me that it might be Vladimir Zelensky who is

00:03:06.880 the obstacle to peace. So let's play this clip. Do you think that it's respectful to come to the

00:03:13.300 Oval Office of the United States of America and attack the administration that is trying

00:03:17.320 to prevent the destruction of your country.

00:03:19.620 A lot of questions.

00:03:21.200 Let's start from the beginning.

00:03:22.340 First of all, during the war, everybody has problems, even you, but you have nice ocean

00:03:28.600 and don't feel now, but you will feel it in the future.

00:03:32.880 God bless.

00:03:33.380 You don't know that.

00:03:34.000 God bless.

00:03:34.660 God bless.

00:03:35.580 You will not have the war.

00:03:36.860 Don't tell us what we're going to feel.

00:03:38.240 We're going to feel very good.

00:03:39.460 You will feel influenced.

00:03:40.080 We're going to feel very good and very strong.

00:03:42.620 You will feel influenced.

00:03:43.780 You're right now not in a very good position.

00:03:46.420 You've allowed yourself to be in a very bad position.

00:03:49.220 And he happens to be right about it.

00:03:50.320 From the very beginning of the war, Mr. President, I was...

00:03:52.560 You're not in a good position.

00:03:53.540 You don't have the cards right now.

00:03:56.000 With us, you start having cards.

00:03:57.280 I'm not playing cards.

00:03:57.900 Right now, you don't...

00:03:58.900 I'm very serious, Mr. President.

00:04:00.320 You're playing cards.

00:04:01.460 You're gambling with the lives of millions of people.

00:04:05.740 So, I mean, you know, obviously, it's part of a much longer exchange.

00:04:09.160 I think it was like an hour long back and forth.

00:04:11.620 And at first, it seemed like it was going to be OK.

00:04:14.420 I look at Zelensky's body language there, and he just seems like a petulant child, like

00:04:18.560 arms crossed, huffing, kind of rolling his eyes, very angry.

00:04:22.620 From my perspective, it's like, you know, the Americans have invited you in.

00:04:25.880 Trump wants to have peace.

00:04:28.020 That is his objective.

00:04:29.180 That is his goal.

00:04:30.080 And I think that's laudable.

00:04:31.360 And, you know, he's already pledged that they're going to have some kind of an economic deal

00:04:34.960 afterwards.

00:04:35.680 So Trump is there trying to negotiate.

00:04:38.040 and it seems to me that zelinski just i don't know if it was performative or he he just there

00:04:43.000 was some kind of a language barrier alex i want to bring you in on this like what was your sort

00:04:46.520 of takeaway from friday afternoon i thought everybody was really rude across the board

00:04:52.760 really um yeah i thought the suit comment was particularly rude do you own a suit i thought

00:04:59.000 that that was kind of belittling um but i also completely agree with you guys i want the war to

00:05:03.960 end yeah i mean like like i you know if i got invited to the white house at the if i'm zelinski

00:05:11.160 and i get invited to the white house this week i'm only i'm i'm only thinking one thing oh good

00:05:16.520 you know trump wants to talk and he i've heard trump talking about wanting peace i'm getting

00:05:20.840 invited to have that discussion i'd be a little bit um disappointed that trump didn't use his power

00:05:27.880 to bring putin and me zelinski in the room together but but yeah i got invited to to meet

00:05:34.840 with trump so i'm going to go there and listen to him and then try and figure out how we advance

00:05:38.920 this he looked like a man who like you said who who either went there naively thinking oh i'm

00:05:45.160 going to get more money for my war i'm going to convince them that uh i'm the good guy like he

00:05:50.520 they they misread each other is is how i interpret this and then and then somehow along the way they

00:05:56.680 They misread each other. There's definitely a language barrier. I mean, when, you know, when Zaleski says things like I had to listen to him two, three times to try and figure out what he meant in some instances.

00:06:05.600 Like, you know, you got oceans, you're going to feel the what he's saying is you're not threatened by Russia because you have an ocean between you and them.

00:06:13.400 But, you know, yeah. And but then I agree with Alex. After a while, when you watch it, you go, OK, somebody should have called a timeout because it does happen in business and in politics.

00:06:26.180 you get a little bit too emotional and too passionate and then somebody needs to call a

00:06:29.540 timeout and everybody needs to regroup but they let this thing escalate so at the end they kind

00:06:34.380 of all looked a bit foolish you know especially because they're they're supposed to be um leaders

00:06:40.460 yeah well and and like okay again from perspective so we had zelensky in there and yeah he wasn't

00:06:47.480 wearing a suit which to me it seemed a little weird and then i mean you go back and you look

00:06:51.320 and it seems to be how he always dresses he's wearing this sort of national ukraine outfit

00:06:55.760 okay we can forgive him for that but there were other points to it uh alex like he kept referring

00:07:00.800 to the vice president by his first name jd which to me was so disrespectful like you know vance

00:07:07.200 himself was calling him mr president and then in response zelinski was calling him by his first

00:07:12.160 name which to me was sort of like pejorative right and so i i mean whoever's idea it was to have it

00:07:17.760 out in front of the press like there's no way to really call a time out because the press is there

00:07:21.120 and they're egging them on um but it just it just to me it's to me like i watched the exchange and

00:07:27.280 just from my perspective it seemed to me that zielinski was just lacking any kind of like

00:07:32.080 gratitude or graciousness or like even not the recognition of the support that the americans

00:07:36.960 have given it a few times he said we're completely by ourselves we're at this alone and it's like

00:07:41.280 well it's not really true when the united states has pledged what hundreds of billions 250 billion

00:07:45.280 dollars. And so to me, I mean, everyone can view that differently. It seems that I am on the

00:07:51.880 opposite side of the Canadian establishment because just about every Canadian leader

00:07:55.080 came out with the opposite side saying that Zelensky was right. So let's just go to Justin

00:07:59.880 Trudeau. He wrote on X following exchange. He said, Russia illegally and unjustifiably invaded

00:08:04.540 Ukraine. For three years now, Ukrainians have fought with courage and resilience. Their fight

00:08:08.620 for democracy, freedom, and sovereignty is a fight that matters to us all. Canada will continue to

00:08:13.420 stand with Ukraine and Ukrainians in achieving a just and lasting peace. Not surprising there,

00:08:19.160 I guess, because that's sort of been his position all along. Pierre Pauling of the conservative

00:08:22.820 leader similarly put out a similar message, maybe not as strong, but he said, as leader of Canada's

00:08:28.140 common sense conservatives, I've always been clear. We stand with Ukraine in its defense

00:08:31.720 against Vladimir Putin's illegal invasion. I also firmly believe that the future of Ukraine must be

00:08:36.720 determined by the Ukrainian people. Conservatives will always stand on the side of freedom and

00:08:41.120 democracy now that seems a little simplified for me right like no one's denying that vladimir putin

00:08:46.200 invaded and that it was illegal and it was reckless and it was horrible like putin's not in the right

00:08:50.240 here but this idea that ukraine is like the personification of freedom and democracy like

00:08:56.360 i'm sorry i don't buy that i don't think that ukraine is a democracy they were supposed to

00:09:00.100 have elections last year in april 2024 and they canceled them because they have martial law

00:09:04.580 because they're in this war so the idea is like let's end the war let's end the war let's find a

00:09:09.960 way to negotiate peace and not prolong this awful war. And let's stop pretending that Ukraine is

00:09:15.900 the leader of the free world, that Vladimir Zelensky is a leading democracy. Go ahead, Marty.

00:09:21.300 If we put it into a weird context, well, not weird, but Ukraine is a proxy war.

00:09:26.260 Like these little, I mean, like if you play the game of risk, Ukraine is one of the strategies.

00:09:31.840 You win risk by controlling Ukraine. And it's a proxy war, but it's an interesting time because

00:09:38.560 in this uh we've had proxy wars like this for the last 50 years and people usually took the

00:09:44.080 american or the russian side this is an interesting one because people are taking

00:09:48.320 the ukrainian side the the the guys that are being played and in every proxy war we've had whether

00:09:53.680 it's afghanistan iraq vietnam cuba places like that the middle guys have always been um fairly

00:10:02.880 innocent the people but the leaders on the inside that are used in these proxy wars they've always

00:10:09.040 been evil like easily manipulated who've thrown their own people under the bus so i'm i'm trying

00:10:14.480 to weave a story i i don't think you it's weird that we are suddenly calling ukraine um yeah

00:10:20.880 democratic like the pattern does it repeats itself and there's nothing there's nothing uh democratic

00:10:26.560 about what's going on in ukraine wasn't prior to and hasn't been since in the last three four years

00:10:31.840 like nothing democratic what's your take alex yeah so there's also kind of this weird um fallacious

00:10:38.560 opinion i'm seeing especially on the political left that we have never made concessions to

00:10:43.280 russia before um i don't know if they've ever read a book on world war ii but we gave russia

00:10:50.640 all of eastern europe um really less than one lifetime ago so if we were to give them donbass

00:10:57.520 i mean i think that that would be a terrible defeat for the ukrainians and i still have a

00:11:00.480 a lot of sympathy for them, because as Marty mentioned, they're the victims in all of this.

00:11:04.280 But it's certainly not historically unprecedented. It's an interesting take. Yeah, I mean, I tend to

00:11:09.520 agree that I think that like, at the beginning, so this has been going on for three years, right?

00:11:13.960 For me, I had a bit of skepticism at the very beginning, because it seemed like all of the

00:11:17.800 people who are being like, particularly insane and nasty over COVID, and the trucker convoy,

00:11:23.160 the freedom convoy, all of a sudden, like overnight, all those people started putting

00:11:26.300 Ukraine flags in their bio and you saw the same sort of propaganda machine in the CBC and Canadian

00:11:30.980 media like telling us that we had to support Ukraine. Whenever that happens I'm like a little

00:11:35.040 skeptical. We did a bit of a deep dive here at the Candace Malcolm show on Chrysia Freeland and her

00:11:39.840 ties to Ukraine nationalists and this whole idea of like Nazi strongholds in that country and there's

00:11:44.460 a lot of validity there. Like I don't think that Ukraine is necessarily a good actor but this idea

00:11:49.960 that it's three years later and we're still litigating the same thing we're still like

00:11:54.240 pretending i mean i'm just going to go through some of the particularly bad takes and then i'll

00:11:57.700 get to you marty but okay this is on the canadian political right these are conservatives these are

00:12:02.900 people who are supposed to be in favor of like freedom and i mean i just think they're wrong

00:12:08.140 so we'll start with spencer fernando who is a conservative writer he puts this on x ukraine is

00:12:13.940 now leader of the free world okay i've never seen a post get ratioed quite like this one but it's

00:12:19.580 so it's just a strange thing i mean i get it yeah vladimir zelensky put on a show in the oval office

00:12:24.860 and a bunch of people in the eu like every eu leader came out in support where you see like

00:12:29.980 leader after leader after leader throwing their support behind vladimir zelensky calling trump

00:12:34.540 a bully and saying that they side with zelensky in this war not surprising uh trudeau also jumps

00:12:40.540 in on that but you know this idea that a country like ukraine is a leader uh adam zivo who writes

00:12:45.820 for the national post he had he had a column over the weekend and he just writes that zelinski's

00:12:50.620 visitor white house imploded friday after trump and vance berated and gaslit the wartime leader

00:12:55.580 the behavior demonstrated yet again how the trump administration cannot be trusted as a reliable

00:13:00.380 security partner then of course andrew coin with the globe and mail writes uh never better display

00:13:05.660 of zelinski's courage than today never clear that trump vance are on the side of the kremlin never

00:13:11.260 more obvious that the democratic world must unite in defense of ukraine and in defiance of the united

00:13:16.620 states so america's now the enemy i guess in ukraine is this like wonderful partner kaveh

00:13:22.220 shiru who i usually have a lot of time for uh he was uh attempted conservative candidate and he's a

00:13:28.060 scholar uh very good on iran but this is this is what he says today about ukraine he says ukraine

00:13:34.220 is the moral test of our time standing with with ukraine means standing for the most basic moral

00:13:40.700 principles that the powerful shouldn't be able to just take what belongs to the weak whenever they

00:13:46.220 wish anyone against ukraine today can't be an ally in any democratic cause i mean that just seems like

00:13:55.100 very extreme like i think like even for me look i don't claim to be the like moral arbiter in this

00:14:01.500 dispute i just happen to be skeptical of ukraine and i don't want to fund wars i don't want to

00:14:06.940 fund them and i think that this is over now like we need to find a way to have peace even if we

00:14:10.700 don't agree with the borders i'd rather have that but this idea that like if you if you don't agree

00:14:15.100 with these people on ukraine that you can't even be part of the conversation on democracy it just

00:14:19.100 seems like really we'll get back to this but let me so let me let me weave this story right so

00:14:24.540 first of all let's go back quickly to the interview uh to the to the discussion it should have been

00:14:29.100 held then private first and then they should have come out in front of the media trump has a very

00:14:33.500 particular way of doing things if he loves you like the prime minister of japan he invites you

00:14:38.220 he puts you on a podium brags about you he takes the selfie and he shares it if he doesn't like you

00:14:44.220 like trudeau he makes you sit over there and you take the selfie and you know do whatever you want

00:14:49.740 so if so trump in this instance it's it to me it's clear that he was sending a message to

00:14:56.220 zelensky he brought him he brought him to the carpet and he gave him a um a beat down now why

00:15:03.740 back to my theory on proxy wars there have been proxy wars in the past between russia and the

00:15:09.020 americans and eventually the the poor scapegoat in the middle how does it end for them how did it

00:15:16.380 end for momar qaddafi for saddam hussein for those guys they didn't get an invitation to the white

00:15:20.700 house to to be you know um beat down they got terminated and so zelensky is kind of in that

00:15:29.000 situation but the difference between zelensky and the other guys is that zelensky uh his his war

00:15:35.980 was in an era that's different than the others and he got to play the media and he got to play

00:15:40.760 all sorts of things and he got sympathy so he does appear as a good guy and canadians and lots of

00:15:47.040 people in the world as we know are easily conned so this has been going on forever so one of the

00:15:52.380 last tweets you said there were uh you know that said it's kind of a moment in history perhaps the

00:15:57.020 moment in history here is that we might finally get to see that the Americans and Russians have

00:16:01.260 actually been fighting each other for a long time and maybe we will finally get a real peace um but

00:16:07.400 but I I think um I think Zelensky in Ukraine is no different than what we've seen many many times

00:16:13.700 in the past, except that Zelensky managed to get a lot of sympathy from a lot of people.

00:16:18.260 And a lot of money, too.

00:16:19.200 And a lot of money.

00:16:20.100 They always do.

00:16:20.920 What do you take away from all of these sort of conservative voices?

00:16:26.360 Not only, I think, kind of taking the wrong position on this exchange, kind of the Trump

00:16:31.260 derangement vision of this exchange, but saying that if you're not a reliable ally on this

00:16:36.120 one issue, you can't be part of the discussion anymore.

00:16:39.780 Yeah, well, I'll give Adam Zeevo some credit because he went there to Ukraine and he experienced

00:16:45.080 it himself. So I'm not speaking about him when I make these comments, but I am speaking about

00:16:49.060 the others. It's really easy to support a war that's halfway around the world that involves

00:16:52.480 nobody you know or anybody in your direct circle, or even by several degrees of separation.

00:16:58.320 If the Americans were to put people on the ground like they did in Vietnam,

00:17:02.280 you'd see people getting pretty upset pretty quickly.

00:17:04.680 okay and and then what about what about to adam zivo like just because he went there you think

00:17:10.360 that he's more credible like what what about what about his thing that you had here i think it gives

00:17:15.000 him some authority certainly as you can see i'm in ukraine right now my lights just went out

00:17:19.800 that's not funny i shouldn't say that so my cat just um yeah i mean he went there so kudos to him

00:17:26.840 um it's an important thing to to do on the ground journalism and i think that that was very brave of

00:17:31.240 him and i think that does make him a bit of an authority on the subject i can't necessarily say

00:17:35.560 the same thing about the others though but but your question was specific candace right you're

00:17:39.880 you asked specifically about the conservatives like can you can you rephrase your question or

00:17:44.280 ask it again like yeah i'll put it to you marty so you know i would kind of expect this from trudeau

00:17:50.520 trudeau just seems to be like the current thing guy that like whatever the popular thing on the

00:17:54.520 political left to progressives are he's going to be the champion of that thing whether it's like

00:17:57.720 like progressive politics, or I mean, the Ukraine stuff.

00:18:01.560 I mean, he seems to have a personal friendship

00:18:03.160 with Vladimir Zelensky.

00:18:05.040 But then on the right side,

00:18:06.940 like in the United States with the Republicans,

00:18:09.040 it seems like there's almost now a consensus

00:18:10.640 that they think this is a waste of time and money

00:18:12.420 and they just don't really want to fund it anymore.

00:18:14.400 And yet in Canada, when it comes

00:18:16.140 to more conservative minded, like leaders,

00:18:19.040 I would say people like, I don't know

00:18:20.240 if you can consider Andrew Coyne a conservative anymore.

00:18:22.240 He was long kind of thought about that way,

00:18:24.040 but I don't think he can be anymore.

00:18:25.380 People like Spencer Fernando,

00:18:26.480 who has long been like a writer and advocate

00:18:29.080 for small C conservative values in Canada,

00:18:32.580 him taking this position, and then some of the others.

00:18:35.020 I mean, I saw Adam Ziva's point, we can disagree.

00:18:38.280 Kaveh Shiraz is another one,

00:18:39.640 like he works with the Mignol laureate.

00:18:41.740 If you don't put the names of the people

00:18:43.540 making those posts, you'd have a hard time knowing

00:18:45.740 what side of the political spectrum they're on.

00:18:48.980 Right, yes.

00:18:49.820 In Canada, more than, yeah.

00:18:51.540 My question is like, why is it that

00:18:53.500 conservative establishment is on the same side with the left on this issue well when it comes

00:18:59.500 to adam's i just wanted like i don't agree with what he says but i think when you stand in the

00:19:03.020 firing line you get the privilege of kind of being able to say whatever you want yeah no i'm not

00:19:08.540 talking about him sorry i'll put that question to you marty so so why is it that the canadian

00:19:12.380 conservative leaders have the same position as the left on this issue i i i think it i think it's

00:19:18.940 they're looking at the popular opinion and they're just like Canadian conservatives are always afraid

00:19:24.380 to be conservative and to go against the popular opinion. I mean, everything they say is based on

00:19:30.580 polling. I'm convinced of that. So, you know, and they're battling the liberals right now. We see

00:19:36.960 it in the polls. So they're moving to the center and their opinion is hard to distinguish.

00:19:43.140 i i that's one aspect i think the other aspect too is you know it's easier to say uh to fool

00:19:49.500 someone than to get them to admit that they've been fooled and so this is a hard pill for a lot

00:19:53.380 of people to swallow including senior politicians like poiliev or whoever are making these comments

00:19:58.980 that um they're not going to suddenly say you know oh we got fooled and ukraine's the bad or

00:20:05.280 zelinski's the bad guy in this one so it's it's just it's one it's one aspect of politicians that

00:20:10.520 i that i detest which is they're they they're so reluctant to admit that they were wrong well i

00:20:15.880 want to go so on sunday pier poliev was speaking at a press conference in ottawa he was specifically

00:20:20.580 asked about this question on this issue and he uh well let's play the clip and then we can react to

00:20:26.740 it do we have that clip we support ukraine and its right to defend itself and to be independent

00:20:36.300 the aggressor in this conflict is russia russia carried out an unprovoked invasion of ukraine

00:20:42.640 an invasion that has been mercilessly prosecuting for the last three years

00:20:47.560 and ukraine has been the victim of that invasion all democracies need to stand with ukrainians

00:20:54.060 and their right to defend themselves and reclaim their territory and any suggestion to the contrary

00:21:01.520 is wrong. So kind of just repeating what he put in his in his tweet there and I think later on he

00:21:09.420 did talk about the need for basically like Canada could have played a bigger role in this had we

00:21:15.600 agreed to like sell our oil like we could have used Canadian LNG and energy to so that Europe

00:21:23.020 didn't have to buy Russian oil and gas and and basically this idea that we could have lowered

00:21:28.840 Europe's energy costs, lower their reliance on Russia, and created jobs at home if we had just

00:21:34.260 done something different. So I think it's good to sort of pivot away from the issue when Poliev

00:21:38.540 senses that it could be divided, because I don't think that the consensus is there in Canada like

00:21:43.580 it is in the US. Maybe it's because we have a larger Ukrainian population in Canada. I don't

00:21:47.760 know. That's a good, actually, that's a point, the fact that we have a large population. But

00:21:52.740 think about Poliev's comments. Like imagine if we go back to, I don't know, 2002, when Russia

00:21:58.700 invades afghanistan would poiliev has stood there and said hey you know uh russia's the aggressor

00:22:04.540 and everybody has the right to defend themselves and blah blah blah the difference would have been

00:22:07.980 back then that afghanistan was considered uh not a democracy and perhaps more of an enemy

00:22:13.820 so then poiliev defends it he's defending ukraine and he's using the excuse that ukraine is a

00:22:20.380 democracy and which is also an interesting thing because that's what if i was talking to poiliev

00:22:26.300 on the stage right now like how how can you make that stretch how can you say that ukraine is a

00:22:30.460 democracy like based on what well okay let's look let's get into this because marty you shared this

00:22:36.140 clip from the joe rogan podcast episode 1880 with tulsi gabbard which was recorded eight months ago

00:22:42.220 and in this they go to is this super interesting they go to a clip of stephen uh colbert report

00:22:48.620 colbert report where he is talking to an editor and sort of like an insider in the obama administration

00:22:55.340 uh so 2014 kind of almost like predicting this war and and and talking again about how

00:23:01.820 i mean to me this is this is not predicting it he's explaining it he's selling it he's selling

00:23:06.220 it on the on the news he's what he's doing yeah yeah so like this idea that ukraine was a buffer

00:23:11.980 state right it's like it's like between europe and russia and it's going to remain neutral and

00:23:17.260 it has to always remain neutral so that the two the two sides can never clash and then this is

00:23:22.060 basically him saying you know our american strategy is to break that that neutrality push

00:23:28.540 our people and push our side and you know replace any kind of like russian government with a pro

00:23:34.220 america like like this is this is the kind of stuff that that i think part of the reason that

00:23:39.260 trump has been elected in the united states because people don't want these like regime change

00:23:44.140 machines happening in washington they don't want the american government to basically dismantle

00:23:50.540 a foreign government so they disagree with so anyway we'll we'll watch this clip it's super

00:23:54.060 interesting and then we'll react i think it's on the longer side i think it's two or three

00:23:57.020 minutes here but let's play the clip and then i'll get your reaction

00:24:03.740 do we have that clip sean rose mr rose thank you so much for being here

00:24:09.100 there's the magazine foreign affairs now now now now gideon uh help me out here we've got

00:24:16.300 We've got a battle, the Ukraine, some of them want to go into the EU, the European Union,

00:24:22.400 and some of them want to stay with Russia.

00:24:24.240 If the Ukraine's not in Europe right now, what continent is it on?

00:24:27.300 Well, it's part of Eurasia, but it's part of Eastern Europe and the former Soviet bloc.

00:24:31.880 It's basically Robin to Russia's Batman.

00:24:35.420 And the challenge here, the challenge here is to try to attract it to the West, to get

00:24:40.680 it to flip sides.

00:24:41.880 So the rebels in the streets, what are they fighting for?

00:24:45.220 They're fighting for a better future.

00:24:46.760 Countries have a development...

00:24:47.760 That sounds like a political speech.

00:24:48.760 No, but it's actually true.

00:24:50.860 Countries have to develop over time.

00:24:52.580 And Ukraine basically, after the end of the Soviet Union, faced two tracks.

00:24:56.760 It could stay a sort of stagnant, corrupt, authoritarian country tied to Russia, or it

00:25:02.000 could essentially join the West.

00:25:04.020 It could modernize, liberalize, become a democracy.

00:25:07.160 At the last minute, when it looked like it was going to trade up from its sort of abusive

00:25:11.160 relationship with its a boyfriend from the hood to a nice yuppie uh you're not loading these choices

00:25:17.000 in any way whatsoever it's actually true when it looked like it was going to trade up to a better

00:25:21.720 uh environment uh at the last minute putin offered a bribe how much 15 billion uh it's a lot of cash

00:25:28.200 it's a lot of cash and the president who himself was tied to the old elites and the eastern part

00:25:33.400 of the country who ties to russia decided to back off the change and go you know how many pirate

00:25:38.440 themed restaurants you can buy with 15 billion dollars the problem was the western parts of the

00:25:43.400 country and the younger parts of the country and the more modern liberal parts of the country

00:25:47.400 basically knew that they had no future being russia's russia's vassal do we know they took

00:25:51.960 to the streets is america taking sides in this in any way if these people the the rebels are

00:25:57.000 winning right now right yes just recently why isn't obama spiking the ball in the end zone

00:26:01.640 and calling putin and saying hey you might have won the medal count but we won the country count

00:26:06.440 beyond okay so that was gideon rose who was the uh editor of foreign affairs magazine and he was

00:26:14.520 a member of the council on foreign relations talking about a book i mean it's so weird to

00:26:18.440 see them kind of making light about it and joking about it but this is the kind of stuff that

00:26:22.120 happens and this is i think something that so many people especially on the political right but

00:26:25.800 it used to be an issue of the political left i mean i remember when i was in university and the

00:26:30.040 iraq war and the afghanistan war the people that opposed those wars were on the political left now

00:26:34.840 it seems that they're on the political right um but this idea that that america like basically

00:26:39.320 meddles with the playing field and installs these governments and then goes on tv and

00:26:44.120 laughs about it i mean it's infuriating what do you what's your take marty it's exactly that i

00:26:48.360 mean it's it's fascinating to see these old clips that that i love the internet for that you can

00:26:53.160 find these old clips that that uh gideon is basically yeah he's an insider who's going on

00:26:58.360 the on the new on the talk show a comedy talk show and the light banter is it's all scripted

00:27:05.240 and he's basically uh telling people what they're about to do and and and and they went and did it

00:27:10.920 i mean yeah like ukraine is the bread basket of of of europe i mean the the amount of food that

00:27:16.440 comes in there like i said it's on it it's so strategic i was surprised that the russians let

00:27:22.280 it go when they did when the federation broke apart because all the rich uh uh russians had

00:27:29.960 properties on the black sea and on and like the resorts are there i mean we never even knew about

00:27:34.760 those resorts until after like you know uh just before the war in ukraine it was popular to go

00:27:40.360 there and visit these resorts are gorgeous and and it was super corrupt i i just want to bring

00:27:45.800 out one other thing one really really weird thing but you know when covet ended when the war in

00:27:51.240 in Ukraine started as soon as the war you as soon as the war in Ukraine started we stopped talking

00:27:56.580 about you uh COVID and all the people pushing the COVID narratives went oh thank God it's over we

00:28:01.600 can move on and now you're seeing that with the war in Ukraine a lot of people that are I'm surprised

00:28:08.420 that the conservatives are not flipping quickly and and going with Trump but you know get on the

00:28:13.940 right side of history and Trump is exposing what's going on and and if you continue down this path

00:28:19.080 you're going to be you're going to be a fool well i agree i think that was the first thing that gave

00:28:23.720 me skepticism was i was watching the trucker convoy and all the people who were trying to

00:28:28.200 say that these people are mega funded and they're extremists and they're nazis or whatever it was

00:28:32.200 like the same exact accounts suddenly like turn on a dime and start pushing this ukraine thing

00:28:38.040 and from my perspective like as soon as i just like someone sent me a tip showed me this picture

00:28:42.120 of christia freeland um with this kind of ukraine nationalist um scarf on and i and i posted it and

00:28:48.760 And I'm like, you know, this is a extreme group in, you know, the Banderas and having a bit of the context of like who that was, Ukrainian leader who collaborated and worked with the Nazis.

00:28:59.180 And then this is who Chrystia Freeland is promoting.

00:29:02.500 And then all of a sudden I'm called a Putin shill.

00:29:04.700 And I had like people in the government and people in the liberal establishment saying that I must be funded by Putin.

00:29:09.160 I'm like, I don't like Putin. I'm not a fan of Putin.

00:29:10.960 I'm just raising questions here. And a lot of it coming from tips from viewers.

00:29:14.680 And to me, that really showed like it was like it was you could see the work of a propaganda machine, propaganda campaign at work playing out online.

00:29:23.420 And that to me, that was what made me skeptical of it. Alex, I want to bring you in on all this.

00:29:28.300 Like when you when you look back and you see clips or I mean, even the idea that it was the Biden administration and Kamala Harris that were kind of like openly talking about bringing Ukraine into NATO, into the European Union.

00:29:41.820 The idea that it's supposed to be a neutral buffer zone and they're just kind of like, no, that's not going to be the case anymore.

00:29:47.360 I'm not saying that I support Putin at all.

00:29:49.580 I think the war has been terrible and obviously it's an illegal invasion, but it's not it's not as black and white as they paint it.

00:29:56.900 Yeah, I mean, it's definitely surreal to see, as Marty had mentioned, the political right now becoming the peaceniks versus the political left.

00:30:04.300 But I wonder how much of that is just a byproduct of the American political system and the two party system.

00:30:08.940 they do tend to flip flop on a lot of different issues over time. So I don't know if that's

00:30:14.020 terribly surprising. If I could backtrack just slightly to Paul Yev's position on the Ukraine

00:30:18.480 war, I think what's happening here, and again, I don't necessarily agree with his position,

00:30:22.460 but I think it's some good political calculus. Because let's be honest here, 99% of the people

00:30:27.280 in Canada who support Trump are already voting for Paul Yev. He doesn't need their vote. He needs

00:30:33.260 votes from the middle. And so it's really quite smart for him to position himself as somebody who

00:30:39.800 Trump doesn't like, right? That's how he's going to secure a lot of those 65 and older, you know,

00:30:45.480 the grandma vote, let's be honest here, who think that he's extreme right and so on and so forth.

00:30:49.900 I just, I think that's wrong. I think that that calculation, I mean, like in order to win an

00:30:54.100 election, you have to motivate your base. And it's the base that are going to go out, they're going

00:30:57.800 to make phone calls, they're going to volunteer, they're going to drive people to the polls. Like,

00:31:00.820 like the people that you really need are your strong. And I think if anything, what the

00:31:04.560 conservatives should have taken away from the last two election defeats is that when they alienate

00:31:08.980 that base to try to move to the center, it doesn't work out for them. They don't actually win. Like

00:31:12.700 to me, I would rather see a strong, like unequivocally conservative government. And

00:31:18.040 otherwise, I mean, you even, you have the PPCs, right? So people, they have another place to go

00:31:22.060 or they can stay home. We saw this in Ontario, just, you know, the voter turnout for Doug Ford

00:31:26.960 was abysmal, right? It was like 46% of the province came out and voted. So Conservatives

00:31:31.640 stayed at home. Now, for Ford, he didn't need that extra 10% of the base because there's no

00:31:36.620 real opposition. But in Canada, there is. I mean, maybe if it was Trudeau, and it was going to be a

00:31:41.720 walk in the park for Paulia, but he has a serious contender now in Mark Carney. And I don't think

00:31:46.060 that he can just rely on the staunchly conservative people to show up. I don't know that they will.

00:31:50.680 Yeah, I agree. I mean, I don't think that's the theme of the show for today, but we'll go there

00:31:55.400 for a few minutes. I mean, I think moving to the center, if both parties move to the center and

00:32:00.800 they make this an election about resumes and personalities, Carney could win this one on

00:32:06.500 personality and resume and credentials. But and I agree, I'd love I'd love conservatives,

00:32:12.720 Canadian conservative leaders to be like Ron DeSantis or somebody like that, that have proven

00:32:19.520 that you can be conservative and win an election. But there's a I think conservatives in this

00:32:23.480 country are afraid that being conservative won't win you an election i i completely agree okay i

00:32:29.240 want to go back to this like switch because i i we still have a couple things to get to i want to

00:32:33.740 first play uh this is tulsi gabbard on tiktok um just kind of going through zelensky and saying

00:32:40.920 like this guy is not your ally like this is not a good model for like freedom and democracy in the

00:32:47.060 West. Let's play that clip. Ukraine's President Zelensky has just banned yet another political

00:32:53.160 opposition party, one that questioned his legitimacy as president and used Ukraine's

00:32:59.280 Department of Justice to mandate the seizure of this party's members' assets. Now, this is just

00:33:05.120 the latest of Zelensky's actions to do this sort of thing. He began banning major political

00:33:09.520 opposition parties in 2022 when he also started banning TV channels that were associated with his

00:33:16.700 political opponents. And he took over total control of Ukraine's largest television networks

00:33:22.540 now controlled by their government. Zelensky's presidential term ended on May 20th. He canceled

00:33:28.940 elections in the name of martial law, suspending Ukraine's constitution so that he could stay in

00:33:34.480 power. So this is the perspective, obviously, of the Trump administration. So on Sunday, we had the

00:33:41.480 2025 London summit on Ukraine. So Western leaders quickly got together, European leaders, plus

00:33:47.300 there's Justin Trudeau. They're all standing with Vladimir Zelensky. And just again, to counter the

00:33:54.700 point that you were trying to make there, Alex, you had Maxi Bernier come in and posted the

00:33:59.280 following on X. He wrote of these leaders, he said, these globalist losers fatally weakened

00:34:05.060 their economies and societies with wokeism, mass immigration, unsustainable spending,

00:34:09.380 destructive energy policies and climate hysteria now they want to ramp up a pointless war against

00:34:14.720 russia while antagonizing the u.s suicidal well what's your what's your take from that alex what

00:34:20.700 do you what do you think of bernier's response i like bernier's response for sure but i think

00:34:26.220 that the ppc is a terrible party to vote for i mean you might as well do a write-in ballot for

00:34:30.580 yourself at that point and they're kind of irrelevant and unelectable yeah you can say

00:34:35.220 all sorts of things that i like it doesn't mean that i would vote for him because at the end of

00:34:38.720 day it's it's political right like you politics is a game about winning it's not about a game about

00:34:44.400 what saying the best things if you replayed that clip don't replay but if you replayed that tulsi

00:34:50.880 clip the last one and you replace the word uh ukraine with uh canada and you replace the word

00:34:57.520 zelensky with trudeau it would ring true like you know she's she's critical of a of a of a

00:35:03.200 country that has censored uh its people remove politicians that are that are problematic uh

00:35:11.360 like all those things we've you know the liberals have done all of that um max is critical of the

00:35:17.840 liberals and he's spot on when he does that i mean the you know and so which also explains why

00:35:24.160 of course if you're a liberal in canada right now you're going to try and defend um ukraine

00:35:30.240 and praise zelensky because you're praising a man who's doing exactly what your party is doing and

00:35:36.080 so you can't come out and criticize zelensky if a liberal came out and criticized zelensky for

00:35:40.800 censorship or or jailing dissidents or freezing bank accounts what would we do we go well you did

00:35:46.880 all those things so they're caught in uh which again i'm surprised like if i was a conservative

00:35:52.800 i would be hammering on the liberals and zelinski all through this but i don't know why they didn't

00:35:57.840 I, I tend to agree with that. And I want to bring this in because Jagmeet Singh in the midst of all of this, right? So, you know, prepare us before you show up, it's frustrating enough to have Justin Trudeau who should be on his way out. Like he, I just don't like him going and spending all of his time on international stage representing us. Like, okay, that's bad enough. But then on top of that, you have sort of his partner in crime, Jagmeet Singh, who in a regular world wouldn't really have any voice. He wouldn't have any standing in on an international stage.

00:36:27.840 stage in representing Canada, but because of the situation where he props up the liberals,

00:36:31.400 he has this importance and you have to take what he says seriously, but he's crazy. I'm sorry. He's

00:36:37.520 very fringed on this issue. So he wants to kick the U.S. out of the G7. He's calling on Trudeau

00:36:44.000 to not allow Donald Trump into the country, saying no to President Trump. He is saying that he should

00:36:49.920 not be allowed to attend the G7 Leaders Summit, which is coming up in Cannabascus, Ontario.

00:36:55.920 uh sorry kind of baskets alberta we have a clip from him and here he is basically just saying

00:37:00.780 that trump is a fascist and we shouldn't let him into canada here's that clip i also believe

00:37:05.280 we need to ban donald trump from attending the g7 summit donald trump should not be welcome here

00:37:13.120 why would we invite someone who has threatened our very democracy our very sovereignty

00:37:20.640 so um justin trito to his credit said that that singh is being irresponsible and that's obviously

00:37:29.040 not going to happen but at the same time you know we're talking about it and so we have to take

00:37:34.160 seriously what this individual has to say my perspective is that canada needs to deepen its

00:37:38.960 ties with the united states and we should make greater efforts to be a partner and to be part

00:37:43.940 of the north american team uh what's your position marty hard to be a bigger partner i mean we're

00:37:49.440 already like their biggest partner i mean you know 70 of their trade is with us we're like it

00:37:54.500 or not we're in bed together yeah but non-rhetoric i mean the fact that our leader i'm part of part

00:37:58.680 of the reason that oh yeah okay is because justin trudeau takes every opportunity he can

00:38:03.500 to criticize and to make like disparaging comments towards president trump at this point i you know

00:38:10.040 you you you're right i mean when when when trudeau handed in his resignation like in the private

00:38:16.260 sector if he handed in his resignation and said i'm going to stay on for another two weeks i would

00:38:20.420 have said no here's your two weeks of pay get the hell out we're letting him go around and do things

00:38:24.900 which is crazy and dangerous and i and i don't believe yeah and i do believe there is a scorched

00:38:30.340 earth uh kind of policy at this point that that that trudeau is going to continue to aggravate

00:38:35.940 trump because it helps uh his party long term um you know in and and then back to sing i mean you

00:38:44.580 like saying again the hypocrisy of him saying that uh trump is a a threat to democracy i'm like

00:38:52.180 come on saying like you mr saying you you you propped up a minority government for four years

00:38:57.860 for your own benefit like you're the threat to our democracy in this country so um 100 i i can't

00:39:05.300 take saying with any kind of i've had people try to convince me that he's actually an intelligent

00:39:09.700 man and he's just really really really good at playing politics and i'm like you're playing

00:39:16.020 politics with people's lives at this point it's not it's it's not good politics it's bad politics

00:39:21.460 i i can't buy that argument because if he was actually good at politics he wouldn't be driving

00:39:25.300 around ottawa in a maserati he wouldn't have a rolex watch collection he wouldn't be in these

00:39:29.860 tailored suits like he's not he's not good at this he's not very smart my my two cents alex

00:39:34.020 what do you think yeah so again i'm taking off my subjective citizen hat here and i'm putting

00:39:38.260 on my political war room hat. I totally agree with both of you guys on Ukraine and the entire

00:39:43.380 subject, really. But if Max Bernier's political decision to be the contrarian and to be the only

00:39:49.540 one who's opposing Trump amongst all the leaders is a good political decision, why isn't it moving

00:39:54.520 the needle? I mean, the PPC, it doesn't look like they're doing any better than they were two weeks

00:39:59.340 ago. And while it may be offensive to us on, you know, the political center of right, let's say,

00:40:04.840 in kind of our exosphere, if that's even a thing,

00:40:09.040 we sometimes forget, and it's easy to lose context,

00:40:11.840 of how leftist Canada really is.

00:40:15.040 I mean, Paul Yev, just on policies alone,

00:40:17.480 is probably left of Bernie Sanders.

00:40:21.460 Totally.

00:40:22.320 I mean, just on healthcare alone,

00:40:24.340 I mean, on lots of different policy issues.

00:40:26.280 And so he needs those votes.

00:40:28.680 I'm glad you went there.

00:40:29.940 I agree with that.

00:40:30.720 I've been taking a lot of crap lately

00:40:32.480 for daring to say that the polls are probably telling some truth right the polls that show

00:40:38.440 that the liberals are regaining some some popularity and that the conservatives are

00:40:43.280 losing it but it goes to that to to alex's point we are you know what we've been liberal 70 percent

00:40:48.420 of the last 157 years and we love to think of ourselves as progressive so um it it is uh yeah

00:40:56.280 that's a reality and good point that you know so i i just want to explore that with alex so do you

00:41:01.520 think? Because I often hear that the PPC people say the PPC have a nice platform and they're

00:41:06.380 conservatives. Do you think it's because of the person that given a different leader? Would the

00:41:14.300 PPC? I just want to push back on one thing, because I think that when it comes to the policies,

00:41:18.560 like each country, like you operate within the context of your own country, right? So like,

00:41:22.920 if Bernie Sanders was a politician in Canada, he would be to the left of the NDP. But he's working

00:41:28.100 in like the realm of what's possible universal health care is left-wing in the united states

00:41:33.240 in canada it's just the the basic like it's it's it's we've moved past that a long time ago yeah

00:41:39.020 yeah and so like i think that polyev to his credit his instincts are conservative and i think he's a

00:41:44.820 conservative individual but he's obviously making calculations as the leader of a political party

00:41:49.080 and doing things and saying things that he has to i would just disagree with that strategy and i

00:41:53.120 would say that i think people want authenticity they want something different so yes canada's

00:41:57.520 default liberal country i i'll take that even though i do think that there are deep conservative

00:42:02.000 principles that exist that a leader has to tap into in order to win and you can like even in

00:42:06.560 centrist like progressive mainstream conservatives who get their news unfortunately from the cbc

00:42:11.760 like if you show them a different perspective and show them a different path they would give

00:42:15.280 it a chance right they would say like if if pauliev came out and took a lot of the positions

00:42:19.920 say that maxim bernier is taking that that that he could be doing better in the polls that's that's

00:42:24.480 my position i'll let you uh put your question to alex here and then we'll wrap up the show

00:42:29.680 marty well i did put the the question i had to alex is is i don't think we want to go there too

00:42:35.280 deeply but is it is the ppc would the ppc do better with a change in leadership i mean it's

00:42:40.400 hard to say it's a hypothetical but but to address both of your points if a party were to direct its

00:42:47.760 entire platform towards bringing over the more conservative the more american conservative voter

00:42:53.360 base in canada um maybe it's a failure of max bernier as a leader but it doesn't appear as though

00:42:57.920 it's getting a lot of traction why that is i don't know it could it be the leader could it be

00:43:03.200 bad press i have no idea but it doesn't seem to be ranking higher than what two percent three

00:43:08.640 percent not a single seat in the house of commons so there was a by-election here recently in

00:43:13.840 clover they received 125 votes i remember as a kid the communist party used to get more votes than

00:43:19.280 125 um so yeah it just doesn't seem to be popular amongst canadians i don't know why

00:43:26.400 were you at the uh i was gonna get yeah so okay well i mean we'll have to have you gentlemen

00:43:32.000 back and we can talk a bit more about conservative strategy but i think i think it's a bit unfortunate

00:43:36.240 that uh we still have to beat this drum and when there is criticism of like the uniparty

00:43:41.360 in canada i think that this is one of the issues they point to on ukraine it's like

00:43:44.560 why do we have to yeah why do we have to put appointments and and before we and i know we're

00:43:49.520 running out of time but i i want to just maybe talk about this real quick i hope there is peace

00:43:54.080 in ukraine and there was and we forgot to talk about that i mean there was progress made so you

00:43:59.440 know trump and and putin sort of had a deal and and there were deals on the table so i what's your

00:44:05.760 thoughts on the events of friday did it completely kibosh a peace deal or was it just a temporary

00:44:12.160 setback i think there's a fundamental difference of agreement right the disagreement when it comes

00:44:17.200 to what the security guarantees are going to be like i think trump was taking it for granted that

00:44:21.600 he was going to get putin and zelinski to just agree that we need to stop the war and then at

00:44:26.880 that point trump wanted to go in and look at mineral rights and and make a deal to kind of

00:44:30.720 like rebuild ukraine but you can't start you can't have an economic deal until you have the security

00:44:34.880 deal and just it doesn't seem like they're there yet that doesn't mean that they're not going to

00:44:37.440 get there like maybe they're working behind the scenes and maybe diplomats are working hard to try

00:44:41.840 to you know fix things and get everyone back together and say like no no we do want this

00:44:47.120 agreement to happen but from what i saw friday in the fallout from it uh yeah yeah i mean zelinski's

00:44:53.280 playing it up right like zelinski's playing the victim in this and he's got he's garnering a lot

00:44:59.040 of sympathy from a lot of people so in a sense this might have backfired on trump it'll be

00:45:03.920 interesting kind of like his approach to trudeau and you know the way the liberals are soaring in

00:45:08.160 the polls right it did i i've asked that question right was he doing it because he's he's definitely

00:45:13.200 giving a bump to the liberals i don't think he did it intentionally um but yeah he's definitely

00:45:18.560 giving a bump to the liberals yeah if you if you were like really cynical you'd almost think that

00:45:23.600 trump and trudeau had some kind of a deal like because every time trump says right

00:45:27.760 all right gentlemen thank you so much for joining the show it's been a lot of fun that's marty up

00:45:30.480 north and uh alex lenski uh sorry all right cheers everyone thanks for joining us bye

00:45:40.640 great thank you so much for tuning in we'll be back again tomorrow with all the news i'm

00:45:43.760 I'm Candice Malcolm.

00:45:44.540 This is The Candice Malcolm Show.

00:45:45.540 Thank you and God bless.

Juno News - March 03, 2025

Canada wants to kick Trump out of the G7？

Episode Stats

Length

Words per Minute

Word Count

Sentence Count

Misogynist Sentences

Hate Speech Sentences

Summary

Transcript