Juno News - July 26, 2022


Dissidents are putting the Iranian regime on notice


Episode Stats

Length

39 minutes

Words per Minute

170.38857

Word Count

6,750

Sentence Count

161

Misogynist Sentences

7

Hate Speech Sentences

28


Summary


Transcript

00:00:00.000 Welcome to Canada's Most Irreverent Talk Show.
00:00:05.640 This is the Andrew Lawton Show, brought to you by True North.
00:00:10.720 Coming up, Iran is a brutal dictatorship with no respect for human rights,
00:00:14.880 with nuclear ambitions that wants to wipe its enemies off the map.
00:00:18.680 What can be done about it?
00:00:20.020 We'll talk about that up next in a special edition of the program.
00:00:23.460 The Andrew Lawton Show starts right now.
00:00:26.760 Hello, everyone, and welcome to Canada's Most Irreverent Talk Show.
00:00:31.000 This is the Andrew Lawton Show here on True North, Tuesday, July 26, 2022.
00:00:37.160 Going to have a bit of a different program today.
00:00:39.600 I'm on the road, if you can't tell, and the reason is one that I didn't mention beforehand,
00:00:44.160 and it was probably, in retrospect, quite a good idea that I didn't.
00:00:47.740 On the weekend, I was supposed to be covering the Free Iran Global Summit,
00:00:52.720 an event put on by the National Council of Resistance of Iran and the MEK,
00:00:57.340 which is the People's Mujahideen Organization of Iran.
00:01:00.940 And this summit was to be dedicated to the Iranian resistance,
00:01:04.400 those seeking to replace the current brutal Iranian regime,
00:01:08.660 which, as we know, has no respect for religious minorities,
00:01:11.920 no respect for gay rights, no respect for women,
00:01:14.760 and is increasingly threatening other states in the world,
00:01:18.180 notably Israel and the United States, as the largest state sponsor of terrorism,
00:01:23.560 no shortage of reasons why the Iranian regime has to go.
00:01:27.280 And this is a group of people that is dedicated to making that happen.
00:01:31.700 Now, the last couple of years,
00:01:33.160 they haven't been able to have their summit in person because of COVID.
00:01:36.200 I've covered them online.
00:01:37.780 You can see some of my coverage on the screen there.
00:01:39.880 And it's attracted a huge number of personalities,
00:01:43.020 political leaders, and dignitaries from around the world,
00:01:45.920 including in Canada, where in the past,
00:01:48.300 people like Stephen Harper have spoken,
00:01:50.100 Liberal MPs, Conservative MPs.
00:01:52.480 I believe Candace Bergen was at the one last year,
00:01:55.680 although she wasn't the Conservative leader at the time.
00:01:58.620 And this was supposed to be a big event.
00:02:01.280 The first time they've been able to do it in person,
00:02:03.700 Stephen Harper and John Baird were slated to be there in person.
00:02:07.040 That's the former Prime Minister and former Foreign Minister of Canada.
00:02:10.920 And interestingly enough,
00:02:12.440 both of them, I think, were at Pearson Airport,
00:02:14.540 just on the flight before me,
00:02:16.420 when it came from Toronto to Germany,
00:02:18.660 where you had to transfer to get on to a Lufthansa flight to Albania.
00:02:22.880 Not that we're doing the travel recap on the show here.
00:02:25.180 It was just about how everyone was going to the same place at the same time.
00:02:29.100 And this event was cancelled at the last minute
00:02:32.800 because of a security alert.
00:02:35.380 And we reported on this at True North.
00:02:37.360 It started on the 21st,
00:02:39.120 which was, I believe, the Thursday,
00:02:40.420 with a security alert that was published by the United States Embassy in Albania.
00:02:45.140 And it was very nondescript.
00:02:46.640 It was very scant on detail.
00:02:48.580 It just said the U.S. government was aware of a potential threat targeting the summit.
00:02:53.300 And they advised U.S. citizens to stay away.
00:02:55.580 Now, I'm not a U.S. citizen,
00:02:57.080 so theoretically, I guess no one was telling me not to go.
00:02:59.900 But it's the sort of thing you take seriously,
00:03:01.960 especially because in 2018,
00:03:04.480 when the NCRI and the MEK were having their big event in Paris,
00:03:08.900 the Iranian government did, in fact, try to blow it up.
00:03:12.540 And the bomber behind that was an Iranian diplomat, believe it or not,
00:03:16.600 who's now facing a jail sentence.
00:03:18.640 And there's talk about extradition going on as we speak.
00:03:21.960 The idea of Iran targeting this event is not foreign.
00:03:25.420 So you take these things seriously.
00:03:27.280 The Albanian government also took it seriously
00:03:30.100 and said to organizers,
00:03:31.580 we really don't think you should proceed.
00:03:33.340 So they had to pull the plug on this event.
00:03:36.100 And a lot of the people that had already gone the distance,
00:03:38.420 including, by the way, Prime Minister Stephen Harper,
00:03:41.120 did not have an event to go to.
00:03:43.040 Now, what happened after that,
00:03:45.320 I have not reported on at this point
00:03:47.020 because of the security implications of it.
00:03:49.440 But several of the people there did participate
00:03:51.960 in informal and casual tours and discussions
00:03:55.340 that were not part of the big summit,
00:03:56.900 but nonetheless did allow people to connect
00:03:59.800 to the story of the Iranian resistance.
00:04:02.860 And that's the story that people were going to be telling
00:04:04.760 at that summit.
00:04:06.140 And there was a delegation of Canadian members of parliament
00:04:08.700 and had Liberal MPs, Conservative MPs,
00:04:11.640 one Bloc Québécois MP, and no NDP MPs.
00:04:14.800 Now, interestingly enough,
00:04:15.960 I was speaking with one of the organizers
00:04:18.500 who's helped liaise between Canadian parliamentarians
00:04:22.060 and the host organization.
00:04:24.340 And she said, you know, in the past,
00:04:25.560 they've tried to have NDP representatives there,
00:04:27.660 and they just can't seem to get any that want to come
00:04:30.260 to an event opposed to the Iranian regime.
00:04:32.620 So take from that what you will.
00:04:34.140 But there was multi-party representation,
00:04:36.560 same as for the U.S.,
00:04:37.880 where you had Democrats and Republicans.
00:04:39.840 And for other countries,
00:04:40.780 they had delegations from France, from Italy, and so on.
00:04:44.840 And interestingly enough,
00:04:46.100 they had an event, a dinner reception,
00:04:48.260 where a lot of these people were able to come together.
00:04:50.620 But because they were already sort of there
00:04:52.440 when the cancellation came,
00:04:53.960 it was unimpeded by all of this.
00:04:56.560 So what's fascinating about this topic
00:04:59.000 is that it's an issue that everyone should be on side with.
00:05:02.240 Everyone should be able to agree with it.
00:05:04.440 The stories you heard there
00:05:05.860 are absolutely phenomenal and gripping.
00:05:08.700 I spoke to one gentleman, as I tweeted about,
00:05:11.180 who was stood, he stood next to a replica
00:05:14.000 of how he was tortured
00:05:16.280 when he was an Iranian political prisoner,
00:05:18.440 put behind bars,
00:05:19.420 because he dared to criticize the regime.
00:05:22.080 And it was just absolutely brutal.
00:05:23.760 And hearing him describe in Farsi through a translator
00:05:26.620 what happened to him was very difficult.
00:05:29.540 Yet there he stood saying,
00:05:30.820 I'm not giving up.
00:05:31.720 I'm not stopping the fight.
00:05:33.780 Another woman who was in a room full of women,
00:05:36.860 they were put in these,
00:05:37.740 they're not even cells,
00:05:38.780 they're cubicles.
00:05:39.780 But I mean, they are cells,
00:05:40.880 they're cages.
00:05:41.820 And she was kept in this little box.
00:05:44.100 And if you so much as raised your head above it,
00:05:46.040 you'd get your head smashed down.
00:05:47.400 And she spoke about how her and her friends
00:05:49.620 were in this thing.
00:05:50.960 Some of them never came out
00:05:52.120 because they were killed.
00:05:53.660 And there was a line that she shared with me
00:05:55.720 that really stood out.
00:05:57.100 She said, you know, for starters, in Iran,
00:05:58.920 simply being a woman in the first place is a crime.
00:06:02.060 Everything else on top of that only makes it worse.
00:06:05.040 So if you're an outspoken woman,
00:06:06.520 if you're a woman that's part of an activist group
00:06:08.780 against the regime,
00:06:10.980 that is something that carries
00:06:12.160 an incredibly steep punishment.
00:06:13.580 So these people who have fled this
00:06:16.140 were telling their stories,
00:06:18.000 but many of them still have family back in Iran,
00:06:20.120 which is why they have not given up the fight.
00:06:23.280 And there was a lot of resilience in these people,
00:06:26.040 which was quite something.
00:06:27.400 And I've spoken with some of them on the show in the past,
00:06:29.820 meeting them in person,
00:06:30.900 seeing this space was very significant.
00:06:33.780 And because there were so many dignitaries there,
00:06:36.240 I said we were able to have some informal conversations
00:06:38.560 that weren't part of the main conference.
00:06:40.560 And one of them really bordered on,
00:06:42.820 I think, that cross-partisan element
00:06:44.760 that I was speaking about before.
00:06:46.780 I spoke to former United States ambassador
00:06:49.280 to the UN's Human Rights Council,
00:06:51.600 Ken Blackwell,
00:06:52.440 who's also been a mainstay
00:06:53.980 in the conservative speaker circuit in the US.
00:06:56.380 I met him many years ago at CPAC,
00:06:58.880 which is the big conservative political action conference.
00:07:01.980 But it was interesting,
00:07:03.400 and I spoke to him about this,
00:07:04.600 how the world capitulates
00:07:06.140 to a lot of these dictatorships and abusive regimes
00:07:08.820 for reasons that,
00:07:10.480 well, we got into it in our chat.
00:07:11.860 Ambassador, let me first ask you about
00:07:14.560 the political approach to Iran,
00:07:18.200 because obviously this is bipartisan.
00:07:19.880 There are Democrats and Republicans
00:07:21.000 that are supportive of the work that's being done here.
00:07:23.760 But I find it's overwhelmingly on the Republican side.
00:07:26.380 So why do you think it is that
00:07:27.540 in the Democrat Party,
00:07:29.480 there is still this resistance
00:07:30.700 to calling out a regime
00:07:33.160 that is doing all of the things
00:07:34.560 that the left is supposed to hate?
00:07:35.920 You know, no women's rights,
00:07:37.560 no gay rights,
00:07:38.280 no religious minority rights.
00:07:39.600 Yeah, that's it's a mystery to me
00:07:43.660 why there isn't a greater groundswell of support
00:07:47.500 within the Democratic Party.
00:07:51.060 But I am pleased.
00:07:53.640 I am encouraged by those who are speaking up
00:07:57.060 and speaking out.
00:07:57.960 And on my side of the aisle,
00:08:01.300 I'm encouraged by those who want to work
00:08:04.340 in a bipartisan spirit
00:08:06.100 to be a false multiplier,
00:08:10.300 a force multiplier
00:08:11.540 to the whole free Iran movement.
00:08:18.000 But what we have to understand
00:08:20.020 is the interrelatedness of things.
00:08:24.300 I don't think there are too many Americans
00:08:27.860 who don't instinctively understand
00:08:30.840 that Iran is a threat economically,
00:08:38.140 in terms of global terrorism,
00:08:41.180 to them.
00:08:42.700 and that a regime
00:08:44.200 that goes unchecked
00:08:46.280 with its brutality
00:08:47.100 in its country
00:08:48.420 will, in fact,
00:08:49.900 eventually spread that cancer
00:08:52.740 throughout the world.
00:08:54.620 You served in the United Nations,
00:08:56.740 and I know there are a great many criticisms
00:08:58.540 that we can all make
00:08:59.580 about the UN
00:09:00.180 and its approach to regimes
00:09:02.020 like Iran or Russia
00:09:03.560 or the other places.
00:09:05.140 But let me ask,
00:09:06.300 is there a role for the UN
00:09:09.160 that you feel it's doing
00:09:10.000 particularly well in this?
00:09:11.380 Well, you know,
00:09:12.120 one of the challenges
00:09:13.020 of the Human Rights Commission
00:09:15.540 in Geneva
00:09:17.380 and committee in New York
00:09:21.020 is that what we find
00:09:23.040 is that many of the folks
00:09:25.080 on the jury
00:09:26.080 should be in the dock.
00:09:27.660 And so there's a lot of log-roading
00:09:29.200 and harsh trading
00:09:30.040 that goes on.
00:09:32.520 And tyrants
00:09:34.320 and authoritarian regimes
00:09:36.360 protect one another.
00:09:38.500 But we can't retreat
00:09:39.820 to the sidelines.
00:09:40.680 We must engage
00:09:42.100 and we must win
00:09:44.520 or else, you know,
00:09:47.900 this will be settled
00:09:49.040 by armed conflict.
00:09:51.360 And so diplomacy
00:09:53.680 is softer.
00:09:56.960 Economic sanctions
00:09:58.560 are a bit harder.
00:09:59.680 harder.
00:10:01.940 But we need to use
00:10:03.420 all of the tools.
00:10:05.760 Economic sanctions,
00:10:07.440 we need to be
00:10:08.340 also engaged,
00:10:10.360 fully engaged
00:10:11.120 in diplomacy.
00:10:13.640 But we must understand
00:10:15.380 that if we don't win
00:10:16.780 on those levels,
00:10:18.120 there will be
00:10:19.880 hard war consequences
00:10:22.820 across the globe.
00:10:24.620 Madeleine Albright
00:10:25.700 in her book
00:10:26.200 has the line
00:10:26.760 that I love,
00:10:27.300 which is that
00:10:27.660 diplomacy is everything
00:10:28.660 from kind words
00:10:29.440 to cruise missiles.
00:10:30.900 And sometimes
00:10:31.500 you get people
00:10:32.220 that don't want
00:10:32.780 to move much
00:10:33.480 beyond kind words.
00:10:35.120 And when you're
00:10:36.500 looking at sanctions,
00:10:38.280 the challenge
00:10:39.160 that's always put,
00:10:39.960 I mean,
00:10:40.240 with Iran sanctions
00:10:41.240 in particular,
00:10:42.040 is that they don't
00:10:43.100 actually harm the people
00:10:43.960 at the top,
00:10:44.520 they harm the people
00:10:45.440 at the bottom.
00:10:45.960 And they can actually
00:10:47.060 be used by the regime
00:10:48.940 to blame the countries
00:10:50.300 that are applying
00:10:50.880 the sanctions.
00:10:51.540 So if you are looking
00:10:52.760 at sanctions as being
00:10:53.920 not the be-all and end-all,
00:10:55.100 but one tool,
00:10:56.580 how do you do them
00:10:57.520 in a way
00:10:58.100 that doesn't harm
00:11:00.540 the people?
00:11:02.080 Well, you know,
00:11:02.480 I'm not sure
00:11:03.140 that you can.
00:11:04.800 What I'm encouraged
00:11:05.980 by is the growth,
00:11:09.380 the expansion
00:11:10.160 in the numbers
00:11:11.440 of folks internal
00:11:12.880 to Iran
00:11:14.700 who are now
00:11:15.980 siding with
00:11:17.340 the opposition.
00:11:18.820 So the harder
00:11:20.040 they crack down,
00:11:22.260 it's backfiring
00:11:23.960 on them
00:11:24.420 because the resistance
00:11:26.640 is being amplified
00:11:27.640 globally,
00:11:29.640 but it is intensifying
00:11:31.780 within the country.
00:11:34.980 And as a consequence
00:11:36.060 of the inside-outside
00:11:37.480 pressure,
00:11:38.480 I think you can affect
00:11:39.800 change
00:11:40.600 and in its most
00:11:42.920 substantial form,
00:11:44.040 regime change.
00:11:45.220 When you mentioned
00:11:45.760 the United Nations,
00:11:46.760 I very much enjoyed
00:11:48.260 your line on that,
00:11:49.540 which I think sums up
00:11:50.340 a very good position.
00:11:51.700 This is a body that,
00:11:53.220 and a lot of international
00:11:54.480 multilateral organizations
00:11:55.980 are like,
00:11:56.380 it's the World Health Organization.
00:11:57.480 They do so much
00:11:58.740 to try to keep China
00:11:59.580 at the table.
00:12:00.120 It comes at the expense
00:12:00.940 of what's supposed
00:12:01.460 to be the mission.
00:12:02.560 United Nations as well,
00:12:03.740 bringing Saudi Arabia
00:12:04.600 onto the Human Rights Committee.
00:12:06.380 And, you know,
00:12:06.860 meanwhile,
00:12:07.340 Canada has been trying
00:12:08.200 to get on the Security Council
00:12:09.880 for a while
00:12:10.420 with little success.
00:12:11.480 But how do you,
00:12:14.040 as the United States
00:12:15.620 representative on that
00:12:16.740 committee for a time,
00:12:18.100 how do you respond
00:12:19.040 to the UN,
00:12:20.600 which has more hostility
00:12:21.840 towards the United States
00:12:22.920 than it does
00:12:23.600 to Saudi Arabia
00:12:24.760 and to Iran
00:12:25.400 at various points?
00:12:27.400 I guess if I ask the question
00:12:29.580 in a different way,
00:12:30.440 it's what's the point
00:12:32.000 when the body itself
00:12:33.280 just seems so hostile
00:12:34.440 to your involvement?
00:12:36.500 You know,
00:12:37.880 we can have impact.
00:12:40.800 But what I used to tell
00:12:42.260 the Bush administration
00:12:44.560 and at the beginning
00:12:45.480 of the Clinton administration,
00:12:47.940 because I was head
00:12:49.960 of the U.S. delegation
00:12:51.820 to the planning
00:12:53.540 of the World Conference
00:12:55.240 on Human Rights,
00:12:56.580 I used to say,
00:12:57.440 look,
00:12:58.080 what we must understand
00:13:00.580 is that we have a choice.
00:13:04.420 We can be on the sidelines
00:13:06.840 or we can be engaged.
00:13:12.260 What we have to affect
00:13:15.120 is we have to leverage
00:13:17.120 everything that we have
00:13:19.480 in our toolbox.
00:13:21.380 And one of those things
00:13:23.240 are bilateral negotiations.
00:13:25.520 And so we need to be stronger
00:13:29.220 on the bilateral side
00:13:31.000 with key players
00:13:32.660 to build our numbers up.
00:13:36.460 You know,
00:13:36.700 what I've now experienced
00:13:37.980 as I crisscrossed
00:13:39.020 the continent of Africa
00:13:40.280 is that people there
00:13:42.960 now know that China
00:13:44.400 didn't do diplomacy
00:13:48.800 and economic contributions
00:13:52.520 for out of the kindness
00:13:55.440 of their heart.
00:13:56.280 They built a debt trap
00:13:58.200 and that's what
00:14:00.200 they're executing.
00:14:01.880 It becomes easier
00:14:03.240 when the United States
00:14:04.880 is forceful
00:14:05.840 and clear-headed
00:14:06.600 in its bilateral
00:14:07.740 communications
00:14:09.440 with those individual
00:14:10.540 countries
00:14:11.740 to join the consensus
00:14:14.300 at the United Nations.
00:14:16.340 So it is a bilateral strategy
00:14:19.360 to affect
00:14:20.200 improved
00:14:21.280 multilateral
00:14:22.800 results.
00:14:24.820 That was former
00:14:26.000 U.S. Ambassador
00:14:26.880 to the U.N.
00:14:27.640 Commissions on Human Rights
00:14:29.240 Ken Blackwell
00:14:30.300 and I appreciated him
00:14:31.740 taking the time.
00:14:32.620 And I will say
00:14:33.380 a couple of these things
00:14:34.300 were taking place
00:14:35.420 in areas where there's
00:14:36.400 a lot of background noise
00:14:37.300 so we've done our best
00:14:38.020 to filter it out
00:14:38.620 but I do apologize.
00:14:40.080 It was just me
00:14:40.900 in Albania
00:14:41.600 with a couple of pieces
00:14:42.880 of equipment there
00:14:43.480 so we didn't have a chance
00:14:44.320 to do like the full studio
00:14:45.400 setup that we normally
00:14:47.060 would like to do.
00:14:48.220 But I will say
00:14:49.340 that what was fascinating
00:14:50.360 in talking to some
00:14:51.320 of the dignitaries
00:14:52.020 that were there
00:14:52.480 and for the most part
00:14:53.520 they were there to listen
00:14:54.360 but some of them
00:14:55.960 have become
00:14:56.560 very supportive
00:14:58.080 and very much
00:14:59.220 not members
00:14:59.880 but certainly very
00:15:00.880 much champions
00:15:02.340 of what the MEK
00:15:03.720 and NCRI are doing
00:15:04.740 and one of those
00:15:05.320 is Stephen Harper
00:15:06.000 who again has been
00:15:06.880 quite a well-regarded speaker.
00:15:09.060 When I told people
00:15:09.900 I was Canadian
00:15:10.480 they said
00:15:10.880 oh you know
00:15:11.280 do you know Stephen Harper
00:15:12.100 and I said
00:15:12.460 well I don't know him
00:15:13.680 and then they of course
00:15:14.440 realize I'm a nobody
00:15:15.280 but I said no
00:15:16.280 I've interviewed him
00:15:17.000 and I certainly know of him
00:15:18.280 and I've followed
00:15:19.000 his participation
00:15:19.700 here.
00:15:21.120 John Baird
00:15:21.860 is someone I have
00:15:22.860 talked to on a number
00:15:23.900 of occasions
00:15:24.460 and he's a very
00:15:25.700 passionate supporter
00:15:26.900 of human rights
00:15:28.120 around the world.
00:15:29.220 John Baird
00:15:29.820 served as
00:15:30.680 Canada's foreign affairs
00:15:31.980 minister
00:15:32.440 big supporter of Israel
00:15:34.420 big supporter
00:15:35.420 of the Iranian resistance
00:15:36.560 and he's become
00:15:37.700 a big supporter
00:15:38.540 of the MEK.
00:15:39.680 Now I want to
00:15:40.540 qualify something here
00:15:41.860 in that I've been
00:15:42.600 speaking very favorably
00:15:43.840 about the stories
00:15:44.600 that have been told
00:15:45.340 about the invitation
00:15:46.920 that I got to see
00:15:48.060 some of this firsthand
00:15:49.040 but what's interesting
00:15:50.900 is that this is not
00:15:51.720 an organization
00:15:52.300 without controversy
00:15:53.660 until 2012
00:15:54.680 it was on the
00:15:56.300 terrorism organization
00:15:57.620 list in Canada
00:15:59.160 in the United States
00:16:00.360 in the United Kingdom
00:16:01.340 and in 2012
00:16:02.980 all of these countries
00:16:04.460 removed it.
00:16:05.460 Now one of the things
00:16:06.680 that had happened
00:16:07.280 is the organization
00:16:07.880 had petitioned in court
00:16:09.440 in many different
00:16:10.560 jurisdictions
00:16:11.100 and many countries
00:16:12.060 challenging the assertion
00:16:13.820 that it was
00:16:14.400 a terrorism organization
00:16:15.980 and essentially
00:16:17.260 in its past
00:16:18.320 some of the members
00:16:19.080 and some of the founders
00:16:19.940 had engaged in
00:16:20.980 violent activity
00:16:22.180 during wars
00:16:23.200 such as the Iran-Iraq war
00:16:24.820 or other conflicts
00:16:26.240 during the Iranian revolution
00:16:27.960 but what was interesting
00:16:29.540 beyond that
00:16:30.620 is that it was
00:16:31.360 the Iranian regime
00:16:32.560 that lobbied it.
00:16:34.280 Bill Clinton
00:16:34.880 back when he was
00:16:36.080 in the White House
00:16:36.660 put the MEK
00:16:38.400 on the terrorism list
00:16:39.820 as kind of a token
00:16:41.340 to the Iranian regime
00:16:42.680 when they were trying
00:16:43.340 to get concessions
00:16:44.240 on some negotiation.
00:16:46.400 So that was
00:16:47.340 the fascinating part
00:16:48.320 is that it was
00:16:48.800 the Iranian regime
00:16:50.500 the brutal dictatorship
00:16:51.980 led by Ayatollah Khomeini
00:16:53.660 that got them
00:16:55.500 declared as a terrorist
00:16:56.860 and I think
00:16:57.220 when a lot of
00:16:57.740 Western countries
00:16:58.500 10 years ago
00:16:59.560 were looking at this
00:17:00.340 saying well
00:17:00.740 this doesn't really fit
00:17:01.960 this isn't really a group
00:17:02.900 that's a terrorist organization
00:17:04.420 and I think the proof
00:17:05.720 of that is
00:17:06.480 the fact that
00:17:07.300 this was a so-called
00:17:08.160 terror group
00:17:08.740 10 years ago
00:17:09.400 but now you have
00:17:10.180 foreign leaders
00:17:10.940 Western leaders
00:17:11.740 from all different parties
00:17:13.240 and political stripes
00:17:14.220 imaginable
00:17:15.000 that are coming out
00:17:16.140 to their events
00:17:16.820 and speaking
00:17:17.800 but I did speak
00:17:18.900 to John Barrett
00:17:19.580 about that
00:17:20.180 and more broadly
00:17:21.280 whether this is
00:17:22.340 an organization
00:17:23.200 that is influential
00:17:24.820 in the resistance
00:17:26.120 and whether it actually
00:17:27.200 has the capacity
00:17:28.060 to do what they're
00:17:28.800 all talking about
00:17:29.680 which is wanting
00:17:30.720 to end the regime
00:17:32.040 as it currently stands.
00:17:33.580 Why are you here
00:17:34.220 first off?
00:17:35.020 I'm here to stand
00:17:35.740 in solidarity
00:17:36.360 with the people of Iran
00:17:37.800 and their great struggle
00:17:38.620 to break the yoke
00:17:40.400 of a brutal government
00:17:42.880 by the Mullahs in Tehran
00:17:44.440 and to promote
00:17:45.840 that there is
00:17:46.200 a better future
00:17:46.820 for the people of Iran.
00:17:48.680 Terrorism is the great struggle
00:17:49.800 of our generation.
00:17:51.160 My grandfather went
00:17:51.820 to World War II
00:17:52.580 to fight fascism
00:17:54.900 and stayed in the Canadian forces
00:17:55.860 for 25 years
00:17:56.800 and to fight communism.
00:18:00.840 The great struggle
00:18:01.320 of our generation
00:18:01.900 is to fight terrorism
00:18:02.800 and Iran is the biggest
00:18:04.500 sponsor of terrorism
00:18:05.780 everywhere in the world
00:18:06.600 but the big victims
00:18:08.180 of terrorism
00:18:08.740 are the Iranian people
00:18:09.680 themselves
00:18:10.080 and I'm inspired
00:18:10.700 by their courage
00:18:11.360 and bravery.
00:18:12.460 A decade ago
00:18:13.460 this organization
00:18:14.500 was on Canada's
00:18:15.860 list of terrorist organizations
00:18:17.740 and that of the United States
00:18:19.140 and the United Kingdom
00:18:19.880 and elsewhere
00:18:20.320 and that changed
00:18:21.780 while you were
00:18:22.920 in government,
00:18:23.800 while Stephen Harper's
00:18:24.480 government was in power.
00:18:26.240 What was it
00:18:27.160 that led to that change
00:18:29.420 and how do you go
00:18:30.720 as the foreign minister
00:18:32.160 of a country
00:18:32.640 that view this
00:18:33.620 as a terrorist organization
00:18:34.660 to being here
00:18:35.240 as a guest now?
00:18:36.060 What is it that
00:18:36.660 the country's got wrong?
00:18:38.620 Well, I think
00:18:39.320 if you look at
00:18:39.740 both the Harper government
00:18:41.120 and the Obama administration
00:18:42.540 looked at the facts
00:18:44.320 and made a determination
00:18:45.360 that it may have been
00:18:46.900 at some point in the past
00:18:48.120 but it certainly wasn't
00:18:48.960 going forward
00:18:49.760 and the fact
00:18:50.420 you have a conservative
00:18:51.040 government in Canada
00:18:51.820 and a liberal democratic
00:18:52.720 government in Washington
00:18:54.080 both did the same thing
00:18:55.240 speaks to the most important thing
00:18:57.140 the truth.
00:18:58.240 I'm inspired by
00:18:59.040 the National Council
00:19:00.040 Resistance of Iran's
00:19:00.920 10-point plan
00:19:01.620 democracy, human rights,
00:19:03.420 the rule of law,
00:19:04.420 gender equality,
00:19:05.700 no nuclear weapons,
00:19:07.960 stopping the export
00:19:09.120 of terrorism
00:19:10.860 in the region
00:19:11.340 and around the world.
00:19:12.700 These are what people
00:19:14.000 in the West
00:19:14.820 have wanted to hear
00:19:15.340 for a long time.
00:19:16.500 The last few conferences,
00:19:17.940 I know the last two
00:19:18.640 have been online
00:19:19.380 when speakers
00:19:20.060 like Stephen Harper
00:19:21.080 like you
00:19:21.620 and other dignitaries
00:19:22.720 have come
00:19:23.040 they've all spoken about
00:19:24.860 what feels like
00:19:25.780 an imminence
00:19:26.380 of being able
00:19:27.020 to bring this organization
00:19:28.120 back to Tehran
00:19:29.000 and have this event there
00:19:30.020 and I guess
00:19:31.120 what I would ask you
00:19:31.880 is how close
00:19:33.260 to that reform
00:19:34.480 do you feel Iran is
00:19:35.880 and what's missing?
00:19:36.920 What's that spark
00:19:38.220 that's needed
00:19:38.760 to really get that change
00:19:39.920 in the regime?
00:19:40.660 The regime is noted
00:19:41.600 if you look at the facts
00:19:42.440 on the ground
00:19:42.900 this regime
00:19:43.600 it's at its weakest point
00:19:44.700 in more than 40 years
00:19:46.240 that we were briefed
00:19:49.020 yesterday
00:19:49.620 on the 5,000
00:19:51.680 resistance units
00:19:52.580 in every corner
00:19:53.540 of the country
00:19:54.500 when change happens
00:19:56.880 when regimes fall
00:19:57.980 it'll happen very quickly
00:19:59.380 and there's no doubt
00:20:00.660 we're getting closer
00:20:01.360 to that day
00:20:01.960 look at how quickly
00:20:03.080 the Berlin Wall fell
00:20:04.200 and Eastern Europe
00:20:05.260 got freedom
00:20:06.580 the same will be the case
00:20:08.140 in Tehran
00:20:09.220 the IRGC
00:20:10.580 is starting to crack
00:20:12.140 the government is afraid
00:20:15.120 the fact that they
00:20:15.740 were scheduling
00:20:16.740 a terrorist attack
00:20:17.700 on Ashraf 3
00:20:18.820 this weekend
00:20:19.880 showed how much
00:20:21.240 they fear this organization
00:20:24.460 the fact that they have
00:20:25.640 a law in Iran
00:20:26.280 that doesn't allow
00:20:26.900 a woman to run
00:20:27.700 for president
00:20:28.160 says they're afraid
00:20:28.920 Madame Rajavi
00:20:30.600 When you look at
00:20:32.760 some of the changes
00:20:33.500 in the Arab world
00:20:34.680 let's talk about Israel
00:20:36.120 having all of these
00:20:37.060 normalized relationships
00:20:38.100 and new diplomatic
00:20:38.760 relationships with Arab countries
00:20:40.220 the traditional allegiances
00:20:42.780 are very much changing
00:20:44.220 and I was wondering
00:20:45.000 if you saw
00:20:45.800 a potential
00:20:46.960 for change
00:20:48.360 in the way
00:20:48.880 the Arab world
00:20:49.540 engages with Iran
00:20:50.520 well listen
00:20:51.180 I mean
00:20:51.780 I used to look at
00:20:53.180 Iran's nuclear program
00:20:54.760 and support for terrorism
00:20:55.900 almost exclusively
00:20:57.040 through the lens
00:20:58.000 of Israel
00:20:59.140 but you look at
00:21:00.240 the Sunni Arab Gulf countries
00:21:01.380 who
00:21:01.720 when I was foreign minister
00:21:02.900 and Stephen Harper
00:21:03.460 was prime minister
00:21:04.080 we had an unprecedented
00:21:05.700 warm and constructive
00:21:07.040 relationship
00:21:07.640 really phenomenal
00:21:08.520 with Saudi Arabia
00:21:09.420 especially
00:21:09.800 the United Arab Emirates
00:21:11.120 and Bahrain
00:21:12.080 to name just a few
00:21:12.860 of the Gulf states
00:21:13.460 they live right across
00:21:15.400 the Gulf
00:21:15.860 from the
00:21:17.040 the mullahs
00:21:17.740 in Tehran
00:21:18.740 and so they're
00:21:19.520 every bit as afraid
00:21:20.680 of this regime
00:21:22.600 as we are
00:21:23.660 and of course Canada
00:21:24.620 with the explosion
00:21:26.060 of the Ukrainian plane
00:21:27.080 killing some
00:21:28.020 killing dozens
00:21:28.900 and dozens
00:21:29.340 and dozens
00:21:29.760 of Canadians
00:21:30.420 and even more
00:21:32.420 Canadian residents
00:21:33.440 it shows you
00:21:34.940 that we're not immune
00:21:35.640 from the terrorism
00:21:36.940 that this regime
00:21:38.080 supports around the world
00:21:39.760 that was not an accident
00:21:40.900 it was a deliberate attack
00:21:42.780 and so now
00:21:43.900 we've been drawn in
00:21:45.000 directly as victims
00:21:46.320 of this
00:21:47.960 of this
00:21:48.800 of this
00:21:50.340 terrible government
00:21:51.120 I recall
00:21:51.960 when the former
00:21:52.680 Harper government
00:21:53.500 ended diplomatic ties
00:21:54.760 with Iran
00:21:55.160 there was
00:21:55.520 some pushback
00:21:56.520 domestically
00:21:57.120 from the political left
00:21:58.620 and I was wondering
00:21:59.460 if you felt
00:22:00.000 looking back on that
00:22:01.740 quite vindicated
00:22:02.660 with how Iran
00:22:03.720 has continued to go down
00:22:04.860 I'll start off
00:22:06.100 with your
00:22:06.320 everyone thought
00:22:07.260 that our strong
00:22:08.640 and unequivocal support
00:22:09.700 for Israel
00:22:10.740 would kill our
00:22:12.360 relationships
00:22:12.860 with the Arab world
00:22:13.780 I think when we
00:22:15.040 left office
00:22:15.680 in 2015
00:22:16.820 we had a
00:22:17.960 not a good relationship
00:22:19.040 with the Arab world
00:22:20.100 we had a phenomenal
00:22:21.020 relationship
00:22:22.120 with the Arab world
00:22:22.920 our relationship
00:22:23.720 with the United Arab Emirates
00:22:24.980 with Jordan
00:22:25.660 with Saudi Arabia
00:22:26.740 with Bahrain
00:22:27.540 with the Morsi
00:22:28.940 our support
00:22:31.400 of the Morsi
00:22:31.920 government
00:22:32.180 is being ejected
00:22:32.880 from Egypt
00:22:33.720 our support
00:22:35.000 of the mission
00:22:35.840 in Libya
00:22:36.360 whether it's
00:22:37.480 Algeria
00:22:38.160 Morocco
00:22:38.720 I could go on
00:22:39.360 it was really
00:22:40.020 unprecedentedly
00:22:40.920 positive
00:22:41.900 and of course
00:22:42.800 we share
00:22:43.520 with both Israel
00:22:45.020 and the Arab world
00:22:46.180 our fear
00:22:47.280 of terrorism
00:22:49.180 and a nuclear-armed Iran
00:22:50.260 I think it brings us
00:22:51.160 all together
00:22:52.360 to fight for what's right
00:22:53.980 What do you think
00:22:55.500 the role is
00:22:56.540 beyond statements
00:22:57.780 of support
00:22:58.440 for countries
00:22:59.280 like Canada
00:23:00.000 in what this
00:23:01.520 organization is advocating
00:23:02.760 I mean I think
00:23:03.260 everyone generally agrees
00:23:04.260 that regime change
00:23:05.480 has to be pushed
00:23:06.180 from within
00:23:06.660 but what support
00:23:07.680 if any of you
00:23:08.220 should be coming
00:23:08.940 from Canada
00:23:09.860 and the global community
00:23:10.680 I think we've
00:23:11.380 I think we all
00:23:12.360 or most of us
00:23:13.340 at least
00:23:13.600 would acknowledge
00:23:14.420 that military-backed
00:23:16.100 regime change
00:23:16.700 by force
00:23:17.300 doesn't work
00:23:18.180 I think we saw that
00:23:19.040 regrettably
00:23:19.680 in Iraq
00:23:21.400 having said that
00:23:22.660 we've got to stand
00:23:23.500 with the people
00:23:24.480 and the resistance
00:23:25.220 you know frankly
00:23:25.960 whether they're monarchists
00:23:27.180 whether they're union members
00:23:28.300 retirees
00:23:29.040 teachers
00:23:29.460 the MEK
00:23:30.800 is obviously
00:23:31.200 the biggest
00:23:32.060 and best organized
00:23:33.600 of all the organizations
00:23:34.460 it won't be
00:23:35.660 it won't be western governments
00:23:36.820 that choose the next
00:23:38.040 government of Iran
00:23:40.360 it'll be a democratic choice
00:23:41.940 and I look at the
00:23:42.940 ten points
00:23:43.760 in the NCRI's plan
00:23:45.780 I think Canadians
00:23:47.200 and the Canadian administration
00:23:48.200 should support
00:23:48.860 each and every one of them
00:23:49.740 and when the people of Iran
00:23:51.140 begin to
00:23:52.080 begin to
00:23:53.520 do the final
00:23:54.620 push
00:23:55.160 to freedom
00:23:55.920 those of us outside
00:23:58.560 whether it's in the west
00:23:59.400 the Arab world
00:24:00.260 or Israel
00:24:01.280 should support
00:24:02.520 their aspirations
00:24:03.280 and do all we can
00:24:04.060 to help
00:24:04.320 I know that the
00:24:05.740 JCPOA
00:24:06.780 was not a Canadian
00:24:07.980 initiative
00:24:08.460 but there have still been
00:24:10.020 especially since
00:24:10.600 the Biden administration
00:24:11.460 took over in the United States
00:24:12.560 perpetual rumblings
00:24:14.080 about a reinstitution
00:24:15.600 of that
00:24:15.940 do you feel that
00:24:16.600 form of agreement
00:24:17.440 with Iran
00:24:17.960 should even be on the table
00:24:18.920 well I just think
00:24:20.200 you've got to work
00:24:20.680 knowledge that
00:24:21.400 the government of Iran
00:24:22.480 can't be trusted
00:24:23.800 we cannot take
00:24:25.200 the Mullah's word
00:24:26.300 there's a long history
00:24:28.180 with the last
00:24:29.200 nuclear containment
00:24:30.020 agreement
00:24:30.420 where they broke
00:24:31.600 the rules
00:24:32.060 the stash of documents
00:24:33.860 that was
00:24:34.400 obtained by
00:24:35.840 Bibi Netanyahu's
00:24:38.420 administration
00:24:38.940 in Israel
00:24:39.840 showed the plan
00:24:41.580 to lie
00:24:42.160 and to cover up
00:24:43.020 the Mullahs in Tehran
00:24:45.300 only respond
00:24:46.180 to one thing
00:24:47.280 and that's
00:24:48.180 tough resolve
00:24:49.620 and we can't
00:24:51.480 show weakness
00:24:52.440 I admire
00:24:54.020 John Kerry's
00:24:55.460 attempt
00:24:55.760 to have a
00:24:56.960 diplomatic solution
00:24:57.920 I think he was
00:24:58.740 well intentioned
00:24:59.420 and I have great
00:24:59.960 respect for him
00:25:01.060 and his leadership
00:25:01.640 in this regard
00:25:02.000 I just think
00:25:02.880 we've got to
00:25:03.920 be much more
00:25:04.760 forceful
00:25:05.320 if we want
00:25:05.720 to get Iran
00:25:06.320 to take
00:25:07.020 a different path
00:25:07.800 that was
00:25:08.760 former Canadian
00:25:09.660 foreign affairs
00:25:10.380 minister
00:25:10.720 John Baird
00:25:11.300 speaking with me
00:25:12.060 in Albania
00:25:13.060 of all places
00:25:14.120 where I had
00:25:14.780 never been
00:25:15.440 and it was
00:25:16.000 quite interesting
00:25:16.680 I should say
00:25:17.660 speaking of
00:25:18.220 Bill Clinton
00:25:18.760 I took a little
00:25:19.740 detour
00:25:20.140 because of course
00:25:20.780 the conference
00:25:21.240 was cancelled
00:25:21.800 so I had a
00:25:22.500 free day
00:25:23.020 in Albania
00:25:24.440 on one of the
00:25:25.400 days that I was
00:25:25.940 there
00:25:26.140 and I said
00:25:26.500 well you know
00:25:27.100 I want to see
00:25:27.660 because the
00:25:28.000 Balkans
00:25:28.480 is a region
00:25:29.380 where countries
00:25:30.160 are not all that
00:25:30.960 far from each
00:25:31.540 other
00:25:31.680 which is why
00:25:32.140 the word
00:25:32.480 Balkanization
00:25:33.460 means what it
00:25:34.200 does
00:25:34.400 breaking things up
00:25:35.340 into smaller pieces
00:25:36.820 so I decided
00:25:38.000 I would take
00:25:38.720 a trip
00:25:39.420 on one of the
00:25:40.140 days to
00:25:40.800 Kosovo
00:25:41.500 which was
00:25:41.940 the border
00:25:42.560 was about
00:25:42.920 two hours
00:25:43.480 from where
00:25:44.300 I was staying
00:25:44.820 in Toronto
00:25:45.500 and beyond that
00:25:47.020 you could get
00:25:47.380 to the Kosovo
00:25:48.000 capital of Pristina
00:25:49.180 in about an hour
00:25:49.920 so it was about
00:25:50.400 three hours
00:25:50.960 all told
00:25:51.400 and I went there
00:25:52.940 and when you go
00:25:53.860 into the capital
00:25:55.120 of Pristina
00:25:55.880 you see this
00:25:57.040 giant
00:25:57.760 just giant
00:25:58.920 billboard
00:25:59.660 of Bill Clinton
00:26:01.120 an American flag
00:26:02.820 and then at the
00:26:03.460 base of the
00:26:04.080 billboard
00:26:04.700 a statue
00:26:05.380 of Bill Clinton
00:26:06.860 and then you go
00:26:07.760 around the corner
00:26:08.340 and you see
00:26:08.760 Madeleine Albright
00:26:09.440 square
00:26:09.820 Madeleine Albright
00:26:10.580 being the former
00:26:11.280 Secretary of State
00:26:12.440 under Clinton
00:26:12.900 because when
00:26:13.860 the Yugoslavia
00:26:15.100 war was going on
00:26:16.140 and you had
00:26:17.300 basically
00:26:17.840 the US
00:26:18.380 was the first
00:26:19.020 place to really
00:26:19.840 recognize Kosovo
00:26:21.080 for what it was
00:26:22.360 and obviously
00:26:23.280 the Serbs
00:26:24.480 do not view
00:26:25.180 Bill Clinton
00:26:25.900 in the same light
00:26:26.640 but in Kosovo
00:26:27.280 they love Bill Clinton
00:26:28.180 they love America
00:26:28.980 it's America themed
00:26:30.200 everything
00:26:30.640 there was like
00:26:31.160 a Route 66 bar
00:26:32.440 their American
00:26:33.480 themed restaurant
00:26:34.560 and it was a
00:26:35.600 very fascinating
00:26:36.340 place in that
00:26:37.100 regard
00:26:37.440 so yes
00:26:38.240 Bill Clinton
00:26:38.680 may not be
00:26:39.160 popular to
00:26:39.840 Iranian dissidents
00:26:40.680 but he is
00:26:41.100 popular to
00:26:41.880 the people
00:26:42.720 of Kosovo
00:26:43.580 that is a
00:26:44.120 little bit of
00:26:44.640 a side part
00:26:45.240 that has
00:26:45.500 nothing to do
00:26:45.980 with anything
00:26:46.300 else
00:26:46.560 but came from
00:26:47.480 the same
00:26:47.940 expedition
00:26:48.780 so I thought
00:26:49.520 I would share
00:26:49.960 it with you
00:26:50.320 here
00:26:50.520 let's talk
00:26:51.840 about the
00:26:52.140 big elephant
00:26:52.600 in the room
00:26:53.080 though
00:26:53.340 with Iran
00:26:54.200 which is
00:26:54.920 its nuclear
00:26:55.480 program
00:26:55.920 this has been
00:26:56.420 a big part
00:26:57.000 of the West
00:26:58.020 interactions
00:26:58.740 with Iran
00:26:59.340 you may remember
00:27:00.400 the Joint
00:27:01.200 Comprehensive
00:27:01.960 Plan of Action
00:27:02.720 the JCPOA
00:27:03.840 that Barack
00:27:04.900 Obama's
00:27:05.440 administration
00:27:06.000 put forward
00:27:06.700 with a number
00:27:07.180 of European
00:27:07.780 countries
00:27:08.380 gave Iran
00:27:09.980 money
00:27:10.560 just boatloads
00:27:11.620 of cash
00:27:12.140 literally cash
00:27:13.060 being dropped
00:27:13.800 into the country
00:27:14.980 lifted sanctions
00:27:16.820 and the exchange
00:27:18.040 was that Iran
00:27:18.940 had to give up
00:27:19.800 its nuclear
00:27:20.460 program
00:27:21.060 and there has
00:27:22.380 been to this
00:27:23.160 day a lot
00:27:23.820 of dispute
00:27:24.280 about whether
00:27:24.800 it actually
00:27:25.360 did that
00:27:25.860 in fact
00:27:26.240 the MEK
00:27:27.120 and some other
00:27:28.040 intelligence analysts
00:27:28.900 especially from
00:27:29.560 the United States
00:27:30.200 have said no
00:27:30.660 they actually
00:27:31.160 kept running
00:27:31.840 secret programs
00:27:33.200 secret nuclear
00:27:34.420 development
00:27:34.940 that was not
00:27:35.580 for its civil
00:27:36.160 energy needs
00:27:36.820 but was in fact
00:27:38.100 for nuclear
00:27:39.340 weapons
00:27:40.000 and the country
00:27:41.360 has clearly
00:27:41.940 never given up
00:27:42.940 its nuclear
00:27:43.840 ambitions
00:27:44.500 the Ayatollahs
00:27:46.080 the new
00:27:46.580 president of Iran
00:27:47.520 all of them
00:27:48.400 have said
00:27:49.380 continuously
00:27:50.040 that they need
00:27:51.060 a nuclear
00:27:51.820 Iran
00:27:52.680 they want it
00:27:53.520 and there is
00:27:54.440 a question
00:27:54.960 about whether
00:27:55.440 this is just
00:27:56.080 because they
00:27:56.580 want to blow
00:27:57.040 Israel off the
00:27:57.780 map
00:27:58.000 which is what
00:27:58.580 they have said
00:27:59.360 or is it just
00:28:00.340 about a deterrent
00:28:01.180 they want nukes
00:28:02.240 so that no one
00:28:02.800 else blows them
00:28:03.640 off the map
00:28:04.760 these are some
00:28:05.760 of the big themes
00:28:06.420 and some of the
00:28:06.880 big questions
00:28:07.440 but I think
00:28:07.940 either way
00:28:08.540 you have to
00:28:09.040 accept that
00:28:09.480 you're not
00:28:09.800 dealing with
00:28:10.420 an honest
00:28:10.800 broker here
00:28:11.520 you're not
00:28:12.300 dealing with
00:28:12.800 an honest
00:28:13.160 actor
00:28:13.580 you're not
00:28:14.320 dealing with
00:28:14.860 a country
00:28:15.440 that is
00:28:16.720 operating in
00:28:17.580 good faith
00:28:18.120 so how
00:28:18.760 should the
00:28:19.160 world respond
00:28:19.920 to the threat
00:28:20.580 of a nuclear
00:28:21.540 Iran
00:28:22.100 I spoke about
00:28:22.960 this with
00:28:23.600 General Chuck
00:28:24.400 Wald
00:28:24.780 a retired
00:28:25.420 general
00:28:25.780 and also the
00:28:26.400 former deputy
00:28:27.140 commander
00:28:27.620 of United States
00:28:29.000 European Command
00:28:29.960 when we hear
00:28:31.220 about Iran's
00:28:31.960 nuclear ambition
00:28:32.740 is this in your
00:28:33.440 view something
00:28:34.040 that is purely
00:28:35.060 a deterrent
00:28:35.940 or is there
00:28:36.960 a risk of it
00:28:37.900 being an
00:28:38.520 offensive goal
00:28:39.300 my belief is
00:28:41.940 it's offensive
00:28:43.020 although it's
00:28:44.580 you never know
00:28:45.580 the problem is
00:28:46.460 that is the
00:28:47.040 uncertainty
00:28:47.580 I mean there's
00:28:48.360 an automatic
00:28:49.120 deterrent because
00:28:49.920 somebody has a
00:28:50.560 weapon that can
00:28:51.220 you know
00:28:51.860 mass destruction
00:28:52.920 of whatever
00:28:53.500 entity they're
00:28:54.740 going after
00:28:55.260 primarily now
00:28:57.040 in the Middle East
00:28:57.540 because they don't
00:28:57.980 have intercontinental
00:28:58.880 ballistic missile
00:28:59.640 capability
00:29:00.160 they will
00:29:00.660 eventually if
00:29:01.300 things go the
00:29:01.880 way they were
00:29:02.200 planning
00:29:02.560 but the issue
00:29:04.660 with nukes
00:29:05.220 is just like
00:29:05.880 it's actually
00:29:07.860 self-defining
00:29:08.720 when you look
00:29:09.280 at Russia
00:29:09.780 and the Ukraine
00:29:10.540 right now
00:29:11.100 is the
00:29:12.940 threat
00:29:14.160 of a nuclear
00:29:15.840 attack by Russia
00:29:16.820 has almost
00:29:17.820 paralyzed the
00:29:18.680 western nations
00:29:19.380 in some ways
00:29:20.240 of really
00:29:20.860 really doing
00:29:22.020 what we probably
00:29:22.760 should have done
00:29:23.380 for the Ukraine
00:29:23.960 long ago
00:29:24.620 so it gives
00:29:26.480 a huge amount
00:29:27.560 of leverage
00:29:28.060 as inept
00:29:29.660 as the Russians
00:29:30.800 have been
00:29:31.200 in Ukraine
00:29:31.940 that threat
00:29:34.600 hanging over
00:29:35.280 the western
00:29:35.800 countries
00:29:36.460 NATO
00:29:36.780 the United States
00:29:37.580 and others
00:29:38.080 has changed
00:29:40.740 the dynamic
00:29:41.400 in the Ukraine
00:29:42.660 and in
00:29:43.880 Eastern Europe
00:29:45.560 if Iran
00:29:49.040 were to be
00:29:49.460 able to get
00:29:49.860 the weapon
00:29:50.280 and validate
00:29:51.300 the fact
00:29:51.720 they could have
00:29:52.200 a delivery
00:29:52.660 platform
00:29:53.200 of some sort
00:29:53.860 that would
00:29:55.680 change the
00:29:56.260 total dynamic
00:29:57.060 in the Middle
00:29:57.580 East
00:29:57.840 it's
00:29:58.240 pretty volatile
00:29:59.900 the way it
00:30:00.420 is
00:30:00.700 but
00:30:00.980 countries like
00:30:03.900 Israel
00:30:04.200 you couldn't
00:30:04.760 expect them
00:30:05.360 to stand
00:30:05.760 by and allow
00:30:06.360 that to
00:30:06.720 happen
00:30:07.000 because it's
00:30:07.740 the
00:30:08.060 it would be
00:30:09.820 the demise
00:30:10.400 of their
00:30:10.720 country
00:30:11.080 if Iran
00:30:12.000 were able
00:30:12.300 to deliver
00:30:13.360 although
00:30:13.960 there's a
00:30:14.680 whole bunch
00:30:14.960 of complexities
00:30:15.460 there
00:30:15.800 but
00:30:16.040 and also
00:30:17.300 I think
00:30:17.820 other
00:30:18.540 Gulf
00:30:19.860 Cooperation
00:30:20.340 Council
00:30:20.780 or Middle
00:30:21.400 East
00:30:21.700 non-Iranian
00:30:23.500 Arab
00:30:23.740 countries
00:30:24.220 would be
00:30:24.860 feel compelled
00:30:25.900 to get
00:30:26.200 the weapon
00:30:26.620 because that's
00:30:27.720 their
00:30:28.020 counterbalance
00:30:29.220 to this threat
00:30:30.020 the leverage
00:30:33.200 that a regime
00:30:33.940 likely
00:30:34.460 like the
00:30:36.100 Mullahs now
00:30:36.800 in Kamini
00:30:37.900 and Rezi
00:30:38.540 and the IRGC
00:30:41.440 as their
00:30:41.880 military arm
00:30:42.640 would get
00:30:43.880 from a nuclear
00:30:44.480 weapon
00:30:44.840 is
00:30:45.220 unacceptable
00:30:48.080 it's
00:30:48.820 significant
00:30:50.740 it would
00:30:51.640 change
00:30:51.940 the dynamic
00:30:52.480 again
00:30:53.000 it would
00:30:53.480 change
00:30:53.940 again
00:30:55.260 just
00:30:55.680 simple
00:30:56.700 things
00:30:57.080 that are
00:30:57.500 sound
00:30:58.040 almost
00:30:58.480 selfish
00:30:58.860 but the
00:30:59.520 free flow
00:31:00.880 of oil
00:31:01.240 from the
00:31:01.600 Middle East
00:31:01.960 could be
00:31:02.320 disrupted
00:31:02.800 which changes
00:31:03.960 the economy
00:31:04.580 of the world
00:31:04.980 economy
00:31:05.420 is part
00:31:05.800 of national
00:31:06.240 security
00:31:06.640 so are
00:31:07.120 other things
00:31:07.700 but the
00:31:10.380 worst part
00:31:10.800 is that
00:31:11.120 you have
00:31:11.500 a
00:31:11.840 declarative
00:31:12.820 policy
00:31:13.300 by the
00:31:13.740 Iranian
00:31:14.040 regime
00:31:14.500 that they
00:31:14.900 want to
00:31:15.200 destroy
00:31:15.580 at least
00:31:16.720 two countries
00:31:17.300 and possibly
00:31:17.860 others
00:31:18.220 in the
00:31:18.480 Middle East
00:31:18.920 and the
00:31:19.520 United States
00:31:20.120 and that's
00:31:22.860 probably not
00:31:23.320 an idle
00:31:23.660 threat
00:31:23.940 you've seen
00:31:24.380 what they've
00:31:24.800 done to
00:31:25.300 the MEK
00:31:27.060 over the
00:31:27.520 years
00:31:27.860 they're
00:31:28.840 harsh
00:31:29.500 they have
00:31:31.700 no morality
00:31:32.400 they have
00:31:33.900 no conscience
00:31:34.520 it appears
00:31:35.100 I think
00:31:35.580 their people
00:31:35.980 are terrified
00:31:36.580 of them
00:31:37.020 they'll do
00:31:37.520 almost anything
00:31:38.080 they can
00:31:38.560 not to get
00:31:39.080 killed
00:31:39.340 themselves
00:31:39.900 and you
00:31:41.820 get the
00:31:42.100 nuclear
00:31:42.380 weapon
00:31:42.720 it changes
00:31:43.200 that from
00:31:43.740 just a
00:31:45.520 terrible
00:31:45.800 situation
00:31:46.400 to an
00:31:46.800 untenable
00:31:47.280 one
00:31:47.560 when you
00:31:48.760 look at
00:31:49.400 Iran's
00:31:50.340 positioning
00:31:51.080 of itself
00:31:51.620 on the
00:31:51.920 world stage
00:31:52.520 there seems
00:31:52.920 to have
00:31:53.120 been a
00:31:53.340 change
00:31:53.680 even in
00:31:54.020 the last
00:31:54.320 few years
00:31:54.860 under the
00:31:55.460 JCPOA era
00:31:56.820 they were
00:31:57.080 really focused
00:31:57.640 on getting
00:31:58.440 support from
00:31:59.120 the United
00:31:59.400 States
00:31:59.800 and from
00:32:00.320 Western
00:32:00.580 European
00:32:00.940 countries
00:32:01.540 now Iran
00:32:02.840 seems to be
00:32:03.460 further
00:32:03.940 cementing
00:32:04.720 this relationship
00:32:05.580 with China
00:32:06.360 and Russia
00:32:06.820 even after
00:32:07.420 Russia's
00:32:08.280 invasion of
00:32:08.820 Ukraine
00:32:09.160 so do you
00:32:10.040 see that
00:32:10.460 Iran is
00:32:11.100 committing
00:32:12.240 to that
00:32:13.040 disengagement
00:32:14.100 from the
00:32:14.480 way I mean
00:32:14.760 it was always
00:32:15.440 I guess
00:32:15.720 a make-believe
00:32:16.520 relationship
00:32:17.320 with the
00:32:17.640 West
00:32:17.800 but do you
00:32:18.080 think they're
00:32:18.360 completely
00:32:18.720 abandoning even
00:32:19.480 that pretense
00:32:20.380 now?
00:32:21.780 Yeah I kind
00:32:22.260 of do
00:32:22.520 I think
00:32:22.940 with RACI
00:32:25.720 coming in
00:32:26.420 has changed
00:32:27.700 that a lot
00:32:28.320 I mean
00:32:28.780 there was
00:32:29.120 some
00:32:29.520 semblance
00:32:30.800 of dialogue
00:32:32.800 you could
00:32:33.260 have with
00:32:33.680 the Iranian
00:32:34.120 regime
00:32:36.540 if you will
00:32:37.160 prior to that
00:32:38.440 I mean
00:32:39.180 this guy
00:32:39.520 is basically
00:32:39.980 a butcher
00:32:40.400 I mean
00:32:40.920 1988
00:32:41.720 killed
00:32:42.280 at least
00:32:43.220 30,000
00:32:43.940 people
00:32:45.000 innocents
00:32:46.460 and so
00:32:48.320 you got to
00:32:48.660 wonder
00:32:48.900 what is
00:32:49.340 the purpose
00:32:49.780 of him
00:32:50.240 being the
00:32:50.840 president
00:32:51.240 which you
00:32:52.580 can speculate
00:32:53.180 on that
00:32:53.820 but he's a
00:32:55.580 hardliner
00:32:56.020 so is
00:32:56.840 Khomeini
00:32:57.440 he wants
00:32:57.860 to be in
00:32:58.180 power
00:32:58.420 that's all
00:32:58.860 that matters
00:32:59.240 to him
00:32:59.640 he thinks
00:33:00.340 a nuclear
00:33:00.740 weapon
00:33:01.060 would give
00:33:01.460 him some
00:33:01.840 leverage
00:33:02.400 to do
00:33:02.740 that
00:33:02.940 he's seen
00:33:03.380 what happened
00:33:03.740 to Gaddafi
00:33:04.300 which was
00:33:05.240 mishandled
00:33:06.040 by the West
00:33:06.560 but that's
00:33:06.980 what happened
00:33:07.460 so I think
00:33:10.700 the dynamic
00:33:11.280 of the
00:33:11.820 regime
00:33:12.440 has changed
00:33:13.040 to be
00:33:13.320 more hard
00:33:13.920 lined
00:33:14.220 I think
00:33:15.020 part of
00:33:15.420 that has
00:33:15.780 to do
00:33:16.040 with the
00:33:16.460 defensive
00:33:16.860 nature
00:33:17.280 of the
00:33:17.520 fact
00:33:17.700 they know
00:33:18.100 they're
00:33:18.320 on thin
00:33:18.980 ice
00:33:19.260 with the
00:33:19.680 population
00:33:20.200 and you
00:33:22.180 put people
00:33:22.660 like that
00:33:23.140 back against
00:33:24.100 the door
00:33:24.460 and by the
00:33:24.980 way all
00:33:25.320 that matters
00:33:25.720 to them
00:33:26.040 is being
00:33:26.340 in charge
00:33:26.820 they just
00:33:27.680 want power
00:33:28.300 and as that
00:33:30.960 becomes more
00:33:31.600 and more
00:33:31.860 threatened
00:33:32.260 they become
00:33:33.140 less rational
00:33:34.040 and they do
00:33:35.060 things that
00:33:36.160 aren't
00:33:36.360 necessarily
00:33:36.880 in anybody's
00:33:38.800 best interest
00:33:39.400 become dangerous
00:33:40.280 you add the
00:33:41.600 nuclear weapon
00:33:42.420 dynamic to that
00:33:43.960 now you've got
00:33:44.500 a real
00:33:44.860 dangerous
00:33:45.460 situation
00:33:46.040 so
00:33:46.420 and they
00:33:48.460 again
00:33:49.640 I'm a
00:33:50.380 westerner
00:33:50.860 so are you
00:33:51.500 I don't understand
00:33:53.240 the Arab mentality
00:33:54.340 I respect
00:33:55.180 the Arab
00:33:55.800 culture
00:33:56.480 etc
00:33:56.960 but
00:33:57.320 and I certainly
00:33:59.060 don't understand
00:33:59.700 the Iranian
00:34:00.140 mentality
00:34:00.760 or certainly
00:34:01.300 don't understand
00:34:01.940 the Mullahs
00:34:02.540 but
00:34:02.900 there's a little
00:34:06.020 different mentality
00:34:07.060 there
00:34:07.480 I mean
00:34:07.960 there's a
00:34:08.520 little more
00:34:09.200 fatalistic
00:34:09.860 I think
00:34:10.360 and
00:34:10.660 from what I
00:34:13.120 can see
00:34:13.480 after
00:34:13.820 spending time
00:34:15.320 at Ashraf 3
00:34:16.100 and viewing
00:34:16.500 the museum
00:34:17.080 their
00:34:17.460 respect for
00:34:20.020 humanity
00:34:20.440 and human
00:34:21.180 life
00:34:21.500 is a little
00:34:22.320 different
00:34:22.640 than what
00:34:23.480 I'm used
00:34:23.840 to
00:34:24.080 when you
00:34:25.240 see
00:34:25.660 the way
00:34:26.340 forward
00:34:26.800 here
00:34:27.080 obviously
00:34:27.400 you're
00:34:27.660 approaching
00:34:27.980 this
00:34:28.340 with the
00:34:28.800 background
00:34:29.160 as a
00:34:29.740 general
00:34:30.020 from the
00:34:30.380 United
00:34:30.580 States
00:34:31.040 do you
00:34:31.300 see
00:34:31.820 regime
00:34:32.980 change
00:34:33.380 as being
00:34:33.700 something
00:34:34.000 that has
00:34:34.380 to come
00:34:34.740 from the
00:34:35.140 Iranian
00:34:35.460 people
00:34:35.840 or do you
00:34:36.120 think
00:34:36.260 there is
00:34:36.640 a global
00:34:37.400 role
00:34:37.960 in this
00:34:38.960 beyond
00:34:39.500 finger wagging
00:34:40.960 effectively
00:34:41.400 that's a good
00:34:43.420 question
00:34:43.800 and I think
00:34:44.520 my personal
00:34:45.480 opinion
00:34:45.840 is the
00:34:46.200 answer
00:34:46.500 is a little
00:34:47.960 bit like
00:34:48.340 the Ukraine
00:34:48.820 model
00:34:49.200 you know
00:34:50.360 Ukrainians
00:34:52.180 if they
00:34:52.760 didn't have
00:34:53.220 the backbone
00:34:53.760 willed to
00:34:54.360 stand up
00:34:54.780 to Russia
00:34:55.560 now
00:34:55.840 and defend
00:34:56.200 themselves
00:34:56.640 there's
00:34:57.040 nothing we
00:34:57.520 can do
00:34:57.800 to make
00:34:58.120 that happen
00:34:58.660 the part
00:35:01.740 there's kind
00:35:02.420 of three
00:35:02.660 parts to
00:35:03.060 that
00:35:03.220 one is
00:35:03.780 they do
00:35:04.100 it
00:35:04.260 without
00:35:04.540 support
00:35:05.000 which is
00:35:05.720 suicidal
00:35:06.560 a lot
00:35:06.880 of times
00:35:07.340 two is
00:35:08.200 they do
00:35:08.520 it with
00:35:08.940 at least
00:35:10.600 minimal
00:35:11.100 support
00:35:11.580 from the
00:35:11.940 standpoint
00:35:12.200 of
00:35:12.600 weapons
00:35:13.140 or
00:35:13.500 other
00:35:14.180 things
00:35:14.920 or four
00:35:15.420 is
00:35:15.700 or three
00:35:16.360 I should
00:35:16.680 say
00:35:16.920 is
00:35:17.200 the
00:35:18.220 U.S.
00:35:18.720 or in
00:35:18.940 this case
00:35:19.320 the United
00:35:19.660 States
00:35:19.940 and Ukraine
00:35:20.520 or NATO
00:35:21.100 actually
00:35:22.100 physically
00:35:22.620 gets in
00:35:23.140 there and
00:35:23.380 fights with
00:35:23.760 them
00:35:23.900 that's
00:35:24.260 probably
00:35:24.460 not going
00:35:24.740 to happen
00:35:25.040 in Ukraine
00:35:25.640 or Iran
00:35:28.080 for that
00:35:28.380 matter
00:35:28.600 well it
00:35:29.320 certainly
00:35:30.580 won't happen
00:35:31.140 in Iran
00:35:31.520 yet
00:35:31.900 now
00:35:32.360 I think
00:35:35.140 if there
00:35:35.520 were
00:35:35.760 I think
00:35:36.340 it has to
00:35:36.740 be done
00:35:37.140 internally
00:35:37.720 I think
00:35:38.760 the people
00:35:39.560 of Iran
00:35:40.040 have to
00:35:40.460 do it
00:35:40.760 because
00:35:41.120 what good
00:35:42.160 does it
00:35:42.400 do to
00:35:42.640 overthrow
00:35:42.920 a regime
00:35:43.380 if the
00:35:43.640 people don't
00:35:44.060 want
00:35:44.300 the people
00:35:45.280 that overthrew
00:35:45.840 that regime
00:35:46.340 to be in
00:35:46.720 charge
00:35:46.960 they've got
00:35:47.360 to want
00:35:47.620 to do it
00:35:49.400 so
00:35:49.680 I think
00:35:50.480 the best
00:35:50.800 thing
00:35:51.000 for the
00:35:51.300 Iranians
00:35:51.760 is to
00:35:52.080 understand
00:35:52.520 that the
00:35:52.940 West
00:35:53.160 will be
00:35:53.500 there
00:35:53.820 and not
00:35:54.860 just
00:35:55.140 in a
00:35:55.480 fickle
00:35:55.880 partial
00:35:56.760 way
00:35:57.060 like
00:35:57.320 you know
00:35:57.560 our
00:35:57.860 attention
00:35:58.460 span
00:35:58.780 in the
00:35:58.980 West
00:35:59.160 is a
00:35:59.480 little
00:35:59.600 bit
00:35:59.860 short
00:36:00.540 that
00:36:02.080 we're
00:36:02.240 there
00:36:02.420 for the
00:36:02.660 long
00:36:02.880 run
00:36:03.100 they
00:36:03.340 can
00:36:03.540 we'll
00:36:03.960 defend
00:36:04.380 them
00:36:04.720 from
00:36:05.400 the
00:36:05.560 standpoint
00:36:05.860 of
00:36:06.160 supportability
00:36:06.860 on
00:36:07.120 whatever
00:36:07.380 they
00:36:07.580 need
00:36:07.800 to
00:36:07.960 survive
00:36:08.400 they'll
00:36:09.100 be
00:36:09.240 brought
00:36:09.500 into
00:36:09.700 the
00:36:09.900 Western
00:36:10.240 world
00:36:10.680 or
00:36:10.860 the
00:36:11.020 world
00:36:11.420 globe
00:36:11.800 if
00:36:11.980 you
00:36:12.100 will
00:36:12.380 through
00:36:14.240 a
00:36:14.380 legitimate
00:36:19.400 succeed
00:36:19.840 and
00:36:20.840 win
00:36:22.800 if you
00:36:23.120 will
00:36:23.340 and
00:36:24.160 some
00:36:24.440 of
00:36:24.520 that
00:36:24.640 has
00:36:24.800 there's
00:36:25.060 a
00:36:25.120 whole
00:36:25.240 bunch
00:36:25.460 of
00:36:25.580 dynamics
00:36:26.020 there
00:36:26.340 but
00:36:26.580 it's
00:36:27.620 got
00:36:27.780 to
00:36:27.880 be
00:36:28.040 that
00:36:28.300 they've
00:36:28.560 got
00:36:28.680 to
00:36:28.800 believe
00:36:29.200 that
00:36:29.480 the
00:36:30.340 majority
00:36:30.920 of
00:36:31.080 the
00:36:31.160 Western
00:36:31.380 countries
00:36:31.820 support
00:36:32.280 them
00:36:32.440 if
00:36:32.700 they
00:36:32.840 do
00:36:33.000 this
00:36:33.260 the
00:36:33.520 last
00:36:33.740 thing
00:36:33.880 I
00:36:33.980 would
00:36:34.080 ask
00:36:34.320 you
00:36:34.420 general
00:36:34.740 is
00:36:35.280 looking
00:36:35.780 at
00:36:35.980 the
00:36:36.100 Arab
00:36:36.320 spring
00:36:36.640 for
00:36:36.840 example
00:36:37.220 or
00:36:37.400 looking
00:36:37.620 at
00:36:37.780 the
00:36:37.880 Iranian
00:36:38.200 revolution
00:36:38.740 we
00:36:38.960 can
00:36:39.100 see
00:36:39.280 that
00:36:39.440 oftentimes
00:36:39.860 the
00:36:40.200 result
00:36:40.560 of
00:36:40.740 revolution
00:36:41.220 is
00:36:41.500 not
00:36:41.860 democracy
00:36:43.100 and
00:36:43.620 secularism
00:36:44.380 in
00:36:44.540 some
00:36:44.740 case
00:36:45.020 the
00:36:45.300 thing
00:36:45.780 that
00:36:45.940 comes
00:36:46.160 in
00:36:46.460 and
00:36:46.760 fills
00:36:47.000 a
00:36:47.160 vacuum
00:36:47.500 is
00:36:47.820 something
00:36:48.280 that's
00:36:48.520 worse
00:36:48.740 than
00:36:49.000 what
00:36:49.540 was
00:36:49.680 overthrown
00:36:50.000 so
00:36:50.160 how
00:36:50.360 do
00:36:50.580 you
00:36:50.720 if
00:36:50.920 that
00:36:51.160 situation
00:36:52.160 gets
00:36:52.680 ripe
00:36:53.000 and
00:36:53.140 if
00:36:53.280 there
00:36:53.420 is
00:36:53.580 a
00:36:53.720 revolution
00:36:54.120 how
00:36:54.680 do
00:36:54.820 you
00:36:54.940 channel
00:36:55.380 that
00:36:55.700 into
00:36:55.960 the
00:36:56.140 reform
00:36:56.580 that
00:36:56.920 people
00:36:57.400 here
00:36:57.960 at
00:36:58.100 Ashraf 3
00:36:58.660 are
00:36:58.800 talking
00:36:59.120 about
00:36:59.480 I
00:37:01.600 think
00:37:01.760 the
00:37:01.900 people
00:37:02.120 of
00:37:02.260 Ashraf 3
00:37:02.920 and
00:37:03.180 the
00:37:03.500 NCRI
00:37:04.420 and
00:37:04.820 the
00:37:05.040 Bujuddin
00:37:05.620 are
00:37:05.760 going to
00:37:05.960 have
00:37:06.080 to
00:37:06.280 be
00:37:06.660 the
00:37:06.800 ones
00:37:07.020 to
00:37:07.180 do
00:37:07.340 that
00:37:07.640 I
00:37:07.880 think
00:37:08.640 it's
00:37:08.860 interesting
00:37:09.260 though
00:37:09.520 that
00:37:09.760 very
00:37:10.300 I'm
00:37:10.800 sure
00:37:10.960 very few
00:37:11.440 Canadians
00:37:11.860 either
00:37:12.240 but
00:37:12.620 maybe
00:37:12.860 more
00:37:13.200 Canadians
00:37:13.640 than
00:37:13.820 Americans
00:37:14.200 but
00:37:14.500 hardly
00:37:15.920 any
00:37:16.300 Americans
00:37:16.760 understand
00:37:17.280 what
00:37:17.560 the
00:37:17.840 NCRI
00:37:18.520 is
00:37:18.860 or
00:37:19.020 what
00:37:20.000 they
00:37:20.180 do
00:37:20.380 here
00:37:20.740 or
00:37:21.140 how
00:37:22.340 responsible
00:37:22.900 they
00:37:23.180 are
00:37:23.440 excuse
00:37:27.000 me
00:37:27.260 they
00:37:28.240 have
00:37:28.680 demonstrated
00:37:29.240 a unique
00:37:29.900 capability
00:37:30.560 to
00:37:31.020 be
00:37:31.660 disciplined
00:37:32.120 and be
00:37:32.600 ready
00:37:32.840 to go
00:37:33.180 so
00:37:33.420 I
00:37:33.640 trust
00:37:34.080 they
00:37:34.260 will
00:37:34.520 that
00:37:35.320 was
00:37:35.620 general
00:37:36.200 chuck
00:37:36.580 wald
00:37:36.920 I
00:37:37.060 got
00:37:37.200 to
00:37:37.340 do
00:37:37.540 the
00:37:37.680 who's
00:37:37.940 who
00:37:38.200 there
00:37:38.800 the
00:37:39.040 former
00:37:39.380 Canadian
00:37:39.760 foreign
00:37:40.120 minister
00:37:40.540 former
00:37:41.080 US
00:37:41.400 general
00:37:41.820 former
00:37:42.300 US
00:37:42.760 ambassador
00:37:43.300 and
00:37:43.900 I
00:37:43.980 think
00:37:44.080 it
00:37:44.180 speaks
00:37:44.400 to
00:37:44.520 the
00:37:44.640 importance
00:37:45.020 of
00:37:45.260 this
00:37:45.440 issue
00:37:45.840 that
00:37:46.380 all
00:37:46.580 of
00:37:46.720 these
00:37:46.860 people
00:37:47.160 all
00:37:47.400 of
00:37:47.520 these
00:37:47.660 stakeholders
00:37:48.120 from
00:37:48.400 around
00:37:48.660 the
00:37:48.820 world
00:37:49.040 are
00:37:49.200 saying
00:37:49.440 you
00:37:49.560 know
00:37:49.660 what
00:37:49.820 we've
00:37:50.040 got
00:37:50.160 to
00:37:50.240 get
00:37:50.380 involved
00:37:50.760 here
00:37:51.100 and
00:37:51.700 Iran
00:37:52.180 needs
00:37:52.700 to
00:37:52.900 be
00:37:53.160 free
00:37:53.600 and
00:37:53.760 it's
00:37:53.900 not
00:37:54.060 about
00:37:54.380 forced
00:37:55.160 regime
00:37:55.640 change
00:37:56.140 on
00:37:56.520 a
00:37:56.760 population
00:37:57.360 that
00:37:57.580 doesn't
00:37:57.880 want
00:37:58.140 it
00:37:58.260 it
00:37:58.400 is
00:37:58.580 in
00:37:58.740 fact
00:37:59.000 about
00:37:59.320 a
00:37:59.840 population
00:38:00.380 that
00:38:00.600 by
00:38:00.780 and
00:38:00.940 large
00:38:01.200 does
00:38:01.560 want
00:38:01.900 it
00:38:02.000 and
00:38:02.120 I
00:38:02.240 think
00:38:02.380 what
00:38:02.540 John
00:38:02.820 Baird
00:38:03.120 said
00:38:03.420 very
00:38:04.160 candidly
00:38:04.760 when I
00:38:04.980 was
00:38:05.100 speaking
00:38:05.340 to him
00:38:05.700 earlier
00:38:06.080 is that
00:38:06.540 you need
00:38:07.160 to talk
00:38:07.560 about
00:38:07.840 a
00:38:08.020 situation
00:38:08.460 in which
00:38:08.820 the
00:38:09.000 people
00:38:09.360 want
00:38:09.800 change
00:38:10.300 in which
00:38:10.560 the
00:38:10.720 people
00:38:11.000 rise
00:38:11.380 up
00:38:11.640 and
00:38:12.080 when
00:38:12.320 that
00:38:12.600 happens
00:38:13.120 it's
00:38:13.420 the
00:38:13.600 responsibility
00:38:14.140 of the
00:38:14.480 world
00:38:14.680 to go
00:38:15.000 in
00:38:15.200 and
00:38:15.340 recognize
00:38:16.020 that
00:38:16.880 it's
00:38:17.080 happened
00:38:17.380 and
00:38:17.700 that's
00:38:18.020 the
00:38:18.240 phenomenon
00:38:18.580 we
00:38:18.820 see
00:38:19.060 after
00:38:19.480 revolutions
00:38:20.040 around
00:38:20.400 the
00:38:20.580 world
00:38:20.800 at
00:38:20.980 a
00:38:21.120 certain
00:38:21.320 point
00:38:21.600 countries
00:38:22.000 decide
00:38:22.520 or
00:38:22.780 don't
00:38:23.280 to
00:38:23.860 recognize
00:38:24.720 who
00:38:25.400 the
00:38:25.600 government
00:38:25.920 is
00:38:26.200 and
00:38:26.320 who
00:38:26.440 the
00:38:26.600 leader
00:38:26.800 is
00:38:27.100 and
00:38:27.220 this
00:38:27.640 is
00:38:27.780 an
00:38:27.900 illegitimate
00:38:28.420 regime
00:38:28.880 so
00:38:29.300 we're
00:38:29.620 not
00:38:29.760 talking
00:38:30.000 about
00:38:30.140 going
00:38:30.360 in
00:38:30.560 there
00:38:30.700 with
00:38:30.840 the
00:38:30.960 military
00:38:31.400 and
00:38:31.820 making
00:38:32.120 it
00:38:32.300 happen
00:38:32.600 what
00:38:32.780 they're
00:38:32.900 really
00:38:33.060 talking
00:38:33.440 about
00:38:33.700 is
00:38:33.800 identifying
00:38:34.400 when
00:38:34.720 those
00:38:34.960 conditions
00:38:35.420 for
00:38:35.740 change
00:38:36.180 are
00:38:36.380 there
00:38:36.700 when
00:38:37.000 the
00:38:37.220 situation
00:38:37.940 is
00:38:38.200 ripe
00:38:38.500 for
00:38:38.700 change
00:38:39.120 as
00:38:39.620 they
00:38:39.780 say
00:38:48.240 security
00:38:49.140 concerns
00:38:49.960 that
00:38:50.240 made
00:38:50.540 it
00:38:50.660 so
00:38:50.780 I
00:38:50.900 didn't
00:38:51.040 want
00:38:51.200 to
00:38:51.260 be
00:38:51.380 reporting
00:38:51.800 about
00:38:52.060 who
00:38:52.500 was
00:38:52.740 there
00:38:53.020 at
00:38:53.260 the
00:38:53.400 time
00:38:53.760 as
00:38:54.040 I
00:38:54.140 was
00:38:54.280 talking
00:38:54.620 to
00:38:54.800 them
00:38:54.920 but
00:38:55.040 now
00:38:55.240 that
00:38:55.460 everyone
00:38:56.000 has
00:38:56.260 left
00:38:56.600 Albania
00:38:57.240 I'm
00:38:57.740 able
00:38:57.880 to
00:38:58.020 tell
00:38:58.220 these
00:38:58.480 stories
00:38:58.820 in
00:38:59.000 a
00:38:59.080 bit
00:38:59.160 more
00:38:59.340 detail
00:38:59.680 and
00:38:59.920 in
00:39:00.020 this
00:39:00.180 show
00:39:00.400 I
00:39:00.600 shared
00:39:00.920 a few
00:39:01.180 of
00:39:01.300 those
00:39:01.440 conversations
00:39:02.100 obviously
00:39:02.880 the
00:39:03.220 point
00:39:03.460 of
00:39:03.560 these
00:39:03.720 things
00:39:03.980 though
00:39:04.140 is
00:39:04.240 that
00:39:04.340 you
00:39:04.420 learn
00:39:04.640 a
00:39:04.780 lot
00:39:04.980 that
00:39:05.120 you
00:39:05.240 keep
00:39:05.440 referring
00:39:05.880 back
00:39:06.240 to
00:39:06.480 when
00:39:07.080 stories
00:39:07.500 emerge
00:39:07.980 that
00:39:08.180 deal
00:39:08.360 with
00:39:08.540 Iran
00:39:08.900 that
00:39:09.100 deal
00:39:09.260 with
00:39:09.400 the
00:39:09.480 human
00:39:09.660 rights
00:39:09.940 abuses
00:39:10.360 and
00:39:10.900 that
00:39:11.000 also
00:39:11.220 deal
00:39:11.500 with
00:39:11.720 the
00:39:11.840 resistance
00:39:12.300 and
00:39:12.760 the
00:39:12.920 opposition
00:39:13.420 to
00:39:13.700 Iran
00:39:14.020 which
00:39:14.220 seems
00:39:14.420 to
00:39:14.540 be
00:39:14.660 growing
00:39:15.020 by
00:39:15.740 the
00:39:15.940 day
00:39:16.220 that'll
00:39:16.820 do
00:39:16.940 it
00:39:17.060 for
00:39:17.280 today's
00:39:17.720 program
00:39:18.080 however
00:39:18.380 my
00:39:18.580 thanks
00:39:18.860 to
00:39:19.000 all
00:39:19.300 of
00:39:19.440 you
00:39:19.540 for
00:39:19.840 tuning
00:39:20.160 in
00:39:20.440 we'll
00:39:20.840 talk
00:39:21.040 to
00:39:21.120 you
00:39:21.240 soon
00:39:21.440 back
00:39:21.740 on
00:39:22.020 Canadian
00:39:22.400 soil
00:39:22.780 this
00:39:23.020 is
00:39:23.180 Canada's
00:39:23.720 most
00:39:24.160 irreverent
00:39:24.600 talk
00:39:24.840 show
00:39:25.040 on
00:39:25.660 True
00:39:25.940 North
00:39:26.160 The
00:39:26.320 Andrew
00:39:26.540 Lawton
00:39:26.800 Show
00:39:27.000 thank
00:39:27.300 you
00:39:27.440 God
00:39:27.760 bless
00:39:28.060 and
00:39:28.280 good
00:39:28.420 day
00:39:28.600 to
00:39:28.720 you
00:39:28.820 all
00:39:29.020 thanks
00:39:29.300 for
00:39:29.460 listening
00:39:29.740 to
00:39:29.940 the
00:39:30.060 Andrew
00:39:30.340 Lawton
00:39:30.660 Show
00:39:30.940 support
00:39:31.780 the
00:39:31.940 program
00:39:32.260 by
00:39:32.480 donating
00:39:32.840 to
00:39:33.040 True
00:39:33.220 North
00:39:33.500 at
00:39:33.880 www.tnc.news